I completely disagree with you, Zatic. Spoiler tags let you break guides down into essential sections and keep it easy on the eyes in terms of how much text is on a page at a time. It's much easier to navigate than a wall of text is.

Guides broken down into pieces like;

Build Order
Analysis
Replays
FAQ

should be considered acceptable since it doesn't cause any unnecessary clutter and makes it easy for you to find the portion of the guide you want to refer back to.

Spoilers might be annoying the first time you read a guide, but you'll thank the author later when you want to go back to a certain part quickly.

Azzur

Australia6267 Posts

July 26 2011 16:39 GMT

#22

I disagree as well. I actually like spoilered guides since they are much easier to navigate and people can choose to read the sections that they are most interested in. I'm not sure this post is a rant or zatic setting guidelines that guide writers are expected to. I can understand if TL wants to set rules but if they do I find it unhelpful that these rules are set based on stylistic preferences.

Mowr

Sweden791 Posts

July 26 2011 16:46 GMT

#23

I prefer non spoilered text, bolded headlines makes it easy to navigate anyways, but it is not too bad. When they put spoilers into spoilers, then begins getting really confusing.

ST.Narcotics

United Kingdom8 Posts

July 26 2011 16:50 GMT

#24

On July 27 2011 00:18 94liuwen wrote:
Expand the spoilers from last to first. This way the spoilers won´t move.

that's what I do, I think that spoilers are great and make things look organised rather than paragraphs and paragraphs of words

ZasZ.

United States2911 Posts

July 26 2011 16:53 GMT

#25

I generally like guides that are organized in spoilers. Often I don't have time in one sitting to get through a really extensive guide, and being able to pick and choose which section I read is easy when it's organized into spoiler tags. Not so much when it's just a wall of text.

I've always thought it was a clever use of spoiler tags to create a virtual "binder tab" feeling that I can flip through to the section I want.

Don't really understand why it would be irritating, either. Maybe if the person is literally spoiler-tagging two lines of text, but most people seem to tuck multiple paragraphs into the tags, and this makes it easier to read IMO.

Just my 2 cents.

Marsupian

Netherlands455 Posts

July 26 2011 16:56 GMT

#26

It seems like we need a poll, I still don't like the spoiler tags but it seems like a lot of people do. Maybe it's best to add the poll in the OP or maybe make a new thread for it? I'm really curious what the majority wants.

Blazinghand

United States25563 Posts

July 26 2011 16:57 GMT

#27

Man that was so annoying to read, clicking all those spoilers, that you sir have me officially convinced. Should I ever be so driven to write a guide, spoilers will be used tastefully and meaningfully.

TrickyGilligan

United States641 Posts

July 26 2011 17:00 GMT

#28

Oh god thank you Zatic.

I like to read TL from my phone, and my shitty phone browser has to reload the page every single time I click a spoiler. For a lot of these guides, that's a huge amount of wasted time for no reason.

Also, to people complaining about walls of text, maybe you should get off the internet and read a damn book. Seriously, learn how to have an attention span of over 30 seconds.

Squigly

United Kingdom629 Posts

July 26 2011 17:17 GMT

#29

I think a poll might be helpful. However if you look at the thread so far, if seriously in favour of tags

Squigly

United Kingdom629 Posts

July 26 2011 17:19 GMT

#30

On July 27 2011 02:00 TrickyGilligan wrote:
Oh god thank you Zatic.

I like to read TL from my phone, and my shitty phone browser has to reload the page every single time I click a spoiler. For a lot of these guides, that's a huge amount of wasted time for no reason.

Also, to people complaining about walls of text, maybe you should get off the internet and read a damn book. Seriously, learn how to have an attention span of over 30 seconds.

If a book had no pages, and was just one long wall of text. If would be much harder to read. How about you just say your opinion and not try and make trouble

Numy

South Africa35471 Posts

July 26 2011 17:22 GMT

#31

On July 27 2011 02:17 Squigly wrote:
I think a poll might be helpful. However if you look at the thread so far, if seriously in favour of tags

Could just be the vocal minority. I don't like the spoiler stuff.

Vod.kaholic

United States1052 Posts

July 26 2011 17:27 GMT

#32

Personally, I liked the way iEchoic laid out his TvT guide, and I do NOT mind the spoilers.

As long as the sections are laid out properly, the spoilers conserve a lot of space and let readers easily access the parts of the guide they want to look at. If I want to review transitions or counters or the BO, I don't have to scroll through the entire guide to get to what I want, I just click the right section and boom, I'm set.

Back when I played HoN, I re-compiled all the changelogs at that time to keep track of individual heroes, and man I wish there were spoiler tags on the HoN forums! Honestly, I think spoiler tags are the best way to keep guides looking neat and consistent. Although, personally, I also prefer guides that have a non-spoiled intro paragraph.

gosuMalicE

Canada676 Posts

July 26 2011 17:27 GMT

#33

On July 27 2011 01:04 SeaSwift wrote:
Walls of text are scary and put people off. Having them accessible but not in plain view makes people more likely to read the article, which means more people posting/commenting/improving on it. Like it or not, people work that way.

Disagree, that is generally only true on forums populated by lazy 12 year olds/mentally retarded highschool dropouts that cant be bothered to read more then a sentence or two at a time. (You know the sites where people bitch when you don't put a tl;dr on every post longer then 4 lines)

The posting standards in TL OP's is usually expected to be much higher and people expect long well written guides when they click on a guide thread, as you cant really explain anything about a strategy with only a few lines.

mathemagician1986

Germany549 Posts

July 26 2011 17:37 GMT

#34

I personally like reading guides on my iphone/iPad so I like these spoilered threads. I also think it improves the readability and structures the posts. Just my opinion though.

statikg

Canada930 Posts

July 26 2011 17:54 GMT

#35

On July 27 2011 02:27 gosuMalicE wrote:

Show nested quote +

Funny post, just makes you look like a 12 year old though not us.

Hoban

United States1600 Posts

July 26 2011 18:00 GMT

#36

I am of the belief that spoilers turn a wall of text into a manageable paragraph of text. No, spoilers should not be used for everything but I do believe they should be used extensively to break up sections. A possible alternative to spoiler tags is the use of a Table of Contents. My main issue with wall-of-text guides is finding information relevant to my needs quickly an efficiently. Spoiler Tags to cut down on the overall size of the document or a table of contents to allow for easy searching both remedy this problem well.

Pictures are also pretty nice too. I love pictures!

rsvp

United States2266 Posts

July 26 2011 18:19 GMT

#37

We need a poll!

Aletheia27

United States267 Posts

July 26 2011 19:35 GMT

#38

It's kinda funny because I found this easier to read and more enjoyable than if it had been 4 separate paragraphs. Sorry Zatic, normally I agree with your rants though

I think it has to do with general organization. Even if it's unnecessary, it's easier to read when something is broken up in this way. Even though paragraphs are meant to do that by their nature, having things "spoiled" adds more visual clarity and is then easier to read.

and aside: Who doesn't love clicking a ton? Gotta spend your extra apm somewhere as you alt-tab in the first 2-3 minutes.

iAmJeffReY

United States4262 Posts

July 26 2011 19:56 GMT

#39

...Honestly it's just clicking. I find it nice, to be honest, because I don't have to scroll down 45 paragraphs to get to reply to the thread. I find it neater, nicer, and more condensed. Like doctors last guide? Pristine. Perfect. You open what you need to open later.

Think of it. You want to re check a transition in game or right before a game. Now I gotta load the page, scroll down 23 paragraphs to find the line I wanted, and read it. Or? Just click TvZ 2 rax into tank push (SPOILER TAG)

I think it's a bit whiny to plea for your own opinion to become to common opinion, but who am I. I am against it, I enjoy the spoilers.

Frozenhelfire

United States420 Posts

July 26 2011 19:58 GMT

#40

I prefer the spoilers for structured guides. Even though it has already been said there is no poll to gauge preferences. I prefer spoiled guides because I can open only the part I am interested in without having to machete my way through a jungle of text I find irrelevant. If opening spoilers is such a hassle why not make an "Open All Spoilers" option?