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edit: comment was already addressed, my bad
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SC2 is not dying. We just lost some dead weight. Fans who move to a new game like Moths to a flame. "ooh, shiney!"
AND I SAY, LET THEM BURN! 
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So since SoS won $100k, that means he has to split that $100k with his Jin Air teammates per KESPA rules right?
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East Gorteau22261 Posts
On March 17 2014 04:47 geokilla wrote:
So since SoS won $100k, that means he has to split that $100k with his Jin Air teammates per KESPA rules right?
I've never heard of something like that
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Removed ... Already been answered!
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On March 17 2014 04:27 TotalBiscuit wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2014 04:23 Zeze wrote:On March 17 2014 03:51 FatCat_13 wrote:On March 17 2014 03:33 TotalBiscuit wrote:On March 17 2014 03:11 purakushi wrote:On March 17 2014 03:09 Master Blaster wrote:
How many viewers did the final get??? I had a bet on whether it would reach 100k... Ditto. What were the max tournament online and offline numbers? Meanwhile... LoL has >350k online Time to drop some motherfuckin stats. 100k for SC2 is GREAT. Wanna know why? Because according to SC2ranks.com, there are 328,642 ladder players active during this season. So why is this great? Well, whenever someone drops some stupid statistic like "Oh look at this LoL final getting 350,000 in their best case scenario of white dudes vs Koreans", you can look at LoL's player statistics and see that actually the conversion of players to eSports viewers is far lower. According to Riot stats, which are most likely fudged but even if they're anywhere near... you have over 60 million monthly players yet these events are only converting that into 385,000 viewers concurrent? It's impossible to know how many uniques the SC2 and LoL streams got but if we compare concurrent, you are looking in the best possible case scenario at a ridiculous 32% player to viewer ratio for Starcraft 2 and fairly pitiful 1.91% ratio for League of Legends. I'm saying best case scenario because SC2ranks is only pulling ladder player stats whereas the League stats include everyone in every possible game mode. SC2 has more than 350,000 active players doing team games, unranked customs and Arcade, but even if you tripled SC2s playerbase, the ratio is still ridiculous. SC2s audience in general is more supportive of competitive play, more interested in eSports and as a result more likely to respond passionately (and negatively) in situations such as this. We should be celebrating that conversion ratio, not trying to chase a viewercount that passed us two years ago and is going to keep passing us whether we like it or not. We have a large, healthy playerbase who likes to watch eSports events and who is on average older with more disposable income. That's very marketable to sponsors. If organisations are savvy and careful, they can create sustainable businesses around this game. WCS continues to get strong numbers, SHOUTcraft Clan Wars, a $500 per match event, is pulling in more than 40,000 viewers across its live shows, reruns and vods and is running in the black while continuing to grow. IEM Cologne was an instudio event that peaked at over 100,000 if you include the foreign language streams, again a model of sustainability and common sense. People are extra salty after a terrible final and a questionable prize distribution model, but can we please just take a step back, look at the facts and stop comparing ourselves to a free2play dota-clone with mass casual appeal. Guess what, we're also less popular than Angry Birds, are you going to get salty about that too? If you actually love this game as much as you all claim, then focus on enjoying great games and supporting cool events. Your stats based on player base are irrelevant. I know a lot of dudes (including myself) who never launched SC2 yet still we watch big events from time to time. Cause it's SC1 that made the game fanbase. Old good times you know when we were students, no wife no kids... Nowadays we watch the game the same way some do for baseball, soccer etc. edit: regarding the comparison of the games - this is actually very important because of it's a fight for sponsorship. Quick example - soccer is not popular in USA, right? Not because it's a bad game (we know it's very popular in other countries) but because no sponsors invest into something not giving a return back in the short-term. Why would anybody do it if you can choose football, basketball and baseball? Whould you like SC2 be more like football or soccer in USA? You do realize you are completly missing the point? If he realised that he wouldnt have posted in the first place 
True, I was just hoping with the benefit of time maybe 
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On March 17 2014 04:48 Zealously wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2014 04:47 geokilla wrote:
So since SoS won $100k, that means he has to split that $100k with his Jin Air teammates per KESPA rules right? I've never heard of something like that
I do know of western teams that take a percentage of the winnings. To cover costs.
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East Gorteau22261 Posts
On March 17 2014 04:53 Rustug wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2014 04:48 Zealously wrote:On March 17 2014 04:47 geokilla wrote:
So since SoS won $100k, that means he has to split that $100k with his Jin Air teammates per KESPA rules right? I've never heard of something like that I do know of western teams that take a percentage of the winnings. To cover costs.
I've heard of that as well, but never splitting money with the entire player roster.
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On March 17 2014 04:56 Zealously wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2014 04:53 Rustug wrote:On March 17 2014 04:48 Zealously wrote:On March 17 2014 04:47 geokilla wrote:
So since SoS won $100k, that means he has to split that $100k with his Jin Air teammates per KESPA rules right? I've never heard of something like that I do know of western teams that take a percentage of the winnings. To cover costs. I've heard of that as well, but never splitting money with the entire player roster.
They do buy dinner for the team (Maybe even more then once), as tradition.
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Austria18413 Posts
Oh my god, I know why herO lost the final. ;_;
In the two previous IEMs Khalaeris and Tod casted BOTH finals, they also kept casting his comebacks in this tournament.
Artosis/Apollo ruined it :'(
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On March 17 2014 04:58 sharkie wrote:
Oh my god, I know why herO lost the final. ;_;
In the two previous IEMs Khalaeris and Tod casted BOTH finals, they also kept casting his comebacks in this tournament.
Artosis/Apollo ruined it :'(
Artosis has planted his curse onto her0. He will only get 2nd place for the rest of the year like jaedong. byebye hero
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Aaaaaagh, I couldn't even watch this tournament at all due to weekend commitments! It sounded awesome, though!
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On March 17 2014 05:03 Lunchador wrote:
Aaaaaagh, I couldn't even watch this tournament at all due to weekend commitments! It sounded awesome, though!
Yeah awesome... Well other than the finals, the rest of the matches were very high caliber
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The time is right to put herO on your FPL anti-teams friends!
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On March 17 2014 04:52 Zeze wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2014 04:27 TotalBiscuit wrote:On March 17 2014 04:23 Zeze wrote:On March 17 2014 03:51 FatCat_13 wrote:On March 17 2014 03:33 TotalBiscuit wrote:On March 17 2014 03:11 purakushi wrote:On March 17 2014 03:09 Master Blaster wrote:
How many viewers did the final get??? I had a bet on whether it would reach 100k... Ditto. What were the max tournament online and offline numbers? Meanwhile... LoL has >350k online Time to drop some motherfuckin stats. 100k for SC2 is GREAT. Wanna know why? Because according to SC2ranks.com, there are 328,642 ladder players active during this season. So why is this great? Well, whenever someone drops some stupid statistic like "Oh look at this LoL final getting 350,000 in their best case scenario of white dudes vs Koreans", you can look at LoL's player statistics and see that actually the conversion of players to eSports viewers is far lower. According to Riot stats, which are most likely fudged but even if they're anywhere near... you have over 60 million monthly players yet these events are only converting that into 385,000 viewers concurrent? It's impossible to know how many uniques the SC2 and LoL streams got but if we compare concurrent, you are looking in the best possible case scenario at a ridiculous 32% player to viewer ratio for Starcraft 2 and fairly pitiful 1.91% ratio for League of Legends. I'm saying best case scenario because SC2ranks is only pulling ladder player stats whereas the League stats include everyone in every possible game mode. SC2 has more than 350,000 active players doing team games, unranked customs and Arcade, but even if you tripled SC2s playerbase, the ratio is still ridiculous. SC2s audience in general is more supportive of competitive play, more interested in eSports and as a result more likely to respond passionately (and negatively) in situations such as this. We should be celebrating that conversion ratio, not trying to chase a viewercount that passed us two years ago and is going to keep passing us whether we like it or not. We have a large, healthy playerbase who likes to watch eSports events and who is on average older with more disposable income. That's very marketable to sponsors. If organisations are savvy and careful, they can create sustainable businesses around this game. WCS continues to get strong numbers, SHOUTcraft Clan Wars, a $500 per match event, is pulling in more than 40,000 viewers across its live shows, reruns and vods and is running in the black while continuing to grow. IEM Cologne was an instudio event that peaked at over 100,000 if you include the foreign language streams, again a model of sustainability and common sense. People are extra salty after a terrible final and a questionable prize distribution model, but can we please just take a step back, look at the facts and stop comparing ourselves to a free2play dota-clone with mass casual appeal. Guess what, we're also less popular than Angry Birds, are you going to get salty about that too? If you actually love this game as much as you all claim, then focus on enjoying great games and supporting cool events. Your stats based on player base are irrelevant. I know a lot of dudes (including myself) who never launched SC2 yet still we watch big events from time to time. Cause it's SC1 that made the game fanbase. Old good times you know when we were students, no wife no kids... Nowadays we watch the game the same way some do for baseball, soccer etc. edit: regarding the comparison of the games - this is actually very important because of it's a fight for sponsorship. Quick example - soccer is not popular in USA, right? Not because it's a bad game (we know it's very popular in other countries) but because no sponsors invest into something not giving a return back in the short-term. Why would anybody do it if you can choose football, basketball and baseball? Whould you like SC2 be more like football or soccer in USA? You do realize you are completly missing the point? If he realised that he wouldnt have posted in the first place True, I was just hoping with the benefit of time maybe
Yet, there is still a thriving soccer business in the united states with lots of sponsor backing. Sponsor money is not as limited as people make it seem. Companies sponsor multiple sports and events. The industries can sustain multiple sports, NHL, NBA, NFL, ect, so it can sustain more then one esport. How many people talk about the NBA finals not getting as many views as the superbowl? Very few. Yet they both have thriving businesses.
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On March 17 2014 05:07 Holdenintherye wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2014 05:03 Lunchador wrote:
Aaaaaagh, I couldn't even watch this tournament at all due to weekend commitments! It sounded awesome, though! Yeah awesome... Well other than the finals, the rest of the matches were very high caliber
might want to pass on nani's single match and taeja's first two games. rest was (really) good from what i've seen!
gz to sOs, the $100k man!
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Russian Federation117 Posts
Rustug,
you're correct about golf but you have to know they also fight for their sponsors with other "elites" like yachting, F1...
TotalBuiscuit,
I'm sorry I could not see how your comments about "running local team" connected to number of people watching tv/ twitch etc. Running a team of players is a bussiness I never had a chance (or wish) to be running so I know nothing about it.
True, I'm not a player anymore (haven't played over ten years or so) but I can tell you - in the end of the day it's just numbers proving the best ROI that every investor looks at. The numbers that show the answer to the question "How many of my potential consumers will watch this?"
I never saw analytics of comparison between LOL and SC2 but I see them having the same sponsors which makes me think some (likely bigger) amount of Intel's money go to LOL instead of SC2. Would I prefer them going into SC2? I think so!
Anyways, SC2 is not passing away. It's good as-is though let's agree it may be improved both on design level via patches and management level (e.g. introduction of a pause for quick commerical break every 15 mins)
This went long far offtopic, sorry guys, let it be the end.
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On March 17 2014 05:14 Koerage wrote:Show nested quote +On March 17 2014 05:07 Holdenintherye wrote:On March 17 2014 05:03 Lunchador wrote:
Aaaaaagh, I couldn't even watch this tournament at all due to weekend commitments! It sounded awesome, though! Yeah awesome... Well other than the finals, the rest of the matches were very high caliber might want to pass on nani's single match and taeja's first two games. rest was (really) good from what i've seen! gz to sOs, the $100k man!
No, his new name is $O$
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TLADT24920 Posts
Missed this final. Were the games any good? I'm surprised that herO lost to sOs though >.> Isn't PvP his forte? I guess sOs is that crafty then lol.
LOL
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EPT
