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On October 07 2010 06:44 CheeseGrater wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2010 06:34 Harem wrote:On October 07 2010 05:33 blagoonga123 wrote:On October 06 2010 03:18 TadH wrote:
Everyone deserves a second chance.
Not sure if the people you're talking about have been caught numerous times, but with a new game comes new trust, or so I would think.
User was temp banned for this post. sorry why was this guy temp banned? I see nothing inflammatory or off topic about his post. Even if I don't agree with it. I will always give a person a second chance, but very rarely any chances beyond that. Reread what he said and then read the OP. Re-read them both. So you are banning people for honest mistakes now? Maybe he didn't play BW so he just didn't know the names the OP was talking about....
No he didn't read the whole OP. If he had read the whole op he would see these guys have been given second chances in bw and have cheated in multiple occasions in tournaments.
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On October 07 2010 06:44 CheeseGrater wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2010 06:34 Harem wrote:On October 07 2010 05:33 blagoonga123 wrote:On October 06 2010 03:18 TadH wrote:
Everyone deserves a second chance.
Not sure if the people you're talking about have been caught numerous times, but with a new game comes new trust, or so I would think.
User was temp banned for this post. sorry why was this guy temp banned? I see nothing inflammatory or off topic about his post. Even if I don't agree with it. I will always give a person a second chance, but very rarely any chances beyond that. Reread what he said and then read the OP. Re-read them both. So you are banning people for honest mistakes now? Maybe he didn't play BW so he just didn't know the names the OP was talking about.... Not a fan of turning TL into a police state
No, he was banned for just mindless replying (his post is 2 minutes after the original post) without even reading the original post. BTW you can check the Automated Ban Thread to see reasons why people were banned.
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On October 07 2010 06:46 waxypants wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2010 06:44 CheeseGrater wrote:On October 07 2010 06:34 Harem wrote:On October 07 2010 05:33 blagoonga123 wrote:On October 06 2010 03:18 TadH wrote:
Everyone deserves a second chance.
Not sure if the people you're talking about have been caught numerous times, but with a new game comes new trust, or so I would think.
User was temp banned for this post. sorry why was this guy temp banned? I see nothing inflammatory or off topic about his post. Even if I don't agree with it. I will always give a person a second chance, but very rarely any chances beyond that. Reread what he said and then read the OP. Re-read them both. So you are banning people for honest mistakes now? Maybe he didn't play BW so he just didn't know the names the OP was talking about.... Not a fan of turning TL into a police state No, he was banned for just mindless replying (his post is 2 minutes after the original post) without even reading the original post. BTW you can check the Automated Ban Thread to see reasons why people were banned.
Oh wow never knew about that thx. I always hafta search through people's post histories till I find the red one lol
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dunno tbh I think people get way too aggressive about hackers. theres a difference between cheating in random ladder games then cheating in a tournament with a prize
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They should get a brand on their forehead that says "MAPHACKER"
(sarcasm)
seriously, can't believe how many TL'ers believe in this kind of thing.
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On October 07 2010 05:46 Squanto wrote:Show nested quote +On October 06 2010 03:18 TadH wrote:
Everyone deserves a second chance.
Not sure if the people you're talking about have been caught numerous times, but with a new game comes new trust, or so I would think.
User was temp banned for this post. Wow was he really banned? lol mods really need to lighten up if someone was banned for stating his opinion in a calm manner. On topic: I am positive there will be some bw hackers who won't hack in sc2 simply because it's expensive. We used to get Brood war for like 20 bucks, not a huge deal if the account was banned. But now that SC2 is linked to a battle.net account, and costs 60 bucks, I wouldn't dare to start hacking.
"Not sure if the people you're talking about have been caught numerous times"
he was banned for saying that since he was not reading the OP.
On topic (jacked, hehe): Blizzard's been pretty good with the hack prevention in Warcraft III until SC2 came out. Patches would be made frequently to prevent hacks from working, but when SC2 was released, the anti-hack patches came slower.
Blizzard definitely has the power to make anti-hacks and they have the capability to ban. With that power in hand, we should let hackers have a second chance, and if they eff it up, they'll get banned from B.Net with their 60 dollar account. Ez.
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On October 07 2010 07:01 petzergling wrote:
dunno tbh I think people get way too aggressive about hackers. theres a difference between cheating in random ladder games then cheating in a tournament with a prize
an what's that difference?!
for me it's so damn obvious, i really see any discussion redundant.
cheating are the equivalent to "performance enhancing drugs" in sports. this sport being "esports".
this means clearly something like this:
being cought once, ban for a year and if it's a tournament with prices a nice fine, if they intend to play again.
being cought more than once, lifeban. being cought twice means, after you got a ban for hacking/cheating, then gotten rehabilitated. and now getting cought another time.
tournaments should have some sort of common blacklist or anti cheating team. it would be easier to oversee the system.
and more important it would prevent people from hacking, cause it will result in much harder punishment.
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On October 06 2010 03:18 TadH wrote:
Everyone deserves a second chance.
Not sure if the people you're talking about have been caught numerous times, but with a new game comes new trust, or so I would think.
User was temp banned for this post.
wow pretty harsh ban right here, well since TL doesn't support hackers and people that support hackers in a third person way I guess it's quiet deserved.
Yeah, don't give these guys a benefit of the doubt, fool me once shame on you, fool me twice shame on me, fool me thrice I'm fucking stupid
oh kay, since I saw that he replied that without lookin at OP it's a pretty straight forward ban. TL must be upping up quality of posting now.
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I really dont see what the difference is between people who have hacked once and people who have hacked several times....
All the people we are talking about have used hack in several serious games to gain something which is considered of value to the starcraft community. Be that fame, respect or whatever.
I know you could probably set this up as those who did it once and those who did it several times, but I really think it's more a question of what you're willing to let slide.
Personally I've always had a zero tolerance stance against hackers or abusers of any kind. Call me an angry elefant or something else for that matter :p
On a side note. I've been playing another game where the community was so small that people were forced to seriously consider to let hacking and abusing slide in every single game. The community consists of around 30 players of which there is 3-4 people who are known to have been abusing once or more times. The community have more or less split into two halves. Those who tolerate this and those who doesnt.
To me I guess the people who play with the abusers either haven't heard about it, or still feel they can get some kind of positive game experience out of this anyway.
I think this is interesting.... But it will never change my zero tolerance stance.
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On October 07 2010 05:45 Odds wrote:Show nested quote +On October 07 2010 05:33 blagoonga123 wrote:On October 06 2010 03:18 TadH wrote:
Everyone deserves a second chance.
Not sure if the people you're talking about have been caught numerous times, but with a new game comes new trust, or so I would think.
User was temp banned for this post. sorry why was this guy temp banned? I see nothing inflammatory or off topic about his post. Even if I don't agree with it. I will always give a person a second chance, but very rarely any chances beyond that. I don't get it either. There doesn't seem to be anything remotely banworthy in that post, not even deserving of a warn. I still disagree, though. A second chance, fine. If you are given a second chance, and then betray that, you are not only a worthless player, but a pathetic human being. Why would we want anyone like that in the community?
seriously? posting w/o reading the OP is banworthy and no it isnt an honest mistake. its ridiculous.
"yo OP, i dont know what ur talkin about becuz i didnt read what u said, but here is my opinion: "
ontopic: I voted no. But I think a player who gets caught once or twice could easily assimilate back into the community. Go play at a LAN and do as well as you are online. not that hard to regain trust
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blizzard should consider removing the fog of war for ALL players and then we can finally see who can actually play the game. i'd love to see some of the top layers fall from grace then when there's a level playing field.
i am sick of playing at a disadvantage.
random ladder games are just as important to the people who shelled out hard erned cash and who play fair and want to enjoy. i couldn't give a toss about tournament players.
blizzard should ban ALL accounts for those found cheating ...no 2nd chances.
force the kiddies to buy the game again under anew name.
sooner or later they'd get fed up.
sad to hear so many top players find it kind of acceptable. to me that suggests maphacking is much more ripe on battlenet than a lot of people admit.
so far over 5000 ppl got banned but i bet thats a small percentage of ppl who cheat.
iam starting to think that about 15% of current players use some kind of script, mod, hack or whatever.
it ruins the experience for honest gamers.
i am honestly considering asking for my money back on the game and using it for a little bag of weed, a lot less stressful 
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Quarkle, but the game is balanced around the lack of information afforded by fog of war.
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No.
If you get caught hacking in CSS, you are banned in all Source engine games (e.g. TF2), the way it should be.
If you get caught hacking in SC1, you shouldn't have a chance in SC2 just because it's a 'different game.'
Simply put, if you're enough of an idiot to cheat and justify doing so, changing what game you play will not change your mindset.
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On October 07 2010 14:23 Genome852 wrote:
No.
If you get caught hacking in CSS, you are banned in all Source engine games (e.g. TF2), the way it should be.
If you get caught hacking in SC1, you shouldn't have a chance in SC2 just because it's a 'different game.'
Simply put, if you're enough of an idiot to cheat and justify doing so, changing what game you play will not change your mindset.
Exactly, we don't need this to end up like many other professional sports, with winners constantly being caught using performance enhancers. Fortunately we can screen fairly well for major tournaments, but the ladder and the smaller tournaments are still vulnerable.
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On October 07 2010 14:23 Genome852 wrote:
No.
If you get caught hacking in CSS, you are banned in all Source engine games (e.g. TF2), the way it should be.
If you get caught hacking in SC1, you shouldn't have a chance in SC2 just because it's a 'different game.'
Simply put, if you're enough of an idiot to cheat and justify doing so, changing what game you play will not change your mindset.
Thats not true at all. You can always buy a new key and enter the tourneys under another alias or use the "my brother was on my account" excuse. The same holds true for sc2 as just because a player may have been "vacced" or account banned, the tournament organizers cant prove they cheated during their competition and thus have no reason to ban players.
But banning cheaters of previous games is entirely unfair in my opinion as SC2 is a new game and unrelated to its predecessor. It would be like banning you from playing Street fighter cos you cheated in Tekken. Although if you cheated in a tournament and were banned from all other events run by that tournament it would make sense. It seems unfair to punish someone for something they havent yet done.
Ultimately if you want cheaters of a current game to be blocked from playing in competitions you need to convince the tournament organisers to set up a blacklist of players that have been independantly proven by a panel of refs or a 3rd party that isnt working on that tourney to have cheated. For example if you have been proven as cheating ingame in the gosucup you are then barred from kraft/zotac/etc. It is really important to have an independant panel to judge the players to keep this valid and things like ladder abuse/matchfixing fall into a grey area because they arent "hacks".
Anyways it was a good idea to bring up the topic up because theres no point in single tournament bans when we have 3 or 4 cups running a week.
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On October 07 2010 14:23 Genome852 wrote:
No.
If you get caught hacking in CSS, you are banned in all Source engine games (e.g. TF2), the way it should be.
If you get caught hacking in SC1, you shouldn't have a chance in SC2 just because it's a 'different game.'
Simply put, if you're enough of an idiot to cheat and justify doing so, changing what game you play will not change your mindset.
I think they should give them a 1 month ban and they do it again, a perm ban.
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On October 07 2010 13:35 Nightfall.589 wrote:
Quarkle, but the game is balanced around the lack of information afforded by fog of war.
It used to be before the hacks started to surface.
lets face anyone can type maphack into google and in a few minutes you are good to go.
The authors even boast how they can stay one step ahead of blizzard.
Reminds of of virus, trojans and worms, virtually any script kiddie can knock something up to stay ahead.
really if blizzard removed the fog of war it would stop virtually ALL cheats in their tracks, as much as i like the tension of the fog if a good percentage of players can't handle it and feel the need to cheat then maybe it is time for blizzrd to remove it.?
only then would it be a level field ..with .reactions, skill, intelligence and speed being the only way to really win fair and square.
maybe blizzard could setup up a ladder for the cheating fuckers? but under no circumstances do they deserve a 2nd chance once they've been caught red handed.
trust me on this when i say the mindset of a cheat cannot be changed or trusted.
cheaters aren't misdirected individuals they were/are born with the predisposition, its in their genetic makeup
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to be honest, i dont think hackers should get a second chance. why? simply because it's pretty much the 'crime' of gaming lol. it's very likely that even if they get caught once, they'll be repeat offenders, and have hacked before.
i also wondered,
why does tadh get temp banned for: "Everyone deserves a second chance.Not sure if the people you're talking about have been caught numerous times, but with a new game comes new trust, or so I would think."
but iG.ClouD gets a warning for this:"Everyone voting yes is a fucking retard. You ruin the game along with them. I don't care about being banned for this post, this is my real opinion about this matter and it won't change."
?
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No. No tolerance should be taken whatsoever. All hackers who are caught should be perm banned right from first offense.
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Cheaters ruin competition, it's that simple. They're scum.
It's fine if you're cheating in single player or whatever unimportant stuff you're doing. Nobody cares about that.
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EPT
