|
On May 04 2012 14:59 coolcor wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 14:18 Angel_ wrote:On May 04 2012 11:47 corpuscle wrote:On May 04 2012 11:24 obsidia wrote:
I think bad casters are already getting weeded out, or atleast being publically acknowledged as lacking. It's up to them whether to shape up or see how long they can last. It's annoying when people defend them to the hilt for some inane reason like "he's done so much for esports", you do realise they were getting payed handsomely? Argueably people like total biscuit who finance their own tournements and donate any profits back to the players or charity should be the ones getting praised for their contribution, rather than the same grey casters doing commissioned work.
On the other hand many casters are working hard to improve their style and it's really noticeable. I feel sorry for jp that he gets bashed so much when he probably has more game knowledge than the average hater. He knows his limits and doesn't try and overstep them or just add useless generic fluff. I personally really enjoy His casting and it's improved leaps and bounds other the course of mlg's
Wish we could see more of grubby casting, he was amazing at mlg arena. Incredible game knowledge and a pleasure to listen to
Why do people think casters make a ton of money? They simply don't, there isn't that much money in the scene. Painuser didn't outright disclose his salary, but he hinted on ITG that he makes a LOT less than what people seem to think, and simply would not be doing what he does if he was picking his career based on salary. I can't imagine that IPL pays their casters significantly less than GOM or NASL. effectively, Huk made a tweet forever ago. Then people blew it up on reddit and made shit up even though half a dozen people actually in the scene declared it was a load of shit. And then...somehow random people blowing it up on reddit became general "known fact", even though it was called out as being bullshit at the time by people like wheat. There is also this post. Why does everybody forget about this post it makes it pretty clear day9 is doing well. Idra also said he's annoyed that day9 pretends he is not doing really well. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=290205¤tpage=9#162I really liked Sotg discussion on casters I think they made good points except for that the Korean casters don't count because they have a script thing. Artosis is awesome and I'd like to add wolf to the list of casters everybody seems to like. I guess my question is wouldn't it be better if someone else was doing all the business behind the scenes work for day9 and husky while they are focusing on being the best caster they can be and making even more content so they get even more popular when they do cast? That seems like the best way instead of making them do both so both sides suffer from divided attention. Also it would be interesting if someone would dare to make a video analyzing a caster who doesn't know what he's talking about and pointing out all the wrong things and why he's wrong.
There's like... three casters, maybe four, that make Day9 levels of money. That's like saying that players are all rolling in it because there's a few like MC that rake it in, most of them are living off of scraps.
|
Good show! Thanks as always ^^
Sweet transition: geoff doing liquid shoutouts, sheth coming in, sheth being there, appreciated stuff!
Keep it up!
|
On May 04 2012 11:47 corpuscle wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 11:24 obsidia wrote:
I think bad casters are already getting weeded out, or atleast being publically acknowledged as lacking. It's up to them whether to shape up or see how long they can last. It's annoying when people defend them to the hilt for some inane reason like "he's done so much for esports", you do realise they were getting payed handsomely? Argueably people like total biscuit who finance their own tournements and donate any profits back to the players or charity should be the ones getting praised for their contribution, rather than the same grey casters doing commissioned work.
On the other hand many casters are working hard to improve their style and it's really noticeable. I feel sorry for jp that he gets bashed so much when he probably has more game knowledge than the average hater. He knows his limits and doesn't try and overstep them or just add useless generic fluff. I personally really enjoy His casting and it's improved leaps and bounds other the course of mlg's
Wish we could see more of grubby casting, he was amazing at mlg arena. Incredible game knowledge and a pleasure to listen to
Why do people think casters make a ton of money? They simply don't, there isn't that much money in the scene. Painuser didn't outright disclose his salary, but he hinted on ITG that he makes a LOT less than what people seem to think, and simply would not be doing what he does if he was picking his career based on salary. I can't imagine that IPL pays their casters significantly less than GOM or NASL.
Its not just about the money, its also about the spotlight/fame and effort.
Pro players dedicate their lives to starcraft, some [bad] casters know pathetic amounts about the game, the strategy and the mind-sets. There are skills other that knowledge to casting for sure, but the amount of money, attention and credit that most casters get far outstrips most non-code-S player, and for a fraction of the effort. That isn't a good situation is it?
|
|
|
Artosis implying Shine doesn't know anything about bw angers me... He's not a random Bisu fan on a tl lr thread... In bw you can't become a progamer without knowing anything about the game, and somehow, I also doubt it's possible in sc2. That and his commentary about Leta a few SotG back then, seriously...
|
On May 04 2012 19:43 corumjhaelen wrote:
Artosis implying Shine doesn't know anything about bw angers me... He's not a random Bisu fan on a tl lr thread... In bw you can't become a progamer without knowing anything about the game, and somehow, I also doubt it's possible in sc2. That and his commentary about Leta a few SotG back then, seriously...
bw artosis was a very uh opinionated guy.
|
I cried when I heard Geoff's analysis of Squirtle vs Taeja game 3. It made my day. Very well played
|
On May 04 2012 19:44 Klonere wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 19:43 corumjhaelen wrote:
Artosis implying Shine doesn't know anything about bw angers me... He's not a random Bisu fan on a tl lr thread... In bw you can't become a progamer without knowing anything about the game, and somehow, I also doubt it's possible in sc2. That and his commentary about Leta a few SotG back then, seriously... bw artosis was a very uh opinionated guy.
wol artosis is also a very opinionated guy (*cough*mech*cough*)
He's the best though, and there is nothing wrong with being opinionated as long as you don't take it as a religion and you can still be reasoned with. Abit of opinion is even required in a good, analytical caster imo, makes it more interesting.
I don't even know who Shine and Leta are...
|
Honestly progamers should just be thankful that e-sports have grown so much that they now have a chance to make a living playing a game they enjoy, Travel the around the world with free hotels, meet fans growing up they never thought they would have. On top of that even if its a long shot but the chance to win Thousands of dollars. it doesnt matter if some people are making more than them because they they spend hours and work hard playing the game to win but earn little to nothing.
Some of us im sure put the same amaount of hours playing and working hard to improve just to have the accomplishment of seeing our name climb the Ladder!! Has E-sports grown so much that some pros get upset others are making $$Thousands$$ on SC2. A few years ago it was great to have a tournament with chance to win $1000 prize pool where players had to travel to it and will happily pay their own expense.
Now some gamers have the odasity to be upset they are not paid enough and frustrates them others in scene are making more money than they are. if you are upset because of that than im sorry you are also in it just for the money. When money and not because of passion and the love of something you do isnt the reason anymore. than you will never make it to the top
|
@itmeJP I really miss the Topic-timelines what you used to do, so I know what topics you gonna talk about, and which parts I can skip, because of this I skip a lot of good content because i skip to much.
|
On May 04 2012 14:59 coolcor wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 14:18 Angel_ wrote:On May 04 2012 11:47 corpuscle wrote:On May 04 2012 11:24 obsidia wrote:
I think bad casters are already getting weeded out, or atleast being publically acknowledged as lacking. It's up to them whether to shape up or see how long they can last. It's annoying when people defend them to the hilt for some inane reason like "he's done so much for esports", you do realise they were getting payed handsomely? Argueably people like total biscuit who finance their own tournements and donate any profits back to the players or charity should be the ones getting praised for their contribution, rather than the same grey casters doing commissioned work.
On the other hand many casters are working hard to improve their style and it's really noticeable. I feel sorry for jp that he gets bashed so much when he probably has more game knowledge than the average hater. He knows his limits and doesn't try and overstep them or just add useless generic fluff. I personally really enjoy His casting and it's improved leaps and bounds other the course of mlg's
Wish we could see more of grubby casting, he was amazing at mlg arena. Incredible game knowledge and a pleasure to listen to
Why do people think casters make a ton of money? They simply don't, there isn't that much money in the scene. Painuser didn't outright disclose his salary, but he hinted on ITG that he makes a LOT less than what people seem to think, and simply would not be doing what he does if he was picking his career based on salary. I can't imagine that IPL pays their casters significantly less than GOM or NASL. effectively, Huk made a tweet forever ago. Then people blew it up on reddit and made shit up even though half a dozen people actually in the scene declared it was a load of shit. And then...somehow random people blowing it up on reddit became general "known fact", even though it was called out as being bullshit at the time by people like wheat. There is also this post. Why does everybody forget about this post it makes it pretty clear day9 is doing well. Idra also said he's annoyed that day9 pretends he is not doing really well. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=290205¤tpage=9#162
Alright, I've seen this mentioned 5 times now in the Cloud thread and now its in this thread too. When did Day9 pretend he isn't doing well? The only thing I've heard from Day9 on finances is that IF he ever wasn't making money from this, if he only had 5 people watching him, he would still be doing it because it's what he loves. The emphasis is on the if. Does anyone have a clip or a reference to a point where Day9 has said or pretended that he isn't doing well? Or is that just Idra's impression, because I have never gotten that impression from Day9.
|
On May 04 2012 20:54 Czarnodziej wrote:I cried when I heard Geoff's analysis of Squirtle vs Taeja game 3. It made my day. Very well played
That's why he should cast the SC2 OSL's
|
On May 04 2012 09:38 Dexington wrote:
Jesus JP, Bitterdam don't get hate, you just think they do because of your irrational hate of NASL. You will come up with any reason to shit on NASL, even though nobody is any more.
Get over it. Biterdam are one of the most accepted casters in the business.
It's not just JP. Rotterdam gets pretty universal love, but for a long time Mr. Bitter has gotten a lot of hate for his casting for a perceived bias for Zerg when he casts. I haven't watched him recently so I can't comment, but I watched a lot of him in 2011 and I hated his casting any time a Zerg was playing. Even when a Zerg wasn't playing, there wasn't as much energy and enthusiasm for the Protoss and Terran. Maybe he has gotten better, but his casting in 2011 turned me off from wanting to listen to him, despite how much I like Rotterdam's casting.
And I'm not the only one. I still see people shitting on Mr. Bitter. And it seems like you just have a problem with JP because he wasn't shitting on NASL, and last week he praised NASL? What's your deal dood?
|
Watching this SOTG with all of the hosts saying that there are popular casters that shit on players and don't know the game well enough, I was very confused. None of the guys up there defended Day9's analytical abilities, yet I have never heard Day9 shit on players or talk excessively about the mistakes the player made. He has always seemed to me the caster that gives players the benefit of the doubt, maybe excessively.
Incontrol and Nony, since you read this thread fairly often, do you agree with Cloud that Day9's analytical ability is overrated? That Day9 sometimes over-analyzes times when progamers just do something stupid and hopes it works? I am not high enough level to be able to tell, but I've always enjoyed Day9's analysis so I'm curious what other progamers think. Cloud doesn't like it. What do you guys think?
|
On May 05 2012 01:37 flowSthead wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 14:59 coolcor wrote:On May 04 2012 14:18 Angel_ wrote:On May 04 2012 11:47 corpuscle wrote:On May 04 2012 11:24 obsidia wrote:
I think bad casters are already getting weeded out, or atleast being publically acknowledged as lacking. It's up to them whether to shape up or see how long they can last. It's annoying when people defend them to the hilt for some inane reason like "he's done so much for esports", you do realise they were getting payed handsomely? Argueably people like total biscuit who finance their own tournements and donate any profits back to the players or charity should be the ones getting praised for their contribution, rather than the same grey casters doing commissioned work.
On the other hand many casters are working hard to improve their style and it's really noticeable. I feel sorry for jp that he gets bashed so much when he probably has more game knowledge than the average hater. He knows his limits and doesn't try and overstep them or just add useless generic fluff. I personally really enjoy His casting and it's improved leaps and bounds other the course of mlg's
Wish we could see more of grubby casting, he was amazing at mlg arena. Incredible game knowledge and a pleasure to listen to
Why do people think casters make a ton of money? They simply don't, there isn't that much money in the scene. Painuser didn't outright disclose his salary, but he hinted on ITG that he makes a LOT less than what people seem to think, and simply would not be doing what he does if he was picking his career based on salary. I can't imagine that IPL pays their casters significantly less than GOM or NASL. effectively, Huk made a tweet forever ago. Then people blew it up on reddit and made shit up even though half a dozen people actually in the scene declared it was a load of shit. And then...somehow random people blowing it up on reddit became general "known fact", even though it was called out as being bullshit at the time by people like wheat. There is also this post. Why does everybody forget about this post it makes it pretty clear day9 is doing well. Idra also said he's annoyed that day9 pretends he is not doing really well. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=290205¤tpage=9#162 Alright, I've seen this mentioned 5 times now in the Cloud thread and now its in this thread too. When did Day9 pretend he isn't doing well? The only thing I've heard from Day9 on finances is that IF he ever wasn't making money from this, if he only had 5 people watching him, he would still be doing it because it's what he loves. The emphasis is on the if. Does anyone have a clip or a reference to a point where Day9 has said or pretended that he isn't doing well? Or is that just Idra's impression, because I have never gotten that impression from Day9.
I think that impression may come from the Day9 who was in grad school and not focusing on SC2 fulltime, before he launched the subscription program, AHGL, and just generally before he had time to do as much as he does now. Honestly though, if Day9 can't make bank of off this scene, everyone else should just jump ship now, because there is no hope.
|
On May 04 2012 19:23 resilve wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 11:47 corpuscle wrote:On May 04 2012 11:24 obsidia wrote:
I think bad casters are already getting weeded out, or atleast being publically acknowledged as lacking. It's up to them whether to shape up or see how long they can last. It's annoying when people defend them to the hilt for some inane reason like "he's done so much for esports", you do realise they were getting payed handsomely? Argueably people like total biscuit who finance their own tournements and donate any profits back to the players or charity should be the ones getting praised for their contribution, rather than the same grey casters doing commissioned work.
On the other hand many casters are working hard to improve their style and it's really noticeable. I feel sorry for jp that he gets bashed so much when he probably has more game knowledge than the average hater. He knows his limits and doesn't try and overstep them or just add useless generic fluff. I personally really enjoy His casting and it's improved leaps and bounds other the course of mlg's
Wish we could see more of grubby casting, he was amazing at mlg arena. Incredible game knowledge and a pleasure to listen to
Why do people think casters make a ton of money? They simply don't, there isn't that much money in the scene. Painuser didn't outright disclose his salary, but he hinted on ITG that he makes a LOT less than what people seem to think, and simply would not be doing what he does if he was picking his career based on salary. I can't imagine that IPL pays their casters significantly less than GOM or NASL. Its not just about the money, its also about the spotlight/fame and effort. Pro players dedicate their lives to starcraft, some [bad] casters know pathetic amounts about the game, the strategy and the mind-sets. There are skills other that knowledge to casting for sure, but the amount of money, attention and credit that most casters get far outstrips most non-code-S player, and for a fraction of the effort. That isn't a good situation is it?
They didn't say that every caster is good, I'd even go so far as to say that they subtly hinted that they don't think some people deserve the position they're in. They can't go and call out specific people, though, that'd be really dumb.
edit: either way even those people who don't "deserve" the spotlight have worked really hard to get where they are and are not being paid super-well
|
Wow, Tyler really covered all my opinions on the casting issues - that whole section was great.
|
Day9 doesn't talk about finances so I'm not sure where people get the impression he's 'lying' about his income. I'm glad he's successful though -- we need more people to be able to make a decent living doing what they love. Nobody goes into Starcraft just to make money, you'd have to be insane to do that.
|
On May 04 2012 11:48 Takkara wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 11:19 acgFork wrote:
Yep, the daily dose of SC2 drama. Feels like a freakkn soap opera guys T_T
Artosis: When will The Artosis Hour be back? Or some streaming? I miss you so much, baby.. :"{ </3 I agree with you about the Artosis Hour that show was solid gold. So informative. Not sure what the guys said tonight that was so controversial. I think every was very fair and quite reasoned. I think they did such a great job about staying out of naming names (except about Moletrap, but I don't think they wanted really to go too far down that way), and they really just stayed on the issues. I've personally felt that SC2 casters try too much to "predict" what's going on. We don't need to really know what's going to happen. We need to know what's happening. Not just the literal events that are occurring, but also what the things that are happening actually means. Casting at its best is when its helping me understand what's happening including the things I'm not good enough to know are actually happening. Casting at its worst is when there is player bashing and pointless (and wrong) predictions. At least according to me. But different strokes for different folks. Everyone has their favorite casting style and casters.
I agree, except I feel like InControL was being way to passive-aggressive, calling people out left and right most of the show. He kept trying to get the rest of the crew to jump on his bandwagon, but they didn't and it just got awkward, especially when InControL was dissing Moletrap for like 5 minutes straight and asked Artosis what he thought, and Artosis just said that MoleTrap was a good fit for the new league... IMO State of the Game would be much more about the actual state of the game if InControL wasn't part of the show. Too much fluff.
|
On May 05 2012 07:30 acgFork wrote:Show nested quote +On May 04 2012 11:48 Takkara wrote:On May 04 2012 11:19 acgFork wrote:
Yep, the daily dose of SC2 drama. Feels like a freakkn soap opera guys T_T
Artosis: When will The Artosis Hour be back? Or some streaming? I miss you so much, baby.. :"{ </3 I agree with you about the Artosis Hour that show was solid gold. So informative. Not sure what the guys said tonight that was so controversial. I think every was very fair and quite reasoned. I think they did such a great job about staying out of naming names (except about Moletrap, but I don't think they wanted really to go too far down that way), and they really just stayed on the issues. I've personally felt that SC2 casters try too much to "predict" what's going on. We don't need to really know what's going to happen. We need to know what's happening. Not just the literal events that are occurring, but also what the things that are happening actually means. Casting at its best is when its helping me understand what's happening including the things I'm not good enough to know are actually happening. Casting at its worst is when there is player bashing and pointless (and wrong) predictions. At least according to me. But different strokes for different folks. Everyone has their favorite casting style and casters. I agree, except I feel like InControL was being way to passive-aggressive, calling people out left and right most of the show. He kept trying to get the rest of the crew to jump on his bandwagon, but they didn't and it just got awkward, especially when InControL was dissing Moletrap for like 5 minutes straight and asked Artosis what he thought, and Artosis just said that MoleTrap was a good fit for the new league... IMO State of the Game would be much more about the actual state of the game if InControL wasn't part of the show. Too much fluff.
uhm.. you call out Incontrol for being the only one calling out names and then you say it's too much fluff with him on the show???
Incontrol said that about Moletrap, because apparently every thread with a GSL tag on it will have someone who says Moletrap is bad (for whatever reason). I think it only got awkward because he was talking to much from the prospective of the moletrap-haters (that's how i picked it up..), not because he wanted to say that Moletrap is a bad caster.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
