EPTI get hydras, I get overlord speed and overlord drop from both hatches at the same time. I then mass hydra, and go for a doom drop. It's worked for me ever since I saw nestea do this against choya recently because there is a pretty damn big window where they won't have a strong army because they are expanding and teching too quickly. It's really worked for me and honestly, if you're going hydra you need some form of transportation, whether it be nydus or drops because hydras are just too damn slow. I don't recommend nydus at all though, unless it's lost temple and you want to take islands and abuse the high ground natural but drops are just as expensive as a nydus+summon worm and you only need to pay for them once which makes them effective all game. If you can't beat your opponent or cripple them severely, then transition into banelings and go for baneling bombs on the colossi, it's extremely effective and due to colossi being able to walk over their own units, the splash damage is unbelievably strong. Give it a shot.
[D] Efficient way to fight voidray&colossi as Zerg - Page 2
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emc
United States3088 Posts
I get hydras, I get overlord speed and overlord drop from both hatches at the same time. I then mass hydra, and go for a doom drop. It's worked for me ever since I saw nestea do this against choya recently because there is a pretty damn big window where they won't have a strong army because they are expanding and teching too quickly. It's really worked for me and honestly, if you're going hydra you need some form of transportation, whether it be nydus or drops because hydras are just too damn slow. I don't recommend nydus at all though, unless it's lost temple and you want to take islands and abuse the high ground natural but drops are just as expensive as a nydus+summon worm and you only need to pay for them once which makes them effective all game. If you can't beat your opponent or cripple them severely, then transition into banelings and go for baneling bombs on the colossi, it's extremely effective and due to colossi being able to walk over their own units, the splash damage is unbelievably strong. Give it a shot. | ||
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Alphasquad
Austria505 Posts
On January 21 2011 07:48 hardethanolninja wrote: Colossus/Void Ray is a tough composition to deal with, and storm can make it even more difficult. Honestly, I think that the best bet is to not let Protoss get to that point. Void Rays and Colossus are extremely expensive and take awhile to get into a decent number. Deny expansions and starve your opponent. I play Protoss, and the best way to beat Zerg is to expand expand expand. If I'm kept on 2 bases to their 3+ there is no way I can make an invincible VR/Colossus ball. how can you not "let" them get this?voidrays will force you to defend until zerg gets hydras but they are quite expensive and immobile so it will take a while until you get enough and you are able to attack and then colossi are out - if the voids wouldnt buy protoss enough time to expand and switch none would do it this combo is really a nightmare since voids are also very strong against your best colossi counter in larger numbers; atm im really thinking of not making hydras and go to spire asap | ||
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Poonchow
United States56 Posts
http://mrbitter.blip.tv/posts?view=archive&nsfw=dc What iNcontroL and Machine say, for the most part, is that information is absolutely critical in this matchup. Whether it be phoenix openings designed to keep your economy low, or void rays that are designed to either kill you or mitigate the effectiveness of corruptors, you have to have sufficient information to respond appropriately in the first place, then make the correct response. iNcontroL talked about using a pack of 10-12 speedlings to aggressively control the watchtowers, harass exposed expansions, and deny information. This is step 1 of beating Stargate play. Step 2 is aggressive creep spread, making sure you are at least a queen ahead of hatcheries so that you can respond to lone void rays and phoenix, while spreading creep effectively. The creep spread will give you valuable information on where and when the attacks are coming and will benefit your roach/hydra composition immensely. The proper response once the Protoss starts to build up this "death ball" seems to be slowly building your roach / hydra army, as soon as you see void rays, hatch out 10-14 corruptors. Make sure you are aggressive in denying expansions, because a third base for Protoss will make the game exponentially harder to win for Zerg. When you engage, make certain you have a good arc and all of your roaches / hydras can attack. Focus the COLOSSUS with the corruptors first, the Colossus are the big damage dealers here, not the void rays. If you can keep the colossus count low, your roach/hydra mix should be able to walk through anything else the protoss throws at you. | ||
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Yamulo
United States2096 Posts
On January 21 2011 07:39 nkr wrote: So my problem right now in zerg versus protoss is when they pressure you early with air and gain map control. The natural response to this is to make a few hydras so that you can actually move outside your base. At this point a protoss will have their expansion up and start going for colossi after their initial voidrays (and perhaps a pheonix to help lift queens). I have found no efficient way to fight colossi & voidray, supported by gateway units obviously, without getting completely blown to pieces. The best combination so far that has managed to put up somewhat of a fight is roach/corruptor supported by a few hydras (build too many and the colossi will eat through your army in a matter of seconds). However it's not enough as no game that reaches this point has ended in my favour. Dear zerg users, and any protoss players that want to help the enemy, what's your response to this unit combination? So as a protoss player, i find the biggest crux to be a large amount of corrupters, this is also what Machine suggested in his lesson with Mr.Bitter who is btw a phenomenal zerg player. But the weakness of this build is its ability to remax. As protoss it takes a very long time to remax off void ray and collosi and random wg units. Also i would like to throw out there that zerg isn't always supposed to be cost efficient, i say this because realistically your production should be much better. | ||
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SkyDiDeLY
Netherlands51 Posts
On January 21 2011 07:49 obsid wrote: Its tough, hardest build I know of right now in ZvP. I think its best to go for a quick drop with hydra (trying ot hit before he gets too many colsi with range upgrade). If you cant hit before he gets colsi going then corrupter (vs phoenixs and colsi) or muta (vs voidrays) or a mixture, with speed roaches and lings to kill the warpgate stuff. This is exactly what I was thinking. I try to do a doomdrop with hydra/roach before the two base protoss gets collosi (that is around the 11-12 minute mark I believe.) Due to the drop in the protoss base he has to fight my army head on and since hydras are good against gateway units I think this build theoretically is strong. Also delay the first collosus with an overseer if you can. | ||
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Fruscainte
4596 Posts
On January 21 2011 08:05 Yoshi Kirishima wrote: Uh, mass Mutas. They'll be using a lot of gas too so you'll definitely have enough. Remember Colossi can't shoot up and it's not like they can adapt nearly as easily as they can say, with their Gateway units in response to the basic Zerg ground units. They mass enough voids somehow so that your mutas can't deal with them? Counter attack with zerglings and buy time to build up enough Mutas. Do you truly believe that on this build, where there are 5-6 stargates, if you are going mass muta someone can't just press that X key a few times for 12-18 pheonix's? In the OP of the original Colossi/VR thread, there were replays of the guy getting 20 pheonix's in a game and still wrecking 200/200 hydra armies just by lifting everything up. So people WILL be getting Pheonix's in that build if pressured to, and they WILL tear everything up. The only way I have lost to this is a Zerg saving up larvae, and then going 200/200 corrupter and spamming corruption on the VR's. And then remacroing up super fucking fast with a roach army or something and pushing with Roach/Corrupter/BL. | ||
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xciLe
Norway213 Posts
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PaPoolee
Netherlands660 Posts
On January 23 2011 22:48 xciLe wrote: corruptor realy works against both colossi and voidray. if its voidray rush. sporecrawlers is key Mate you clearly don't understand what you're saying. Voidray's melt Corruptors! and the OP wasn't talking about a "Voidray rush" he's talking about a late game army composition! you are not obligated to post! don't post unless you understand what you're talking about. OP: Don't let the toss get 3+ bases to get that army because you need around a 350 food army or so to beat it! that is if he doesn't have money to rebuild it with 15 Warpgates and such! i'd recommend getting loads of Corruptors and roach/hydra combo! an Infestor or two would be nice! use Corruption on the colossi and shift click attack them all with the corruptors  . | ||
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TibblesEvilCat
United Kingdom766 Posts
the only way i've beaten this is going around 11 mins a doom drop with nydus retreat before the +range collus+1-2 voids (with left over gateway defense) it's 50:50 for me, silver vs master 2200 players eu, esl. thats just my exp | ||
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TheRealzz
150 Posts
I did try to pressure him but got rofl stomped and managed to just fend off the counter. Sure i know im behind at this stage ? What now ? Allin ? or try take that extra base ? IDK... But I agree this composition bites~! Im testing Infestors now. to NP the Collossi and fight air with Corruptors and a smallish roach army... Hope it works... :/ | ||
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MuffinFTW
United States235 Posts
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ControlMonkey
Australia3109 Posts
Either have more mining/production the protoss, or don't let them get to that stage. Unit composition is less important than just having way more stuff than them. | ||
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