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Hello there.
I am playing Diamon league ~23 and I often use a usual DT Rush to beat T.
In the following sentences I'll show you some basic things about DT Rush because I think DT's and Warp Prism as well aren't used that much although they're great units.
General
DT Rush is an opening. That means you always must have the option to change stratgey because as soon as T gets a mobile observer like a raven your DT's are nothing worth anymore.
The strength of a DT rush is that T is not expecting it: So make always sure you hide Twilight Council and Dark Shrine if possible out of reach of any watchtower, if not make sure at any cost you hold this watchtower. Otherwise T will easily beat you.
The best hidden location is between you and the Terran to shorten the walking distance of the first DT's
DT's use alot of Vespin Gaz; combine it with zealots but don't show too many zealots to the T or he perhaps goes air what would be hard to deal with: Show him your first stalker!
Build Order
9 Pylon (scouting Probe on big maps)
11 Gateway (scouting Probe on small maps)
14 Assimilator
16 Pylon
16 Cybernetic Core
18 Assimilator
20 Gateway (stop building Probes for the first stalker)
20 Research Warpgate
20 Stalker
23 Twilight Council
24 Gateway
24 Pylon
25 Dark Shrine
25 Robotics Facility
26 Pylon
Additional Informations
On small (2 spawnpoints) maps I use not to scount in first place but build the Pylon at 16 at the hidden location. Important: A good player will realize you only have 1 Pylon in your base and will look for your hidden one.
The mentionned Build Order is in case of 16 Pylon is the hidden one. Sometimes at 16 you don't know the location of T, so build the hidden one at 20-23 and then instantly the Twilight Council
You have to change strategy if T is doing anything unusual.
Robo at 25 is an additional nice feature, watch at T. If he is aggressive a robo is to expensive to hold off T.
When your First DT is warping in you have 6:57.
Playing Style
Chrono boost nothing until you started creating Gateway at 11. Use massive chronoboost for economy after starting to build the firt Gateway.
Chrono boost Research Warpgate and the first Stalker
Your first stalker is to hold off reapers (in high league the stalker will be out too late and you'll have to gg) and to demonstrate aggressiveness. Walk with the first stalker instantly towards the T wall and harass his marines, buildings, marauders.
T fears stalker/immortal and your early stalker signs such a build.
Now to the DT play:
spread your DT's out!
That is the most important thing. T will be forced to use scans to kill your DT's. If your DT's are spread, he can always only kill one single DT per scan - in this time his mules are history xD
Use 1 DT to hold position on his sunken supply depot when he is pushing out!
If you got warp prism, that's not necessary, just fly behind enemys base and spread out some DT's.
The first surprising Attack
You must have already at least 1 DT in his base waiting.
Now attack in front with a DT: likeable he is pushing out and you can attack his forces: He'll use a scan.
Now attack with the DT behind his probeline.
make sure he can't build missile turrets!
Warp in further DT's in front and behind and harrass further.
At the back build further warpgates, pylons and zealots. Research Charge.
Cloaked Units have a very strong psychological aspect^^ T will be abject.
If T pushes out with huge forces use DT's spread out on the way to your base because he must have a raven first or use always a scan or build missile turrets the whole way.
Well that's the whole thing. If he gets a raven or has many turrets best is often a zealot/stalker/immortal combination depended on your minerals/gaz.
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-138747.jpg)
This is a sapmle replay I played still in platin league. I know ressource management on the later game is bad and T is not the best enemy at all but it shows the early gameplay quite well I think.
![[image loading]](http://www.gamereplays.org/community/uploads/repimgs/repimg-33-140000.jpg)
Here a replay of a game where T dealt well with the DT's or even expected it.
Have fun guys and I hope I helped.
Looking forward to seeing some comments and critics.
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DT rush is super strong in PvT and I'm glad noone does it to me (although I open 111 raven, if I didn't I would absolutely hate DT rushes)
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Love this post! Thanks a bunch.
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i can't fathom how this would work in diamond league, uinless the terran goes "HURR ONLY 1 PYLON? THATS NORMAL"
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you get your twilight council b4 stalker even out... how can you prevent an scv not to scout it?
2nd gate b4 any units = die to early pressure on short map like steppes or blizz. he just need like 6 marines rush into your base and kill probe + your 1st stalker.
in case you are hiding your tech, if you watched trump's stream, he mentioned that every Terran should suspect some sneaky things going on when they scout 2 gates and i guess that all they did at high level  ....
yes! i have used this lots in "phase 1" of the beta but really man, its just 50/50 and wont work in high level game
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I tried this in beta but.. guy got a raven from starport then my DTs were useless..
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it's cool, fun, and almost effective enough to use consistently. However, certain aspects of it make DT's in general unreliable, and IMO a "last resort" unit. Specifically, you will be screwed if they build a single missile turret. fun for the occasional cheese though, especially if they are bad.
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A 15 orbital will make rush dts useless. I generally feel stealth units are a gamble against T since the have detection on demand.
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I am sure all smart Terran would be like. "Oh, he has 2 gas and only 1 stalker. OR Oh, he's missing a pylon no problem. Or Oh, he has only 2 gate no Stargate no Robo and no Tech. Seems perfectly normal to me."
And don't most Terran wall in even if you are able to enter then don't Terran usually go 1/1/1 build anyways? So Raven can be cranked out very quickly?
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I usually never go for a straight up DT rush. However, what I've found to be amazingly effective (and this is even more powerful against Z) is a Chargelot/DT push. If T turtles heavily when you pushout, you are quite safe to expand, and if you engage him in combat, chargelots are already good at early-mid stage of the game vs T, and even if T orbwalks, zealots are more likely to take the shots than the DTs.
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dt rush against another toss i could understand but terran? also in the replay the oponent played aweeeeeful! not even bronze league material. 6 racks and no gas? and he left his depo down as if to say welcome in mr dark templar lol :\
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I used to DT rush into expand in all my games PvT. Your build gets them out fast, but it could be better. The build I used was essentially from the Day[9] Daily #130 with some slight modifications.
You should be constantly producing probes. The Dark Shrine should be coming out at high 20 food or even 30s if you expect some sort of opening pressure (from scouting around). Since this build won't be designed to win outright, being ahead in the macro game is what will carry you to victory.
You can get save your first 50 gas from Warp Gates to get your Council out sooner. Warp Gates is 140 seconds without chronoboost. The Council and Dark Shrine together is 150 seconds I believe. So if you go Council first and then Warp Gates with your next 50 gas, you will have your Warp Gates ready to go just as your Dark Shrine finishes. This will get those DTs out a little bit sooner. Since you can do this without chronoboosting anything, feel free to use it on probes or extra units if you see an attack coming your way.
Since you're trying to get ahead via macro, the timing of your Nexus is flexible. If the Terran walled in, the I will go for a Robo first and then Nexus. Or if you see a large force that may move out before your Dark Shrine is done, some extra units and then Robo/Nexus. The fast expand works beautifully since you've been building probes consistently.
Once again, a lot of things are flexible based on what you see. Now for what to do with your DTs once they're there.
Two variations of Terran: Walled In and No Wall.
No Wall is the most simple. You can just walk your DTs on in. Still try to take a roundabout route in case he can see the distortion. You don't need to get to his SCVs asap (explained in a bit).
With a wall you have two options. One you can have your DTs STOPPED outside his wall and a bit off to the side. Hold position does not work since your DTs will attack anything that moves in front of them. The key here is to wait patiently. The only downside is if they move out with a Raven, this DT will die. The idea is to move into his base when he moves out to attack (which is the critical moment).
The alternative is if you built a Robo in response to his wall, you can try to sneakily warp in (get your Prism there first before/just after Shrine) or load them up somewhere nearby (proxy pylon) if your Prism is late. Beware of common areas which people spread supply depots (behind LOS blockers) and try to find another way in. Your Prism does have greater sight range than buildings, so it should be okay if you're cautious. Just don't be too slow about it.
(There is a third Terran who already has Turrets... but he wasted money on those so it's not a big issue. The psychological effect of DTs, scouted or not, has taken place. Although your DTs should not be scouted if possible)
The critical moment is when to attack. You have two options. More often than not, both happen at the same time!
First moment is when the Terran moves out to attack. Have a probe, stalker, watchtower, etc. give you that information. His attack will likely destroy you since you're expanded and spent a lot on tech. If you attack once he's left his base, you're in amazing condition. Either he continues to attack and loses his SCV line (but you probably will sac your expansion since the attack is coming). Or he pulls back to try to defend the DTs. Having them spread out is important if you have more than one. Whatever keeps him back the longest is best.
So the idea is to delay his attack so you can safely put up an expansion and slam out a ton of units to defend. Or if he attacks, you ruin his economy and you can still defend by adding some additional DTs at home. Either way, you're ahead.
The other timing (or if it happens at the same time) is when he calls down Mules. Yes, getting him to scan prevents a Mule. But killing the Mule does the same thing and prevents the scan. I'm still pretty sure you can see energy on the enemy's CC, but if you cannot anymore, just wait for the calldown. If this works out perfectly, he does not have the energy to scan anymore since it was just spent on the Mule. And if you kill said Mule, you will halt mining for quite some time.
If both happen at the same time, the Terran player is in trouble. He's low on scans to begin with. He can go back to defend but then you're ahead in the macro game. If he attacks, you just need to defend your main. Either result, providing it's well played, will give you the lead. Best thing about Dark Shrine + Robo is that you're 1 building or upgrade from almost every Protoss transition. You can do Colossi, High Templar, Blink/Charge, etc etc.
Of course this doesn't work every time. However the opening is super strong. Just be ready to abort if you see very early Marauder pressure or something incoming. If the DTs are delayed too long, they will lose some of their edge.
And best of all... you have DTs! While they are the crux of the opening, these guys are always useful throughout the game. You only need a few.
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On August 14 2010 09:39 Powster wrote:
I tried this in beta but... guy got a raven from starport then my DTs were useless...
Raven's aren't exactly tanks. And you can always shift them to Archons which can attack underneath a PDD. On top of that, you are in position to build High Templar which will crush them with Feedback.
Just because someone has a counter and uses it, doesn't mean it's game over or that it's not a good idea. Dark Shrine is only 50 gas more expensive than a Raven. If you know they scouted it, feel free to let them burn that money on a Raven. I actually like letting them see the Dark Shrine, because I find Ravens to be far easier to deal with than Ghosts. If you build High Templar (or whatever) instead (now made extra good because of the free Feedback targets), all of the sudden Ravens are a bad idea... but if they don't keep building them then you just go back to Dark Templar to punish them.
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This is why I like to have a missile turret near the entrance of my base.
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I think the purpose of dts is to keep terran contained while u expand and buy time for higher tech units. Killing probes is just a bonus.
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Thx for comments guys and super thx to NightFury!
Until now my guide works against nearly every terran but as I also said you're right that smart T will realize the rush and your guid will be the optimal strike to deal with the smart ones ;-)
Thx
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What to do when terran decides to exchange bases? I lost many games like that losing my inferior army and being unable to kill his lifted buildings. Maybe investing in three or more DT's and morphing one Archon would be viable?
What is the soonest time DT can arrive at Terrans base? On the replay it was like 07:30. Raven usually comes out at 07:15. Can we make it before Raven's out?
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I can get DTs out around the 5 min mark, maybe even a little sooner. I don't fuck around with the terran wall i just take it down. Yeah he might scan once and kill my DT but Ill just send another one to keep hacking down the supply depot. Once I'm in and he hasn't teched to detection just yet I can do enough damage by killing probes / army / tech buildins / supply depots and am VASTLY ahead of him in macro, allowing me to just steamroll him a few minutes later. I also put up 4 gates while my DS is warping in so it looks like a 4gate push. It almost never gets scouted (And that was mid-high diamond in beta)
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Ok I've done some math and if you do 10 Gate on 01:20 then counting build times you get Dark Shrine ready at 5:45. So it's rather 6 minute mark. Quite fast nonetheless. Delaying warp gate research at least 10 seconds gets you into a perfect synchronisation. You can even delay 50s if you store enough chronoboost.
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On August 14 2010 20:43 ChickenLips wrote:+ Show Spoiler +I can get DTs out around the 5 min mark, maybe even a little sooner. I don't fuck around with the terran wall i just take it down. Yeah he might scan once and kill my DT but Ill just send another one to keep hacking down the supply depot. Once I'm in and he hasn't teched to detection just yet I can do enough damage by killing probes / army / tech buildins / supply depots and am VASTLY ahead of him in macro, allowing me to just steamroll him a few minutes later. I also put up 4 gates while my DS is warping in so it looks like a 4gate push. It almost never gets scouted (And that was mid-high diamond in beta)
According to SC Armory, build times are
25s Pylon
65s Gateway
50s Cyber Core
50s Twilight
100s Dark Shrine
Total: 4 minutes and 50 second.
Unless you have some sort of magical tricks to start making your pylon immediately once the game starts, and somehow fit in 2 assimilators and warp-gate technology while teching without ANY delays between tech buildings, I don't see how you can get DTs out even remotely close to 5 minutes.
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EPT
