TL Mafia LXX: Guardians of the Galaxy

On March 24 2015 08:04 Damdred wrote:
Seriously IF YOU HAVE THE ORB HIT RITOKY WITH IT.

On March 24 2015 08:45 Eden1892 wrote:

Hella interesting that you picked out one vig but not the other. Elaborate

On March 24 2015 08:49 Damdred wrote:


We have someone fake claiming a tracker claim tos omeone who was roleblocked last night. That same person hasn't done a lot this whole game besides yell at people....

Now we have a replacement into the game 2xx pages in?

On March 24 2015 08:52 Damdred wrote:
Honestly if we want to go down the real wifom road. Rayn said he would afk every game he was mafia in...

On March 24 2015 08:54 rsoultin wrote:
ritoky dude

like 72 hours before lynch xP

you've been in the game what an hour? lol

YES WE ALL HAVE READS BASED SOLELY ON YOUR PLAY!

On March 24 2015 08:46 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

There's no one that's "confirmed" as in greenchecked or anything like that. Here's where I'm at.
100% Confirmed Town
Me.
99.99% Confirmed Town
Vivax
Toadesstern
Trfel
Eden1892
Rsoultin
99% Confirmed Town
Exo
Damdred
95% Confirmed Town
FecalFeast

On March 16 2015 11:17 Fecalfeast wrote:
Oh I need reads already? I haven't been following very closely as of yet. I'm off work in 45 mins.

I am a vt

On March 16 2015 12:12 Eden1892 wrote:
Damdred claimed cop with an inno on rsoultin not 12 hours ago rofl

This game

On March 16 2015 13:12 Eden1892 wrote:
Lmao

I don't even know what that makes FF now. I had Damdred strong town so I should prolly stick with that

On March 16 2015 13:14 Fecalfeast wrote:
I'm gonna WIFOM a little here and say that I would have definitely checked out scum QT and seen what was up before hard claiming vt

Who's the most controversial player atm?

On March 16 2015 13:15 Eden1892 wrote:
I kinda buy that

Everyone is controversial

Hell you're controversial now lololol

On March 24 2015 09:12 sicklucker wrote:


Most are just there reads tbh. Its kind of absurd to say tref/toad/vivax/dandred/exo/eden area all confirmed with sketchy claims or no claims at all. I would bet my left nut 1 or 2 of them are acualy mafia

On March 24 2015 09:36 Breshke wrote:


Most lukely bullshutting. Dont think its allighnment indicitive for him though

On March 24 2015 09:40 Breshke wrote:


Because he recently talked about how he likes the wifom play. I also believe town SL with the orb would go for gliry and not try pull a roleblock.

Motivation for town SL without orb is to try pull a Rb or nk which is very unlikely.

Motivation for mafia Sl is to make it look like he is tryong to do a play which he says he likes as town.

I can see it either way

On March 24 2015 13:37 Eden1892 wrote:

your team is about 120 hours too late on the disruption strategy

a for effort tho

On March 24 2015 09:34 ritoky wrote:
so i just read about this orb thing in the op. SL instantly claimed having the orb, what do people make of that? more likely town, more likely mafia, completely null? why?

On March 24 2015 14:08 Eden1892 wrote:
why aren't you engaging breshke about this instead of trfel? breshke's the one who's actually a question mark relatively speaking

On March 24 2015 09:47 ritoky wrote:


pretty sure this dude is town pile for now. this is an incredibly reasonable read.

On March 24 2015 14:10 Eden1892 wrote:
not trying to be antagonistic here but quite honestly this doesn't look like it's going anywhere

I'm really sympathetic to the fact that you replaced some 285 pages in but I'm also gonna be a bit of a stick in the mud about your questions if I don't like them cuz I think you're mafia

so please orient your efforts toward something more productive TIA

On March 24 2015 14:19 Eden1892 wrote:
ritoky, here's what i want you to understand about your slot right now, and why i'm frustrated with it and clueless as to how i'm supposed to read you based only on your actions.

your slot:
- claimed blue under no pressure from the thread
- hardclaimed tracker to its top scumread at the time
- got unreasonably pissed at people who suspected it, ever
- didn't try especially hard, relative to the other players in the game, to solve the game

and apparently now we learn the claim was definitely fake too. and you claimed vt in a really scummy way. and even though you're cool tr'ing basically everyone else in the town circle, you're somehow deciding it's a good idea to throw garbage at the guy who's done by far the most this game to actually organize that circle

like how the fuck am i supposed to think you're town from this? help me help you

On March 24 2015 14:17 Trfel wrote:
Ritoky, discussing sicklucker's recent activities has little purpose, and there is good reason not to.

I would rather you analyzed LightningStrike's list post, and/or people's responses to it. That is more concrete, more useful, and has no downside.

On March 24 2015 14:36 Alakaslam wrote:

Rayn is not asshole

He just has a different strategy

On March 25 2015 03:06 Fecalfeast wrote:
If you guys are serious I can do filter diving or whatever and actually play.

How is me making a case a scumtell, though?

On March 25 2015 04:27 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Ritoky, Onegu's claim should resolve itself by nighttime. He said he'll claim his partner at EoN.

On March 25 2015 04:30 Vivax wrote:
But maybe I'm biased about Damdred, I'm still somewhat paranoid on him.

On March 25 2015 04:47 Fecalfeast wrote:

People should be scumreading me for the fact that i make cases?

What?

On March 25 2015 04:44 rsoultin wrote:


considering how many of us are actually aware of the game he's talking about...

eh, nvm lol i wasn't gonna talk. evil people being too interesting xP

On March 25 2015 04:56 rsoultin wrote:


lol you're cute xP

On March 25 2015 05:39 Damdred wrote:
Also just a observation if I get lynched soon tonight is interesting. Like all of a sudden Palmar says why I'm not up for lynch and stopping it there, ritoky says he doesn't like me but gives a weak read based on conjecture ans besides that and shows nothing from my small filter why he hates me. He has a great way to read me but decides not to.

And now vivax says damdred paranoia. Its interesting to me

On March 25 2015 06:20 Damdred wrote:
Who is against a ritoky/Rayn lynch and for what reason

On March 25 2015 06:58 Superbia wrote:


There were mason claims and a fake Tracker in rayn (iirc). I'm just speculating because I believe more information can be extracted from the NKs with 2 vigi claims.

Let's eliminate the world in which both vigis are real, and slam is town:
- Scum never RBs Vivax because:
- You show 4 KP in the night (withholding a possible mafia vig shot), 4 town die, town suspects vigis due to possibility of mafia vig. Mafia probably wins game.

Hence, if you believe both vigis, Slam is probably always mafia.

On March 25 2015 07:08 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

1. You don't know if Vivax is shooting Slam or someone else.
2. RBing Vivax isn't between 4 or 2 KP but 4 or 3 KP
3. An alive town Slam is highly likely to get lynched.
I don't find your case very convincing. I think there's a good chance Slam is scum, but not because of this.

On March 25 2015 07:09 Superbia wrote:
Like I am showing, with math, why it is the correct play for mafia to let both vigi KP go through if it's both on town. You get a possible d3 mylo with 2 huge question marks (vigis), which you will just leave alive for the rest of the game. SO EASY.

On March 25 2015 07:10 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

Super serious at the start, convincingly wanted to change his town meta, then basically stopped playing. If he truly felt strongly about it I think we would've seen more of him this game.

On March 25 2015 07:16 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

Can you explain that read on him?

On March 25 2015 07:25 Superbia wrote:
Like I think my logic here is pretty fucking solid.

On March 25 2015 07:11 ritoky wrote:


Yeah but you're making a lot of assumptions. Such as vigis don't shoot into prot, JK doesn't stop a vigi shot, and vigis shoot town instead of mafia. All of those things have to break mafia's way for the mathematical scenario you brought up to occur. That's a lot of factors out of mafia's control.

On March 25 2015 07:31 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Also I remember something something about when Ritoky makes sense he's scum. He's making sense now so it bodes poorly for him.

On March 14 2015 09:55 ritoky wrote:
The Grand Manifesto On Why Ritoky is Confirmed Town:

1) Trollzy play - ritoky is incapable of humor and trollzy play as mafia. recently he demonstrated some ability to do it as Serial Killer, but that is very different from mafia.

Examples of ritoky being trollzy -

cell mafia 2: ritoky spams the thread with american flags and propoganda for the first 50 pages. link

titanic return of mspaint: ritoky literally does nothing the entire first and second day but antagonize people and general dickbaggery. link

mafia down under 1: such troll, much wow link

2) The angry tunnel does not exist - The #1 mafia tell ritoky has as has been indicated by many players is that as mafia ritoky gets very angry when things don't go his way and he is prone to tunneling on a player and not interacting with the rest of the game. ritoky is also completely incapable of understanding jokes and flips out when people call him scum. in this game ritoky has pushed literal 0 people, never given a damn, and is content with getting lynched. clear town.

Example of angry ritoky tunnels:

Imperial mafia:






3) As mafia ritoky always has very clear lynch targets and tries to push them. This one is difficult to quote in a concise manner, you will have noticed it if you cared to do the research. Essentially, as mafia I like controlling the lynch, and I like influencing the direction of the game. Having not pushed a scum read this game, sorry cannot be mafia.

4) ritoky loves him some bussing. Not only does ritoky bus teammates hard, but he pushes back even harder. In this game, if ritoky were scum with JAT he would have bussed JAT HARD. He did not, cannot be scum.

Examples:

Down Under Mafia 2: ritoky tries hard to lynch Alakaslam day 1, after he magically survives, ritoky get's pissed off and calls for a vigi shot on teammate.




Carol of the Bells: Holyflare randomly starts scum reading ritoky for no reason, ritoky turns on the bus train




Imperial Mafia: ritoky's scum reads include robik (town), superbia (teammate), marv (teammate), damdred (teammate), sicklucker (town)

ritoky didn't bus JAT and doesn't have firm enough scum reads to be bussing this game. Always busses as mafia, cannot be mafia.

5) The damdred factor - Damdred has a soul read on me. He subbed into a game where no one had suggested the idea I could be SK and called me SK 2 posts in. Damdred has called ritoky town, ritoky is town. Further ritoky always shoots damdred if ritoky is mafia. ALWAYS.

6) The VT claim - very simple mafia mechanics here, if you can't understand it I don't think you deserve to be playing right now. ritoky plays troll all day 1 phase, if ritoky is mafia in this situation and is faced with lynch pressure, ritoky claims PR and either outs a PR for a trade or buys a free day. Rather than do this, ritoky pre-emptively before the lynch pressure exists claims VT. This is a play that is literally the most inefficient and stupid thing ever as mafia.

7) Divergent reads - ritoky was mislynched a lot early on in his mafia career because he doesn't often give reads in a manner that coincides or agrees with the "vets" (really the circlejerk party). In the process of rolling 13 straight town games in his first 13 TL games, it became widely known that ritoky had divergent reads as town and sick day 1 reads that should be taken to the bank. A prime example is Hearthstone mafia. In games where ritoky is mafia his reads tend to not be very against the grain.

8) The last and simplest to understand point of how ritoky cannot be mafia: the notorious giant list post. Very commonly when ritoky is mafia he makes a giant list of every player in the game and gives reads on them. It is atrociously bad and easy to spot.

And that my friends is how there is literally 0 way ritoky is ever mafia this game.

tl;dr:
1) troll and jokes = town (filter examples)
2) angry tunnels when mafia, no angry tunnel this game
3) likes to have clear lynch targets as mafia, pushed 0 people this game = town
4) ritoky is #1 TL busser as mafia, did not bus JAT
5) damdred soul read, ritoky always shoots damdred ASAP
6) VT claim, would have claimed PR under pressure
7) ritoky reads counter to thread sentiment -> ritoky town
8) no giant read list post = ritoky town

you now know how it is impossible for ritoky to be mafia this game. anyone who votes on me is confirming their own idiocy.

On March 25 2015 07:32 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
I think someone said it in the obs qt of the game where ritoky and oats were scum at the end.

On March 25 2015 07:38 Trfel wrote:
Damdred, do you remember how ritoky played in Down Under 2?

He tried far harder than everyone else in the game, and continued to do so throughout. The only tell I am currently aware of that he was scum in that game was the way he waffled on his scum partners.

I'm hesitant to town read him at this time.

On March 25 2015 07:53 Trfel wrote:
I suppose maybe it's possible we have three jailkeepers.... Maybe if there's six mafia? Would that be balanced?

On March 25 2015 08:10 Damdred wrote:
I'm glad I said shoot Palmar: ) that makes me happy

On March 25 2015 08:24 Damdred wrote:
4 possible what Eden.

I'm not mason

On March 25 2015 08:28 Damdred wrote:
Don't forget breshke I think?

I haven't ignored oneg necessarily he's blue claimed

On March 21 2015 10:48 Damdred wrote:


Hf literally claims a role every game he's not generally..

On March 22 2015 02:46 Damdred wrote:


I'm going to be working from this mostly tonight tomorrow i'll probably expand a bit more or Monday depending on time constraints, I kind of want to look at the other wagons and see how they fell apart but this is probably the most important i'm deleting the failed wagons at this point but leaving wagons with single voters on it.
________________________________________________________________________________________________
Firstly I want to talk about the claims a bit going forward,

HF and Oneg are confirmed town. There is no reason at all for mafia to claim Mason early in the game. For starters you give up two of your team mates just in case one flips on a cop check or a rogue vigilante shot. They are the easiest people in the game to confirm 100%. Its idiotic for anyone to say that HF or Onegu are scum because of X. HF made the right call in the long run if HF flips scum, then onegu has to flip scum. its simple, mafia don't claim mason in this type of situation so people quit being bad.

Two vigilantes are sort of likely in my mind. BH has had two vigilantes before in one of his games which makes ti more possible and then when you add in the orb which is basically a randomized killer in some instances it sort of makes more sense to me. The orb can act as another kill power for mafia or town, so another vig to help with a bit of balance makes a little sense to me. For now i'd rather just leave this alone and focus elsewhere.

Rayns tracker claim is possibly the most meh to me as its hard for me to see so many hard confirming roles on people especially with masons in the game. I still think it might be true at this point though.

(And 5 power roles makes sense in this setup with a weaker mason and a weak tracker also. Three weak roles and two strongers mafia probably has stronger roles in this setup as well if this is the case)
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Now moving back to the voting,

Bill Murray (8): Holyflare, Eden1892, rsoultin, Superbia, Vivax, Breshke, raynpelikoneet, Palmar
Vivax (7): Artanis[Xp], LightningStrike, sicklucker, Toadesstern, Trfel, ExO_, Damdred
LightningStrike (3): Bill Murray,FecalFeast, Onegu
Toadesstern (1): VisceraEyes,
sicklucker (1): Alakaslam


Not Voting (0):

Taking out the strikes at this juncture just for a clearer reading.

Here we have confirmed BM who flipped green pushed by Mason HF to not lynch into the claims. We have claimed mason partner onegu on LS, with confirmed towny BM. We also have Tracker Rayn on BM.

Also apart from the claims HF looks really towny himself, he pushed his own ideas early and helped get conversation started without stone walling anything. He pushed a lynch onto a towny he did but town is more than likely to be wrong than right especially early on.

Vivax a part from the claim actually looks better after a glance at his filter, he tried really hard and his reads that he gave at the end especially towards little things like Art and myself actually had really good insightful things in them. He acted the part of town dying really well if hes scum and I don't think he can do it that well as scum i'm pretty sold of Vivax being town in this situation. His early filter screamed scum to me early but after that point he just looks really towny especially after the claim.

Toads actions around the claim look decently towny to me at this point. Some of his thought process is jumbeled but I don't see the point of a mafia CC there just to go 1-1 especially if its a real scum vigi at this juncture. Its dumb to give up your shot in that sense for a shot at lynching the town vigilante. It just doesn't make logical sense to me to do that.

I colored myself green since i'm confirmed to myself at least

_______________________________________________________________________________________________

Bill Murray (8): Holyflare, Eden1892, rsoultin, Superbia, Vivax, Breshke, raynpelikoneet, Palmar
Vivax (7): Artanis[Xp], LightningStrike, sicklucker, Toadesstern, Trfel, ExO_, Damdred
LightningStrike (3): Bill Murray,FecalFeast, Onegu
Toadesstern (1): VisceraEyes,
sicklucker (1): Alakaslam

My next stop is on the Eden and FecalFeast train. These two are probably my top two towns at this point in time, some of it is gut feelings but most of it is based on the play in the game up to this point.

FecalFeast has played extremely aggressive up to this point. He has questioned people pretty doggedly and pushed his own ideas forward. He cased LS earlier in the game and it wasn't a bad case I think hes put in the most work in trying to figure out peoples alignments and figure out motivations through his postings. hes really towny and has a filter that shows that hes trying to solve the game.

Eden has shown an interesting amount of play this game. Eden has been involved in almost everything that has been going on in the thread besides a few quick breaks and catching up. Also has shown to re-evaluate the game as the game has went along and has obviously been paying close attention and showing the thread his thought process. The questions that he asks and the pressure that he tries to apply to people look towny to me and the anger (which he is obviously trying to stop) looks like it is coming from town Eden. I am really sure that this is Eden also at times you can see a real lack of knowing what to do that I can see coming from town Eden, while at the same time pushing his own thoughts and feelings in the thread to try to get things done.

_______________________________________________________________________________________________


Bill Murray (8): Holyflare, Eden1892, rsoultin, Superbia, Vivax, Breshke, raynpelikoneet, Palmar
Vivax (7): Artanis[Xp], LightningStrike, sicklucker, Toadesstern, Trfel, ExO_, Damdred
LightningStrike (3): Bill Murray,FecalFeast, Onegu
Toadesstern (1): VisceraEyes,
sicklucker (1): Alakaslam

Now we come to the hard portion of the reads, I have Rsoultin, Breshke as town.

Rsoultins filter was absolutely HORRIBLE to get through at this point (really shame on you rs for derailing the thread at point for hideous things to talk about *finger wagging*). But besides the derailing you can see how Rsoultin is going through the thread and trying to get people to post there thoughts to get more information from it, it feels more relaxed than any scum game I have currently seen Rsoultin play While it lacks a lot of amazing things to be frank it does have a clear consistant thread going through it that you can follow on who she scum reads and why.

Breshke I started off as scum reading because of lack of activity at points and a real lack of effort pushing the game forward. However Breshke re-entered the thread after that and seamlessly changed my mind, he was involved in things he posted his own thoughts and pushed the thread forward. At points he challenged sl on the read and seemed to want to evaluate people based on what they were saying. The scum game that Breshke normally plays with is horrible, and I just don't think I can see Bresh as scum at this point in time.

They are both solid town at this point.
________________________________________________________________________________________________

Bill Murray (8): Holyflare, Eden1892, rsoultin, Superbia, Vivax, Breshke, raynpelikoneet, Palmar
Vivax (7): Artanis[Xp], LightningStrike, sicklucker, Toadesstern, Trfel, ExO_, Damdred
LightningStrike (3): Bill Murray,FecalFeast, Onegu
Toadesstern (1): VisceraEyes
sicklucker (1): Alakaslam

Slam is probably scum in this situation sadly. My earlier read on slam was that he was trying to take the game more serious and that his attack on HF was indicative of a town slam trying to be different. This is true that slam can be serious and still be town, HOWEVER there was another tell that I use to distinguish between town slam and scum slam that I didn't want to reveal till I got to see more of what he does. Lazy slam+Serious slam=scum slam. Anytime slam is serious and active in the thread and doing things such as attacking HF or digging at people hes more likely town but as the game went along he fell off the face of the world and only showed up to complain about the thread and still did little to nothing to help the game progress only complaining that we lynched BM at this juncture. I think he has a good shot to be scum.

The other solo voter at this point was VE. I think VE is actually town here. His vote when looked at without the strikes isn't actualy in context. He was trying to get what he thought was the scum vigilante killed and had to leave before deadline and the BM wagon taking off. Aside from that he has been decently proactive when he has been here and I do not get the scum sense from him reading his filter, his anger at BM getting lynched instead of one of the Vig seems genuine and he seems to actually be putting forward a real effort at this juncture. I think hes a good towny at this point after reading

________________________________________________________________________________________________

Bill Murray (8): Holyflare, Eden1892, rsoultin, Superbia, Vivax, Breshke, raynpelikoneet, Palmar
Vivax (7): Artanis[Xp], LightningStrike, sicklucker, Toadesstern, Trfel, ExO_, Damdred
LightningStrike (3): Bill Murray,FecalFeast, Onegu
Toadesstern (1): VisceraEyes
sicklucker (1): Alakaslam

LS is scum I think....This makes me sad writing this. He just seems so lazy and its really hard to see where hes at or where hes going with his reads at this juncture. He just feels forced and he just doesn't seem to be digging or doing homework on his meta...

Palmar is town I think. His antics EoD were a little difficult to keep up with but he just seemed to not want to lynch Vivax and would of rathered lynch his scum read in Toad. Some of his early game stuff was a bit meh like his interaction with toad. But he has said some really towny things to me, his slight pressure on me during the course of the game was good I thought.

________________________________________________________________________________________________

Bill Murray (8): Holyflare, Eden1892, rsoultin, Superbia, Vivax, Breshke, raynpelikoneet, Palmar
Vivax (7): Artanis[Xp], LightningStrike, sicklucker, Toadesstern, Trfel, ExO_, Damdred
LightningStrike (3): Bill Murray,FecalFeast, Onegu
Toadesstern (1): VisceraEyes
sicklucker (1): Alakaslam


I am probably going to regret this but i'm going to mark SL in as a towny at this point. His wanting to take vivax hostage to get me lynched to a point felt towny, he wanted his person lynched no matter what. His work after lynch when he was here was pretty godo and the questions and observations he made while catching up I felt came from a towny perspective. I have a good feeling that Sl is town at this juncture.

Exo is a very likely scum in this situation. His actions after eod do not exactly make sense to me coming from a logical place. He just seems so angry that we left both claimed vigilantes alive when its just so much better to get the extra information. He seems to be unable to scum hunt currently because of this and is just harping on how bad everyone is instead of pointing out legitimate things that we need to focus on. As such if you look at his early game he had to be pressured to an extent to make any type of conclusion when it had been talked about before. His pressure on Eden looked kind of bad to me, he lacked follow up also on questions that were answered to him and he just let fall to the way side. He probably is the most likely mafia out of anyone at this juncture

________________________________________________________________________________________________

This leaves me in a world where I have two mafia or one depending on setup between Superbia, Trfel and Artanis.

I am the most sure that Superbia is the scum in this group. His actions near eod are really interesting for instance he talks to Palmar at points like he is confirmed town to him. He keeps asking Palmar where his vote is going at one point and wants to follow him and complains when Palmar is wanting to switch back to toad. Really weird inconsistencies in the early play that myself and Eden pointed out (mostly Eden to give credit), Vivax also pointed out some really good things earlier. Really lackluster in scum hunting and backs off most things when confronted ie against Eden.

Bill Murray (8): Holyflare, Eden1892, rsoultin, Superbia, Vivax, Breshke, raynpelikoneet, Palmar
Vivax (7): Artanis[Xp], LightningStrike, sicklucker, Toadesstern, Trfel, ExO_, Damdred
LightningStrike (3): Bill Murray,FecalFeast, Onegu
Toadesstern (1): VisceraEyes
sicklucker (1): Alakaslam

Artanis had some rally interesting bad things in his filter in retrospect. Just sheeping onto my case when I posted it is a real head scratcher. Maybe it comes from being so sure and playing with Vivax so much and his filter is really big at the same time so i'm really torn and not sure what to make of Artanis. He did have some good interactions with myself (but he dropped the scum read really fast even though I had little follow up) and he had an ok interaction with VE when they were arguing. I'm still leaning town on Art currently but things bother me

Trfel started off really bad in my mind. And the eod was so/so at points it felt like Trfel was just settling on things rather than digging, such as the vote on Vivax. It makes sense to some degree and I might be expecting to much in that regard but I think a total town trfel would look elsewhere and see what he could find. Also his mid game was really good I felt which was what initially changed my mind on him. His early game was pretty bad and lackluster, but his return to the thread after he couldn't sleep and the barrage of thoughts got me to come around on him. His later postings before EoD were not bad as well as you could keep track of his thought process.

________________________________________________________________________________________________

Wagon Formations.

This was probably one of the hardest things I've had to look at.

Vivax wagon came about when I pushed vivax and Art immediately jumped on followed quickly by LS. LS still had me as null at that moment in time I believe as he is usually really antsy about following me after I tricked him in titanic. But instead of questioning or looking for himself to try to see if I had a meta point he instantly sheeped soon as he saw it which makes it seem like he is the scum that initially started the piling up process. The claim by vivax I belive had him leading the lynch 5-3 over rayn. His wagon began to disintergrate at that point until toad counter claimed and people started piling up. This wagon was probably the one mafia most wanted to happen btw as it was so quickly piled on even as vivax started giving his last reads on.

Toads wagon had Vivax, Palmar, Rayn and Ve being the main pushers to get him lynched. This wagon gained little traction as he was the CC and most people generally agreed that mafia would not cc there and go 1-1.

BM was a last minute wagon formed by HF to give us more time to scum hunt and be able to get more information by using the Vig to shoot who we wanted to at that time.. It was a last second wagon with most of the people who wanted to lynch toad swinging over with some hold outs from lynching Rayn. Most of the people who could of hammered vivax were totally against his lynch so they would be unable and I feel like super could not risk taking the negative effects of hammering the vig so had to stay put.

I still need to look on the earlier parts of the day and see how people were voting and what was being pushed.

TLDR:

Scum team:
Slam, LS, Super, Exo

Undecided:
Trfel and Artanis

blah blah blah really wordy much wow. Damdred bored at home.

On March 24 2015 08:06 Damdred wrote:


exlain?

On March 24 2015 12:12 Damdred wrote:
No clue onegu....

Anyway Eden, part of it was how BM rayn was when he was here compared to his most recent mafia showing. And his most recent town showing (mini mafia by fecal feast) he was much more balanced in that game than in XXX or in this game.

He also started fights for no reason with Palmar here and myself in XXX. And his read progression in this one and XXX was hard to follow at points as well.

On March 25 2015 07:29 Damdred wrote:
Also orb user do it to Palmar! Ultimate use out of it

On March 24 2015 18:31 sicklucker wrote:
weekend*

On March 25 2015 08:32 Damdred wrote:
Can I be confirmed town because I told orb user to shoot Palmar.

I feel like vivax I have a theory brewing

On March 25 2015 08:45 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

Onegu not actually being mason would help a lot and it's looking that way.

On March 25 2015 08:42 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

That's presuming SL was telling the truth which no one knew, and presuming Damdred remembered SL saying that. This point is stretching AT THE VERY LEAST.

On March 25 2015 08:51 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

Because apparently he found it important to mention. It's really not much of a stretch.

On March 25 2015 08:55 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

I'm willing to revisit Damdred once my PoE proves ineffective. I'm pretty sure I can get a margin of error that leaves us at lylo pending on who the orb had if there's a mafia in my confirmed town list.

On March 25 2015 14:46 Onegu wrote:



Like how did a fake mason claim hurt town if I'm town, and how is it smart as scum. Therefor it's not BS.

On March 25 2015 14:53 Onegu wrote:



Nope it has confirmed sicklucker as town, plus I'm going to go back to the point I claimed mason with Rayn to see who didn't believe, but that is moreso if you flip scum which I don't think is likely. Also it made mafia miss a shot as I got n1 protection while getting shot. So what were you saying about it not helping town?

On March 25 2015 15:04 Onegu wrote:
And did it really cause that much confusion? Yeah a bit after HF was shot. Then more when I claimed Rayn and Rayn said he wasn't with me. But for the most part it was ignored other than wanting me to claim partner so they could put 2 people as confirmed.

On March 25 2015 07:25 ritoky wrote:


Not really, but I can try a little bit. It is primarily a tone, content, and specificity read. The tone and content read comes from me joking a lot with him and engaging in eye of the chupazi training and kinda starting to get a glimpse inside the wifom bunker after the great bombing of the chupazitron 50000 cracked the shell. There's also this kinda specific tell that he does in regards to directly addressing people with jokes/antagonism as town versus doing it in a general sense as mafia that I don't wanna give away. There was a game a while back when slam fooled me for a good long while cuz I had 0 clue how to read him, then something clicked. It was return of MSpaint mafia. I found that in that game I could very clearly tell who Slam wanted to lynch every phase. He didn't necessarily push them or make an agenda or lead people onto them, but I always knew the exact person he wanted dead. I don't know who he wants lynched as of yet.

There's some other stuff to it, but you would call it absolutely crazy.

On March 25 2015 15:37 Trfel wrote:
Ritoky, why should I townread you?

You crushed me last game. Have you done anything you are incapable of as scum yet? Is there something I missed in your scumplay last game?

On March 25 2015 15:54 Eden1892 wrote:
meh sorry can't take Damdred out as of yet. But if everyone else on that list is someone you're cool with then I'm sure you'll have time to convince me otherwise, yeah?

On March 25 2015 17:59 Eden1892 wrote:
ritoky talk to me about this meta read Damdred's supposed to have on you. What is it, why is it so effective iyo, how accurate has it been, what makes you say Damdred hasn't been using it and what does it mean for his alignment that he hasn't?

On March 26 2015 02:21 Trfel wrote:
Hm, Onegu, I certainly hope that surgery goes okay.

Vivax is generally considered town due to the number of posts and the effort he has been putting into this game.

Eden is town because he has also been putting a ton of effort into this game, and he has been constantly thinking critically and willing to discuss with anyone. He's the only certain townread that I'm willing to give for gameplay alone.

On March 26 2015 03:52 Fecalfeast wrote:

this post actually feels town to me

On March 26 2015 05:00 Damdred wrote:
....onegu has a way to read rayn 100%. He has a god tier soul read on him supposedly and anytime I've read or been in a game with them ehs always read him correctly.

This is the worst play for scum to claim...just all risk with no reward honestly

On March 26 2015 05:09 Alakaslam wrote:

It feels meh to me as I don't have any cross referebnce to what he is saying, and I know I am town and am 80% certain Vivax is scum.

On March 26 2015 05:18 Damdred wrote:
Just because I think oneg has a god tier read on someone doesn't mean hes necessarily right on it at this point.

Its honestly probably Breshke and then have to go through town reads to figure out the rest. Maybe superbia at this point I thought super was scummy since early meh.

On March 26 2015 12:18 Eden1892 wrote:
ritoky
postrt_this_game: 4.7438
postrt_town: 3.7115
postrt_scum: 1.9685

On March 27 2015 04:20 Vivax wrote:


You're the guy I was just looking for. Aren't you suspicious of Damdred? Now is the time for a good case.

On March 27 2015 03:58 Damdred wrote:
I kinda want to lynch ritokyvright now for totally vanishing and not pushing his soul scum read currently. He also is missing the drive to push much of anything and he's super serial

On March 27 2015 04:27 ritoky wrote:


give me like 20 mins to catch up on the thread, then i will start working on it.

On March 27 2015 05:08 Damdred wrote:
I'd vote super with you art. I just think Rayn was scun

On March 27 2015 05:25 Vivax wrote:
I rescind my vig claim

On March 27 2015 06:23 Superbia wrote:
Rayn/Ritoky is the easy mafia that will be bussed tomorrow.

On March 25 2015 13:21 Superbia wrote:
Ritoky is by definition town in my current world.

On March 27 2015 06:30 Superbia wrote:


Look who shows up to bury me. You bring bad luck to my town game ritoky. I wanted to go after the big mafia today. The one they're relying on to carry the fucking game. But nope. Of course all of the mafia are lurkers and people on the background, because that's how mafia wins, and that's why palmar was on the background.

On March 27 2015 07:25 Onegu wrote:
I claimed VT that must count for something right?

On March 27 2015 07:29 Onegu wrote:



Well I claim VT now!

On March 26 2015 08:15 Damdred wrote:
btw I think its really depressing and stupid you guys are basically discussing POLICY lynching people after we killed two mafia instead of diving into their filters and looking for connections or weird interacitons between them.

Everyone really needs to read breshke filter and stop being lazy and give opinions, instead of talking abou tpolicy lynching slam/oneg at this point.

On March 26 2015 08:26 Damdred wrote:
Ok since policy lynching is ok when I get home i'm going to RNG this lynch ( a form of policy) and go from there.

Since its what the thread wants its what it will get, a total lackluster approach to a day where no worthwhile discussion or attempt to get peoples alignments right or any work what so ever just fighting who to policy lynch because they are scared of them in lylo

On March 27 2015 20:48 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Guys, here's my plan. Ritoky spends all day talking about why Damdred is scum tomorrow. We lynch him. If he flips mafia, we can clear Damdred since there's no way scum would bus their only buddy that's considered kind of confirmed. If he flips town, we know he's genuine in his analysis of Damdred and we take a good hard look at him.

Reasons: We have PoE if we can eliminate Damdred and we presume my town circle is correct. Also Ritoky is in the PoE list.

On March 28 2015 04:52 Damdred wrote:
Your slot has more history than just you in fact most of the interactions come from rayn especially. You haven't really been trying overall to solve the game I feel though, and you are missing your town traits shrug

On March 28 2015 05:00 Fecalfeast wrote:

Yeah but I took 2 levels in fighter for the bonus feats

On March 28 2015 05:03 Fecalfeast wrote:
3.5 because my buddy owns all but 3 of every WOTC rulebook for 3.5

On March 27 2015 20:48 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Guys, here's my plan. Ritoky spends all day talking about why Damdred is scum tomorrow. We lynch him. If he flips mafia, we can clear Damdred since there's no way scum would bus their only buddy that's considered kind of confirmed. If he flips town, we know he's genuine in his analysis of Damdred and we take a good hard look at him.

Reasons: We have PoE if we can eliminate Damdred and we presume my town circle is correct. Also Ritoky is in the PoE list.

On March 28 2015 05:17 Fecalfeast wrote:
So from where I'm sitting. There has to be a scum who is bamboozling everyone. Scum is almost certainly looking to me for a mislynch this coming day, if everyone is right on super/ritoky. I'm going to have a look at the big townies now that we have some information.

On March 28 2015 05:38 Vivax wrote:


So even if I'm hypothetically scum my team would know I shouldn't be carrying KP. GJ, try again.

On March 28 2015 05:44 Fecalfeast wrote:
well i didn't really do anything so that makes sense

On March 29 2015 09:15 Superbia wrote:
I also presume that scum has orb, since there have been no post-night claims? Like even a possible town result could be useful.

On March 29 2015 09:30 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

I already brought up orb wifom things during EoN, could've scared scum off from claiming anything if they had the orb.

On March 29 2015 09:36 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Anyway my carpet bomb strategy prefers Ritoky going all out on figuring Damdred out then lynching Ritoky and seeing if there's any reason to worry. This is further bolstered by the fact that Ritoky first agreed, then (if scum) realized that he'd have to flip scum for it, flips his thoughts and flips his read on me on something that is pretty much null (I'm pretty sure he had a townread on me until that point), asks Vivax about the plan (why Vivax specifically?) and flips his tunnel on Damdred (90 mentions) entirely.

On March 29 2015 09:37 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

What could they claim that could gain them cred? The kill went through, any VT claim on anyone would just connect them.

On March 29 2015 09:42 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

The orb can't red check anyone, just rolecheck. Any mafia in PoE claiming a red check on someone outside of PoE would get lynched first anyway. Mafia could still think they can win if they eliminate the most vocal townies and convince the more paranoid ones to lynch with them.

On March 29 2015 09:41 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

Convince me someone is more town in my PoE 5 than Damdred and I will.

On March 29 2015 09:50 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

Effort and detail in analysis. He's made multiple posts in a style I've never seen him do as mafia. I've also thought on one line with him a few times this game early on. He's made two vote count analyses which are the biggest posts in his filter and they look quite good, you should be able to find them fairly quickly.

On March 29 2015 09:56 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

I was scum with him in Imperial and I find that he's definitely playing beyond that right now. In Imperial, he was always hanging a bit in the danger zone, and I don't think he ever created an analysis like he has this game. I'll look it up just to make sure though.

On March 29 2015 09:53 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
I also still want an explanation for this.

And your read on me right now.

On March 29 2015 10:00 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

Have you thoroughly gone into the analysis he's done though? I find it extremely hard to imagine he can fake that as scum. Also what's with this soft accusing thing I highlighted? I'll ask again: What is your read on me?

On March 29 2015 09:52 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

And I think you're really wrong here because you're describing the only play mafia could make to win if they're all in PoE and for some reason you want to give them that chance when I'm over 95% certain on every townread of mine besides MAYBE Damdred. I'm not going to ignore the strength of these reads and the desparation mafia would have based on a single redcheck, that's ridiculous.

On March 29 2015 10:07 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Actually, I was wrong. You were never okay with the idea, you instantly replied cautiously.

What made you change from thinking I might be scum for this post to now again reading me town?

Half an hour later, you asked Vivax what he thought about my post. Why Vivax?

Now that you've confirmed you think I'm town, that post can no longer be a reason why you switched your opinion on Damdred, so why did you switch your opinion from being near certain to possibly?

On March 29 2015 10:11 Artanis[Xp] wrote:

So you're telling me to look at Imperial. I look at Imperial and see it's inferior to what he's done here, then you tell me he's improved it? You can't have it both ways.


Doesn't your argument suggest that we should always lynch into the person making the claim if they're in PoE yourself? Why did you argue otherwise earlier?

On March 29 2015 10:42 Superbia wrote:
I need to go to sleep soon. Ritoky, from your perspective, if you're town, Rayn fakeclaiming Tracker and not getting RBed (seemingly) nor getting put KP on should influence your reads. From your perspective, a confirmed town fake claimed a cop role and did not get answered whatsoever. In fact, they chose to roleblock a Vigi. Why are you not questioning this vigi?

On March 29 2015 13:24 Trfel wrote:
I see three practical possibilities for the Night 1 KP.

Assuming that Onegu town,

On March 30 2015 03:24 Onegu wrote:



And what does my lynch tell you?

On March 30 2015 04:24 Artanis[Xp] wrote:
Well, what did you think about my explanations regarding the orb, and why did you ask Vivax in particular?

Also, what's your feeling on Superbia right now after my exchange with him?

On March 30 2015 05:17 Vivax wrote:


You got no reasons for a standalone damdred scumread?

On March 30 2015 05:35 Vivax wrote:


What makes you want to lynch Onegu first if Damdred is in your opinion scummy on his own? That makes everything sound like bs.

On March 30 2015 05:38 Onegu wrote:
Also how are my claims scum as fuck ritoky?

On March 30 2015 05:43 Onegu wrote:



Not all fake claims are bad. I mean seriously. It didn't quite accomplish what I wanted but in a world where SL doesn't get the orb he still becomes almost confirmed town with how he reacted to HF being my mason partner. And I don't think it was that confusing plus I drew a mafia shot, how is that not good for town?

On March 25 2015 05:51 ritoky wrote:


you're not utilizing your read on me either.

hello pot, i am kettle.

i wrote down immediately in my notes: mason or mafia next to you. i just don't think the line of play you're taking in regards to me is something you would do if you were playing from an individual pov, it seems more like an approach you would take if you were collaborating. i feel like if you were solo you would be more confident in your read on me versus meta stuff on rayn.

my read on you usually takes about 36 hours to really get it down though. so in about 24 hours ask me damdred's alignment and i will give it to you with 100% accuracy.

On March 25 2015 06:24 ritoky wrote:


Are you mason with onegu?

Your filter has 0 interaction with him whatsoever. In fact you seem to go out of your way to ignore him.

On March 31 2015 08:19 Onegu wrote:
Ok I had the orb n3 and RB ritoky. Was waiting to see what got claimed today to see if I could catch scum ezpz

On March 31 2015 08:32 Onegu wrote:



Why?

On March 31 2015 08:35 Onegu wrote:



Thought I could catch scum fake claim orb RB then CC and EZPZ

On March 31 2015 08:45 Onegu wrote:
And after I RB you the kill still went through so my orb power told town nothing useful imo, was worth it to try to find scum.

On March 31 2015 09:29 Breshke wrote:
I dont see in anyway how onegu played that was antitown especially if he didnt realise the orb would dissapear.

On April 02 2015 08:23 Onegu wrote:

Wifom, I really hope you are town just so I can keep my soul read intact

On April 02 2015 08:22 Fecalfeast wrote:

You voted the other wagon, who is also town. All that means is you had the option to vote either player and picked me to make this post.

On April 02 2015 08:28 Vivax wrote:
The votecounts are kinda uninformative considering a rayn/Palmar/LS team

On April 02 2015 08:31 Fecalfeast wrote:



You guys have bad will saves

On April 02 2015 08:51 Fecalfeast wrote:

Breshke was town, I am town. You vote breshke and he flips town, you don't get to make any other posts you're making.
You vote me, I don't flip which leaves me unconfirmed so you can spout all this BS. If people swapped to me, you still get the ML. Sorry, I don't see how that makes you town

On April 02 2015 09:06 Fecalfeast wrote:

Does she tell people that you're both pregnant?

On April 03 2015 10:35 Fecalfeast wrote:
Take me out of your mafia list and I'll talk to you, ritoky. This really feels like mafia is just waiting for the win and makes me feel a little worse for voting for 24h days.

On April 03 2015 12:01 Fecalfeast wrote:
Like why isn't anyone pushing me except people in the POE list? Artanis is at least talking to me like a human, vivax came around to the idea of me being town but onegu and ritoky have had me in the scum pile for ages. I said I didn't want to vote breshke but tried to vote him last second to save myself? Nobody even bothered to question that decision.

Basically right now half of me feels like I'm the only green in the poe list and I'm the only chance for scum while the other half of me is convinced that there's two scum in a VERY comfortable spot just waiting for the inevitable lynching of ritoky/onegu/ff/damdred, regardless of any team mates in the pile....

Game is hard

On April 04 2015 05:32 Fecalfeast wrote:

What scum agenda have I pushed this game?

On April 04 2015 04:18 Damdred wrote:
I'm actually pretty sure ff is town here over oneg now meh.

I'll put effort in tonight