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On May 08 2017 19:10 Pandemona wrote:Show nested quote +On May 08 2017 18:58 Dracolich70 wrote:On May 08 2017 18:19 Pandemona wrote:
I never said anything other than Rafa was crap for us and the players we had won us that Europa League which is fact. Our players were tenfold better than what we were playing against at the time again a fact. Even the glorious Torres was finding the net in that competition, winning it for us was inevitable.
I also stated that he turned the fans onto the board with his signing for us as no one wanted him, we sang for him to resign multiple times, we cheered the last game of the season when we knew he wasn't coming back. The whole season we were just thankful for DiMatteo and then we were all happy again once Mourinho returned and fixed everything.
You also state pointless facts like wow Rafa made you finish 3rd place in the league with points higher than from a 2010-11 season. Wow amazing, that same season saw Ancelotti get fired for that, good feat beating his points marker by 4 in which DiMatteo had already beaten both Spurs and Arsenal away before he came. And I argued your points, and you left them, and now you do it again, as if it didn't happen. Torres had been horrible since joining from LFC. Now he got reaquinted with Rafa, who made him into a superstar at LFC. These things are effects of managers. Hopefully you also accredit Conte for his work and accomplishments, even if most of the players were not his, and they had won the league only two seasons ago. Supporters support. Fans don't decide who is hired or not. They just pay to watch football, by the choices of the club. If they don't support, of course they can't take anything from winning. If you stay away, or boo against the manager you are hurting your own team. But again, it is not Rafas fault he got hired. He was willing to help Chelsea out, after they sacked Di Matteo after 12 matches, and him losing Charity Shield, Super cup and the early exit from CL, and Rafa did a competent job, steadying the ship, got Chelsea back into top 4, and won EL. The mark of a very good manager, when he comes in 1/3 into the season. It was the season Chelsea got 2nd, so 4 points more, is pretty good. Di Matteo had a great start to the season, just like I said, but then it dipped, and they lost 2(Utd and WBA) and drew two(LFC and Swansea) and in the league, and the early exit was the final nail in the coffin for Abramovic. I am not saying it was fair on Di Matteo, but Rafa got a better point average as I showed. Rafa didn't nearly ruin the club, and he is a very good manager, not awful or terrible. The End. he was just at the helm making awful decisions causing huge rift in Chelsea football clubIs what i said, this is what Chelsea fans think, this is all we care about. Roman has made 2 awful decisions in his time at Chelsea, the worst that hurt and displeased the Chelsea faithful is hiring Rafa Benitez into which our beloved Gus Hiddink could have done the same job quite comfortably or at the matter of fact any other manager. Instead he chose the man who has said; ‘Chelsea is a big club with fantastic players, every manager wants to coach a such a big team, But I would never take that job, in respect for my former team at Liverpool, no matter what. For me there is only club in England, and that’s Liverpool' So why did he rock up at Stamford bridge all smiles and what not? Because it was an easy job to get his name back out there and to say hey look at me i got top 4 and a sub par european troffie. This is what made him our worst manager ever, he turned Stamford Bridge into a cauldron of hate towards the board and the owner. There isn't a Chelsea fan in the world who would say that Rafa was not the worst manager in our clubs history. No one cares for facts of what he has done or how many glorious points per game he had, the fact that a man can say all the shit he did against us then rock up at the club all smiles is beyond belief.
So you don't hate him because of anything remotely related to football, and you're not talking at all about his qualities as a manager in football. Just about his relationship to the club. Zzzzzz
Also, by the same reasoning you came up with to call Chelsea relevant, AZ Alkmaar is a fucking gigantic club. Chelsea up until Abramovich was irrelevant in Europe and even England. An English subtop team that was sometimes dangerous to the top. Hell, Blackburn Rovers is historically more relevant than Chelsea. But they weren't bought by a filthy rich Russian and are therefore relegated to League One.
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pande i dont think you understand what the word "professional" means.
rafa may or may not have meant what he said when he talked shit about chelsea. but that was in the past and its part of his job to be loyal to the club hes at (to some extent talking crap about other clubs may become part of this).
whether you like it or not your own beloved abramovich brought him in to do a job and rafa accepted it and put all the bad history behind him. you cant fault him for being a professional when called upon, you can only blame yourselves for not standing behind your new manager and letting it go.
an example of a true bad manager is someone like moyes, who despite admittedly having an incredibly tough task in continuing saf's legacy, he destroyed the infrastructure already in place at man utd and eventually caused new managers to come in and rebuild the club from scratch. firing backroom staff, having no control over his squad, being clueless about how to actually win games, finishing 7th, giving rooney a 5 year contract and bringing in fellaini are what make him the worst manager weve had.
if you want to compare another manager that was basically fired because the supporters protested against him, you can look at van gaal. van gaal was fired because he brought a playstyle to the club that fans just couldnt accept and it cost him his job, but if you really asked fans hated him i doubt youd find a man utd fan that truly thought he was a terrible manager. you have to credit your managers for what theyve done and the truth is despite the type of football van gaal brought to the team, he did a lot of work in rebuilding the team and creating a structure that could be carried on by succeeding managers. he also won us a trophy which is better than nothing. likewise as much as everyone jokes about how anyone could manage pep's barca and win, the reality is that managers have massive influence on the success of a team. trying to say chelsea won EL to no thanks to rafa is just being bitter.
lastly you look at mou, who had a lot of fans disliking him while he was at rm and even chelsea. now hes here and despite our league position its evident that the team is progressing and he is doing a good job (although final judgment will be made depending on champions league). now you dont find many fans who are openly against mou; fans have to accept that managers are also professionals hired to do a job and that they have the clubs best interests in mind while theyre there. you can either have a sook about it or you can cheer for your team and hope for the best.
tbh i think like others have already kinda stated, the success abramovich brought chelsea has spoiled chelsea fans. if chelsea hadnt been bought by a billionaire and were kinda like the current newcastle or so, i doubt many of you would harbour such hate for a man who saved a sinking boat mid-season and brought you an EL title
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Umm I don't have irrational hate towards Rafa. I do think that our EL success wasn't due to him, but due to the players though. I don't think he did anything useful for the club, except maybe steadied it after Jose rocked the boat too much.
I personally dislike hiddink over what he did last season. With absolutely nothing to play for and the first team being a disgrace, there's no better time to play the youngsters. But nope matic ivanovic etc starting all the time instead of rlc Kennedy traore etc.
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
On May 08 2017 19:58 Acrofales wrote:Show nested quote +On May 08 2017 19:10 Pandemona wrote:On May 08 2017 18:58 Dracolich70 wrote:On May 08 2017 18:19 Pandemona wrote:
I never said anything other than Rafa was crap for us and the players we had won us that Europa League which is fact. Our players were tenfold better than what we were playing against at the time again a fact. Even the glorious Torres was finding the net in that competition, winning it for us was inevitable.
I also stated that he turned the fans onto the board with his signing for us as no one wanted him, we sang for him to resign multiple times, we cheered the last game of the season when we knew he wasn't coming back. The whole season we were just thankful for DiMatteo and then we were all happy again once Mourinho returned and fixed everything.
You also state pointless facts like wow Rafa made you finish 3rd place in the league with points higher than from a 2010-11 season. Wow amazing, that same season saw Ancelotti get fired for that, good feat beating his points marker by 4 in which DiMatteo had already beaten both Spurs and Arsenal away before he came. And I argued your points, and you left them, and now you do it again, as if it didn't happen. Torres had been horrible since joining from LFC. Now he got reaquinted with Rafa, who made him into a superstar at LFC. These things are effects of managers. Hopefully you also accredit Conte for his work and accomplishments, even if most of the players were not his, and they had won the league only two seasons ago. Supporters support. Fans don't decide who is hired or not. They just pay to watch football, by the choices of the club. If they don't support, of course they can't take anything from winning. If you stay away, or boo against the manager you are hurting your own team. But again, it is not Rafas fault he got hired. He was willing to help Chelsea out, after they sacked Di Matteo after 12 matches, and him losing Charity Shield, Super cup and the early exit from CL, and Rafa did a competent job, steadying the ship, got Chelsea back into top 4, and won EL. The mark of a very good manager, when he comes in 1/3 into the season. It was the season Chelsea got 2nd, so 4 points more, is pretty good. Di Matteo had a great start to the season, just like I said, but then it dipped, and they lost 2(Utd and WBA) and drew two(LFC and Swansea) and in the league, and the early exit was the final nail in the coffin for Abramovic. I am not saying it was fair on Di Matteo, but Rafa got a better point average as I showed. Rafa didn't nearly ruin the club, and he is a very good manager, not awful or terrible. The End. he was just at the helm making awful decisions causing huge rift in Chelsea football clubIs what i said, this is what Chelsea fans think, this is all we care about. Roman has made 2 awful decisions in his time at Chelsea, the worst that hurt and displeased the Chelsea faithful is hiring Rafa Benitez into which our beloved Gus Hiddink could have done the same job quite comfortably or at the matter of fact any other manager. Instead he chose the man who has said; ‘Chelsea is a big club with fantastic players, every manager wants to coach a such a big team, But I would never take that job, in respect for my former team at Liverpool, no matter what. For me there is only club in England, and that’s Liverpool' So why did he rock up at Stamford bridge all smiles and what not? Because it was an easy job to get his name back out there and to say hey look at me i got top 4 and a sub par european troffie. This is what made him our worst manager ever, he turned Stamford Bridge into a cauldron of hate towards the board and the owner. There isn't a Chelsea fan in the world who would say that Rafa was not the worst manager in our clubs history. No one cares for facts of what he has done or how many glorious points per game he had, the fact that a man can say all the shit he did against us then rock up at the club all smiles is beyond belief. So you don't hate him because of anything remotely related to football, and you're not talking at all about his qualities as a manager in football. Just about his relationship to the club. Zzzzzz Also, by the same reasoning you came up with to call Chelsea relevant, AZ Alkmaar is a fucking gigantic club. Chelsea up until Abramovich was irrelevant in Europe and even England. An English subtop team that was sometimes dangerous to the top. Hell, Blackburn Rovers is historically more relevant than Chelsea. But they weren't bought by a filthy rich Russian and are therefore relegated to League One.
How we were irrelevant? We were finishing top 4 / 5 multiple seasons in a row, beating the big clubs at the time, had huge players. We had world cup winning France defense as our defense.... Won domestic cups, European cups...
You say that Blackburn comment with 0 idea on how blackburn won the league and became relevant so again if you don't know history of the league why bother commenting? Blackburn were bought by Jack Walker Steel in 1990s who were one of the richest business' in England at the time. He got Kenny Dalglish in and got promoted from Division 1 and then splashed RECORD numbers of money on transfers and won the league that way.....Two seasons later after finishing 4th, then 2nd and finally winning it the season after. They effectively "bought" the league, the same way everyone says Chelsea and City did which is fair enough but at least Chelsea won it from day 1 not 2 seasons of splashing absurd levels of cash
And also i never said anything about questioning Rafa's managerial career. I said he was OUR worst manager EVER, which he is for Chelsea as he is a man who walked into the club on the back of saying he would never manager Chelsea because we have plastic flags to generate atmosphere and not hears like Liverpool fans. On top of the rest of his actions in the past. It would be like Mourinho managing Arsenal or Liverpool it just wouldn't happen.
On May 08 2017 20:17 evilfatsh1t wrote:
pande i dont think you understand what the word "professional" means.
rafa may or may not have meant what he said when he talked shit about chelsea. but that was in the past and its part of his job to be loyal to the club hes at (to some extent talking crap about other clubs may become part of this).
whether you like it or not your own beloved abramovich brought him in to do a job and rafa accepted it and put all the bad history behind him. you cant fault him for being a professional when called upon, you can only blame yourselves for not standing behind your new manager and letting it go.
an example of a true bad manager is someone like moyes, who despite admittedly having an incredibly tough task in continuing saf's legacy, he destroyed the infrastructure already in place at man utd and eventually caused new managers to come in and rebuild the club from scratch. firing backroom staff, having no control over his squad, being clueless about how to actually win games, finishing 7th, giving rooney a 5 year contract and bringing in fellaini are what make him the worst manager weve had.
if you want to compare another manager that was basically fired because the supporters protested against him, you can look at van gaal. van gaal was fired because he brought a playstyle to the club that fans just couldnt accept and it cost him his job, but if you really asked fans hated him i doubt youd find a man utd fan that truly thought he was a terrible manager. you have to credit your managers for what theyve done and the truth is despite the type of football van gaal brought to the team, he did a lot of work in rebuilding the team and creating a structure that could be carried on by succeeding managers. he also won us a trophy which is better than nothing. likewise as much as everyone jokes about how anyone could manage pep's barca and win, the reality is that managers have massive influence on the success of a team. trying to say chelsea won EL to no thanks to rafa is just being bitter.
lastly you look at mou, who had a lot of fans disliking him while he was at rm and even chelsea. now hes here and despite our league position its evident that the team is progressing and he is doing a good job (although final judgment will be made depending on champions league). now you dont find many fans who are openly against mou; fans have to accept that managers are also professionals hired to do a job and that they have the clubs best interests in mind while theyre there. you can either have a sook about it or you can cheer for your team and hope for the best.
tbh i think like others have already kinda stated, the success abramovich brought chelsea has spoiled chelsea fans. if chelsea hadnt been bought by a billionaire and were kinda like the current newcastle or so, i doubt many of you would harbour such hate for a man who saved a sinking boat mid-season and brought you an EL title
Chelsea fans aren't spoil for what we have, we were happy and complete after our Champions league success with club legend Di Matteo. We didn't ask to be signed by a Russian billionaire who loves the club so much he bankrolled almost half of his networth into it! We were actively looking to sell the club and thankfully getting into the champions league along with some other fatal actions saw Roman buy our club and not anyone else's. From then on we were also counted as blessed and happy, our track record has proven every decision minus the Benitez one has been right as we have won trophy after trophy. However there is one dark period over Chelsea and that was when Benitez was there any fan will tell you the same thing, he was a terrible man and tried to oust JT, there is a reason why all the players now are public with what went on with his abysmal training, attacking of fans during his time there and trying to turn the team on club captain JT. Benitez was close to being our Moyes but luckily he was only and ever was an interim.
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Calling Benitez a abysmal manager is so funny and so like Chelsea XD
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
I don't think i have said anything other than Rafa was our worst manager? Not questioning his past or future failures or whatever just the man turned our club into dark times and was very toxic.
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On May 08 2017 21:59 Pandemona wrote:
I don't think i have said anything other than Rafa was our worst manager? Not questioning his past or future failures or whatever just the man turned our club into dark times and was very toxic.
I'm sorry but really the majority of your arguments are centered around the fact that you dont like him, it takes more than just a manager and a few comments to stoke toxicity at the levels you keep describi\ing, the fans have to be toxic in the first place for it to be a thing.
You have provided ample evidence of this In the last 2 pages. He is not the worst manager you have ever had, not for footballing reasons anyway which again is quite well proven at this point anyway.
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On May 08 2017 23:39 Pandemona wrote:I never said anything about football reasons...so why is that being discussed? People started defending saying he won you the mighty Europa League which we were destined to win anyway. The results before Rafa came in and after were pretty similar. The fact that it was the worst moment in the club era under Roman for sure was because the hostilities and toxicity that followed around. He was not the man we wanted, everyone hated him and what we were watching and seeing him on the touchline thats all i was saying. He also if you read quotes from players and articles on how bad he was with the players as well and how he treated JT then it all adds up to pissing off every Chelsea fan. I never once questioned his on the field tactics or the way he plays football as if anything its pretty similar to Mourinho minus the fact he rotates his squad ALOT oh and doesn't win as much 
Well, rotation is a nice thing.
Mou now doesn't rotate at all, doesn't win at all and forced to play U21's cuz everyone is injured 
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
True this season it is failing him, but the 3 premier league titles with Chelsea was when he used like 14 players xD
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Germany3128 Posts
I'm so fucking nervous for the Monday game tonight in Germany
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On May 08 2017 23:56 Pandemona wrote:
True this season it is failing him, but the 3 premier league titles with Chelsea was when he used like 14 players xD
And that would continue to work if the teams in the PL didnt play an obnoxious amount of games. Honestly Id rather see these teams play less games and get quality output rather than the absolute garbage all of these 'top' clubs with all these 'amazing' managers put out every so often, Im fully convinced it has to do in large parts with the scheduling.
Liverpool is a shining example of this, some games they are refreshed and play heavy metal like never before and the games after they will come out jaded as fuck. Because really no one can play the kind of intensity Klopp or even for that matter Pep playstyles demand.
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All I know about Rafa is that he was the worst Real Madrid manager for this century... Maybe on par with Luxemburgo. No wonder he lasted 6 months in Madrid. Going from Carletto to him was a nightmare.
edit: Actually, after thinking carefully about Luxemburgo, he was better... So yeah, Rafa was the worst.
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On May 08 2017 15:11 Dracolich70 wrote:Show nested quote +On May 08 2017 14:44 zeo wrote:
Just stopping by to say Rafa Benitez was indeed the worst manager Chelsea Football club ever had. No contest. Rafa had a win percentage of 58.3% at Chelsea with no influence of what players came in. Villas Boas had 47.5%, Scolari had 55.6%. Neither won anything, and were sacked not even a year into their tenure. Villas Boas got Chelsea outside Top 4, and Scolari was pos 4. Benitez got Chelsea in 3rd place with a EL title to boot. So much for no contest. Thanks for stopping by.
Win percentages aren't everything though. He was just an extremely toxic presence at the club and a dismal motivator, his ability to blame everyone but himself for his failings is unparalleled in the football world. He has ruined every club he went to after Liverpool and it took 2 years to undo the loser/fail attitude he injected into the side. Who know what would have happened if he had stayed at the club longer than 6 months.
And he sold Sturridge for peanuts.
Conte on the other hand has given a masterclass on how to pull a Mourinho super-squad that has imploded out of the gutter.
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I think Benitez just does not know how to handle big egos which is like half the job of a coach in a top team.
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On May 09 2017 00:48 TheNewEra wrote:
I'm so fucking nervous for the Monday game tonight in Germany
Calm down, there is no way Stuttgart manages to finish out this season without collapsing. Also I think i liked it better when they were mostly successful this year over seeing them fuck around in relegation again next year.
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Pandemona
Charlie Sheens House51493 Posts
Great win for Chelsea tonight, 3-0 very solid very good! Come on 3 more points and it's done.
Great touch from Conte at the end going over to 'boro players, management and fans to shake hands and clap off the fans as they are now relegated.
Cesc Fabregas so so good!
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On May 09 2017 05:54 Pandemona wrote:
Cesc Fabregas so so good!
he was awesome today. First one to assist 10+ goals in six different EPL seasons. Amazing!
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On May 08 2017 23:47 Skynx wrote:Show nested quote +On May 08 2017 23:39 Pandemona wrote:I never said anything about football reasons...so why is that being discussed? People started defending saying he won you the mighty Europa League which we were destined to win anyway. The results before Rafa came in and after were pretty similar. The fact that it was the worst moment in the club era under Roman for sure was because the hostilities and toxicity that followed around. He was not the man we wanted, everyone hated him and what we were watching and seeing him on the touchline thats all i was saying. He also if you read quotes from players and articles on how bad he was with the players as well and how he treated JT then it all adds up to pissing off every Chelsea fan. I never once questioned his on the field tactics or the way he plays football as if anything its pretty similar to Mourinho minus the fact he rotates his squad ALOT oh and doesn't win as much Well, rotation is a nice thing. Mou now doesn't rotate at all, doesn't win at all and forced to play U21's cuz everyone is injured
mou actually rotated players a fair bit this season. everyone ended up injured anyway but it wasnt due to rotation problems
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Ay will we do a Brighton hahaha
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EPT
