• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 06:22
CEST 12:22
KST 19:22
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins EWC 202543Tournament Spotlight: FEL Cracow 202510Power Rank - Esports World Cup 202580RSL Season 1 - Final Week9[ASL19] Finals Recap: Standing Tall15
Community News
Weekly Cups (Jul 28-Aug 3): herO doubles up6LiuLi Cup - August 2025 Tournaments4[BSL 2025] H2 - Team Wars, Weeklies & SB Ladder10EWC 2025 - Replay Pack4Google Play ASL (Season 20) Announced62
StarCraft 2
General
RSL Revival patreon money discussion thread Official Ladder Map Pool Update (April 28, 2025) The GOAT ranking of GOAT rankings Weekly Cups (Jul 28-Aug 3): herO doubles up Clem Interview: "PvT is a bit insane right now"
Tourneys
LiuLi Cup - August 2025 Tournaments WardiTV Mondays RSL Season 2 Qualifier Links and Dates StarCraft Evolution League (SC Evo Biweekly) Global Tourney for College Students in September
Strategy
Custom Maps
External Content
Mutation # 485 Death from Below Mutation # 484 Magnetic Pull Mutation #239 Bad Weather Mutation # 483 Kill Bot Wars
Brood War
General
BW General Discussion StarCraft player reflex TE scores BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ StarCon Philadelphia Where is technical support?
Tourneys
[ASL20] Online Qualifiers Day 2 [CSLPRO] It's CSLAN Season! - Last Chance [Megathread] Daily Proleagues Cosmonarchy Pro Showmatches
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates [G] Mineral Boosting Simple Questions, Simple Answers Muta micro map competition
Other Games
General Games
Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Nintendo Switch Thread Total Annihilation Server - TAForever Beyond All Reason [MMORPG] Tree of Savior (Successor of Ragnarok)
Dota 2
Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Heroes of StarCraft mini-set
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine The Games Industry And ATVI European Politico-economics QA Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
INnoVation Fan Club SKT1 Classic Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Movie Discussion! [Manga] One Piece Anime Discussion Thread [\m/] Heavy Metal Thread Korean Music Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2025 Football Thread Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Gtx660 graphics card replacement Installation of Windows 10 suck at "just a moment" Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
TeamLiquid Team Shirt On Sale The Automated Ban List
Blogs
[Girl blog} My fema…
artosisisthebest
Sharpening the Filtration…
frozenclaw
ASL S20 English Commentary…
namkraft
The Link Between Fitness and…
TrAiDoS
momentary artworks from des…
tankgirl
from making sc maps to makin…
Husyelt
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 749 users

Over-nerfed: Why Zerg dominated Korea. - Page 2

Forum Index > SC2 General
Post a Reply
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 15 16 17 Next All
JreL209
Profile Joined April 2010
United States78 Posts
May 17 2010 06:12 GMT
#21
I believe it is do to zerglings + speed effectiveness and queens ability to defend + macro capabilities. Zerg are able to just sit there and defend quite well early mid game. No air rushes work anymore because people learned to use queens properly, and its amazing seeing zerglings fend off drops for any type of harassment.
shiroinohito
Profile Joined February 2010
United States38 Posts
May 17 2010 06:14 GMT
#22
good read, i waaas wondering that :\ its kinda disapointing that zerg have so few units
wooo...?
cartoon]x
Profile Joined March 2010
United States606 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-17 06:16:05
May 17 2010 06:14 GMT
#23
The article seems to imply streamlined learning would effect asia and not effect europe / north america.. which doesnt really make sense. I think that zerg plays the most like a starcraft 1 race is the best explanation.
I absolutely agree zerg have been over-nerfed.
It is not enough to conquer; one must learn to seduce.
Wi)nD
Profile Joined April 2010
Canada719 Posts
May 17 2010 06:14 GMT
#24
On May 17 2010 15:11 Ftrunkz wrote:
Show nested quote +
Take a good, honest, unbiased look at the Korean SC2 scene as I have just described it.


Sorry but i personally find it hard to believe that your look at it is unbiased. I mean, you even say at the bottom you have likely missed out on some of the top players and the fact you are infact a zerg player yourself also makes this questionable.

Also, i personally think this roach change is also to pave the way for ultras to become a big part of zerg late game just like they were in broodwar zvt and zvp... I would be very surprised if things are left the way they are currently.

ps: you can no longer call any other race, the easy race. hah. :p



the ultras would need some insaine buff to make them even come across the mind for lategame units instead of broodlords since they die pretty damn ez in every fight they are put in
Chrispy
Profile Blog Joined June 2009
Canada5878 Posts
May 17 2010 06:21 GMT
#25
I wonder if Blizzard looks into concerns about the Korean zergs being strong as hell.

On a side note: Are there any Tester replays available? I'd love to see how he plays.
Retvrn to Forvms
Attica
Profile Joined February 2010
United States277 Posts
May 17 2010 06:22 GMT
#26
I think he's saying there's a lot of ex-pro gamers playing zerg right now which is why they are dominating. It has nothing to do with the race but rather the players. Because zerg has the most pros playing it they have the best representation of success. If those same pros would have chosen different races to play we would see a different race dominating the top ranks of Asia.
zomgzergrush
Profile Joined August 2008
United States923 Posts
May 17 2010 06:22 GMT
#27
And queue a flood of "unbiased" opinions of non-zerg users....

now.
Bronze skipping straight to Diamond in 40 games retail release. Bnet 2.0 ladder really takes it's sweet time to think about that league placement.
aliciakeys
Profile Joined April 2010
United States62 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-17 06:25:49
May 17 2010 06:24 GMT
#28
just b/c you are sucking doesn't mean y ou have to blame it on imbalance
edit: and two players practicing terran...hardly evidence of a zerg backlash
no one no one no oooooone can get in the way of what i feel for you
mrdx
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
Vietnam1555 Posts
May 17 2010 06:25 GMT
#29
Not saying Artosis' 2nd point is weak, but I found it surprising if the entire impression of Zerg being overwhelming in Asia was because of those 6 ex SC1 progamers listed. They must have been either so far ahead of everyone, or being so influential to the entire Zerg player base (by writing Zerg playing guides, commentaries, 1st person VODs etc...)?

The first point about Zerg being overall easier to figure out was not convincing IMO, as if it is, it would be the same case outside of Asia.
BoxerForever.com - the one and only international Boxer fansite since 2006 :)
Geo.Rion
Profile Blog Joined October 2008
7377 Posts
May 17 2010 06:30 GMT
#30
WOW, thank you Artosis, finally someone with a name points out that Z is overnerfed
"Protoss is a joke" Liquid`Jinro Okt.1. 2011
CursOr
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States6335 Posts
May 17 2010 06:32 GMT
#31
...or it could be that Hydras are just straight Broken.

+ Show Spoiler +
No but seriously. This makes sense. Easier and faster to figure out. I honestly think their macro mechanic is too strong- coupled with the slightly cheaper hatcheries and "simplicity" you point out. I have said it before, Zerg wil catch some form of Macro nerf once it becomes apparent what they to do other races in the hands of Professionals. Again, it's only a guess. But from what I've gathered it seems likely.
CJ forever (-_-(-_-(-_-(-_-)-_-)-_-)-_-)
On_Slaught
Profile Joined August 2008
United States12190 Posts
May 17 2010 06:33 GMT
#32
On May 17 2010 15:22 Attica wrote:
I think he's saying there's a lot of ex-pro gamers playing zerg right now which is why they are dominating. It has nothing to do with the race but rather the players. Because zerg has the most pros playing it they have the best representation of success. If those same pros would have chosen different races to play we would see a different race dominating the top ranks of Asia.


Except there is no foundation for this and you can't prove it without questioning the race they play. There are plenty of amazing players who aren't famous.
mrdx
Profile Blog Joined October 2004
Vietnam1555 Posts
May 17 2010 06:33 GMT
#33
Btw I'm quite sure Blizzard is aware of a chicken or egg dilemma that they are having - to decide whether it's good players picked Zerg and made it so strong, or it's already strong (i.e imba) which made good people (who were smart enough to realize that) decided to pick it.
BoxerForever.com - the one and only international Boxer fansite since 2006 :)
nodule
Profile Joined February 2008
Canada931 Posts
May 17 2010 06:33 GMT
#34
Or, maybe the strongest players picked the overpowered race, the race that allowed them to win most easily. Artosis and Idra switching to zerg is no coincidence, perhaps?
ohN
Profile Blog Joined November 2009
United States1075 Posts
May 17 2010 06:34 GMT
#35
On May 17 2010 15:30 Geo.Rion wrote:
WOW, thank you Artosis, finally someone with a name points out that Z is overnerfed

Couldn't agree more. I stopped playing zerg after this patch. I was getting tired of seeing zerg get nerfed every single goddamn patch despite not being glaringly overpowered and watching (for the most part) terran get buffed. Guess what race I play now. =P
Attica
Profile Joined February 2010
United States277 Posts
May 17 2010 06:37 GMT
#36
If zerg is so easy then why do they struggle on US and EU servers?
Chaoz
Profile Joined March 2010
United States507 Posts
May 17 2010 06:37 GMT
#37
From the comments I was expecting an in depth article, but the second just lists some known players. It doesn't explain why Zerg dominates in Korea at all.
CursOr
Profile Blog Joined January 2009
United States6335 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-17 07:34:35
May 17 2010 06:37 GMT
#38
It's all too apparent, IMO, that Zerg isn't going to develop tactically in SC2 like they did in SC1. The years will pass- but I would imagine this Zerg- as it is now, would scarcely be able to change its play. Agreeing with Artosis- the paths through the build orders and possible tactics are indeed seeming far more limited than the original Zerg. Who's biggest problem, from what I observed, was becoming proficient in using all of their variety and possibilities to their maximum impact. Opposite is the case this time- optimal build orders and unit compositions seem to be crystallizing and you're punished if you deviate.
CJ forever (-_-(-_-(-_-(-_-)-_-)-_-)-_-)
bearbuddy
Profile Blog Joined February 2009
3442 Posts
May 17 2010 06:39 GMT
#39
They're bound to overshoot so they can correct it after acquiring enough data. It is unreasonable to assume that they can simply go from zerg being favored to perfectly balanced. If they nerf the zerg with very, very small changes, the subtle difference doesn't really show up all that much.

This is what the Beta is for, believe it or not.
Katkishka
Profile Blog Joined December 2009
United States649 Posts
Last Edited: 2010-05-17 06:40:53
May 17 2010 06:39 GMT
#40
On May 17 2010 15:22 zomgzergrush wrote:
And queue a flood of "unbiased" opinions of non-zerg users....

now.

And queue a flood of "unbiased" opinions of zerg users....

now.

I don't think people realise that one of the reasons zerg has so few units is because of spawn larvae. If zerg could tech switch immediately to an extremely diverse range of units, zerg would be horribly OP
Zerg's few attack units are all very "general" for a reason.

Also, Artosis, I think you're going overboard with the extreme "korea is god" bias. No offense or anything, it just seems like every defense you have includes the words "korea" and "better"
Prev 1 2 3 4 5 15 16 17 Next All
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
The PondCast
10:00
Episode 57
CranKy Ducklings18
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
RotterdaM 127
Harstem 123
ProTech44
StarCraft: Brood War
Calm 15068
Sea 1880
firebathero 1214
Bisu 674
Jaedong 562
EffOrt 454
Larva 417
ggaemo 316
Stork 263
actioN 222
[ Show more ]
Mini 178
Hyuk 138
Mind 135
Killer 129
Dewaltoss 90
Sacsri 84
Soma 80
Last 69
Snow 67
sSak 58
Backho 49
Noble 35
sorry 32
ZerO 25
Sharp 23
NaDa 21
JulyZerg 12
Sexy 12
IntoTheRainbow 11
Terrorterran 2
ToSsGirL 0
Dota 2
BananaSlamJamma278
XcaliburYe264
League of Legends
JimRising 241
Counter-Strike
shoxiejesuss584
x6flipin317
Other Games
singsing1162
Fuzer 268
DeMusliM242
crisheroes227
Mew2King127
SortOf100
rGuardiaN23
ZerO(Twitch)8
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick781
StarCraft: Brood War
Kim Chul Min (afreeca) 467
lovetv 10
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
sctven
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• davetesta10
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• iopq 1
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Upcoming Events
WardiTV Summer Champion…
38m
Replay Cast
13h 38m
LiuLi Cup
1d
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
1d 4h
RSL Revival
1d 15h
RSL Revival
1d 23h
SC Evo League
2 days
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
2 days
CSO Cup
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
[ Show More ]
uThermal 2v2 Circuit
3 days
Wardi Open
4 days
RotterdaM Event
4 days
RSL Revival
5 days
The PondCast
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

ASL Season 20: Qualifier #2
FEL Cracow 2025
CC Div. A S7

Ongoing

Copa Latinoamericana 4
Jiahua Invitational
BSL 20 Team Wars
KCM Race Survival 2025 Season 3
BSL 21 Qualifiers
HCC Europe
BLAST Bounty Fall Qual
IEM Cologne 2025
FISSURE Playground #1
BLAST.tv Austin Major 2025
ESL Impact League Season 7
IEM Dallas 2025

Upcoming

ASL Season 20
CSLPRO Chat StarLAN 3
BSL Season 21
BSL 21 Team A
RSL Revival: Season 2
Maestros of the Game
SEL Season 2 Championship
WardiTV Summer 2025
uThermal 2v2 Main Event
Thunderpick World Champ.
MESA Nomadic Masters Fall
CS Asia Championships 2025
Roobet Cup 2025
ESL Pro League S22
StarSeries Fall 2025
FISSURE Playground #2
BLAST Open Fall 2025
BLAST Open Fall Qual
Esports World Cup 2025
BLAST Bounty Fall 2025
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2025 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.