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Players such as Jinro, HuK, and Adelscott did not apply for this tour, so don't ask why they aren't on this list. DIMAGA, Kas, and LaLush turned applications in late so they will not appear either. Please take some time to learn who exactly applied. Please inform yourself about who applied and who didn't. |
Good job, good choices amazing players, looking forward for this to start 
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On March 30 2011 07:06 Xeris wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 06:57 Bean54 wrote:
Xeris, you say you didnt accept NightEnD because he didn't already have a VISA. Did you even let the players know this was a requirement before or during the application process? Based on what it sounds like, you didn't. If not having a passport is a legitimate concern and is cause for disqualification you should have let NightEnD and all players know that BEFOREHAND so they could actually obtain one or fail to. Then you'd have a valid reason for disqualifying them. Sounds like you disqualified him for something that could easily have been remedied if you had let him know ahead of time. I didn't specifically tell the players, however, when I was approached by BRAT_OK's manager (from RoX), about the NASL, he actually provided me with BRAT's B1/2 VISA number that we verified. White-Ra has demonstrated his ability to get into the US before (I met him at MLG DC and Blizzcon, so I'm well aware he could get here). While it is true, I could have been clearer I guess, the ultimate burden of responsibility must be shared by both organizers and players. We are not here to hand-hold, and this is a two-way street. The fact that someone like BRAT's manager made sure to provide me that information (the contract specifically says that you need to *guarantee* your ability to be in the US for the final) in order to alleviate any concern shows that: a) they understood the implications of playing in the league, and b) they cared enough about being a part of it to go the extra mile. NightEnD didn't do this, nor did his manager. I obviously take some responsibility for not explicitly stating it, but neither him or his manager has taken any responsibility in the matter, and instead responds with harsh words to me and the league. This is unfair for us. In our internal discussions, we wanted to avoid people from countries who had VISA problems entering the US because those players are "high risk" for us (I.E. what happens if they qualify but can't come to the finals?), this is also why we only considered ONE player (BRAT_OK) from RoX, and none of their other players... the RoX manager didn't even submit applications for the other ones because he knew they didn't have and couldn't guarantee VISAS. We did research on various countries, and knew that Romania doesn't have a VISA waiver program with the US, and that it would be difficult for a Romanian to get a VISA, which is why we didn't have NightEnD on our list, and which was why he was on our backup list. So again, people should be aware that in life, there are always two parties and both hold responsibility.
Ok I understand, but I try to look at things from the player's perspective because you suffer no loss by a mutual mistake but the player suffers an opportunity for large sums of money through competing.
Just having the wording in the contract that says "guarantee" you can get here is extremely vague and isn't an explicit solicitation to provide travel documentation or a request of anything, I would assume it means make sure you have enough funds for travel and stay or something.
Its clearly too late at this stage and I'm sure youll be more careful in the future about your wording and requirements but I understand why NightEnD is so upset and I feel for him.
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I still see absolutely no reason why ViBE was chosen over ThisIsJimmy.
Jimmy has a longer history of SC2 success, better results in online cups (including recently), etc.
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On March 30 2011 07:18 SimDawg wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 07:00 Minigun wrote:
To those negatively critizing the nasl...
Does everyone realize how big e-sports can get in the NA if this booms?
It will be huge, it's getting huge as we speak.
It's a list of 50 people. Unfortunately that means not every top player can get it.
They need to make money off it as well. So not only do they invite top players, but people the community favorites.
If there are players that don't belong, then they will be weeded out pretty fast. They may have taken your favorite players spot, but there's always next season, and if they really deserve to be there, then they will probably be able to get through using the qualifier. I'm not sure how well I would have done if they threw me in there now. I can't say I would be confident playing someone like ogsmc in a tournament. Although I would love the chance too (favorite protoss player <3)
Nasl is a business. I want to watch it grow. Am I little disappointed I didn't get in? Ofc..but will there be other chances to get in, other turnys (especially if the NASL takes off) ? Yes.
Starcraft 2 is so close to becoming huge in the NA. Instead of negatively criticizing one of the first businesses to actually try and expand E-sports in the west. Lets give it our unconditional support. Starcraft 2 can be huge, but only if the community supports it.
Buy your ticket, sit back, with some food and coke, and enjoy the show. I know I will.
Oh btw, thanks for the support to me guys, it means a lot. Total baller man! You've got a fan for life here.
Just waiting for someone to start the minigun fanclub
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On March 30 2011 07:16 NightEnD wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 07:06 Xeris wrote:On March 30 2011 06:57 Bean54 wrote:
Xeris, you say you didnt accept NightEnD because he didn't already have a VISA. Did you even let the players know this was a requirement before or during the application process? Based on what it sounds like, you didn't. If not having a passport is a legitimate concern and is cause for disqualification you should have let NightEnD and all players know that BEFOREHAND so they could actually obtain one or fail to. Then you'd have a valid reason for disqualifying them. Sounds like you disqualified him for something that could easily have been remedied if you had let him know ahead of time. I didn't specifically tell the players, however, when I was approached by BRAT_OK's manager (from RoX), about the NASL, he actually provided me with BRAT's B1/2 VISA number that we verified. White-Ra has demonstrated his ability to get into the US before (I met him at MLG DC and Blizzcon, so I'm well aware he could get here). While it is true, I could have been clearer I guess, the ultimate burden of responsibility must be shared by both organizers and players. We are not here to hand-hold, and this is a two-way street. The fact that someone like BRAT's manager made sure to provide me that information (the contract specifically says that you need to *guarantee* your ability to be in the US for the final) in order to alleviate any concern shows that: a) they understood the implications of playing in the league, and b) they cared enough about being a part of it to go the extra mile. NightEnD didn't do this, nor did his manager. I obviously take some responsibility for not explicitly stating it, but neither him or his manager has taken any responsibility in the matter, and instead responds with harsh words to me and the league. This is unfair for us. In our internal discussions, we wanted to avoid people from countries who had VISA problems entering the US because those players are "high risk" for us (I.E. what happens if they qualify but can't come to the finals?), this is also why we only considered ONE player (BRAT_OK) from RoX, and none of their other players... the RoX manager didn't even submit applications for the other ones because he knew they didn't have and couldn't guarantee VISAS. We did research on various countries, and knew that Romania doesn't have a VISA waiver program with the US, and that it would be difficult for a Romanian to get a VISA, which is why we didn't have NightEnD on our list, and which was why he was on our backup list. So again, people should be aware that in life, there are always two parties and both hold responsibility. So u picked the 50 players and said x is not invited becouse y is not invited becouse NightEnD is not invited becouse he has no visa . How could u know that i dont have visa if u didnt even bother t to ask me ? Pls cut the crap
Nightend: I don't know you or Xeris personally, but let it go.
Next season, man; next season. Complaining now isn't going to get you any closer to what you want at this point.
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Poor Dimaga. At least he'll be in season 2 hopefully.
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I'm sad to see that 3 of my top 5 favorite players did not get spots.
I hope they use this as motivational fuel and try to prove NASL wrong with great tournament results, so that they'll never be "ignored" again.
ThorZain has a good start already by beating FD in TSL.
Other than that I support NASL 100% and understand that it's impossible to make everyone happy with so many great candidates. Was hoping it wouldn't be on the expense of my favorites, but there you go.
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On March 30 2011 07:11 nvs. wrote:Show nested quote +Demuslim (probably?) couldn't guarantee he'd be able to play as much as anyone The problem I see with that is "probably." It seems they never contacted him directly and just based their judgement of his health on his application vod. =/
But the NASL is not solely responsible to sort that out though. If I was applying for a gig and there was something that may sway the decision one way or another, it's also my responsibility to clarify it and make sure it was sorted so it wouldn't ruin my chances. In nightend's case though it's a bit more dodgy, but still if you have to go to the US if you progress and you also have to guarantee that you can get there, it shouldn't be that big of a surprise that you need a visa. Still, NASL should have handled that one a lot better.
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Canada211 Posts
I think the NASL was most certainly not going to invite the 4 koreans of the final day of invites until they realized they could be beaten (TSL/WC) and decided they would then invite them. Seems odd that they'd wait for the last day and invite other, lesser koreans along the way.
Seems like this whole "league" is decided on a whim as they go.
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you all realize that there are no more applications and what not... the only way that Dimaga, DeMusliM, Minigun, etc... will get into an NASL is if they place top 8 in one of their 1028 man tournaments right.
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I really like what Players were picked, think they did a good job!!
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On March 30 2011 07:23 TheBanana wrote:
I'm sad to see that 3 of my top 5 favorite players did not get spots.
I hope they use this as motivational fuel and try to prove NASL wrong with great tournament results, so that they'll never be "ignored" again.
ThorZain has a good start already by beating FD in TSL.
Other than that I support NASL 100% and understand that it's impossible to make everyone happy with so many great candidates. Was hoping it wouldn't be on the expense of my favorites, but there you go.
I agree with that 100%. If you weren't picked it should motivate you to do better, prove them wrong, etc etc. Instead of just bitching about why you weren't picked. That gets you no where.
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On March 30 2011 07:20 Defacer wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 07:16 NightEnD wrote:On March 30 2011 07:06 Xeris wrote:On March 30 2011 06:57 Bean54 wrote:
Xeris, you say you didnt accept NightEnD because he didn't already have a VISA. Did you even let the players know this was a requirement before or during the application process? Based on what it sounds like, you didn't. If not having a passport is a legitimate concern and is cause for disqualification you should have let NightEnD and all players know that BEFOREHAND so they could actually obtain one or fail to. Then you'd have a valid reason for disqualifying them. Sounds like you disqualified him for something that could easily have been remedied if you had let him know ahead of time. I didn't specifically tell the players, however, when I was approached by BRAT_OK's manager (from RoX), about the NASL, he actually provided me with BRAT's B1/2 VISA number that we verified. White-Ra has demonstrated his ability to get into the US before (I met him at MLG DC and Blizzcon, so I'm well aware he could get here). While it is true, I could have been clearer I guess, the ultimate burden of responsibility must be shared by both organizers and players. We are not here to hand-hold, and this is a two-way street. The fact that someone like BRAT's manager made sure to provide me that information (the contract specifically says that you need to *guarantee* your ability to be in the US for the final) in order to alleviate any concern shows that: a) they understood the implications of playing in the league, and b) they cared enough about being a part of it to go the extra mile. NightEnD didn't do this, nor did his manager. I obviously take some responsibility for not explicitly stating it, but neither him or his manager has taken any responsibility in the matter, and instead responds with harsh words to me and the league. This is unfair for us. In our internal discussions, we wanted to avoid people from countries who had VISA problems entering the US because those players are "high risk" for us (I.E. what happens if they qualify but can't come to the finals?), this is also why we only considered ONE player (BRAT_OK) from RoX, and none of their other players... the RoX manager didn't even submit applications for the other ones because he knew they didn't have and couldn't guarantee VISAS. We did research on various countries, and knew that Romania doesn't have a VISA waiver program with the US, and that it would be difficult for a Romanian to get a VISA, which is why we didn't have NightEnD on our list, and which was why he was on our backup list. So again, people should be aware that in life, there are always two parties and both hold responsibility. So u picked the 50 players and said x is not invited becouse y is not invited becouse NightEnD is not invited becouse he has no visa . How could u know that i dont have visa if u didnt even bother t to ask me ? Pls cut the crap Nightend: I don't know you or Xeris personally, but let it go. Next season, man; next season. Complaining now isn't going to get you any closer to what you want at this point.
after how much i ''cryed' now mark my words i will not be invited in 2nd season or in 3 they will find an excuse like this if not a bigger one .
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*Sigh*
So far I am worried about NASL, they have been trying to present a professional front, but every time I see something about them they have been less than professional. I am not going to complain about who should/shouldn't have been picked but just mention the WAY they were picked. As much as we all like these "fan favorites" they might not be the best out there, and even in your intro video you say you want the "best players in the world" then go on to admit you picked this or that person because people liked them. Your decision making process just seemed so arbitrary.
Another thing to look at is how hurried you were, it shows VERY poor planning IMO to give people/teams that little time to apply. Was there even enough time for Nightend to get a visa if you had made that a requirement up front? I don't think there was. These are things you should have thought of but didn't, and reflect very poorly on NASL.
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Great list of players and I'm excited to see this get rolling. We could argue all day about who deserves to be and who was left out but at the end of the day these are the people we know were going to see. If you didn't make the cut, play hard in smaller tournaments and get some results on your scorecard and apply again for next season.
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On March 30 2011 07:26 NightEnD wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 07:20 Defacer wrote:On March 30 2011 07:16 NightEnD wrote:On March 30 2011 07:06 Xeris wrote:On March 30 2011 06:57 Bean54 wrote:
Xeris, you say you didnt accept NightEnD because he didn't already have a VISA. Did you even let the players know this was a requirement before or during the application process? Based on what it sounds like, you didn't. If not having a passport is a legitimate concern and is cause for disqualification you should have let NightEnD and all players know that BEFOREHAND so they could actually obtain one or fail to. Then you'd have a valid reason for disqualifying them. Sounds like you disqualified him for something that could easily have been remedied if you had let him know ahead of time. I didn't specifically tell the players, however, when I was approached by BRAT_OK's manager (from RoX), about the NASL, he actually provided me with BRAT's B1/2 VISA number that we verified. White-Ra has demonstrated his ability to get into the US before (I met him at MLG DC and Blizzcon, so I'm well aware he could get here). While it is true, I could have been clearer I guess, the ultimate burden of responsibility must be shared by both organizers and players. We are not here to hand-hold, and this is a two-way street. The fact that someone like BRAT's manager made sure to provide me that information (the contract specifically says that you need to *guarantee* your ability to be in the US for the final) in order to alleviate any concern shows that: a) they understood the implications of playing in the league, and b) they cared enough about being a part of it to go the extra mile. NightEnD didn't do this, nor did his manager. I obviously take some responsibility for not explicitly stating it, but neither him or his manager has taken any responsibility in the matter, and instead responds with harsh words to me and the league. This is unfair for us. In our internal discussions, we wanted to avoid people from countries who had VISA problems entering the US because those players are "high risk" for us (I.E. what happens if they qualify but can't come to the finals?), this is also why we only considered ONE player (BRAT_OK) from RoX, and none of their other players... the RoX manager didn't even submit applications for the other ones because he knew they didn't have and couldn't guarantee VISAS. We did research on various countries, and knew that Romania doesn't have a VISA waiver program with the US, and that it would be difficult for a Romanian to get a VISA, which is why we didn't have NightEnD on our list, and which was why he was on our backup list. So again, people should be aware that in life, there are always two parties and both hold responsibility. So u picked the 50 players and said x is not invited becouse y is not invited becouse NightEnD is not invited becouse he has no visa . How could u know that i dont have visa if u didnt even bother t to ask me ? Pls cut the crap Nightend: I don't know you or Xeris personally, but let it go. Next season, man; next season. Complaining now isn't going to get you any closer to what you want at this point. after how much i ''cryed' now mark my words i will not be invited in 2nd season or in 3 they will find an excuse like this if not a bigger one .
There will be no invites for season two, it's pure qualification turnys.
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On March 30 2011 07:24 Phaint wrote:
I think the NASL was most certainly not going to invite the 4 koreans of the final day of invites until they realized they could be beaten (TSL/WC) and decided they would then invite them. Seems odd that they'd wait for the last day and invite other, lesser koreans along the way.
Seems like this whole "league" is decided on a whim as they go.
I'm pretty sure they didn't make the names up on the fly but had all 50 players decided from the beginning.
Otherwise Xeris' explanation about player performances would be pretty pretty flawed anyway due to Thorzains TSL performance for example, or he wouldn't have written that Cruncher validated their decision by beating IdrA.
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On March 30 2011 07:24 Insanious wrote:
you all realize that there are no more applications and what not... the only way that Dimaga, DeMusliM, Minigun, etc... will get into an NASL is if they place top 8 in one of their 1028 man tournaments right.
Its basically the same difficulty as the Code A qualifiers. You have to win 7 rounds to get into the top 8 (Code A qualifiers is 5 rounds). Only thing I didn't like was that it was single elimination. Bo3 is so much less volatile.
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On March 30 2011 07:14 Lz wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 07:06 Zlasher wrote:On March 30 2011 06:09 Lz wrote:On March 30 2011 05:59 abominable wrote:
after watching LzGamer stream for the last 3 hours... wtf happened?
lol... he's better than at least half of the US players in the tournament, and he wasn't even important enough to mention in the "why players weren't invited" section. lol thats how I feel.. atlest a reason why i was not "mentioned" in the section.. I guess im not Good enough for the league.. for laugh's go look at my recent games list EGLzGaMeR 327 .. lol its funny Im obviously sad i did not even get apparently thought about during this process.. but I will still watch and support the NASL! and of course cheer on my teammates ~ EG FIGHTING Lz you know I love you and you're one of my favorite players, but results in clan leagues and clan matches, showmatches, and tournaments all went against you the past few months, it's really hard to argue someone in just based on ladder games (although lets be honest, they seemed to have done that for 3-5 players on the list). Even Strifecro who's on your team, has better results all over and he wasn't invited, as with Demuslim. haha... It's ok.. I just wanted to know the real reason.. if its "skill level" then thats fine they can have there opinion... Just wanted to know.
I mean it is pretty evident they chose some people purely based on a video or a name, as there are players invited that have shown to do not much either, I'm just saying that a pretty clear process was originally intended to invite the best but through the firestorm they really dropped the ball on several occasions.
Only thing people like You, Strife, Demu, Mini, Thorzain, Kas, Nightend, etc. can do is fight through that tournament, but you read a post like Nightends and how he's fought through brackets to make it into tournaments all his career and even then gets denied after having to work harder than 60% of those invited. It's a stupidly unfortunate situation.
On March 30 2011 07:18 LooseMoose wrote:
NightEnD... obviously many people feel for your situation, but if the contract stated that you had to have proof of your ability to get into the US then the responsibility was yours. Xeris was quite clear on this.
Stop it dude there is no contract originally. The "rules" stated that you had to be in the US if you made it a certian distance, the NASL runners, who are obviously quite busy, didn't even bother to go out of THEIR way to contact players saying please show us proof of visa, so decision makers, which I presume to be Xeris, OCsurfer, among others, made the ASSUMPTION to leave out a top level player because they didnt' come to him, becuase BRAT_OK did (even though we KNOW that in the past BRAT OK has had extreme issues with Visa's, so it was obvious to HIM to show the NASL, even though it is less obvious for a player like Thorzain or Nightend who both don't run into visa issues and would assume that it is knowledge that they can get them).
I'm not buying the excuse that it is a two way street and that we should blame Praetoriani over the NASL. The NASL should have either EXPLICITLY explained, once they received brat ok's visa, that all other foreigners should do the same, instead they made the assumption that they couldn't and left players out because it was the less time-consuming thing to do as it is pretty evident they ARE busy running a star league as a small organization of a few people.
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On March 30 2011 07:26 NightEnD wrote:Show nested quote +On March 30 2011 07:20 Defacer wrote:On March 30 2011 07:16 NightEnD wrote:On March 30 2011 07:06 Xeris wrote:On March 30 2011 06:57 Bean54 wrote:
Xeris, you say you didnt accept NightEnD because he didn't already have a VISA. Did you even let the players know this was a requirement before or during the application process? Based on what it sounds like, you didn't. If not having a passport is a legitimate concern and is cause for disqualification you should have let NightEnD and all players know that BEFOREHAND so they could actually obtain one or fail to. Then you'd have a valid reason for disqualifying them. Sounds like you disqualified him for something that could easily have been remedied if you had let him know ahead of time. I didn't specifically tell the players, however, when I was approached by BRAT_OK's manager (from RoX), about the NASL, he actually provided me with BRAT's B1/2 VISA number that we verified. White-Ra has demonstrated his ability to get into the US before (I met him at MLG DC and Blizzcon, so I'm well aware he could get here). While it is true, I could have been clearer I guess, the ultimate burden of responsibility must be shared by both organizers and players. We are not here to hand-hold, and this is a two-way street. The fact that someone like BRAT's manager made sure to provide me that information (the contract specifically says that you need to *guarantee* your ability to be in the US for the final) in order to alleviate any concern shows that: a) they understood the implications of playing in the league, and b) they cared enough about being a part of it to go the extra mile. NightEnD didn't do this, nor did his manager. I obviously take some responsibility for not explicitly stating it, but neither him or his manager has taken any responsibility in the matter, and instead responds with harsh words to me and the league. This is unfair for us. In our internal discussions, we wanted to avoid people from countries who had VISA problems entering the US because those players are "high risk" for us (I.E. what happens if they qualify but can't come to the finals?), this is also why we only considered ONE player (BRAT_OK) from RoX, and none of their other players... the RoX manager didn't even submit applications for the other ones because he knew they didn't have and couldn't guarantee VISAS. We did research on various countries, and knew that Romania doesn't have a VISA waiver program with the US, and that it would be difficult for a Romanian to get a VISA, which is why we didn't have NightEnD on our list, and which was why he was on our backup list. So again, people should be aware that in life, there are always two parties and both hold responsibility. So u picked the 50 players and said x is not invited becouse y is not invited becouse NightEnD is not invited becouse he has no visa . How could u know that i dont have visa if u didnt even bother t to ask me ? Pls cut the crap Nightend: I don't know you or Xeris personally, but let it go. Next season, man; next season. Complaining now isn't going to get you any closer to what you want at this point. after how much i ''cryed' now mark my words i will not be invited in 2nd season or in 3 they will find an excuse like this if not a bigger one .
place top 8 in one of their 1028 tournaments and you get to play in the NASL season 2... there are no more invites. So as long as you place well in one of the open NASL tournaments you get to play in the next season.
So go and SHOW THEM how good you are, and that you deserve a seat.
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EPT
