EPTMafia VII - GG - Page 74
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fusionsdf
Canada15390 Posts
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L
Canada4732 Posts
Thats exactly the point. You are still arguing who played better look at your arguments. Im arguing about balance. That we played better or not is not a matter of argument. Town played like complete shit, we did not. Maybe you should learn how an argument is formed before telling me what my argument is. Feel free to separate a premise from a conclusion and read my posts again. | ||
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BloodyC0bbler
Canada7876 Posts
My intention was in the end for the mafia to join up and work together, I never saw it happening so soon. Also, THEY were gimped day 1, horribly as bockits death proved. I had a huge argument with qatol on that hit going through, he tried to rule break me, I told him to think like a mafia. So bockits death was because mafia A didnt know mafia B existed, hense the members wouldn't hesitate to kill someone, they then knew of another family instantly when hits came up. As for Me lying to ver, i said he wouldnt be gimped after night 1, and its true, KNOWING there is more KP you can use then is fair grounds. As for when the mafia joined and the town was doing its "lynches" knowing that mafia qatol would want to off other mafia. Multiple mafia players even brought up openly that it would be dumb for the mafia to target eachother and why, and after 2 days of hits not overlapping the town should have realized what had happened, but it hadnt. You then asked me to give you information you didnt know, which would completely alter your playstyle. MAFIA is a game of using your heads, and overall the people in the town using theirs were ignored then killed off, and no one bothered to recheck the dead players posts to see if they were on to something (see camlito). You guys didnt try to put two and two together, you wandered around like weirdos. Also note the rule edits i only edited the mafia once, to prevent them from killing peopl ein their own family, THE RULE DOES NOT STATE, one family must live to win. This game in its balance, actually favours the town, provided it plays well, and mafia has to play very very well to win. Which they did. There were issues with this game obviously, as all games do, but the assumption of rules without honest deep thought or considering of the objecting opinions given from your opinion of those rules was not the reason you lost. Knowing either way if the mafia had to kill eachother or not would not have changed how you voted as that was never given as a reason during your votes. You also had more blues than normal with the 2 vets, 1 med and 1 dt. so 4 blue roles more than normal. | ||
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Malongo
Chile3479 Posts
That we played better or not is not a matter of argument. Town played like complete shit, we did not. Maybe you should learn how an argument is formed before telling me what my argument is. Feel free to separate a premise from a conclusion and read my posts again. SO you want to validate this : "The game is balanced." Lets look at this argument: -If this game was balanced, the team that performed better should win. Correct? sure thats right -Town played horribly. Mafia played near perfectly. Mafia should win under those circumstances, and they did. (That we played better or not is not a matter of argument.) seems like its part of this argument... :D. Hey sherlock! so the game is balanced because the side that played best won? oops you have a logic problem right there. If a team played better than the other and won doesnt imply that the game is balanced. Learn some logic its not Balanced<=>Better team win. Its obvious that the better team can win and the game still be imba. Just to make you think a bit. | ||
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BloodyC0bbler
Canada7876 Posts
This game is tweaked so that both sides have issues, but overall favours the town with added blue roles, and mafia kp being divided till mafia finds eachother. So yes it was slightly imbalanced towards town, and you lost, stop bitching already. | ||
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Camlito
Australia4040 Posts
If i posted my analysis earlier, and maybe kept pasting it, then we could have got more mafia. If someone did something, something would happen - these arguments can go on all day, but every game is different, and luck and timing play an important part in the game. Mafia played well, town played crap BECAUSE mafia got in office, the clue analyzation was pathetic - even my first clue analysis' were laughable, and overall inactiveness. If we played this game again in the exact same manner, maybe tweaking mafia/blue numbers, the results would be completely different or somewhat different in most cases. Discussion aside, i thoroughly enjoyed the game in the end, wished it went longer, and hope BC hosts another so i can fully understand his clues  .GG~ Camlito has left the game | ||
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BloodyC0bbler
Canada7876 Posts
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HeavOnEarth
United States7087 Posts
On May 10 2009 18:09 BloodyC0bbler wrote: Malongo, do me a favour, never host. This game is tweaked so that both sides have issues, but overall favours the town with added blue roles, and mafia kp being divided till mafia finds eachother. So yes it was slightly imbalanced towards town, and you lost, stop bitching already. Finalllllllly, end to the madness =/ | ||
RaGe
Belgium9950 Posts
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Malongo
Chile3479 Posts
On May 10 2009 18:09 BloodyC0bbler wrote: Malongo, do me a favour, never host. This game is tweaked so that both sides have issues, but overall favours the town with added blue roles, and mafia kp being divided till mafia finds eachother. So yes it was slightly imbalanced towards town, and you lost, stop bitching already. Sure. I wasnt bitching learn to read. | ||
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HeavOnEarth
United States7087 Posts
With that said, I think BC posted pretty concrete evidence,seeing he's the host of the game =/ | ||
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LucasWoJ
United States936 Posts
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Showtime!
Canada2938 Posts
Anyway, Mynock said it best: On May 10 2009 05:58 Mynock wrote: My key point here is: The Town and Mafia played by a different set of rules. And YOU knew it. This is undeniable. It was pretty obvious that they were working together based on the votes and kills (other than bockit, ahem). Either way the game is over. The rules should be known to everyone next time. Many Townies made key mistakes. The biggest one was the Qatol train, which to me was just baffling. Relax. We were screwed from the start. Chances of us unifying before the chaos that would ensue was slim to none. The DTs turned the other cheek when I voiced my ideas (hell, they had every right not to trust me) and we got fucked. Likewise, if everyone were to vote for me as Mayor next game we would probably find ourselves in the same predictament based on bandwagoning. Reds and blues alike made themselves huge targets this game, i.e. Pyr, SoG, Ver, etc. How some of this went unnoticed is beyond me. Now, keep in mind the amount of intellectual power we have on this website is unparallel and we collectively missed the mark. | ||
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L
Canada4732 Posts
seems like its part of this argument... :D. No shit. Its a premise. Its also a correct premise. However attacking a premise doesn't mean you've killed the conclusion, especially if your critique is horrendously poor. So no, i'm not arguing that we played better: that's fucking obvious. I'm making an argument about the balance of the game. Feel free to read what I responded to, because it seems like you don't even know what you're talking about at this point. Hey sherlock! so the game is balanced because the side that played best won? oops you have a logic problem right there. If a team played better than the other and won doesnt imply that the game is balanced. Learn some logic its not Balanced<=>Better team win. Its obvious that the better team can win and the game still be imba. Just to make you think a bit. I never claimed that the game is automatically balanced because the better team won. The game would be balanced if the better team won every time regardless of which side they were on. I said that the fact that the better team won is evidence pointing towards the fact that the game was balanced. I picked out the point in time that you were referencing, day 5, at which point the town was completely outplayed and noted that if the town should have been close to death if the better team should win the game. A number of other players made the same point. But here's a better question for you: Do you believe town played better than us? Provide proof to dismantle that premise of mine. If you can't, then you need to do what I originally suggested and bring your frame of reference from the doomed day 5 perspective to the day 0 perspective and see how town could have done better. You need to do this because my statement about who should win from day 5 forward would stand pretty clear: at that point town was grossly outplayed. Feel free to look at what town players of higher stature have been saying. Read Ace and Camilto's positions. Again, go back to the start and pretend the town didn't shoot itself in the foot multiple times a day. | ||
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Showtime!
Canada2938 Posts
our Town was too stupid to boot. Not like I played any better because I didn't. Did I protect anyone? No. Did I attempt to find more people to rally around me? No. No time to. Two reasons for that a) work; family = inactivity b) didn't see a post from BC announcing a Day shift Either way, it's hard to act upon information you just got. I only had a few hours when Vivi approached me. Q gave me a good list to protect from the outset. Let's look at this game from another perspective shall we? Ace, Cam, Mynock or myself in office. The game could have ended the other way. Perhaps the mafia would then cry wolf. | ||
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Caller
Poland8075 Posts
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On May 11 2009 05:05 Caller wrote: hi can you please give me feedback on my mafia idea ^^ no lolololololol | ||
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Showtime!
Canada2938 Posts
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Showtime!
Canada2938 Posts
On May 10 2009 07:32 Caller wrote: How about this for a new game idea: There are 50 townies and 10 mafia. KP of Mafia is 1 per person. The catch is, each mafia member is by themselves in the beginning. Storyline: A group of mafia sleeper agents woke to see their Godfather being executed publicly in the street. Unfortunately, they do not know who the others are. Mafia: Two powers: 1) May investigate one person and find their role (millers included) 2) May kill one person (including other mafia members) that night. This does two things: A) it gives mafia pause from simply just 1a2a3aing their way through the active players. This also prevents mafia from simply just hiding and staying inactive, as they need to meet up with the other mafia. Obviously, once mafia gets organized, they will have massive hit potential. But this is counteracted by the fact that they aren't organized to begin with-thus, there is a chance that mafia may hit their own. Thus, they may choose to instead investigate people and find that person's role. This also counteracts DT roleclaim confirmations and Vigilante claims. However, there will still be Millers in the game. Thus, a group of organizing mafia may inadvertently invite a miller into their group. Add the fact that Millers now can be any town, blue OR green (the miller "red" appears over blue/green, but town is unaware of it) and mafia must now be more careful. Interesting idea. This would get rid of the bandwagon to a certain extent. I still think the game would be far too chaotic. Probably best to make it 55-60 Townies, but then again we're still having problems with activity. | ||
Ver
United States2186 Posts
The more people there are, the more posts there are, and the less the average person is going to want to contribute or have time to read up. | ||
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