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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On August 11 2014 20:27 oneofthem wrote: they are not going to break 60 wins unless the east is just disastrously bad. with a soft interior d they can't coast that much. and what if they end up going 40-1 or 39-2 at home while dominating Western Teams? This is entirely possible. | ||
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FakePseudo
Belgium716 Posts
On August 11 2014 22:19 Ace wrote: and what if they end up going 40-1 or 39-2 at home while dominating Western Teams? This is entirely possible. How constructive is that comment? I don't see any hows or whys. So basically he's saying A and you're saying "and what if not A (and some more), this is possible". Well, then 60 wins happens I guess, [and they get destroyed by halfcourt defense in playoffs duuuuuh]. Point is that didn't bring anything to the table. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
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andrewlt
United States7702 Posts
On August 11 2014 10:57 cLutZ wrote: Phil in his book also basically wrote that Ohare Airport + Being in the middle of the country was also a huge part of it. Basically, they rarely had long trips and Chicago basically gave them free reign so they also had no delays. Plus, you know, Jordan. Pissed Jordan. They also wanted it that year. They went all the way to 70-9 before resting players. The next year, they started 68-10 then lost 3 out of their last 4 because they didn't give a shit about 70 anymore. Also, I remember that one of the ten losses during that 72-10 season was to Toronto. They had a better record against non-expansion teams. | ||
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FakePseudo
Belgium716 Posts
On August 11 2014 23:16 Ace wrote: It means beating up on a weak East isn't the only way to hit 60 wins. I don't see what you're crying about. We aren't even talking about the playoffs. I don't think anyone in here finds it tremendously interesting that having a top 3 all time home record while dominating a uber stacked West conference is another way to get you above the 60 mark. That's why I immediately said that your post was a bland "what if 60 wins", because the the implication "good HR + beat western teams => 60 wins" isn't really argument worthy but it still relies on a very irrealistic premisce, at least to me. The playoffs poke between brackets was just funsies. I like defensive, fundamental teams. That's it | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
The year before they went 39-2 at home going 26-4 vs the West (87%) while going 40-12 vs the East (76%). You sure this isn't realistic? | ||
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FakePseudo
Belgium716 Posts
On August 12 2014 00:01 Ace wrote: Cleveland 2010 went 23-7 vs the West (76%) while going 38-14 vs the East (73%) with a 35-6 home record. The year before they went 39-2 at home going 26-4 vs the West (87%) while going 40-12 vs the East (76%). You sure this isn't realistic? well now at least we have a point to argue about  .Still I don't think it will click right away for them and I think (and hope) their defensive weakness will hurt them a lot. Plus I think a case could be made about the west being A LOT stronger than 2008-2010. (Spurs, durant, clippers) | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
With schedule quirks this can be good enough to hit 60. What I think you're talking about is the playoffs where winning without good interior defense is a pipe dream because you won't be limiting Conf Semifinals and later opponents from multiple opportunities most of the time. As for the West being stronger than 08-10 that's probably true. The Cavs may already "fill" in 55+ wins off everyone else and the difficult part may be finding the extra 5 or so vs the elite Western teams. Lucky for the Cavs then all 3 play in different divisions so they might get a schedule break and not play OKC-SA back to back. | ||
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FakePseudo
Belgium716 Posts
On August 12 2014 00:23 Ace wrote: Need to be clear here: They can still reach 60 wins (as difficult as it may be) with a league average defense and historically good offense (possible with Love+Lebron and getting another top tier offensive player.). Remember DRTG can still be above average even with shit shot protection if you dominate in rebounds, turnovers, and not fouling - almost like the Minnesota Timberwolves of last season (16,6,1 ranked respectively). You'll give up clean looks but limit opportunities while getting more shots on offense to widen Point Differential. You can have defensive weakness in 1 of the four areas and still run wild over 82 games. With schedule quirks this can be good enough to hit 60. What I think you're talking about is the playoffs where winning without good interior defense is a pipe dream because you won't be limiting Conf Semifinals and later opponents from multiple opportunities most of the time. As for the West being stronger than 08-10 that's probably true. The Cavs may already "fill" in 55+ wins off everyone else and the difficult part may be finding the extra 5 or so vs the elite Western teams. Lucky for the Cavs then all 3 play in different divisions so they might get a schedule break and not play OKC-SA back to back. GTG but this is getting an interesting conversation. | ||
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TwoToneTerran
United States8841 Posts
Like, back when the Cavs won 66 games Lebron was a worse player, the East was a stronger conference, and his best teammates were...Big Z and Delonte West? ALL STAR POINT GUARD Mo Williams? I suppose with West, Wallace and Big Z that team was definitively better defensively (though Lebron hadn't really blossomed into the top tier defender he is now) but man, when your second and third best scoring options are Delonte West and Mo Williams things have to be better than that. Also they have a real coach instead of Mike Brown which cannot be stressed enough. Basically, I'm not betting on it, but I wouldn't be surprised if the Cavs won more than 60 games. | ||
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oneofthem
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
the teams that won a lot of games in the regular season tend to be very good and consistent on defense. the formula for predicting wins by scoring margin has to take into account level of scoring, a 5 point margin is better when you are talking about 90-85, vs 110-105. | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
ESPN Basketball expert.....  | ||
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icystorage
Jollibee19350 Posts
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zulu_nation8
China26351 Posts
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icystorage
Jollibee19350 Posts
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
 Loading up on Bucks/Sixers/Timberwolves players this year | ||
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Tosstriss
Canada334 Posts
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
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oneofthem
Cayman Islands24199 Posts
also this article manages to articulate my thoughts on love quite well. https://medium.com/ten-pens/the-kevin-love-problem-e08496464659 some stuff on cavs defense http://www.washingtonpost.com/news/fancy-stats/wp/2014/08/06/with-kevin-love-the-cavaliers-will-struggle-on-defense/ | ||
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TwoToneTerran
United States8841 Posts
Also, him comparing Wiggins to any part of the two headed defensive wing juggernaut that was Jordan and Pippen is so hilariously out of tune with the world. Just so many things in that article that bug me and sound like sports punditry. | ||
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