|
Players such as Jinro, HuK, and Adelscott did not apply for this tour, so don't ask why they aren't on this list. DIMAGA, Kas, and LaLush turned applications in late so they will not appear either. Please take some time to learn who exactly applied. Please inform yourself about who applied and who didn't. |
On March 30 2011 07:00 Minigun wrote:
To those negatively critizing the nasl...
Does everyone realize how big e-sports can get in the NA if this booms?
It will be huge, it's getting huge as we speak.
It's a list of 50 people. Unfortunately that means not every top player can get it.
They need to make money off it as well. So not only do they invite top players, but people the community favorites.
If there are players that don't belong, then they will be weeded out pretty fast. They may have taken your favorite players spot, but there's always next season, and if they really deserve to be there, then they will probably be able to get through using the qualifier. I'm not sure how well I would have done if they through me in there now. I can't say I would be confident playing someone like ogsmc in a tournament. Although I would love the chance too (favorite protoss player <3)
Nasl is a business. I want to watch it grow. Am I little disappointed I didn't get in? Ofc..but will there be other chances to get in, other turnys (especially if the NASL takes off) ? Yes.
Starcraft 2 is so close to becoming huge in the NA. Instead of negatively criticizing one of the first businesses to actually try and expand E-sports in the west. Lets give it our unconditional support. Starcraft 2 can be huge, but only if the community supports it.
Oh btw, thanks for the support to me guys, it means a lot.
Definitely bummed out for NightEnD and several other players and I will join the chorus of voices saying that I dont think INcontrol deserved an invite. That being said, I really agree with this post by Minigun. The NASL is doing their best to create something professional and sustainable and I still think it will be amazing. They are breaking new ground here and there is bound to be some mistakes along the way. Mad props to Minigun for staying positive despite the snub.
|
Artosis has participated in gsl and coached while casting. GSL must totally be a non legit tournament then right????
Well it did look silly, and he was obviously biased while casting. That didn't detract from the entertainment but it did make it look less professional having Artosis running around everywhere.
|
On March 30 2011 07:00 Minigun wrote:
To those negatively critizing the nasl...
Does everyone realize how big e-sports can get in the NA if this booms?
It will be huge, it's getting huge as we speak.
It's a list of 50 people. Unfortunately that means not every top player can get it.
They need to make money off it as well. So not only do they invite top players, but people the community favorites.
If there are players that don't belong, then they will be weeded out pretty fast. They may have taken your favorite players spot, but there's always next season, and if they really deserve to be there, then they will probably be able to get through using the qualifier. I'm not sure how well I would have done if they through me in there now. I can't say I would be confident playing someone like ogsmc in a tournament. Although I would love the chance too (favorite protoss player <3)
Nasl is a business. I want to watch it grow. Am I little disappointed I didn't get in? Ofc..but will there be other chances to get in, other turnys (especially if the NASL takes off) ? Yes.
Starcraft 2 is so close to becoming huge in the NA. Instead of negatively criticizing one of the first businesses to actually try and expand E-sports in the west. Lets give it our unconditional support. Starcraft 2 can be huge, but only if the community supports it.
We all want it to succeed. However, if the business wants support from the community, it should do its best to represent and treat the community fairly as well.
People have valid criticisms of how their applications were handled that should be remedied rather than glanced over just because the business is hosting the tournament of a game we all love. Just because we want a e-sports to be big doesn't mean we turn a blind eye and give the NASL or any other tournament carte blanche to pick favorites and disregard hard-working and deserving players. The NASL depend on our viewership and the viewers should be heard (support AND criticism).
|
Minigun, you've just made me a fan. Train hard mate and qualify for the next season!!!
|
Also kudos for providing legit explanations for people who were rejected or did not make the cut and explaining why they picked who they did. When it comes down to it they are trying to get a product out and narrow a field so many will not be happy regardless. Any good player that did not make it is free to qualify for a later tournament, how many people are in gsl now that were not in season 1?
|
Demuslim (probably?) couldn't guarantee he'd be able to play as much as anyone
The problem I see with that is "probably." It seems they never contacted him directly and just based their judgement of his health on his application vod. =/
|
no matter what there would be people that would be left out and people would be complaining about it. all that i can say is that gsl 1 had some really bad players in it, and it got progressively better each season, so those who feel as if this isnt the best can rest assured that each season will be better than the previous season in all probability. plus there are the qualifiers to play through so maybe your favorite player will qualify through that. give it a chance guys i think the league is a great thing 
|
Minigun is now a hero, so wm <33333333333
|
On March 30 2011 07:06 Xeris wrote:
[
I didn't specifically tell the players, however, when I was approached by BRAT_OK's manager (from RoX), about the NASL, he actually provided me with BRAT's B1/2 VISA number that we verified. White-Ra has demonstrated his ability to get into the US before (I met him at MLG DC and Blizzcon, so I'm well aware he could get here). While it is true, I could have been clearer I guess, the ultimate burden of responsibility must be shared by both organizers and players. We are not here to hand-hold, and this is a two-way street.
The fact that someone like BRAT's manager made sure to provide me that information (the contract specifically says that you need to *guarantee* your ability to be in the US for the final) in order to alleviate any concern shows that: a) they understood the implications of playing in the league, and b) they cared enough about being a part of it to go the extra mile. NightEnD didn't do this, nor did his manager.
They would care because Brat_OK failed to get a visa for the IEM, for Dreamhack and for Assembley. So of course his manager would have been keen to prove it wouldnt be a problem this time and Brat_OK doesnt live in a EU country.
I dont want to seem like im ganging up on you, I know how hard people have to work organising tournaments.
|
I certainly hope that lessons are learned from this, and that if the tournament is a success that future application processes can be handled much better.
Getting someone to conduct Skype or phone interviews with the players or their managers, even if they had just been short 5-10 minute conversations could have saved so much hassle.
Really disapointed the only top class British player in the world isnt in this tournament. Besides arent Incontrol and Demuslim on the same team? I apreciate you guys arent in the same country but i cant quite wrap my head around that one.
I'll still watch it, but meh.
|
On March 30 2011 07:06 Zlasher wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 06:09 Lz wrote:On March 30 2011 05:59 abominable wrote:
after watching LzGamer stream for the last 3 hours... wtf happened?
lol... he's better than at least half of the US players in the tournament, and he wasn't even important enough to mention in the "why players weren't invited" section. lol thats how I feel.. atlest a reason why i was not "mentioned" in the section.. I guess im not Good enough for the league.. for laugh's go look at my recent games list EGLzGaMeR 327 .. lol its funny Im obviously sad i did not even get apparently thought about during this process.. but I will still watch and support the NASL! and of course cheer on my teammates ~ EG FIGHTING Lz you know I love you and you're one of my favorite players, but results in clan leagues and clan matches, showmatches, and tournaments all went against you the past few months, it's really hard to argue someone in just based on ladder games (although lets be honest, they seemed to have done that for 3-5 players on the list). Even Strifecro who's on your team, has better results all over and he wasn't invited, as with Demuslim.
haha...
It's ok.. I just wanted to know the real reason.. if its "skill level" then thats fine they can have there opinion... Just wanted to know.
|
On March 30 2011 07:09 Bean54 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 07:00 Minigun wrote:
To those negatively critizing the nasl...
Does everyone realize how big e-sports can get in the NA if this booms?
It will be huge, it's getting huge as we speak.
It's a list of 50 people. Unfortunately that means not every top player can get it.
They need to make money off it as well. So not only do they invite top players, but people the community favorites.
If there are players that don't belong, then they will be weeded out pretty fast. They may have taken your favorite players spot, but there's always next season, and if they really deserve to be there, then they will probably be able to get through using the qualifier. I'm not sure how well I would have done if they through me in there now. I can't say I would be confident playing someone like ogsmc in a tournament. Although I would love the chance too (favorite protoss player <3)
Nasl is a business. I want to watch it grow. Am I little disappointed I didn't get in? Ofc..but will there be other chances to get in, other turnys (especially if the NASL takes off) ? Yes.
Starcraft 2 is so close to becoming huge in the NA. Instead of negatively criticizing one of the first businesses to actually try and expand E-sports in the west. Lets give it our unconditional support. Starcraft 2 can be huge, but only if the community supports it.
We all want it to succeed. However, if the business wants support from the community, it should do its best to represent and treat the community fairly as well. People have valid criticisms of how their applications were handled that should be remedied rather than glanced over just because the business is hosting the tournament of a game we all love. Just because we want a e-sports to be big doesn't mean we turn a blind eye and give the NASL or any other tournament carte blanche to pick favorites and disregard hard-working and deserving players. The NASL depend on our viewership and the viewers should be heard (support AND criticism).
There will be problems and people felt like they were "wronged" in every tournament. It's just unavoidable for the most part. (I'm not saying anyone was or wasn't, staying out of that because it's not really my business.)
I think you are missing how extremely hard it would be for someone to pick 50 top players, out of koreans, eu, and na.
I would pull my hair out. It's IMPOSSIBLE to not leave people out.
I can think of a few iffy players on that list, but im keeping my opinion out of it. It doesn't matter if there are a few iffy players.
NASL are one of the first businesses to put themselves out there, and try and do something amazing for e-sports and starcraft 2.
I'm not going to not support them because someone I think was deserving didn't get in.
There's always the next tournament.
A perfect list would look 100% different for everyone.
Did people who deserved to get in not get in? Of course, that would have happened no matter who made the list. whether it was me, you, or someone who was completely unbiased.
|
+ Show Spoiler +On March 30 2011 07:06 Xeris wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 06:57 Bean54 wrote:
Xeris, you say you didnt accept NightEnD because he didn't already have a VISA. Did you even let the players know this was a requirement before or during the application process? Based on what it sounds like, you didn't. If not having a passport is a legitimate concern and is cause for disqualification you should have let NightEnD and all players know that BEFOREHAND so they could actually obtain one or fail to. Then you'd have a valid reason for disqualifying them. Sounds like you disqualified him for something that could easily have been remedied if you had let him know ahead of time. I didn't specifically tell the players, however, when I was approached by BRAT_OK's manager (from RoX), about the NASL, he actually provided me with BRAT's B1/2 VISA number that we verified. White-Ra has demonstrated his ability to get into the US before (I met him at MLG DC and Blizzcon, so I'm well aware he could get here). While it is true, I could have been clearer I guess, the ultimate burden of responsibility must be shared by both organizers and players. We are not here to hand-hold, and this is a two-way street. The fact that someone like BRAT's manager made sure to provide me that information (the contract specifically says that you need to *guarantee* your ability to be in the US for the final) in order to alleviate any concern shows that: a) they understood the implications of playing in the league, and b) they cared enough about being a part of it to go the extra mile. NightEnD didn't do this, nor did his manager. I obviously take some responsibility for not explicitly stating it, but neither him or his manager has taken any responsibility in the matter, and instead responds with harsh words to me and the league. This is unfair for us. In our internal discussions, we wanted to avoid people from countries who had VISA problems entering the US because those players are "high risk" for us (I.E. what happens if they qualify but can't come to the finals?), this is also why we only considered ONE player (BRAT_OK) from RoX, and none of their other players... the RoX manager didn't even submit applications for the other ones because he knew they didn't have and couldn't guarantee VISAS. We did research on various countries, and knew that Romania doesn't have a VISA waiver program with the US, and that it would be difficult for a Romanian to get a VISA, which is why we didn't have NightEnD on our list, and which was why he was on our backup list. So again, people should be aware that in life, there are always two parties and both hold responsibility.
Well obviously if the contract, something the community was not privy to, stated that absolute proof was necessary then I agree with your decision.
I still dislike how demuslim's app was handled, though 
Hoping for a successful season!
|
On March 30 2011 07:06 Xeris wrote: (I.E. what happens if they qualify but can't come to the finals?)
You simply take the next player from the drop-out's group?! It's less big of a deal than you make it sound. As esports has proven time and time again, there can be no guarantees when it comes to visas anyway. Unexpected things can happen, and it's impossible to rule out that people from countries like Russia might get their visa applications denied. Just accept that you don't have 100% control over it, regardless of what contract you make people sign. Other tournaments survived visa-related drop-outs, too.
On March 30 2011 07:00 Minigun wrote:
Does everyone realize how big e-sports can get in the NA if this booms?
Stop this already, the unjustified NASL-will-make-esports-huge hype is getting more and more annoying. At this point, this is just a professional tournament with a rather high prize money pool. From what is known so far, in no way it is going to have a significant influence on the development of esports. I don't even see how anyone could rate its importance higher than WCG, MLG and IEM. It's going to be a great league and it could turn into a viable business that benefits esports but it has no potential to be a game-changer. It's not even tailored to reach broader audiences.
|
On March 30 2011 07:00 Minigun wrote:
To those negatively critizing the nasl...
Does everyone realize how big e-sports can get in the NA if this booms?
It will be huge, it's getting huge as we speak.
It's a list of 50 people. Unfortunately that means not every top player can get it.
They need to make money off it as well. So not only do they invite top players, but people the community favorites.
If there are players that don't belong, then they will be weeded out pretty fast. They may have taken your favorite players spot, but there's always next season, and if they really deserve to be there, then they will probably be able to get through using the qualifier. I'm not sure how well I would have done if they threw me in there now. I can't say I would be confident playing someone like ogsmc in a tournament. Although I would love the chance too (favorite protoss player <3)
Nasl is a business. I want to watch it grow. Am I little disappointed I didn't get in? Ofc..but will there be other chances to get in, other turnys (especially if the NASL takes off) ? Yes.
Starcraft 2 is so close to becoming huge in the NA. Instead of negatively criticizing one of the first businesses to actually try and expand E-sports in the west. Lets give it our unconditional support. Starcraft 2 can be huge, but only if the community supports it.
Buy your ticket, sit back, with some food and coke, and enjoy the show. I know I will.
Oh btw, thanks for the support to me guys, it means a lot.
I agree. This is great for the esports community. However it could also affect it negatively if not handled correctly. (Not saying I think the nasl will fail, just saying that god forbid anything negative happened it would look bad) That's why people get apprehensive over anything they think should be handled differently, they just want it to succeed. That being said I really do hope the nasl grows to rival the level competition the gsl provides.
Also, I think it's unfair to judge players before they even get the chance to prove themselves. By the time season 2 rolls around everyone will know who deserved their spot and who didn't based on performance. So just give it time. (Still wish minigun was chosen though :/)
|
On March 30 2011 07:06 Xeris wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 06:57 Bean54 wrote:
Xeris, you say you didnt accept NightEnD because he didn't already have a VISA. Did you even let the players know this was a requirement before or during the application process? Based on what it sounds like, you didn't. If not having a passport is a legitimate concern and is cause for disqualification you should have let NightEnD and all players know that BEFOREHAND so they could actually obtain one or fail to. Then you'd have a valid reason for disqualifying them. Sounds like you disqualified him for something that could easily have been remedied if you had let him know ahead of time. I didn't specifically tell the players, however, when I was approached by BRAT_OK's manager (from RoX), about the NASL, he actually provided me with BRAT's B1/2 VISA number that we verified. White-Ra has demonstrated his ability to get into the US before (I met him at MLG DC and Blizzcon, so I'm well aware he could get here). While it is true, I could have been clearer I guess, the ultimate burden of responsibility must be shared by both organizers and players. We are not here to hand-hold, and this is a two-way street. The fact that someone like BRAT's manager made sure to provide me that information (the contract specifically says that you need to *guarantee* your ability to be in the US for the final) in order to alleviate any concern shows that: a) they understood the implications of playing in the league, and b) they cared enough about being a part of it to go the extra mile. NightEnD didn't do this, nor did his manager. I obviously take some responsibility for not explicitly stating it, but neither him or his manager has taken any responsibility in the matter, and instead responds with harsh words to me and the league. This is unfair for us. In our internal discussions, we wanted to avoid people from countries who had VISA problems entering the US because those players are "high risk" for us (I.E. what happens if they qualify but can't come to the finals?), this is also why we only considered ONE player (BRAT_OK) from RoX, and none of their other players... the RoX manager didn't even submit applications for the other ones because he knew they didn't have and couldn't guarantee VISAS. We did research on various countries, and knew that Romania doesn't have a VISA waiver program with the US, and that it would be difficult for a Romanian to get a VISA, which is why we didn't have NightEnD on our list, and which was why he was on our backup list. So again, people should be aware that in life, there are always two parties and both hold responsibility.
So u picked the 50 players and said x is not invited becouse y is not invited becouse NightEnD is not invited becouse he has no visa . How could u know that i dont have visa if u didnt even bother t to ask me ? Pls cut the crap
|
On March 30 2011 07:00 Minigun wrote:+ Show Spoiler +To those negatively critizing the nasl...
Does everyone realize how big e-sports can get in the NA if this booms?
It will be huge, it's getting huge as we speak.
It's a list of 50 people. Unfortunately that means not every top player can get it.
They need to make money off it as well. So not only do they invite top players, but people the community favorites.
If there are players that don't belong, then they will be weeded out pretty fast. They may have taken your favorite players spot, but there's always next season, and if they really deserve to be there, then they will probably be able to get through using the qualifier. I'm not sure how well I would have done if they threw me in there now. I can't say I would be confident playing someone like ogsmc in a tournament. Although I would love the chance too (favorite protoss player <3)
Nasl is a business. I want to watch it grow. Am I little disappointed I didn't get in? Ofc..but will there be other chances to get in, other turnys (especially if the NASL takes off) ? Yes.
Starcraft 2 is so close to becoming huge in the NA. Instead of negatively criticizing one of the first businesses to actually try and expand E-sports in the west. Lets give it our unconditional support. Starcraft 2 can be huge, but only if the community supports it.
Buy your ticket, sit back, with some food and coke, and enjoy the show. I know I will.
Oh btw, thanks for the support to me guys, it means a lot.
Minigun, I've seen you play. You're really good and I'm impressed. For you not to get into the NASL off the getgo kinda sucks, but from this post I can see you're a man of reason and forethought. Good on you for not going sour and thinking not being picked is a slap in the face, but rather somewhat of a challenge to make it in next season and show your worth.
Very mature mate. I will nolonger clench my fist in Zerg stress when you beat destiny on his stream. Mad props to you. You gained me as a fan.
|
NightEnD... obviously many people feel for your situation, but if the contract stated that you had to have proof of your ability to get into the US then the responsibility was yours. Xeris was quite clear on this.
|
On March 30 2011 07:00 Minigun wrote:
To those negatively critizing the nasl...
Does everyone realize how big e-sports can get in the NA if this booms?
It will be huge, it's getting huge as we speak.
It's a list of 50 people. Unfortunately that means not every top player can get it.
They need to make money off it as well. So not only do they invite top players, but people the community favorites.
If there are players that don't belong, then they will be weeded out pretty fast. They may have taken your favorite players spot, but there's always next season, and if they really deserve to be there, then they will probably be able to get through using the qualifier. I'm not sure how well I would have done if they threw me in there now. I can't say I would be confident playing someone like ogsmc in a tournament. Although I would love the chance too (favorite protoss player <3)
Nasl is a business. I want to watch it grow. Am I little disappointed I didn't get in? Ofc..but will there be other chances to get in, other turnys (especially if the NASL takes off) ? Yes.
Starcraft 2 is so close to becoming huge in the NA. Instead of negatively criticizing one of the first businesses to actually try and expand E-sports in the west. Lets give it our unconditional support. Starcraft 2 can be huge, but only if the community supports it.
Buy your ticket, sit back, with some food and coke, and enjoy the show. I know I will.
Oh btw, thanks for the support to me guys, it means a lot.
Total baller man! You've got a fan for life here.
|
We did research on various countries, and knew that Romania doesn't have a VISA waiver program with the US, and that it would be difficult for a Romanian to get a VISA, which is why we didn't have NightEnD on our list, and which was why he was on our backup list.
I can't help but think that your time would have been better spent simply asking players about their VISA, rather than researching which countries would have difficulty if it was that much of an issue.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
