• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 08:14
CEST 14:14
KST 21:14
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
Serral wins Maestros of the Game 236ByuL, and the Limitations of Standard Play3Team Liquid Map Contest #22: Results and Winners7Code S Season 2 (2026): RO4 and Finals Preview12TL.net Map Contest #22 - Voting & Ladder Map Selection7
Community News
BSL Season 22 Full Overview & Conclusion5BSL Season 22 Full Overview & Conclusion5Weekly Cups (June 29-July 5): Solar Doubles0MC vs IdrA, Boxer vs Nal_rA to be Legacy Matches @ BlizzCon445.0.16 Hotfix (June 30) - Balance + Bug Fixes40
StarCraft 2
General
Most successful SC2 players of Q2 2026 AquaTrail-(I've Tested) My 90 Day Honest Experienc https://www.facebook.com/Power.Pro.Genius.USD/ Serral wins Maestros of the Game 2 MC vs IdrA, Boxer vs Nal_rA to be Legacy Matches @ BlizzCon
Tourneys
RSL Revival: Season 6 - Qualifiers and Main Event GSL CK #5 Race War HomeStory Cup 29 Vespene Cup #1 — $300+ USD, July 10 Sea Duckling Open (Global, Bronze-Diamond)
Strategy
[G] Having the right mentality to improve
Custom Maps
New Map Maker - Looking for Advice - Love or Hate Work In Progress Melee Maps [D]RTS in all its shapes and glory <3
External Content
Mutation # 533 Die Together The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 532 Nuclear Family Mutation # 531 Experimental Artillery
Brood War
General
BGH Auto Balance -> http://bghmmr.eu/ BW General Discussion BSL Season 22 Full Overview & Conclusion ASL 22 Proposed Map Pool Starcraft vs Retro Category on Twitch
Tourneys
[Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL22] Wildcard Qualifier IPSL Spring 2026 Top 4! Escore Tournament StarCraft Season 2
Strategy
Fighting Spirit mining rates Simple Questions, Simple Answers Creating a full chart of Zerg builds Relatively freeroll strategies
Other Games
General Games
General RTS Discussion Thread Summer Games Done Quick 2026! Nintendo Switch Thread Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread Dawn of War IV
Dota 2
Looking for a Dota Mentor Official 'what is Dota anymore' discussion
League of Legends
Heroes of the Storm
Simple Questions, Simple Answers Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
NeO.D_StephenKing vs This Guy From 1 Million Dance TL Mafia Community Thread TL Mafia Power Rank Vanilla Mini Mafia
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread UK Politics Mega-thread YouTube Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread
Fan Clubs
The IdrA Fan Club The HerO Fan Club!
Media & Entertainment
Anime Discussion Thread Movie Discussion! Series you have seen recently... [Req][Books] Good Fantasy/SciFi books [TV/BOOK] *SPOILERS* Game of Thrones Discussion
Sports
2024 - 2026 Football Thread McBoner: A hockey love story Tennis[sport] Formula 1 Discussion TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
FPS when play League Of Legend on laptop How to clean a TTe Thermaltake keyboard? Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
The Automated Ban List
Blogs
Major Shifts in the Gaming I…
TrAiDoS
An Exploration of th…
waywardstrategy
Gauntlet SC2: A Retrospectiv…
Ctone23
ramps on octagon
StaticNine
Funny Nicknames
LUCKY_NOOB
Evil Gacha Games and the…
ffswowsucks
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 6903 users

MLG Spring Arena [Day 2] - Page 62

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Tournaments
Post a Reply
Prev 1 60 61 62 63 64 113 Next
FrostedMiniWheats
Profile Joined August 2010
United States30730 Posts
April 22 2012 00:02 GMT
#1221
Grubby looking sharp
NesTea | Mvp | MC | Leenock | Losira | Gumiho | DRG | Taeja | Jinro | Stephano | Thorzain | Sen | Idra |Polt | Bomber | Symbol | Squirtle | Fantasy | Jaedong | Maru | sOs | Seed | ByuN | ByuL | Neeb| Scarlett | Rogue | IM forever
Zerothegreat
Profile Joined September 2010
United States787 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-22 00:03:39
April 22 2012 00:02 GMT
#1222
On April 22 2012 08:57 Porcelina wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 08:46 Zerothegreat wrote:
On April 22 2012 08:43 SiroKO wrote:
On April 22 2012 08:40 Zerothegreat wrote:
On April 22 2012 08:38 SiroKO wrote:
On April 22 2012 08:36 Zerothegreat wrote:
On April 22 2012 08:35 SiroKO wrote:
can't believe we had 1 year of zerg whining about a so called deathball which in fact doesn't stand a chance agaist well microed bl/infestors.



You mean stood a chance against very bad vortexes? And only 2 archons?? =/


Had the zerg either researched neural or learn how to not clump broodlords game would have end the game 10 minutes before, thanks for the reminder.


Microing broods is like trying to micro hydra.... And spreading them out too much makes them easier to be picked off by remaining stalkers for w/e the vortex doesn't get. Too much QQ


Just an observation of a glaring balance flaw.
Zerg is supposed to be ahead in the number of bases because of low cost-efficiency, however broodlords/infestors is the most cost-efficient unit combinaison of the game, only challenged by storm/colossi against bioball in PvT.



If you really want to see balance problems watch Leenock vs HeRo from Ro16 series.... Protoss late game is extremely hard to beat when played correctly. Zerg has to play perfect and even then it's very hard.


Both HerO v Leenock from Code S and Parting v Violet here had play that would be laughed at when this game gets more figured out.

Wings of Liberty is still so young, so unexplored in late game and lacks so much refinement. Claiming racial imbalance in super late game is so silly because there is not enough data on it and because we see new developments whenever a matchup has so far found a stable way to transition there.

At some point this game needs to be figured out. It will probably not be in Wings of Liberty, because any projected release date for Heart of the Swarm will certainly come way before this point. But all the same, at some point we just have to sit back and look at the game develop over a long period of time. Both spectators and professionals like to point out whatever they think to be evidence of imbalance, but even if a game was balanced perfectly, we will go through long periods of things feeling imbalanced because a race had something figured out while the other did not.

Of course it is always going to be a fear that we will never reach that stage. I hope Blizzard will have the integrity and confidence to leave things alone at some point; the whining will be immense but the alternative is that we just remain in a flux where skill and development takes a back seat to micro managing racial win percentages through nerfs and buffs.


I'm not saying the game is imbalanced at all. I'm saying a standard game can shift in favoring one race over another depending on the length of the game. Which isn't really fun gameplay if you get in the mindset: "I have to kill (insert race here) before they get a certain army composition or I lose!" OR "I have to stay alive until I get a certain composition of units to have an easier chance to win."

Edit: Anyways, I'm getting off topic so I will be sticking to what the thread is designed for now.
Jaegeru
Profile Joined February 2012
United Kingdom676 Posts
April 22 2012 00:02 GMT
#1223
Ganzi so good with that multitasking dropping so much and with constant aggression.
MVP on winning his Fourth GSL - "Yeah I know the routine, take the flowers and cheque, I will kiss the trophy for the photo"
0ne
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
Spain2464 Posts
April 22 2012 00:02 GMT
#1224
On April 22 2012 08:59 Aunvilgod wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 07:57 Azarkon wrote:
On April 22 2012 07:51 lulutheking wrote:
One none Korean and he's getting own... The gap is huge, seems like only Stephano and Naniwa have the level to compete with Koreans, all other foreigners are really far from the average Korean


Average Koreans? Haha.

Naniwa has a shot - his PvP >= MC and Parting, his PvT is good enough to take down Ganzi and Heart, but not MKP. He loses to DRG and Violet, though.

Stephano, no, because this line-up is Terran heavy and Stephano's ZvT isn't at this caliber.


Stephano´s ZvT definately is at this caliber. I mean, Polt is not bad, is he?

Do you remember MMA vs Stephano?
Rk0
Profile Joined August 2011
Netherlands224 Posts
April 22 2012 00:02 GMT
#1225
shakuras is so terrible in zvt, it is horrible if there are tanks on the high ground and you cant do shit about em
Ectrid
Profile Joined February 2012
Germany51 Posts
April 22 2012 00:02 GMT
#1226
are there any restreams with original sound? please keep the internet free... it started so good

User was banned for this post.
Nobody is more a slave than the one who considers himself free without being free
ZenithM
Profile Joined February 2011
France15952 Posts
April 22 2012 00:03 GMT
#1227
Yeah, ok, analysts also thought it was weird to pull SCVs yet start a CC, I'm reassured.
Was it a genius decision?
I'm still sticking with the "oh shit I'm not macroing and I have a lot of mins lol" CC.
dcsoda
Profile Joined June 2011
United States583 Posts
April 22 2012 00:03 GMT
#1228
Felt like Ganzi should have been hurt more by that first push with all the SCVs I'm not sure what happened with that game.
thepuppyassassin
Profile Joined April 2011
900 Posts
April 22 2012 00:03 GMT
#1229
Hmmm... These tournaments should have a clause where players get paid the bulk of their money 3 years down the road. I'm reasonably sure that once these kids manage to fill their pockets a little bit.. practice goes down the toilet.

tsk tsk.. No discipline.. wait til Flash comes over and teaches you the meaning of consistency. Yeah DRG I'm talking to you!
SinTio
Profile Joined April 2011
Germany871 Posts
April 22 2012 00:04 GMT
#1230
On April 22 2012 08:57 MLG_Adam wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 08:55 SinTio wrote:
On April 22 2012 08:50 MLG_Adam wrote:
The best part about this format is nothing is decided yet aside from 2 things:

MKP is in the bracket and Huk is out. Down to the last few matches and everything is on the line


And we only needed (nearly) two days to get to the interesting matches...



As a fan I've been interested the whole time.


In the games yes. Interested in the overall group situation? Not at all. I just don't find a group stage that stretches over 2 days and in the end only 2 out of 8 are out too interesting. Just my opinion, the rest of this arena was top
Testuser
Profile Blog Joined June 2011
6469 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-04-22 00:05:16
April 22 2012 00:04 GMT
#1231
Adebisi is so likable, and a really good caster/observer to boot. Hope we'll see him more!
https://soundcloud.com/papercranesdk
FrostedMiniWheats
Profile Joined August 2010
United States30730 Posts
April 22 2012 00:04 GMT
#1232
On April 22 2012 09:02 0ne wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 08:59 Aunvilgod wrote:
On April 22 2012 07:57 Azarkon wrote:
On April 22 2012 07:51 lulutheking wrote:
One none Korean and he's getting own... The gap is huge, seems like only Stephano and Naniwa have the level to compete with Koreans, all other foreigners are really far from the average Korean


Average Koreans? Haha.

Naniwa has a shot - his PvP >= MC and Parting, his PvT is good enough to take down Ganzi and Heart, but not MKP. He loses to DRG and Violet, though.

Stephano, no, because this line-up is Terran heavy and Stephano's ZvT isn't at this caliber.


Stephano´s ZvT definately is at this caliber. I mean, Polt is not bad, is he?

Do you remember MMA vs Stephano?


Sure, but MMA does that to a lot of Zergs. Thought Stephano played quite well even though he got his ass kicked
NesTea | Mvp | MC | Leenock | Losira | Gumiho | DRG | Taeja | Jinro | Stephano | Thorzain | Sen | Idra |Polt | Bomber | Symbol | Squirtle | Fantasy | Jaedong | Maru | sOs | Seed | ByuN | ByuL | Neeb| Scarlett | Rogue | IM forever
MLG_Adam
Profile Joined July 2010
United States994 Posts
April 22 2012 00:04 GMT
#1233
2v2 voting is done! 1st round is MKP+Huk vs DRG + MC and Parting+ Ganzi vs Heart Violet
Twitter: MrAdamAp
Zerothegreat
Profile Joined September 2010
United States787 Posts
April 22 2012 00:04 GMT
#1234
Looks like DRG won't be tied for 2nd now. Nice job to Violet.
snullbar
Profile Joined May 2011
17 Posts
April 22 2012 00:05 GMT
#1235
MLG_Adam who decides the mappool you have? I mean man why use old maps like shakuras and taldarim which are proven to be not the best maps. U really should let artosis run that
Jombozeus
Profile Blog Joined August 2010
China1014 Posts
April 22 2012 00:05 GMT
#1236
Holy shit. Ganzi was doing this shit on his stream last week, going as far as going triple CC vs 1-1-1 in tvt... Hes really getting this to WORK. That was not a mistake, hes been doing this errday errnight, putting zergs in uncomfortable situations and wait for them to fall apart.

Probably the most interesting player out there right now.
Dodgin
Profile Blog Joined July 2011
Canada39254 Posts
April 22 2012 00:06 GMT
#1237
On April 22 2012 09:05 snullbar wrote:
MLG_Adam who decides the mappool you have? I mean man why use old maps like shakuras and taldarim which are proven to be not the best maps. U really should let artosis run that


Have to agree that Taldarim and Shakuras have overstayed their welcome in competitive play, but I don't know if Artosis picking the maps is the best idea ^^ he would only pick maps Mech is good on.
mordk
Profile Blog Joined November 2010
Chile8385 Posts
April 22 2012 00:06 GMT
#1238
On April 22 2012 09:02 Zerothegreat wrote:
Show nested quote +
On April 22 2012 08:57 Porcelina wrote:
On April 22 2012 08:46 Zerothegreat wrote:
On April 22 2012 08:43 SiroKO wrote:
On April 22 2012 08:40 Zerothegreat wrote:
On April 22 2012 08:38 SiroKO wrote:
On April 22 2012 08:36 Zerothegreat wrote:
On April 22 2012 08:35 SiroKO wrote:
can't believe we had 1 year of zerg whining about a so called deathball which in fact doesn't stand a chance agaist well microed bl/infestors.



You mean stood a chance against very bad vortexes? And only 2 archons?? =/


Had the zerg either researched neural or learn how to not clump broodlords game would have end the game 10 minutes before, thanks for the reminder.


Microing broods is like trying to micro hydra.... And spreading them out too much makes them easier to be picked off by remaining stalkers for w/e the vortex doesn't get. Too much QQ


Just an observation of a glaring balance flaw.
Zerg is supposed to be ahead in the number of bases because of low cost-efficiency, however broodlords/infestors is the most cost-efficient unit combinaison of the game, only challenged by storm/colossi against bioball in PvT.



If you really want to see balance problems watch Leenock vs HeRo from Ro16 series.... Protoss late game is extremely hard to beat when played correctly. Zerg has to play perfect and even then it's very hard.


Both HerO v Leenock from Code S and Parting v Violet here had play that would be laughed at when this game gets more figured out.

Wings of Liberty is still so young, so unexplored in late game and lacks so much refinement. Claiming racial imbalance in super late game is so silly because there is not enough data on it and because we see new developments whenever a matchup has so far found a stable way to transition there.

At some point this game needs to be figured out. It will probably not be in Wings of Liberty, because any projected release date for Heart of the Swarm will certainly come way before this point. But all the same, at some point we just have to sit back and look at the game develop over a long period of time. Both spectators and professionals like to point out whatever they think to be evidence of imbalance, but even if a game was balanced perfectly, we will go through long periods of things feeling imbalanced because a race had something figured out while the other did not.

Of course it is always going to be a fear that we will never reach that stage. I hope Blizzard will have the integrity and confidence to leave things alone at some point; the whining will be immense but the alternative is that we just remain in a flux where skill and development takes a back seat to micro managing racial win percentages through nerfs and buffs.


I'm not saying the game is imbalanced at all. I'm saying a standard game can shift in favoring one race over another depending on the length of the game. Which isn't really fun gameplay if you get in the mindset: "I have to kill (insert race here) before they get a certain army composition or I lose!" OR "I have to stay alive until I get a certain composition of units to have an easier chance to win."

Edit: Anyways, I'm getting off topic so I will be sticking to what the thread is designed for now.

This has always been like this in BW and it's never been a problem, depending on the builds used and the players involved, some matchups heavily depend on things like this
ACrow
Profile Joined October 2011
Germany6583 Posts
April 22 2012 00:07 GMT
#1239
On April 22 2012 09:02 Ectrid wrote:
are there any restreams with original sound? please keep the internet free... it started so good

Piracy keeps the internet free and ensures there won't be any good content. Please don't do this and support the event if you can.
PS: Asking for restreams might get you banned btw.
Get off my lawn, young punks
Rk0
Profile Joined August 2011
Netherlands224 Posts
April 22 2012 00:07 GMT
#1240
hahaha canadians sounds so herpy derp 'oot. who is he? what does he cast regularly? 'scooting information' hehe
Prev 1 60 61 62 63 64 113 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
SC Evo League
12:00
SEL S3 Ladder Invitational
ByuN vs Classic
Cure vs Solar
IntoTheiNu 534
LiquipediaDiscussion
Afreeca Starleague
10:00
ASL22 Wildcard
Snow vs Jaedong
YSC vs hero
Afreeca ASL 3975
LiquipediaDiscussion
CranKy Ducklings
10:00
Sea Duckling Open #147
CranKy Ducklings48
LiquipediaDiscussion
RSL Revival
09:00
Season 6 - Group A
Serral vs Bunny
ByuN vs GgMaChine
Tasteless1233
Ryung 931
RotterdaM601
TKL 277
IndyStarCraft 190
Rex148
3DClanTV 97
Liquipedia
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
Tasteless 1233
Ryung 931
RotterdaM 601
TKL 277
IndyStarCraft 190
Rex 148
MindelVK 25
StarCraft: Brood War
Britney 23770
Calm 6388
Bisu 2649
firebathero 801
Hyuk 786
Shuttle 623
BeSt 529
Mini 458
Horang2 353
ZerO 185
[ Show more ]
Stork 184
Dewaltoss 159
Last 128
ggaemo 121
soO 41
Soma 25
sorry 22
IntoTheRainbow 14
GoRush 13
Sexy 11
sSak 11
ajuk12(nOOB) 9
Dota 2
Gorgc5689
XaKoH 662
Dendi587
XcaliburYe177
League of Legends
Doublelift2940
JimRising 516
Counter-Strike
zeus168
Other Games
gofns10656
FrodaN2661
singsing1125
B2W.Neo794
Lowko293
Pyrionflax269
KnowMe109
ToD44
DeMusliM13
Organizations
Other Games
gamesdonequick25484
StarCraft: Brood War
UltimateBattle 124
lovetv 14
StarCraft 2
Blizzard YouTube
StarCraft: Brood War
BSLTrovo
[ Show 12 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• CranKy Ducklings SOOP10
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• LaughNgamezSOOP
• Migwel
• sooper7s
StarCraft: Brood War
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
League of Legends
• Jankos2580
Upcoming Events
IPSL
3h 46m
Dragon vs Ret
Patches Events
3h 46m
RSL Revival
20h 46m
Solar vs Rogue
Maru vs NightMare
Sparkling Tuna Cup
21h 46m
IPSL
1d 3h
Bonyth vs Hawk
GSL
1d 22h
Replay Cast
2 days
WardiTV Weekly
2 days
The PondCast
3 days
Replay Cast
4 days
[ Show More ]
CrankTV Team League
4 days
Replay Cast
5 days
CrankTV Team League
5 days
Replay Cast
6 days
RSL Revival
6 days
Clem vs Lambo
Scarlett vs Cure
CranKy Ducklings
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Escore Tournament S3: W2
HSC XXIX
Eternal Conflict S2 E1

Ongoing

IPSL Spring 2026
Acropolis #4
YSL S3
CSL 2026 Summer (S21)
ASL Season 22: Wild Card Qualifier
RSL Revival: Season 6
CranK Gathers Season 4: BW vs SC2 Team League
SCTL 2026 Spring
XSE Pro League 2026
IEM Cologne Major 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 2
CS Asia Championships 2026
Asian Champions League 2026
IEM Atlanta 2026
PGL Astana 2026
BLAST Rivals Spring 2026

Upcoming

CSLAN 4
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
Light Tournament 2026
Eternal Conflict S2 Finale
Eternal Conflict S2 E3
Eternal Conflict S2 E2
Logitech G Connect 2026
StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #5
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer Qual
Stake Ranked Episode 3
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.