On May 30 2012 21:34 Dismay wrote: So, I don't mean to interrupt this absolutely thrilling discussion, but any news on State of the Game?
I agree with you sir. I am totally over the whole issue and the eternal debate who should be invited to what and why. Planning the next Redbull lan will be as much fun as planning a wedding with your drunk/slightly-criminal inlaws.
But on to real topics, when do we get more SotG glory? I have not seen enough Nony this month.
if they have an episode this week, don't get your hopes up for nony being on. he's finishing up moving to California this week.
I will continue to hope, but be understanding if he is busy. After all, the closer he is to the Blizzard main office, the more likley it is that he just walks in one day and says "David, I've seen the latest patch notes. We need to talk."
On May 30 2012 21:34 Dismay wrote: So, I don't mean to interrupt this absolutely thrilling discussion, but any news on State of the Game?
Well not sure why it hasn't been said yet but we plan on doing one thurs.. usual ish time. JP will confirm that when it's finalized.. have to grab everyone's schedule
This will probably get lost amidst the righteous pitchforks being raising for the betterment of ESPORTS, but good shit, hope it happens.
On May 31 2012 03:33 iNcontroL wrote: woops stand corrected.. we aiming for monday now!
Sorry bout that. Planned to do show tomorrow but realized we'd have more to talk about on Monday + no guests for tomorrow since Tyler is driving to Cali on Friday and Artosis is on vacation currently.
They should get Day on the show (If he has the time of course) and have him talk about what he is thinking of the recent critique on his casting style and weather or not he thinks he has really changed since the early times of his dailies.
On May 31 2012 03:40 KazmA wrote: They should get Day on the show (If he has the time of course) and have him talk about what he is thinking of the recent critique on his casting style and weather or not he thinks he has really changed since the early times of his dailies.
He actually has on kings of tin I think the show was? Might have been live on three, one of the other shows djwheat does with scoots/slasher day 9 was talked to about it.
On May 31 2012 03:40 KazmA wrote: They should get Day on the show (If he has the time of course) and have him talk about what he is thinking of the recent critique on his casting style and weather or not he thinks he has really changed since the early times of his dailies.
He actually has on kings of tin I think the show was? Might have been live on three, one of the other shows djwheat does with scoots/slasher day 9 was talked to about it.
Yeah it was the latest live on three. But if I remember correctly they talked mostly about redbull battlegrounds, lastshadow's invite and the fact that Day earns money. Nothing that I remember about his casting style.
The criticism about Day[9] is pretty dumb. Generally people say something like: "I used to like him a lot, but gradually his style changed. Instead of being mostly analytical it turned into Day[9] story time." However, I've seen three instances of this that all follow this pattern, but they follow a different time line. I think it's just the natural reaction some have to his personality, because if you take a look at the older dailies (beta) it's more story time than recent dailies(I only watched like 3 this year though). I myself found Day[9] really annoyed me at first, before I got used to his mannerisms (still back in the beta), though some time after I stopped watching him his mannerisms would annoy me again until I got used to it once more.
And there was criticism about his casting style way back to the first IEM in Germany (with Morrow's 5-rax reaper victory) where he co-casted with Apollo. A lot of viewers complained he would shout over Apollo constantly (and the consensus was his solo casting was better than his dual casting). So if there is an annoyance at his "overly loud" casting style, that's not a recent change, it was always there.
I also found this article by him. (link) Try reading it in the "Day[9] voice" and you can see he still talks exactly the same now as he did three years ago. So instead of Day[9] turning into a caricature of himself, I think that people just naturally got over their infatuation with him, while he remained on the pedestal we built for him in the beta and early release. (eventually leading to some resentment) After all, he only has a limited number of insights from his Brood War experience and eventually he's going to repeat himself. Simply move on, at this point, instead of constructing this "Day[9] has changed!!1" narrative. (and of course we have a lot of other good content creators available now, so he's less 'special')
I do wish he wasn't so insulated. It seems like he's barely a member of the community these days, cozying with sponsors like Red Bull or doing something like the AHGL project instead. But even so, he has some responsibility for Red Bull being in the scene at all. Same for the Vile/Quantic merger that was supported by Google employees that got interested in the scene by Day[9]'s AHGL.
Also, if he makes money, then let him, it's not his fault if people donate to him or pay him to come to events. And if you don't like his casting, don't watch his casts - even if he's at MLG there are many streams available where he's not casting. And if you doubt his ability to get to Grand Master don't forget he used to be one of the best foreigner zergs out there, with really good mechanics. He's not beyond criticism (and the fact you could never criticize him out of fear of being attacked by fans was annoying), but outside of this Last Shadow debacle, he hardly deserves any of the negative portrayals that appear on TL&Reddit nowadays.
I'm saying all of this, because I went into the Red Bull Battlegrounds tournament kind of hyper aware of possible negative aspects of Day[9], since I had read so much criticism about him the days before. But even if I wasn't super happy about the casting and production at the event (the player intro was ridiculous and the casting lacked a bit on the analytical side), he still got me quite excited a lot of times and in general he was a positive factor for the event. (again, outside of the Last Shadow thing)
I won't be able to do Monday (wouldn't have been able to do any time on any day really haha. This is what JP has to put up with...). See you guys in Anaheim!
On May 30 2012 21:34 Dismay wrote: So, I don't mean to interrupt this absolutely thrilling discussion, but any news on State of the Game?
I agree with you sir. I am totally over the whole issue and the eternal debate who should be invited to what and why. Planning the next Redbull lan will be as much fun as planning a wedding with your drunk/slightly-criminal inlaws.
But on to real topics, when do we get more SotG glory? I have not seen enough Nony this month.
if they have an episode this week, don't get your hopes up for nony being on. he's finishing up moving to California this week.
I will continue to hope, but be understanding if he is busy. After all, the closer he is to the Blizzard main office, the more likley it is that he just walks in one day and says "David, I've seen the latest patch notes. We need to talk."
Location: MLG Anahiem, Live State of the Game, from a Barcraft. Guests: KeSPA invites, Sundance, David Kim, Slasher, Wheat, Day[9], Tastosis, Incontol, Nony, Nazgul, and Hwanni. Time: As long as it takes Possible special appearences by: poopfeast420, goatlust, Cella, Anna (ONLY via Incontrol's cellphone and ONLY when Nony is making a point), Huk, Demuslim (with full on english accent), Sir Scoots (in a rocking chair recanting ye old PC stories from when you had to move your mouse through 4 feet of snow, both ways) and Dustin Browder.
Look I know your busy with MLG and SC2 and your new show, and traveling and dealing with this thread and casting and playing starcraft among other things. But for once....think of the ratings this would get....think of the numbas....
Location: MLG Anahiem, Live State of the Game, from a Barcraft. Guests: KeSPA invites, Sundance, David Kim, Slasher, Wheat, Day[9], Tastosis, Incontol, Nony, Nazgul, and Hwanni. Time: As long as it takes Possible special appearences by: poopfeast420, goatlust, Cella, Anna (ONLY via Incontrol's cellphone and ONLY when Nony is making a point), Huk, Demuslim (with full on english accent), Sir Scoots (in a rocking chair recanting ye old PC stories from when you had to move your mouse through 4 feet of snow, both ways) and Dustin Browder.
Look I know your busy with MLG and SC2 and your new show, and traveling and dealing with this thread and casting and playing starcraft among other things. But for once....think of the ratings this would get....think of the numbas....
From, GrackersNCheese
dont get your hopes up. Sunday night at the EG/TL/Complexity/Dignitas barcraft is where all the players will be most likely and there is gonna be a live Live On Three
On May 30 2012 04:02 Felnarion wrote: Not sure why Day9's casting takes so much shit too. I think it's just becoming a popular thing to do.
A couple reasons, I think. First and most importantly, it's become somewhat ok to do so recently. It wasn't that long ago that any criticism of the guy would get you roundly abused by his fans. That's fine, nothing wrong with people defending their favorites, but Day was basically bulletproof. And then people like Cloud and others made it known that maybe the dude isn't all sunshine and daisies, and the people who've thought for a while that he's a bit overrated had someone to give them cover. It's ok to criticize Day now, because Cloud did it and iNcontroL did it and IdrA did it, so you can as well. You know you're not in a minority of one anymore.
Second, he's clearly changing his style. Watch a Brood War daily, then watch an early SC2 daily, and then watch a more recent one. There's a clear shift away from serious, lecture-style instruction towards a more loose, camera-on-my-face-while-I-tell-a-story style. Again, I'm not saying there's anything wrong with that, but it's undeniable.
Third, I always remember a moment in the Chill/CombatEx showmatch series, in which Day criticizes something Chill does and says, "But what do I know? I'm just an A-level Zerg!" And it's totally true. Day was an A-level Zerg, one of the great foreign players with a fantastic analytical mind. But in Starcraft 2... he's not an A-level player anymore. He's not a player at all, really; I mean, we know he plays the game, and we know he's good at it and knows things. But the highest level of accomplishment he has in Starcraft 2 is being GM with three races. And that's a fantastic achievement, for you and me. But JP is Masters with Random, and if you brought him up as an example of a great analytical caster (sorry JP!) you'd get laughed off the forum. Does one level of ladder rank really make that much difference?
So the popularity thing is important, but there are also legitimate points to make.
It's one thing to recognize a change in style and point it out, it's completely another the outright hate that's going on for changing a casting style. Using RBBG as an example? He still has better understanding than most casters, he still offers more entertainment than most casters, all while he helped organize the freaking tournament.
At any rate, so what if he's not showing top level performance? First, doesn't mean he's capable of it (he likely is) and second, during what time could he do it? Guy's organizing tournaments and content constantly, when can he play? Everyone just wants to use up personalities and then spit them out.
Gimme gimme gimme more content, gimme more dailies, more tournaments, more casting, better casting, be a competitive pro player, do it all for free. Some players focus on nothing but playing, that's their job, and they never post wins, never post any relevant tournament results...Why would Day9 try go full time to be a pro, when he's already full time building tournaments, viewers, and awareness? Because some nerds question his ability to make every call correctly, or speak in a tone they prefer?
I don't disagree with anything you've said, particularly. Day's not my favorite caster by any means, but I have nothing against him either. He's a gigantic community figure who has done and continues to do as much for the scene as anyone. I understand both sides here.
Location: MLG Anahiem, Live State of the Game, from a Barcraft. Guests: KeSPA invites, Sundance, David Kim, Slasher, Wheat, Day[9], Tastosis, Incontol, Nony, Nazgul, and Hwanni. Time: As long as it takes Possible special appearences by: poopfeast420, goatlust, Cella, Anna (ONLY via Incontrol's cellphone and ONLY when Nony is making a point), Huk, Demuslim (with full on english accent), Sir Scoots (in a rocking chair recanting ye old PC stories from when you had to move your mouse through 4 feet of snow, both ways) and Dustin Browder.
Look I know your busy with MLG and SC2 and your new show, and traveling and dealing with this thread and casting and playing starcraft among other things. But for once....think of the ratings this would get....think of the numbas....
From, GrackersNCheese
dont get your hopes up. Sunday night at the EG/TL/Complexity/Dignitas barcraft is where all the players will be most likely and there is gonna be a live Live On Three
Um.....so they have everything setup for them? I guess I'm not seeing what you are .
Location: MLG Anahiem, Live State of the Game, from a Barcraft. Guests: KeSPA invites, Sundance, David Kim, Slasher, Wheat, Day[9], Tastosis, Incontol, Nony, Nazgul, and Hwanni. Time: As long as it takes Possible special appearences by: poopfeast420, goatlust, Cella, Anna (ONLY via Incontrol's cellphone and ONLY when Nony is making a point), Huk, Demuslim (with full on english accent), Sir Scoots (in a rocking chair recanting ye old PC stories from when you had to move your mouse through 4 feet of snow, both ways) and Dustin Browder.
Look I know your busy with MLG and SC2 and your new show, and traveling and dealing with this thread and casting and playing starcraft among other things. But for once....think of the ratings this would get....think of the numbas....
EPT
