I want to ask the good Zerg players about the scout planting evolution chamber on the enemies mineral line if possible, else place it in front of a gas.

my Experience as 1150 Gold league player is that all zerg players so far begin to attack it.
and one time after it finishes even destroyed it, at the cost of about 3-4 of his workers.

I just think it could make a new way of playing ZvZ if any got anything to say about it please join in.

//Killingsali

neobowman

Canada3324 Posts

September 30 2010 20:29 GMT

It's nigh impossible to place it in the mineral line. If you put it in front of gas, you can still mine gas at a slower rate, or use 1 extra drone to still get maximum possible resource collection. Most things work in gold league. I could SCV rush in gold league and it would probably work with some micro.

Not worth it.

Killingsali

Denmark6 Posts

September 30 2010 20:32 GMT

okay so by instant you saying is impossible,

but 75 minerals is cost of the evolution chamber + you have sight from it.

you'll scout anyway and if you can manage to build maybe 2 evolution chambers instead and go early air(mutalisk) you can actually delay his air / hydra so much that you'll be dominating his queens. just thought though.

TSM

Great Britain584 Posts

September 30 2010 20:36 GMT

hang on didn't PsY starcraft do this in a ZvZ when his opponent did it to him?

Rolster

United States19 Posts

September 30 2010 20:40 GMT

So the plan is to send in a drone to the enemy base...get it past all his zerglings if they aren't already guarding the ramp.. and have it do what.. any good player would tech outside of the sight range of it anyway so im not sure how it can help

Killingsali

Denmark6 Posts

September 30 2010 20:50 GMT

On October 01 2010 05:40 Rolster wrote:
So the plan is to send in a drone to the enemy base...get it past all his zerglings if they aren't already guarding the ramp.. and have it do what.. any good player would tech outside of the sight range of it anyway so im not sure how it can help

at this time of the game 12-13 supply do you really think he have zerglings up? how late do you scout ?

Hadji

1 Post

September 30 2010 20:54 GMT

I've been doing this lately, and with mild success. Try to build it between their gas and the hatch right before the gas finishes building. This will delay their gas collection.

Once they have lings, they'll usually attack with just a few, and when the Evo chamber dies, the broodlings that spawn can take out the lings plus a few workers if you micro well, thus making it worth it.

tackklee

United States270 Posts

September 30 2010 20:58 GMT

It's viable. And it's not new. I play at 1500+ and it's happened to me a couple times. It really works well on Xel'Naga caverns, where it literally forces the gas drones to walk a ridiculous pattern. It's so noticeable that you end up having like 6 or so more banelings by the time he get's his baneling nest up. I know it doesn't work so well on other maps like LT, where it barely shoves the gas drones to the side.

Also.. you can assume that most zergs do the standard 14 gas 14 pool, give or take. So you'd time your scout going off that. I usually scout at 9, but that's to check for cheese.

It's a cute little trick. Another thing to note about the trick is that sometimes it forces rally point fire, buys you time to come in with your banelings.

FabledIntegral

United States9232 Posts

September 30 2010 21:03 GMT

I do it if I get the chance on the gas. Slows down their gas, gives you vision of when they go lair, etc. and if they kill it you use the broodlings to take out at least 1 drone, or soften up the Zerglings.

Mindspider

91 Posts

September 30 2010 21:17 GMT

#10

For the cost, I'd rather just do a double gas steal.

-Frog-

United States514 Posts

September 30 2010 21:20 GMT

#11

Is it worth the lost mining time, the drone and the mineral cost? I think you either come out even or behind using this trick.

Chill

Calgary25990 Posts

September 30 2010 21:20 GMT

#12

Seems viable. People say mannering buildings in SC2 is harder than BW but I find it way easier. I'd have to see the builds play out to see if it was viable.

People need to consider both the lost mining time and the possible drone kills with the broodlings.

tackklee

United States270 Posts

September 30 2010 21:56 GMT

#13

On October 01 2010 06:17 Mindspider wrote:
For the cost, I'd rather just do a double gas steal.

Do you realize how early you'd have to send 2 drones? On a small map like Xel'Naga, if you scout with 9, they'd already have their gas down. That means you'd have to send your 7 and 8 drones. You might as well 6 pool.

MoreFaSho

United States1427 Posts

September 30 2010 22:06 GMT

#14

On October 01 2010 06:56 tackklee wrote:

Show nested quote +

And you get no broodlings. I think you can probably often get one drone kill with the broodlings, at the very least you should be able to get some scouting from them, they can wander around creep pretty quickly.

TiBe

Mexico200 Posts

September 30 2010 22:09 GMT

#15

I'm not so sure about this.. I mean, first is a little bit difficult to pull it off.. Second you lost mining time and the resources of the evo, the broodlings are not a big deal if you have a queen and a little of micro.. However the lack of gas could be so dangerous especially if your opponent is using banelings..

coltrane

Chile988 Posts

September 30 2010 22:09 GMT

#16

use the search function and bump one of the 19586098105 threads on this.

afflicted2k9

United States6 Posts

September 30 2010 23:06 GMT

#17

From my personal experience I send a drone to their base at about 7-9 supply and just scout it out and hit a drop my gas on theirs to scout for a little bit, while its completing i go back to my base maybe make an overlord/zerglings/queen. Then I will go back to their base and cancel my gas building (the name escaped me) and scout around their base and land on their other gas if available, then I go back to my base. It works because if they attack it before its complete just cancel it, you get most mins back even potentially your drone back if you can micro it well. Longer scouting, and if they waste their time trying to kill it with their drones you hurt their economy. Less minerals also. I have had a lot of success with scouting this way.

Zvendetta

United States321 Posts

September 30 2010 23:11 GMT

#18

I would rather keep the evo chamber for upgrades :p

greycubed

United States615 Posts

September 30 2010 23:16 GMT

#19

http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=147648

cybe41

United States46 Posts

September 30 2010 23:32 GMT

#20

So, I've been testing around with this and it does have random success. I'm like 950'ish plat. So let's look at the pros and cons.

The pros:
1. you some site - at least some idea on # of lings they have around their base.
- so far, doesn't really tell me much, the evo chamber doesn't show you too much in their base.
2. you slow down their gas.
- I think this is huge in a ZvZ game. Gas is rediculously important. In one area where you can hold out most T and P alone w/ minerals and speedlings, ZvZ is all about the banes / roaches / mutas / hydrahs / infesters. The 1st to speedling tech automatically gets a huge advantage in battle.
3. they spend time destroying it. - this all depends with how they deal with it.
- this will have varying success. If they're completely dumb, they'll use drones to attack it and your broodies will take out 2-3 drones : ) and deter mining time. That's a 150 mineral cost to your 75 mineral cost, YAY.
- if they let lings destroy it, in my experience, you can kill 3-4 lings which is still a 75 to 75 cost + you slow down gas - still a win.
- if they let the queen tank it, then you lose 75 minerals, but slow down their gas a bit meaning you'll have speedlings/banes/roaches before them.
- next scenario - they let their queen tank the broodlings. Welp, you lose mineral, but at least you slowed down gas for a bit.
- final scenario - they say it's possible to micro the banes, but i have yet to try this.

Cons
1. They return their scout drone to mine and/or do not scout you, they let their queen tank all the broodlings, and are able to beat off your gas rush.

So best outcome
- you get them to use drones to kill it, seriously slow down their income, take out a few drones (yeah, they'd have to be quite dumb).
mediocre outcome
- you slow down gas income and kill off a few lings with an even trade
worse income
- they queen tank the broodlings, and return their drone to outmine you by 1 drone and have a 75 mineral benefit.

Either way, i'm working it into my build until it stops working in the higher levels.