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[WCS 2019] BlizzCon Finals Day - Page 114

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
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The_Red_Viper
Profile Blog Joined August 2013
19533 Posts
November 02 2019 03:09 GMT
#2261
On November 02 2019 12:08 fgonzo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2019 12:02 NotSoHappy wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:01 digmouse wrote:
I don't really understand what Serral's game plan really is. He already totally shutdown the exact same playstyle the map before, does he really believe he is that better to be able to pull it off?


asking myself the same questions


Simply put: Reynor is just 10x better than Serral in every way, shape and form. Of course, blue pilled Starcraft fans will say Serral is GOAT

I think serral's shape is less round, no idea if you'd think that's 10 times better, beauty of shapes is in the eye of the beholder.
IU | Sohyang || There is no God and we are his prophets | For if ‘Thou mayest’—it is also true that ‘Thou mayest not.” | Ignorance is the parent of fear |
lolfail9001
Profile Joined August 2013
Russian Federation40190 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-11-02 03:10:37
November 02 2019 03:09 GMT
#2262
On November 02 2019 12:07 The_Red_Viper wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2019 12:04 lolfail9001 wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:03 ZigguratOfUr wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:02 lolfail9001 wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:01 ZigguratOfUr wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:00 digmouse wrote:
On November 02 2019 11:58 Zambrah wrote:
What does Serral even do to win from here

10+ vipers, other than that any charge is a highway to hell.


Even vipers aren't enough. Since hydra/lurkers support vipers so much better than all the melee units that don't shoot up that Serral had.


Nah, 10+ vipers would give him a small shot since to be honest Reynor's supporting cast for vipers lacked, it was literally mass lurker.

But only 3 with 2 blinding clouds total? Not a chance.


Sure but the opponent's vipers just yoink yours to kill them with hydras and you can't do the same.



If you manage to throw enough blinding clouds to disable most of lurkers, you have a chance. If you don't, RIP, vipers own fate is irrelevant.

It doesn't disable though, just shorten the range. Which doesn't matter against melee units, the lurkers attack anyway at full range if you actually commit into it (just a little later)


I do know that roach/hydra can use their melee attack in blinding cloud, and i do not have client on hand right now to test it. And even if it is so, preventing lurkers from killing your lings before they even hit anything is a win in my book.
DeMoN pulls off a Miracle and Flies to the Moon
Vindicare605
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States16121 Posts
November 02 2019 03:09 GMT
#2263
On November 02 2019 12:08 TheBloodyDwarf wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2019 12:05 fgonzo wrote:
Why do people think Serral is the best player? He is far from GOAT. Top 3? Yes. Top 1? No. I knew this guy would lose after I saw how easy his round of 16 group and round of 8 were. Serral stands no chance against Reynor. He would have lost handily to Dark too.

Serral would have easily won Dark


Would have, could have. should have.
aka: KTVindicare the Geeky Bartender
lolfail9001
Profile Joined August 2013
Russian Federation40190 Posts
November 02 2019 03:09 GMT
#2264
Guys, don't feed the fat troll unless you want to be entertained.
DeMoN pulls off a Miracle and Flies to the Moon
outscar
Profile Joined September 2014
2832 Posts
November 02 2019 03:10 GMT
#2265
The main question now is: how good is Dark's ZvZ? I was 99% sure Serral would beat him, but now he's against the kid who defeated Serral who 3-0'ed him last year on global finals.

I wanna believe in a fairy tale where Classic gets to finals, but don't think he can pull 3 more moves from protoss BS bible. Let's see.
sunbeams are never made like me...
fgonzo
Profile Joined September 2019
108 Posts
November 02 2019 03:10 GMT
#2266
On November 02 2019 12:08 Anc13nt wrote:
what would happen if Serral went teched to Broodlord and made more vipers?

Also, really well played by Reynor. After beating Trap, herO and Serral, I realized that I don't give him enough credit for his skill.

Everyone is wrongly fixated on Serral. Reynor is the best player of all time. Period.
swarminfestor
Profile Joined September 2017
Malaysia2450 Posts
November 02 2019 03:10 GMT
#2267
On November 02 2019 12:07 Nakajin wrote:
So many cool possibility: Reynor winning WCS at 17
Classic ending his carreer as world champion
The Emperor last son finaly giving Boxer his world champion


Compared to Parting, who was the youngest one?
Rogue & Maru fan boy. ^^
tskarzyn
Profile Joined July 2010
United States516 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-11-02 03:10:30
November 02 2019 03:10 GMT
#2268
Mirror match + Bo5 (as opposed to Bo7) = lots of variance. shit happens.
NotSoHappy
Profile Joined November 2010
445 Posts
November 02 2019 03:10 GMT
#2269
On November 02 2019 12:10 tskarzyn wrote:
Mirror match + Bo5 (as opposed to Bo7) = lots of variance. shit happens.


ye, the semis should be bo7.
Dave4
Profile Joined August 2018
494 Posts
November 02 2019 03:11 GMT
#2270
Pretty bummed for Serral, but still a great tournament from the Goat. Again, he took it to the brink, and needed some outstanding play to beat him.

People will go and say this is evidence he is crap etc. But clearly he is the 'one to beat' in every tournament - and that means he is the best.
Starcloud
Profile Joined September 2018
138 Posts
November 02 2019 03:11 GMT
#2271
On November 02 2019 12:01 kaykoose wrote:
That was a strange game from Serral. Why go Ultras vs all those lurkers? Very well played by Reynor though! GGs


Yeah. I dont understand that throw. He had a massive lead. Serra loves lurker-play and rarely goes ultras, because they just suck. He had all the time in the world to do the transition, since Reynor couldnt leave his base(s). Then he could practically camp Reynors bases and bleed him out, but somehow he was set to close the game with ultras although it failed time after time. Serral rarely is that stubborn, but now it prolly cost him the championship. Very uncharacteristic indeed.

On November 02 2019 12:01 digmouse wrote:
I don't really understand what Serral's game plan really is. He already totally shutdown the exact same playstyle the map before, does he really believe he is that better to be able to pull it off?


Yeah, exactly this.

Pretty dissapointed by that game from Serral. But good luck to Reynor though !
yht9657
Profile Joined December 2016
1810 Posts
November 02 2019 03:11 GMT
#2272
On November 02 2019 12:10 swarminfestor wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2019 12:07 Nakajin wrote:
So many cool possibility: Reynor winning WCS at 17
Classic ending his carreer as world champion
The Emperor last son finaly giving Boxer his world champion


Compared to Parting, who was the youngest one?

Parting was 18 when he won the Blizzard World Cup, so Reynor would be younger.
AzAlexZ
Profile Joined September 2016
Australia3303 Posts
November 02 2019 03:11 GMT
#2273
imagine if 'ZERG OP' but then Classic wins it all
Faker is the GOAT!
The_Red_Viper
Profile Blog Joined August 2013
19533 Posts
November 02 2019 03:11 GMT
#2274
On November 02 2019 12:09 lolfail9001 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2019 12:07 The_Red_Viper wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:04 lolfail9001 wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:03 ZigguratOfUr wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:02 lolfail9001 wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:01 ZigguratOfUr wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:00 digmouse wrote:
On November 02 2019 11:58 Zambrah wrote:
What does Serral even do to win from here

10+ vipers, other than that any charge is a highway to hell.


Even vipers aren't enough. Since hydra/lurkers support vipers so much better than all the melee units that don't shoot up that Serral had.


Nah, 10+ vipers would give him a small shot since to be honest Reynor's supporting cast for vipers lacked, it was literally mass lurker.

But only 3 with 2 blinding clouds total? Not a chance.


Sure but the opponent's vipers just yoink yours to kill them with hydras and you can't do the same.



If you manage to throw enough blinding clouds to disable most of lurkers, you have a chance. If you don't, RIP, vipers own fate is irrelevant.

It doesn't disable though, just shorten the range. Which doesn't matter against melee units, the lurkers attack anyway at full range if you actually commit into it (just a little later)


Are you sure you are not confusing it with Dark Swarm? I do know that roach/hydra can use their melee attack in blinding cloud, and i do not have client on hand right now to test it.

Well you just said it, hydra/roach attack under blinding clowd. So lurkers would as well on melee range, but their spike attack would still travel all the way aka attack on full range.
IU | Sohyang || There is no God and we are his prophets | For if ‘Thou mayest’—it is also true that ‘Thou mayest not.” | Ignorance is the parent of fear |
Grizvokian
Profile Joined June 2018
11 Posts
November 02 2019 03:11 GMT
#2275
On November 02 2019 12:04 FueledUpAndReadyToGo wrote:
I want an analysis of Ultralisks in ZvZ now pls panelists


They've been awful for quite a while in my opinion.

It was a weird choice from Serral, all things considered, to make not only Ultras but Mutas too. I wish he'd just play to try and get to a roach vs roach midgame. All zergs excel at that style to some extent, but Serral is the absolute master of that.
BerserkSword
Profile Joined December 2018
United States2123 Posts
Last Edited: 2019-11-02 03:12:28
November 02 2019 03:12 GMT
#2276
On November 02 2019 12:04 NotSoHappy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2019 12:04 BerserkSword wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:02 NotSoHappy wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:01 digmouse wrote:
I don't really understand what Serral's game plan really is. He already totally shutdown the exact same playstyle the map before, does he really believe he is that better to be able to pull it off?


asking myself the same questions


style on the cocky teenage greenhorn who tried to embarrass you with a n00b build by using said build to eliminate him


overconfidence and big ego is sucha a b* sometimes


it's weird

serral is usually pretty humble

says that he is scared of players like neeb and showtime, before proceeding to crush him

when asked about reynor he often talking shit

"he should be easy"
"he is bad at lategame"
TL+ Member
Vindicare605
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States16121 Posts
November 02 2019 03:12 GMT
#2277
On November 02 2019 12:11 AzAlexZ wrote:
imagine if 'ZERG OP' but then Classic wins it all


CLASSIC GOAT!

Not that hard to imagine.
aka: KTVindicare the Geeky Bartender
Zambrah
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
United States7393 Posts
November 02 2019 03:12 GMT
#2278
On November 02 2019 12:11 The_Red_Viper wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2019 12:09 lolfail9001 wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:07 The_Red_Viper wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:04 lolfail9001 wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:03 ZigguratOfUr wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:02 lolfail9001 wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:01 ZigguratOfUr wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:00 digmouse wrote:
On November 02 2019 11:58 Zambrah wrote:
What does Serral even do to win from here

10+ vipers, other than that any charge is a highway to hell.


Even vipers aren't enough. Since hydra/lurkers support vipers so much better than all the melee units that don't shoot up that Serral had.


Nah, 10+ vipers would give him a small shot since to be honest Reynor's supporting cast for vipers lacked, it was literally mass lurker.

But only 3 with 2 blinding clouds total? Not a chance.


Sure but the opponent's vipers just yoink yours to kill them with hydras and you can't do the same.



If you manage to throw enough blinding clouds to disable most of lurkers, you have a chance. If you don't, RIP, vipers own fate is irrelevant.

It doesn't disable though, just shorten the range. Which doesn't matter against melee units, the lurkers attack anyway at full range if you actually commit into it (just a little later)


Are you sure you are not confusing it with Dark Swarm? I do know that roach/hydra can use their melee attack in blinding cloud, and i do not have client on hand right now to test it.

Well you just said it, hydra/roach attack under blinding clowd. So lurkers would as well on melee range, but their spike attack would still travel all the way aka attack on full range.


That’s pretty cool tbh, I never considered that aspect of the Lurkers attack as it might relate to Dark Swarm
Incremental change is the Democrat version of Trickle Down economics.
lolfail9001
Profile Joined August 2013
Russian Federation40190 Posts
November 02 2019 03:13 GMT
#2279
On November 02 2019 12:11 The_Red_Viper wrote:
Show nested quote +
On November 02 2019 12:09 lolfail9001 wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:07 The_Red_Viper wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:04 lolfail9001 wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:03 ZigguratOfUr wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:02 lolfail9001 wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:01 ZigguratOfUr wrote:
On November 02 2019 12:00 digmouse wrote:
On November 02 2019 11:58 Zambrah wrote:
What does Serral even do to win from here

10+ vipers, other than that any charge is a highway to hell.


Even vipers aren't enough. Since hydra/lurkers support vipers so much better than all the melee units that don't shoot up that Serral had.


Nah, 10+ vipers would give him a small shot since to be honest Reynor's supporting cast for vipers lacked, it was literally mass lurker.

But only 3 with 2 blinding clouds total? Not a chance.


Sure but the opponent's vipers just yoink yours to kill them with hydras and you can't do the same.



If you manage to throw enough blinding clouds to disable most of lurkers, you have a chance. If you don't, RIP, vipers own fate is irrelevant.

It doesn't disable though, just shorten the range. Which doesn't matter against melee units, the lurkers attack anyway at full range if you actually commit into it (just a little later)


Are you sure you are not confusing it with Dark Swarm? I do know that roach/hydra can use their melee attack in blinding cloud, and i do not have client on hand right now to test it.

Well you just said it, hydra/roach attack under blinding clowd. So lurkers would as well on melee range, but their spike attack would still travel all the way aka attack on full range.


Thing is: hydra and roach very explicitly have a melee attack, i played enough with SC2Editor back in the day to know that. Do burrowed lurkers?
DeMoN pulls off a Miracle and Flies to the Moon
fgonzo
Profile Joined September 2019
108 Posts
November 02 2019 03:13 GMT
#2280
On November 02 2019 12:10 tskarzyn wrote:
Mirror match + Bo5 (as opposed to Bo7) = lots of variance. shit happens.


That's no excuse. Reynor proved today that he can beat Serral if he tries. The minute he had enough WCS points to qualify for Blizzcon, he stopped trying against Serral. He was playing on ladder against someone I was watching via stream and he admitted it. Not my words, just his.
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