On June 23 2014 21:38 Doublemint wrote: Very strange, usually immos do insane damage against Archons and I was quite sure stats was in a good spot. Must have let the immos fire on the zealots which is very sloppy.
No, not really?
Archons aren't armored, Immortals are pretty bad against Archons.
EDIT: Actually. out of all units, Immortals do the worst against Archons, since Archons are the toughest non-armored units.
An immo beats an archon one on one
Yeah, and 1 Roach beats 2 Marines, conclusion Roaches are good against Marines?
Doesn't work that way.
Well, it does mean that armies with a higher immo count against the archon count are usually stronger.
Whenever I watch PvP where one guy has Archons, Immortals and Zealots and other guy has just Archons and Zealots, the guy without Immortals usually wins since more Archons just melts Zealots so fast that from the start it feels like just Immortals and Archons against Zealots and Archons. Of course, it depends on the positioning, Time Warps, if one guy has Sentries etc, and on a lot of other factors... but that still happened in this game.
On June 23 2014 21:38 Doublemint wrote: Very strange, usually immos do insane damage against Archons and I was quite sure stats was in a good spot. Must have let the immos fire on the zealots which is very sloppy.
I think its a bit of a missconception though, Archons aren't armored, so Immortals only deal 20 damage to them. With 350 shields and 10 HP Archons are also very, very tanky, and they have aoe, which means they drain trough Immortal shields faster then usual. So now that I think of it, Archons rock.
Still, shields + the fact that Archons do rather weak damage against non bio gives immos the edge in my experience.
In low numbers immos are better, just focus the archon and everything else dies. But on big battles archon splash is much better.
On June 23 2014 21:38 Doublemint wrote: Very strange, usually immos do insane damage against Archons and I was quite sure stats was in a good spot. Must have let the immos fire on the zealots which is very sloppy.
No, not really?
Archons aren't armored, Immortals are pretty bad against Archons.
EDIT: Actually. out of all units, Immortals do the worst against Archons, since Archons are the toughest non-armored units.
An immo beats an archon one on one
Yeah, and 1 Roach beats 2 Marines, conclusion Roaches are good against Marines?
Doesn't work that way.
Well, it does mean that armies with a higher immo count against the archon count are usually stronger.
Whenever I watch PvP where one guy has Archons, Immortals and Zealots and other guy has just Archons and Zealots, the guy without Immortals usually wins since more Archons just melts Zealots so fast that from the start it feels like just Immortals and Archons against Zealots and Archons. Of course, it depends on the positioning, Time Warps, if one guy has Sentries etc, and on a lot of other factors... but that still happened in this game.
I have the opposite experience : ) But yeah, a lot of factors are important.
On June 23 2014 21:38 Doublemint wrote: Very strange, usually immos do insane damage against Archons and I was quite sure stats was in a good spot. Must have let the immos fire on the zealots which is very sloppy.
No, not really?
Archons aren't armored, Immortals are pretty bad against Archons.
I'm pretty sure that an immortal wins against an archon in 1vs1 (and they are also less gas-intensive)
Why would you think about it as 1v1 Scenario? 1 Roach can win against 2 Marines easily, but 30 Marines WITHOUT Stim melts 15 Roaches.
Assuming no CS, Roaches win easily.
I've tried it multiple times with my friend, and every time he was left with ~15 Marines, so no.
Without upgrades, without stim, without anything, just move and hit.
On June 23 2014 21:38 Doublemint wrote: Very strange, usually immos do insane damage against Archons and I was quite sure stats was in a good spot. Must have let the immos fire on the zealots which is very sloppy.
No, not really?
Archons aren't armored, Immortals are pretty bad against Archons.
I'm pretty sure that an immortal wins against an archon in 1vs1 (and they are also less gas-intensive)
Why would you think about it as 1v1 Scenario? 1 Roach can win against 2 Marines easily, but 30 Marines WITHOUT Stim melts 15 Roaches.
Assuming no CS, Roaches win easily.
I've tried it multiple times with my friend, and every time he was left with ~15 Marines, so no.
Without upgrades, without stim, without anything, just move and hit.
Didn't move either of the sides, just a similar concave at the beginning of the fight. Result was 7 Roaches left.
On June 23 2014 21:38 Doublemint wrote: Very strange, usually immos do insane damage against Archons and I was quite sure stats was in a good spot. Must have let the immos fire on the zealots which is very sloppy.
No, not really?
Archons aren't armored, Immortals are pretty bad against Archons.
I'm pretty sure that an immortal wins against an archon in 1vs1 (and they are also less gas-intensive)
Why would you think about it as 1v1 Scenario? 1 Roach can win against 2 Marines easily, but 30 Marines WITHOUT Stim melts 15 Roaches.
Assuming no CS, Roaches win easily.
I've tried it multiple times with my friend, and every time he was left with ~15 Marines, so no.
Without upgrades, without stim, without anything, just move and hit.
Didn't move either of the sides, just a similar concave at the beginning of the fight. Result was 7 Roaches left.
I've moved both sides close to each other so both of them can shoot and that was when 17 Marines left in the end. Well, Roaches definitely favor bigger concave where Marines favor a clumped up group, I think that is the only reason.
On June 23 2014 21:38 Doublemint wrote: Very strange, usually immos do insane damage against Archons and I was quite sure stats was in a good spot. Must have let the immos fire on the zealots which is very sloppy.
No, not really?
Archons aren't armored, Immortals are pretty bad against Archons.
I'm pretty sure that an immortal wins against an archon in 1vs1 (and they are also less gas-intensive)
Why would you think about it as 1v1 Scenario? 1 Roach can win against 2 Marines easily, but 30 Marines WITHOUT Stim melts 15 Roaches.
Assuming no CS, Roaches win easily.
I've tried it multiple times with my friend, and every time he was left with ~15 Marines, so no.
Without upgrades, without stim, without anything, just move and hit.
Didn't move either of the sides, just a similar concave at the beginning of the fight. Result was 7 Roaches left.
I've moved both sides close to each other so both of them can shoot and that was when 17 Marines left in the end. Well, Roaches definitely favor bigger concave where Marines favor a clumped up group, I think that is the only reason.
Dwf is right, no way 30 marines without stim randomly beat down 15 roaches.
EPT
