EPTOn March 19 2008 07:45 ShaLLoW[baY] wrote:
Such Epil Fail signifies nothing less than Mafia!
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Such Epil Fail signifies nothing less than Mafia!
Epil Fail
Epil
Epil
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TL Mafia 2 [GG] - Page 37
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Artanis[Xp]
Netherlands12972 Posts
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ShaLLoW[baY]
Canada12499 Posts
On March 19 2008 07:47 Artanis[Xp] wrote: You saw through my cunning plan! | ||
Empyrean
17070 Posts
On March 19 2008 07:39 ahrara_ wrote: Voting for Empyrean is the WORST option we have, from a cost-benefit point of view. Empyrean does not appear to have read much of the analysis from last night, including Ace's Bodyguard plan. He doesn't appear to have a good grasp of what's going on. He is basically trying to coerce us into voting for him because he may or may not be a detective. How good each scenario is, in order, with how good each scenario is on a scale of 1-10, 5 being neutral. The best we can do by voting for emp is a 6. The worst is a 1. The best we can do by NOT voting for Emp is a 10, and the worst is a 4. Losing a detective is not a huge loss because we have a lot. Do NOT vote for Empyrean. Lightning edit: I wrote "best" instead of "worst". 1. You think I haven't read the whole thread? Yes, I'm well aware of Ace and Ghar's mayoral strategies, as well as the bodyguard plan. 2. You cannot assign each action on your arbitrary scale. A cost-benefit analysis of this is essentially worthless. 3. Losing a detective is not a huge loss? | ||
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qrs
United States3637 Posts
On March 19 2008 07:39 ahrara_ wrote: ...Ace will coordinate the real detectives How? This is what I keep asking. We can't coordinate unless the detectives can all trust someone. They can only trust someone if they know he is towny. That means either: we waste 3/8 of the valuable yes/no questions, or the mayor reveals a bodyguard. Ace has said he does not want to reveal a bodyguard immediately, so how will he be able to coordinate the detectives? | ||
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Empyrean
17070 Posts
On March 19 2008 07:31 MasterOfChaos wrote: One thing about detective is, that they should mostly ask about who voted for a specific person. A question about a clue has a shannon-entropy of atmost one bit, whereas the question about how many people voted for a specific person usually leads to a significantly higher entropy. Yes, I agree. We should save the "what is this person's role" investigations until the endgame. | ||
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Empyrean
17070 Posts
On March 19 2008 07:39 ahrara_ wrote: ...Ace will coordinate the real detectives Such cleverly disguised misdirection against me won't work. Don't use such a leading tone; you incite suspicion against yourself. | ||
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ahrara_
Afghanistan1715 Posts
First, a protected detective is NOT that valueable. Under Ace's plan, it will be made clear who the detectives are. He will be their mouthpiece, and their identities will remain secret. They can only die if they're accidentally killed off. Second, you can't really save somebody if the Mafia is determined to kill them. They can use several kill points to make sure they take out an important role. It might be viable in the beginning, when you have all 7 medics saving one person because that's the only one they know is worth saving, but it would difficult to keep him alive for long when there are more people (including innocent townies who are likely to be targetted just becaused the contribute a lot) worth saving later in the game. Finally, clues at this point are useless. I can't emphasize this enough. Let me try again. CLUES AT THIS POINT ARE USELESS. All this pointless, unsubstantiated finger pointing is annoying, QUIT IT. When a lot of them start to add up, and there's behavioral clues to add to it, then it becomes worth talking about. A lot of people were lynched last game on a whim. Let's not do that again. The clues pointing to Ghar aren't very sound at all. I don't buy them for a second, but if a lot of them started to suggest him loosely, then I'll consider it some more. In fact, I would ask that clue analysis be kept to yourself for now, because it makes you a target and it causes unneeded and unwarranted suspicions amongst townies. Although you should by all means continue analyzing, just post them ONLY when you have a strong case against someone. This and this clue might point to this person is pure shit. The town can only be hurt by this pointless finger pointing. Oh man, that's a terrible pun. ;( | ||
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On March 19 2008 05:13 Falcynn wrote: Only the mayor knows who the body guards are, even the bodyguards themselves don't know. So if a bodyguard doesn't get a message...he'll just assume that he's not a bodyguard. Hmmm? Not quite. Remember that Chuiu PMs everyone their Bodyguard Roles after elections. If a Bodyguard doesn't get a message something is fishy because he knows the Mayor has to know who he/she is, and that if the Mayor is following the plan they HAVE to PM them. This is the self-checking part of the plan. Also guys, I don't think we need to reveal a bodyguard. Whoever wins mayor will undoubtedly be checked up on by a Detective or a Jack, and if found Mafia will be turned out ASAP. If things are quiet, we can be sure as heck that they must be innocent. The Mayor will be the mouthpiece of "the committee" (Bodyguards + Mayor) 1. Even if I were mafia, a mafia mayor would still be good for the town. Think about it. Mayors have to act in town interest. If he doesn't, there is mass suspicion against him, and he can be lynched. It's in the town's best interest to always enact double-lynches. If, for some reason, the mayor declines, he's pretty much voted dead the next day. It's NOT in The Town's best interest to always enact double lynches - they are only useful is some critical information is going to be revealed or the case where out of the candidates someone is SURELY Mafia and we have exhausted other attempts at figuring it out. 2. Yes, I am forcing the town's hand. I'm fine with having someone confirm me as a detective, or for having people give me questions to confirm. If I am not mayor or pardoner, I'll be a likely target for the mafia the first night. They're smart enough to put multiple hits on people to ensure bodyguard protection is wasted. If mafia don't target me first night, I'll be able to reveal some more clues until they're forced to kill me or otherwise be revealed. I'm not fine with anyone confirming anything based on you - because what you're asking is a system where you are the only person accountable for anything. In other words, you are asking for blind trust and using your abilities in last game (which have 0 bearing on your status this game) as a crutch to get elected - and I'm not for it. A detective mayor/pardoner is the best bet for the town. Why? At the end of the game, it's likely that at least one bodyguard will still be alive. When the playing field has diminished so greatly, I'll be able to ask "What is [player]'s role" which leads to an immediate mafia death. That's why you should vote for me. Surely you don't think we are this stupid??? 1.) You role claim at a point no one can justify 2.) You are pretty much asking for blind trust 3.) You have no plan Seriously, if people keep saying you are so good at this game I can't help but ignore how BAD this move is for the town. It's a very selfish move akin to "I don't want to die" and your campaign for Mayor/Pardoner isn't even strong at all. I seriously hope people do not vote for you, because you definitely are not acting like a leader or in the best interest of the town. You did not need any protection at all, and in fact the more I think about your little stunt is actually taking votes away from more qualified candidates like randombum and Ghar. You are acting VERY selfish and I just can't stop repeating it. You have offered no plan and you are pretty much saying "I'm a Detective, Mayor + Detective = win, vote for me". People I URGE you to reconsider your votes for Empyrean, because he is NOT displaying good qualities we need as a Mayor or Pardoner. | ||
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French_Toast
United States99 Posts
This, and fuck yeah sea king, are two of the worst things that ever spawned out of 4chan. | ||
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qrs
United States3637 Posts
On March 19 2008 07:54 Ace wrote: Also guys, I don't think we need to reveal a bodyguard. Whoever wins mayor will undoubtedly be checked up on by a Detective or a Jack, and if found Mafia will be turned out ASAP. If things are quiet, we can be sure as heck that they must be innocent. The Mayor will be the mouthpiece of "the committee" (Bodyguards + Mayor) The problem with that in a nutshell is that you are forcing all the detectives to use one of their two "is-he-Mafia" questions. (If one does not, how do we know that all of them will not?) Surely it's better to save those questions for when we can use them better, and out a single bodyguard (who can be protected or fake-protected). | ||
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Empyrean
17070 Posts
2. I support your plan. I probably should have made that more clear. Think about it from a mafia standpoint: If I truly were mafia roleclaiming to be detective, once the election is over and under your plan, the detectives reveal their clues (not publically, of course), it'll be obvious that I wasn't a detective. So why would the mafia risk such a scenario? Quick edit. | ||
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~OpZ~
United States3652 Posts
Lot's of Pulp Fiction, Reservior Dogs, and Kill Bill references...or someone with a name like it. "The Wolf" - Pulp Fiction, Robert DeNiro Random Snake Names - Duh Kill Bill Mr. random colors - Reservior Dogs (Fuck Mr. Blonde is evil) | ||
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bumatlarge
United States4567 Posts
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Falcynn
United States3597 Posts
On March 19 2008 07:44 Wysp wrote: I can't find the post right now, but a quick summary is...http://teamliquid.net/forum/profile.php?user=So no fek Enigma ran his hand through his hair and said "So we're going to gut this town clean and take it over, eh? No more of this bullshit protection, thats grand!" I looked at every profile picture, and his hair is the only hair that stands out. Not to mention he looks he looks 'enigmatic.' Nothing concrete, of course. Also, where can one learn what Dr.Dragoon did? In the last game, Shallow[bay] in MSpaint doctored up a screenshot of Dr.Dragoon PM'ing him something like "hey, I just heard someone say you're mafia. I'm mafia too! Who should we kill first?" Dr.Dragoons responce to this was "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooo" so everyone thought it was real and voted to lynch Dr.Dragoon, who continued to defend himself/insult everyone else. Turns out Dragoon was innocent and Shallow was mafia. | ||
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fusionsdf
Canada15390 Posts
Find The pattern Explore the Pattern Learn the pattern (hear the patter?) | ||
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ShaLLoW[baY]
Canada12499 Posts
On March 19 2008 08:04 Falcynn wrote: I can't find the post right now, but a quick summary is... In the last game, Shallow[bay] In MSpaint doctored up a screenshot of Dr.Dragoon PM'ing him something like "hey, I just heard someone say you're mafia. I'm mafia too! Who should we kill first?" Dr.Dragoons responce to this was "NOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOooooooooo" so everyone though it was real and voted to lynch Dr.Dragoon, who continued to defend himself/insult everyone else. Turns out Dragoon was innocent and Shallow was mafia. It was hot! | ||
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LucasWoJ
United States936 Posts
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Ace
United States16096 Posts
On March 19 2008 07:58 qrs wrote: The problem with that in a nutshell is that you are forcing all the detectives to use one of their two "is-he-Mafia" questions. (If one does not, how do we know that all of them will not?) Surely it's better to save those questions for when we can use them better, and out a single bodyguard (who can be protected or fake-protected). I would rather have the DTs use their abilities to verify the Mayor and easing the conscience of the Bodyguards and allowing the Town to start off on a good foot. I also hope people are looking at ahrara's last post. Do not jump to conclusion's people - there is no strong evidence pointing to anyone at all right now. | ||
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ShaLLoW[baY]
Canada12499 Posts
On March 19 2008 08:07 LucasWoJ wrote: It was also very apparent to outsiders that Dr. Dragoon was completely innocent. Yeah, well, what can you do?  | ||
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GeneralStan
United States4789 Posts
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