• Log InLog In
  • Register
Liquid`
Team Liquid Liquipedia
EDT 12:35
CEST 18:35
KST 01:35
  • Home
  • Forum
  • Calendar
  • Streams
  • Liquipedia
  • Features
  • Store
  • EPT
  • TL+
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Smash
  • Heroes
  • Counter-Strike
  • Overwatch
  • Liquibet
  • Fantasy StarCraft
  • TLPD
  • StarCraft 2
  • Brood War
  • Blogs
Forum Sidebar
Events/Features
News
Featured News
[ASL22] Ro4 Preview: Mirror Mirror6[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: Within Reach5[ASL22] Ro8 Preview: In A Tizzy11[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Holy Diver5[ASL22] Ro16 Preview: Rough Waters10
Community News
Weekly Cups (October 5-11): Farewell to 5.0.162Rollback Netcode in Brood War995.0.17 Patch Notes - October 7, 202624Weekly Cups Results (Sep 28-Oct 4)0SC4ALL: II SC2 Complete Invited Player Lineup10
StarCraft 2
General
How do you feel about the mass reverts in the 5.0.17 PTR? SCII needs to put more weight on strategy and tact Server Blocker 5.0.17 Patch Notes - October 7, 2026 ESL Pro Tour for SC2 discontinued
Tourneys
$3,500 WardiTV Not-Summer Championship Stellar Fest TWO the Moon (Dec 16-20) ISSL (IntoTheTV x SOOP SC2 League): Premier RSL 2026 Offline Finals LCQ Sign-Ups ScienceCraft (October 24-25) - Live Event
Strategy
[H] ZvP Mid-Late Game: Stalkers Collossi HT
Custom Maps
[G] How to playtest arcade maps [A] Nemrods 1/4 players [M] (2) Sweltering Sands [M] (2) Frigid Storage
External Content
The PondCast: SC2 News & Results Mutation # 547 Temple Of Terror Mutation # 546 Catch the Train Mutation # 545 And Drops and Rifts
Brood War
General
Bot on ladder BW General Discussion Sagi.gg Launcher Released Rollback Netcode in Brood War ASL22 General Discussion
Tourneys
ASL 22 Finals [Women's StarCraft] MonstarZ vs Dreams 2026-10-15 [Megathread] Daily Proleagues [ASL22] Semifinal B
Strategy
Cliff Jump Revisited (1 in a 1000 strategy) Simple Questions, Simple Answers Replay Review Process - What do you do?
Other Games
General Games
Nintendo Switch Thread Dawn of War IV Stormgate/Frost Giant Megathread General RTS Discussion Thread Warcraft III: The Frozen Throne
Dota 2
Dota 2 Champions League Season 3 Begins April 25!
League of Legends
[TL LoL EUW IHs] Teemo shall perish
Heroes of the Storm
Heroes of the Storm 2.0
Hearthstone
Deck construction bug
TL Mafia
TL Mafia Community Thread
Community
General
US Politics Mega-thread Things Aren’t Peaceful in Palestine Artificial Intelligence Thread Canadian Politics Mega-thread Russo-Ukrainian War Thread
Fan Clubs
Serral Fan Club
Media & Entertainment
[Manga] One Piece Movie Discussion! Diablo Animated Series on Netflix
Sports
Football (Soccer) Thread TeamLiquid Health and Fitness Initiative For 2023 MLB/Baseball 2023
World Cup 2022
Tech Support
Computer Build, Upgrade & Buying Resource Thread
TL Community
Recent Gifted Posts
Blogs
The Link Between Gaming and …
TrAiDoS
[ASL22] Ro4 Day1 Ticket Giv…
bITt.mAN
38 yo Retired SWE loo…
PurE)Rabbit-SF
Can Bots Beat Pros?? Starcr…
namkraft
[meme] I finally understa…
LUCKY_NOOB
Customize Sidebar...

Website Feedback

Closed Threads



Active: 8973 users

[G] TheCore - Advanced Keyboard Layout - Page 156

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
Post a Reply
Prev 1 154 155 156 157 158 432 Next
fengshaun
Profile Joined April 2012
149 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-25 03:52:55
March 25 2013 03:50 GMT
#3101
Why not PO once? so, if you're moving your army, it's gonna be PO<look down><army CG>!

EDIT: oh, now I get it. spaceboy said to spam Hatch>selec>hatch>select to know exactly when larvae pop. I thought as long you check it every few seconds, you're fine.
Ninjury_J
Profile Joined August 2012
Canada408 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-25 04:17:16
March 25 2013 04:07 GMT
#3102
^Yeah, that sounds good to me. (check every two secondsish)

Also, an inject is 40 seconds. So let's say my inject pops and I exhaust all my larva. The next free larva will be in 15 seconds. If I make this an overlord, it will pop exactly when the inject does. Assuming that I am not supply blocked (which is, I think, OK as long as I made sufficient overlords in the first 15 seconds after an inject) then I will be able to spend one more larva per hatch at the 30 second mark of the previous inject cycle. Because of energy regen, counting to 10 in real time will land you pretty much on the nose at 40 seconds.

@ t=0: inject, make units
@ t=16-18: each hatch can produce one OL
@ t= 31-33: one more larva per hatch. Spend on units, OL or save
count to ten
@ t= 40: inject (and overlords) pop, restart.

Basically one can measure how far one is from the next inject by paying attention to how many natural larva have generated since the previous inject.
“The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting."- Sun Tzu
JDub
Profile Joined December 2010
United States976 Posts
March 25 2013 04:11 GMT
#3103
I also am a proponent of the check your hatches, if you have a lot of larva that means an inject just popped way of injecting. You should be building stuff with your larvae constantly all game, you should be able to notice when you get an additional 12+ larva (depending on # of hatches) larva all at once. When it is in the early game and the hatches aren't in sync yet (eventually all hatches will end up in sync b/c your injects won't be perfect), I just use camera locations and look at each hatch, and inject them all manually.
Ninjury_J
Profile Joined August 2012
Canada408 Posts
March 25 2013 04:20 GMT
#3104
@JDub,

Do you think it is beneficial to wait on an inject in order to sync them? ex: Going pool, hatch, queen, second queen around 21; they won't be in sync. Is it worth the 10+ second wait to sync them?
“The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting."- Sun Tzu
sanddbox_sc2
Profile Joined October 2011
United States173 Posts
March 25 2013 04:28 GMT
#3105
On March 25 2013 13:20 Ninjury_J wrote:
@JDub,

Do you think it is beneficial to wait on an inject in order to sync them? ex: Going pool, hatch, queen, second queen around 21; they won't be in sync. Is it worth the 10+ second wait to sync them?


Don't waste any potential larva trying to line them up; if your build lines them up, that's great, but don't intentionally waste an inject. Your queens will sync up over time, so being out of sync in the early game is not a big issue.
JDub
Profile Joined December 2010
United States976 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-25 04:29:42
March 25 2013 04:29 GMT
#3106
On March 25 2013 13:20 Ninjury_J wrote:
@JDub,

Do you think it is beneficial to wait on an inject in order to sync them? ex: Going pool, hatch, queen, second queen around 21; they won't be in sync. Is it worth the 10+ second wait to sync them?

No, I really don't. Especially in the early game, you want your injects + larva usage to be as optimal as possible. Also at that point in the game you don't have all that much to do anyways, besides scout with a couple lings / move some overlords around / make drones, so it's not like it should be all too hard to keep tabs on your two hatcheries. Or in ZvP when you open 3 hatch, you need to be keeping tabs on your 3 hatches anyway to make sure you split up your workers optimally, so I don't think it's unreasonable to expect people to keep switching their camera between their first 3 hatches for the first ~8 or so minutes, after which they will probably have missed those ~10-25 seconds of inject time and can have their hatches in sync again.

Then in late game when you are stockpiling larvae (when the "do I have lots of larva? time to inject" method stops working), I don't think it's particularly important (unless you are going super ling-heavy or something) to have perfect or near-perfect injects. Even professional Zerg players will let their queens max out on energy in the late game, which can even be more beneficial than having perfect injects because you can use your 4-5 queens to transfuse ultras/brood lords/etc.

Edit: sanddbox beat me to the punch and said when took me 2 paragraphs in 2 sentences. Well played.
Ninjury_J
Profile Joined August 2012
Canada408 Posts
March 25 2013 04:39 GMT
#3107
Ha , thanks so much sandbox and JDub.
“The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting."- Sun Tzu
JaKaTaKSc2
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States2787 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-25 06:09:17
March 25 2013 04:49 GMT
#3108
EDIT:

The ultra super mega alpha version of TheCore 1.0 is finished on TheCore Archives

Swim at your own risk, don't go out too far over your head
Commentatorhttps://www.youtube.com/JaKaTaKtv
Ninjury_J
Profile Joined August 2012
Canada408 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-25 04:54:35
March 25 2013 04:51 GMT
#3109
You are a wonderful person.

Edit: it might be mean to edit a message that says "you are a wonderful person". Nevertheless, it seems that every instance of lefty "A" in the Terran layout is missing the associated righty apostrophe.
“The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting."- Sun Tzu
JaKaTaKSc2
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States2787 Posts
March 25 2013 04:59 GMT
#3110
hahahaha, yea, feel free to clean that up if you get the chance, Google Docs does that when you copy paste. It might make the = into ERROR as well
Commentatorhttps://www.youtube.com/JaKaTaKtv
Ninjury_J
Profile Joined August 2012
Canada408 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-25 05:09:09
March 25 2013 05:05 GMT
#3111
Need to go to sleep and write an essay tomorrow morning. I will be free around 11:30-3:30 pst to help. Let me know what I can do .

Edit: Google- one of the world's must resourceful innovators. Explores the edges of engineering, computing, and science. And yet, the greatest spreadsheet technology they have is the good old ctrl c ctrl v. I don't even...
“The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting."- Sun Tzu
JaKaTaKSc2
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States2787 Posts
March 25 2013 05:08 GMT
#3112
I'll be casting on twitch.tv/yegwen at those times... Hopefully I can have the first round of error checking done by tuesday.
Commentatorhttps://www.youtube.com/JaKaTaKtv
Ninjury_J
Profile Joined August 2012
Canada408 Posts
March 25 2013 05:09 GMT
#3113
Cool, I will check it out then. Have a good night.
“The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting."- Sun Tzu
JaKaTaKSc2
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
United States2787 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-25 06:08:43
March 25 2013 06:08 GMT
#3114
The ultra super mega alpha version of TheCore 1.0 is finished on TheCore Archives

Swim at your own risk, don't go out too far over your head
Commentatorhttps://www.youtube.com/JaKaTaKtv
fengshaun
Profile Joined April 2012
149 Posts
March 25 2013 08:46 GMT
#3115
I would say M is easier to press than H. Why make M patrol but H 4th ability/burrow? I would say pressing M is even more natural than /! Oh God, this is not looking good! Also, why J for spawn nydus instead of O?

- build basic/advanced look good.
- Maybe leave H as 4th ability, but make M 3rd. That'll leave / for patrol.
- Evo chambers are often made in 2 per round (double upgrades) and they are more often made now because of the vipers, why have them on / where Shift can't be used to make multiple ones?
Geva
Profile Joined May 2010
Israel16 Posts
March 25 2013 11:19 GMT
#3116
I have some concerns with the changes to hotkeys on the buildings for protoss.
Unlike warping units in, where you can just hold the unit and press, without needing shift, if you want to build multiple things, you have to use shift.
In this setup, you constantly have to shift your thumb from / to shift. say I want to build cannons at my main and then pylons at my natural. I'd go /,*move thumb*, shift ' ' ' ,*move thumb*, /,*move thumb* shift JJJ, while in the old setup, I already have my thumb on shift and my index on building basic, and all that would be moving would be the pinky, once.
Found it difficult to articulate but when I tried to manually do the action it seemed a lot less comfortable.
Why K for gateway and I for assimilator? Not sure I understand that as well...
8 for core, while on paper seems better then the old setup, N/M/H I think are more comfortable just because the pinky is so much more flexible then the ring finger, and when you tilt your keyboard, you stretch your ring out.
Basically this whole new setup puts thumb on / constantly because of skills buildings, instead of being on shift, which is as you said the most used key, which makes a lot of awkward back and forth movement.
Ninjury_J
Profile Joined August 2012
Canada408 Posts
Last Edited: 2013-03-25 12:28:10
March 25 2013 11:35 GMT
#3117
@Feng,

I had some similar reactions as you at first, so allow me try to address some of your concerns. Here is my understanding.

H as ability 4: H may work in combination with some control groups better than M does. Specifically, i think 0 and 9 are uncomfortable to press in combination with M. I think that one of the design philosophies of TheCore is a focus on combinations over individual key presses.

/ as a an ability instead of M and H: for one, it is on the thumb, giving us access to combinations that we did not have before. It is also scored better than any other non-home key. Just because it is not intuitive, does not mean it is worse . When was the last time you used your left thumb to type? If you are a righty, I would guess that you probably never use it. I am confident that the motion of pressing / or Z will became intuitive with some practice.

H and M (haha, does that store exist where you live? It is quite large here) not both being abilities: this allows 4 abilities to be on all different fingers: middle, ring, pinkie and thumb. Further, 7/10 of Zerg cgs are on the index, so one never needs to double key press with the index cgs (at least I don't think so).

Pressing / for evo's: I think this is ok. Can one not just hold down the / button to build multiple?

Nydus worm on J: I think that J is supposed to be the best key along with maybe P. O is not worse by a lot though. Do you think O is better than J (it's definitely possible), or do you have a different reason for Nydus being on O?

@ Geva,

Can you explain why you can't hold down a button to build things, like warpgate? I'm not sure I understand that. I agree with you about HNM all being more accessible than 8 and U, but this will largely depend on your own hand.

Edit: oh, you need to be able to shift que because Protoss. Can't believe I didn't think of that :p

@Jak,

Currently (zrm 1.0) overlords are set to I and roaches are set to /. Would you consider reversing these for egg hot keying?

Also, I know that hatcheries should not overlap too much with select larva. Still, because of the frequency of queens, I think they should be made on a more accessible key. Comma and c are personally less-than-optimal, to put it mildly. In 0.6.3, the first command (burrow) overlapped with the mutalisk. Now it overlaps with the corrupter. I would therefore suggest giving every hatch tech command (except select larva) one more priority.
Burrow on H/H (also nice because burrow-the-ability is on H/H), OVspeed on 5/8, OVsacs on V/M, Queen on T/U and lair on C/comma.
“The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting."- Sun Tzu
Geva
Profile Joined May 2010
Israel16 Posts
March 25 2013 12:36 GMT
#3118
On March 25 2013 20:35 Ninjury_J wrote:
@ Geva,

Can you explain why you can't hold down a button to build things, like warpgate? I'm not sure I understand that. I agree with you about HNM all being more accessible than 8 and U, but this will largely depend on your own hand.

Edit: oh, you need to be able to shift que because Protoss. Can't believe I didn't think of that :p


Indeed. So a situation that is otherwise not as important for other races is quite critical for toss. Think it might be something worth changing for toss players specifically?
Ninjury_J
Profile Joined August 2012
Canada408 Posts
March 25 2013 13:00 GMT
#3119
@ Jak,

1) Just curious, why did you change the priority of unload and morph overseers for zrm?
2) Build ultra cavern is on / and Z, but so is build advanced. Should it be changed to K and nydus to H to avoid the double key stroke?
“The supreme art of war is to subdue the enemy without fighting."- Sun Tzu
Spaceboy
Profile Joined February 2011
United Kingdom220 Posts
March 25 2013 14:27 GMT
#3120
On March 25 2013 12:18 Ninjury_J wrote:
~ When you say "the command card" do you mean the the long rectangle in the middle (the wireframe) or the squarish box on the right (the command card)?


I did indeed mean the wireframe, my bad! Although I'm sure you worked out what I meant anyway :D
I am terrible at this game!
Prev 1 154 155 156 157 158 432 Next
Please log in or register to reply.
Live Events Refresh
Next event in 6h 25m
[ Submit Event ]
Live Streams
Refresh
StarCraft 2
ProTech155
Codebar 140
StarCraft: Brood War
Horang2 609
ggaemo 332
Hyuk 316
Leta 160
Mind 79
sSak 66
PianO 52
Bishop 35
Hyun 35
ToSsGirL 33
[ Show more ]
Shinee 33
Terrorterran 33
Sacsri 14
yabsab 14
JYJ 11
zelot 10
ajuk12(nOOB) 9
Noble 5
Dota 2
Gorgc3811
Dendi1388
XaKoH 539
canceldota75
Fuzer 23
Counter-Strike
fl0m3075
x6flipin272
Other Games
singsing1738
hiko913
Coldzera 827
Beastyqt534
Khaldor452
ceh9378
Liquid`Hasu237
KnowMe184
DeMusliM160
QueenE76
Chillindude11
[ Show 15 non-featured ]
StarCraft 2
• 3DClanTV 40
• AfreecaTV YouTube
• intothetv
• Kozan
• IndyKCrew
• Migwel
StarCraft: Brood War
• ChaeLyn 5
• FirePhoenix4
• BSLYoutube
• STPLYoutube
• ZZZeroYoutube
Dota 2
• C_a_k_e 2043
League of Legends
• Nemesis2786
• Jankos1735
Other Games
• Shiphtur474
Upcoming Events
OSC
6h 25m
Online Event
18h 25m
Korean StarCraft League
1d 10h
Afreeca Starleague
1d 13h
Rush vs Soulkey
CranKy Ducklings
1d 17h
AI Arena Tournament
1d 23h
BSL Open Qualifier
2 days
Sparkling Tuna Cup
2 days
OSC
2 days
IPSL
2 days
[ Show More ]
BSL Open Qualifier
3 days
WardiTV Weekly
3 days
IntoTheTV X SOOP
4 days
PiGosaur Cup
5 days
The PondCast
5 days
Kung Fu Cup
5 days
IntoTheTV X SOOP
6 days
Liquipedia Results

Completed

Proleague 2026-10-14
Blizzard Classic Cup 2026
Copium Cup

Ongoing

ASL Season 22
Super Anchor Qualifying S3
Acropolis #5
HCC Season 3
Thunderpick World Champ. '26
ESL Pro League Season 24
Stake Ranked Episode 4
1win Private Club #1
Logitech G Play Connect 2026
SL StarSeries Fall 2026
FISSURE Playground #3
BLAST Open Fall 2026
Esports World Cup 2026
BLAST Bounty Summer 2026

Upcoming

Acropolis #5 - GSC
BSL Season 23
SC4ALL II: Brood War
BSL 23: Non-Korean Championship
HSC XXX
Stellar Fest 2: Lunar Cup
SC4ALL II: StarCraft II
Kung Fu Cup 2026 Grand Finals
RSL Offline Finals
eXTREMESLAND 2026
PGL Major Singapore 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 6
BLAST Rivals Fall 2026
IEM Beijing 2026
Stake Ranked Episode 5
PGL Masters Bucharest 2026
1win Private Club #2
TLPD

1. ByuN
2. TY
3. Dark
4. Solar
5. Stats
6. Nerchio
7. sOs
8. soO
9. INnoVation
10. Elazer
1. Rain
2. Flash
3. EffOrt
4. Last
5. Bisu
6. Soulkey
7. Mini
8. Sharp
Sidebar Settings...

Advertising | Privacy Policy | Terms Of Use | Contact Us

Original banner artwork: Jim Warren
The contents of this webpage are copyright © 2026 TLnet. All Rights Reserved.