Question

what if protoss doesn't build cannons?

Even if you pull 10 drones, it still takes a while to bust out this way.

Does this mining time lost on 10-15 drones pay for the cost of 3 pylons?

Psyclon

Bulgaria2443 Posts

August 31 2011 18:18 GMT

#42

I'd love to see this in action, because when i try it with my friend (15 hatch/15 pool) the drones never seem to break through in time before the first cannon warps in. And if it warps in, game over.

Girondelle

France969 Posts

August 31 2011 18:22 GMT

#43

To be honest if you manage to keep your fast expansion and all your drones, you are in a quite good position, because protoss wont be able to have his nexus as fast as your hatchery.
I'd be willing to be some minerals down my opponent just not to be contained.
That said, i still think a quick pool into hatchery is better (safer) since your protoss opponent cannot build cannons in the back of your natural where the drone drill wont be effective, like Dimaga said.

Poopfeast

160 Posts

August 31 2011 18:22 GMT

#44

You don't need to pull all your drones. Max drones that can hit it is about 6-8 at a time. It was a bug in starcraft 1 where you could 1shot stuff if you stacked drones. Nowadays you can deal as much dmg as you would do in a Worker vs Ling fight. I've known this for ages and used it offensively too in a cheese rush.

Kimaker

United States2131 Posts

August 31 2011 18:30 GMT

#45

Actually, wall off's still viable since you just build the next pylon on top of the dying one, one hex back...but this should make things a bit tougher for my current PvZ build....T_T

Talic_Zealot

688 Posts

August 31 2011 18:31 GMT

#46

I love things like this. In bw the outdated engine allowed for some really interesting tricks/glitches and I miss it.

Fiddel

Netherlands20 Posts

August 31 2011 18:36 GMT

#47

This won me a game today! Nice :D (Or at least it prevented the cannon rush after going hatch first)

Netherlands12045 Posts

August 31 2011 18:37 GMT

#48

@_@ holy shit... wow.. holy shit... WOW

ZeromuS

Canada13389 Posts

August 31 2011 18:39 GMT

#49

dude, this is a perfect example of what SC2 really needs to move forward in terms of micro :O

Small things like this means theres more that has yet to be discovered and its so so awesome. Lets hope that bliz doesnt patch this out :S

KangaRuthless

United States304 Posts

August 31 2011 18:48 GMT

#50

Thank God I don't have to gg when my patrolling Drone fails to block off this crap.

Back to 15 Hatch in ZvP :D

Flonomenalz

Nigeria3519 Posts

August 31 2011 18:48 GMT

#51

This is great, but if they put another pylon and cannon behind your mineral line you lose your hatch anyway. Couple that with the mining time lost... idk.

The Intensity

United Kingdom66 Posts

August 31 2011 18:51 GMT

#52

11 drones did 40 damage each time doing this...

drones op. =]

TolEranceNA

Canada434 Posts

August 31 2011 19:00 GMT

#53

On September 01 2011 03:48 Flonomenalz wrote:
This is great, but if they put another pylon and cannon behind your mineral line you lose your hatch anyway. Couple that with the mining time lost... idk.

Theres always a risk with going hatch first, it just makes it slightly more viable. This is not the "solve-all solution" to ZvP, it is just another great trick to know in the future.

Anyway, great post, certainly will try hatch first in map that has alot of space at the back of the minerals!

-Dustin-

United States718 Posts

August 31 2011 19:04 GMT

#54

Amazing find MilkyWay, Its a pain to do but its not as big of a pain as being walled in ;_;. I 14/14 vs Toss anyways but I may do some 15 Hatch to try this in ladder game. Thanks for the find! and thanks to the guy who posted it here so I could see it^^.

shizam

12 Posts

August 31 2011 19:29 GMT

#55

Noooooooooo! My beautiful cannon rush strategies! All ruined!

Great find though, and thanks to whoever posted it here on tl

Acritter

Syria7637 Posts

August 31 2011 19:37 GMT

#56

Couldn't this be used to break wall-ins and make 6pools very hard to hold?

GenesisX

Canada4267 Posts

August 31 2011 19:40 GMT

#57

I'm so happy I want to cry

cLutZ

United States19573 Posts

August 31 2011 19:43 GMT

#58

On September 01 2011 04:37 Acritter wrote:
Couldn't this be used to break wall-ins and make 6pools very hard to hold?

Only if you pull drones on the 6-pool...like all your drones.

DuckS

United States845 Posts

August 31 2011 19:50 GMT

#59

It took about a minute from when you pulled the probes, to killing the pylon and getting to the cannons. Could trim off some extra seconds by executing it better. I'd like to know what is worth more.. 1 minute mining or stopping the cheese. Also, it seems like 1/4 of the drones weren't attacking.. I think it would be beneficial to leave that fourth mining minerals while taking down the cannon. Now, beyond the math, and applied to actual game settings, I think the Z would come out ahead just from toss having to cut so much stuff to cannon, then cancel. You have to also be wary that some tosses can be sneaky - throw up a gateway, or pylon to block off the pylon that is about to fall. This could put you realllly behind if you commited 10~ drones and didn't have some kind of Plan B tech or fall-back.