On May 03 2012 20:06 DeMusliM wrote: protoss isn't very good at the top top pro level guys, david kim be fixing that shit soon.
These protosses are on fire right now (Parting is crazy good, Hero always good, Squirtle went Blastoise on IPL), after all people didnt qq when it was 7 terrans in top 8 ....
Wait, did you just say people didn't qq when it was Gom TvT? o.O
On May 04 2012 04:24 Heavenlee wrote: So many complaints about storms lately...yet so few terrans are even using ghosts effectively nowadays. A lot of them aren't even bothering to build them, as if the EMP radius nerf somehow made them useless. It's been widely known that there is a major AOE battle between ghosts and high templar but terrans are losing it constantly, for no reason. Ghost v Templar is not imbalanced in either favor, it comes down to skill, but in recent months terrans just haven't been doing it.
The problem with Ghosts is this. They make your army slower than the lategame Protoss army. If you need to move around alot don't take Ghosts with your army or they die .
Its also very hard to EMP every Templar is the Toss knows what he's doing. If he positions his army well before the fight he will just move in the Templar when he specifically wants to Storm and in most cases you don't you every position he put his Templars because on the current maps theres way too much open space.
Templars make the protoss army even slower >_<
But the Korean Protoss started to position them pre-fight and random proxy Polyns and move in with them when needed . They don't run around with them unless they really need to because of it.
Waittt... so can't you position ghosts pre-fight too? Cloaking ghosts and moving them ahead of the army is also pretty effective too. You can't warp in HTs from random pylons because they won't have energy for storm.
You can, but Terran doesn't have the luxury of hiding ghosts behind a wall of 9 range laser beams and a meatshield of chargelots and only bringing them forward when necessary. Getting off EMPs on templars is a lot harder than getting off storms on bio simply because of the superior range and health of a Protoss army. Pre-positioned cloaked ghosts can be good but if you're playing against a Protoss who likes to keep a lot of observers out like Parting, it's not going to accomplish much of anything.
I don't have an issue with storm itself btw, but the combo of storms and colossi in a single army is maddening.
On May 04 2012 04:40 NexUmbra wrote: The problem is that Ghosts cost a ton and if you waste money on buying Ghosts and suddenly they just have 2 ranged collosus then you are just fucked.
I'm pretty sure that storms and EMP have the same range. The previous dude was complaining about HTs that were positioned everywhere; I just said that you can actually do the same with ghosts. If the HTs are in the deathball, it's even easier to carpet EMP it. HTs tend to die after storming; ghosts can do the same.
On May 04 2012 04:49 power-overwhelming wrote: I agree. Last year Protoss deathballs would decimate in 10 seconds due to carpet EMPS. I dunno why Terrans have stopped building ghosts. Parting takes risk by flanking with templars.. why cant terrans do the same? At least if a ghost is spotted it can cloak or beefy enough to tank. Templars cant fight back or forced to use storm on a lone marine if spotted.
Top Toss is just playing better than Top Terrans right now.
On May 03 2012 23:24 power-overwhelming wrote: I just don't get the whine balance. Why can't people realize that the only reason P is strong is because MC is not the only good Protoss now and that all these Terrans have only been fighting other Terrans and Zergs the past 6 seasons.
It's really ironic how when Terrans were dominating since the start of SC2 it was because "best players play Terran" but in this one season Protoss does well it's automatically imbalance lol.
All the Protoss who advanced are godly at PvTs.. even Naniwa. If MVP did not cheese him out Naniwa would've advanced and would be a RO4 protoss. Similar to the Super Tournament when it was all Terrans.
You must have missed all the Terran nerfs. Bunkers had a small nerf. Barracks building time was nerfed. EMP was nerfed. Reapers were nerfed. Stimpack was nerfed. BFH were nerfed. Thors were nerfed.
Only nerf I can think of for Protoss is their storm. They were buffed for immortals, forge upgrades, and archons (splash, or was that in the beta? I don't remember).
Now you wonder why Terran was dominate in the start of SC2, as well as having maps favorable to T back in the day for the most part? And also, it is true there are more BW pros playing Terran than the other races, take it for what you will however.
Let me dissect your Terran nerfs
1. Bunker 100% salvage never made any sense. What kind of game design allows someone to make buildings and get full refund for it? Be thankful you get 75% back
2. Barracks time was nerf to the same time as other tier 1 unit builder. Why should Barracks build 5 second faster than Gateway?
3. EMP radius was nerfed to THE SAME SIZE AS STORM. Why the hell should EMP, an ability that COMES IN FREE, from a unit that is faster, more range, and has the ability to cloak and MORE ENERGY, be bigger in size than storm?
4. Reapers nerfed because a unit that ignores pathing doing that much dmg is bad game design. Terran already has something like that called vikings
5. Stimpack nerf.. as if Stimpack is even an issue now
6. BFH nerf. Well when terrans can just build 10 hellions and roast 80 workers then it's imbalance
7. Thors nerfed. Lol coz they are underpowered right now right?
Funny thing is, those nerf happened because Terran as race started overpowered as shit to begin with.
Think of it this way, it took all those nerf for both races to catch up to Terran. Now that MU are nearing 50% win rate better players are winning regardless of race.
Your comparisons to other race's spells are just dumb, don't do that when discussing balance. Or you want SC to be like AOE, zero uniqueness?
Actually we shouldn't discuss balance at all, almost no one qualified here.
On May 04 2012 04:24 Heavenlee wrote: So many complaints about storms lately...yet so few terrans are even using ghosts effectively nowadays. A lot of them aren't even bothering to build them, as if the EMP radius nerf somehow made them useless. It's been widely known that there is a major AOE battle between ghosts and high templar but terrans are losing it constantly, for no reason. Ghost v Templar is not imbalanced in either favor, it comes down to skill, but in recent months terrans just haven't been doing it.
All those devastating storms that go off and make the game look imbalanced...? How about use some actual EMPs, ghost cloak, snipe templar and observers? How many games in the past have been completely swung by EMPs but now terran aren't even using them?
The problem is that Ghosts cost a ton and if you waste money on buying Ghosts and suddenly they just have 2 ranged collosus then you are just fucked.
Colossi don't just magically appear on the battlefield. Switching into Colossus tech is slow and costly as well. Moreover, any tech switch induces a period of weakness as a lot of resources are suddenly being dumped into things that can only pay off in about 1-2 minutes. The problems Terrans have are in very specific timings, and as such it is likely to get solved after a period of suffering.
Problem with constantly patching the game is that every new patch opens up new possibilities for abusive timings which will look just as unfair and impossible to stop. Every patch will inevitably break something else somewhere else. So if they keep doing that, the feeling that the game is imbalanced or broken will never go away (it hasn't after 2 years of doing it).
On May 04 2012 04:24 Heavenlee wrote: So many complaints about storms lately...yet so few terrans are even using ghosts effectively nowadays. A lot of them aren't even bothering to build them, as if the EMP radius nerf somehow made them useless. It's been widely known that there is a major AOE battle between ghosts and high templar but terrans are losing it constantly, for no reason. Ghost v Templar is not imbalanced in either favor, it comes down to skill, but in recent months terrans just haven't been doing it.
The problem with Ghosts is this. They make your army slower than the lategame Protoss army. If you need to move around alot don't take Ghosts with your army or they die .
Its also very hard to EMP every Templar is the Toss knows what he's doing. If he positions his army well before the fight he will just move in the Templar when he specifically wants to Storm and in most cases you don't you every position he put his Templars because on the current maps theres way too much open space.
Templars make the protoss army even slower >_<
But the Korean Protoss started to position them pre-fight and random proxy Polyns and move in with them when needed . They don't run around with them unless they really need to because of it.
Waittt... so can't you position ghosts pre-fight too? Cloaking ghosts and moving them ahead of the army is also pretty effective too. You can't warp in HTs from random pylons because they won't have energy for storm.
You can, but Terran doesn't have the luxury of hiding ghosts behind a wall of 9 range laser beams and a meatshield of chargelots and only bringing them forward when necessary. Getting off EMPs on templars is a lot harder than getting off storms on bio simply because of the superior range and health of a Protoss army. Pre-positioned cloaked ghosts can be good but if you're playing against a Protoss who likes to keep a lot of observers out like Parting, it's not going to accomplish much of anything.
I don't have an issue with storm itself btw, but the combo of storms and colossi in a single army is maddening.
On May 04 2012 04:40 NexUmbra wrote: The problem is that Ghosts cost a ton and if you waste money on buying Ghosts and suddenly they just have 2 ranged collosus then you are just fucked.
I'm pretty sure that storms and EMP have the same range. The previous dude was complaining about HTs that were positioned everywhere; I just said that you can actually do the same with ghosts. If the HTs are in the deathball, it's even easier to carpet EMP it. HTs tend to die after storming; ghosts can do the same.
On May 04 2012 04:49 power-overwhelming wrote: I agree. Last year Protoss deathballs would decimate in 10 seconds due to carpet EMPS. I dunno why Terrans have stopped building ghosts. Parting takes risk by flanking with templars.. why cant terrans do the same? At least if a ghost is spotted it can cloak or beefy enough to tank. Templars cant fight back or forced to use storm on a lone marine if spotted.
Top Toss is just playing better than Top Terrans right now.
He summarized my point pretty well.
If you spot a positioned HT'(s) with units the HT('s) can still Storm those units and potentially kill them . A positioned Ghost cannot do that. An EMP only helps you if plan to fight soon.
On May 04 2012 04:24 Heavenlee wrote: So many complaints about storms lately...yet so few terrans are even using ghosts effectively nowadays. A lot of them aren't even bothering to build them, as if the EMP radius nerf somehow made them useless. It's been widely known that there is a major AOE battle between ghosts and high templar but terrans are losing it constantly, for no reason. Ghost v Templar is not imbalanced in either favor, it comes down to skill, but in recent months terrans just haven't been doing it.
All those devastating storms that go off and make the game look imbalanced...? How about use some actual EMPs, ghost cloak, snipe templar and observers? How many games in the past have been completely swung by EMPs but now terran aren't even using them?
The problem is that Ghosts cost a ton and if you waste money on buying Ghosts and suddenly they just have 2 ranged collosus then you are just fucked.
Colossi don't just magically appear on the battlefield. Switching into Colossus tech is slow and costly as well. Moreover, any tech switch induces a period of weakness as a lot of resources are suddenly being dumped into things that can only pay off in about 1-2 minutes. The problems Terrans have are in very specific timings, and as such it is likely to get solved after a period of suffering.
Problem with constantly patching the game is that every new patch opens up new possibilities for abusive timings which will look just as unfair and impossible to stop. Every patch will inevitably break something else somewhere else. So if they keep doing that, the feeling that the game is imbalanced or broken will never go away (it hasn't after 2 years of doing it).
The game right now is as balanced as it is humanly possible to achieve. Last several patches have created just as many problems as they have solved, there is no overall progress being made.
On May 04 2012 04:24 Heavenlee wrote: So many complaints about storms lately...yet so few terrans are even using ghosts effectively nowadays. A lot of them aren't even bothering to build them, as if the EMP radius nerf somehow made them useless. It's been widely known that there is a major AOE battle between ghosts and high templar but terrans are losing it constantly, for no reason. Ghost v Templar is not imbalanced in either favor, it comes down to skill, but in recent months terrans just haven't been doing it.
All those devastating storms that go off and make the game look imbalanced...? How about use some actual EMPs, ghost cloak, snipe templar and observers? How many games in the past have been completely swung by EMPs but now terran aren't even using them?
The problem is that Ghosts cost a ton and if you waste money on buying Ghosts and suddenly they just have 2 ranged collosus then you are just fucked.
Colossi don't just magically appear on the battlefield. Switching into Colossus tech is slow and costly as well. Moreover, any tech switch induces a period of weakness as a lot of resources are suddenly being dumped into things that can only pay off in about 1-2 minutes. The problems Terrans have are in very specific timings, and as such it is likely to get solved after a period of suffering.
Problem with constantly patching the game is that every new patch opens up new possibilities for abusive timings which will look just as unfair and impossible to stop. Every patch will inevitably break something else somewhere else. So if they keep doing that, the feeling that the game is imbalanced or broken will never go away (it hasn't after 2 years of doing it).
The Techswitch in most cases will happen then the Toss already has a bank and enough of an army he won't die while transitioning into Colossi. Once the Robos and the Bay are done Colossi are build pretty fast especially with Chronoboost. This window the toss is vulnerable while adding Colossi is very slim. This timing is barely useable on the current Mappool . Current Maps are way too big for that.
On May 03 2012 23:24 power-overwhelming wrote: I just don't get the whine balance. Why can't people realize that the only reason P is strong is because MC is not the only good Protoss now and that all these Terrans have only been fighting other Terrans and Zergs the past 6 seasons.
It's really ironic how when Terrans were dominating since the start of SC2 it was because "best players play Terran" but in this one season Protoss does well it's automatically imbalance lol.
All the Protoss who advanced are godly at PvTs.. even Naniwa. If MVP did not cheese him out Naniwa would've advanced and would be a RO4 protoss. Similar to the Super Tournament when it was all Terrans.
You must have missed all the Terran nerfs. Bunkers had a small nerf. Barracks building time was nerfed. EMP was nerfed. Reapers were nerfed. Stimpack was nerfed. BFH were nerfed. Thors were nerfed.
Only nerf I can think of for Protoss is their storm. They were buffed for immortals, forge upgrades, and archons (splash, or was that in the beta? I don't remember).
Now you wonder why Terran was dominate in the start of SC2, as well as having maps favorable to T back in the day for the most part? And also, it is true there are more BW pros playing Terran than the other races, take it for what you will however.
Funny thing is, those nerf happened because Terran as race started overpowered as shit to begin with.
Think of it this way, it took all those nerf for both races to catch up to Terran. Now that MU are nearing 50% win rate better players are winning regardless of race.
Or, think of it this way: Terran players played the best all along, and now that their race is ludicrously underpowered, the winrates have started to stabilize.
On May 04 2012 04:24 Heavenlee wrote: So many complaints about storms lately...yet so few terrans are even using ghosts effectively nowadays. A lot of them aren't even bothering to build them, as if the EMP radius nerf somehow made them useless. It's been widely known that there is a major AOE battle between ghosts and high templar but terrans are losing it constantly, for no reason. Ghost v Templar is not imbalanced in either favor, it comes down to skill, but in recent months terrans just haven't been doing it.
The problem with Ghosts is this. They make your army slower than the lategame Protoss army. If you need to move around alot don't take Ghosts with your army or they die .
Its also very hard to EMP every Templar is the Toss knows what he's doing. If he positions his army well before the fight he will just move in the Templar when he specifically wants to Storm and in most cases you don't you every position he put his Templars because on the current maps theres way too much open space.
Templars make the protoss army even slower >_<
But the Korean Protoss started to position them pre-fight and random proxy Polyns and move in with them when needed . They don't run around with them unless they really need to because of it.
Waittt... so can't you position ghosts pre-fight too? Cloaking ghosts and moving them ahead of the army is also pretty effective too. You can't warp in HTs from random pylons because they won't have energy for storm.
You can, but Terran doesn't have the luxury of hiding ghosts behind a wall of 9 range laser beams and a meatshield of chargelots and only bringing them forward when necessary. Getting off EMPs on templars is a lot harder than getting off storms on bio simply because of the superior range and health of a Protoss army. Pre-positioned cloaked ghosts can be good but if you're playing against a Protoss who likes to keep a lot of observers out like Parting, it's not going to accomplish much of anything.
I don't have an issue with storm itself btw, but the combo of storms and colossi in a single army is maddening.
On May 04 2012 04:40 NexUmbra wrote: The problem is that Ghosts cost a ton and if you waste money on buying Ghosts and suddenly they just have 2 ranged collosus then you are just fucked.
I'm pretty sure that storms and EMP have the same range. The previous dude was complaining about HTs that were positioned everywhere; I just said that you can actually do the same with ghosts. If the HTs are in the deathball, it's even easier to carpet EMP it. HTs tend to die after storming; ghosts can do the same.
On May 04 2012 04:49 power-overwhelming wrote: I agree. Last year Protoss deathballs would decimate in 10 seconds due to carpet EMPS. I dunno why Terrans have stopped building ghosts. Parting takes risk by flanking with templars.. why cant terrans do the same? At least if a ghost is spotted it can cloak or beefy enough to tank. Templars cant fight back or forced to use storm on a lone marine if spotted.
Top Toss is just playing better than Top Terrans right now.
He summarized my point pretty well.
If you spot a positioned HT'(s) with units the HT('s) can still Storm those units and potentially kill them . A positioned Ghost cannot do that. An EMP only helps you if plan to fight soon.
You can force an engagement if you get off a bunch of money EMPs. I'm not suggesting to spread your ghosts all over the map; spread them near your army, and move in for the kill once your EMPs go off.
On May 04 2012 04:24 Heavenlee wrote: So many complaints about storms lately...yet so few terrans are even using ghosts effectively nowadays. A lot of them aren't even bothering to build them, as if the EMP radius nerf somehow made them useless. It's been widely known that there is a major AOE battle between ghosts and high templar but terrans are losing it constantly, for no reason. Ghost v Templar is not imbalanced in either favor, it comes down to skill, but in recent months terrans just haven't been doing it.
All those devastating storms that go off and make the game look imbalanced...? How about use some actual EMPs, ghost cloak, snipe templar and observers? How many games in the past have been completely swung by EMPs but now terran aren't even using them?
The problem is that Ghosts cost a ton and if you waste money on buying Ghosts and suddenly they just have 2 ranged collosus then you are just fucked.
Yeah, and scouting is so difficult for terran XD
It is. It's a crapshoot when you scan the Protoss =/
*scans main and see's only three gateways* Hmmmmm... does he have 2 forges/citadel at his natural, dt, colossus or 6 gating? Or maybe took a quick third. Sigh
Protip #1: Send an scv to check for thirds Protip#2: If you burned your scan, send an scv into their nat to see their unit comp Protip#3: A more effective scout is to drop a single stim marine in their base and run it around
On May 03 2012 23:24 power-overwhelming wrote: I just don't get the whine balance. Why can't people realize that the only reason P is strong is because MC is not the only good Protoss now and that all these Terrans have only been fighting other Terrans and Zergs the past 6 seasons.
It's really ironic how when Terrans were dominating since the start of SC2 it was because "best players play Terran" but in this one season Protoss does well it's automatically imbalance lol.
All the Protoss who advanced are godly at PvTs.. even Naniwa. If MVP did not cheese him out Naniwa would've advanced and would be a RO4 protoss. Similar to the Super Tournament when it was all Terrans.
You must have missed all the Terran nerfs. Bunkers had a small nerf. Barracks building time was nerfed. EMP was nerfed. Reapers were nerfed. Stimpack was nerfed. BFH were nerfed. Thors were nerfed.
Only nerf I can think of for Protoss is their storm. They were buffed for immortals, forge upgrades, and archons (splash, or was that in the beta? I don't remember).
Now you wonder why Terran was dominate in the start of SC2, as well as having maps favorable to T back in the day for the most part? And also, it is true there are more BW pros playing Terran than the other races, take it for what you will however.
Let me dissect your Terran nerfs
1. Bunker 100% salvage never made any sense. What kind of game design allows someone to make buildings and get full refund for it? Be thankful you get 75% back
2. Barracks time was nerf to the same time as other tier 1 unit builder. Why should Barracks build 5 second faster than Gateway?
3. EMP radius was nerfed to THE SAME SIZE AS STORM. Why the hell should EMP, an ability that COMES IN FREE, from a unit that is faster, more range, and has the ability to cloak and MORE ENERGY, be bigger in size than storm?
4. Reapers nerfed because a unit that ignores pathing doing that much dmg is bad game design. Terran already has something like that called vikings
5. Stimpack nerf.. as if Stimpack is even an issue now
6. BFH nerf. Well when terrans can just build 10 hellions and roast 80 workers then it's imbalance
7. Thors nerfed. Lol coz they are underpowered right now right?
Funny thing is, those nerf happened because Terran as race started overpowered as shit to begin with.
Think of it this way, it took all those nerf for both races to catch up to Terran. Now that MU are nearing 50% win rate better players are winning regardless of race.
Your comparisons to other race's spells are just dumb, don't do that when discussing balance. Or you want SC to be like AOE, zero uniqueness?
Actually we shouldn't discuss balance at all, almost no one qualified here.
It's called comprehension. I was responding to the guy who whined about all the Terran nerfs when they were overpowered to begin with, hence the need for the nerf.
Spells are unique on their own already, the fact that EMP is instant and free is VERY unique to storm which is progressive and need to be researched. Blizzard obviously found it unfair for EMP to have bigger radius than storm, hence the nerf. Shouldn't throw the word dumb around if you didn't even comprehend my argument.
Watching vods right now, however they seem to be on a faster speed (in the Taeja/Squirtle matches), it's like playing video on x1.5. Am I the only one having the problem or is it the vods themselves. If it's on my part, where can I fix this, didn't find an option in the player. It's kind of funny though, Tasteless sounds a bit squeaky that way
On May 04 2012 04:24 Heavenlee wrote: So many complaints about storms lately...yet so few terrans are even using ghosts effectively nowadays. A lot of them aren't even bothering to build them, as if the EMP radius nerf somehow made them useless. It's been widely known that there is a major AOE battle between ghosts and high templar but terrans are losing it constantly, for no reason. Ghost v Templar is not imbalanced in either favor, it comes down to skill, but in recent months terrans just haven't been doing it.
All those devastating storms that go off and make the game look imbalanced...? How about use some actual EMPs, ghost cloak, snipe templar and observers? How many games in the past have been completely swung by EMPs but now terran aren't even using them?
The problem is that Ghosts cost a ton and if you waste money on buying Ghosts and suddenly they just have 2 ranged collosus then you are just fucked.
Yeah, and scouting is so difficult for terran XD
It is. It's a crapshoot when you scan the Protoss =/
*scans main and see's only three gateways* Hmmmmm... does he have 2 forges/citadel at his natural, dt, colossus or 6 gating? Or maybe took a quick third. Sigh
Protip #1: Send an scv to check for thirds Protip#2: If you burned your scan, send an scv into their nat to see their unit comp Protip#3: A more effective scout is to drop a single stim marine in their base and run it around
On May 03 2012 21:59 0ne wrote: Terran does well every season " hey terran players are just better "
Protoss does well one season " IMBALANCE "
Stay classy terrans :p
pretty funny considering how Zerg and Toss have been crying for months
What´s also "funny", is that even Blizzard found it "funny" and tweaked the balance a bit - looks like the whining was not all that uncalled for.
A bit?? Check how many nerfs terran has had... And im an ex Zerg who actually found it was too much even back then.
And every single nerf was deserved. im an ex terran and even i found the terran dominance a little too much back then (or more like for the entire lifespan of SC2)
Meh. Everything was deserved except the ghost nerfs. EMP radius + leaving enough energy for a storm is just stupid
EMP is still strong. having a skill that takes out all sheilds and ALL energy (basicly cutting away half of every protoss units HP and making casters completley useless) in a huge area is just stupid.
It doesnt take out all shields and energy. Thats the problem!
EDIT: ok re-read... Well just compare to storm and feeback...
Storm is an AoE DoT and it doesnt remove energy... Feedback is a singel target spell. EMP was way to powerful pre-nerf, it basicly made everything struck in its AoE useless. Give me a solid argument for why it should take away all sheilds and all energy. thats potentially like 200 instant damage against units with high sheild HP. compared to Storm that does 80 damage over time.
You can dodge a storm and negate most of the damage. EMP is instant, wich means that once you where hit (and there was no way for slow units like templars to dodge it either) you were screwed.
you don't get the point. EMP doesn't kill anything. you don't get zealots (the most build unit protoss compositions nowadays) below 2/3 of their HP with EMP. now look at storm vs terran: marine stim takes them down to 45 hp, 2ticks from a storm (which are the average ticks if you react quickly and pull them out) and voila 5 hp left, WOW. Now lets look at our beafy marauders: stim takes them down to 100hp, 2 ticks from a storm and voila: down to 60hp that's 50% and much lower than our zealots that got hit by an EMP. And OMG you can cast a 2nd storm on them and it does actually do the same amount of dmg to them. 5 EMPs don't kill a zealot as 100 won't. And that's the big point, why storm is much more relevant in those battles and overall in the matchup than is EMP.
On May 04 2012 04:49 power-overwhelming wrote: I agree. Last year Protoss deathballs would decimate in 10 seconds due to carpet EMPS. I dunno why Terrans have stopped building ghosts. Parting takes risk by flanking with templars.. why cant terrans do the same? At least if a ghost is spotted it can cloak or beefy enough to tank. Templars cant fight back or forced to use storm on a lone marine if spotted.
Top Toss is just playing better than Top Terrans right now.
Ok so let's use our head and think for a sec. Which is more likely, the 32424 godly Terrans that's been dominating most of last year, all suddenly somehow became stupid and stopped using a strategy that has been working all along, OR just maybe they all have tried it and realized it doesn't actually work?
On May 03 2012 21:59 0ne wrote: Terran does well every season " hey terran players are just better "
Protoss does well one season " IMBALANCE "
Stay classy terrans :p
pretty funny considering how Zerg and Toss have been crying for months
What´s also "funny", is that even Blizzard found it "funny" and tweaked the balance a bit - looks like the whining was not all that uncalled for.
A bit?? Check how many nerfs terran has had... And im an ex Zerg who actually found it was too much even back then.
And every single nerf was deserved. im an ex terran and even i found the terran dominance a little too much back then (or more like for the entire lifespan of SC2)
Meh. Everything was deserved except the ghost nerfs. EMP radius + leaving enough energy for a storm is just stupid
EMP is still strong. having a skill that takes out all sheilds and ALL energy (basicly cutting away half of every protoss units HP and making casters completley useless) in a huge area is just stupid.
It doesnt take out all shields and energy. Thats the problem!
EDIT: ok re-read... Well just compare to storm and feeback...
Storm is an AoE DoT and it doesnt remove energy... Feedback is a singel target spell. EMP was way to powerful pre-nerf, it basicly made everything struck in its AoE useless. Give me a solid argument for why it should take away all sheilds and all energy. thats potentially like 200 instant damage against units with high sheild HP. compared to Storm that does 80 damage over time.
You can dodge a storm and negate most of the damage. EMP is instant, wich means that once you where hit (and there was no way for slow units like templars to dodge it either) you were screwed.
you don't get the point. EMP doesn't kill anything. you don't get zealots (the most build unit protoss compositions nowadays) below 2/3 of their HP with EMP. now look at storm vs terran: marine stim takes them down to 45 hp, 2ticks from a storm (which are the average ticks if you react quickly and pull them out) and voila 5 hp left, WOW. Now lets look at our beafy marauders: stim takes them down to 100hp, 2 ticks from a storm and voila: down to 60hp that's 50% and much lower than our zealots that got hit by an EMP. And OMG you can cast a 2nd storm on them and it does actually do the same amount of dmg to them. 5 EMPs don't kill a zealot as 100 won't. And that's the big point, why storm is much more relevant in those battles and overall in the matchup than is EMP.
You're right man! Storm OP. it should need to be researched and cost twice as much to get than stim--also, it should be in the archives. That will balance it
I'm tired at seeing all these people crying about balance. PLEASE, just because protoss players found a way to beat terran, that doesn't mean protoss is unbeatable. You need to wait for the meta game to solidify before you can say "something needs to be nerfed right now!" Terran players haven't tried everything yet. Heres what I can think of off the top of my head: adding tanks to the bio mix, dropping with low energy medivacs to prevent feedback, abusing the cloak/speed/range on ghosts against high templars(all ghost spells are range 10 and all high templar spells are range 9), and building extra orbital commands for scans to anticipate tech switch. When the 111 build got popular, it was 80%+ win rate against protoss. Nothing was done to fix it, but now protoss players can hold it off.
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