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The usual: Don't flame casters or players. Don't discuss balance in this or any LR thread. Don't call your fellow posters idiots. Be excited, happy and entertained. |
opterown
Australia54784 Posts
On March 18 2013 10:26 Vanadiel wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 10:16 ShivaN wrote:
wow he calls zerg weak, after just winning the 1st major Hots tournament? Are you fucking kidding me? lol Well if you don't count Life game, zerg are 3-21 in ZvT in this tournament. And Life barely win against Polt and Last, even if both are really good player, Life has been since the last 6 month of MLG hand down the best player in the world and I think it's fair to say he is a way better player. Furthermore, yes he did win at the end, but a lot of his win was due to the fact that he cleverly exploited the HoTS metagames with his baneling bust timing, it's not going to work as much now it has been shown. It's not lying to say that zerg is a little bit underpowered against terran, I'm not sure if there is real problems in the PvZ match up to be honest, but there is style a lot of room to improve bio mine in terms of timing and the micro/positionning of the widow mine but I really don't see how you can play better that Life did.
well if you don't count life games, there was only one other korean zerg lol
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IdrA on his stream just finished singing Life's praises.
Yeah, you have to be a pretty great player to play as aggressively as Life does with great macro behind it.
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On March 18 2013 10:26 Killcani wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 10:24 the.bishOp wrote:On March 18 2013 10:21 CursOr wrote:
Why didn't Life loose about 300 lings and 30 mutas to those Mines towards the end of the last game? He just ran in a big cluster over like 5 of them. Looked buggy to me. It has an activation time. The units passed by so fast that it went through its range and no particular unit triggered it. Mines are really good and really powerful but they are not the end all unit that was made up to be. What needs to happen is some buffs to things that can stop speedvacs drops and the game would be in a pretty good state of balance. You don't even know what you are talking about lol. Those mines did donate and hit it just didnt do enough damage.
But it looked really strange. It was like 5 mines and they basically killed absolutely nothing. And then you have one mine killing 20 zerglings all on its own.
Kinda strange :O
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On March 18 2013 10:27 Zarahtra wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 10:24 the.bishOp wrote:On March 18 2013 10:21 CursOr wrote:
Why didn't Life loose about 300 lings and 30 mutas to those Mines towards the end of the last game? He just ran in a big cluster over like 5 of them. Looked buggy to me. It has an activation time. The units passed by so fast that it went through its range and no particular unit triggered it. Mines are really good and really powerful but they are not the end all unit that was made up to be. What needs to happen is some buffs to things that can stop speedvacs drops and the game would be in a pretty good state of balance. The mines all actually shot right in middle of the sling cluster, yet like nothing died. Really think hellbats would've worked better than those mines, they atleast make the zerg consider twice before they send the slings into the meatgrinder. I'm just so confused after those mines, it was like splash was disabled or some shit, they killed so little.
agree those mines need serious splash damage or rework..
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On March 18 2013 10:26 Vanadiel wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 10:16 ShivaN wrote:
wow he calls zerg weak, after just winning the 1st major Hots tournament? Are you fucking kidding me? lol Well if you don't count Life game, zerg are 3-21 in ZvT in this tournament. And Life barely win against Polt and Last, even if both are really good player, Life has been since the last 6 month of MLG hand down the best player in the world and I think it's fair to say he is a way better player. Furthermore, yes he did win at the end, but a lot of his win was due to the fact that he cleverly exploited the HoTS metagames with his baneling bust timing, it's not going to work as much now it has been shown. It's not lying to say that zerg is a little bit underpowered against terran, I'm not sure if there is real problems in the PvZ match up to be honest, but there is style a lot of room to improve bio mine in terms of timing and the micro/positionning of the widow mine but I really don't see how you can play better that Life did.
Foreigners vs Koreans stats are invalid becuase of huge skill gap.
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On March 18 2013 10:26 LighT. wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 10:25 EpiK wrote:On March 18 2013 10:21 c0ldfusion wrote:On March 18 2013 10:20 derthy wrote:On March 18 2013 10:17 Fjodorov wrote:
haha this thread is so funny. A few games back in the series ppl were calling mines OP, now they are UP. -_- Just means that mines are a huge gamble and people should stop relying on them. Yeah, that's exactly the problem with mines. Too much randomness, not good for an esports game. what about bw scarabs, spider mines and goon pathing? I think randomness is great for the spectator aspect. Adds a ton of suspense. +1 No, those are the worst aspects of BW. How disappointing to watch any Protoss matchup in a grand final be determined by lucky or unlucky scarabs. The silliest thing ever.
Spider mines are not that bad. Their mechanic is different from widow mines, and they generally hit in a more consistent, less volatile manner.
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On March 18 2013 10:25 grungust wrote:Zerg may be the worst race in HotS but Life is just amazing. He reminds me of a young Jaedong. Insane aggression and ling use. Also one of the only people who can take out Flash 
lol
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On March 18 2013 10:20 GolemMadness wrote:
First people complain about widow mines being too OP, then they complain that they suck and Flash shouldn't have used them? Really?
Group A are zergs/toss
Group B are terran
that should explain things
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On March 18 2013 10:27 Levistus wrote:
Flash had no answer. Kept doing the same thing. After watching his play i wish Innovation got into the finals instead. Life is just too good.
You may wish that, but he would have gotten there if he deserved it. Alas, he got outplayed by Flash, so there isn't much point to discuss this.
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On March 18 2013 10:23 figq wrote:
I'm just sad that SC2 now has such element of pure randomness which is the mines. Randomness is bad. More skill-based gameplay please. Things that you as a player personally control and determine if they were played well. Not this lottery.
That's if you rely on mines like Flash did.
There's no randomness in Life's play what so ever.
Polt's game against life is way way solid than Flash. I guess flash just doesn't have the confident against Life in straight games.
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On March 18 2013 10:27 sibs wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 10:23 DemigodcelpH wrote:On March 18 2013 10:20 mothergoose729 wrote:
Its funny, so much of terran balanced was based around how well MVP could play during the height of his dominance. Meanwhile every other terran in the world at the time was struggling hardcore. It would be ironic if zerg balance revolved around Life in HOTS. One thing is for certain, no zerg matchup overhaul is likely to happen for at least a few more week after life smashed through that stacked mlg! If MVP didn't win tournaments, another Terran would, thats the biggest difference here, Life doesnt win, it's not another Zerg who will win, actually Zerg wouldnt get anywhere.
lolololol no.
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All the randomness that widow mines bring is great for the game. Stuff like that is what made BW a great spectator game because you never knew what would happen and it added suspense to games rather than knowing how fights would turn out before they even happened.
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On March 18 2013 10:26 Havik_ wrote:
I'm going to let you all in on a secret Zerg is not the worst race in hots, Saying so is preposterous,
Everyone with eyes and a brain disagrees with you though (that is, except the 5-6 names that you always see spewing the same anti-Zerg garbage and that you learn to ignore eventually).
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On March 18 2013 10:26 Killcani wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 10:24 the.bishOp wrote:On March 18 2013 10:21 CursOr wrote:
Why didn't Life loose about 300 lings and 30 mutas to those Mines towards the end of the last game? He just ran in a big cluster over like 5 of them. Looked buggy to me. It has an activation time. The units passed by so fast that it went through its range and no particular unit triggered it. Mines are really good and really powerful but they are not the end all unit that was made up to be. What needs to happen is some buffs to things that can stop speedvacs drops and the game would be in a pretty good state of balance. You don't even know what you are talking about lol. Those mines did donate and hit it just didnt do enough damage.
It didn't detonate on the first few units that ran by and wouldve triggered a HUGE cluster of damage. It triggered on the last units running by and did no damage. That was the whole point of countering mines with lings anyway, trading cheap units and punishing bio with their own AOE.
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On March 18 2013 10:26 Vanadiel wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 10:16 ShivaN wrote:
wow he calls zerg weak, after just winning the 1st major Hots tournament? Are you fucking kidding me? lol Well if you don't count Life game, zerg are 3-21 in ZvT in this tournament. And Life barely win against Polt and Last, even if both are really good player, Life has been since the last 6 month of MLG hand down the best player in the world and I think it's fair to say he is a way better player. Furthermore, yes he did win at the end, but a lot of his win was due to the fact that he cleverly exploited the HoTS metagames with his baneling bust timing, it's not going to work as much now it has been shown. It's not lying to say that zerg is a little bit underpowered against terran, I'm not sure if there is real problems in the PvZ match up to be honest, but there is style a lot of room to improve bio mine in terms of timing and the micro/positionning of the widow mine but I really don't see how you can play better that Life did.
yeah just look at the stats and nevermind who actually played the games because that doesnt matter at all. I played against DRG the other week. We played 5000 games and i lost every game. Zerg OP
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On March 18 2013 10:27 sibs wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 10:23 DemigodcelpH wrote:On March 18 2013 10:20 mothergoose729 wrote:
Its funny, so much of terran balanced was based around how well MVP could play during the height of his dominance. Meanwhile every other terran in the world at the time was struggling hardcore. It would be ironic if zerg balance revolved around Life in HOTS. One thing is for certain, no zerg matchup overhaul is likely to happen for at least a few more week after life smashed through that stacked mlg! If MVP didn't win tournaments, another Terran would, thats the biggest difference here, Life doesnt win, it's not another Zerg who will win, actually Zerg wouldnt get anywhere.
You realize Mvp is the only Terran to play in a GSL finals since 2011 right? And he did it twice.
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On March 18 2013 10:24 PhoenixVoid wrote:
If there is anything I could say Flash could have improved against Life, would be switching up his builds and transitioning into late-game. Bio/Widow Mine is good and all, but making it exclusive TvZ build just gets predictable, and Life knew this and reacted by doing anti-builds. Flash always banked tons of gas, and he could have invested it into Ravens which would have helped greatly against Mutas and the possible BL transition.
I predict that the Bio-Mine style will not keep up with time going on. Life showed glimpses of how to play against it and the countering of that strategy will get more and more refinement while I don't see a lot of room for improving on this strat. The lack of reliable splash damage hurts this build against mass zergling too much. I think Hellbats will come in this hole and be added to the mix or replace the mines in the mixture.
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I think widow mines are dope as hell.. not sure about you guys.
XD
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On March 18 2013 10:27 Zarahtra wrote:Show nested quote +On March 18 2013 10:24 the.bishOp wrote:On March 18 2013 10:21 CursOr wrote:
Why didn't Life loose about 300 lings and 30 mutas to those Mines towards the end of the last game? He just ran in a big cluster over like 5 of them. Looked buggy to me. It has an activation time. The units passed by so fast that it went through its range and no particular unit triggered it. Mines are really good and really powerful but they are not the end all unit that was made up to be. What needs to happen is some buffs to things that can stop speedvacs drops and the game would be in a pretty good state of balance. The mines all actually shot right in middle of the sling cluster, yet like nothing died. Really think hellbats would've worked better than those mines, they atleast make the zerg consider twice before they send the slings into the meatgrinder. I'm just so confused after those mines, it was like splash was disabled or some shit, they killed so little.
Yeah it was really weird, it looked like they went off but nothing died.
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Also to be noted Life is the current unofficial World Champion of HOTS.
edit fuck my life...
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EPT
