EPTNext time, I'd recommend going one base, getting sentries to prevent stim rushes with force field and quick teching to Collosi.
[H]PvT why do I keep losing to noobs? - Page 4
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AuxPriest
Canada38 Posts
Next time, I'd recommend going one base, getting sentries to prevent stim rushes with force field and quick teching to Collosi. | ||
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Rarak
Australia631 Posts
I was having big trouble with terran infantry up until a week ago but now find it possibly my best matchup. You need to set the pace with the terran player and dictate what he builds. Check Gnial's PvT stalker-void ray opener - it's great. Basically you chrono 2 stalkers asap from 2 gateways and send them to his ramp to poke around. If he has marines, reapers or SCV's in range kill them. Once there are none of them in range, start picking off any supply depo's or barracks that is in range. If he has a maurauder out shoot at it until your stalker loses its shields then retreat the weakened stalker. While this is going on you should be macroing up in your base and depending on his composition either continue with stalkers (marine heavy) or lay down a stargate and chrono out some void rays (maurauder heavy). The key is not to lose your void rays or stalkers if you can help it and keep him contained. If he messes up its game over. At this point my approach diverges with Gnial's. Provided the terran has handled it well, while maintaining the contain or retreating if neccesary. If there is a threat of maurauders overunning my stalkers I will lay down a robo bay and pump a few quick immortals and expo if I feel I can hold it off. From here a transition to 2x robo bay producing collosus on 2 base and attack as soon as I have about 4 along with several immortals left over from earlier, some stalkers, sentries and quite a few zealots to put up front as meatshields. Obviously depending on the situation things may change, but this approach is quite good. The key with collosus is you need to attack him before he can maintain a large ground army AND get a large viking force. I expect at some level higher than my own, this won't work so well anymore, but anywhere up to mid diamond it works great. | ||
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GoodNewsJim
United States122 Posts
An added bonus is that Immortal rock buildings too. | ||
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Chocobo
United States1108 Posts
OP needs many more zealots in his army. | ||
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UisTehSux
United States693 Posts
If anything you can use storm to buy time to get a bigger army. I just know that whenever I go 3 rax marauder/marine if I saw a group of 3 or so high templar I start shaking in my boots. | ||
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sadyque
Romania251 Posts
1. No counter. Dont start now with the classic "Oh i cant build HT cuz i get emp stomped!". That should never happen with really basic usage of protoss scouting abilities. Always keep your maphack observer near their army. Not on the army...not patroling around their army so they can see it ..just standing near. Always attack first dont be on the defense. There is no way for the T to react fast enough if you attack first. If you see his ghosts with the observer get 1-2 temps in front of your army and shift+feedback all of them. 2. Storm cant really be dodged. It looks like they dodged but they really didnt. If they want to move fast enough out of storm they have to stim (-10 hp). If they dont stim chargelots get freeshots on them. So either way storm does the damage. 3. Instant base defense with teh khay(wutever) amulet thingy that gets HTs storm ready on warp in. You got 2 medivacs chock full of marines droped in ur base? no problem...warp in 2 HTs insta-storm him and feed back the medivacs just for loughs. Still 1-2 rines/marauders left? No worries morph them into an archon. 4. Contrary to popular belief archons are pretty decent units. After your temps run out of energy just morph them into big balls of psionic energy and splash T bio armies with ~30 dmg wohooo. Diamond ~300 pts terran player ftw. PS I really have no ideea how to beat this combo...and by beat i mean build some shit and rolfstomp them - like imortals vs marauders, colosus vs rines, hts vs bio balls, charged voidroids vs anything,pheonix vs tanks and stuff like that. Toss has so many ways to rolfstomp a terran that it isnt even funny sometimes. U say rines kill fast vrays? Ok true but what can rines do vs the chargelots that should come with the ray. So many unit combos and so many effective strategies in the toss arsenal. You just hava to look at pro replays and stuff like that. Im not saying that the matchup is imbalanced in any way. But a terran player should always feel like he is fighting an uphill battle vs a toss. | ||
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wwiv
Singapore182 Posts
I feel that the major issue is that you are losing far too much units to mis micro. While it is true that stalkers / immortals dont fare incredibly well against the MMM ball, they should not be suffering 3:1 army loss ratios as evident at the end of your last game. A few posters have already highlighted the colossus mismicro + attacking at a horrible angle + lack of army pop. IMO That army you had was more than enough to win that engagement. But another thing is the lack of aggression in your play. When you first spotted his dropships, you should have allowed/waited for them to begin disembarking and immediately engage with forcefields, instead you cramped up your army in all the way on the edge, revealing yourself and wasting a great opportunity. You also did not do anything useful with that warp prism at the bottom, just warping in anything into an opponent's main base as he is about to engage is usually enough to throw his micro off. It... almost seems as if you are trying to turtle... or playing a singleplayer mission, trying to get as much minerals as possible... IMH experience, if you wish to adopt such a passive stance, I would advise expanding at 50 (3 gate 1 robo) and transiting into 2 stargate void rays / DTs and do harassing while leaving yr main initial force behind. It would put you in much better stead since you clearly have issues when engaging on a larger scale. | ||
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Random()
Kyrgyz Republic1462 Posts
To answer your question though, you build too many workers (if you're staying at one base ~30 is enough), you lose units unnecessarily and you have inefficient unit composition and positioning. | ||
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fosh.ger
Germany14 Posts
With proper scouting it is rather easy to detect the 3 Rax Build. My opponents normally didn't care very much about Medivacs, but focused on Macro and constantly and rapidly build up a force of mixed Marine and Marauders. Some neglect Marauders completely, others have a more 50/50 approach. While it is true, that only a handful of HT can wreck havoc on this bio ball I had never the chance to get out enough of them with proper energy to fight. I didn't have the time to get to the Tier 4 unit, not talking about having the necessary upgrades for them (Storm + Amulett). By the time where they can amass around 30-35 Marines you nowhere near an appropriate army to counter that. Same is with Colossus and Chargelots. The Tech costs too much time and ressources (With Chargelots even more, since you need also Twilight Council + Charge) . So you are left with say 2 Colossus, and a handful of each Zealots and Stalkers which is not enough to deal with the incoming forces. Also VR are not helping really, since VR + gate units is too weak and VR in addition to Mech or HT costs even more ressources. Maybe the harrassing power of VR can be exploited, but if your opponent's micro is not too bad, he can deal with it very easily. From my point of view you definitely need Sentries to block ramp or choke and buy you time for either HT or Collosus. Sentries also can help you to seperate their army to fight it with your inferior forces. Edit: One more reason for Sentries is the Shield ability that reduces incoming damage by 2 which is a huge 33% loss for the Marines. | ||
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Rarak
Australia631 Posts
To the silver player above, it will make sense when you play more and improve. | ||
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emuscles
Canada12 Posts
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craz3d
Bulgaria856 Posts
On August 09 2010 03:16 0mar wrote: Expanding against 1/1/1 is a huge trap. A good terran will immediately go into marine/tank/raven and push you at around 80 supply. With PDD, shield/stim marines and tanks, you don't have a chance. It's kind of risky, but if your expansion kicks in you'll have enough income to run 8-9 gateways. If I see fast tech from the Terran, I always put my expansion down after 2-3 stalkers (unless the positions are really close, in which case I tech hard to chargelots). In order to counter any fast Banshee build, I'll get a forge and put a cannon at each mineral line while getting a head start on armor upgrades. They key in this matchup is chargelots and storm. If you go for collossus, you better hide the tech so as not to let the terran counter you too quick. For me, the collossus is a good way to insure you win the first few skirmishes and to keep your expansion, but after that you should switch to templars because a group of vikings will be able to snipe the collossi very fast before your stalkers can kill them. | ||
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preacha
Norway210 Posts
im a diamond-player, btw. edit; i usually go 2gate,robo,gate and pump out sentries and stalkers and go for the attack when i have 2 immortals. if i break through, i just keep sending stalkers and making immortals. | ||
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kar1181
United Kingdom515 Posts
The turnaround came from fast stalker opening. Opening up with 2-3 chrono'd stalkers and then starting a fast mid game transition (usually chargelot/templar) on one base until you get some breathing space. Those two stalkers buy you the time you need to get your tech up and running before the inevitable doompush. I was surprised by it actually, I though two stalkers will get caned. But against most plat, low diamond terrans they wall in with depots and build few maurauders v. early on. You can snipe his marines with impunity, and then take out a supply depot. All without losing a stalker. As soon as he gets conc shells or a couple maurauders pull-out. But you've just bought yourself a critical amount of time. You *need* a solid BO to pull this off though, it's all about timing. | ||
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Holywow
Canada34 Posts
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phantaxx
United States201 Posts
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Billyten
Canada37 Posts
I've encounter this problem (p vs MMM) against relatively good players (low diamond/high plat) and when I scout the MMM, and see he's going to push me, I always delay my expansion!!! this may look bad because zealots/templar(amulet+storm)/colossi is very expansive and gas starving but if I don't get to spend all the money I have at THE EXACTE MOMENT I scout this, well i'm screwd because MMM is so cheaper and can be reinforced way faster!!! If you held the first push, make a contain while scouting and expand the fastest you can!!! ... but again, that has been working for me... but i'm not that good of a player so.... take it the way you want  | ||
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Kobra Atlantis
United States29 Posts
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Dogsi
Indonesia298 Posts
The reason I am frustrated with this is because I KNOW what they are doing and I can't stop it. I don't scout terrans at all anymore because in the last 20-30 games vs terran, all except 1 or 2 have done the exact same bo. I don't want to say that terran is op atm but it certainly feels that way to me. | ||
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Elanshin
Australia216 Posts
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