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On November 25 2010 10:02 sjschmidt93 wrote:
I hate how people say "good players don't lose to x strategy". Most of these are cheeses, including 4 gates, six pools, and proxy gates/raxes, however GSL players get knocked out by these things all the time.
4 gate is NOT a cheese, unless we're talking about attempting to get a pylon in the enemy base (Korean 4-gate)
It's an all-in. Please pound the difference into your skull.
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Norway533 Posts
On November 25 2010 10:14 tetramaster wrote:Show nested quote +On November 25 2010 10:02 sjschmidt93 wrote:
I hate how people say "good players don't lose to x strategy". Most of these are cheeses, including 4 gates, six pools, and proxy gates/raxes, however GSL players get knocked out by these things all the time. 4 gate is NOT a cheese, unless we're talking about attempting to get a pylon in the enemy base (Korean 4-gate) It's an all-in. Please pound the difference into your skull.
4 gate on steppes of war. MMMMM, they can even scout it and its hard.. :D
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On November 25 2010 10:17 haegN wrote:Show nested quote +On November 25 2010 10:14 tetramaster wrote:On November 25 2010 10:02 sjschmidt93 wrote:
I hate how people say "good players don't lose to x strategy". Most of these are cheeses, including 4 gates, six pools, and proxy gates/raxes, however GSL players get knocked out by these things all the time. 4 gate is NOT a cheese, unless we're talking about attempting to get a pylon in the enemy base (Korean 4-gate) It's an all-in. Please pound the difference into your skull. 4 gate on steppes of war. MMMMM, they can even scout it and its hard.. :D
Its still not a cheese. You dont cut probe production, and you don't HAVE to make any sort of proxy. Its a 4 gate build, doesnt mean you HAVE to use any gateways at all. If you see an opportunity to expand 5 times before making any units, you could TECHNICALLY make 50 gateways before making so much as a zealot. Sorry, 4 gate will never be cheese, there is no cheese, its all in the game. The only thing that could be considered "cheese" is when a player pulls off 4 or more workers to send with their attack, then thats more of a cheese. People ALWAYS complain when other players find a different way to win that they have never seen before. People need to just suck it up and stop complaining about losing. Seriously.
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On November 25 2010 09:01 CharlieMurphy wrote:
any of you cocksuckers wanna do 100 4gates vs my zerg?
thats not very nice, I'm quoting so maybe a mod could take care of him?
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Holding off a 4-gate is one of the most stressful things in the world. Shame on you for making this challenge.
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Good luck to everyone going for the challenge.
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Haven't you people seen the zerg that uses no queens and beats a 4 gate push?
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Norway533 Posts
No, mvp, could you provide replay/VOD? 
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Name/ID: Salivanth.254
Division: Silver
Points before "Hundred 4Gate Challenge": 1201 (557 bonus pool)
Final score: 24-26
Replay pack: Not happening (I suck, you really don't want to watch them, and I didn't complete the challenge)
This is a good challenge for me: Often I'll lose a game because I have no idea what build I'm gonna do when I enter the game and scramble for an idea. I've actually been like "Okay, so I might FE, oh, I just threw down a Gateway, guess I'll go robo this game", so this will allow me to focus.
100 straight games of 4-Gate should allow me to learn that build, then keep it in my toolbox, forever, even if I 4-gate 6 times a year afterwards.
Plus, once we've done that we'll move on to the 100 Slightly-More-Macro-Based-Build Challenge (I'm thinking some sort of Robo build) 
P.S: In the build I use, I cut probes at 30, and get 3 waves of units on top of my initial gateway units, attacking with 7 Zealots, 6 Stalkers, and 2 Sentries (60 food, so fairly late).
EDIT: I've decided to discontinue my attempt at 50 matches. I learnt some stuff about micro, practiced the build, and now it's time to move on to either 2-Gate Robo, or, if I'm addicted to losing for a while, FE.
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On November 25 2010 17:13 Salivanth wrote:Name/ID: Salivanth.254 Division: Silver Points before "Hundred 4Gate Challenge": 1201 (557 bonus pool) Final score: Unknown Replay pack: Probably not for a couple of months if I stick with this, I don't play much. This is a good challenge for me: Often I'll lose a game because I have no idea what build I'm gonna do when I enter the game and scramble for an idea. I've actually been like "Okay, so I might FE, oh, I just threw down a Gateway, guess I'll go robo this game", so this will allow me to focus. 100 straight games of 4-Gate should allow me to learn that build, then keep it in my toolbox, forever, even if I 4-gate 6 times a year afterwards. Plus, once we've done that we'll move on to the 100 Slightly-More-Macro-Based-Build Challenge (I'm thinking some sort of Robo build)
If you want to learn fundamentals, I'd suggest going 2 Gate-Robo every game instead of 4 gate. It allows you to be aggressive or sit back and macro. You could figure out your own variation of it and make several different options out of it. If you do 4 Gate every game, you're forced to do early pressure that kills your opponent or puts you extremely far ahead and if it fails you're screwed. 2 Gate Robo on the other hand allows you to put on some early pressure and follow up with several possible builds to play out the game.
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All the 4-gaters in GSL lose. This also helps explain why there are so few P in high level play but so many on the ladder.
4-gating will make you a mediocre player and probably get you high on the ladder. 4-gating may even earn you a few wins in tourneys and what not. But, it will never produce a good player or a winner. 2 GSLs and no P in the top 4 with only 5 advancing so far in GSL 3 with a large number of P doing some 4-gate and losing.
Moral: 4-gate if you like mediocracy and don't want to get better.
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Woohoo here come some free wins for me
I love when a toss 4 gates me.
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If you wan't to learn fundamentals...
this made me giggle.
maybe short for wan not?
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My main race is zerg and I've never played toss before, but I'm gonna give this a try ^^
Name/ID: ecomania
Division: Diamond
Points before "Hundred 4Gate Challenge": 572 (1233 Bonus pool)
Points x Games into challenge: ~
Final score: Unknown
Replay pack: When it's done
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On November 24 2010 15:41 b_unnies wrote:
i'd much prefer to have Protoss do a challenge where they don't go 4 gate for 100 games
Quoted for truth.
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I think this is a good initiative!
I'm also mixing 10 different builds and none of them are refined at all.
I just started 1 hour ago and won't be able to play a lot currently but should be ok.
Name/ID: graxx
Division: Diamond
Points before "Hundred 4Gate Challenge": 1176 (850 Bonus pool)
Points 2 Games into challenge: 1232
Final score: Unknown
Replay pack: end of the year I hope
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On November 25 2010 20:23 roliax wrote:
All the 4-gaters in GSL lose. This also helps explain why there are so few P in high level play but so many on the ladder.
4-gating will make you a mediocre player and probably get you high on the ladder. 4-gating may even earn you a few wins in tourneys and what not. But, it will never produce a good player or a winner. 2 GSLs and no P in the top 4 with only 5 advancing so far in GSL 3 with a large number of P doing some 4-gate and losing.
Moral: 4-gate if you like mediocracy and don't want to get better.
Second this. I hate seeing 4-Gate Protoss players. It promotes crappy macro play and little variation in Protoss play.
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I only use 4-gate when I'm playing a Bo3 or a series of some kind. It's pretty useless on ladder.
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On November 25 2010 23:35 Twistacles wrote:
I only use 4-gate when I'm playing a Bo3 or a series of some kind. It's pretty useless on ladder.
This man lies. Don't trust him!
Sup Twist.
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If you know a 4 gate is coming it is easy enough to hold against. What is annoying is that the build is so ridiculously easy to execute. Players with far inferior mechanics can win against better players just because Protoss happens to have one build that requires no skill and can win you games up into mid-high diamond.
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EPT
