EPTPatch 1.3.3 PTR - Page 77
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Massive units are not affected by concussive shells. If you think they are, you are wrong. It's SPORE crawlers that are being changed, not SPINE. Please read carefully. | ||
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MrGreyness
Australia35 Posts
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frucisky
Singapore2170 Posts
On April 26 2011 23:00 sp00n- wrote: You're spore in the mineral line has just been killed with voidrays and the queen is also dead because of pheonix lift. You have few spores left but when you uproot them voidray will focus one and then move again.... This change is needed. Wouldnt mind for Spine crawlers also receiving this buff. You have a point, though very situational. Most of the times I play, I either have a bunch of spores almost completed or I just see the VR and start the spores. In the latter case, the spores will definitely get killed by the void ray + phoenix combo. In the former case, my properly positioned spores + still popping queens will defend the harass. A lot of theorycraft though and I welcome any buff but if Blizzard's aim was to make the P air harass easier to defend for Z and build time buff for spore's woulda been a way better choice. | ||
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clusen
Germany8702 Posts
On April 26 2011 22:52 frucisky wrote: I'd much rather have seen a concomitant Spore Crawler build time buff so it makes it a little more forgiving if I get surprised by Stargate units. You're saying that it's made to deflect Banshees and Phoenixes easier. But it doesn't make sense since any good Zerg player will place the spores properly in the first place to defend the drones. This change makes it kinda possible to defend Banshees/Rays when you were surprised, because you can now build spores somewhere else and move them into your mineral line, which was impossible before because they would all die while rooting. No, it's not effective(and it shouldn't be), but it is something. No Zerg is able to place Spores properly when surprised because they die while building :p And since we don't have T1 AA that can be built as a reaction(Queens take way too long) I like this change. | ||
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Necro)Phagist(
Canada6667 Posts
On April 26 2011 23:04 Danzo wrote: "Hardly a nerf" But still a nerd that's not actually necessary. lol Yeah blizzard the way to stop that terran force is too attack their bunkers! Seriously? It's bad enough it takes long just hold to out but now strip us of our resource? When was the last time you guys saw offensive bunkers being useful against zerg? I guess you haven't watched boxers play vs zerg? almost every game he throws up an offensive bunker while expanding behind it... lmao @"Strip us of our resources" Your bunker will cost you half a fucking marine.... seriously its insane that you think bunkers being free wasn't broken. change has been needed for a long fucking time! | ||
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frucisky
Singapore2170 Posts
On April 26 2011 23:07 clusen wrote: This change makes it kinda possible to defend Banshees/Rays when you were surprised, because you can now build spores somewhere else and move them into your mineral line, which was impossible before because they would all die while rooting. No, it's not effective(and it shouldn't be), but it is something. No Zerg is able to place Spores properly when surprised because they die while building :p And since we don't have T1 AA that can be built as a reaction(Queens take way too long) I like this change. I suppose you've a point there but you can only put spores on creep and that isn't somewhere an opponent going air isn't going to be able to spot. But as I said, I welcome any Zerg buff :D | ||
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FeyFey
Germany10114 Posts
Nice to see hts got a buff, nice they want to make ghosts more viable with mech, but i would have left minerals the same. The zealot build time change is like many people have put it extremly funny, since they buff nerfed the time already several times >.>. (take into consideration that the last nerf was aimed at the warp gate cooldown of the zealot as people could replinish their army to fast late game.) Since it didn't affected hts and the cooldown time is better still, there won't be lots of strats with gate only, probably the 4 non warp gate push, that will hit earlier then the 4 gate on smaller maps  .But since i went for robo before warp in pvp i am fine anyway ^.^. can save me a gate that way | ||
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Cheerio
Ukraine3178 Posts
On April 26 2011 22:30 sluggaslamoo wrote: Just like concussive and all these other 50/50 upgrades that make no sense, take an extremely long time to research and require no tech pattern or planning at all. Agreed. Those are artificial upgrades. When I think about those I dont understand why is marauder a viable T1 unit and hydra isnt. They put it at T2 where it still has little use while zerg struggles defending against air at T1 and they have to bring another artificial change to make up for it (spores). Balance of sc1 was pure genius, I guess people behind it no longer work for Blizzard. | ||
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TwilightStar
United States649 Posts
Does the archon change mean they can knock down FF? | ||
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{ToT}ColmA
Japan3260 Posts
would ve liked to see some raven change thou  | ||
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Striding Strider
United Kingdom787 Posts
On April 26 2011 23:05 Alexl wrote: So a 4gate nerf in exchange for an overall protoss buff and no adressing of mass wg warp-ins to reinforce instantly in 200pop fights when others need to wait? This coming from a Zerg? Seriously? | ||
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papaz
Sweden4149 Posts
On April 26 2011 23:11 TwilightStar wrote: I think the pylon change is absolutely unnecessary... Does the archon change mean they can knock down FF? yes | ||
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TimeSpiral
United States1010 Posts
On April 26 2011 22:59 RogerChillingworth wrote: 1. Putting your shit in bold doesn't make it correct. 2. Terran didn't get nerfed. Ghosts got buffed, bunkers return 75 instead of 100 minerals. Hardly a nerf. Roger, it's called formatting. Is it not apparent that the bold style is to create the feeling of headlines and sub-headlines? Deal with it. + Show Spoiler [zany theory] + Or is he actually saying bold text implies some level of authority over non-bold text? Lol. If this is so I should have not even replied at all. (2) Terran didn't get nerfed? Good luck explaining that one. The Ghost and the Raven are the most expensive spell-casters in the game. That remains unchanged. Moving some of the gas cost to minerals is a plus in early game (when Ghosts are not used) and may encourage a few early Ghost plays, so like I said, I'm going to let this one pan out. The bunker change is a nerf (no way to argue that), and the Archon buff is an indirect nerf to Terran bio armies (this is debatable). The amount of kiting and micro required to fight an a+clicked Protoss deathball is already silly, this is just going to make it much worse. This will probably encourage more Terrans to transition into Ghost Mech in lategame versus Protoss. Maybe this is a good thing. Only time (and Blizzard) will tell. | ||
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jacobmarlow
Canada100 Posts
I am a diamond level toss and simply talking to zerg players online, they win a clear majority of their games versus protoss at ease. I love how roaches, the cheap unit that they are, literally counters all protoss ground units except the immortal which can only be built 1 at a time and cost 3 roaches and some more gas. Also lets not forget, zerglings counter immortals.... | ||
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Pred8oar
Germany281 Posts
. The ghost change also might screw the protoss players over and i dont see why they changed it, infestors for example do cost a crap ton of gas and ghosts dont? Oo | ||
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Ragoo
Germany2773 Posts
On April 26 2011 22:50 WhiteDog wrote: LoL ? Archon are not weak, but colo are OP so it makes them worthless. They do not need any buff, they are already pretty good but nobody make them. They're great to tank ultra, great against ling, not good against roach & hydra. Archon zealot stalker colo & some templar is awesome late game protoss unit composition in PvZ. Protoss get the habit to think that every units should be good against every units. That's not much, being good against Ultras which are a shitty unit anyway and pwning lings which are basically killed by storm before. Maybe their dps and splash is fine , but the collision size, speed and range means they will most likely not be able to fight anyway. They are neither good in chokes nor good with forcefields which makes them so much worse than Collossi in PvZ. | ||
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R3N
740 Posts
On a more serious note Infestors are really good, sometimes borderline OP so I think this is a reasonable buff. BUT Ghosts are OP against protoss and this buff will make it even worse. BUT Since I hate protoss I don't mind that at all  ALL Hail Ghost buff! | ||
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DeLiriuMs
Bulgaria40 Posts
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Nakas
United States148 Posts
On April 26 2011 23:00 sp00n- wrote: You're spore in the mineral line has just been killed with voidrays and the queen is also dead because of pheonix lift. You have few spores left but when you uproot them voidray will focus one and then move again.... This change is needed. Wouldnt mind for Spine crawlers also receiving this buff. If zerg is so far behind with anti-air against protoss stargate play that they're killing spore crawlers, that's pretty much gg. Chasing after a charged void ray with an uprooted spore crawler is not going to save that game. | ||
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Necro)Phagist(
Canada6667 Posts
On April 26 2011 23:12 TimeSpiral wrote: Roger, it's called formatting. Is it not apparent that the bold style is to create the feeling of headlines and sub-headlines? Deal with it. + Show Spoiler [zany theory] + Or is he actually saying bold text implies some level of authority over non-bold text? Lol. If this is so I should have not even replied at all. (2) Terran didn't get nerfed? Good luck explaining that one. The Ghost and the Raven are the most expensive spell-casters in the game. That remains unchanged. Moving some of the gas cost to minerals is a plus in early game (when Ghosts are not used) and may encourage a few early Ghost plays, so like I said, I'm going to let this one pan out. The bunker change is a nerf (no way to argue that), and the Archon buff is an indirect nerf to Terran bio armies (this is debatable). The amount of kiting and micro required to fight an a+clicked Protoss deathball is already silly, this is just going to make it much worse. This will probably encourage more Terrans to transition into Ghost Mech in lategame versus Protoss. Maybe this is a good thing. Only time (and Blizzard) will tell. Bunkers being free was retarded. to so much a nerf more fixing then anything. as for Archon being a "Nerf" to Terran. God forbid a Protoss death ball consisting of 2 different tier 3 units should be able to a move your tier 1 infantry army.... Seriously the fact that Terrans have been able to stay on tier 1 bio for 30 minute macro games and win is just fucking silly..... | ||
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mprs
Canada2933 Posts
On April 26 2011 22:56 TimeSpiral wrote: Did Protoss just get buffed, rofl? That's amazing. Terran gets Nerfed, ROFL! The bunker is on the only defensive structure in the game that does not increase area DPS for cost. It's the only defensive structure that can be halted mid-construction by a minimum of a single worker unit. Its sole advantage was that it added a little durability to barracks units that are stationary, in the form of "armor (HP)." You're essentially paying for additional HP per unit in a given area plus get a slight range buff. If the bunker was destroyed, or mass repaired (this costs money), the salvage feature was negated. That was the primary benefit of a bunker. This is a silly, and stupid change. I'm on the fence about the Ghost. We'll have to see how that works out. Seems like it could be a buff, but where are our free spell casters (Sentry/HT)? + Show Spoiler [tongue and cheek] + Slightly kidding about this, but those two units are stupid cheap for their value. Zerg gets buffed? Cool. I don't mind that, especially since they are terrified of the necessary Infestor nerf and don't appear to be getting one any time soon. You can't look at these changes and say that T got nerfed with a straight face. You are under-valuing that ghost change. It will help vs infestors osooooooooooooooooooooooooo much. losing 25 minerals on bunker salvages is like the most negligible change ever compared to everything else in this patch. | ||
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