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On May 30 2012 07:51 LuckoftheIrish wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 04:02 Felnarion wrote:
Not sure why Day9's casting takes so much shit too. I think it's just becoming a popular thing to do.
A couple reasons, I think. First and most importantly, it's become somewhat ok to do so recently. It wasn't that long ago that any criticism of the guy would get you roundly abused by his fans. That's fine, nothing wrong with people defending their favorites, but Day was basically bulletproof. And then people like Cloud and others made it known that maybe the dude isn't all sunshine and daisies, and the people who've thought for a while that he's a bit overrated had someone to give them cover. It's ok to criticize Day now, because Cloud did it and iNcontroL did it and IdrA did it, so you can as well. You know you're not in a minority of one anymore. Second, he's clearly changing his style. Watch a Brood War daily, then watch an early SC2 daily, and then watch a more recent one. There's a clear shift away from serious, lecture-style instruction towards a more loose, camera-on-my-face-while-I-tell-a-story style. Again, I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that, but it's undeniable. Third, I always remember a moment in the Chill/CombatEx showmatch series, in which Day criticizes something Chill does and says, "But what do I know? I'm just an A-level Zerg!" And it's totally true. Day was an A-level Zerg, one of the great foreign players with a fantastic analytical mind. But in Starcraft 2... he's not an A-level player anymore. He's not a player at all, really; I mean, we know he plays the game, and we know he's good at it and knows things. But the highest level of accomplishment he has in Starcraft 2 is being GM with three races. And that's a fantastic achievement, for you and me. But JP is Masters with Random, and if you brought him up as an example of a great analytical caster (sorry JP!) you'd get laughed off the forum. Does one level of ladder rank really make that much difference? So the popularity thing is important, but there are also legitimate points to make.
It's not just the style of the dailies, his casting style has shifted from analytical with some insight on the metagame, to a sequence of exaggerated shouting and whispering with a little bit of dwelling on pointless details thrown in. Some people may enjoy his new style compared to his old, but there is no doubt his casting has changed.
At the start of SC2 he was a caster who could be a draw for any tournament, I would watch games I normally wouldn't because day was casting. Now it has become pretty much the opposite for me, I try to avoid his casting as much as possible.
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On May 30 2012 08:03 Duravi wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 07:51 LuckoftheIrish wrote:On May 30 2012 04:02 Felnarion wrote:
Not sure why Day9's casting takes so much shit too. I think it's just becoming a popular thing to do.
A couple reasons, I think. First and most importantly, it's become somewhat ok to do so recently. It wasn't that long ago that any criticism of the guy would get you roundly abused by his fans. That's fine, nothing wrong with people defending their favorites, but Day was basically bulletproof. And then people like Cloud and others made it known that maybe the dude isn't all sunshine and daisies, and the people who've thought for a while that he's a bit overrated had someone to give them cover. It's ok to criticize Day now, because Cloud did it and iNcontroL did it and IdrA did it, so you can as well. You know you're not in a minority of one anymore. Second, he's clearly changing his style. Watch a Brood War daily, then watch an early SC2 daily, and then watch a more recent one. There's a clear shift away from serious, lecture-style instruction towards a more loose, camera-on-my-face-while-I-tell-a-story style. Again, I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that, but it's undeniable. Third, I always remember a moment in the Chill/CombatEx showmatch series, in which Day criticizes something Chill does and says, "But what do I know? I'm just an A-level Zerg!" And it's totally true. Day was an A-level Zerg, one of the great foreign players with a fantastic analytical mind. But in Starcraft 2... he's not an A-level player anymore. He's not a player at all, really; I mean, we know he plays the game, and we know he's good at it and knows things. But the highest level of accomplishment he has in Starcraft 2 is being GM with three races. And that's a fantastic achievement, for you and me. But JP is Masters with Random, and if you brought him up as an example of a great analytical caster (sorry JP!) you'd get laughed off the forum. Does one level of ladder rank really make that much difference? So the popularity thing is important, but there are also legitimate points to make. It's not just the style of the dailies, his casting style has shifted from analytical with some insight on the metagame, to a sequence of exaggerated shouting and whispering with a little bit of dwelling on pointless details thrown in. Some people may enjoy his new style compared to his old, but there is no doubt his casting has changed. At the start of SC2 he was a caster who could be a draw for any tournament, I would watch games I normally wouldn't because day was casting. Now it has become pretty much the opposite for me, I try to avoid his casting as much as possible.
He changes his dailys to what his fans want. His casting style hasn't changed at all in SC2 from what i can tell, although there may be more fluff in there, but every game needs some fluff.
People just like to jump all over the people that are down and kick them. See any witch hunt for an example of this. Day 9 might not be a perfect person, but neither are Incontrol, Huk, Boxer, or anyone else, and I still think they are awesome.
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lol @ the people acting like they care about LS and the competitive atmosphere of esports so much that they need to crusade against him on the forums. Do you honestly give a fuck that he forfeited a match at a tournament? He said he had personal issues and doesn't want to divulge them to the public (completely understandable). He has stated in the past that he has mental health issues. Do you know how bad his issues are that you can state with a reasonable amount of certainty that the benefits to esports of not forfeiting outweighed the personal negative effects of his mental health issues? No, you don't, because you don't have enough information.
TL; DR: Smarten up or shut the fuck up.
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On May 30 2012 08:10 Doodsmack wrote:
lol @ the people acting like they care about LS and the competitive atmosphere of esports so much that they need to crusade against him on the forums. Do you honestly give a fuck that he forfeited a match at a tournament? He said he had personal issues and doesn't want to divulge them to the public (completely understandable). He has stated in the past that he has mental health issues. Do you know how bad his issues are that you can state with a reasonable amount of certainty that the benefits to esports of not forfeiting outweighed the personal negative effects of his mental health issues? No, you don't, because you don't have enough information.
TL; DR: Smarten up or shut the fuck up.
If he can't participate in tournaments, he shouldn't participate in tournaments. While I'm sorry to hear that he may have mental health issues, he knew precisely what he was doing and made the choice to do so anyway; in squandering this choice, he gave a middle finger to the community much like Naniwa did when Probe rushing (especially when playing Parting was relevant for seeding).
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On May 30 2012 08:10 Doodsmack wrote:
lol @ the people acting like they care about LS and the competitive atmosphere of esports so much that they need to crusade against him on the forums. Do you honestly give a fuck that he forfeited a match at a tournament? He said he had personal issues and doesn't want to divulge them to the public (completely understandable). He has stated in the past that he has mental health issues. Do you know how bad his issues are that you can state with a reasonable amount of certainty that the benefits to esports of not forfeiting outweighed the personal negative effects of his mental health issues? No, you don't, because you don't have enough information.
TL; DR: Smarten up or shut the fuck up.
As I think TT1 said. Someone is going to end up killing themselves or the witchhunt BS that people pull online and he wont enjoy saying I told you so. These are not people who have trainers in how to deal with media and fans like pro sports players and such. They are like you and me, only they have 200,000 people watching them play matches at MLG and 5000+ flaming them and calling them all sorts of shit when they do something wrong.
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On May 30 2012 08:14 Shiori wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 08:10 Doodsmack wrote:
lol @ the people acting like they care about LS and the competitive atmosphere of esports so much that they need to crusade against him on the forums. Do you honestly give a fuck that he forfeited a match at a tournament? He said he had personal issues and doesn't want to divulge them to the public (completely understandable). He has stated in the past that he has mental health issues. Do you know how bad his issues are that you can state with a reasonable amount of certainty that the benefits to esports of not forfeiting outweighed the personal negative effects of his mental health issues? No, you don't, because you don't have enough information.
TL; DR: Smarten up or shut the fuck up. If he can't participate in tournaments, he shouldn't participate in tournaments. While I'm sorry to hear that he may have mental health issues, he knew precisely what he was doing and made the choice to do so anyway; in squandering this choice, he gave a middle finger to the community much like Naniwa did when Probe rushing (especially when playing Parting was relevant for seeding).
How do you know that LS knew that the tournament might cause his mental health issues to flare up? Do you know enough about mental health issues to say with a reasonable amount of certainty that not a single one of them has the potential to flare up unexpectedly? Please explain your reasoning.
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On May 30 2012 08:10 Doodsmack wrote:
lol @ the people acting like they care about LS and the competitive atmosphere of esports so much that they need to crusade against him on the forums. Do you honestly give a fuck that he forfeited a match at a tournament? He said he had personal issues and doesn't want to divulge them to the public (completely understandable). He has stated in the past that he has mental health issues. Do you know how bad his issues are that you can state with a reasonable amount of certainty that the benefits to esports of not forfeiting outweighed the personal negative effects of his mental health issues? No, you don't, because you don't have enough information.
TL; DR: Smarten up or shut the fuck up.
Yea buts its ok to flame wolf because to your knowledge he doesnt have any mental health issues?
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^ lol keep acting like that is relevant to whatever argument I'm in bud. We're talking about LS forfeiting a tournament match here.
EDIT: And I'm not sure what kind of vendetta you have against LS but I can count at least 10-15 posts against him, including in his FANCLUB thread and his stream thread lol. Does it go back to his BW days?
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On May 30 2012 06:23 takingbackoj wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 03:47 yeint wrote:On May 30 2012 03:46 Neelia wrote:On May 30 2012 03:45 yeint wrote:On May 30 2012 01:47 SeinGalton wrote:On May 30 2012 00:56 Angel_ wrote:On May 30 2012 00:50 yeint wrote:On May 29 2012 21:27 SeinGalton wrote:Actually thought Day's response was a little wierd: "Day[9], some people are saying you're only doing this for the money and that you're disingenuous." "No, I work really hard." Stephano actually gave Day the correct answer at the LAN: "Stupid question." On May 29 2012 08:46 Duravi wrote:
Don't forget, he still got $500 even for bombing out. So we can confirm that LS lacked the decency to also forfeit his last place prize money? I was hoping this wasn't the case, because if it is ... well that would be disgusting behaviour. Are you actually being serious? yes, he is actually being serious. Welcome to the burn-everyone-at-the-stake members of the community that don't actually think about things in any sort of realistic "real-world" way that are really actually offended over anything they can be. Hopefully a reddit thread won't get made about it so there's a chance LS will still be allowed to try to qualify in the future. Then again he's not on a team to kick him, doesn't have sponsors to boot him, and Gom probably doesn't give a shit about enraged community (like most sponsors and tournaments really should given our community). I'm actually not invested in the welfare of ls, nor do I find something that has no bearing on me offensive. That may have come off as more vitriolic than I intended, but $500 is a lot of cash where I'm from and considering his contentious invitation I'm surprised that he didn't do his best to redeem it. Of course a weekend of competitive SC2 for $500 might be hard bargain and I might be wrong. Even if it is not - even if what LS did is deplorable and there is no way to justify it - I'm the last person interested in doing anything about it. But considering that I actually work weeks for that kind of cash, I'm sure you can see how I find it pretty disgusting. Do you not understand how purchasing power parity works? $500 is not a massive amount of money in the US, because it buys far less goods/services than it would in SA. It might take you weeks to earn $500, but there are parts of the world where people need to work for months for that kind of money. And contrariwise there are places where $500 won't even pay a week's rent in a modest apartment. At any rate, Lastshadow did exactly what he was supposed to do - he competed and tried to win. So he wasn't the best invite, who gives a shit? There have been questionable invites to many invitationals and no one lost their shit over it. But apparently a certain subset of the Starcraft community is so addicted to Internet drama they just can't pass up an opportunity to use this incredibly trivial non-issue to crucify Day9, as some sort of amazing act of iconoclasm. Anyone who doesn't respect Day9 for the work he's done over years and years for this game is a drooling retard. He'd literally have to pull some sort of Gus Ledesma crap to deserve scorn from anyone. Forfeiting 1/3 of his matches = competing? Okay.. Forfeiting one out of his three matches, because he was sick and had no chance to improve his standing even if he won. Completely disagree with this. Quitting like that underminds the sport.
it undermines nothing, and it actually happens in other sports as well. It's not uncommon for curling teams to forfeit sets if a match is unwinnable. Another recent example was where Norwegian javelin thrower Andreas Thorkildsen exited a competition half way through - basically because he "wasn't feeling it" (it was raining) and he was afraid of causing injury if he stayed in the competition. And there was no controversy about it - imagine that. Things like this happen frequently in the real world of real sports.. LS dropping out of a competition he was in no position to win is understandable and trivial
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On May 30 2012 10:18 Apollo_Shards wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 08:10 Doodsmack wrote:
lol @ the people acting like they care about LS and the competitive atmosphere of esports so much that they need to crusade against him on the forums. Do you honestly give a fuck that he forfeited a match at a tournament? He said he had personal issues and doesn't want to divulge them to the public (completely understandable). He has stated in the past that he has mental health issues. Do you know how bad his issues are that you can state with a reasonable amount of certainty that the benefits to esports of not forfeiting outweighed the personal negative effects of his mental health issues? No, you don't, because you don't have enough information.
TL; DR: Smarten up or shut the fuck up. Yea buts its ok to flame wolf because to your knowledge he doesnt have any mental health issues?
Ya mental issues are serious things, but if it keeps you from playing at top level tournaments you should stop trying to compete, get help, then come back later. Should we just accept the fact that he can quit at any tournament because he has issues? Everyone has problems and public figures are no different. It happens in football, baseball, any type of sport. It's one thing for a guy to quit mid tournament and say "well guys I have issues I have to deal with before I continue on with my career". Its another thing for a guy to quit mid tournament and say "well guys I have some issues but im going to keep on going and everyone else can deal with it."
I don't care if someone has a serious problem and they can still compete. Thats great, shows a lot of character but if it gives you the right to just quit whenever you want without question then its not right. Im not witch hunting here, im just being honest.
Quitting in the middle of a match or tournament or whatever isn't accepted in any serious sport without consequences. If he needs help then he should put his career on hold and get it like anyone else would if they were incapable of performing. Thats how the real world works.
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On May 30 2012 11:11 Quotidian wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 06:23 takingbackoj wrote:On May 30 2012 03:47 yeint wrote:On May 30 2012 03:46 Neelia wrote:On May 30 2012 03:45 yeint wrote:On May 30 2012 01:47 SeinGalton wrote:On May 30 2012 00:56 Angel_ wrote:On May 30 2012 00:50 yeint wrote:On May 29 2012 21:27 SeinGalton wrote:Actually thought Day's response was a little wierd: "Day[9], some people are saying you're only doing this for the money and that you're disingenuous." "No, I work really hard." Stephano actually gave Day the correct answer at the LAN: "Stupid question." On May 29 2012 08:46 Duravi wrote:
Don't forget, he still got $500 even for bombing out. So we can confirm that LS lacked the decency to also forfeit his last place prize money? I was hoping this wasn't the case, because if it is ... well that would be disgusting behaviour. Are you actually being serious? yes, he is actually being serious. Welcome to the burn-everyone-at-the-stake members of the community that don't actually think about things in any sort of realistic "real-world" way that are really actually offended over anything they can be. Hopefully a reddit thread won't get made about it so there's a chance LS will still be allowed to try to qualify in the future. Then again he's not on a team to kick him, doesn't have sponsors to boot him, and Gom probably doesn't give a shit about enraged community (like most sponsors and tournaments really should given our community). I'm actually not invested in the welfare of ls, nor do I find something that has no bearing on me offensive. That may have come off as more vitriolic than I intended, but $500 is a lot of cash where I'm from and considering his contentious invitation I'm surprised that he didn't do his best to redeem it. Of course a weekend of competitive SC2 for $500 might be hard bargain and I might be wrong. Even if it is not - even if what LS did is deplorable and there is no way to justify it - I'm the last person interested in doing anything about it. But considering that I actually work weeks for that kind of cash, I'm sure you can see how I find it pretty disgusting. Do you not understand how purchasing power parity works? $500 is not a massive amount of money in the US, because it buys far less goods/services than it would in SA. It might take you weeks to earn $500, but there are parts of the world where people need to work for months for that kind of money. And contrariwise there are places where $500 won't even pay a week's rent in a modest apartment. At any rate, Lastshadow did exactly what he was supposed to do - he competed and tried to win. So he wasn't the best invite, who gives a shit? There have been questionable invites to many invitationals and no one lost their shit over it. But apparently a certain subset of the Starcraft community is so addicted to Internet drama they just can't pass up an opportunity to use this incredibly trivial non-issue to crucify Day9, as some sort of amazing act of iconoclasm. Anyone who doesn't respect Day9 for the work he's done over years and years for this game is a drooling retard. He'd literally have to pull some sort of Gus Ledesma crap to deserve scorn from anyone. Forfeiting 1/3 of his matches = competing? Okay.. Forfeiting one out of his three matches, because he was sick and had no chance to improve his standing even if he won. Completely disagree with this. Quitting like that underminds the sport. it undermines nothing, and it actually happens in other sports as well. It's not uncommon for curling teams to forfeit sets if a match is unwinnable. Another recent example was where Norwegian javelin thrower Andreas Thorkildsen exited a competition half way through - basically because he "wasn't feeling it" (it was raining) and he was afraid of causing injury if he stayed in the competition. And there was no controversy about it - imagine that. Things like this happen frequently in the real world of real sports.. LS dropping out of a competition he was in no position to win is understandable and trivial
Theres a huge difference between fearing you might cause injury due to bad conditions and being sick. Not comparable at all. Things like this may or may not happen in some sports (not any I watch) but it doesn't happen in Starcraft. Could you imagine any great player quitting before they played the matches they signed on to play because they weren't feeling it? Jaedong? MVP? Violet?
Thats just a bad excuse im sorry and you have to realize that its bad for the game. Trivial? Maybe to you but I imagine some people take that kind of thing serious like the players and as I posted earlier the outcome of that match could have changed the outcome of the group.
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On May 30 2012 11:16 takingbackoj wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 10:18 Apollo_Shards wrote:On May 30 2012 08:10 Doodsmack wrote:
lol @ the people acting like they care about LS and the competitive atmosphere of esports so much that they need to crusade against him on the forums. Do you honestly give a fuck that he forfeited a match at a tournament? He said he had personal issues and doesn't want to divulge them to the public (completely understandable). He has stated in the past that he has mental health issues. Do you know how bad his issues are that you can state with a reasonable amount of certainty that the benefits to esports of not forfeiting outweighed the personal negative effects of his mental health issues? No, you don't, because you don't have enough information.
TL; DR: Smarten up or shut the fuck up. Quitting in the middle of a match or tournament or whatever isn't accepted in any serious sport without consequences. If he needs help then he should put his career on hold and get it like anyone else would if they were incapable of performing. Thats how the real world works. Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 11:23 takingbackoj wrote:On May 30 2012 11:11 Quotidian wrote:On May 30 2012 06:23 takingbackoj wrote:On May 30 2012 03:47 yeint wrote:On May 30 2012 03:46 Neelia wrote:On May 30 2012 03:45 yeint wrote:On May 30 2012 01:47 SeinGalton wrote:On May 30 2012 00:56 Angel_ wrote:On May 30 2012 00:50 yeint wrote:
[quote]
Are you actually being serious? yes, he is actually being serious. Welcome to the burn-everyone-at-the-stake members of the community that don't actually think about things in any sort of realistic "real-world" way that are really actually offended over anything they can be. Hopefully a reddit thread won't get made about it so there's a chance LS will still be allowed to try to qualify in the future. Then again he's not on a team to kick him, doesn't have sponsors to boot him, and Gom probably doesn't give a shit about enraged community (like most sponsors and tournaments really should given our community). I'm actually not invested in the welfare of ls, nor do I find something that has no bearing on me offensive. That may have come off as more vitriolic than I intended, but $500 is a lot of cash where I'm from and considering his contentious invitation I'm surprised that he didn't do his best to redeem it. Of course a weekend of competitive SC2 for $500 might be hard bargain and I might be wrong. Even if it is not - even if what LS did is deplorable and there is no way to justify it - I'm the last person interested in doing anything about it. But considering that I actually work weeks for that kind of cash, I'm sure you can see how I find it pretty disgusting. Do you not understand how purchasing power parity works? $500 is not a massive amount of money in the US, because it buys far less goods/services than it would in SA. It might take you weeks to earn $500, but there are parts of the world where people need to work for months for that kind of money. And contrariwise there are places where $500 won't even pay a week's rent in a modest apartment. At any rate, Lastshadow did exactly what he was supposed to do - he competed and tried to win. So he wasn't the best invite, who gives a shit? There have been questionable invites to many invitationals and no one lost their shit over it. But apparently a certain subset of the Starcraft community is so addicted to Internet drama they just can't pass up an opportunity to use this incredibly trivial non-issue to crucify Day9, as some sort of amazing act of iconoclasm. Anyone who doesn't respect Day9 for the work he's done over years and years for this game is a drooling retard. He'd literally have to pull some sort of Gus Ledesma crap to deserve scorn from anyone. Forfeiting 1/3 of his matches = competing? Okay.. Forfeiting one out of his three matches, because he was sick and had no chance to improve his standing even if he won. Completely disagree with this. Quitting like that underminds the sport. it undermines nothing, and it actually happens in other sports as well. It's not uncommon for curling teams to forfeit sets if a match is unwinnable. Another recent example was where Norwegian javelin thrower Andreas Thorkildsen exited a competition half way through - basically because he "wasn't feeling it" (it was raining) and he was afraid of causing injury if he stayed in the competition. And there was no controversy about it - imagine that. Things like this happen frequently in the real world of real sports.. LS dropping out of a competition he was in no position to win is understandable and trivial Theres a huge difference between fearing you might cause injury due to bad conditions and being sick. Not comparable at all. Things like this may or may not happen in some sports (not any I watch) but it doesn't happen in Starcraft. Could you imagine any great player quitting before they played the matches they signed on to play because they weren't feeling it? Jaedong? MVP? Violet? Thats just a bad excuse im sorry and you have to realize that its bad for the game. Trivial? Maybe to you but I imagine some people take that kind of thing serious like the players and as I posted earlier the outcome of that match could have changed the outcome of the group.
I gave you real, serious sports example of someone quitting without there being any consequences, so whatever... the only thing that's not comparable here is that Andreas Thorkildsen was basically satisfied with his result and decided to build on that and focus on the London Olympics, while LS went 0-3 and had a shitty showing and there were thousands of people who were more interested in seeing him fail than the actual tournament (myself included) Beyond that, it's as fair a comparison as you can get, given that the sports have very little common ground.
LS didn't quit in "the middle of a tournament." He was essentially competing for last place. There are countless marathon runners or cross country skiers or whatever who quit for whatever reason before they reach the finish line - without consequences. Some of the time it is simply because it's not their day. Shit happens - if you quit all the time, you'll eventually get dropped by sponsors/not get invited again, etc. But LS leaving when he was for all intents and purposes out of the competition is not something that would have consequences if this was golf or whatever. It would only have consequences if it kept on happening
It is completely trivial because the game he forfeited didn't matter. What's so difficult to understand about that? LS was obviously not mentally in the game, so the result would've been the same if he played or if he forfeited. The standing of the group wouldn't have changed at all. People forfeit games at MLG all the time, but when LS does it, bring out yer pitchforks! If Jaedong or whoever you mentioned was competing for last place and he decided to give up at that point, then yes, I'd be completely fine with that. The last thing SC2 needs as an esport is more meaningless games
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On May 30 2012 10:52 Doodsmack wrote:
^ lol keep acting like that is relevant to whatever argument I'm in bud. We're talking about LS forfeiting a tournament match here.
EDIT: And I'm not sure what kind of vendetta you have against LS but I can count at least 10-15 posts against him, including in his FANCLUB thread and his stream thread lol. Does it go back to his BW days?
It is amusing how you tell people to lay off somebody while telling a different person they are fucking horrible and should work at walmart. That is all I am pointing out.
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On May 30 2012 11:16 takingbackoj wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 10:18 Apollo_Shards wrote:On May 30 2012 08:10 Doodsmack wrote:
lol @ the people acting like they care about LS and the competitive atmosphere of esports so much that they need to crusade against him on the forums. Do you honestly give a fuck that he forfeited a match at a tournament? He said he had personal issues and doesn't want to divulge them to the public (completely understandable). He has stated in the past that he has mental health issues. Do you know how bad his issues are that you can state with a reasonable amount of certainty that the benefits to esports of not forfeiting outweighed the personal negative effects of his mental health issues? No, you don't, because you don't have enough information.
TL; DR: Smarten up or shut the fuck up. Yea buts its ok to flame wolf because to your knowledge he doesnt have any mental health issues? Ya mental issues are serious things, but if it keeps you from playing at top level tournaments you should stop trying to compete, get help, then come back later. Should we just accept the fact that he can quit at any tournament because he has issues? Everyone has problems and public figures are no different. It happens in football, baseball, any type of sport. It's one thing for a guy to quit mid tournament and say "well guys I have issues I have to deal with before I continue on with my career". Its another thing for a guy to quit mid tournament and say "well guys I have some issues but im going to keep on going and everyone else can deal with it." I don't care if someone has a serious problem and they can still compete. Thats great, shows a lot of character but if it gives you the right to just quit whenever you want without question then its not right. Im not witch hunting here, im just being honest. Quitting in the middle of a match or tournament or whatever isn't accepted in any serious sport without consequences. If he needs help then he should put his career on hold and get it like anyone else would if they were incapable of performing. Thats how the real world works.
Obviously if he has debilitating issues he should put competition on hold. I would just point out that this was his first major LAN in a long time so it's plausible that he didn't see it coming, but now he knows. We don't know either way because we do not have enough information. Therefore we shouldn't draw sweeping conclusions.
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On May 30 2012 07:51 LuckoftheIrish wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 04:02 Felnarion wrote:
Not sure why Day9's casting takes so much shit too. I think it's just becoming a popular thing to do.
A couple reasons, I think. First and most importantly, it's become somewhat ok to do so recently. It wasn't that long ago that any criticism of the guy would get you roundly abused by his fans. That's fine, nothing wrong with people defending their favorites, but Day was basically bulletproof. And then people like Cloud and others made it known that maybe the dude isn't all sunshine and daisies, and the people who've thought for a while that he's a bit overrated had someone to give them cover. It's ok to criticize Day now, because Cloud did it and iNcontroL did it and IdrA did it, so you can as well. You know you're not in a minority of one anymore. Second, he's clearly changing his style. Watch a Brood War daily, then watch an early SC2 daily, and then watch a more recent one. There's a clear shift away from serious, lecture-style instruction towards a more loose, camera-on-my-face-while-I-tell-a-story style. Again, I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that, but it's undeniable. Third, I always remember a moment in the Chill/CombatEx showmatch series, in which Day criticizes something Chill does and says, "But what do I know? I'm just an A-level Zerg!" And it's totally true. Day was an A-level Zerg, one of the great foreign players with a fantastic analytical mind. But in Starcraft 2... he's not an A-level player anymore. He's not a player at all, really; I mean, we know he plays the game, and we know he's good at it and knows things. But the highest level of accomplishment he has in Starcraft 2 is being GM with three races. And that's a fantastic achievement, for you and me. But JP is Masters with Random, and if you brought him up as an example of a great analytical caster (sorry JP!) you'd get laughed off the forum. Does one level of ladder rank really make that much difference? So the popularity thing is important, but there are also legitimate points to make.
It's one thing to recognize a change in style and point it out, it's completely another the outright hate that's going on for changing a casting style. Using RBBG as an example? He still has better understanding than most casters, he still offers more entertainment than most casters, all while he helped organize the freaking tournament.
At any rate, so what if he's not showing top level performance? First, doesn't mean he's capable of it (he likely is) and second, during what time could he do it? Guy's organizing tournaments and content constantly, when can he play? Everyone just wants to use up personalities and then spit them out.
Gimme gimme gimme more content, gimme more dailies, more tournaments, more casting, better casting, be a competitive pro player, do it all for free. Some players focus on nothing but playing, that's their job, and they never post wins, never post any relevant tournament results...Why would Day9 try go full time to be a pro, when he's already full time building tournaments, viewers, and awareness? Because some nerds question his ability to make every call correctly, or speak in a tone they prefer?
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So, I don't mean to interrupt this absolutely thrilling discussion, but any news on State of the Game?
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On May 30 2012 21:34 Dismay wrote:
So, I don't mean to interrupt this absolutely thrilling discussion, but any news on State of the Game?
I agree with you sir. I am totally over the whole issue and the eternal debate who should be invited to what and why. Planning the next Redbull lan will be as much fun as planning a wedding with your drunk/slightly-criminal inlaws.
But on to real topics, when do we get more SotG glory? I have not seen enough Nony this month.
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On May 31 2012 03:15 Plansix wrote:Show nested quote +On May 30 2012 21:34 Dismay wrote:
So, I don't mean to interrupt this absolutely thrilling discussion, but any news on State of the Game? I agree with you sir. I am totally over the whole issue and the eternal debate who should be invited to what and why. Planning the next Redbull lan will be as much fun as planning a wedding with your drunk/slightly-criminal inlaws. But on to real topics, when do we get more SotG glory? I have not seen enough Nony this month.
if they have an episode this week, don't get your hopes up for nony being on. he's finishing up moving to California this week.
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iNcontroL
USA29055 Posts
On May 30 2012 21:34 Dismay wrote:
So, I don't mean to interrupt this absolutely thrilling discussion, but any news on State of the Game?
Well not sure why it hasn't been said yet but we plan on doing one thurs.. usual ish time. JP will confirm that when it's finalized.. have to grab everyone's schedule 
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EPT
