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On May 28 2010 20:28 TheDna wrote:
I just hope this is the end for KeSPA !
Would be cool if pros and semi pros can have their own sponsors now, better teams and a better environment for progaming.
I dont like how boot campish it is to become a pro gamer over there. That is without earning real money. All the pros over there are more like slaves no real pros like in sport or something :/
How do you expect to beat someone that plays for 12 hours when you only play for lets say 5? They play a lot for a reason.
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Well there are already US companies interested in being sponsors thanks to the exposure from sponsoring teams for WoW and whatnot, these companies are clearly aware of SC 2 and its potential.
I'm just glad Blizzard finally just got someone who actually respects IP rights (which is something nearly every game developer cherishes).
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On May 27 2010 09:51 arb wrote:
haha i cant wait to see what Kespa thinks about this
This.
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On May 28 2010 21:03 Windblade wrote:
Well there are already US companies interested in being sponsors thanks to the exposure from sponsoring teams for WoW and whatnot, these companies are clearly aware of SC 2 and its potential.
I'm just glad Blizzard finally just got someone who actually respects IP rights (which is something nearly every game developer cherishes).
Maybe developers think too highly of their finished products as well !
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Love the middle finger to KESPA. They thought they could get away with a 'Korean standard of business ethics' when trying to profit from an American game. Blizz said "I'm taking my ball and going home," and then found some new friends.
I wish Blizz had been honest and just acknowledged their right to profit from the thing they made instead of saying "it's not our intention to make excessive profits" in one sentence, and then saying "respect our IP" in the next, but all in all, the good guys (producers) win; Capitalism is virtue.
[It's only excessive profit if you're guilty of collusion and price fixing, like a certain chip manufacturer that's been in the news recently...]
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On May 28 2010 20:20 heishe wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2010 20:13 iounas wrote:On May 28 2010 19:34 AyJay wrote:
This thread is so funny - almost every post is either QQ, go to hell blizz, this end of esports orOMG IM NOT BUYING SC2.
:D
Its more funny how people dont even know what kespa is but make stupid comments.. Most think kespa is a group of referees that make rules and take money from everybody as a governing body.. Kespa is everything.. By saying let kespa die, you say let teams die,let osl, msl, proleague die, fuck you sponsors that make pro starcraft possible.. Let flash and jaedong lose their paying jobs for who knows what? Playing on shitty internet tournaments for prize money.. I like gom for their english stream but thats it, if it didnt have english casting nobody would care about it which means you are selfish.. kespa organizes the teams, pays the money and so forth... so what? When they're gone, somebody else will do it. Where do you think kespa has the money from to pay the players? They don't get it from the government, they get it from sponsors and OGN/MBC. What do you think? That kespa is some philantrophical organisation who just throws all the money at the players for nothing? When kespa is gone, sponsors will simply have contracts with the clans or players themselves. The clans will hire managers who organize the training houses and keep their players on check. It has been run like this in Europe forever and it works just fine. And now kespa won't be able to pull their restrictive bullshit anymore ("don't play in foreign tournaments or expect punishment"). And wtf at you people who say Blizzard doesn't care about eSports? Do you have no brains at all? Firstly, they can make money in the eSports business if they control it. Secondly, if eSports grows, more players will buy their games -> more money for them. PLUS it's a huge publicity "+" when people see them as the messiahs of eSports.
You have NO IDEA how the progaming scene works. You have no idea what KeSPA is. Why are even people like you posting in a serious discussion?
No KeSPA means no OGN, no MBC, CJ, SKT, KT and so on. Good luck finding other companies that are going to be willing to fork as much money as KeSPA companies do...
Seriously, STOP POSTING. You're making a fool out of yourself.
"sponsors will simply have contracts with the clans or players themselves. The clans will hire managers who organize the training houses and keep their players on check."
They fucking already do!
"don't play in foreign tournaments or expect punishment"
Are you kidding me? When did that even happen? Progamers played in dozens of international tournaments...
"And wtf at you people who say Blizzard doesn't care about eSports? Do you have no brains at all?"
No LAN, region lock, crappy ladder for casuals, ridiculous tournament fees, thretening to shut down OSL, MSL and ProLeague. Do I seriously need to go on?
"Firstly, they can make money in the eSports business if they control it."
YES! They want to make money off esports. But they are not going to put any money INTO it! sponsoring GOMTV every now and then is nothing compared to the amount of money KeSPA corporations are throwing...
Once they get rid of KeSPA, there will be no team houses and barely any players with salaries. We'll get back to stone age of esports thanks to Blizzard.
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@maybenexttime
This game was made with eSports in mind. No LAN isn't end of the world.
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I don't know how the companies work, but from skimming the replies to various fomos articles, CJ owns 20% of Gretech (GOM), and Mr Bae something owns 40%. There were various people that said it so I will assume it's true. But the main debate was whether OGN was a 'subsidiary(?)' or a 'slave' to CJ. (I think CJ has 51% of the shares)
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So funny how everyone who hates Kespa has no idea what it is. Any organization that e-sports team owners form in replacement of Kespa will just be Kespa by a different name.
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On May 28 2010 21:41 Wala.Revolution wrote:
I don't know how the companies work, but from skimming the replies to various fomos articles, CJ owns 20% of Gretech (GOM), and Mr Bae something owns 40%. There were various people that said it so I will assume it's true. But the main debate was whether OGN was a 'subsidiary(?)' or a 'slave' to CJ. (I think CJ has 51% of the shares)
CJ owns 25% of Gretech based on the 2007 report (meaning 2006 fiscal year). Now perhaps it's 25-30%.
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On May 28 2010 21:35 AyJay wrote:
@maybenexttime
This game was made with eSports in mind. No LAN isn't end of the world.
ROFL, do you honestly believe this after all of this? Those are just WORDS. When it comes to actions: no, LAN, region lock, no chat channels, "pro league" replays released, tournament licenses and fees, threatening to shut down major BW leagues. Blizzard does not care about esports. Stop deluding yourself. They want to get rid of the entity that makes esports possible in Korea. There are going to be no professional teams with team houses and so on for SC2. Blizzard is scaring every potential sponsor off with the way they are handling the negotiations with KeSPA.
Did you see Stars War games? The lag was horrible. That's "Blizzard esports."
On May 28 2010 21:44 Ryo wrote:
So funny how everyone who hates Kespa has no idea what it is. Any organization that e-sports team owners form in replacement of Kespa will just be Kespa by a different name.
Exactly. And they still will not agree to the ridiculous demands of Blizzard.
People who are thinking "another organization will be formed and they'll make a deal with Blizzard" are kidding themselves.
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MrHoon
10183 Posts
Most of you TL.netters are supporting GOMtv because you have great commentators like Nick/others to make the games more entertaining
Have you guys actually HEARD the Korean Commentators for GOMtv?
They are terrible (no offense to them but goddamn they suck ass). They have the most unappealing voices ever
Im sorry but if I have to end up watching Korean GOMTV Commentators for the rest of my life I think I'd rather cut "Watching Esports" out of my hobby list
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On May 28 2010 21:24 maybenexttime wrote:
Once they get rid of KeSPA, there will be no team houses and barely any players with salaries. We'll get back to stone age of esports thanks to Blizzard.
So why is kespa going to die?
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They don't know any better MrHoon. :/
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On May 28 2010 21:56 zoltanium wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2010 21:24 maybenexttime wrote:
Once they get rid of KeSPA, there will be no team houses and barely any players with salaries. We'll get back to stone age of esports thanks to Blizzard. So why is kespa going to die?
Could you elaborate?
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This thread is so polarized with so many people convinced that they are absolutely right on both sides and zero ability to imagine a middle ground it's quite scary. For those of us who haven't done thorough research reading this thread is just cognitive dissonance overload :D.
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doesn't look like bw will survive this unless gom really want it to; but blizz clearly don't care either way
guess it makes sense, there's money to be had in sc2 after all
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Blizzard now has a direct partner to run Starcraft tournaments.
It doesn't mean the very same companies that are part of KeSPA will never invest in the future of the scene, it just means they can't have control over everything.
SKT, CJ, Samsung (etc) can all still sponsor Starcraft leagues and the teams if they want. They can all continue to fund the houses and train Pro-gamers 14 hours a day. Funding teams and houses to have the best pro-gamers makes people want to watch those gamers and opens their eyes to see the company names on the uniforms. Why would this stop?
GOM TV is apparently willing to cooperate with OGN and MBC for broadcasting, who also have nothing to lose by continuing their support like before.
So GOM TV had crappy Korean casters, why can't they get new ones? Why can't they improve on what's bad, much like "KeSPA" did since it first came to be?
I really don't think it will be all that much different than it is now, perhaps minus the shitty attitude towards foreign markets. We'll have the games available online streaming live as well as worldwide leagues to promote eSports to more companies. Other tournaments like the HDH and TSL are unaffected since they already get permission from Blizzard and as an added bonus might even get their games broadcasted as well.
The main point I think people need to understand is this:
The companies that sponsor Starcraft leagues will now have one less thing to do, while still getting the exact same advertisement.
Companies sponsor for advertisement. None of them care whether it's Flash or Jaedong who wins, as long as they get the company name out. If it's profitable to spread their name all over Starcraft tournaments, theres absolutely no reason to stop.
Tell me, what do these companies (aka KeSPA) stand to lose by continuing to support esports like before? Control?
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On May 28 2010 21:24 maybenexttime wrote:Show nested quote +On May 28 2010 20:20 heishe wrote:On May 28 2010 20:13 iounas wrote:On May 28 2010 19:34 AyJay wrote:
This thread is so funny - almost every post is either QQ, go to hell blizz, this end of esports orOMG IM NOT BUYING SC2.
:D
Its more funny how people dont even know what kespa is but make stupid comments.. Most think kespa is a group of referees that make rules and take money from everybody as a governing body.. Kespa is everything.. By saying let kespa die, you say let teams die,let osl, msl, proleague die, fuck you sponsors that make pro starcraft possible.. Let flash and jaedong lose their paying jobs for who knows what? Playing on shitty internet tournaments for prize money.. I like gom for their english stream but thats it, if it didnt have english casting nobody would care about it which means you are selfish.. kespa organizes the teams, pays the money and so forth... so what? When they're gone, somebody else will do it. Where do you think kespa has the money from to pay the players? They don't get it from the government, they get it from sponsors and OGN/MBC. What do you think? That kespa is some philantrophical organisation who just throws all the money at the players for nothing? When kespa is gone, sponsors will simply have contracts with the clans or players themselves. The clans will hire managers who organize the training houses and keep their players on check. It has been run like this in Europe forever and it works just fine. And now kespa won't be able to pull their restrictive bullshit anymore ("don't play in foreign tournaments or expect punishment"). And wtf at you people who say Blizzard doesn't care about eSports? Do you have no brains at all? Firstly, they can make money in the eSports business if they control it. Secondly, if eSports grows, more players will buy their games -> more money for them. PLUS it's a huge publicity "+" when people see them as the messiahs of eSports. You have NO IDEA how the progaming scene works. You have no idea what KeSPA is. Why are even people like you posting in a serious discussion? No KeSPA means no OGN, no MBC, CJ, SKT, KT and so on. Good luck finding other companies that are going to be willing to fork as much money as KeSPA companies do... Seriously, STOP POSTING. You're making a fool out of yourself. "sponsors will simply have contracts with the clans or players themselves. The clans will hire managers who organize the training houses and keep their players on check." They fucking already do! "don't play in foreign tournaments or expect punishment" Are you kidding me? When did that even happen? Progamers played in dozens of international tournaments... "And wtf at you people who say Blizzard doesn't care about eSports? Do you have no brains at all?" No LAN, region lock, crappy ladder for casuals, ridiculous tournament fees, thretening to shut down OSL, MSL and ProLeague. Do I seriously need to go on? "Firstly, they can make money in the eSports business if they control it." YES! They want to make money off esports. But they are not going to put any money INTO it! sponsoring GOMTV every now and then is nothing compared to the amount of money KeSPA corporations are throwing... Once they get rid of KeSPA, there will be no team houses and barely any players with salaries. We'll get back to stone age of esports thanks to Blizzard.
Why does no kespa mean no money for players and no houses? if kespa could pay then money was being generated by esports which could then be redistributed. It's not like Kespa is making the money. The players make the money and Kespa is jsut the infrastructure that they use to organize things.
The players will keep making money as long as the esports scener survives.
The scene won't die because GOM can give the rights to others to broadcast, isntead of it coming from Kespa.
Players can live in a house just like normal people. If several pros want to live in the same house then they dont need kespa to organize that.
Also, it's not said that Kespa will go under, they simply can't dictate things anymore. The rest of the infrastructure( teams, houses etc) could very well stay.
Kespa is an unneeded middleman which is now being removed.
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Saying that people who dont understand what KeSPA is do not understand what is going on is probably pretty legit. However, also saying that if KeSPA is shut out that no one new will fork over anything similar is pretty assumptive. Even assuming that the same companies in KeSPA wont just roll over and find some way to make a profit out of the new system is not to far stretched I don't think.
Someone needs to make a picture of a homeless Doomsayer with a card board box hanging from his shoulders reading "We have displeased KeSPA! The world will end!"
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EPT
