EPTPatch 14 Changes - Page 28
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Champi
1422 Posts
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Trok67
France384 Posts
On June 03 2010 06:49 gillon wrote: The problem is that people are approaching ZvT mech the wrong way. They think that they are supposed to win by running into a siege ball. This isn't the case. It didn't work in BW, it's not gonna work now. Think of the major drawback a mech terran has: Mobility. You're playing zerg, what do you have an abundance of? That's right, mobility. Use it, make him feel like he can't move out, attack production, attack expos, attack supply, attack everywhere where his army isn't at. plz guys stop talking about MOBILITY bullshit, youve probably never played zerg and you think that all zerg are noob and nobody have found the solution while youve found it, thats ridiculous. So to answer your point quickly. In BW Zerg could deal without a lot of problems with mech army. Goliath didnt rape completely Mutalisk as Thor do, they countered mutalisk but at least terran had to make a good number while now just 2 or 3 thors rape any number of mutalisk. Furthermore, Goliaths were also weaker than thor against grounds units. Thor is just completely retarded : counter very hard air unit and also very strong against every grounds zerg units. So in BW you could fight a mech army as zerg when no you just cant. With the mobility shit : yes you can drop, yes you can nydus worm, but the terran will play very defensivly so you have to wait until he moves out of his base. Most of time if you drop while he is attacking youit will end up either by base trading (which isnt at the advantage of zerg at all) or either by him completely destroying your base while still able to defend his main because he let some tanks around his buildings which are very hard to kill. Yes zerg can win against mech terran if the terran make a lot of mistake but at equl skill this is simply not the case. | ||
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Doc Daneeka
United States577 Posts
On June 03 2010 06:01 osten wrote: I have this question for you Why buff the burrow aspect of the roaches? 1 Raven and all of it goes down the drain... The only way of popping up under tanks is by playing someone that isn't good at all. So we go infestors against tanks? Nope, they die while channeling. So we go ultras? Nope, they come too late. So Broodlords? Nope, they come too late. I am (not kidding) switching to terran now. 1 raven negates: cloaked ghosts, dark templar, burrowed anything including baneling traps, observers, creep tumors... obviously anything that's cloaked. solution? kill the raven. or you know, scout, and hit somewhere there isn't a raven. also, a raven by itself isn't gonna do anything against a decent number of roaches. autoturrets will get raped with or without burrowed regen increase and HSM requires research investment the T probably won't have made. do you want an 'i win' button to mech or something? what would be the point of mech then? | ||
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osten
Sweden316 Posts
If I had a "kill tank" spell in my hatchery it would balance things out. | ||
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Chen
United States6344 Posts
On June 03 2010 09:01 Doc Daneeka wrote: 1 raven negates: cloaked ghosts, dark templar, burrowed anything including baneling traps, observers, creep tumors... obviously anything that's cloaked. solution? kill the raven. or you know, scout, and hit somewhere there isn't a raven. also, a raven by itself isn't gonna do anything against a decent number of roaches. autoturrets will get raped with or without burrowed regen increase and HSM requires research investment the T probably won't have made. do you want an 'i win' button to mech or something? what would be the point of mech then? u fucking serious? raven is a detector, it makes burrowed roaches useless because you see and kill them before they get under your army. plus, its not hard for the terran to stick a raven next to his army and a turret in all his bases for detection. hitting a place without detection requires your opponent to be bad. plus, killing a raven is nearly impossible because PDD nullifies basically ALL AA attacks, void ray being the only reasonable exception. plus vikings and tanks outrange everything so you have to run into the army before trying to snipe it. | ||
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Sadist
United States7328 Posts
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MattDamon
United States59 Posts
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melfice
Austria12 Posts
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Doc Daneeka
United States577 Posts
On June 03 2010 09:08 Chen wrote: u fucking serious? raven is a detector, it makes burrowed roaches useless because you see and kill them before they get under your army. plus, its not hard for the terran to stick a raven next to his army and a turret in all his bases for detection. hitting a place without detection requires your opponent to be bad. plus, killing a raven is nearly impossible because PDD nullifies basically ALL AA attacks, void ray being the only reasonable exception. plus vikings and tanks outrange everything so you have to run into the army before trying to snipe it. i'm not talking about a-moving your army into his and expecting it to work out, obviously you have to be more opportunistic than that. and you make it sound like terran's gonna have every unit and every structure at all times which is totally unrealistic. there's just plenty of opportunities to fuck up terran's perfect little mech ball before it ever gets to that point. if you just sit back and let him do whatever he wants for 20 minutes, you kinda deserve to lose. | ||
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Orange Goblin
218 Posts
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Doc Daneeka
United States577 Posts
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TheYango
United States47024 Posts
On June 03 2010 09:22 Orange Goblin wrote: I wonder how this argument had been if Zerg had been this strong late-game... They are strong late-game. Broodlords and Ultralisks are fine. It's the transition that kills people. And frankly, that's exactly what this patch helps--the fact that the speed upgrade no longer needs to be researched reduces the time required for Ultras to be useful. Granted, I think speeding the transition to Broodlords might have had a bigger impact. | ||
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Jaxx
Slovakia758 Posts
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Philosophy
186 Posts
On June 03 2010 09:20 Doc Daneeka wrote: i'm not talking about a-moving your army into his and expecting it to work out, obviously you have to be more opportunistic than that. and you make it sound like terran's gonna have every unit and every structure at all times which is totally unrealistic. there's just plenty of opportunities to fuck up terran's perfect little mech ball before it ever gets to that point. if you just sit back and let him do whatever he wants for 20 minutes, you kinda deserve to lose. So you're basically saying that Zerg players should drop, burrow, harass, counter, nydus and flank the Terra to win, while the Terra should just a-move. | ||
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clickrush
Switzerland3257 Posts
On June 04 2010 00:09 Philosophy wrote: So you're basically saying that Zerg players should drop, burrow, harass, counter, nydus and flank the Terra to win, while the Terra should just a-move. exactly. a T must commit his immobile army to a well timed and perfect push, while a Z can macro up and constantly harass/distract him. | ||
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Daedie
Belgium160 Posts
On June 03 2010 09:22 Orange Goblin wrote: I wonder how this argument had been if Zerg had been this strong late-game... You mean like 3 patches ago? | ||
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Conventer
Poland72 Posts
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cArn-
Korea (South)824 Posts
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osten
Sweden316 Posts
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CrunkOwns
United States138 Posts
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