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The Protoss Help Me Thread - Page 231

Forum Index > StarCraft 2 Strategy
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Make sure you read the OP before asking a question. Asking a question already addressed in the OP will result in moderation action.
Lafer
Profile Joined April 2010
United States114 Posts
May 07 2012 16:01 GMT
#4601
Can anyone tell me what to expect from what I scout from zerg before his lings come out?

For example, what should I expect/do when I see a 1 gas expand?
2 gas expand?
No gas expand?
Fast 3 base with 1 gas?

I have a hard time figuring out exactly what is going on, especially because of the lings that come out. I try to go around the zerglings that take the watch tower, but then I die to the queens before I can see what's going on in the base and I have to wait for hallucinate or the obs. I really need to get better at knowing what to expect from what I see early.
Orazio
Profile Joined February 2012
New Zealand10 Posts
May 07 2012 21:48 GMT
#4602
Hi am having a bit of trouble holding the 4 gate these days. Have learnt how to scout it just by the amount of energy oin the nexus but never seem to be able to have enough out to defend. Last game I played I only had one sentry on zealot when he hit and immortal just finished after my only FF on ramp ended. He ran up ramp, got vision, warped onto high ground. I tried going for 3 gate robo but everything was so late? What are the current counters to 4 gates these day?
Four gate for days
Sated
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
England4983 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-08 10:48:11
May 07 2012 23:01 GMT
#4603
--- Nuked ---
adfasd
Profile Joined May 2012
United States6 Posts
May 08 2012 02:03 GMT
#4604
okay so i have been doing a PvP build of Tylers that he did at MLG Columbus against oGsMC

but i was wondering if this build would work for PvT as well. When i think about it i say it allows me to put the pressure back on terran and it is a strong unit mixture. In my experience i hit Terran and they just crumble. I have experimented on the ladder with it alittle but i am only in bronze so i am really asking if this would work once i reach higher leverls bc i don't want to put time into a build taht only works bc the people i play against are making some fatal flaw in their play.
We have the GSL what do you have? The Superbowl? AHAH... no thanks!-Arotsis
aZealot
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
New Zealand5447 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-08 04:40:16
May 08 2012 03:27 GMT
#4605
Is that Tyler's anti 4 Gate from pre WG nerf? The one with precise timings resulting in a super fast Robo/Immortal?

As to the second part of your question, mate, don't worry about it. Just play it against T, have fun and try it out. You'll learn stuff along the way and, who knows, be even able to share it with your Brotoss in the future too.
KT best KT ~ 2014
cwalk
Profile Joined May 2012
United States26 Posts
May 08 2012 04:32 GMT
#4606
What is a good followup to a FFE in a PvZ when the Zerg is going for an early third, and then massive roach attacks later on?

I typically have 5 gates, a robo and robo bay, 1-1 done, and a third on its way by the time the first roach attack comes. I might be able to survive the first few roach attacks, but I get worn down eventually.

I'm pretty sure I need to either take an earlier third to keep up with the zerg in economy, or pressure them. However, I don't know any specific ways to do either of these things effectively.
For Aiur!
aZealot
Profile Blog Joined May 2011
New Zealand5447 Posts
May 08 2012 04:41 GMT
#4607
Hi, see these:

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=320894

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=327905
KT best KT ~ 2014
cwalk
Profile Joined May 2012
United States26 Posts
May 08 2012 04:53 GMT
#4608
Thanks
For Aiur!
SupplyBlockedTV
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
Belgium313 Posts
May 08 2012 13:57 GMT
#4609
Hey, i have been messing with a carrier-only build in PvZ..works good against most leagues..only against master league it fails (low master myself), enough corruptors will rape my carriers. So would it be viable to make a air-deathball out of carriers and voids (voids to kill corruptors?).
PEW PEW PEW
Sated
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
England4983 Posts
May 08 2012 14:00 GMT
#4610
--- Nuked ---
Rimak
Profile Joined January 2012
Denmark434 Posts
May 08 2012 14:20 GMT
#4611
On May 08 2012 22:57 Xenocide_EU wrote:
Hey, i have been messing with a carrier-only build in PvZ..works good against most leagues..only against master league it fails (low master myself), enough corruptors will rape my carriers. So would it be viable to make a air-deathball out of carriers and voids (voids to kill corruptors?).

Hey.
There is a big duscussion going on about Sky Toss here:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=333403

The build is ridculous, funny, but it works.
2000 Jungler 66% Hecarim, 63% Volibear, 60% Jarvan IV
SupplyBlockedTV
Profile Blog Joined September 2011
Belgium313 Posts
May 08 2012 14:48 GMT
#4612
On May 08 2012 23:20 Rimak wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 08 2012 22:57 Xenocide_EU wrote:
Hey, i have been messing with a carrier-only build in PvZ..works good against most leagues..only against master league it fails (low master myself), enough corruptors will rape my carriers. So would it be viable to make a air-deathball out of carriers and voids (voids to kill corruptors?).

Hey.
There is a big duscussion going on about Sky Toss here:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=333403

The build is ridculous, funny, but it works.

Ah thanks alot for linking that, looks really awesome.

PEW PEW PEW
TheExodus
Profile Joined November 2011
293 Posts
May 08 2012 19:57 GMT
#4613
What is a good build for me, a bronze player, in PvT? I want a decently quick expansion while at the same time getting enough units to hold off any early shenanigans. I know 1-gate FE is good against terran, but I lack the skills to constantly produce workers while doing the scouting necessary for it to be safe. I usually play 3-gate robo, but the expansion goes down a bit later than what I'd like. Is it safe to do a 3-gate expand and plant the robo straight after the nexus? Any other options?
Teoita
Profile Blog Joined January 2011
Italy12246 Posts
May 08 2012 20:04 GMT
#4614
On May 09 2012 04:57 TheExodus wrote:
What is a good build for me, a bronze player, in PvT? I want a decently quick expansion while at the same time getting enough units to hold off any early shenanigans. I know 1-gate FE is good against terran, but I lack the skills to constantly produce workers while doing the scouting necessary for it to be safe. I usually play 3-gate robo, but the expansion goes down a bit later than what I'd like. Is it safe to do a 3-gate expand and plant the robo straight after the nexus? Any other options?


http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=204010 extremely outdated but imo the most solid opening for pvt in lower leagues.
ModeratorProtoss all-ins are like a wok. You can throw whatever you want in there and it will turn out alright.
Sated
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
England4983 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-08 20:13:48
May 08 2012 20:13 GMT
#4615
--- Nuked ---
TheExodus
Profile Joined November 2011
293 Posts
May 08 2012 20:27 GMT
#4616
On May 09 2012 05:04 Teoita wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 09 2012 04:57 TheExodus wrote:
What is a good build for me, a bronze player, in PvT? I want a decently quick expansion while at the same time getting enough units to hold off any early shenanigans. I know 1-gate FE is good against terran, but I lack the skills to constantly produce workers while doing the scouting necessary for it to be safe. I usually play 3-gate robo, but the expansion goes down a bit later than what I'd like. Is it safe to do a 3-gate expand and plant the robo straight after the nexus? Any other options?


http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=204010 extremely outdated but imo the most solid opening for pvt in lower leagues.


Sated wrote:
http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=315812

The 1gas version will hold up against any crap the Terran can throw at you early game, and gets both a Nexus and a Robotics Facility quickly. The build Teoita posted is also very, very good for lower-level players


Thanks to both of you! It seems that the 2-gate FE requires a little bit more multitasking while scouting than the 2-gate robo FE, while the 2-gate FE gives a better eco. I think I'll use the 2-gate robo build until I have my macro down pat and then move to the 2-gate FE. Any opinions on that? Am I wrong in that assumption?

I just want to make it as simple as possible to learn to macro properly while not dying. If I'd been terran I'd do 1rax gasless expand every time, but I don't think us tosses have the luxury of a generic build?
Sated
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
England4983 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-08 20:36:36
May 08 2012 20:33 GMT
#4617
--- Nuked ---
TheExodus
Profile Joined November 2011
293 Posts
May 08 2012 20:40 GMT
#4618
On May 09 2012 05:33 Sated wrote:
The most "generic" build would be MC's 1gate FE, but I don't think this is suitable for lower levels. It requires a lot of good scouting reads to pull off properly - especially against 1base plays like the 3rax Stim-Timing. The Protoss strategy pages on Liquidpedia are pretty up to date these days, so if you wanna read up more then check those out: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Protoss_Strategy


With "generic" I mean one that works in all 3 matchups. Would you say MCs build work in PvZ and PvP as well?
Sated
Profile Blog Joined March 2011
England4983 Posts
Last Edited: 2012-05-08 20:43:45
May 08 2012 20:42 GMT
#4619
--- Nuked ---
TheExodus
Profile Joined November 2011
293 Posts
May 08 2012 20:52 GMT
#4620
On May 09 2012 05:42 Sated wrote:
Show nested quote +
On May 09 2012 05:40 TheExodus wrote:
On May 09 2012 05:33 Sated wrote:
The most "generic" build would be MC's 1gate FE, but I don't think this is suitable for lower levels. It requires a lot of good scouting reads to pull off properly - especially against 1base plays like the 3rax Stim-Timing. The Protoss strategy pages on Liquidpedia are pretty up to date these days, so if you wanna read up more then check those out: http://wiki.teamliquid.net/starcraft2/Protoss_Strategy


With "generic" I mean one that works in all 3 matchups. Would you say MCs build work in PvZ and PvP as well?

Oh! Sorry about that =P

No, it wouldn't. The 1 Gate 1 Assim FE in PvZ is kinda similar, but the small things that make it different are pretty important to how the build works. As for PvP, you wouldn't be able to hold a 4gate with it.


Right now I use a 3-gate sentry expand in PvZ, a 3-gate robo in PvP, and (for the moment) the 2-gate robo in PvT. I kind of feel I don't even have to scout with the fast observer in PvT, as the observer is so DAMNED fast. Perhaps on 4-player maps though... Well, at least I'm ending up with 50-52 probes with it at the 10-min mark, so that makes it easy enough for me in my book
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