On December 07 2021 22:00 Harris1st wrote: There is a difference between "this is boring to watch" and "this strat is unstoppable"
Like you mentioned, herO was 2 years away and insta solves the problem. At this point I'm inclined to think Protoss players are just bad right now instead of Zerg OP
Meh, Zerg will probably just adapt the queen walk and still wreck / come out ahead. Zest also beat queen walks with Void rays + mass batteries in some games a few months ago, doesn't mean Zergs didn't win any queen walks after (as we have seen countless times). It's only 2 games that were won with mass oracles so far (yes, 2 out of 2).
That's the beauty of Starcraft. 10 years later it still evolves. More and more Protoss players will play and perfect mass oracle strat and suddenly Zerg cries "Toss OP" until a Zerg figures out to counter it reliably and then we will be at "Zerg OP" again
People are overeacting to the Queen Walk thing imo, sure they are tanky, can heal, and got decent DPS in mass. They are still the ONLY anti-air option for Zerg before Lair tech, what else you supposed Zerg to make against unit that fly? If Hydra tech was a tier-one, no Toss would even even think about double SG opening.
On December 07 2021 22:00 Harris1st wrote: There is a difference between "this is boring to watch" and "this strat is unstoppable"
Like you mentioned, herO was 2 years away and insta solves the problem. At this point I'm inclined to think Protoss players are just bad right now instead of Zerg OP
Meh, Zerg will probably just adapt the queen walk and still wreck / come out ahead. Zest also beat queen walks with Void rays + mass batteries in some games a few months ago, doesn't mean Zergs didn't win any queen walks after (as we have seen countless times). It's only 2 games that were won with mass oracles so far (yes, 2 out of 2).
That's the beauty of Starcraft. 10 years later it still evolves. More and more Protoss players will play and perfect mass oracle strat and suddenly Zerg cries "Toss OP" until a Zerg figures out to counter it reliably and then we will be at "Zerg OP" again
I love how ppl say herO solved that, not like the oracle strat is heavily depending on the zerg not socuting and commiting isntead of waiting and abusing you having invested the money into 8 oracles :D
On December 07 2021 22:00 Harris1st wrote: There is a difference between "this is boring to watch" and "this strat is unstoppable"
Like you mentioned, herO was 2 years away and insta solves the problem. At this point I'm inclined to think Protoss players are just bad right now instead of Zerg OP
Meh, Zerg will probably just adapt the queen walk and still wreck / come out ahead. Zest also beat queen walks with Void rays + mass batteries in some games a few months ago, doesn't mean Zergs didn't win any queen walks after (as we have seen countless times). It's only 2 games that were won with mass oracles so far (yes, 2 out of 2).
That's the beauty of Starcraft. 10 years later it still evolves. More and more Protoss players will play and perfect mass oracle strat and suddenly Zerg cries "Toss OP" until a Zerg figures out to counter it reliably and then we will be at "Zerg OP" again
I love how ppl say herO solved that, not like the oracle strat is heavily depending on the zerg not socuting and commiting isntead of waiting and abusing you having invested the money into 8 oracles :D
Well, yeah scouting is part of it. It's not like Toss has a gazillion ways to scout Queens Gambit early.
On December 07 2021 22:00 Harris1st wrote: There is a difference between "this is boring to watch" and "this strat is unstoppable"
Like you mentioned, herO was 2 years away and insta solves the problem. At this point I'm inclined to think Protoss players are just bad right now instead of Zerg OP
Meh, Zerg will probably just adapt the queen walk and still wreck / come out ahead. Zest also beat queen walks with Void rays + mass batteries in some games a few months ago, doesn't mean Zergs didn't win any queen walks after (as we have seen countless times). It's only 2 games that were won with mass oracles so far (yes, 2 out of 2).
That's the beauty of Starcraft. 10 years later it still evolves. More and more Protoss players will play and perfect mass oracle strat and suddenly Zerg cries "Toss OP" until a Zerg figures out to counter it reliably and then we will be at "Zerg OP" again
I love how ppl say herO solved that, not like the oracle strat is heavily depending on the zerg not socuting and commiting isntead of waiting and abusing you having invested the money into 8 oracles :D
It's also not like herO after the TSL match immediately said Zest came up with it first
On December 07 2021 22:00 Harris1st wrote: There is a difference between "this is boring to watch" and "this strat is unstoppable"
Like you mentioned, herO was 2 years away and insta solves the problem. At this point I'm inclined to think Protoss players are just bad right now instead of Zerg OP
Meh, Zerg will probably just adapt the queen walk and still wreck / come out ahead. Zest also beat queen walks with Void rays + mass batteries in some games a few months ago, doesn't mean Zergs didn't win any queen walks after (as we have seen countless times). It's only 2 games that were won with mass oracles so far (yes, 2 out of 2).
That's the beauty of Starcraft. 10 years later it still evolves. More and more Protoss players will play and perfect mass oracle strat and suddenly Zerg cries "Toss OP" until a Zerg figures out to counter it reliably and then we will be at "Zerg OP" again
I love how ppl say herO solved that, not like the oracle strat is heavily depending on the zerg not socuting and commiting isntead of waiting and abusing you having invested the money into 8 oracles :D
It's also not like herO after the TSL match immediately said Zest came up with it first
He did? Pity because this would be such a herO thing to do ^^ Curious to see if this turns into a legit counter
On December 07 2021 22:00 Harris1st wrote: There is a difference between "this is boring to watch" and "this strat is unstoppable"
Like you mentioned, herO was 2 years away and insta solves the problem. At this point I'm inclined to think Protoss players are just bad right now instead of Zerg OP
Didn't you say the queen walk was solved? Somebody needs to tell Zest.
Also with unwatchable PvZ (which is a big part of the game considering how few Terrans there are) we will lose viewers, with less viewers the incentive to create SC2 events will be lower.
On December 07 2021 22:00 Harris1st wrote: There is a difference between "this is boring to watch" and "this strat is unstoppable"
Like you mentioned, herO was 2 years away and insta solves the problem. At this point I'm inclined to think Protoss players are just bad right now instead of Zerg OP
Didn't you say the queen walk was solved? Somebody needs to tell Zest.
Also with unwatchable PvZ (which is a big part of the game considering how few Terrans there are) we will lose viewers, with less viewers the incentive to create SC2 events will be lower.
Well, Zest laughably easily defended the queen walk in game 1. He even made a lot of stupid micro mistakes and still it wasnt even remotely close. The 2nd game was a build order loss, nothing to do with queen walk.
On December 07 2021 22:00 Harris1st wrote: There is a difference between "this is boring to watch" and "this strat is unstoppable"
Like you mentioned, herO was 2 years away and insta solves the problem. At this point I'm inclined to think Protoss players are just bad right now instead of Zerg OP
Didn't you say the queen walk was solved? Somebody needs to tell Zest.
Also with unwatchable PvZ (which is a big part of the game considering how few Terrans there are) we will lose viewers, with less viewers the incentive to create SC2 events will be lower.
Well, Zest laughably easily defended the queen walk in game 1. He even made a lot of stupid micro mistakes and still it wasnt even remotely close. The 2nd game was a build order loss, nothing to do with queen walk.
Well, he lost to a queenwalk, I'm not saying it's imba, it's just not obviously solved if you lose with queens killing you at your nat :D
On December 07 2021 22:00 Harris1st wrote: There is a difference between "this is boring to watch" and "this strat is unstoppable"
Like you mentioned, herO was 2 years away and insta solves the problem. At this point I'm inclined to think Protoss players are just bad right now instead of Zerg OP
Didn't you say the queen walk was solved? Somebody needs to tell Zest.
Also with unwatchable PvZ (which is a big part of the game considering how few Terrans there are) we will lose viewers, with less viewers the incentive to create SC2 events will be lower.
Well, Zest laughably easily defended the queen walk in game 1. He even made a lot of stupid micro mistakes and still it wasnt even remotely close. The 2nd game was a build order loss, nothing to do with queen walk.
Well, he lost to a queenwalk, I'm not saying it's imba, it's just not obviously solved if you lose with queens killing you at your nat :D
I thought when we say a strat is solved it means that it can be quite confidently countered. Otherwise no strat would be solved, every attack in the game has potential to kill you if you are not ready for it. Serrals build directly countered what Zest was doing (+ Zest donated his adepts), it happens sometimes, just bit of luck, nothing more to it
Btw. Zest is playing super garbage today... I know he has these kind of days quite often and didn't except him to actually beat Serral but his control and decisions are just sad, giving out free units all the time, fighting for no reason, welp.
On December 07 2021 22:00 Harris1st wrote: There is a difference between "this is boring to watch" and "this strat is unstoppable"
Like you mentioned, herO was 2 years away and insta solves the problem. At this point I'm inclined to think Protoss players are just bad right now instead of Zerg OP
Didn't you say the queen walk was solved? Somebody needs to tell Zest.
Also with unwatchable PvZ (which is a big part of the game considering how few Terrans there are) we will lose viewers, with less viewers the incentive to create SC2 events will be lower.
Well, Zest laughably easily defended the queen walk in game 1. He even made a lot of stupid micro mistakes and still it wasnt even remotely close. The 2nd game was a build order loss, nothing to do with queen walk.
G2 kind of his what I hate most about queen walk. After defending the first adept wave there's lot of option for the zerg to follow up with a lead. You can slap a hydra den and goes for a max out timming or a longer game , goes for a quick ravager-bane bust before the air army is ready, go spire into corruptor with a fourth, ect ... While all of these option may hold some risk it's not like they are bad choice, but queen walk arr so much better than anything else you can do there's pretty much no reason you shouldn't go for it on the counter.
I thought Zest got a shot to take it to super lategame with Skytoss, he seems to be very well with it previously. His timing attack in game 3 was lacking Templar to deal with Viper, and game 4 was close but on cigar on it.
EPT
