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[DreamHack] Winter Day 3 2013 - Page 114

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 112 113 114 115 116 266 Next
JustPassingBy
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
10776 Posts
November 30 2013 19:17 GMT
#2261
On December 01 2013 04:17 CCa1ss1e wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 01 2013 04:16 JustPassingBy wrote:
What was the question to which Life answered Naniwa?


who's the most handsome progamer @ dreamhack.


Oh god, this is so wrong on such many levels...
Keeemy
Profile Joined November 2012
Finland7855 Posts
November 30 2013 19:17 GMT
#2262
On December 01 2013 04:15 Undead1993 wrote:
lol life will get crushed by taeja if he makes it there, taeja played way better yesterday no idea why he "should have won there"

Sure thing boss. Game 1 Life had control of the whole game before miscontrolling his mutas a couple of times. Game 2 was a stupid all-in that Taeja countered.

Those games don't tell much.

Just watch tonight.
Hello
stuchiu
Profile Blog Joined June 2010
Fiddler's Green42661 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-11-30 19:18:34
November 30 2013 19:18 GMT
#2263
On December 01 2013 04:16 Shikyo wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 01 2013 04:15 stuchiu wrote:
On December 01 2013 04:12 75 wrote:
On December 01 2013 04:10 Qwerty85 wrote:
On December 01 2013 04:06 samurai80 wrote:
On December 01 2013 04:03 Rinny wrote:
On December 01 2013 03:52 Shikyo wrote:
How on earth does a bo3 benefit "a style"?



Consider the following, there are two starcraft players X and Y, X is slightly better at starcraft and he wins 60% of the games he plays against Y leaving Y to win only 40% . It is entirely possible for Y to play a set number of games with X and win more than him, but if X and Y were to play a million games of starcraft the probability that Y would win more games than X is VERY close to 0 like .000000001% . However if they were to play a 3 games (as in a bo3) the probability that Y would win more games is like 32 percent.

Most of the time playing cheesy doesn't result in a win rate of >50% in starcraft II (the exception being in the early days when tournaments were dominated by 1 base scv pulls) because as the game gets figured out and some of those strategies are patched out they lose their effectiveness. But even without a >50% winrate it's totally possible to beat superior opponents.

TL;DR Lower amounts of games in a series mean it is more likely for inferior opponents to advance.

Which benefits inferior players that is protoss. Is that what you mean ?


More like it benefits the player with more opening options. Protoss have much more builds that just straight up kill you if caught by surprise.

why is having more builds better in bo3 than ,lets say, bo7


I don't think there is good sound theory about how to play a bo7 perfectly. We'd have to ask Mvp.

The more builds you can use, the better longer series are.

In a Bo1 or Bo3, you can perhaps get away with the same macro build. Not so much in a Bo7.


Nestea only had 1 build per series. but he won 3 GSLs. Same with one of MC's own GSLs.
Moderator
TheBloodyDwarf
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
Finland7524 Posts
November 30 2013 19:18 GMT
#2264
On December 01 2013 04:14 stuchiu wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 01 2013 04:12 Shikyo wrote:
On December 01 2013 04:10 Qwerty85 wrote:
On December 01 2013 04:06 samurai80 wrote:
On December 01 2013 04:03 Rinny wrote:
On December 01 2013 03:52 Shikyo wrote:
How on earth does a bo3 benefit "a style"?



Consider the following, there are two starcraft players X and Y, X is slightly better at starcraft and he wins 60% of the games he plays against Y leaving Y to win only 40% . It is entirely possible for Y to play a set number of games with X and win more than him, but if X and Y were to play a million games of starcraft the probability that Y would win more games than X is VERY close to 0 like .000000001% . However if they were to play a 3 games (as in a bo3) the probability that Y would win more games is like 32 percent.

Most of the time playing cheesy doesn't result in a win rate of >50% in starcraft II (the exception being in the early days when tournaments were dominated by 1 base scv pulls) because as the game gets figured out and some of those strategies are patched out they lose their effectiveness. But even without a >50% winrate it's totally possible to beat superior opponents.

TL;DR Lower amounts of games in a series mean it is more likely for inferior opponents to advance.

Which benefits inferior players that is protoss. Is that what you mean ?


More like it benefits the player with more opening options. Protoss have much more builds that just straight up kill you if caught by surprise.

Flying 4 medivacs full of units into a protoss's army benefits the protoss player.


And so is being able to open with:
Proxy oracles
Proxy gate
fast HT
Blink aggression
DTs
Robo with DTs
Robo collosus
2 base stalker collosus
Zealot ht all-in

Protoss just has more variety, but having said all that, none of that had to do with why Patience beat Innovation.

lol, you should try to hide your whining better
Fusilero: "I still can't believe he did that, like dude what the fuck there's fandom and then there's what he did like holy shit. I still see it when I close my eyes." <- reaction to the original drunk santa post which later caught on
BlackCompany
Profile Joined August 2012
Germany8388 Posts
November 30 2013 19:18 GMT
#2265
On December 01 2013 04:16 rinnnedor321 wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 01 2013 04:14 vthree wrote:
On December 01 2013 04:05 rinnnedor321 wrote:
On December 01 2013 04:02 opisska wrote:
On December 01 2013 03:59 rinnnedor321 wrote:
i hope flash will soon invent a build that gets a thor in a decent amount of time to shut down all the blink builds

thors are 300-200 and have such high dps they decimate stalkers and zealots and sentrys.

1-2 thors nicely timed to supplement a bio build to make them immune to blink

the PROBLEM with blink is actually the forcefields. if there was no forcefields terrans could just go bio normally vs blink and be fine. thors are mostly to solve the forcefield problem

blink costs like 150/150 for the upgrade 150/100 for the twilight. thors 150/100 for the armory then 300/200 per thor. imo the cost could probably be worth it considering if you go a standard bio build into a few thors you dont need to spend 600 minerals on bunkers that you otherwise would need to get if you scout blink

getting a few thors in there imo is the best plan to combat the stupid blink stuff which put innovation behind 1000 minerals just cuz he scouted blink and tried to prepare for it


hope flash discovers the right way to everything soon!


Probably the right reaction to this is to abandond the build on the first sight of the Thor (while continuing to fake pressure) and then laugh about the two medivacs the terran misses for each Thor.


thors combat stats are not that bad at all. their DPS is worth the cost. spending 600/400 to be immune to blink, and being behind 4 medivacs, while having tons of DPS instead, isnt that bad considering you are allowed to do a standard bio build and essentially not have to worry about blink ever again

paying a 600/400 insurance policy to do bio while not worrying about bios stupidest counter (blink)

the plan is just do normal bio but then somehow get the thors in there when blink would normally screw around with you.

sacrifice the first 4 medivacs to be immune to blink. then get more medivacs after that. its a trade off sure but you wouldnt need to worry about blink


4 huge issues

1) Thors are too slow. If you mix 2 Thors in your army, your army is now much less mobile.

2) upgrades, over time, your Thor just get weaker and weaker due to no upgrades.

3) getting your medivacs late means you can't drop until p has Templars. Not a good plan

4) it is common misconception that gateway units don't trade well vs bio. They don't trade we'll vs stimmed bio with medivac support. Therefore, no having medivac support is the early mid game means p can trade with their gateway units while they tech to AoE tech.


correct. going the 2thor plan would mean terran has 0 offensive drop options against protoss and the protoss can tech to whatever he wants

but so can the terran

this is bad this is assuming terran has no lategame counter to protoss. that may be true, im hoping flash proves us all wrong in the future though


You might want to try your luck with a new god, because thids one is stuck in another game
Necosarius
Profile Blog Joined September 2009
Sweden4042 Posts
November 30 2013 19:18 GMT
#2266
Life is life nanaNaniwa
Musicus
Profile Joined August 2011
Germany23578 Posts
November 30 2013 19:18 GMT
#2267
Life will crush Patience so hard now, I'm nor sure I want to watch it. I'm not in to gore.
Maru and Serral are probably top 5.
JustPassingBy
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
10776 Posts
November 30 2013 19:18 GMT
#2268
Okay, I don't really care who wins, but please please please just beat Taeja and show us some emotions during the crowning ceremony!!!
Tobblish
Profile Joined August 2011
Sweden6404 Posts
November 30 2013 19:18 GMT
#2269
I don't get why you have downer signs at events, you don't need a sign to ask Apollo if he miss Day9..
The curse is real
Symbioth
Profile Joined October 2011
Poland103 Posts
November 30 2013 19:18 GMT
#2270
I'm glad Incontrol asked that question, that was funny in a cute way ;p
Muffloe
Profile Joined December 2012
Sweden6061 Posts
November 30 2013 19:19 GMT
#2271
On December 01 2013 04:17 Keeemy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 01 2013 04:15 Undead1993 wrote:
lol life will get crushed by taeja if he makes it there, taeja played way better yesterday no idea why he "should have won there"

Sure thing boss. Game 1 Life had control of the whole game before miscontrolling his mutas a couple of times. Game 2 was a stupid all-in that Taeja countered.

Those games don't tell much.

Just watch tonight.

Yh Life totally got this if he can get past Patience. An underdog on fire is always scary
Swiv
Profile Joined October 2011
Germany3674 Posts
November 30 2013 19:19 GMT
#2272
From what I've seen on Nathanias' stream, he is hiding very very well how much he must 'hate' Patience. ^^
[_] Terran [_] Zerg [_] Protoss [X] Random ------- Fantasy - hyvaa - sOs
ujonecro
Profile Joined September 2010
United Kingdom846 Posts
November 30 2013 19:19 GMT
#2273
Oh god please Life please win this, wouldnt be too too mad about a close lose against Taeja but anything else will ruin my day.
Weavel
Profile Joined January 2010
Finland9223 Posts
November 30 2013 19:19 GMT
#2274
LIFE FIGHTING!!!!!!
Life/Seed//Mvp/NaNiwa fighting! ZeNEX forever!
opisska
Profile Blog Joined February 2011
Poland8852 Posts
November 30 2013 19:19 GMT
#2275
So i don't know who to root for. Let me help choose: which of these player is easier for Taeja?
"Jeez, that's far from ideal." - Serral, the king of mild trashtalk
TL+ Member
Valikyr
Profile Joined June 2010
Sweden2653 Posts
November 30 2013 19:19 GMT
#2276
On December 01 2013 04:17 JustPassingBy wrote:
Show nested quote +
On December 01 2013 04:17 CCa1ss1e wrote:
On December 01 2013 04:16 JustPassingBy wrote:
What was the question to which Life answered Naniwa?


who's the most handsome progamer @ dreamhack.


Oh god, this is so wrong on such many levels...

Pleasing the crowd : >

And 6 major tournament wins in the last year is kind of bonjwaesque.,
Noonius
Profile Joined April 2012
Estonia17413 Posts
November 30 2013 19:19 GMT
#2277
Elämä on laiffii.

Finnish people will get it
Terran forever | Maru hater forever
Nomzter
Profile Joined March 2012
Sweden2802 Posts
November 30 2013 19:19 GMT
#2278
Gogo Life!!!!!
Vindicare605
Profile Blog Joined August 2011
United States16121 Posts
November 30 2013 19:19 GMT
#2279
On December 01 2013 03:59 rinnnedor321 wrote:
i hope flash will soon invent a build that gets a thor in a decent amount of time to shut down all the blink builds

thors are 300-200 and have such high dps they decimate stalkers and zealots and sentrys.

thors lose to immortals but have 7range. if you add 2 thors into your normal bio tactics, the immortals wont be shooting the thors and the thors high dps will help vaporize all the gateway units since the thors would likely target the immortals near the end of the engagement

1-2 thors nicely timed to supplement a bio build to make them immune to blink

the PROBLEM with blink is actually the forcefields. if there was no forcefields terrans could just go bio normally vs blink and be fine. thors are mostly to solve the forcefield problem

blink costs like 150/150 for the upgrade 150/100 for the twilight. thors 150/100 for the armory then 300/200 per thor. imo the cost could probably be worth it considering if you go a standard bio build into a few thors you dont need to spend 600 minerals on bunkers that you otherwise would need to get if you scout blink

getting a few thors in there imo is the best plan to combat the stupid blink stuff which put innovation behind 1000 minerals just cuz he scouted blink and tried to prepare for it


hope flash discovers the right way to everything soon!


Not sure if trolling or just that clueless.
aka: KTVindicare the Geeky Bartender
TheBloodyDwarf
Profile Blog Joined March 2012
Finland7524 Posts
November 30 2013 19:19 GMT
#2280
On December 01 2013 04:19 Noonius wrote:
Elämä on laiffii.

Finnish people will get it

life is life :D
Fusilero: "I still can't believe he did that, like dude what the fuck there's fandom and then there's what he did like holy shit. I still see it when I close my eyes." <- reaction to the original drunk santa post which later caught on
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