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On November 23 2010 16:12 Stoned wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2010 16:06 Liquid`Ret wrote:
Haypro was doing insanely well in practice... I think nerves combined with the almost impossible to scout builds used by this terran got the best of him....its extremely easy to die to these kind of timing builds, that's starcraft 2 for you, it all happens a lot faster than it did in sc1 and you need almost psyhic abilities to consistently win in this game..,,and that's why you see so many upsets. thats good to hear but people on here make it sound like these builds would be SOOO easy to counter when in a professional standpoint they really are extremely hard to prepare for let alone mount the proper defense upon your reaction of seeing it coming
well as a professional sc player, haypro should have easily countered the all-in in the first game by simply scouting better and not going blindly 14-hatch in such a map (as a progamer, he should know what the current metagame is like). for the second game though, i agree with you.
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On November 23 2010 16:14 Serpico wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2010 16:12 HolyArrow wrote:On November 23 2010 16:09 lariat wrote:
BitbyBit you better sleep with one eye open tonight because I'm going over there to gouge out your eyes and break both your wrists so you may never play SC2 again What the **** is up with idiotic posts like this? You give the non-Korean scene a bad name. Just shows how passionate some people are 
If by passionate you mean retarded, yes.
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On November 23 2010 16:15 VikingKong wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2010 16:13 Secret05 wrote:On November 23 2010 16:12 kwkwookw wrote:On November 23 2010 16:11 VikingKong wrote:On November 23 2010 16:10 Secret05 wrote:
i wish zergs could have more options for crazy build orders like terrans... zergs have to constantly worry about what is the terran gona do? but it doesnt seem like terrans ever really have to constantly worry about what zerg is gona do That's the nature of zerg. They're almost purely reactionary and passive, that's why Kyrix is so famous for his aggressive style. i agree and i think the different characteristics of each of the three races is what makes sc interesting and fun imo ya for sure, but it just seems like zerg doesn't have near the options terran and protoss have They're not supposed to. That's what asymmetrical balance means. Terran and Protoss can't macro like Zerg, but Zerg can pretty much only macro.
good point
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On November 23 2010 16:15 kojinshugi wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2010 16:14 Serpico wrote:On November 23 2010 16:12 HolyArrow wrote:On November 23 2010 16:09 lariat wrote:
BitbyBit you better sleep with one eye open tonight because I'm going over there to gouge out your eyes and break both your wrists so you may never play SC2 again What the **** is up with idiotic posts like this? You give the non-Korean scene a bad name. Just shows how passionate some people are If by passionate you mean retarded, yes.
I am actually mentally retarded. 
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Someone needs to teach HayprO how to scout, that was just sad. Position your overlord so you can see when he moves out, position another one near the rocks. Put a fucking zergling outside the dudes ramp. Control the watch towers because speedlings are good at that.
Seriously, what the hell. Nerves need to stop affecting good players.
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On November 23 2010 16:16 lariat wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2010 16:15 kojinshugi wrote:On November 23 2010 16:14 Serpico wrote:On November 23 2010 16:12 HolyArrow wrote:On November 23 2010 16:09 lariat wrote:
BitbyBit you better sleep with one eye open tonight because I'm going over there to gouge out your eyes and break both your wrists so you may never play SC2 again What the **** is up with idiotic posts like this? You give the non-Korean scene a bad name. Just shows how passionate some people are If by passionate you mean retarded, yes. I am actually mentally retarded.
You should get that looked at then.
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On November 23 2010 16:09 Fayth wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2010 16:06 Liquid`Ret wrote:
Haypro was doing insanely well in practice... I think nerves combined with the almost impossible to scout builds used by this terran got the best of him....its extremely easy to die to these kind of timing builds, that's starcraft 2 for you, it all happens a lot faster than it did in sc1 and you need almost psyhic abilities to consistently win in this game..,,and that's why you see so many upsets. hence why I was saying earlier in another thread people have no idea about the variance in this game compared to broodwar
thats true but when you 14hatch as zerg, EVERY korean terran is responding in the same way. to 14hatch, see 2 raxes and then just build a crawler and 8 lings and drone hard.
sure you cant scout it, but every terran has done it, u see the 2 rax... you gotta assume surely
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On November 23 2010 16:07 blackh3d wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2010 16:00 imPERSONater wrote:On November 23 2010 15:58 Liveon wrote:
How could someone like that qualify while InControl, HuK and Tester couldn't? So bad... That's a naive comment to say the least. Haypro is a phenomenal player that was caught out of his element. In terms of raw skill, he is probably one of the best foreigners around. No offence but your counter-comment sir, is naive as well. If you claim that Haypro is a 'phenomenal player', I would appreciate you back it up with evidence / proof claiming he is of such standard. From what we saw today (and I'm assuming many ppl have not seen Haypro's play much), wouldn t you agree that he does not fit the bill of a 'phenomenal player'? In my opinion, Haypro has much to improve on. He may possess the mechanics to make him a good player but I personally believe he needs to improve his gameplay sense, to be able to counteract what he's being faced with.
Whats wrong with you people?? Stop shitting up threads when you don't know what you are talking about.
MAN it's HayprO!!!!! He has probably been playing SC longer than you can hold a Mouse sheeeshh....
http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/HayprO
edit: spell-check
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On November 23 2010 16:13 TheDougler wrote:
Havn't heard a response yet so I'm just gonna throw it out there again, sorry if this is kinda doushy but I'm a bit of a noob and REALLY want to hear everybody's input on this thought of mine:
I'm not making a claim about balance, but I think due to the current metagame Terran WILL win this season of the GSL. Not because the 2 rax is unstoppable, but because right now if you're terran you can make them play your game for the first ten minutes of the game. You can put up two barracks so they are forced to put up a baneling nest. They put up a baneling nest so they're gonna be a little slower on their lair. They're slower on their lair so you can get some solid kills with a cloaked banshee. You can diminsh their income with the banshees so they'll need to spend more larva on drones to replenish. They're spending more larva on drones which means they have a smaller army than you therefore you can win.
My logic could be WAY off here, but that's the way Tasteosis seems to be saying these games will play out and it looks like that's what's been happening. I'd very much appreciate your guy's thoughts on this.
based on what artosis has been saying, the build is based on a scan timing. If he scans all out defense with banelings and no drone production, he'll just sit back and expand (or teching banshees seem to be in vogue). if he scouts any drone production whatsoever and a lack of defense, he'll just go kill the zerg
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On November 23 2010 16:06 Liquid`Ret wrote:
Haypro was doing insanely well in practice... I think nerves combined with the almost impossible to scout builds used by this terran got the best of him....its extremely easy to die to these kind of timing builds, that's starcraft 2 for you, it all happens a lot faster than it did in sc1 and you need almost psyhic abilities to consistently win in this game..,,and that's why you see so many upsets.
Don't upset us, we've been upset too many times this season. :[
Be the first to show everyone that SCV + rine pushes AREN'T invincible vs. hatch first.
Ret hwaiting!
Let's see some gosu spinecrawler defense -> offensive spinecrawlerss
RAWRRRR
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On November 23 2010 16:15 kwkwookw wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2010 16:12 Stoned wrote:On November 23 2010 16:06 Liquid`Ret wrote:
Haypro was doing insanely well in practice... I think nerves combined with the almost impossible to scout builds used by this terran got the best of him....its extremely easy to die to these kind of timing builds, that's starcraft 2 for you, it all happens a lot faster than it did in sc1 and you need almost psyhic abilities to consistently win in this game..,,and that's why you see so many upsets. thats good to hear but people on here make it sound like these builds would be SOOO easy to counter when in a professional standpoint they really are extremely hard to prepare for let alone mount the proper defense upon your reaction of seeing it coming well as a professional sc player, haypro should have easily countered the all-in in the first game by simply scouting better and not going blindly 14-hatch in such a map (as a progamer, he should know what the current metagame is like). for the second game though, i agree with you.
you would think that just scouting would work. and you would also think from watching all the other tvz's he'd know. but its so easy to fake as we've seen.
i would love to see a blind baneling nest with speedlings after a 14/15 hatch gas and then spawning pool
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I think this GSL bracket should have been organized so there was zero TvZ in the first round to weed out all the jerks with solid marine/scv micro who are weak in other areas
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On November 23 2010 16:17 Ojahh wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2010 16:07 blackh3d wrote:On November 23 2010 16:00 imPERSONater wrote:On November 23 2010 15:58 Liveon wrote:
How could someone like that qualify while InControl, HuK and Tester couldn't? So bad... That's a naive comment to say the least. Haypro is a phenomenal player that was caught out of his element. In terms of raw skill, he is probably one of the best foreigners around. No offence but your counter-comment sir, is naive as well. If you claim that Haypro is a 'phenomenal player', I would appreciate you back it up with evidence / proof claiming he is of such standard. From what we saw today (and I'm assuming many ppl have not seen Haypro's play much), wouldn t you agree that he does not fit the bill of a 'phenomenal player'? In my opinion, Haypro has much to improve on. He may possess the mechanics to make him a good player but I personally believe he needs to improve his gameplay sense, to be able to counteract what he's being faced with. whats wrong with you people?? stops hitting up threads when you don't know what you are talking about. MAN it's HayprO!!!!! he hes probaly playing SC longer than you can hold a Mouse shhehh.... http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft/HayprO
What's the Oblivion hack and how did he unintentionally use it?
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On November 23 2010 16:16 Subversion wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2010 16:09 Fayth wrote:On November 23 2010 16:06 Liquid`Ret wrote:
Haypro was doing insanely well in practice... I think nerves combined with the almost impossible to scout builds used by this terran got the best of him....its extremely easy to die to these kind of timing builds, that's starcraft 2 for you, it all happens a lot faster than it did in sc1 and you need almost psyhic abilities to consistently win in this game..,,and that's why you see so many upsets. hence why I was saying earlier in another thread people have no idea about the variance in this game compared to broodwar thats true but when you 14hatch as zerg, EVERY korean terran is responding in the same way. to 14hatch, see 2 raxes and then just build a crawler and 8 lings and drone hard. sure you cant scout it, but every terran has done it, u see the 2 rax... you gotta assume surely
Why not 3 crawlers and an extra queen? No way in hell is he getting through there, especially if you can squeeze in a transfuse. Slow lings are terrible and easily tanked by the SCVs.
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haypro
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On November 23 2010 16:12 Stoned wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2010 16:06 Liquid`Ret wrote:
Haypro was doing insanely well in practice... I think nerves combined with the almost impossible to scout builds used by this terran got the best of him....its extremely easy to die to these kind of timing builds, that's starcraft 2 for you, it all happens a lot faster than it did in sc1 and you need almost psyhic abilities to consistently win in this game..,,and that's why you see so many upsets. thats good to hear but people on here make it sound like these builds would be SOOO easy to counter when in a professional standpoint they really are extremely hard to prepare for let alone mount the proper defense upon your reaction of seeing it coming
Why is everyone making ridiculous excuses for Haypro? If the sides were switched and Haypro was the Terran here, people would just be commenting on how brilliant his timing was. Haypro lost and he was fully capable of winning. It was not from any inability for Zerg to scout or any of that nonsense. Is that a joke? He SAW the Banshee coming, and it's not like Raven was some cheesey unit. He simply didn't defend at all, the very definition of greedy econ hungry Zergs.
Also, this wasn't even an upset. Based on what previous matchups was Haypro supposed to be favored over a guy no one knew anything about?
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Netherlands4514 Posts
Hatch first in game 1 worked off amazingly well. He got it up. How would pool first be better?
Also it's easy to judge play when you can see the whole map. As Zerg you have a million things to 'worry' about when terran is staying on 1 base. The strategies performed by this terran are just a fraction of the many different things terran can throw at you and almost all of them will hurt you bad unless you are prepared for it.
You are constantly making choices...and every choice you make solidifies your position against what you THINK is coming..but leaves you wide open if you assessed the situation wrongly. You have to stay economically healthy while being able to defend...this is a very thin line you are balancing on...you overcommit to defense, you die if terran made a command center and doesnt send all his scvs towards your base. So it goes wrong often. I think Hayder just didn't scout well enough. I think he was very nervous, and the terran strategies were very hard to predict (in game 1 hayder just barely missed the attack with his scouting ling, although he should have had a ling infront of the terran base at all times - I think this is just nerves) and well executed. GG's.
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On November 23 2010 16:18 Ocedic wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2010 16:12 Stoned wrote:On November 23 2010 16:06 Liquid`Ret wrote:
Haypro was doing insanely well in practice... I think nerves combined with the almost impossible to scout builds used by this terran got the best of him....its extremely easy to die to these kind of timing builds, that's starcraft 2 for you, it all happens a lot faster than it did in sc1 and you need almost psyhic abilities to consistently win in this game..,,and that's why you see so many upsets. thats good to hear but people on here make it sound like these builds would be SOOO easy to counter when in a professional standpoint they really are extremely hard to prepare for let alone mount the proper defense upon your reaction of seeing it coming Why is everyone making ridiculous excuses for Haypro? If the sides were switched and Haypro was the Terran here, people would just be commenting on how brilliant his timing was. Haypro lost and he was fully capable of winning. It was not from any inability for Zerg to scout or any of that nonsense. Is that a joke? He SAW the Banshee coming, and it's not like Raven was some cheesey unit. He simply didn't defend at all, the very definition of greedy econ hungry Zergs. Also, this wasn't even an upset. Based on what previous matchups was Haypro supposed to be favored over a guy no one knew anything about?
because we love haypro <3 
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ah shit, Northkorea jsut fired grenades onto South korean territory, an "artillery fight" has been happening on the Isle of "Yeonpyeong" Army has been set to highest alert...
really hope there no bigger shit brewing there, for the sake of the people, and this lovely SC2 tourney
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On November 23 2010 16:15 kwkwookw wrote:Show nested quote +On November 23 2010 16:12 Stoned wrote:On November 23 2010 16:06 Liquid`Ret wrote:
Haypro was doing insanely well in practice... I think nerves combined with the almost impossible to scout builds used by this terran got the best of him....its extremely easy to die to these kind of timing builds, that's starcraft 2 for you, it all happens a lot faster than it did in sc1 and you need almost psyhic abilities to consistently win in this game..,,and that's why you see so many upsets. thats good to hear but people on here make it sound like these builds would be SOOO easy to counter when in a professional standpoint they really are extremely hard to prepare for let alone mount the proper defense upon your reaction of seeing it coming well as a professional sc player, haypro should have easily countered the all-in in the first game by simply scouting better and not going blindly 14-hatch in such a map (as a progamer, he should know what the current metagame is like). for the second game though, i agree with you.
even in game 1 if he hadnt hatched first we will never know how that would have turned out because terran was trying to force lings by putting really early pressure along with going up to 4 rax was going to have more marines then most terrans ive seen
and yes game 2 was a completely whack build no one could have prepared for
also i dont play z i like watching gsl tho
im speaking from gsl experience
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EPT
