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Darthturtle
United States718 Posts
Now let's say, for argument's sake, that he's as good in all 9 matchups as you are in your three. You take away his random advantage. He stops going random. He now practices three times as hard for one single race. He owns you hardcore anyway. Too many people forget that the moment he picks random, the random player has a disadvantage. | ||
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superman.
65 Posts
wall of your choke, scout on 11 or 12, get a gas at around 12. what is the problem...? its not like in wc3 where if ur night elf and ur vs a random you are screwed on say lost temple, cuz u needed to go potm hunts and u didnt. the opening i mentioned is sufficient against all 3 races... | ||
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Severedevil
United States4839 Posts
1) Perform a stable opening which will involve you not dying 2) Scout him 3) Adjust your opening to what your opponent can have, knowing what you do after scouting him. Yes, the first three minutes of your build will not be as optimized as it could've been against a player who chose race. No, that's not a big fucking deal. | ||
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Sleight
2471 Posts
On July 14 2010 14:01 Severedevil wrote: At the start of a match against any race, you don't know what your opponent is doing. So, you: 1) Perform a stable opening which will involve you not dying 2) Scout him 3) Adjust your opening to what your opponent can have, knowing what you do after scouting him. Yes, the first three minutes of your build will not be as optimized as it could've been against a player who chose race. No, that's not a big fucking deal. I think Severedevil has broken Starcraft 2 AS WE KNOW IT!??!!?!? Thank you for being logical and reasonable. There is no trick to the game, y'all. Read the above and actually follow it, whether the opponent is Random or not. | ||
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Competent
United States406 Posts
On July 14 2010 05:52 stk01001 wrote: ohh.. but being able to concentrate purely on one race while a random player needs to learn all 3 isn't an advantage for "choosers"?? needs needs needs ... That player CHOOSE that, he WANTED to do random, do not make it out like he NEEDS to play random. It's and advantage, no argument. | ||
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kidcrash
United States620 Posts
On July 14 2010 20:25 Competent wrote: ... That player CHOOSE that, he WANTED to do random, do not make it out like he NEEDS to play random. It's and advantage, no argument. If it's really that much of an advantage than why don't you just choose random yourself? It's not an advantage if anyone has the option of choosing it. Also I think you misunderstood what he was saying. He was saying that by choosing random, you need to learn all 3 races or else it's a disadvantage. Aside from that it's actually even deeper because you are learning 9 match ups in addition to random vs random. You end up pulling the 1-3 match ups that you have a less than a 50% win ratio with and guess what, your so called advantage(minimal advantage at best) has just turned into a HUGE disadvantage that could have been avoided by just picking race. | ||
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Zanzabar Haberdasher
United States510 Posts
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sikyon
Canada1045 Posts
Also I always wall off in TvT, I've never had a problem with tanks dominating forward buildings (I make sure to get air control) and I HAVE had problems with MM stim rushes before seige finshes. | ||
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Markwerf
Netherlands3728 Posts
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clowntable
Germany11 Posts
If you just want to randomize what race you play roll a D6 and divide by two. I guess it would be a nice feature to have a "random but revealed" builtin for practicing but playing against a random needs to mean "you will face a random race and don't know which" in any competitive setting | ||
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shinosai
United States1577 Posts
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Darthturtle
United States718 Posts
On July 14 2010 20:25 Competent wrote: ... That player CH It's an Use proper English first. Then get this through your head. If the random player instead focused on a single race, he would have three times the practice with that one race. By choosing random instead of a specific race, he is playing at a much lower level than his potential. This negates any advantage you imagine he has. | ||
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moopie
12605 Posts
On July 15 2010 00:34 sikyon wrote: Also I always wall off in TvT, I've never had a problem with tanks dominating forward buildings (I make sure to get air control) and I HAVE had problems with MM stim rushes before seige finshes. I also generally wall off as a terran, as well as build on the choke as a toss (I play random). If my scouting probe spots a cheese, I can always toss a second gateway to close it up and buy myself some time. As zerg, depending on map/spawning location I simcity so if needed I can add 2 spines inside. This, coupled with early scouting works most of the time to prepare for anything early on (except for some proxys). | ||
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kickinhead
Switzerland2069 Posts
really - do the normal wall-in with bunker+depots, get gas, upgrade CC, until then, you should've pretty much scouted out what the opponent is playing. If not, I build a factory next. | ||
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Mnijykmirl
United States299 Posts
I don't hold random players in very high regard. They get a hefty innate advantage for being random and when you're splitting hairs as you almost always do in fragile SC, that extra 10 seconds they cost you minimum can be half of your mineral line dead. But there's nothing more you can do other than be more cautious than normal. | ||
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Plakk
Canada32 Posts
The other is opening something like early reapers or 4 rax into expand, early agression with bio balls into expand work against almost every race. | ||
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Nightmarjoo
United States3360 Posts
You should just make sure you're comfortable opening tech lab or fact first vs all three races, so in case you scout them 3rd and don't get much information by then (scouting blocked) you have a fairly good idea of what to do no matter what you do up to that point. There are definitely a multitude of viable openings for each matchup, don't limit yourself to only one opening per matchup. Terran is pretty flexible. 9rax 11gas 11oc depot reaper asap is a good opening vs random. You can even opt to not scv scout to get a few extra minerals if you're so inclined. This gives you scouting and harassing, this works basically no matter what they did. Even a terran with well placed marines shouldn't be able to completely block your scouting with it. I like opening 9rax 11depot 11oc 11marine 12gas in all three mus. You get a good economy going thanks to mules, and get marines a little quicker, which can help you react to whatever your opponent does. It does get gas a little slower though, for example hellions come out about 20 seconds slower than with 10depot 12rax 13gas. With this opening I scout with the scv that makes the barracks, and I'm comfortable with the speed at which I scout my opponent. You could even preemptively cheese, forcing the game to go a certain way no matter what your opponent is. Something like a proxy 8rax -> reaper build, maybe with a bunk rush after you scout him is going to be effective to some degree no matter what. Reapers will stop any fast ling/zlot/marine cheese your opponent might opt for, and if they go standard all the more harass potential for you Mostly facing random is just about how comfortable you are with a variety of builds and openings and being able to adapt any and all of them to any and every situation. Just use a build that plays to your strengths, and then figure out how to transition out of what you blindly choose based on what your opponent turns out doing. | ||
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