EPTwe want to play together again ^^ i'll try to refrain posting every thought that comes into my head this time -_-
Student Mafia V
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rsoultin
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we want to play together again ^^ i'll try to refrain posting every thought that comes into my head this time -_- | ||
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3 games, same ones as Trfel | ||
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^noob question of the day | ||
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are you playing? I thought you were replacing this game? | ||
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 yeah, the gungan is brand new ^^ still developing his algorithms lol | ||
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why do a self-imposed posting limit, geript? | ||
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It's certainly a convenient excuse to not have to post much as scum xP | ||
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On January 16 2015 11:22 geript wrote: After doing my review, it struck me how interesting it could be to focus on posting the most content and least fluff. hmm...if all you're doing is passively evaluating everyone else, I could see that working, but wouldn't it be hard to ask questions/pressure/push a lynch if you only have 10 posts in a 48hr period? | ||
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It would certainly be tricky xP Good luck. | ||
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On January 17 2015 07:20 Trfel wrote: He said that he would only be making 10 posts per day. I personally feel that it will be extremely hard for him to play effectively with 10 posts per day. If he is purposefully handicapping himself with a very strict post limit and that causes him to play poorly and be lynched, that's his fault; we can't allow for players to intentionally play badly. I will remove my vote if he proves himself useful. ##vote Tfel You're new but not bad. Not to mention I think you effectively posted with about that much (or less) in Carol and got us our first scum lynch. BS meter going off.  | ||
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On January 17 2015 10:24 LightningStrike wrote: It was to make a meta read on her and WarWaffle I only played 1 game with him and he seemed to be posting the same way he did in the last newbie game when he was Vet. Damdred's entrance post is all he got atm so I need to wait for a meta read on him. Although rsoultins only entrance was to vote you she didn't explain her reasoning for why she votign for you now. rsoultin welcome to the game now why calling BS on Tfrel's post? If it's a joke vote I can maybe understand but I don't see anything totally wrong with his vote except for the fact that gerpit had not posted yet so (shrugs) What's wrong with it is that the Trfel, before a single word was spoken...in fact practically the second the game started...decided to vote for someone because they are "intentionally playing bad". Not only has geript not posted at all in this thread, but Trfel himself has been very effective with quite minimal posts, and is usually very slow to vote or scumread people until he is sure. It may well be a pressure vote (the second the game started!) but not only is it more aggressive than I've come to expect from him, but his explanation is inherently false which he should know based on his own play in the last two games. Thus, BS meter. | ||
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On January 17 2015 10:31 Trfel wrote: I ended Carol of the Bells with a 3 page filter, 53 posts (plus or minus one, I lost count.. not going back to check since the exact number is irrelevant). Seeing as I skipped nearly all of Day 1 and Night 1, those posts came almost entirely from Day 2 and Night 2. Probably 45 of my posts at least were in that time period, which is three times as many as geript is suggesting. And of all people, I thought you knew how to spell my name? XD Typo. <3 you Trfel, lol. Game face back on. Now, much as I'd love to quibble with you about how may posts you made each day (and 45 is definitely wrong xP) the real point is that you have demonstrated yourself that high content, low post count play can be effective. I also have never seen this level of aggression from you...ever. So. I think that your explanation post is BS. And I said so by voting you here in-thread, where even I, as aggressive as I usually play, have never started off a game with a vote. ^^ | ||
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On January 17 2015 10:38 DarthPunk wrote: Why would scum put the spotlight on himself from the get go for no reason? Shit like this always looks bad but the underlying point ends up being that they don't give a fuck what they look like which is a townie trait because scum ALWAYS care what they look like due to their inherent feelings of guilt. Do you think Trfel is scum? Cause he is my biggest town read in the game so far. What does BS meter mean exactly? Why does Trefel's early vote fit with the mafia agenda? It means that his explanation does not line up with what I know of him. The vote I could really care less about. I think it's preemptive but not alignment indicative. His explanation for it directly contradicts the simple fact that Trfel plays effectively with a low post count, and LS is right in that I don't think I've ever seen him policy lynch. (Note that my vote never made it to the voting thread. I don't necessarily think he's scum but I want him to explain to me why the sudden near-180 in his play.) | ||
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On January 17 2015 10:45 Trfel wrote: There is no voting thread XD someone is really prepared for this game haha LightningStrike, you played in Carol of the Bells. So did LoneMeow. Any thoughts on him? Lolol, oops. Well, explain then. -cracks whip- Seriously, you've dodged twice now. First quibbling over how many posts you posted in Carol on Day 2, then commenting that I didn't read the OP. (Which is true >> probably should go do that now.) | ||
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On January 17 2015 10:47 LightningStrike wrote: I don't think there is a voting thread for this game fyi guys. Also what is the BS Meter? I never heard you use this term before can you explain it please? I used it in our last game, Night 1, with -Celestial-. It means that what he's saying strikes me as bullshit, or BS. On January 17 2015 10:47 DarthPunk wrote: So you are saying he is being a hypocrite? How does that affect his alignment? Like can only scum be Hypocrites? If so, what is your rationale for that belief? It means that I don't think he actually believes what he is saying. That is different from being a hypocrite, and if true, would in fact make him scum. | ||
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On January 17 2015 10:53 LightningStrike wrote: rsoultin can you tell me why you think JarJar your brother would ask for a no lynch? No se. Better to ask him. He isn't going to have anything to base his dead peoples' votes algorithm on without voting data...but I do know he detests Day 1 so -shrugs-. | ||
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On January 17 2015 10:59 Trfel wrote: I explained it already. I feel that geript is purposefully handicapping himself. Yes, his decision to use 10 posts per day was made before the game began, therefore before he knew his alignment. That doesn't matter though, since if he really is going to handicap himself, he deserves to get lynched for it. If he either stops using this self-imposed restriction or proves that he can play successfully using it, great for him. I generally try to be careful with calling people scum, that is true. But voting someone and calling them scum are very different things. Votes can be done in jest or for a wide variety of reasons, surely I don't need to provide examples for you. So you are telling me that he deserves to get lynched regardless of alignment. Are you planning on scumhunting this game? Will you change your vote if you do scumread someone, or will it stay so long as geript doesn't break the 10 post barrier? | ||
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On January 17 2015 11:50 Trfel wrote: Ok, I will respond to jarjar's request for a no lynch. No, we will definitely lynch. No lynch on Day 1 is bad because it usually leaves you in an almost equally uninformed position on Day 2. Eventually you have to make that first lynch. Yes, town is often lynched on Day 1, but you can still lynch scum on Day 1 with effective play (and a bit of luck). I will keep my vote on geript until I feel that it is better for me to move it. It is really silly to ask me for rules for what I will do with my vote, since it's my own judgement and there is absolutely no reason for me to try and set rules for every possible scenario. Mhm. The question was not what your rules are. The question was do you intend to scumhunt at all? Why is it so difficult for you to answer a simple question? Will you or will you not adhere to policy voting over scumread voting? Since you can't possibly be scumreading geript off of no posting (and have admitted to such) I feel that it's a valid question. | ||
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By admitted to such I meant that you have outright stated that the vote is not dependent on his alignment. Which it shouldn't be, so that makes sense. | ||
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On January 17 2015 12:00 Damdred wrote: Can't policy voting be scum hunting as well rso It can. Not sure how it is in this situation, but it can be, certainly. | ||
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On January 17 2015 12:04 Damdred wrote: Kk so its three. Tell me where you are at in the game this second Ls. RS its possible but voting feript out is like an rng lynch it can hit scum but who knows. This is exactly why I am questioning Trfel this hard. He usually has very good reasons for voting people out, right or wrong...to enter with a straight up policy vote less than a minute after game start to me is out-of-character for him. -shrugs- | ||
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On January 17 2015 12:51 Trfel wrote: rsoultin, I would like to know what you expected to gain from some of your later questions, particularly, "do you intend to scumhunt this game"? There is only one possible answer to that question. Also, do you have any thoughts on the rest of the thread? I'm surprised that you picked on my opening but not GlowingBear's opening, which is bad for reasons I have previously stated. That said, rsoultin's questioning does fit with her town meta. For an example of this, see the opening of the most recent Newbie Mafia. LightningStrike, why do you townread GlowingBear for that opening? Yes, it is true that there is no motivation for scum to claim VT right at the start of the game with no pressure. But there is also no motivation for town to claim VT right at the start of the game with no pressure. Sure, I have thoughts. One is how wriggly wormy you're being here lately. The scumhunt question obviously was rhetorical; it implied that your policy vote is not scumhunting. Again, you are nitpicking instead of addressing the point of my questions: namely, now that you've gotten discussion started, how serious really are you about that vote? GB has been questioned without really responding, as has JarJar. On January 17 2015 12:50 DarthPunk wrote: It was pretty obviously a policy thing at the start of the game. What kind of reasons do you expect somebody to have about 1 min in to the game? Like they are always gonna be poor or arbitrary. He was pretty clear trying to get the ball rolling. Townie Points for a Townie Action. I expect a certain rationality from Trfel based on the games we've played together. He typically does not do poor or arbitrary things. This is not about every player. This is about him. If he did some of the things LS or SL does every single game, it would get my attention, too. Are you trying to tell me that scum couldn't open with a policy lynch on a player that pre-game claimed he wouldn't post much, and pre-game was asked about why and jokingly called scum? I'm not saying Trfel is scum, but I don't see anything particularly townie about it. I'd call it flat-out low-hanging fruit for scum, personally, going after a geript lynch right now. Which is why I want to know how far Trfel intends to take it. I'd be riding his ass less if he were more direct about answering my questions. I get that you think he's being townie here, and I get that you think it's too bold a move for scum to make, but I personally don't see the danger in it for scum. Even if geript were lynched later today, who would hold Trfel accountable? I mean, honestly, who? | ||
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On January 17 2015 13:04 Breshke wrote: Soz had irl shit to do rsoultin do you disagree with the bolded question? I couldnt see if you have already answered it or not. I think DP is fairly spot on with trefel and i don't understand where you are coming from at all. Even if trefel is playing different it is possible to do that as town as well. So saying someone is playing different isn't a good enough reason to call them scum. Also GB can make that entrance post as a blue ,VT or scum so people looking into that post are going to go nowhere. I am not calling Trfel scum. I am questioning his intentions, because his first explanation did not jive. ^Next time someone asks me this I am going to flat-out quote this post of myself because I'm getting tired of answering it. I do not think there is actually any danger in the particular way he drew attention to himself if he is scum. ^Again, the next time someone asks me this I will quote this post. | ||
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On January 17 2015 13:20 Trfel wrote: Not at all. To be honest, I expect that geript will be just fine with only 10 posts. His analytical skills won't be hampered at all, he only loses most of his ability to question people and it will be difficult for him to push a lynch. Assuming that others do those two things for him, he should be just fine. ##Unvote Now that I have clarified this, I would really like to hear your thoughts on what other people have said so far. ##Unvote (since apparently we actually do not have a voting thread :/) I'm okay with DP, Damdred and Lonemeow right now. LS, too...he is actively participating in the thread. JarJar may be scum; for someone who relies on voting analysis to suggest no vote is even more strange than the average player. I'd like to see his response. The rest I haven't really been able to get a read on as of yet. | ||
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On January 17 2015 13:24 Breshke wrote: Sorry i probably could have worked that shit out myself. The point is you "questioning his intentions" doesn't feel like you are trying to work out his alignment. It feels like you are just asking questions so you have a presence in the thread. Mhm. When you're ready to ask me something or accuse me let me know. Thanks. | ||
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On January 17 2015 13:31 DarthPunk wrote: Ninja'd I'm more interested in the reasons FOR the reads than the actual reads right now. Would you care to elaborate for me? They're not strong reads. You haven't played with me before...I tend to be a paranoid sort. With you, Damdred and Lonemeow, I see questioning that I like and a willingness to look at more than one side of an issue. So right now I see no reason to scumread any of you and if I had to lynch someone now, it would not be one of those three. LS always is a bit of a strange player, but his poking and prodding at people strikes me as town. I generally give him more leeway because he is much easier to scumread as town than most players. JarJar is my brother. He likes stats, numbers, and doesn't trust in what people say. His first game on this site he made a model based on the votes/reads of the dead townies. So asking us to do something that will not gather any empirical data is reason enough for me to be suspicious of him. | ||
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On January 17 2015 13:38 GlowingBear wrote: I've coached Trfel last game and I told him how to generate discussion. I can easily see him trying to put my "lesson" in that post. Okay, GB. I can buy that explanation. | ||
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On January 17 2015 13:43 GlowingBear wrote: This is bullshit. You never tell someone you're doing a pressure vote because you reveal you're doing it just for pressure. You're just trying to push him to look contributive. xP Lol, sure. Cause it wasn't at all straight up mimicking him or anything to make a point. GB, how much do I really need to do to look contributive? You may want to finish reading the thread before you start making judgments. | ||
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On January 17 2015 19:14 jarjarbinks wrote: Finally Questions! Rsoultin: What is your stance on DP? If I had to sum it up in one word: Trfel-centric. His filter appears to be a light push on Trfel for Trfel's entrance post, town-reading him, convincing others to, and pressuring anyone who doesn't. I can post quotes as evidence, but as he has a 1-page filter it's pretty self-evident right now. (Oh, I forgot to mention trolling GB. Probably because that is just fluff anyway xP) Also, JarJar, I know you said after the game, but your posts just now established your innocence enough for me to not want to lynch you Day 1, so I think you're doing better than you realize. We can talk more after the game.@DP...do you have any reads on anything/anyone else? You asked me for mine...quid pro quo bro. | ||
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On January 17 2015 22:27 GlowingBear wrote: I understand the thing abou jar jar, but his opening is very bad and it fits more of a scum perspective because: (1) If there is an ongoing discussion, opening the game saying that he is excited without giving any thoughts is extremely contradictory and it doesn't fit town perspective. If he is excited, he saw something different. If he saw something different, he will probably comment it. This means his excitement is a forced emotion. (2) An opening post suggesting a no lynch is something comety disconnected. A no lynch discussion helps no one but mafia. A no lynch is only helpful to town in specific situations and that's definetely not day1. And, if the game is exciting, a no lynch isn't the correct conclusion? Anyway, he just ignores the ongoing discussion to throw a bad idea into the thread. GB, has your opinion on JarJar changed any in light of his more recent posts? I think we can all agree that his opening was bad. | ||
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On January 18 2015 02:43 jarjarbinks wrote: Lol im guessing saying I suck at this game is a bad way to go. Gereipt asked for my reads on people. I thought I had good quotes to follow up my thoughts on some of the most active guys. The inactive guys not so much. Still wanted to shed my thoughts on them though in case. Damdred: for your reaction vote, did you include shining in your scum list to see if anyone would jump on it based on what was said before the game started? Or did you just do it because you needed someone else to through on your scum team? So, JarJar, hi. I think the problem is you stated things about people without explicitly saying what you think about those actions in your reads post. If you could quote yourself and add: town, null, could be scum or something to each of your comments that would help me at least get a better idea of where you're at. (I know what I think about those particular points, but that doesn't tell me what you think.) | ||
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On January 18 2015 02:33 Damdred wrote: Here in the knowledge bomb for today guys; Town: Trfel: Slightly different from what I am used to in other games, the pressure vote is not alignment indicative as Geript is a good enough player to do this with post restrictions as scum or as town. However the followup to people commenting on his stance is really good, he calls to attention the problems in LS stance at the time which is a good observation and shows that someone is really reading the game. Hes inquisitive about why people are doing things and he seems to be in the thick of all talks when hes in the thread. For now hes in the town pile and i'm pretty sold that he shouldn't be the lynch today at all. Disagree. You may be able to convince me null or not best lynch today, but I am far from putting him in any town pool at the moment. LightningStrike: Some of the stances he has taken seem a bit flimsy at times and it seems like he reverts on them as time passes sometimes. Which gave him a few scum points at first from me. But when questioned about where he was in the game he took little to no time at having actual somewhat developed thoughts on the people in the game. Was really quick to answer and hes not scared to push what he is thinking in the thread (or just put it out there) Pretty sure he is town here. Agreed. Pretty sure he's town. RS: Hes town, he pressures people. Hes reading the thread, he has follow up on what he says and hes asking opinions to try to figure out peoples alignments. Wouldn't lynch him today at all. Well, obviously xP Null: LM: Why you not have your neck out and giving actual thoughts instead of just reacting to what people say to you  .Would like to see more from him, but like what I see so far. Warwaffle: not really rememerable but hasn't posted much See above. Shining: where are you baby doll? Breshke: Who are you again? what do you think? The only thing in the whole thread to catch his eye was my push on Trfel? Weird. Null for me, too. Scum: TLCoolName: I have talked about him before now and I will reinterate. He attacks JarJar at one point and JarJar answers him, instead of interacting with him and trying to figure out his alignment. He disengages and says oh I like this post and never returns to it. When confronted with this information he says he just hasn't analyzed what JarJar has done. Shouldn't be much to analysis and Jarjar was in the thread at the time so he missed a good opoortunity to actually analysis the player and figure out his alignment. And then he switched to talking about me or rather slow pushing a target, he quoted something before the game started. He waited for someone else to vote and threw his vote down with that person. He claims it was a reaction test, but his reaction is not one a town would generally make. Instead of talking it through and trying to understand alignments of both he retreats from the confrontation and says just do analysis on everyone else. This guy is scum, hes not interested in finding out who is scum or pressuring people. He wants to find an easy target park there after someone else has fired the first shot and go on his merry way. Eh, I'm not putting as much weight on this as you are. At best a slight scum lean for me. Unless he's a smurf or something I think his questioning isn't bad for a newbie, even if he did wait to vote until after GB did. The behavior he is calling out is definitely scummy behavior. General thoughts: I didn't bother to do everyone yet, Geripts huge post is full of good things that I want more peoples comments on. He might be onto something but I haven't rad DP filter or contextualized it yet. GB could really be town here, anger at the start seems authentic and GB hates being VT. Some good thoughts but not as many as drunk bear should usually have at this point. I'm undecided about JarJar currently, his recent postings looked pretty ok, but his previous postings looked bad. So can't really put him in a null town or scum currently but might lynch him depending on play as the game goes along. Overall cool is the scummiest thing in the thread and people should comment on what I wrote. Commented on your reads above. Additionally I like Geript's post, probably because the majority of it were things that lined up with my own thoughts. Even though it's just one post it has so much meat that I think scum would have a hard time producing that. If he continues in the same vein I have no problem calling him town. JarJar did ask me what the purpose of Day 1 was after last game, and I did tell him that I think the most valuable part of Day 1 was getting people to talk and see if it lined up with their actions later. That is how I found Celestial last game. The reason I bring this up is his posts are ringing true to me, so I don't think he's a good lynch for today. People really should stop confusing new with stupid. My brother isn't stupid and has never claimed to be, but he is new, so it makes sense that it's taking him some time to get the hang of things. | ||
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On January 18 2015 03:08 Damdred wrote: Maybe your right about TL, i'll give him a bit more time to develop but i'll come back to him later on. We will probably disagree about tr but I think i'm right. The point of D1 is to find mafia and kill mafia !!!!!!!!! Who are your scum today rs Hm...I'm testing something currently Damdred, so I'll get back to you on this later when I have something to show for it. Mostly right now I'm determining who I don't want to lynch, particularly out of the group of people who I think would make for easy mislynches. So far that group consists of: LS JarJar WarWaffle Shining <- Cop check if we have one I think, though if he's still AWOL Day 2 I'd be down for a lynch | ||
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On January 18 2015 03:17 jarjarbinks wrote: heyro sis! I'll attempt to do what you asked. I'll attempt to do what you asked except i'll put everyone in the section I think they should be in. Town: LS Null: Gereipt Rsoultin Trfel LoneMeow Breshke GB Damdred Scum: DP CoolITLName Definitely expect changes in the next 36 hours though. Hopefully I'll have more people out of the Null category. Damdred, I have another question for you in a second... Ouch. Yeah. That looks like a current list rather than a list based off your initial post (you also left off WW who you mentioned in your summary above). Are you scumreading Cool for lurking? What makes DP scum? Questioning me? I see nothing inherently wrong with questions as long as they're leading somewhere. | ||
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On January 18 2015 03:46 Damdred wrote: I've read everyones filter besides DP just procrastinating on his Interesting. I don't dislike your play so far...but that response is interesting. Can anyone else point out why it raises concerns? | ||
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On January 18 2015 03:45 jarjarbinks wrote: Yep current list. Not scumming Cool for lurking. More scumming him for leaving me so fast. Seems to be going after the easy target. I did leave out Waffle. He would also be on null. DP, JarJar. What is the basis of your read on him? | ||
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On January 18 2015 03:52 coolTLname wrote: #unvote my list so far WarWaffle, Breshke, Shining Why? | ||
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On January 18 2015 04:07 coolTLname wrote: Mafia are generally scared of talking, every word they say can be used to incriminate them. These people seem scared Okay. Do you find anything scummy in anything that they have posted? Do you think that the entire mafia team is likely to be lurking? Town players with roles also tend to be scared to post, especially in games with this many newbies. Are you taking that into account when naming your scum team? Why is Shining in that group? He could just be completely inactive. (To be fair, without a decent scumread, I would be fine with lynching him, but I don't think we're at that stage yet with over 24 hours of the Day phase left.) | ||
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On January 18 2015 05:13 Damdred wrote: DP could be town or a mafia partner if i'm mafia. or I could just be lazy town currently Nah, not concerned about that. As you said, too many explanations for it to be significant. Check Trfel's filter on the player list. (Preemptively I will say that yes, I realize there is more than one way to access a filter and I am not calling you scum for this, thus the word: interesting.) | ||
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On January 18 2015 05:41 Damdred wrote: Oh I know his filter leads to eden however he was the first sign up so I got to his in really fast. And I knew that there was a good bit of discussion about him in the thread. Fair enough lol. Like I said, more interesting than anything else. Not at all on the same level as the Bats!trap in Carol. | ||
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On January 18 2015 07:57 Trfel wrote: I suppose I can see this. At the same time, WarWaffle seemed to provide many more reads in the previous game. I know this game hasn't been going for as long yet, but there has been more posting here. And last game he had lots of time issues as well (I know he said he had some in this game, I think, but they should be less than last game). I am trying very hard to find reasons to town-read you this game, Trfel. This is simply untrue. :/ WW analyzed HTS' post and gave a list post on his reads Day 1 last game. It seems about the same to me, except WW actually questioned someone this game (LS). Considering there are still 24ish hours left for Day 1...dude, give me a reason to town-read you, please >< | ||
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On January 18 2015 06:00 GlowingBear wrote: He is my pupil and he isn't doing what I'm expecting. I know he was in some RL trouble recently but since he confirmed, his total lurkage is odd. And I am going to lynch scummy lurkers day1. I hope you guys all have this in mind Of the lurkers/players with short filters I'm inclined to agree that Breshke appears the most scummy. Of course, part of that may be OMGUS lol, not gonna lie. | ||
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On January 18 2015 08:38 Trfel wrote: + Show Spoiler + On January 07 2015 04:51 TheWarWaffle wrote: My apologies for the inactivity. I give no excuse other than the fact that my life is busy. After reading the thread my current reads for the game are as follows: The Shining: Town The Shining has not posted all that much but the quality of posting changed drastically as soon as the game started. The Shining asks questions where they need to be asked and maintains a cordial aloofness towards everyone who is playing. No person is accused of anything without evidence. Half the Sky: Town HTS acts like a true townie. Says what she wants, when she wants to, to whomever she wants. At least, that's what she wants us to believe, but I don't have anything better at this time. rsoultin: Suspicious The accusation-train keeps on rolling whenever rsoultin is around. I find the similarities in play style to her previous games an indicator of deceit rather than openness. Rsoultin rolled Town in every other game she played like this, so why shouldn't she be Town now? I can't think of a better cover than this. Strangely, even though rsoultin admits that it's her "bias" to ignore inactives, she votes for me. This is strange for several reasons: I was inactive at the time she started my lynch wagon; she had previously agreed with my post on HTS; and there was no progression of thought as to why I was scum. jarjarbinks: Light Town Jarjarbinks' behavior sets off no alarm bells in my mind even though he lurks more than he posts. The posts he does make are normally short and succinct, and while many of his posts appear misleading at first, they work in the context. I think the only reason he is voting for me is because other people started the wagon. Trfel: Unknown As Trfel has posted effectively nothing indicating any affiliation, I must refrain from passing judgment on the hangman. Gumdrop: Town Gumdrop hasn't said much but from what was said I glean bits of Town. The reasons given for not posting more are adequate, and the type of posts implies a desire for something to happen, something the Mafia does not want. The posts that were made are logical and forward-thinking. A more Mafia-oriented lurker would post more misleading information. Silverarte: Possible Mafia The ease of which Silverarte hops aboard the bandwagon train is startling. Silverarte was leaning towards ExO_ and Gumdrop being scum, for the reasons of aggressive accusations and "posting and offering nothing" respectively. Somehow, both of these are forgotten as soon as she jumped on my vote bandwagon. For someone who admits she's new and even goes as far to use that as defense for gumdrop her voting for me makes no sense based on her previous actions. The previous existing relationship between Silverarte and rsoultin gives cause for the sudden change of thought, but even so... ExO_: Light Town My thoughts on ExO_ have flipped back and forth for some time now. Initially I thought he was town for being the only one willing to aggressively step and take affirmative action. After that, I thought he was scum for simply spreading accusations thin and putting a cloud of doubt over everyone, which is scum-like behavior. Though his disappearance is suspicious, it does not seem implicative. -Celestial-: Town -Celestial- maintains a consistent level of posts and explains his thoughts in a logical progression. I see no suspicious behavior, only a desire to understand and unearth new information. LightningStrike: Suspicious/Unknown I have my own reasons for being suspicious of LS, mainly due to the constant attempts to shift attention whenever the focus is on him. Tubesock: Mafia After looking at all of Tubesock's posts, I strongly believe that he is Mafia. His posts, while numerous, are short and always seem to detract from the conversation rather than add. Very few of the accusations presented by Tubesock are his; most are other people's regurgitated ideas. I think Tubesock's passive beginning was only due to the low amount of traffic it received, and that his "coming out of his shell" was him realizing that he could take advantage of it. Several times he has posted about the inactivity of the thread, which seems redundant when your very post makes it active. Tubesock only did this to make it look like he cares. A Mafia player wants there to be confusion, chaos, and distrust in the thread. Do Tubesock's actions create clear, organized discussion? I don't think so. Currently, Tubesock has my vote. I'd like to hear other people's opinions as well. To me, that post seems much more comprehensive than the post in this game. I don't see your point. I could also understand where TheWarWaffle was coming from in that post, even though I disagreed with his reads. In this game, his logic doesn't make sense. He says that because GlowingBear and I did something towny, we have to be scum. Both GlowingBear and I have also asked questions and contributed to discussion (however effectively), so that is the other criteria he set for his townreads. Ignoring the early questioning, TheWarWaffle's play seems noticeably worse. It actually makes me tempted to lynch him, though as GlowingBear stated, coming in with two scumreads on reasonably active players doesn't make sense for mafia. He did go into an explanation for each and every player, it's true, but if you recall that was not terribly long before EoD and he was scumread by a lot of people for it because his reads were pretty wonky to most of us. You may not agree with GB that the post itself makes him town, but why are you trying to convince people that WW is scum? Are you scumreading him right now? While I don't agree with him on GB necessarily (I think GB has been doing a good job of analyzing this game) I can see where he's coming from just fine on the whole do something scum wouldn't do as scum to get townread. In fact, that should always be the objective of scum, shouldn't it? To not act like scum so they don't get caught? | ||
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On January 18 2015 09:17 DarthPunk wrote: Look at the formatting. One is literally a wall the other is formatted well and divided into easily readable chunks. I also respect Geripts opinion ( horrifying I know) and give zero fucks about trifles opinion. That is the only difference really. Are you caught up now? (Kinda been waiting for you to finish making your way through the thread.) | ||
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On January 18 2015 09:23 LightningStrike wrote: rsoultin and GlowingBear can you two read my meta case on Breshke being scum and tell me your thoughts please? LS, you know I <3 you, but that's not really a case ^^; It's saying Breshke is playing lurky and then links to his two scum games where he presumably also lurked. (I know he wasn't the most active in metal, which I was following as it was playing out, but the problem there as I recall was him sheeping his scumread in the Day 1 vote.) I'm not seeing the inquisitiveness that I saw from him in our town game together. I think his little bit of a nothing push on me lacked follow-through, and am wondering why he didn't look into, question or comment on anything else. | ||
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On January 18 2015 09:32 LightningStrike wrote: Did you read the latest scum game of his (New Years Eve Party)? He posting about the same style as he had in that game in my opinion. Also yes mafia!Breshke loves to sheep and just lay back and maybe smoke weed and all that stuff crazy stuff. Lol, I was supposed to read New Years Eve for Damdred as a possible replace, but then he let the cat out of the bag on one of the roles (he was frustrated) and so I couldn't replace in.So no, I haven't read it. Imperial and our Newbie game were all I had time for. A look through his filter though makes it look like he was certainly more active even in New Years Eve than he is here, which makes me think his inactivity I not alignment indicative. Not really on point, but good call on the Bresh shot, vig xP | ||
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On January 18 2015 09:49 The Shining wrote: [...] JJB - [...] This brings me to my next point. Although at face value, the fact that you responded to why you thought the No lynch was a good idea seemed believable to me, it struck me as odd that you thought you didn't see a Cop/Doctor setup(setup A) and that sent you on a full Google search for Mafia strats and that's how you came up with the NL. Mate, couldn't you just check the OP and see at least one setup did in fact have a cop + doc? And in an open setup game, how sure can you be that any of the 3 setups is the one we're playing? The only way you'd know that is as scum. Was that a slip? [...] Trfel - Damn, Shining, lol. You're not my lynch for today. I don't know how much I actually believe in scum slips, though I have seen ritoky commit one, but this is an angle I hadn't thought of with JarJar. You're right that only scum would know if doc/cop was the setup. :/ | ||
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On January 18 2015 09:38 DarthPunk wrote: Yeah basically. This game started on a weekend for me and I am kinda busy. I missed this post. Yes, your response did answer my question. I think Damdred already answered the question you were asking him, though, in his reads post. So then it just becomes a matter of whether you believe him or not. Gonna play devil's advocate here even though I'm not scumreading you right now: assuming Tfel is town, does scum never defend town? If you had to lynch someone right this second, who would it be? | ||
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On January 18 2015 09:08 Trfel wrote: When I'm saying I'm scumreading someone, I'm pretty serious about it. I'm not scumreading him, but I do think his play is suspicious. Are you saying that his reads aren't wonky in this game, since I think they are (for previously stated reasons). I was able to understand his reads in the previous game. Of course scum wants to try and get townread. But doing a townie thing doesn't make someone scum. At worst, it makes them null. Except in extreme circumstances, of course. GlowingBear, how does Hapahauli coaching have any effect on your actions/reads? I'm saying that based on last game wonky reads don't make WW scum. I don't think his read on you is wonky. As I've said before...I'm trying really hard to find a reason to town-read you. You yourself mention doing a "townie thing" doesn't make someone scum, but at worst makes them null. I don't feel you're being contributive. Sorry. I wish I could say that I did. And without anything else "townie" from you, at best you're null. But I expect more from you. Even as a town role you were great. So...you being at best null to me is highly suspicious. Again, give me a reason to town-read you, Trfel. | ||
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On January 18 2015 10:30 Trfel wrote: rsoultin, I'm not scumreading TheWarWaffle. I'm saying that his play seems different this game from last game, and that it is suspicious. He responded with an adequate explanation (I don't have a phone, so I forgot that phone posting is something that a lot of people do). So I will wait and see what happens, though I still question the quality of his reasoning. Fair enough, Trfel. I agree that his explanation for you and GB as scum, by itself, doesn't seem strong enough for a scumread. Maybe when he fully explains himself it will be easier to follow. | ||
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On January 18 2015 10:41 Trfel wrote: That's a good point. Still, when I made the initial statement, he hadn't said that he would make a more complete version of the post later. The way I read his post, that was the fully explained version. Which has me and GlowingBear (well, I'm obviously biased, so you can argue about me but definitely not GlowingBear) being scumread while doing the exact same things that he says the people he townreads are town for. I just agreed with you xP Defensive much? | ||
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On January 18 2015 11:57 geript wrote: Say what? Why do you think Shining is town (or in the least not worthy of being lynched) for that post? 5. @Rsoultin. Why do you find Damdred scummy for that specific post? + Show Spoiler + On January 18 2015 03:56 rsoultin wrote: Interesting. I don't dislike your play so far...but that response is interesting. Can anyone else point out why it raises concerns? Regarding Shining, it was mostly just because he mentioned the point on JJB possibly knowing the setup this game (which only scum could) and that's a point I hadn't noticed before. I also didn't see anything in his analysis that jumped out at me as god-awful (something I try not to scumread people for anyway after Carol and the shitfest with SL and GB and all their present chatter). Nothing scummy on Damdred from that post. It was a half-trap that I realized halfway in wasn't a good trap lol cause we can still see players' filters. (Eden's filter was linked to Trfel's on page 1.) Damdred I'm reserving judgment on presently, if you're curious. Part of it is how little I'm generally agreeing with him, and part of it is his "reaction test" I didn't think was very good, personally. But he wouldn't be the first townie I disagreed with. | ||
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I believe I said not a Day 1 lynch. Let me clarify that I am not townreading Shining at this time. | ||
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On January 17 2015 07:00 Trfel wrote: ##Vote geript Note the time. Less than a full minute after game start. On January 17 2015 07:20 Trfel wrote: He said that he would only be making 10 posts per day. I personally feel that it will be extremely hard for him to play effectively with 10 posts per day. If he is purposefully handicapping himself with a very strict post limit and that causes him to play poorly and be lynched, that's his fault; we can't allow for players to intentionally play badly. I will remove my vote if he proves himself useful. Best I can tell without him quoting the post he was responding to himself, this was a result of LS' question. Note the bolded reason: policy lynch dependent on Geript being "useful". On January 17 2015 11:50 Trfel wrote: Ok, I will respond to jarjar's request for a no lynch. No, we will definitely lynch. No lynch on Day 1 is bad because it usually leaves you in an almost equally uninformed position on Day 2. Eventually you have to make that first lynch. Yes, town is often lynched on Day 1, but you can still lynch scum on Day 1 with effective play (and a bit of luck). I will keep my vote on geript until I feel that it is better for me to move it. It is really silly to ask me for rules for what I will do with my vote, since it's my own judgement and there is absolutely no reason for me to try and set rules for every possible scenario. Note the bolded portion again. It went from when Geript is "useful" to when he feels like it...after I asked him whether or not he planned to lynch a policy lynch over a scumread. On January 17 2015 13:20 Trfel wrote: Not at all. To be honest, I expect that geript will be just fine with only 10 posts. His analytical skills won't be hampered at all, he only loses most of his ability to question people and it will be difficult for him to push a lynch. Assuming that others do those two things for him, he should be just fine. ##Unvote Now that I have clarified this, I would really like to hear your thoughts on what other people have said so far. Huh? What was the purpose of the policy lynch then? Geript had yet to post in the thread at the time of Trfel's unvote. On January 18 2015 06:25 Trfel wrote: I do need to clarify that based on how last game (Newbie Mafia) went and my postgame discussions with GlowingBear, I have been trying a slightly different playstyle this game. My opening attempted to generate discussion, and a relatively large number of posts were made about it (the quality of the discussion it generated is more questionable, so perhaps it didn't work out as I intended). The reason I pushed that (false) viewpoint was because I wanted to get as much discussion from it as possible, which I believe I did. As for providing less content per post than in previous games, this is a conscious change I made after seeing how last game went. Parsed this down out of his giant reads post. I will address his reads themselves in a moment. So now it's to generate discussion. Okay, so his reasons went from: Policy Lynch (Geript can't possibly be effective with such few posts) to he'll change it when he feels like it, to nevermind he thinks Geript will be fine (before Geript has posted once), to nope, just to generate discussion. <- Interesting that this is after GB already tried to explain Trfel's behavior. Was GB just right, or was this a convenient excuse that Tfel could now use to explain it away? Even if you think, as some of you do, that all of this wasn't strange and even thought it made Trfel town (still mind-boggling to me), I laid off him some to see if he came up with anything but a weird-ass Trfel's Reads + Show Spoiler + On January 17 2015 10:17 Trfel wrote: I'm back. LightningStrike's play does seem rather weird so far. First he says that my early vote is scummy, and then says that it is towny. Regardless of whether my early vote was a good or bad play, LightningStrike's view changed on it after DarthPunk and LoneMeow expressed opinions that it was a slightly townie thing to do. And then, asking for rsoultin makes no sense at all. Why rsoultin? If it's to make a meta read, how about all of the rest of us he has played with before? GlowingBear's opening seems pretty bad as well. In general I don't like claiming, since I feel that town players should simply play well to show that they are town (just like how I don't put very much focus on setups). Claim aside, why would he even sign up for the game if he doesn't want to play VT, the most common role? VT is the core of the game, the power roles are the fluff (especially in games like this one with only two power roles). Side note, I've been cop/tracker twice out of three previous games, and it hasn't been particularly enjoyable for me. VT is a much more enjoyable role IMO, less pressure and you can more freely speak your mind. - LS "weird" for changing viewpoint based on vet opinions. Really? - GBs opening claim. I think someone already mentioned that if they're supposedly doing the same thing, this is an odd read. + Show Spoiler + On January 18 2015 06:25 Trfel wrote: The way that LightningStrike played the start of this game still feels really weird to me. His thoughts seemed to be all over the place and his posting was somewhat random (particularly asking for rsoultin). However, since then he seems to have gained confidence and seems more towny. Especially after glancing through the scumgame he linked (yes I'm aware I played in that game, I wanted to look at it again anyway). Weird-more, towny...null? LoneMeow seems very strange to me. At first I liked his questioning, and I still do, but all he has done is pick on people for small things. The one read he provided was at the request of GlowingBear. I know that LoneMeow is a very good player, and provides a lot of content without using a large number of posts, so I will wait for now.... but I am a bit suspicious. Liked questioning, suspicious...null? No reason to include this except to say HEY LOOK I TOWNREAD A TOWN!! I generally like the way that Damdred and GlowingBear have been playing so far. Their analysis shows that they are reading the thread and trying to scumhunt, as well as generating discussion. I did notice that GlowingBear provided a lot of comments on posts in the thread, and I liked those. However, he also provided overall reads, but didn't show why he made those reads (they also didn't necessarily align with the comments he provided). The recent vote on Breshke is a continuation of this. However, I'm sure either of them could play a very capable scum game as well. Not a good Day 1 lynch. What? Between suddenly townreading(ish?) GB after suggesting he was scum earlier, all the back and forth, and the fact he never actually mentions Damdred individually...I feel like I got nothing from Trfel out of this paragraph. DarthPunk is coming up null. I have been waiting for more posts from him to provide more thoughts, but since he hasn't posted in a while, I will share my thoughts now. I do like that he picked up on LightingStrike's weird play at the start of the game. That was the same feeling that I got. However, he hasn't done very much at all except for saying that my opening made it seem that I am town. My opening doesn't really say anything about my alignment for reasons previously stated by geript, however the way I followed it up is more important (more on this later). For the record, several of you seem to be familiar with DarthPunk's playstyle, and I am completely unfamiliar with it, so that doesn't help. Lot of words to describe yet another null read. Geript's first post seemed a bit towny, and his second post seemed a bit scummy (it seemed like a poor use of a post when you are limiting yourself to ten). That's one fewer post to use to push a lynch later. Overall, geript seems fine for now, and is probably a poor Day 1 lynch. Towny, scummy. Null again?! Rsoultin and jarjar, you two need to talk so that jarjar feels comfortable with Day 1. That aside, while jarjar's opening post is pretty horrible, he has given some useful thoughts since then. As for rsoultin, I feel that her play lines up exactly with (my knowledge of) her town meta. I also liked the questioning that she used with regards to my opening. Still, I take note that jarjar said that she is capable of doing this as either alignment. One thing I did find really strange is that rsoultin provided her thoughts using a Damdred quote. I have no idea why she would do this except to compare opinions, but she didn't provide any thoughts on Damdred (I know their thoughts on other players were side by side, but still), and it gave the impression that her reads were less independent. JarJar horrible opening->useful thoughts; Me: Town meta (no one knows how I play scum but Shining and Dammy, lol) -> reads less independent...so...null reads again. I do need to clarify that based on how last game (Newbie Mafia) went and my postgame discussions with GlowingBear, I have been trying a slightly different playstyle this game. My opening attempted to generate discussion, and a relatively large number of posts were made about it (the quality of the discussion it generated is more questionable, so perhaps it didn't work out as I intended). The reason I pushed that (false) viewpoint was because I wanted to get as much discussion from it as possible, which I believe I did. As for providing less content per post than in previous games, this is a conscious change I made after seeing how last game went. Brief summary of my play in last game: there wasn't much discussion on the first day, and I was busy, so I didn't share many thoughts or put in the effort that I wanted, and then I died. My death provided absolutely nothing for town to work with, since I hadn't shared any thoughts as they were not anywhere near conclusive. This game I am trying to share my thoughts more frequently to prevent something like that from happening again. The downside is that my posts will not contain as much quality content as I would like, but I believe that I have provided enough content. Everything I say is there for a reason (in the case of the coolTLname paragraph, the reason is because I don't want to delete it; not always the best reason, but whatever). This to me is just icky. Huge explanation at the end of his reads as to why he's been sucking this game (sorry, Trfel, but I'm entitled to my own opinions and you've rocked other games) with a conclusion that as long as he's providing content the quality doesn't matter? At least, that's how I read the bolded section. With that in mind, I will answer geript's question. I (obviously) disagree with your read on me. I was intentionally being stubborn to argue with rsoultin and generate discussion, which (as I already stated) I think I was somewhat successful in. I was not so sure about your townread on LightningStrike at the time you made the post in question, but given some rereading and his posting since then, it seems reasonable. Rsoultin's play does seem towny so far, but he hasn't done anything that I couldn't see him doing as scum. I don't think that jarjar is a good lynch, however the reasons for that are mostly due to posts he made after you posted the read. If you have any questions, feel free to ask. And now, the giant novel of null. Seriously, there is pretty much nothing useful in this post. Open the spoiler and see my comments, but essentially he wrote paragraphs on half the players in this game just to call them null, then defended his lack of quality content. Also, if you can On January 18 2015 06:35 Trfel wrote: Sorry, you're right, that wasn't clear enough. I try to play with really high standards for scumreading someone. I stated this in my last game if you need me to dig up that quote. I am most suspicious of LoneMeow and a bit suspicious of DarthPunk. At the moment, my lynch list would probably be LoneMeow, then The Shining, then Breshke, then DarthPunk. However, I'm not going to worry about (potentially) policy lynching until the deadline is much closer. :/ LoneMeow and DarthPunk who were (apparent?) null reads, with Shining and Breshke (definite null reads for lack of activity)...so, really no scumreads. I'm having a hard time with this idea that Trfel has absolutely no strong town/scumreads at all this game. There's obviously more in his filter, to include WW and DP later in the game, and some questions. I'm not saying I'm 100% sure Trfel is scum. I do think that he is the most likely to flip scum of the players here, however. My reasons in a nutshell: - His reasons for his opening post kept changing. - No reads. What he does post is a lot of verbage to say he doesn't have an earthly clue and everyone is null. Blech. ##Vote: Trfel | ||
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On January 18 2015 15:30 geript wrote: I'm just going to go ahead and say this right now. If you newbies ever lynch DP after I die, I swear to fucking god I will reach out from my grave and vigi shoot every single one of the townies who vote for him. Lol, good to know. -flicks- I get shot (at) every game so don't really care. Not by vigis though. That said DP is not even within the realm of people I'm considering to lynch right now. | ||
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On January 18 2015 15:33 geript wrote: This is the thing that really bugged me about JJB, more than alot of the other little stuff that's been brought up. I'm not seeing how a towny could scum somebody for "leaving a [townie] lynchwagon so fast." Like to me, what Cool said wasn't cool and was pretty sarcastic and mean. I'm not sure if he meant any of it honestly. It's not OMGUS, it's like "Oh you should be scumreading but you left it so fast when you should be scumreading me." It's basically saying Cool is mafia for unvoting JJB, but that doesn't make any sort of sense unless JJB actually is mafia. Devil's advocate time. Or maybe just protective big sister time. He was parroting Damdred there. Whether you think the parroting is scummy or not is up to you, but it's a little obvious where he got that from. Just saying: On January 17 2015 23:48 Damdred wrote: A reaction or pressure test is brining that up and voting instantly IE like GB did. You say that you haven't analys'd Jarjar yet, but then why go after him and then one post later say I love this post and never mention him again? There seems to be a disconnect between what you say and what you ar edoing. | ||
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On January 18 2015 15:48 geript wrote: Ain't no place for pullups in this game missy. You shit your pants you're one one that has to sit in it until your parents come pick you up. I can almost 90% guarantee that if y'all pull a dumbass move as vets and vote my noob brother for playing bad...he will flip town and you will be eating crow. First, he's playing better than he did last game, which you should know, geript. And secondly, I have actually known this kid since he was in diapers. Forgive me if I believe I can read him better than you. If he were slam or marv, I'd likely defer to your judgment.Mr. | ||
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On January 18 2015 15:51 geript wrote: Actually, Rsoultin. Can you tell me anything you think might help me understand JJB. Like not as a mafia player but as a person. (also the above was clearly a joke) He's super competitive but doesn't like to show it.(Thus why the google thing, yeah, I could see that from him lol) He jokes under stress and gets flack for it because people assume that means he doesn't care. (Your slam-lite comment?) He's a terrible liar and gets offended if you call him one. He prefers numbers/actions over words because anyone can say anything. He's not going to want to make firm reads until he feels really strongly about them. If he's asking questions (which he has this game) and making an attempt to play, I don't like him for a Day 1 lynch. | ||
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On January 18 2015 16:01 geript wrote: Please take your panties and unwad them. It's a joke. It's clearly meant as a joke. I'm sorry if it came across is any means other than a sarcastic quip. As to you reading him better than me, it wouldn't surprise me in the least. As for playing better than last game, idk about that. That said, I still want you to tell me what you know about him as a person. Just whatever random factoids that you think of when you think of your lil bro. I'm not upset lol. Sarcasm for sarcasm. It's okay, though. I've been told I'm dry. Already did respond; if you've got any questions please ask. | ||
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On January 18 2015 16:04 geript wrote: Do you find it odd at all that I don't think he's claimed town yet? If you're talking about no: I AM TOWN I AM TOWN this game...lol that was cause I was mocking HTS in my first post last game. Ongoing joke I don't find it odd that you'd notice that or think that was important, but yeah. A joke + he's not stupid. Clearly it didn't prevent him from being mislynched last game, dead JarJar vid and all xP | ||
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On January 18 2015 16:09 geript wrote: Well you also weren't alive on D3 remember. Plus, I don't think JJB was seriously considered for a lynch on any day except D3. Also, I thought Shining got lynched on D3. It was between 2 towns that the lynch never should have been close to regardless. Your point? He did that in his first post last game, right after I said it in reference to others' entrance posts. He probably did it 3 or 4 times. I told people not to lynch him and to trust me on my brother -_- lol. Course I'm wrong so often about other people I guess I can't blame them...entirely. | ||
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On January 18 2015 16:16 geript wrote: I know. I just can't decide if that's actually be or mafia. Like I think your bar is too high for people and maybe mine is too low. I just can't decide if it feels like honest bullshit or not. Let's look at her filter overall though, that'll give us a better look. -shrugs- If you have questions let me know, I guess. I didn't think my case was so awful, but that's kind of a given. | ||
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On January 18 2015 16:28 geript wrote: @Rsoultin. When did your read change on JJB from could be mafia to probably town? More importantly why did it change? I am tempted to be snarky and to tell you to read my filter, since you're in the process of it already. His re-entrance into the thread addressing several posts and asking questions was enough at the time to make me reconsider him as a lynch today. I can't say that I was fond of his explanations for his list post, but when I pressed him for the reasons behind his scumreads they seemed genuine enough to me. | ||
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On January 18 2015 16:27 geript wrote: That's a really weird statement. I don't really actually like this post at all. Moreso because the big Trfel case-post is like 90% on the first set of posts from Trfel which I don't find as being important at all. Like sure Trfel was bullshitting one way or another. Like I think I know why I was so meh about Rsoultin's case. It comes off as a Lynch all liars policy lynch which I find terribly awful. If all you're reading is the first part of my case, then I'd have to agree with you that it isn't strong. My gut feel on him from our first exchange was his posts were out-of-character. I'm not talking about a metaread here; I'm talking about the personality that I've come to associate with him. Trying to put that into words is hard. Please actually take the time to open the spoiler with his giant novel reads post and re-read it. I made comments directly into that post. Whether you agree with me or not, that is the main thrust of my case. | ||
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On January 18 2015 16:45 geript wrote: No, other than the nul, null, null, type of stuff which is odd, I don't actually like your analysis at all there. I saw that stuff and that's a bit odd imo from Trfel, but I think my reasons on that same post are significantly better than yours. And I found reasons to both scumread and townread him from that post. Believe what you will. I've made it clear why I think he's scum. If you don't like those reasons, that's fine, but tell me why I'm wrong if you really want to convince me not to lynch Trfel, not just that I'm bad. | ||
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On January 18 2015 17:11 DarthPunk wrote: #vote: Lightningstrike I still have no idea how the fuck people are town reading this guy but I choose to blame geript. He always posts this way. For me lynching him for posting like this is the same as lynching someone for not posting at all. You'll have to do better than that. I'm sorry. May I just point out that (apart from New Years where he was shot dead by mafia) he is friggin always mislynched as town, for these same reasons. -_- | ||
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On January 18 2015 17:21 rsoultin wrote: He always posts this way. For me lynching him for posting like this is the same as lynching someone for not posting at all. You'll have to do better than that. I'm sorry. May I just point out that (apart from New Years where he was shot dead by mafia) he is friggin always mislynched as town, for these same reasons. -_- http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/474146-newbie-mini-mafia-lx http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/474389-new-years-eve-party-mini-mafia http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/472628-tl-mafia-lxix-carol-of-the-bells<- forgot he claimed ghost in this one http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/471489-student-mafia-iv-new-newish-players-welcome http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/469857-campus-mafia-new-newish-players-welcome?user=LightningStrike Hate it all you want, DP. My point is he's an easy mislynch and I think every single person who first plays with him scumreads him. Or pretty damn close. I'm the only one who has successfully scumread and lynched him and I got it wrong last game when I shouldn't have -_-. Just found the filter on the first one where he was lynched claiming cop Day 1. | ||
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On January 18 2015 17:46 jarjarbinks wrote: lol she might not like me for that one. She can get fixated at times and generally doesn't like it when people straight up lie to her. Carries grudges sometimes. Can get frustrated easily. To get brownie points for that I'll say she is one of my favorite people to have a conversation with and is pretty funny. Also super smart and stuff! lol xP Nah, it's true. I'm stubborn as a mule. Good to know behind that smile you're not rolling your eyes, wishing I'd shut up, bro. >> | ||
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On January 19 2015 00:59 Trfel wrote: + Show Spoiler [rsoultin's case] + On January 18 2015 15:14 rsoultin wrote: I did in fact get something out of my questions to Trfel. Please note the progression here. Note the time. Less than a full minute after game start. Best I can tell without him quoting the post he was responding to himself, this was a result of LS' question. Note the bolded reason: policy lynch dependent on Geript being "useful". Note the bolded portion again. It went from when Geript is "useful" to when he feels like it...after I asked him whether or not he planned to lynch a policy lynch over a scumread. Huh? What was the purpose of the policy lynch then? Geript had yet to post in the thread at the time of Trfel's unvote. Parsed this down out of his giant reads post. I will address his reads themselves in a moment. So now it's to generate discussion. Okay, so his reasons went from: Policy Lynch (Geript can't possibly be effective with such few posts) to he'll change it when he feels like it, to nevermind he thinks Geript will be fine (before Geript has posted once), to nope, just to generate discussion. <- Interesting that this is after GB already tried to explain Trfel's behavior. Was GB just right, or was this a convenient excuse that Tfel could now use to explain it away? Even if you think, as some of you do, that all of this wasn't strange and even thought it made Trfel town (still mind-boggling to me), I laid off him some to see if he came up with anything but a weird-ass Trfel's Reads + Show Spoiler + On January 17 2015 10:17 Trfel wrote: I'm back. LightningStrike's play does seem rather weird so far. First he says that my early vote is scummy, and then says that it is towny. Regardless of whether my early vote was a good or bad play, LightningStrike's view changed on it after DarthPunk and LoneMeow expressed opinions that it was a slightly townie thing to do. And then, asking for rsoultin makes no sense at all. Why rsoultin? If it's to make a meta read, how about all of the rest of us he has played with before? GlowingBear's opening seems pretty bad as well. In general I don't like claiming, since I feel that town players should simply play well to show that they are town (just like how I don't put very much focus on setups). Claim aside, why would he even sign up for the game if he doesn't want to play VT, the most common role? VT is the core of the game, the power roles are the fluff (especially in games like this one with only two power roles). Side note, I've been cop/tracker twice out of three previous games, and it hasn't been particularly enjoyable for me. VT is a much more enjoyable role IMO, less pressure and you can more freely speak your mind. - LS "weird" for changing viewpoint based on vet opinions. Really? - GBs opening claim. I think someone already mentioned that if they're supposedly doing the same thing, this is an odd read. + Show Spoiler + On January 18 2015 06:25 Trfel wrote: The way that LightningStrike played the start of this game still feels really weird to me. His thoughts seemed to be all over the place and his posting was somewhat random (particularly asking for rsoultin). However, since then he seems to have gained confidence and seems more towny. Especially after glancing through the scumgame he linked (yes I'm aware I played in that game, I wanted to look at it again anyway). Weird-more, towny...null? LoneMeow seems very strange to me. At first I liked his questioning, and I still do, but all he has done is pick on people for small things. The one read he provided was at the request of GlowingBear. I know that LoneMeow is a very good player, and provides a lot of content without using a large number of posts, so I will wait for now.... but I am a bit suspicious. Liked questioning, suspicious...null? No reason to include this except to say HEY LOOK I TOWNREAD A TOWN!! I generally like the way that Damdred and GlowingBear have been playing so far. Their analysis shows that they are reading the thread and trying to scumhunt, as well as generating discussion. I did notice that GlowingBear provided a lot of comments on posts in the thread, and I liked those. However, he also provided overall reads, but didn't show why he made those reads (they also didn't necessarily align with the comments he provided). The recent vote on Breshke is a continuation of this. However, I'm sure either of them could play a very capable scum game as well. Not a good Day 1 lynch. What? Between suddenly townreading(ish?) GB after suggesting he was scum earlier, all the back and forth, and the fact he never actually mentions Damdred individually...I feel like I got nothing from Trfel out of this paragraph. DarthPunk is coming up null. I have been waiting for more posts from him to provide more thoughts, but since he hasn't posted in a while, I will share my thoughts now. I do like that he picked up on LightingStrike's weird play at the start of the game. That was the same feeling that I got. However, he hasn't done very much at all except for saying that my opening made it seem that I am town. My opening doesn't really say anything about my alignment for reasons previously stated by geript, however the way I followed it up is more important (more on this later). For the record, several of you seem to be familiar with DarthPunk's playstyle, and I am completely unfamiliar with it, so that doesn't help. Lot of words to describe yet another null read. Geript's first post seemed a bit towny, and his second post seemed a bit scummy (it seemed like a poor use of a post when you are limiting yourself to ten). That's one fewer post to use to push a lynch later. Overall, geript seems fine for now, and is probably a poor Day 1 lynch. Towny, scummy. Null again?! Rsoultin and jarjar, you two need to talk so that jarjar feels comfortable with Day 1. That aside, while jarjar's opening post is pretty horrible, he has given some useful thoughts since then. As for rsoultin, I feel that her play lines up exactly with (my knowledge of) her town meta. I also liked the questioning that she used with regards to my opening. Still, I take note that jarjar said that she is capable of doing this as either alignment. One thing I did find really strange is that rsoultin provided her thoughts using a Damdred quote. I have no idea why she would do this except to compare opinions, but she didn't provide any thoughts on Damdred (I know their thoughts on other players were side by side, but still), and it gave the impression that her reads were less independent. JarJar horrible opening->useful thoughts; Me: Town meta (no one knows how I play scum but Shining and Dammy, lol) -> reads less independent...so...null reads again. I do need to clarify that based on how last game (Newbie Mafia) went and my postgame discussions with GlowingBear, I have been trying a slightly different playstyle this game. My opening attempted to generate discussion, and a relatively large number of posts were made about it (the quality of the discussion it generated is more questionable, so perhaps it didn't work out as I intended). The reason I pushed that (false) viewpoint was because I wanted to get as much discussion from it as possible, which I believe I did. As for providing less content per post than in previous games, this is a conscious change I made after seeing how last game went. Brief summary of my play in last game: there wasn't much discussion on the first day, and I was busy, so I didn't share many thoughts or put in the effort that I wanted, and then I died. My death provided absolutely nothing for town to work with, since I hadn't shared any thoughts as they were not anywhere near conclusive. This game I am trying to share my thoughts more frequently to prevent something like that from happening again. The downside is that my posts will not contain as much quality content as I would like, but I believe that I have provided enough content. Everything I say is there for a reason (in the case of the coolTLname paragraph, the reason is because I don't want to delete it; not always the best reason, but whatever). This to me is just icky. Huge explanation at the end of his reads as to why he's been sucking this game (sorry, Trfel, but I'm entitled to my own opinions and you've rocked other games) with a conclusion that as long as he's providing content the quality doesn't matter? At least, that's how I read the bolded section. With that in mind, I will answer geript's question. I (obviously) disagree with your read on me. I was intentionally being stubborn to argue with rsoultin and generate discussion, which (as I already stated) I think I was somewhat successful in. I was not so sure about your townread on LightningStrike at the time you made the post in question, but given some rereading and his posting since then, it seems reasonable. Rsoultin's play does seem towny so far, but he hasn't done anything that I couldn't see him doing as scum. I don't think that jarjar is a good lynch, however the reasons for that are mostly due to posts he made after you posted the read. If you have any questions, feel free to ask. And now, the giant novel of null. Seriously, there is pretty much nothing useful in this post. Open the spoiler and see my comments, but essentially he wrote paragraphs on half the players in this game just to call them null, then defended his lack of quality content. Also, if you can :/ LoneMeow and DarthPunk who were (apparent?) null reads, with Shining and Breshke (definite null reads for lack of activity)...so, really no scumreads. I'm having a hard time with this idea that Trfel has absolutely no strong town/scumreads at all this game. There's obviously more in his filter, to include WW and DP later in the game, and some questions. I'm not saying I'm 100% sure Trfel is scum. I do think that he is the most likely to flip scum of the players here, however. My reasons in a nutshell: - His reasons for his opening post kept changing. - No reads. What he does post is a lot of verbage to say he doesn't have an earthly clue and everyone is null. Blech. ##Vote: Trfel I already explained my responses to these points. I will state them again. Note that I need to leave for church in the near future, I will comment on the rest of the thread when I return. I already stated that my opening arguments were a falsified position with the intention of creating discussion. I held on to them for as long as practical. I don't understand why shifting my viewpoint from a policy lynch to "I will use my vote in the way that I feel it is most effective" is questionable. Wouldn't you ALWAYS want someone to use their best judgement with their vote? Whenever someone says that they will be doing something with their vote, it's assumed that they will change their vote if they see a reason to do so, which is basically what I said. My opening was not intended to policy lynch geript but to start discussion. Again, I think that it largely succeeded in that. Whether or not it did isn't really relevant to my alignment. LightningStrike's play was weird for other reasons. Read DarthPunk's comments on the start of the game. I don't see how you can possibly not call that weird. In particular, he's in the middle of the discussion, and then he suddenly asks for a female. Changing his viewpoint based on what more experienced players say is understandable, though it hints at a lack of conviction in his own opinion. As for not deleting that paragraph, I admitted there was no useful reason to keep it. But I wrote it. I didn't want to delete something that I wrote, especially since it ended up being very correct. I know it's silly. But it's not mafia. I don't generally make townreads, you should know that. At this moment I do not have strong scumreads, however I need to reread this entire game, and there has been a lot of new information since then. I wasn't calling players null, I was sharing my thoughts. I never called them reads. The reason for this is obvious: I didn't share my thoughts last game, and ended up being a terrible liability to town. I felt that I had enough thoughts that, while not being of much use on their own, could help provide some discussion. + Show Spoiler [meta] + I guess I need to say this after all. For those of you who dislike newbies using meta, you do not need to read this, however I do request that geript read this since he is (to some level) using meta against me. Remember, I come to TL Mafia without having played a game of mafia before, forums or in person or however. So I hd absolutely zero clue how anything worked. Before I started playing, I read all of the TL forum guides possible, including the TL XXX guide by Ver. This guide gave me the impression that all cases and reads were done using meta, and the best posts were really long meta posts (see the Foolishness post mentioned in that guide). You can see this being readily apparent in my case against batsnacks on Day 1. I made cases against batsnacks and Damdred in that game, in which I was 100% confident. Guess what, I was wrong on both. That shook my confidence a lot, and since then I decided that I needed to be better with my reads, hence drastically increasing the level of suspicion required to scumread someone*. Then I jumped into the Carol of the Bells game. Surely you remember how I basically sat out Day 1 and Night 1, spent most of Day 2 making excuses and whining that the thread was too long? Then I made a case on KelsierSC which was thrown together at the last second and primarily created to prevent me from dying. When I read it now, it actually looked pretty good (ironically the first half, for which I included the quotes to prove each point, was rather weak while the second half which was thrown together without supporting quotes at the last second was rather strong), at the time I didn't know if it was any good at all. I just posted it because I had tried to create cases on several people and none of them had felt strong enough, and I was at risk of being lynched if I didn't show something. It ended up being correct, but I still spent the majority of the game whining and complaining. Surely you don't call that amazing play. Then, see the Newbie Mafia game. I provided no reads, no useful thoughts, little to no discussion. The one thing I did right is that I correctly analyzed that none of the wagons were mafia, and that the mafia presence in the thread wasn't very high. I got shot on Night 1 for reputation, leaving town with next to zero information. The only good thing you can say about my play is that I realized that all of the Day 1 wagons were town. Geript later said that my play was good in that game for this insight, as well as seeming towny despite having poor posts. Realize that I provided no scumreads whatsoever in this game. So today, that leaves me with a reputation of being a good player (!) which resulted from making long posts and getting lucky once. Meanwhile, I'm still trying to figure out how to play the game, ie what level of suspicion I need to scumread someone, how fluid or static my reads should be, if/how I should incorporate townreads into my play, how claiming has any effect on anything whatsoever, voting analysis, etc. *I still dont' know what level of suspicion is required for a scumread. Since I increased the level I wanted, I have made one scumread. It was correct, but this playstyle doesn't seem to be working very well. In summary, I'm a noob for a reason. I'm still trying to figure out how to play this game. Please stop trying to hold me to glossy expectations based on the highlights of my play while ignoring the many, many shortcomings. I don't see how anyone can possibly disagree with this, but I can provide plenty of evidence if you think it is necessary. I really would rather not, though, since I have better things to do with my time, such as finding scum. Okay, so let's assume that I was overestimating your ability for kicks and giggles, despite the good play in Carol...you really shouldn't lie to me, Trfel; my brother is 100% right that it's a hole I don't easily climb out of. Damn it, you were the friggin seer in that game and still managed to call out not one but two scum in the little bit of posting you did on Day 2. Okay, digression over. The point of that was once you do lie to me I have a hard time believing a word you say and see lies in almost everything. I know I'm getting hung up on this, but I am hung up on it. Let's assume that was all pure luck as you're suggesting. Let's assume you really do think it's somehow more beneficial to town to read a giant post of blah with no actual opinions. The LS read bugs me. You and I were both on the same page with him last time, so I know that you know that scumreading LS for being erratic is bad. You called it "weird" when sheeping from him is normal. What makes it more weird this game than last game? What do you think of LS now? And please do not tell me that saying something is weird isn't scumreading. -_- At the very least it's implying that something could be scum. | ||
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On January 19 2015 00:44 LoneMeow wrote: This progression on LightningStrike is is just pure bullshit. "Weak meta case" when he's in your strong town category, really? And if you actually had read his previous town games you would have instantly seen that he's playing exactly like he has done as town so far. I'm fairly sure you didn't actually bother to get any kind of meta on him, just used that as excuse for a town read. Scum like to do that. ##Vote: Breshke GlowingBear, I am sorry for doubting you Lonemeow, where are you this game? If anyone could be accused of being disconnected, I think it's you. | ||
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That was unimpressive -_- | ||
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##unvote | ||
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On January 19 2015 01:50 geript wrote: For lack of reasons that you aren't not a good lynch. And stuffs. Lots of stuffs. How's your poe coming geript? | ||
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On January 19 2015 01:57 Damdred wrote: Rs vote lm with me I feel this one. I'm thinking about it, Damdred. As an inactive lynch I think it's not a bad choice. I'm seeing nothing of value from him this late in the Day phase. Can you give me your reasons? I like bullet format that I can then verify myself, personally. | ||
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On January 19 2015 02:07 GlowingBear wrote: LM is playing exactly like he played in Christmas Carol. I don't remember much of Lonemeow from Xmas Carol except during Night 1...actually, I remember going through his filter to try to figure out who his fellow mason(s) were...joke was on me cause somehow we had just 1 mason. He actually did seem to be poking and prodding at a lot of different people. I narrowed it down to 3 possibles I think, then had them give me reads on each other lol. That's all to say he was more active that game, for sure, and quite inquisitive. His vote on Breshke makes no sense. Did he read the quotes he used to justify his votes? I see no meta case from Breshke at all. | ||
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On January 19 2015 02:19 GlowingBear wrote: A meta case on Breshke at this point isn't that good IMO. There is no much meta to do on day1, and there is no much meta to do regarding a newbie. All we have is this idea that he lurks more as scum than as town. But he could be inactive because of RL stuff. I'd rather wait more days if that's the only reason to lynch Breshke today. I would vote SCUMMY lurkers, and I have yet to figure out Breshke's most possible alignment ATM I tend to agree with this, GB. I'm not getting scummy vibes from Breshke. Granted, he hasn't posted much, but I don't think he's the best lynch right now. | ||
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On January 19 2015 02:21 Damdred wrote: Lm>jajar >tr Is where in at What scummy lukerst I'm still trying to decide if LM is scum or just doesn't care this game, honestly. But since I'm trying to give Trfel a chance, of the three I guess LM would be my preference. | ||
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On January 19 2015 02:23 TheWarWaffle wrote: It's not just about the policy vote; it's about how all of Trfel's actions coalesce into a very suspicious pile. The vote itself was suspicious in Trfel's meta-reads: There are more, and there are posts made by him entirely on the topic of meta I will not post here. I am unsure as to how you may have missed them, considering what few reads Trfel has are all based of off predetermined ideas of what people should be doing. What is YOUR definition of meta, LoneMeow? WarWaffle, if we can't lynch Trfel today, do you still prefer GB? | ||
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On January 19 2015 03:06 LoneMeow wrote: Other thoughts, well. LightningStrike looks town by meta. DarthPunk looks town for the way his LightningStrike read evolved when presented with evidence from other games. Trfel I'm really torn on, the case by rsoultin has merit but Trfel puts quite a lot of effort into some of his posts which is a town trait. rsoultin is perhaps town for his defence of LightningStrike, since if I trust my read on LightningStrike he'd just be narrowing his potential mislynch pool if he did that as scum. But that's associative between unflipped players so meh. Okay, LM, please clarify your vote on Breshke. The way I read it, you were saying Breshke had a weak meta case on LS, when the opposite was true. (Sorry LS, <3 you, but ^^ | ||
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On January 19 2015 03:12 rsoultin wrote: Okay, LM, please clarify your vote on Breshke. The way I read it, you were saying Breshke had a weak meta case on LS, when the opposite was true. (Sorry LS, <3 you, but ^^ EBWOP: Also, can you please explain to me what part of my case on Trfel you thought was good? The going sentiment among the vets was it was shit, so... (I personally still think it was decent, but with so many people calling it bad xP Have to wonder why you like it.) | ||
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On January 19 2015 03:18 LoneMeow wrote: Right, it's far less strongly implicating him as scum now that I understood correctly, although I still don't like the way he went from "LightningStrike town" to "wouldn't call him town anymore" without any real explanation on what caused the shift. For now, ##Unvote Yeah, that would be the part that made me :/ at it, too, but I think it was at the same time that DP was talking about an LS lynch if I remember correctly. | ||
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On January 19 2015 03:22 LoneMeow wrote: I find myself agreeing that the way he suddenly backed out from a policy lynch he had strongly defended up to that point is suspicious. I think it's more likely to come from scum who's scared about all the attention the policy push is getting. I also don't like the way he implies "weird" means "scum". I can see making a post like that to generate discussion, and if in fact that was his intention I can see trying to keep the discussion going rather than going meh nevermind as soon as he got heat. I'm not completely out to lunch. It definitely wasn't a genuine policy lynch, so he definitely wasn't being honest about his intentions, which does attract me like a heat-seeking missile -_- To me he held onto it for a very long time, though, and why he didn't just say when he removed his vote that it was to generate discussion I can't fathom. The fact that GB brought that possibility up before Trfel himself did makes me wonder if Trfel didn't just say hey yeah that sounds good, that. I'm more concerned with his lack of drive in this thread. The latter part of my case. I am trying to think about it from the perspective that I haven't seen Trfel's thoughts as they develop and that's why they're so blah...but if all he had was blah, the novel makes me twitch. I'm not seeing firm stances on anything. He could have written "reasons so and so could be town vs reasons so and so could be scum" and been just as effective. Or ineffective as the case may be. | ||
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On January 19 2015 03:27 LoneMeow wrote: rsoultin, so if I somehow manage to convince you to not lynch me, and Trfel isn't viable either, who's the next best choice? I've looked at GB. I can see the complaints, but I think they've been overstated. I've looked at you and my main issue was you didn't seem to care. Trying to help me find a viable lynch would go a long way to help change that opinion. I won't vote for JarJar or LS today. I don't like a push on Shining, either, though I'm less certain on him. WW I think is probably town or he has a weirdly aggressive scum game lol. Getting itchy feelings about Damdred...can't pin down why. I want to hear Geript's poe. He told me that he looks for towns when he plays instead of scum, and lynches from what's left. I'm not sure that I'm seeing that this game, tbh. | ||
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On January 19 2015 03:45 LoneMeow wrote: Definitely not lynching LightningStrike today. Why not jarjarbinks? As a matter of fact, I do agree with that, but I want to hear your reasons. I need to reread Damdred and geript. JarJar is mostly a tone read; he's my little brother. But if you want logical I haven't known this kid since he was in diapers reasons: - He's not getting flustered by the heat he's taking. - He's making an honest attempt to figure out the game (at least in my eyes) with making his pushes here and there while answering the questions directed at him, so he's not purely on the defensive. - I kind of like what shining pointed out about a possible "slip", but I have to agree that if you're the scum team and know the layout you'd have to be pretty careless to let it slip in-thread like that. - He's not good about fully explaining what he's saying. For instance, the mislynches comment regarding his being competitive. I went wtf at first to that, too, and I'll let him explain it just in case I'm wrong, but I'm pretty sure I understand what he meant by it on a second reading. This has happened several times throughout the game where it looks like he posts a conclusion without the connecting thoughts. I think that will come with time, and is just a product of him being new. | ||
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On January 19 2015 04:07 GlowingBear wrote: Damdred is Mafia!! Says he could lynch me, when scumreads on me were getting traction: But before that, a series of posts shows he had a slight townread on me, even one post after: + Show Spoiler + On January 18 2015 02:33 Damdred wrote: Here in the knowledge bomb for today guys; Town: Trfel: Slightly different from what I am used to in other games, the pressure vote is not alignment indicative as Geript is a good enough player to do this with post restrictions as scum or as town. However the followup to people commenting on his stance is really good, he calls to attention the problems in LS stance at the time which is a good observation and shows that someone is really reading the game. Hes inquisitive about why people are doing things and he seems to be in the thick of all talks when hes in the thread. For now hes in the town pile and i'm pretty sold that he shouldn't be the lynch today at all. LightningStrike: Some of the stances he has taken seem a bit flimsy at times and it seems like he reverts on them as time passes sometimes. Which gave him a few scum points at first from me. But when questioned about where he was in the game he took little to no time at having actual somewhat developed thoughts on the people in the game. Was really quick to answer and hes not scared to push what he is thinking in the thread (or just put it out there) Pretty sure he is town here. RS: Hes town, he pressures people. Hes reading the thread, he has follow up on what he says and hes asking opinions to try to figure out peoples alignments. Wouldn't lynch him today at all. Null: LM: Why you not have your neck out and giving actual thoughts instead of just reacting to what people say to you .Warwaffle: not really rememerable but hasn't posted much Shining: where are you baby doll? Breshke: Who are you again? what do you think? Scum: TLCoolName: I have talked about him before now and I will reinterate. He attacks JarJar at one point and JarJar answers him, instead of interacting with him and trying to figure out his alignment. He disengages and says oh I like this post and never returns to it. When confronted with this information he says he just hasn't analyzed what JarJar has done. Shouldn't be much to analysis and Jarjar was in the thread at the time so he missed a good opoortunity to actually analysis the player and figure out his alignment. And then he switched to talking about me or rather slow pushing a target, he quoted something before the game started. He waited for someone else to vote and threw his vote down with that person. He claims it was a reaction test, but his reaction is not one a town would generally make. Instead of talking it through and trying to understand alignments of both he retreats from the confrontation and says just do analysis on everyone else. This guy is scum, hes not interested in finding out who is scum or pressuring people. He wants to find an easy target park there after someone else has fired the first shot and go on his merry way. General thoughts: I didn't bother to do everyone yet, Geripts huge post is full of good things that I want more peoples comments on. He might be onto something but I haven't rad DP filter or contextualized it yet. GB could really be town here, anger at the start seems authentic and GB hates being VT. Some good thoughts but not as many as drunk bear should usually have at this point. I'm undecided about JarJar currently, his recent postings looked pretty ok, but his previous postings looked bad. So can't really put him in a null town or scum currently but might lynch him depending on play as the game goes along. Overall cool is the scummiest thing in the thread and people should comment on what I wrote. On January 17 2015 23:48 Damdred wrote: A reaction or pressure test is brining that up and voting instantly IE like GB did. You say that you haven't analys'd Jarjar yet, but then why go after him and then one post later say I love this post and never mention him again? There seems to be a disconnect between what you say and what you ar edoing. On January 17 2015 23:35 Damdred wrote: GB probably town for this. tlcool is in the scum pile. Mostly the three names were a reaction test to see how people would look at it. I don't scum read people for 0 posts lol. LS is probable town. JarJar made some interesting posts just now I need to go back over On January 19 2015 00:11 Damdred wrote: GB reaction is priceless I'd rather not lynch the bear. And that's what GB does, likes killing lurkers early Here is the problem: if you think someone is probably town you can NEVER say, NEVER, that he is someone you could lynch. It doesn't matter if he changed his mind, it doesn't matter if he said "doubtful". LYNCHING ME IS NEVER AN OPTION FOR DAMDRED, SPECIALLY IN THIS GAME, BECAUSE WE ARE EXTREMELY FAMILIAR WITH EACH OTHER GAMEPLAY. A thought of lynching me CAN NEVER CROSS HIS MIND AFTER THOSE QUOTED POSTS. THIS IS A SCUM KEEPING IS OPTIONS OPEN. Doubt we have a grasp of each others meta? Check the spoiler: + Show Spoiler + On January 15 2015 08:28 GlowingBear wrote: @Marv: (Damdred is town in all the following games): .:Arnie has got a gun minimafia (town damdred/mafia gb): http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/464753-arnie-got-his-gun-mafia?user=Damdred + Show Spoiler + On August 20 2014 04:41 Damdred wrote: Is it outside the realms of realiy? I'm not sure that GB is mafia why not help me understand what you are seeing that makes you unhesitant about him. I'm seeing a lot of his town play right here and hes tunneled on Rob for whatever reason and won't move just doesn't feel like mafia right there This is an example of how usually damdred has an opinion about me. See that he says he is seeing a lot of my town play and that my tunnel on Robik in this game makes me town. He has an opinion on my meta, although it's wrong. This is just an example. You can check how in his first 3 pages of filter he spends a lot of time talking about me. .:Guilty Mini Mafia (town damdred/town gb) http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/465098-guilty-mini-mafia?user=Damdred&page=8 + Show Spoiler + On August 22 2014 23:29 Damdred wrote: If this is the post you responded to me on ok, I don't disagree with a town read on GB for his earlier posting and responses in the thread, infact I agree with you that they felt a lot more natural than when we last saw GB as mafia however (I should of specified earlier) I only disagree with such a strong town read. There have been several instances where GB has been as awkward as the mafia game. re-entry post and where he asked me whether WoS was mafia or not and then promptly went to bed and has had no follow up on that post earlier its strange that it seemed like an important exchange in finding each others alignments but it seems to be quickly forgotten. Also instead of waiting for me to respond to his earlier question he immediately qued on an odd post I made and then retreated to bed shortly before I responded and still hasn't drawn conclusions from the posts. So yes I disagree with your stronger town read currently, I have a falling town lean after re-reading GBs filter. And I know you said earlier WoS activity level cannot be put in comparison to scummy level so glad you checked on that though. On August 23 2014 01:24 Damdred wrote: You really didn't push people yesterday GB, you allowed yourself to be questioned by Wave and you were being a bit dickish to Kel when he didn't answer your question straight away before understanding why he was doing that.When you actually started trying to get answers out of me instead of waiting for me to answer you then pointed to a bad looking post and peace'd out and didn't return to that upon your return at all. So yea theres not much of a push just the image of a push at that point in your filter. I really want you to read the thread and respond when you can GB, you are looking bad because of some of the things I mentioned and this anger because people are scum reading you when you are admittedly behind on the thread feel weird to me generally when i've played with townGB in the past whenever this happened you would take a step back and say let me go read and i'ill be back not get angry it's just weird at this point for you and does feel a bit forced. First post: Damdred is now aware of how I can sound like mafia and has a clear intuition regarding my gameplay. Second post: Damdred says that I look weird when I'm behind the thread, poiting out that I may be scum in this game. Again, check his filter and for the first pages, look how much posts I am his main topic of discussion. .:Fanfic Minimafia (town damdred/mafia gb) http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/466211-tl-mafia-lxviii-fanfic-crossover-edition?user=Damdred&page=6 + Show Spoiler + On September 19 2014 11:47 Damdred wrote: Why would town GB make a big deal about me not analyzing batsnacks at the drop of the hat, and never comment on a post I wrote. Is going to vote geript without any real reasons or thoughts it feels. Has started to discredit people and started to paint them scummy...im starting to think GB is scum On September 19 2014 11:20 Damdred wrote: GB you are acting weird I haven't led a read of yours all day and wasn't talking to you with that question but hf to get clarification on stuffs and if you look at my filter I want to lynch geript today Here, with more experience in my gameplay, he townreads me first but starts believing I'm scum for doing awkward things. I've added a bonus post where he clearly states why I'm looking scum. He is taking a very original and genuine stance, with a clear and precise thought process that I HAVE NEVER SEEN IN THIS THREAD YET. Same thing. Read his filter and see how much time he spends talking about me. .:Hearthstone Mafia (town damdred/town gb) http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/469686-hearthstone-mafia?user=Damdred&page=8 + Show Spoiler + On November 02 2014 00:45 Damdred wrote: because i hate lynching the biggest filter on d2 just like on d1 its just a bad idea generally. GB we've been over your meta a lot, you are more standoffish as scum and you are fluff make promises that you don't keep and when you do its just bad. Right now you have 2/3 scum traits right now. So if i had a gun i might shoot you but i don't. On November 02 2014 07:56 Damdred wrote: It's meta reasoning, GB is playing towards his scum meta of making promises never delivering tunneling on one person and being very passive. I was scared to lynch into a big filter and I really still am. First post: Says I'm scum for meta things. Admits we have been over my meta for a long long time. Second post: again, scum reads me for meta. Has a clear distinct meta thingy on me. AGAIN, main topic of his early filter is me. .: Russia Today Mini Mafia (town damdred/town gb) http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/471815-russia-today-mini-mafia?user=Damdred&page=2 + Show Spoiler + On November 28 2014 12:29 Damdred wrote: I'm pretty much caught up I won't go into my town reads but I have a good many of them this time around. GB- Overall GBs game has been lacking, entrance to the thread was strange for GB had a really try hard air to it which is strange for GB. Does not seem to have a firm direction in the way hes pushing things for the most part, but some thoughts seem to be their and the frustration which he answers a lot of the claims really appears to be real (thats a null trait). Leaning scum on GB but i'm not as confident lynching GB today as the response to Superbia actually looks ok and the small bit of paranoia GB has towards some of the other players look real. Sent- I would probably settle on a sent lynch today right now, I cannot remember anything from the 4x pages of game besides sent talking about turtling up for the day. Nothing memorable besides a pressure on my slot. Sno- Frustration seems real, overall lacking day is very different from the last game I played with him (Neat and tidy mafia) was able to give reads even though he was unfamiliar with meta and tried to really help town out. Doesnt really show that here. Overall i'm more in favor of a sent lynch as he is possibly the least memorable person in the thread On November 28 2014 13:12 Damdred wrote: You can check with this host if he has a problem, I personally don't care as long as the flip happens since then my play is public knowledge. I chose you sno and GB. GB has played oddly by his standards but has a few staples of his town play. Sno reacted strangely to pressure but seemed genuinely frustrated at the way he was being read and treated by some players. You on the other hand sent have taken almost no pressure becaue you have steered clear of almost everything and turned most of everything into a joke. Its not so much that you have been absent from the thread for the first 24 hours, its clear from your filter that you were here during some of the decent moments during the thread, but you didn't give your opinons on them and you seemed pretty wishy washy, you still haven't given reads besides pressuring elvis which you have now retreated on and we stiill have no idea what you found out from the pressure. Why aren't you still pressuring? You can't have gained much insight into my alignment and its pretty obvious that you disagreed with what I came up with and view it was easy lynches perhaps? So why not keep pressuring me instead of retreating? On November 29 2014 00:08 Damdred wrote: Screw you JAT no reason to be snarky at me at this point. @Marv, I'm not sure sno is acting strange but he's said some things I've remembered I think. Sent has kept his hands clean and even though he's been back in the thread he's avoided mu questions to him about his vote. There's a ton more games on me to read so he could get some hood evidence. though GB becomes a better lynch as his case does not materialize On November 29 2014 00:38 Damdred wrote: I'm not really sure I agree, sno is weird in thread and is totally different from last time I played, just not sure he is the lynch today idk. So is GB but there are a few posts and a missing case that drives gbs scumminess for me currently rather than meta. don't think I've played with sent I just think how sent is going about today is scummy. On November 29 2014 00:42 Damdred wrote: Spent most time on GB because I'm most familiar with GB probably. I'm more null for you jat but you would rather lynch me? On November 29 2014 00:59 Damdred wrote: GB is more likely town than scum after that case probably On November 29 2014 04:20 Damdred wrote: Struggles with getting across complex ideas and generally looks meh doing it at times which is generally towny of GB. Does what he promises instead of excuses and foes after a hard target in Marv instead of an easy target he could of picked. Seems to believe everything he says. First post: a very strong meta thing on me. Second post: gut feelings/meta thing on me. THIRD AND FOURTH POST (IMPORTANT): scumread me for meta (he is scum if his promised case doesn't materialize). FIFTH POST: admits he is familiar with my gameplay and, therefore, spends more time with me. SIXTH POST: META ME AS TOWN BECAUSE I'VE DELIVERED A CASE. SEVENTH POST: SHOWS WHAT HE BELIEVES IS A TOWNTELL FROM ME I'm gonna stop on Russia Minimafia because it alone is very damning. Also, remember that Russia was AFTER Hearthstone, a game where damdred said he stopped making meta reads on me because he was wrong on me, WHAT IS EXTREME BULLSHIT SINCE HE META'ED ME A LOT ON RUSSIA MINIMAFIA. As ever, he spends a lot of time having me as the main topic. TL;DR = read only Russia Minimafia part I also want you to look at how his thoughts are clear in these games and how contributive he is to the thread, a very different behaviour from him regarding this game. A couple of Damdred's town posts that I have never, ever seen in this game below: + Show Spoiler + On November 02 2014 00:36 Damdred wrote: If you want reasons behind my reads i'm more than happy to give my reasons, generally if you ask me for something I do it. GB asked for the reads laughed them off. Jay is a good townread I think currently, Overall his posts seem to have a clear direction in them with a clear thought pattern that town generally has. He starts the game off with Its a strange opening, but he does not stop at that he explains himself in what appears to be a concise manner. He also sees pressure votes piling up on him and welcomes them just asking why they are that way. He doesn't freak out about the votes, he wants to know why though. The pressure has moved off of him, but he continues to help the thread and posts like this seem to have a clear thought pattern behind them. He is really logical about how he approaches things and seems to be coming from a town mindset hes not looking to gang up on people in his filter (or thread). He is generally replying to everything asked of him and giving his thoughts about what is going on. I'll give a few examples of that now some of it is policy talk which is really safe but (crazy theory lololol) (really like this post) He also calls out hf for what he sees a shit flinging. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/469686-hearthstone-mafia?page=25#483 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/469686-hearthstone-mafia?page=27#538 He actually pressures a good many people in the thread and draws attention to himself through it, with the hf, the lord tolkien, puts some pressure on gb he is digging for thoughts into people so that he can get better reads and get the thread involved. So overall, he seems to be coming from a towny mindset. Hes looking for information gives his thoughts pretty freely and is doing things. He shouldn't be a lynch today and unless he takes a nose dive or some form of red check confirmed hes in my town pile pretty heavily. On August 20 2014 00:41 Damdred wrote: Are you serious right here? here are the posts where i pursued the issue with GB Why are you lying on me Xata? There was NOTHING casual about this I went after GB and didn't stop and GB eventually left the thread and came back today....why are you saying things like this On August 20 2014 01:30 Damdred wrote: I don't like Geript at this time and i'm pretty sure a lot of what hes doing is mafia oriented. Ok so his first real post in the thread is a list post, it looks big and good but a lot of it is no analysis really or spotty analysis at best. Also him pulling my post that he says is odd is strange its not my most scummy post by far up to this point oats got me on that one. Subsequently he has little follow up with a lot of this and some of these posts aren't as scummy in context as they appear. Actually i'm really confused now all of this ray town read Xata when all he said about xata was or his most recent posting before death so i'm not understanding why rays posting would have him rethinking his scum read when he generally trusts rays reads...its just strange and implies that ray townread xata more of this later I'm going to ignore the part about me here people can disect it if they want. I want to talk about GB first I really feel like the post he quotes isn't scummy at all for what was going on in the thread at the time and it could be taken out of context and shown as scummy. And he claims to trust rays reads....but ray had GB as town hrm. Point three about poof just doesn't make sense, and i'd rather him not be hunting for town. He should be hunting for scum. I hate this stupd stupid stupid timing read meta shit that he keeps bringing up its crappy and honestly stupid. Its not indicative of mafia or town at all and him claiming poof said he was trying to emulate his town game is just...honestly a lie or a misinterpretation of what poof actually said since he was talking about two seperate games he played with marv when explaining what this shit was to me. And then he continues to spout it to gain poof lynch support. Of course yoru reads on why you scum read people matter, or in this case have an illusion of scum reading people where you take stuff out of context to make them look scummy lie about what people actually say to make them look scummy and have people spouting off he gave good reads....he hasn't done jack shit but just has the appearance of it. VOTE DAMDRED FOR GREAT JUSTICE! GB, I'm going to be honest here, I'd like to see less about Damdred's tendency to meta-read you (cause I'm having trouble following it) and more about his play overall to be sold on a Damdred lynch. I will say though that a town Damdred (unless he's just in a meh phase) tends to have a lot more thread presence. His read progression on you wasn't something that I easily followed, and my kneejerk reaction to not want to lynch you and hesitate on LM is I'm not certain on Damdy. This post is kind of giving me an OMGUS vibe. Do you have anything else? | ||
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On January 19 2015 04:19 geript wrote: ##vote glowingbear The PoE hasn't really changed. LM, GB, JJB, Trfel and Shining are all decent lynches imo. If expect to see someone add good reasons if the want to lynch WW, Breshke or Trfel. I feel a lot like DP. There's not a really strong leader in the pack for me. That said, GB showing he has no intention of posting or thinking reasonably earns my vote. LM I'm kinda unsure what to do with because he feels so disjoint, but I kinda like the reasons for the Breshke read but... Idk it's such an easy thing to push. Devil's advocate again. GB had me all up his ass in Carol cause he's not a reasonable player. Or at least wasn't that game, and I've seen enough people say that he's bad (sorry GB, just saying what I've seen ^^ to think that it's normal for him to be...well...irrational. I've burned myself several times now mislynching people for irrational and am leery of it.Also, Trfel keeps making your decent lynches and do not lynch lists. I am going to use the word "weird" here for that. I didn't see where your read changed...and you keep (accidentally?) putting him in both camps. The post against WW was when WW scumread both him and GB, and while I can't say that I really agree with the reasoning per se from WW, it is true that those were low-risk ways to get townread for scum, so I do find those actions null rather than townie. | ||
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On January 19 2015 04:22 GlowingBear wrote: Tell me what's wrong in my case. Tell me why I could be wrong. I don't understand your case. The progression on his reads on you I agree is weird but the rest I simply do not understand. I want to know if that is all you have against Damdred. | ||
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On January 19 2015 04:32 GlowingBear wrote: Yes, that's all You need more evidence than that???? Lol, frankly, yes. But given how little evidence you had against HF and you were still right, I'll take the time to look at Damdred closer. I did say that he was giving me itchy feelings this game, after all, just can't put a finger on it >< | ||
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I think the main thing that had me itchy was the reaction test and eh...maybe that's a thing, I don't know. Damdred, can you explain to me what made you think a GB lynch today was a maybe? Everything in your filter does seem to indicate that you're leaning town on him, so I can see why he has a bug up his ass about it. | ||
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On January 19 2015 04:53 Damdred wrote: I've said it twice at least, he's boring before now and usually GB isn't boring. So...you townread him a bunch of times then suddenly decided he was boring. And maybe worth lynching. But didn't bother to mention that reason until questioned. Damdred, my BS meter. It is going off again. Geript, please answer where you actually stand on Trfel. Once is a mistake. Twice is a pattern. | ||
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On January 19 2015 05:03 jarjarbinks wrote: OK read up and stuff. Questions: Geript: does GB usually contribute better than in this game? His filter isn't as high quality as yours but he definitely appears to be scumhunting IMO. Damdred: Was the vote for GB reactionary? Or was it really because he was "boring"? Is boring enough to lynch him? Have you read DP's filter yet? He's already given the reaction you claimed to be looking for. Rsoultin: What are your thoughts on LM now that he's posted some more? Let me know if you have questions for me. I'll probably be on here for about 30 more minutes looking for things. ^ What makes me think JJB is town. Dude, please explain your mislynches response when Breshke asked if scum couldn't try hard if they were competitive, too? Pin in LM. Sometimes I will not state my thoughts aloud if I think that will cause someone to play differently than they otherwise would, especially when I'm still trying to get reads on certain players. | ||
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On January 19 2015 05:09 geript wrote: I talked with DP and Damdred about it. i think with you about it too. Like there are things that make me think he'll flip mafia in his filter. There are also things that make me think he'll flip town in his filter. I don't think he's a bad lynch per se, I'm just personally not interested in lynching him because I think there are higher percentage flips. So why is he the only one you're riding the fence on? To clarify, I see you posting reservations about some of the other "good lynches" names in your list of 5, specifically LM and JarJar, but he is the only one I've seen making multiple lists in the same post. If you don't think he's a good lynch today he shouldn't be in the 5, right? | ||
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On January 19 2015 05:11 geript wrote: Are you not actually reading the thread at all? Do you think that post is in any way productive? If you've got a problem, state it clearly. Thank you. | ||
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I'm fine with that one, too, actually. Usually one point isn't enough for me but the "boring" thing just isn't ringing true. It seems like a distinct unprompted change in his overall read, and you were getting flak from others at the time. | ||
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On January 19 2015 05:45 geript wrote: If you can't read 2 of my posts and know that I'm town, then there's really nothing I could ever say that would change that. I'm buddying up to DP because he's the only good player who I'm sure is town and can get an honest opinion on. I can post 2 good posts as scum, too. Probably not as well as veterans can, but I can. I can also talk my way out of a mislynch as scum. You've shown a proclivity to ignore/not fully read wall posts yet expect people to read yours and townread you for them. I'm asking you why you keep scumreading Trfel hard, then saying he could be town, yet keeping him in both your good lynch and don't lynch piles. He is the only one you are doing that with. Saying he could be scum or town = null to me. At the very least, if you have such big reservations, why is he in your 5-man lynch pile? It's not adding up and you're refusing to clarify. | ||
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On January 19 2015 05:50 rsoultin wrote: I can post 2 good posts as scum, too. Probably not as well as veterans can, but I can. I can also talk my way out of a mislynch as scum. You've shown a proclivity to ignore/not fully read wall posts yet expect people to read yours and townread you for them. I'm asking you why you keep scumreading Trfel hard, then saying he could be town, yet keeping him in both your good lynch and don't lynch piles. He is the only one you are doing that with. Saying he could be scum or town = null to me. At the very least, if you have such big reservations, why is he in your 5-man lynch pile? It's not adding up and you're refusing to clarify. EBWOP: lol, talk my way out of a lynch | ||
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On January 19 2015 05:58 geript wrote: You're literally either being dense or mafia. I've covered why Trfel is in my group of good lynches multiple times now. There's literally only 1 person who I would never lynch in this game and that's DP. I maybe could write a good case on him... Maybe. There's not a single other player in this game who I don't have reasons to find as being mafia. Overall, I take the good and the bad I have on a player and weigh them. If you don't like that, then I have no qualms about ramrodding a lynch in either your or JJB's direction just out of spite. Okay, don't explain why he's the special pool straddler; that's fine. Spite voting is so townie So am I to understand that your purpose for buddying up to DP has nothing to do with the fact that before you started he said your opinion was the only opinion he gave a flying fuck about? | ||
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On January 19 2015 06:09 geript wrote: I have no clue why you're distracting me from doing something useful here. I've played with DP a bunch. I was a major reason why he was the last man standing in a VS game where I correctly read Rayn as town, I pushed mafia all D1 and acceded from my own spectacular case on one mafia to an ok case on another mafia while retracting a previous townread on DP. He knows I'm a good player. I know he's a good player; I've seen him hold together good lynches while numerous bad lynches are sprouting up left and right. Damdred's an up and comer. The two of us are quite literally the only "names" in this game. Like BH isn't even really a "name" anymore because he hosts too much and is more interested in doing silly stuff than playing actual mafia. Welcome to the world outside of the kiddy pool. If you want to be recognized as a good player, you need to prove it. If you're town, then you should be ignoring me. I don't see a geript lynch forming right now. I'm going to put a pin in you for awhile, anyway. ^^ Sorry, your dazzle star power doesn't make me want to worship you. If something's odd I'm gonna prod at it. Okay, so where is LM? | ||
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On January 19 2015 06:34 Damdred wrote: anyway a Scum team of jarjar-tr_-rs is interesting pre flip associative reads stink but yea. Anyway serious last thing in case I die Lol, yeeeeah that's likely. You're bad at this. | ||
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On January 19 2015 06:36 LoneMeow wrote: Just got back and caught up, so not yet. Why are you voting Damdred? Any other reason than GlowingBear's case? If you read Damdred's filter pretty much every read in it on GB is town. GB's case didn't highlight that correctly, in my opinion, and the meta thing is fucking confusing, but it's true that I see absolutely nothing in there to indicate that Damdred was scumreading GB. Then he says GB may be lynchable? No reasons for it. Doesn't vote him. When questioned it was that GB has been boring. All of a sudden. Even though GB reacted to his reaction test (which he was townread for) and Damdred even flatout said he didn't want to lynch GB cause his reactions are interesting? It seemed to me like he had to quickly scrounge for a good reason to leave the GB lynch open. | ||
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On January 19 2015 06:44 Trfel wrote: But I disagree. I was in Carol of the Bells with him. That said, I seem to be the only person who disagrees. If he isn't lynched today I want to see him step up his play tomorrow, but I will reconsider my lynch for today. Trfel, I gave you some breathing room. What else did you come up with? I think LM is playing differently than carol, too (cue vets screaming about meta xP) but I can't decide if it's scummy or just flat out inactive. | ||
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-shrugs- | ||
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##unvote ##vote: WarWaffle Okay, I think he's moderately more likely to flip scum than GB and JarJar. If you're right, geript, props to you. | ||
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Will come back to the game in the morning. | ||
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Okay, I'm feeling a little better about this lynch now. Before anyone comes riding like bats out of hell...I now feel much more confident town-reading: -Damdred -GB -Geript for their end-game play. I don't see most of what was going on there coming from scum. So I don't think any of them are good lynches tomorrow. That narrows down the scum pool significantly, I think. I'll probably be lynching into either Breshke or LM tomorrow...most likely LM, for the inactivity and his timing for returning to the thread. I don't think carrying them into LYLO is a good idea. Trfel still holds suspicions for me, but that can wait a day. GB, Damdred...your thoughts? | ||
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On January 19 2015 11:49 Damdred wrote: I have to cover all of my basis though, and we actually need to analysis the claim. Firstly, there are two possible scenerios that involve a tracker. One is Cop tracker and one is tracker doctor. I thought about it as JarJar softing, but he cannot possibly know still that a medic exists in this setup as we are down to a 50/50 if he is the tracker. If we see a doc/cop flip obviously hes mafia, there might be something there and its still possibly a scum slip instead of a soft. I know it sounds tin foil, but its something we have to consider down the line and JarJar isn't confirmed if he isn't shot obviously. And if cop flips and doc flips.outs we at least have one mafia already there. So just figured I would talk it out before moving down. Trfel should be the lynch tomorrow, maybe LM, and we still have to evaluate a couple more people. I'm going to heal Dp tonight obviously, hes the most towny person in the game. I"m not sure if we should kill breshke tomorrow I like some of his posts but we need to pressure him a bit more, and talk me through your EoD rsoultin. Eh, messy. Was trying to work out my thoughts with Lonemeow (ironic, I know) since the only one I was pretty sure on was Trfel, but no one wanted to lynch him and I didn't have any further arguments apart from what I already posted. Plus, yeah, I get stubborn and tunnel about people being insincere, when their words don't line up with their actions. GB never felt like a good lynch to me. I didn't want to lynch LS. I feel I've got a pretty good tone read on my brother, so I didn't want to lynch JarJar. And no, I didn't want to lynch WW either. I actually was still deciding what to do when JarJar claimed and didn't see it until I'd already changed my vote. There was something like 90 seconds left at that time. If anything, I found the lynch immensely frustrating. And much as I think that geript can't be scum unless I'm wrong on either JarJar or GB, that trfel in two pools thing still is niggling at me. It may not mean anything, though, odd as it seems and much as geript didn't want to actually explain it >< | ||
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Why do you think that Trfel is the lynch tomorrow? You got onto us for not being willing to lynch inactives last game, and we've only got two mislynches left before scum wins. | ||
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On January 19 2015 12:00 LightningStrike wrote: Well in the post you said you were going to heal DP and idk how it would of been auto corrected to that unless you are posting from a phone. Stop. | ||
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On January 19 2015 12:01 Damdred wrote: Look at Russian Mafia for geripts last scum game, it was a really good scum game for him one that he probably should of hard carried to the victory. Honestly its one of the reasons hes not my #1 town, he makes me more paranoid than HF does as scum I think. Its a pretty small lynch pool for you tomorrow then? I think I already mentioned that it is. I don't see the value in lynching people on paranoid whisperings right now when no scum has flipped yet. If you read my filter (which I thought you said you were?) I already mentioned the people I didn't want to lynch a few times. Most of them I consider to be players who are often misread as scum, like LS and yes, my brother. | ||
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On January 19 2015 12:09 Damdred wrote: Obviously jarjar will be alive tomorrow more than likely just for wifom if hes tracker and more than likely he will be blocked if he is the true tracker. I'm not going to give scum strategy so we shouldn't talk about it to much in depth, but until we start seeing some flips of another power role we need to just ignore it for now more than likely. I don't have much to substantiate with but the "softing/scum slip" earlier makes me a bit weary to believe the claim. We have little inactives, I think we can eliminate shining from lynch tomorrow. Breshke needs a good day, LM needs a decent day. Those to me are our really only inactives and they aren't spammy but are here if we have a cop I would check one of them and hope to get lucky. Trfel has been the least interested in the days activity I think, and has really changed the play from all of the other games I played with him in. Even in the last newbie it seemed very similar to carol/last student mafia. Was pretty strong even if he wasn't as inactive, and as blue in carol he was really strong. This just seems like a weird mirror like performance, playing down his ability no real scum reads sheeping instead of pushing. Being wrong is good in mafia it helps you get more information instead of laying back ... Forgive me if this sounds crusty but why the hell are you coming to this conclusion now when I've been saying it all along? >< I stopped pushing trfel because I couldn't get any traction and started wondering if I was just being a stubborn ass again and blind to what everyone else was seeing. | ||
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On January 19 2015 12:17 Damdred wrote: Nights the best time for re-evaluation and talking through your reads and scum hunting more I say. If I get shot I need my thoughts out there anyway. there felt like a good bit of resistance to a tr lynch, and I felt LM and cool was scummier at the moments, after a relook at tr filter I found a lot of scum traits. also I considered tr was a blue so I didn't want to bring it up but then I checked on his other blue game and it directly mirrored his VT game even though he was more absent in carol he bled town whenever he was there. Not so here, I think hes scummy now though. And I was halfway afk through most of th eday Meh you townreading trfel when you and I were both in the same games with him was one of the main reasons I kept waffling on you, and I kept trying to sideline it by telling myself I could be wrong about him. If this is a deliberate change in his play as town, after this game someone needs to give him a good kick in the rear. He was more helpful living 1-2 days and getting shot by scum than he's been this game -_- He was awesome as a blue in carol and didn't vomit crap into the thread | ||
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On January 19 2015 12:22 Damdred wrote: You were in the last newbie game with him I believe, how different do you think his play is from there to here? (he claims he played bad in that newbie game as well) Didn't you read it? Regardless, he couldn't be as active because of returning to school, but when he was he was a pretty solid voice of reason, even if he didn't come up with any of his own scumreads, and the very first odd thing he pointed out ended up being a post from one of the scum players. He may genuinely feel that he didn't do as well as he could have, but his instincts were still excellent even without much time to evaluate the thread. I want to townread him because I feel I can trust him to temper my stubbornness when I'm town. But as hard as I've tried I can't, and I haven't had any trouble doing so before. | ||
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When he and I are town. | ||
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Do you think that's the case? | ||
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Lol, if you're scumreading me you're wrong -shrugs- That said, have at it. | ||
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On January 19 2015 12:48 DarthPunk wrote: I just said I was going to read your filter and stuff. Why so ultra defensive about it? Ultra defensive would not be that post. I actually encourage you to read my filter. I've never come close to being mislynched, with the exception of a shenanigans vote in response to a hammer vote, and I doubt that will change this game. | ||
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On January 19 2015 12:55 DarthPunk wrote: It's a fucking weird/excessive reaction to an off the cuff statement. You're entitled to your opinion. Who of the trains do you think was scum, since you think all of them can't be town? | ||
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On January 19 2015 13:07 DarthPunk wrote: Dunno. It seems really unlikely that 4 wagons were all town. But Damdred and glowingbear seem townie since the lynch. JJB is an un-counterclaimed tracker And the War Waffle flipped town. So unless one of damdred or glowingbear is actually scum ( which makes no sense unless they are both scum, which also makes no sense.) Or JJB is counterclaimed, I guess every wagon yesterday was on a townie which means everyone should take a step back and re-evaluate your reads. Which is what I plan to do tonight. Fair enough. I've been doing some of that myself -_- But honestly probably won't dive until tomorrow. Little worn out right now. I agree that Damdred and GB almost definitely have to be the same alignment, and it seems to be a ridiculously high-risk move for scum. (Plus I don't really read GB as scum anyway.) | ||
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This is straight up bad, DP. You're trying to tell me you think that it's town for LM to completely misread Breshke, vote him on the misread, then correct himself when someone points it out? How is that a good read? He was voting Breshke for a meta case Breshke never made. What's so amazing about his first set of reads? LS and you town for obvious reasons everyone is already saying you're town for? If you think this makes LM town I have to wonder what you're smoking. | ||
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On January 19 2015 13:57 Damdred wrote: I'm somewhat breaking my promise about not doing a ton of quotes in a post but i'm going to hide them behind spoilers to make readability better. Going into EoD, I had a few problems with LM. These problems were mainly, a disconnect from the game. The catch up posts were incredibly behind and out of context they looked ok but in context seemed really disjoined and didn't flow well with the thread. Wasn't really interested in interactions much going into the day either. I decided to look into EoD for LM and a few thing struck out at me. The last quote in the spoilers is interesting to me, the vote hinges on WW voting with his scum read on tr. When if you check the votes and pay attention WW was on GB well before Tr even made a move that way. So it was an excuse to strengthen a mislynch which is telling to me, why lie and over explain your vote? At the start of the quotes (previously jarjar was only mentioned twice and never was really sure if it was a scum read or what but was non committal) Asks why wouldn't you lynch jarjar, makes some noncommittal marks about somewhat scum reading me because it looks like my train is about to take off. Next quote is a inconsitancy as LM never said that he didn't want to vote Jarjar, and also I think the train was going against GB and it was better to say I shouldn't be the lynch at this moment. Overall it looks like someone just trying to find a safe spot for a vote, lying and over explaining everything while not really trying to rock the vote while parroting at points to. pretty sure this person is scum. Quotes are in filter + Show Spoiler + On January 19 2015 03:45 LoneMeow wrote: Definitely not lynching LightningStrike today. Why not jarjarbinks? As a matter of fact, I do agree with that, but I want to hear your reasons. I need to reread Damdred and geript. On January 19 2015 06:47 LoneMeow wrote: Not lynching Damdred today unless there's something new on him, I quickly read his filter and I think he's more likely town than not. I prefer jarjarbinks over GlowingBear despite what I said earlier about not wanting to lynch him today. jarjarbinks just seems to be making apologies and sitting in the background whereas GlowingBear is very vocally pushing for his lynch. ##Vote: jarjarbinks On January 19 2015 06:57 LoneMeow wrote: Wait, TheWarWaffle was actually voting with his previous best scum read Trfel? Yeah I'm ok with lynching him. ##Unvote ##Vote: TheWarWaffle Give me a bit to see how these actually play out in context. I know I was there, but it was so chaotic at EoD it's kind of blurry in my memory right now. At first glance it looks like you may have picked up on something. | ||
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On January 20 2015 01:21 Damdred wrote: Did you find anything in context, and I think your reasons are weak dp. Eh, preliminary impression? His votes are going with the majority feel in the thread at the time for weak reasons. (The JarJar vote was weird when he said he agreed with not voting him earlier, just as you pointed out.) Everyone else is arguing and it looks more like he's just trying to find somewhere to park where his vote doesn't stand out too much. | ||
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LM got lost in the shuffle with everyone else exploding. Which imo would be ideal for scum, but doesn't necessarily make him scum. His voting at EoD certainly doesn't make me any more inclined to townread him though. I think he's a good lynch. | ||
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On January 20 2015 01:49 Damdred wrote: I noticed that you said dps reasoning's were weak. What do you make of that? Eh, tbh I'm trying not to make pre-flip associations this game if I can avoid it. Some of DPs posting has come across as pretty townie to me, but I'm not as sold on him as some of the rest of y'all are. His early filter was all seemingly in defense of trfel, so if we lynch trfel and he flips scum, DP needs to be looked at hard. That he also has weak reasons to townread LM isn't making me feel better about him. The other player I think bears close watching is Breshke, but I'm not really feeling him as a better lynch than either trfel or LM atm. If JarJar turns out to be scum (in which case I will stop giving tone reads on him or defending his bad play lol in future games) I think geript is a good place to look. I find this scenario least likely, though. | ||
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On January 20 2015 02:25 jarjarbinks wrote: Most of these are parrots b/c people already said most of this. I figured you'd want my opinion on it though. Geripts play makes no sense from a mafia perspective IMO. Poor Waffle, I honestly think he's played better than me both D1's and gotten lynched both times. I feel that GB and damdred are town based on EOD play. What a move by GB. Didn't understand it at first, but I think I get it now. LM did have two votes before my train started really picking up. It was 2-3 at one time. I think there was an hour left but it still was relatively close to EOD. I think Breshke made my train possible for GB to pull off his risky move. I wouldn't be surprised if Shining is town despite the EOD vote. His reads might have been wrong, but the way he played it made me think he could be town. What does this mean? What did you get from it? | ||
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On January 20 2015 01:49 Damdred wrote: I noticed that you said dps reasoning's were weak. What do you make of that? quid pro quo you also said his reasoning was weak after I did. What's your take? | ||
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On January 20 2015 02:39 Damdred wrote: Yea I don't see how LM is really re-evaluating reads or votes from that, he got caught in a mistake/lie/not reading and had to back peddle from it. Nothing really towny about that. His other posts were really disjoined and really weren't flowing with the game in most spots so not sure why they were so good? Lol, no offense, but that's pretty obvious. What do you take from that regarding DP? | ||
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On January 20 2015 02:49 Damdred wrote: No clue DP is a better player than that though I don't know him. Eh, could just be bad play, but with a tfel/lm scum team he's a very likely third in my eyes. Just have to see how it plays out. | ||
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On January 20 2015 06:48 DarthPunk wrote: Don't lynch: Geript, GB, dam dried, in counterclaimed blues. Everyone else is on the table. Also fuck phone posting and auto correct. -snorts- seriously? you can't narrow it down more than the obvious ones? after going through everyone's filters? this is pretty disappointing. Okay, well... Trfel, LM for the reasons I described earlier...then look into DP/Breshke unless it turns out JJB false-claimed, in which case: Trfel, JJB...then look into Geript/LM/Breshke At least, that's what I would do. Everyone else I'm more or less townreading, and geript should be townread unless one of those wagons were scum. Then he's on the table again. | ||
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I will be good and not gloat...but know that I want to, especially regarding the doubters I was fighting with all Day 1 ##vote: Trfel | ||
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On January 20 2015 07:54 LightningStrike wrote: Also rsoultin remember when your BS Meter going off on Tfrel? Well now you know the reason lynch him with me since I'm the Town Cop! Now I understand why you were so determined to get Damdred to tell you if he was a doc or not xP | ||
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On January 20 2015 08:53 Breshke wrote: So GB flipping town makes damdred fairly townie for what was going on with the wagons between the two. Also rsoultin is also fairly townie for how hard she was going against trfel especially at times when she seemed to be the only one doing it. For me that leaves two mafia within the following players given no cc's occur and trfel actually flips mafia 5) DarthPunk (filter) 6) The Shining (filter) 8) LoneMeow (filter) 10) geript (filter) So for auto i only need one more town read and that would probably be geript for a couple reasons the biggest one being that I don't really see the scum motivation to lead the wagon off of GB (a town) onto warwaffle (another town). So for next day phase i want to lynch one of the three remaining players and if i was to choose it would probably be LM. I realize i could easily be wrong on any of my town reads as some of it is fairly weak reasoning so that makes this type of analysis maybe not the best but for now it is the world im living in. We have a ton of time. I will say that I would not be so quick to townread geript, though. I was questioning about his shifty trfel read at EoD, which he refused to answer. There is also a paranoid part of me that thinks it is very, very interesting that as soon as I produced my trfel case, he broke with his 10 post rule...I have to wonder if he wasn't trying to bury it with all the chatter. Also, look at his reaction to the nk and the cop claim. Does that look like someone who is excited that we probably found scum today? I think it's ridiculous that he went out of his way to post about why wasn't he the night kill. Why would he be? He led a mislynch on WW and had no post-lynch analysis...no night thread presence at all... Which suggests to me his reason for bringing it up was to get ahead of others questioning why he isn't dead. Kinda silly, cause I at least wouldn't have questioned it at all. | ||
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Long and short of it is I don't think we should rule anyone out just yet. | ||
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On January 20 2015 09:32 geript wrote: They didn't kill me. They didn't kill DP. They didn't kill JJB. DP just shoots me here. I'm calling him town and he knows I'd catch him. JJB's the oddball, but RB him and shooting a good player is strategy that wins. Like your team just pulled the same shit tier move in imperial... Twice. Like If you can't see the bus play from rsoultin then you're either mafia or you're bad. Maybe I'm just irritable. But why the fuck as town would rsoultin ask me about my Trfel read 4 times or some shit like that when I fucking explained it in my goddamn fourth post. Then she asks the same shit 3-4 times which I tucking explain each time and she mystically "doesn't get it and finds it scummy." She can't possibly be that fucking dense. Plus the JJB read is really awkward. Okay, geript. I will find the posts in your filter and highlight them since for some reason you're not getting what I am asking you. I've seen you shit the bed as town in Imperial, so I can believe that this attitude could come from you either way, but I find it hard to believe you still don't understand my question. You can't possibly be that fucking dense ^^ | ||
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On January 18 2015 11:57 geript wrote: Town: Rsoultin LightningStrike Don't Lynch for now: Darth Punk Damdred TheWarWaffle Trfel Null: Breshke LoneMeow CoolTLname TheShining Good Lynches: Jarjarbinks Trfel GlowingBear On January 19 2015 04:19 geript wrote: ##vote glowingbear The PoE hasn't really changed. LM, GB, JJB, Trfel and Shining are all decent lynches imo. If expect to see someone add good reasons if the want to lynch WW, Breshke or Trfel. [...] ^I'm not asking you why you don't want to lynch Trfel. I'm asking you why he keeps making both your good lynches and do not lynch lists. Do you understand me now? | ||
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On January 20 2015 09:56 geript wrote: I did not shit the bed in imperial. Not even close. Matter of opinion, but the point is I think if you'd been less combative you probably would have been fine and not mislynched. Regardless, take it as the concession it is. I'm saying your attitude is not alignment-indicative and shouldn't be held against you. | ||
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On January 20 2015 10:07 geript wrote: And I explained that. Read the fourth post. Read my answers to your question. I found good reasons to think Trfel might be mafia. Thus he's a good lynch. I also found good reasons why I thought he was town. Thus why I don't want to lynch him. It's not fucking rocket science. Okay, let's try this again. Why is he the only one you can't decide where to put him? What makes him special? Are you saying that all your other good lynches never did anything that you thought might be town? | ||
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Please also explain why you decided not to stick to the 10 posts a day phase thing, Geript, if you care to answer me. Thank you. | ||
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Okay. Then it's still a bit confusing to me how Trfel earned his own special do not lynch this scum spot, but regardless of your alignment I am not going to get a different answer from you. Thanks for bearing with me. You really get pretty steamed about being questioned. It's not personal, I hope you know. | ||
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On January 20 2015 10:31 geript wrote: I needed to actually talk to DP and find a good lynch. Posting is rather addictive. If trfel flips scum which...highly likely he will...your timing was unfortunate. Your 7th post was soon after my case. That is when you started posting back and forth with DP and didn't mention the case until he brought it up. To someone like me...that is suspicious when Trfel is scum. I understand that you will say that was not the reason regardless, but I'm just calling it like I see it. Who do you think is scum now? | ||
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On January 20 2015 10:32 geript wrote: No. I don't give a fuck about being questioned. I give a fuck about being questioned for for absolutely stupid shit when any person should be able to easily read me as town. Consider it a compliment to your ability to play this game. I think you're capable of townie posts as scum. ^^ | ||
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On January 20 2015 10:45 geript wrote: I dearly miss promethelax. People literally have no fucking clue how to read me when I'm literally the easiest get to read ever. To be fair, while I can't rule you out completely because you've done some questionable things (in my mind) I do think it highly unlikely that you'd derail a town train onto another town. As long as JJB is town, which I still believe he is, you're not on my immediate lynch list. More like a...if no one else I think is scum flips scum I have to look at you again, sorta deal. | ||
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On January 20 2015 10:53 DarthPunk wrote: I also think Rsoultin could easily be scum and bussed Trifel from the start. Like without meta involved Trefels opening was objectively townie. Then rsoultin comes up with some difficult to confirm reasoning on why he is scum and now is trying to mislynch the two best townies in the game off it. It is so transparent. Or...you can realize that I've played with Trfel more than almost anyone here, and it was his responses to my questions + his lack of any useful content that prompted the scumread. His opening was unusual for him but fine. It was his reaction to my pressure that made me suspicious. This two towniest town thing is getting old -_- I think you have come across as town for the most part, DP, but you and geript are probably the only ones with no doubt at all about your "towniness", even if you are both town. Sorry to break it to you. | ||
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I find an insta-pressure vote right off the block null rather than townie. I think I've already mentioned that. It is a low-risk way to get townread if you're scum. Which unless LS is lying (which I can't find a good scum reason to false claim the beginning of the day phase with a red check before lylo) seems to be exactly what happened. | ||
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On January 20 2015 11:21 LightningStrike wrote: I'm back guys and honestly let's kill our confirmed scum today and try to figure out by association who is scum. Also DP me and rsoultin been playing with Tfrel since he started TL Mafia so ofc me and her had a weird reaction to his Opening and now it makes complete sense of why he opened the way he did. I'd be surprised if there were a counterwagon, honestly, unless people are just convinced you're lying LS. So where are you at in your reads right now? | ||
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On January 20 2015 11:49 The Shining wrote: This post is going to be a little rushed but I'll be able to expand on it once I'm done packing. It's one of my only days off today and I move at the end of the month. LS Cop claim seems pretty honest. I don't see scum coming out with a blue claim at the very beginning of D2 with a red check. ##Vote:Trfel Damdred's case on LM - it's not 100% convincing but more than enough to make me look into LM, which is something I've been meaning to do. I do see the seeming disinterest in the game which is not something I expect from Town, who should be actively trying to figure out this game. I also didn't like the switch from JJB to WW. I'm not going to quote what was already quoted but LM's posts are bare, don't really contribute to conversation and don't seem consistent. I know reads evolve as the game progresses but without any explanation, I'm not sure how you get away with a one-liner to lynch WW with misinformation, since WW voted GB before Trfel did. It looks bad that that is his last post in his filter. AFK a vote on Town at EoD and not be heard from since seems scummy. I originally had Geript as a strong, even unlynchable townread. I'm going to rescind that for the last minute pull back from GB to WW. I need a little more time to see if Geript's post about RSo holds any weight but like I mentioned I'm a little swamped today. He isn't backing down from RSo(whose questioning I'm convinced can come from either scum or town since I know her) and although it isn't alignment indicative, it gives us more to analyze. I would think scum would eventually backtrack in fear of getting caught saying something that could be used against them. Also, no one has really looked at the interactions between Geript and RSo besides DP from what I've read, which makes me think there is a small chance they are both actually Town. Scum sit back, let them pressure eachother, and once it's gone deep enough, pressure one or the other into a mislynch. You claimed you can read me as scum, Shining, after my first two scum games.That said, you're right, I can still be active as scum. Probably not this active, but town would be remiss not to at least consider the possibility. I'll be interested in your reads once you've had more time to go through everything. | ||
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On January 20 2015 11:49 LightningStrike wrote: Town: Damdred: Pretty much been confirmed at EoD of Day 1 with his actions and also had some good questioning at Day 1. rsoultin: Good questioning and actively trying to figure out who is scum and been pushing her reads. Geript: Really good analyse at Day 1 and went over his 10 post limit per day to try and find scum and also had some good questions towards a couple of players. JarJarBinks: UnCCed Tracker (claimed it when he was possibly being lynched) and also claimed to be roleblocked. The Shining: Looked really townie EoD with his questioning although he seemed to be inactive during times since he normally works at night but he had good questions and had some concern about my play at Night phase when I asked Damdred if he really claimed Doctor because I had a Tinfoil Hat Theory that if Damdred really claimed Doctor then JarJarBinks would be almost certainly Mafia but he didn't. Null: LoneMeow: Doesn't really have much in his filter but the last time I was unimpressed with his play was at Carol when he was the only Mason in the entire game but who knows this game. DarthPunk: Seems very defensive towards the questions from rsoultin and me when me and rsoultin told him how Tfrel opening wasn't his normal type of opening. Breshke: Really inactive but claimed it's because in real life stuff and hope he becomes more active. His content is pretty Ok but not worth lynching today due to finding confirmed Mafia Mafia: Tfrel: Had a really weird opening from his own standards and had a bunch of weird posts that he normally doesn't make when he's town and I checked him with my Cop powers and got him back as confirmed Mafia. Hmm, so we've got a little under 72 hours go scumhunting for the other two, then. I think I need to take a closer look at Breshke and DP...LM's filter I've been through a few times lately. | ||
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On January 20 2015 12:11 Breshke wrote: Yep, fairly weak PoE as well since id actually had DP as a townread D1. I generally like to talk things out during the night phase. You were a good person to bounce ideas off of the last time I played with you. It crossed my mind that you could be blue...but since that doesn't seem to be the case...why lay low the whole night? | ||
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On January 20 2015 12:11 geript wrote: 99.5% I absolutely could be wrong about him. I'm just not seeing it. There's too many things that don't really add up for him to be mafia. The NK. Like it looks really bad for him if both LM and Trfel are mafia; I get that. His GB case was meh and I was surprised that he didn't feel about GB how I felt about him at the time. I'd consider lynching him this game only if LM and Trfel are mafia. But I'm pretty sure I'd still want to lynch other people first. Like I see absolutely no reason for him to kill GB there. Like it's a really terrible kill. Plus, he's not in any way afraid to bus as mafia. He did it to Todd or one of the low hanging fruit in the VS game. He and Palmer both bussed the fuck out of Vivax or some other people in MS paint. Like if people are catching a bunch of flack, not pulling their weight, etc. he'll just bus them for cred. He's also more of an egotistical asshole when he's mafia. He's actually been quite tame this game. Like really tame. He also would be significantly blindly follow me on WW than just bus a shitty partner. He'd just lynch GB. He'd find it too fun. You know him better than I (or probably anyone) does... Do you think that my more or less solo push on trfel would have been enough to prompt a buss? Or the pressure on LM? In the Carol game, HF was the mafia RBr, and because of that the scum team put their necks out for him more than they probably otherwise would have. Do you think that would be a factor with DP? Or does he just not care? These are honest questions, not a trap, I promise lol | ||
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On January 20 2015 12:24 Breshke wrote: I had originally planned to be around after EoD because thats when i knew people would be around but i got called into work so that couldn't happen and when i got back there didnt seem to be anyone around and i was tired as shit so i went to bed. But i've had too many irl excuses this game so i don't expect you to accept that. Also i think i know where you are going with this and i don't think it is a good direction. I'm not sure but are you trying to say scum is less likely to be active during the night because they are busy in their QT? If so i don't think that is the case. Nah, I don't think it's generally alignment indicative. Some players talk and some don't. I just remember having discussions with you on my first game here, that's all, so I know you're not one of the players who avoids posting in the night phase, at least not exclusively. | ||
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On January 20 2015 12:23 LightningStrike wrote: rsoultin can you go back into my filter and read his filter from those two games he played as Mafia and see if you can compare the games to this one here. Metal Mini: He was Shot Night 1 by a Vig. New Years Eve Party Mafia: He was Shot Night 2 by a Vig (Me!) I <3 you, LS, but I really don't trust myself with games I haven't played in. Is Breshke's scum behavior from those games lining up with this one in anything other than general inactivity? Town players can be inactive, too, is my reservation there. | ||
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On January 20 2015 12:29 Breshke wrote: Also RSo you said youve been through LM's filter a few times, have you got anything from it? Not a lot. Just that his EoD votes followed thread sentiment for weak reasons. He did say he'd help me find scum, that he'd look through GB's and Damdred's filter, but he didn't. :/ <- I don't consider that alignment indicative lol it just made me :/ His reads were not very substantial, either, but I've only seen him play once before so I don't know if that means anything. | ||
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On January 20 2015 12:33 geript wrote: Like I said before, your case wasn't very good imo. So no. Then...why are you sure he's town again, if you don't think there was enough pressure on trfel to merit a buss? Just the NK? You honestly feel he'd kill you 100% of the time? | ||
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On January 20 2015 12:32 Breshke wrote: Yeah GB taught me it is good to go hard during the night. The problem being i like to do votecount analysis and the D1 votecount is fairly useless because everyone who was around was switching to WW. Even the votecounts before that don't seem to be that useful because it is very likely it was all town wagons D1. That I can definitely understand. My first reaction to the lynch was this is a royal mess...but it does narrow down potential scum a bit, so in that sense it could have been worse lol. Thanks for answering. | ||
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On January 18 2015 13:18 Breshke wrote: Damdred i had a look at jarjars filter and am probably agreeing with you. This read is almost baseless. Amid all the fluff the two reasons for the town read are that he generated discussion and meta. As to the generated discussion part i would say many players have done this. The first two that come to mind are Trfel and GB with both of their openings. However in the spoiler below you can see that Jarjar doesn't think that them making waves with their opening is alignment indicative but thinks the fact that LS has generated discussion is townie. The thought process here doesn't seem to line up. + Show Spoiler + On January 17 2015 18:48 jarjarbinks wrote: I bolded the part (I hope lol) of this quote that I thought summed up my thoughts on Trfel and GlowingBear. Trfel's vote and GlowingBears equally "interesting" opening is probably due to the strategy GlowingBear helped give Trfel. GlowingBear's explanation of Trfel's Vote makes this WIFOM in my eyes. They both started the way they did to make waves and nothing more. Not alignment indicative in my eyes. That being said, I'm more suspicious of GlowingBear over Trfel because of his playing experience. A counterargument to this for Trfel is his "stubbornness" on the bottom of page 8. Strange play if you were just trying to "make waves". He could just feel a necessity to defend himself, but I felt the arguments against his vote were relatively weak at the time. Saying what I said above about GlowingBear, I feel like he might want to try doing something else besides claiming VT at the beginning if that was the "making waves" play that shows balls. Us newbs killed LS for just that last game and we (mostly me) are slow learners. Also secondly on his meta point he has played one game as town and has never seen him as mafia so that isn't really justified either. Hence i think his LS read is fairly scummy So this post here, Breshke. I remember this catching my attention but then I forgot. The meta read obviously doesn't hold that much weight, though I'd think you'd have a read on LS cause you've played with him more. My question is...do you put LS' play early game in the same category as GB's and Trfel's? This almost seems like a problem with semantics, from my pov. | ||
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On January 20 2015 12:57 Breshke wrote: How did the lynch narrow down scum for you? Or do you jsut mean because WW flipped town? My townreads were pretty limited prior. I've since solidified my read on GB (meh, means nothing now) and have Damdred as a townread along with geript so long as I'm right about JJB. I'm too paranoid to be overly liberal with townreads, heh. | ||
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On January 20 2015 12:55 Breshke wrote: He seemed to jump on the JJR wagon with a weak reason for why he was going back on his earlier read. I want to say that when he jumped on thread sentiment was that GB was going to be lynched so this could have been a safe vote for him. Also in a town v town i think it would be best for scum to keep the votes as close as possible as to always keep the person who doesn't get lynched a question mark but im not sure if that actually makes sense. These two posts also stuck out to me as trying to keep trfel off the table for today even though he was null on him but i think i could just be trying to find things to make him scummy as these could easily be made as town Eh...the 2nd quote I think was a valid question...since WW had said (if I recall correctly) that GB was his top scumread. The 3rd in all honesty was because I'd said I was laying off trfel. I don't think either of those quotes were really alignment indicative. The JJB vote though specifically got Damdred's attention, and mine when I went to look for context but there really wasn't any that I could see to make him suddenly change his mind. | ||
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On January 20 2015 13:03 geript wrote: Because he's playing like he does when he's town. And he's really easy to read early on. Like I get what he's saying. :/ Lol, okay. He is because he is. Alright, well, I'll take a look through his filter tomorrow after work. Most of what I remember seemed townie enough; it's mostly just his association with trfel that makes me suspicious. I don't see him as a Day 3 lynch unless something drastic happens anyway. | ||
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On January 20 2015 13:07 Breshke wrote: Um im not exactly sure what you mean but i think the answer is no. GB and trefel both purposely set out to create discussion with opening posts that people would find weird and what not. Whereas LS created discussion by just being LS. The point was both sides were still creating discussion but he seemed to only be townreading LS for it. LS was also his only town read at the time and he seemed fairly certain and i couldnt understand why because as i found both his reasons lacking. I wouldn't say i have a meta read on LS i havn't played nearly enough games with him or anyone to have any meta reads. I agree that LS can easily be misread as scum when he is town but I also think that works a lot for him when he is mafia because people who have played with him before seem more inclined to town read him like I even found myself doing it this game. You may be right. I thought he was pretty obvious scum in his scum game, personally...spent all day arguing it lol. But you may be right. I know that I get the feeling sometimes in these games with vets that newbies get picked on, because a lot of them have trouble appearing town. Like, I expect mafia to capitalize on that. (I realize I'm a newbie, too, but reads are my problem way more than getting townread, generally.) All I'm saying is that generating discussion by posting something what is the word? Contradictory is wrong. Controversial. Posting something controversial vice pressuring and asking questions seem different enough to me to not require someone to read them the same way. That's why this post got my attention. Do you disagree? | ||
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On January 20 2015 13:34 Breshke wrote: No you are right they are different. What LS was doing was actually pushing the game forward to scumhunt. So yeah you are right about me just arguing semantics I guess i just never really thought of it out of the context of creating discussion vs creating discussion. Here is where i say i still don't understand how he was reading LS as his one and only town because i still think his reasons were weak because I think LS could easily ask questions as scum. That being said the read as right and LS is town the same as Jarjar so it could easily be me who has to think about stuff differently You may want to reread? He said LS was towniest of town, at least in the posts you quoted. At any rate, I find tfel's hard defense of JJB at EoD and my brother only really coming into the thread to say he was roleblocked, then breezing out again, more eeeeeh than I do him concentrating on trying to read players he's played with before. But that's just me. Is it strange that I was more confident he was town before he claimed? lol Un-CCd though so not worth thinking too much on. Hopefully he'll come back. Thanks for clarifying. | ||
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On January 20 2015 13:50 Damdred wrote: A hard defense of someone when its coming from mafia is easy. They have perfect information to pull upon, they get cred at the flip and boom good job them. JarJar is acting like bad confirmed town here but hes more than likely town. Actually at this point someone should of CC'd him by now to give us two mafia on the block. I think you're most likely right, Damdred, I really do, lol. And probably when he reenters the thread and I see my brother all in his posts, the suspicion will disappear. Your tinfoil hat theory last night awakened my paranoia xP It also stands to reason that JJB's slip early in the game made it clear to mafia he was blue, so protecting him in particular would be good towncred. This is just speculation, though. I'm not advocating doing analysis from a fake claim perspective in the slightest >< | ||
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On January 20 2015 14:02 geript wrote: Damdred (2): rsoultin, LightningStrike jarjarbinks (4): Breshke, Damdred, GlowingBear, LoneMeow GlowingBear (6): geript, TheWarWaffle, DarthPunk, jarjarbinks, The Shining, Trfel Let's assume this is true for a second. We can color JJB blue I guess since no one else has claimed. Technically, Trfel and LoneMeow could both claim here I think since they haven't posted but meh. If LM is blue, he might not come off JJB so quickly. I think definitely as cop he's significantly less likely to come off, but whatever. Voting wise, Rsoultin makes sense. IDK if she'd be willing to bus that early. Hard to tell. Breshke I thought was town yesterday, not sure I see a real reason to change that. Damdred could be mafia; it makes sense with the GB kill. 2 mafia on the short stack seems ok enough. Shining I forget my read on him yesterday. The argument vs JJB seemed odd (knowing the setup). I think that makes more sense, but usually mafia don't vote back to back. IDK. Seems like DP is the obvious scum if both of them are. That's just really hard to accept. Can you explain more on Damdred? How does that play out in your head? I'm asking because he didn't go with the GB wagon to save himself, which struck me as town, but if there's a scenario where he could be safe doing that, I'm considering him pretty much confirmed town when I shouldn't. | ||
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On January 19 2015 06:26 Half the Sky wrote: Day 1: This Final Hour Damdred (3): GlowingBear, rsoultin, LightningStrike jarjarbinks (2): Breshke, Damdred LoneMeow (2): Trfel, jarjarbinks GlowingBear (3): geript, TheWarWaffle, DarthPunk Not Voting (2): The Shining, LoneMeow Currently, Damdred is set to be lynched. Day 1 ends in at 22:00 GMT (+00:00). Reminder to make sure to unvote before voting, if you have already voted someone. Remember, voting is Mandatory. You may NOT abstain. Mmm. Well, see, this was where we were at before GB jumped on JJB, too. I mean...I wouldn't say it was entirely outside the realm of possibility for Damdred to be lynched? I know that this wasn't as close to EoD, though. | ||
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On January 20 2015 14:28 jarjarbinks wrote: You do have a point, although they could have seen GB as a possible bigger threat if he had some reads right. You are right that it is a little WIFOM, but I felt it was worth mentioning. My sister had a nice argument against one of the mafia last game (Celestial from the latest newbie mini mafia) and we all didn't even notice it. Turned out she was killed for it on N2. UnCCd blue, JarJar, was why Celestial wasn't lynched Day 3. And in the scum QT they were trying to mislynch me the whole time anyway lol, realized they couldn't and NKd me instead, risking a doc save. It was never about my reads, just my thread presence. Also have to say geript and DP want me to be/read me as scum anyway lol. They think I bussed Trfel cause they couldn't understand my case. Not that I blame them; I've been up in their grill (apparently I'm a super bold, bussing, strong player annoying first-time TL scumlet ) and it's hard to explain that Trfel's play didn't match his personality. | ||
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Where are you standing? I know this is preemptive, but if I were scum and Trfel had a red check, I wouldn't fight this lynch. Personally. So I'm not expecting much new knowledge to come from Day 2. Your paragraph was pretty convoluted and I'm not sure I fully understand it. | ||
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On January 20 2015 14:44 jarjarbinks wrote: I'll rank them. 1. LM- The lurky mafia of the group. Was scumming me after I felt mafia knew I was blue. A lot of people had talked about them. I voted for LM before forced to leave and I'll stick to it for now. The Trfel vote on LM worries me, but I could see him doing that to throw people like me off. 2. Breshke- GB was suspicious of you, I'm suspicious of you. You were on me after I felt mafia knew I was tracker. 3. Geript- I could see Geript pulling off killing Waffle as mafia and thinking he could get away with it. Plus GB didn't like him. 4. DP- This is more based on what other people have said about DP being the #3 if LM and Trfel are Scum. Who did you track? I know you got RBd, but who were you going to track? ^That mirrors my PoE, too, though I don't see why geript would move a train off a town onto another town. Can you explain why you think he could still be scum? To me that seems too risky unless he's super confident he'll get townread for it even though he was saying he didn't like WW as the lynch earlier. | ||
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On January 20 2015 14:45 rsoultin wrote: Hrum...so, all things remaining equal and assuming the dead townie N2 is universally townread already...likely... Where are you standing? I know this is preemptive, but if I were scum and Trfel had a red check, I wouldn't fight this lynch. Personally. So I'm not expecting much new knowledge to come from Day 2. Your paragraph was pretty convoluted and I'm not sure I fully understand it. EBWOP: This was @geript Sorry, JarJar. Yes, convoluted means confusing. I couldn't follow his train of thought well. | ||
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On January 20 2015 14:51 geript wrote: On the face LM looks the worst to me, but I need to actually read and think. Like, supportive shit from Trfel's filter assuming mafia is nice, but we should easily be able to find arguments that stand on their own. Yeah, a reread is in order. I'm seeing LM at the top of everyone's lynch list, though I guess we haven't all posted yet. Still, makes me wonder if maybe I'm missing something again. Nite geript. | ||
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On January 20 2015 15:27 jarjarbinks wrote: Ugh sorry sis. Laptop issues xD keyboard need to come in soon xD I tracked Breske, first thought about LM but seeing how the thread was going I figured Breshke would be a better choice. I was looking for the suspicious quiet types. Only reasons I could see why Geript would make the vote go to Waffle: 1. Waffle was getting towned by most despite limited posts. Could be a hard sell to lynch (although I guess not due to geripts influence) 2. Bragging rights. Got us all to vote him based on "not the best" logic. 3. He started the GB train. GB was on to him. Could look bad. I feel like this isn't the vet play though. 4. Shifts the lynch on to me without voting for me. Causes me to either die or claim blue. If he was mafia he would probably know I was blue by that point. I'd have to admit I didn't do the best job of hiding it. If I was cop, they might have tried to kill me N1 instead of someone else. They would know for sure if I claimed. 5. He looks a little bad, but do you notice how many people think he's still town? He probably wouldn't see it as that much of a risk. Obviously these are all hypotheticals. I don't know if he is town or mafia. But its not like he had 0 reasons to switch right? ...This one. The others don't make sense...but 4 is worth investigating. I think they could RB you regardless, cop or tracker, but this one... I have to remember this when I'm going back through the votes. GB, right, was the train? You were the other. He tried to get people off of GB onto WW. It's untraceable to him if he doesn't get enough people to actually lynch WW and therefore lynches you by default, and he probably wouldn't have gotten enough if you didn't claim. And he didn't want to lynch WW before, on top of that. It verifies you as blue if they're suspecting that you are, or gets you lynched. Damn, bro. There is a possible scum motive for that wagon switch after all. ...okay. Gonna have to think on this one ><. The town to town switch was my main reason for townreading him with some of the other things he's done. Tomorrow I'll look at it more in depth to see if it actually jives with the EoD voting. | ||
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On January 21 2015 08:18 jarjarbinks wrote: @Rsoultin I looked at the votes. Definitely doesn't conclusively show that Geript switched to screw me. Right before he switched I had 4 and GB had 6. His switch made it GB-5 me-4. LS switched to me about 10 seconds later. THEN others followed. I mean it is possible that he did switch to screw me, but he would have had to figure people would get off the GB train if he switched and/or saw that the GB train was losing traction. Damdred was hard bussing me. It is possible he saw it coming, but he was definitely not the only factor in putting me on the chopblock. And thanks again for defending me at EOD! You get some more bro brownie points lolz I still haven't had a chance to look closely. Just got home from work. But I will say that it is a bit of an out there sort of play unless scum was all nicely settled on GB. It's a cool theory though lol. I kinda like the outlandish ones just to have a different viewpoint to approach things from. I'll still look but it seems like there would be too many unknowns to pull it off effectively. Geript is questioning you about bussing because bussing means mafia pushing or voting their own mafia teammate. Assuming you're town, it's okay lol. I did it my first game, too, calling it bussing when it was just a push. | ||
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On January 21 2015 08:53 geript wrote: I will say that Damdred's filter looks exceptionally worse in skimming it. Shining is town; then mafia then town then mafia. LS is in the same boat. Las is mafia for trying to get a meta read on Damdred. Then it's the reason he's obviously town. I really don't get it. The LS thing bugged me cause Damdred has played with LS. The trfel thing bugged me cause Damdred has played with trfel. These two players he should know well enough to have an idea of what is normal and what isn't, probably moreso than I do. The GB thing bugged me because GB was townread, townread, townread then considered as a possible lynch. There's another thing bugging me, too. WIFOM, so don't jump down my throat for it, but considering who was townread for the EoD antics, you and Damdred benefitted the most from a flipped GB confirmed town. When you take into account that (assuming no false claims, which I am at this point) and if you take it on faith I'm town (something considerably more easy for me to do than the rest of y'all xP) Damdred literally had no scum on his wagon at all. If scum, that would make it perfectly safe for him not to hammer GB to save himself and get townread in the process. Trfel was still on LM...and possibly he third scum could have been waiting in the wings...LM or Shining. I know no one has flipped yet, but I don't think it's accurate to say Damdred is confirmed town after all. | ||
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On January 21 2015 09:25 geript wrote: You really have to take the wifom out. GB flipping town doesn't give credibility to anyone. It doesn't really lessen credibility either. It's a NK. Like we're the people pushing him pushing him for good reasons? Does GB have any valuable reads we've missed out on now knowing he's town. That's what matters. Regarding the Damdred wagon, that's a quite interesting point. Just like mafia tend to not lynch claimed blues or in the least tend to move off their wagon. Mafia tend to not help lynch vets. So if Damdred is town it makes sense for him. Like if you assume for a second that DP and I am town. That same vote count makes GB look awfully scummy. I need to reread you both, but I think my first instinct on you was right, and you're probably town based on EoD. Paranoia is normal for me -_- that and an argumentative soul lol. So you're saying that mafia wouldn't be on Damdred if he is town? If DP and you are town...how does that make GB look scummy? o.0 I think I'm missing your point, lol. I thought the only "vets" in this game were you and DP. Everyone's a vet compared to me but y'all have a different line. | ||
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On January 21 2015 09:41 Damdred wrote: This is dumb the bolded especially. LS asked for a meta on me early in the game which caused me to doubt him and put him in mafia pile as evidenced in my filter if you looked. I put him down in the reaction test to see how people reacted and then I said that he was town and haven't moved from that since then. I've played like one decent game with trfel and I town read and then later in the game it became a scum read before they were checked not sure. That's just how me and GB are, gb goes damdred is town, scum, town, town town town. Just how we are when we play. I'm just going to ignore the stupid going on though its ok LS always hyperfocuses on meta. -_- I find it hard to believe you've failed to notice that. Just like I find it hard to believe you missed Trfel's EXTREME play change. It's not stupid. Just as it isn't stupid that you townread GB all through the game, then with apparently no explanation said maybe he could be a good lynch? How does that make sense? It certainly doesn't to me. Where did you first start thinking GB was boring, may I ask? Maybe I just missed that part when I went back into your filter before EoD. | ||
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On January 21 2015 09:53 Trfel wrote: Sorry, I thought that we were supposed to post at least once every phase, not once every 48 hours. I had a bunch of work to do, I finished some of it, I will be be back and post more tonight. Sorry, I didn't realize that I would be so busy. This lynch wagon is completely ridiculous. I can't believe that everyone is voting to lynch me. Just because I am trying to change my play and figure out how the game works? That doesn't make any sense at all. I care enough to try different things and see what works. Evidently this didn't work. You guys are seriously believing the guy who claimed cop? First of all, he started the game completely nonsensical, and somehow got townread, and then changed his behavior completely. Why would town do anything different after they get townread? I can't decide if he is simply a town liar or if he is a mafia trying to get a townie lynched, but I'm inclined to think the latter. If you don't listen to me know, hopefully you will at least lynch him next after I flip. A one to one change with a mafia is a pretty good result for a townie. I'll look into some other scum options, but this wagon on me is really giving a lot away. I'm pretty sure that the mafia team is leading it. Lol xP Gotta give you props for the attempt truffle <3 I will say this, though. If LS is lying, you can rest easy in that you'll be avenged. | ||
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On January 21 2015 09:50 Damdred wrote: LS focusing on meta is good, LS ASKING someone else my meta isn't good. There is a distinct difference between the two. GB was boring before he pushed me, a boring GB is scum. When GB barely does anything hes boring, he didn't really do anything until he pushed me. Hmmm I may be overreading the GB part, a skim didn't show me what I thought I read earlier o.0 which is weird. I could be wrong on that. Anyway, I think since we have this much time I'm gonna go solo on the analysis for a bit cause I get easily distracted in-thread. If anyone has questions for me, I'll be around to answer, though. | ||
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On January 21 2015 10:06 geript wrote: No. My point is that what you're reading me town for makes me nothing. Like if I'm mafia I could be trying to get a blue lynched. Like that's such a god awful reason to read me as town. Like read me town for what I've done in the game that matters. Leading or not leading a vote on town/mafia isn't alignment indicative. Last minute shenannies or no do not make me or anyone else anything. Your analysis was too good as a scum coach who already knew the scum team for me to say definitively that those two posts alone make you town, geript. But I will look closer at you, too. No worries. I'm usually better at identifying town than I am at identifying scum >< usually. | ||
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On January 21 2015 10:14 geript wrote: No. Not really. But it's not bad play. Like if you can get town to waste two days discussion it's quite good play in fact. Doesn't really make sense from LS point in the game but not unreasonable. Hm. Maybe. I'd expect something that bold with scum's back against the wall, though, rather than just sacrificing a scummate out of the blue. Was anyone really in so much danger that a Day 2 lynch would be inevitable? Maybe it's just how I play scum, but I'd rather not lose members unless I have to. Makes it harder to win. | ||
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On January 21 2015 10:22 Breshke wrote: The only problem is if LS is fake and red checked a partner then we lynch trfel. A doc claims D3 and we only have 2 mislynches until we lose so we could theoretically lynch jarjar and the doc incorrectly. But that seems like a very thought out play and im not sure if mafia goes for it. It's possible, I suppose. Ballsy but possible. | ||
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On January 21 2015 13:40 DarthPunk wrote: Even if by some miracle Trfel is town. Then we just lynch LS tomorrow. I think it is correct to lynch trefle no matter what his defense is like. Agreed. I'm not sure what this is from him, anyway. Trfel, if I were you and town I'd get out my case-making mojo, comb the thread and the filters, and give us something awesome to work with if you flip town. LS is a given with a green (or blue) flip. | ||
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On January 21 2015 13:54 Trfel wrote: Why should I bother if you guys are just going to lynch me anyway? I have other things to do, you guys won't listen to my logic. The game is lost, I should give it up. If you guys don't lynch me maybe I will build some cases for you, since you seem to be too lazy to do it yourself. Rsoultin could very well be mafia as well. Well there you go, finally pointing a finger at the player who has been saying this isn't your town game the entire game. Was wondering how long it would take. What logic, exactly? You're saying we should believe you when you say LS is scum...that it's a logical move for town to ignore a claimed cop with a red check just because you say he's lying? | ||
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gg trfel ^^ | ||
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On January 21 2015 22:40 LoneMeow wrote: Breshke is scum. There's a clear avoidance of committing to any reads, and it's quite scummy how he wants to lynch me without considering other options. Out of this list of 4 people, I can understand why he would not consider geript or DarthPunk at the time of this post, but he makes no explanation of why he picked me over The Shining. In fact, nowhere in his filter does he take any kind of stance on The Shining or analyze him. The only reason he gives for wanting to lynch me is where my vote ended up - he does not analyze why it ended up there, nor try to use the rest of my posting to validate his read in the slightest. There's also a certain lack of going anywhere with his posts, he's content to discuss whether LightningStrike might have fake claimed (as if) and ask questions that don't really go anywhere instead of posting his own analysis. Currently he's by far my best lynch after Trfel. This is actually true...he asked Damdred and agreed with Damdred on something townie that Shining had done, but I'm pretty sure that was after this list. Otherwise I'm not seeing anything original about Shining's alignment at all o.0. Interesting point, LM. The next question is if Shining is unique in Breshke's filter, or Breshke just isn't giving analysis on most of the players in this game. Got work, but I'll check back later. | ||
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Nice job, LS. Seriously, though, I'm always happier to see players playing poorly flip scum. Would've been sad to lynch Trfel if he really was town trying to change his play-style. Geript, Alan is lonemeow? <- The newbies will have no clue who you're talking about if you refer to people by name. I'll be in-thread for questions or if anyone has any ideas they want to bounce around. (Can already say that there are at least 4-5 posts of geript's that I'll need clarification on. Not sure why, geript, but sometimes I can't follow your train of thought when you post. Something to do with the writing style.) | ||
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On January 22 2015 07:32 Breshke wrote: So its true that i havn't properly analysed the shining but not from lack of trying. I actually find his filter hard to read and i don't actually know why. I do think his interaction with GB was townie though wanting his question answered as pushing it because it shows to me he wanted information. So i actually have him as a town lean. This leads me to think my PoE was shiter than i thought it was. LM could you explain the bolded to me? I know you said you don't know exactly why his filter/posts are hard to read, but could you try to put it into words for me, Bresh? I ask because for whatever reason he keeps...slipping my notice. If that makes any sense. Usually something stands out to me, and I'll engage with that person, but by and large Shining has not engendered that response. Maybe if you can articulate it I can figure out why that keeps happening lol. | ||
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On January 22 2015 09:54 DarthPunk wrote: God I hate days like yesterday Eh, I was lazy :/ I'll admit. Have you had a chance to go back through the game, bring anything new to the table? | ||
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On January 22 2015 10:05 geript wrote: Yah, they're pretty awful all around. Mind walking me through your thought process EoD Day 1? You said you didn't see GB/JJB/LM as a scum team, then dropped all of them and pursued WW. I'm curious what in particular brought him to mind. You seemed pretty sold on it at the time. | ||
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On January 22 2015 10:35 geript wrote: I've literally covered that. I started not liking a GB lynch so I was looking for who the prefered lynch was. So I read a bunch of filters to see who I thought could be town or not. WW stuck out to me as odd and likely mafia. Half-covered it, to be honest. Who else did you read? Like, it's obvious you got cold feet on GB and you didn't think the remaining were a scum team...just not sure how you got from that to WW specifically. The static reads thing makes sense, but his reads weren't amazing last game, either. The curse of the newbie ^^ Did it have something to do with Trfel's post on WW that had you reading Trfel as possibly town? | ||
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On January 22 2015 10:36 Breshke wrote: ehh, the posts feel kind of robotic too me but thats not alignment indicative. I also think more words are used than are encessary if that makes sense like I believe he could be more to the point as well. I also find that he says a lot of "good" things but nothing really controversial (this is the hardest bit for me to explain.) Like i dont think he has been trying to work out allighments. LM has been one of his top scums and he really hasn't pushed or suspected anyone else except for GB at some point. He even admits he hasn't really looked through LM's filter. I don't know if this is scummy or lazy town though because i did really like his interaction with GB. Hm. Thanks. The nothing really controversial bit makes sense...though I have to take another look to see if I agree with that or not. | ||
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On January 22 2015 11:03 geript wrote: Like my bottom 5 or so, reread GB to be sure, skimmed LM, Shining thought he was kinda town, Breshke to be sure, WW. Maybe 1-2 more. I forget. Felt like I read 6 filters I think. Okay, fair enough. Damdred you weren't liking earlier. Can you tell me where you stand now? | ||
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On January 22 2015 11:15 Damdred wrote: In day one I really didn't care if I got lynched or not, at that point I thought GB was town. And at that point it was either gb or me and GB had been playing better due to putting in work than me obviously. I thought JJB had been playing scummy so tried to get a wagon moved there instead of on gb which happened and he turned out to be blue and we moved the wagon onto your lynch. Afterwards I just went to work to try to figure the game out. Lol, Damdy, you were a bit quick on that one, weren'tcha? I wasn't asking you why geript didn't like you...or what you had to say for yourself xP And...what did you figure out? No offense, but I don't think an LM read is particularly earth-shattering then or now. | ||
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On January 22 2015 11:15 Damdred wrote: In day one I really didn't care if I got lynched or not, at that point I thought GB was town. And at that point it was either gb or me and GB had been playing better due to putting in work than me obviously. I thought JJB had been playing scummy so tried to get a wagon moved there instead of on gb which happened and he turned out to be blue and we moved the wagon onto your lynch. Afterwards I just went to work to try to figure the game out. Okie doke (you're right, sorry, I'm doing three things at once right now)...so...I guess I don't get how you can go from at least partially scumreading him for being "boring" enough to be okay with a Day 1 lynch to saying he's putting in enough more work than you that you'd rather yourself be lynched over him? You were that certain he was town at that point? I do remember you arguing a lot that he was, but it seems like a very sudden shift. | ||
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On January 22 2015 12:42 LightningStrike wrote: Here where he started scum reading Breshke: But if you look at his filter he never really pressured Breshke at all after this vote here until today when he finally posted his vote on to Tfrel as seen here: But he has yet to pressure Breshke at all or asking him anything which seems really scummy. Also his reads today prelynch was very vague though when I said his reads was vague with little reasons as seen in this post: Although he did follow up with his thing on Breshke but never pressured him after that that post. Nice catch, LS. Regardless, he doesn't seem terribly interested in the game, even when he is in-thread. I'm taking a closer look at his voting progression vs. reads progression right now. | ||
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On January 19 2015 06:57 LoneMeow wrote: Wait, TheWarWaffle was actually voting with his previous best scum read Trfel? Yeah I'm ok with lynching him. ##Unvote ##Vote: TheWarWaffle I'm not Breshke. But this is why I think you're scum, if I had to choose one vote in your entire filter. The JJB one was eh, but GB looked pretty townie imo at the time you posted it, so I don't find it terribly alignment indicative, however that reads like complete contrived BS. WW AFKd a vote on GB (again not alignment indicative, and GB was a scumread for him all game) and trfel only switched to GB a good deal later. It's factually untrue and looks to be grasping at straws to justify a vote change. Then you return to finding reasons to scumread bresh. I already pointed out how your first reasons were at best based on a misread and at worst scummy. Couple that with your relative inactivity and questions with little-to-no analysis this game and I think you're the solid Day 3 lynch, with the highest potential of flipping scum. I actually like Breshke's play EoD Day 1. His read on JJB (though probably incorrect) was very easy to follow, and he pushed it in-thread, albeit not as loudly or strongly as our talkative, more forceful vets. His Day 2 play also is pretty decent imo. I don't think he's the lynch. I looked back through Shining's posts. I don't think he's the lynch, either. His voting on GB made sense from a townie perspective; I'm often inclined to scum people who I feel are avoiding my questions, and his follow-up seemed genuine to me. He's got a ton of text which I think is the problem reading him, but forcing myself to read each word, it's all meat and i'm not seeing anything making me go woah wtf like I did with trfel. That leaves Damdred, DP and geript by poe. geript's push on WW reads genuine. there are a couple things in his play I don't understand (I.e. his reaction to the red check and the odd (imo) special treatment on trfel) but i'm going to give him a tentative townread for now because on the whole his play seems townie, especially in the voting at eod DP...your filter is rock solid. I want to townread you for that so bad. the trfel (and possible lm) associative reads seem almost coincidental in the context of the rest of your filter. my concern with dp is i'm not seeing any drive from you really since D2 started and the sheeping vote at the end of day 1. I know you're convinced geript is town so I can see town doing that, but you seem like a strong enough player to have your own opinions. town to me, but I want more from you. hell, build a case against me, that would make me happy ^^ something that doesn't use geript as a crutch damdred...you're still null. you feel off this game. your filter looks fine when I read it but in context you're just not giving me those razzle dazzle town feels I get when you're in the game and on fire. your play feels more reactive than productive. I know you said you're burnt out, and that's a possible explanation, but I need to think more on you. if I had to lynch someone other than lm day 3, the ball would be in your court, because everyone else I've found reasons to think they could be town, but you're just not impressing me sorry for the long post. wanted to get my thoughts out there before day 3. if you guys have questions for me, i'll try to answer them, but i'm off to work so I probably won't have the time to go in-depth/may not see them | ||
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On January 23 2015 08:14 geript wrote: Actually, I'm just going to sheep Breshke. He's obviously reading far more carefully than I am right now. ##vote Lonemeow lol thinking about it? gb and i were both pushing you bby xP now jjb said he would and shining said he was scumming you, gb and lm...have you bothered to evaluate the vote? jjb...knowledge nuggets plsthnx | ||
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On January 23 2015 08:48 jarjarbinks wrote: I remember him getting a lot of towncred for this statement. I still didn't get why. I knew GB was one of the guys who towncredded him. Was the other geript? I don't see how town and mafia could respond differently to this. heh i was thinking on why ppl were ignoring what to me seemed pretty clear but i think it comes down to ppl mistaking active for town. i dont think defending oneself in gen is alignment indicative frankly. thus not being impressed by the ww post from trfel like geript was. | ||
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On January 23 2015 09:14 jarjarbinks wrote: Man Trfel literally did everything to defend me in this game. Like in almost every post he mentioned me. Makes me wonder if/when he knew I was tracker. It would make more sense to hard defend me if I wasn't tracker. Then I would be more likely to die and he could claim "knowledge" or whatever. If he knew, I would think he would have wanted to lynch me. Maybe I wasn't as obvious as I thought? I do post very strange posts often xD lol...jjb...you said there was no doc/cop setup. if you're not scum (which is the assumption without a cc) by default you're the tracker xP and they can kill/rb you whenever they want also not sure why this matters as a discussion point o.0 | ||
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On January 23 2015 09:17 Breshke wrote: @JJB am i correct in assuming you scumread LM? What do you think of the fact that basically no one disagrees with this? Feel free to answer this aswell RSo. Eh, hard to say. It's still early in the day. I will undoubtedly doubt myself and maybe even get cold feet if it still looks like this at EoD, but for now I don't think it's particularly concerning. | ||
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On January 23 2015 09:34 geript wrote: Shining has posted less than I remember from the Newbie game. ~1.5 pages when she had about 2-3 I think at this point in the newbie. That's interesting. Do you have any other reasons to think he's scum, geript, apart from filter length? Assuming that was where the interesting comment was leading. (If it's something I can address that's pissing you off, please let me know. I'm actually not here to take the fun out of things. :/) | ||
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On January 23 2015 09:55 geript wrote: Nothing in particular sprung out at me right now after reading his filter twice. Maybe GB's point about Shining having all the reasons to townread Trfel is echoing again. I can kinda see that point right now if you look at only specific points in the read. Defenitely feels like he's posting differently, but still early in his mafia career afaik so meta really isn't a applicable. I'd probably have him as null if not for the push on GB at EoD. It just seemed really genuine to me. As well as the frustration afterwards with both Damdred and GB. Otherwise his reads seemed well-articulated/solid but kind of forgettable. Which was the null part. | ||
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On January 23 2015 08:54 jarjarbinks wrote: This is about Trfel voting Geript at the beginning. Do you guys think that Trfel would try to bus BOTH of his mafia bro's? I would definitely hope not. Especially right out of the gate. I could see him bussing one and maybe joining a lynchtrain on the other, but trying to kill off both your buddies seems messed up to me. If geript turns mafia, PLEASE don't let me be mafia with Trfel lol But anyways, what are your thoughts on this rsoultin? Think that possibly gives any towncred to geript if LM does turn scum? Definitely an if statement lol Wouldn't call the geript vote a buss if he never intended to actually push it. Now he could have been bussing LM and trying to implicate you by being so pro-JJB lol. LM's vote on WW was contrived. He completely made that reason up as an excuse. It's not a townie thing to do, moreso than pretty much anything else that has been discussed in the thread. I'm not worried too much with what trfel said, especially on Day 2. He knew he was almost 100% going to be lynched so none of that is useful, at least, I don't find it so. | ||
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On January 23 2015 14:01 jarjarbinks wrote: Nope lol She could fool me any day of the week though lol Oh, psht. Play a game with me where I'm actually scum and then you can have a say xP I'm just assuming my tone read on you is good until proven otherwise. Where you at on your reads, bro? | ||
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On January 23 2015 14:06 geript wrote: Not really no, Still think DP is town. I miss your analysis posts xP Sheeping bresh on LM almost seemed defeatist of you. Penny for your thoughts? | ||
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On January 23 2015 14:28 DarthPunk wrote: Kinda want to lynch Shining. Small filter and all his posts look carefully constructed. Okay, what makes him more scummy than anyone else? What part of his posting gives you the "formulaic" feeling? | ||
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Really that WW vote alone is almost enough for me. A lot of the other players were being much more productive, pushing reads or at least encouraging people off townreads, during the vote. With nothing townie jumping out at me from LM's dinky filter anyway, I'm fairly confident of this one. ##vote: LoneMeow | ||
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On January 23 2015 15:10 DarthPunk wrote: Have you read his filter. Basically every post of his reads as careful. Also he is posting less. Those are both traits of newer scum players. I have read his filter. Have you read his fit at GB and Damdred? Doesn't seem fake to me. The more relevant question I suppose is what makes Shining more scummy than LM? Or LM more townie than Shining? | ||
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On January 23 2015 15:10 geript wrote: It takes idk 2-3 hours to make those posts. I don't feel like putting 2-3 hours into each specific post like that especially when people seem to not actually read them. If there are good points that are worth sheeping, then you sheep unless you find something better. It's just good play. I can buy this. I think I've seen you say this somewhere before. Imperial, probably. Still, gave me a much better idea of where you were at in the game lol. | ||
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On January 23 2015 15:20 DarthPunk wrote: I said before that I thought LM looked townie for a few of his posts, That hasn't changed just because the thread collectively decided he was scum. Also he seems to be putting in effort. And trying to solve the game. Like I could be wrong. But I just prefer a Shining lynch. The read of yours I called bad? lol Calling him town for changing his vote when it was brought to his attention that his read on Bresh was based on complete misinformation? Anything else making you think he's town? | ||
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On January 23 2015 15:25 Breshke wrote: I don't get the impression that he is trying to solve the game at all he has four nulls and i don't see anywhere that he is trying to work out their alignments. I personally don't consider four posts, two of which are a static scum read and the other two one-liners, a real attempt to solve the game, myself. The Shining comment was worth noting and investigating, but beyond that...most of his filter consists of questions without direction and few if any real reads. | ||
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then turning around in the same post and also townreading him for rescinding his vote when this was brought to his attention... is just objectively a bad read. I'm surprised you're still hanging onto it. That's why I wanted to know if you have anything else convincing you he's town. Cause I definitely can't get behind you on that -_- | ||
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On January 23 2015 15:35 geript wrote: TBH, I kinda don't know where I am on Damdred. That has me questionable a bunch of things. Like I think you and Breshke are town. JJB is town unless there's a retard blue out there. Essentially we have 3 lynches to kill 4 people. So it's just kinda a matter of figuring out which person is most likely to be town of DP, Damdred, Shining, LM. DP's the most likely town imo, next I would guess is Shining. Between LM and Damdred it's a pretty simple lynch. We have to kill LM at some point. I like Breshke's points on him although Damdred was apparently pissed that they were your/damdred's points on N1 and I missed it but eh. I like Bresh and Shining for town. It's my silly BS meter again. I probably haven't explained my BS meter well, but their voting/pushes lined up well with where they were going in-thread before and during the lynch. Bresh in particular picked up his game when most of us were content to lynch the red check. I don't know about Damdred either. I don't think he's oozing town by any means, and poe points to him cause apart from LM I think I have decent reasons to tr everyone else, or at least think it through several times before scumming them. Can I ask you to do something for me? Cause I'm thinking you're town, genuinely. Your tone keeps throwing me off sometimes, but I have that problem with some players. Like, I expected a get the trfel reaction rather than a why am I not dead reaction from that red check. But what I'd like you to do, if you're willing, is to take a step back and just consider this game as if it's possible your read on DP is wrong. He's been sheeping you a ton-a-bunch. You know him better than anyone else in this game. Does he normally follow you around like a lost puppy even when it looks like he does seem to actually have opinions of his own? Is it possible that your townreading him might explain why you haven't been NKd? If you still think he's town after reconsidering it I can respect that. You know him better. The sheeping is really bugging me, though. It's like, the one main reservation I have about him. Cause all the vets scream at me that NKs are WIFOM, lol. | ||
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On January 23 2015 15:53 DarthPunk wrote: How am I sheeping geript a bunch? I switched onto some random and then we lynched a confirmed scum. Now I am wanting to lynch someone he thinks is town. That is like a complete misrepresentation of what is actually happening. Is it? You've made it clear you don't want to lynch LM and would prefer Shining, yes. But what about the rest of the game? The vote switch onto WW? Why not JJB? While most of us seem to be talking out our reads, I get the impression you're trying to consolidate yours with his, particularly Day 1. Your filter seems very townie, it's true. I still think that. I like most of your analysis this game. Even your push on GB. But you really have been buddying up to geript and I think he's in the best position to evaluate whether or not that play is normal from you. | ||
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On January 23 2015 16:03 Breshke wrote: RSo do you disagree with DP's read on the shining? I think it is fairly similar to what we were discussing before when i said his filter is hard to read. I just don't seem to interpret as being as scummy as DP is. I do. I agree Shining is hard to read, however I did make the effort to read it and I'm not interpreting it as careful like he is. The rage against Damdred and GB, then the effort to make reads on geript and myself to determine which one of us is scum (when we're both generally townread and very vocal) do not seem like careful plays to me, even if he did townread us anyway after going back through. More to the point, I do not understand his LM read at all. He's not making an effort to sell it to me. If he really thinks LM is town and going to be mislynched, you'd think he'd try harder, even with us dumb noobs, to get us to see what he's seeing xP | ||
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On January 23 2015 16:03 DarthPunk wrote: I buddy up to people I think are strong players. Read any of my town games with rayn or geript I'll let him make that assessment rather than trying to read a game I was never part of. | ||
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On January 23 2015 16:27 geript wrote: I've said that I could be wrong about DP before. I still don't really see that world existing. Alright. You know him best. | ||
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On January 23 2015 20:54 DarthPunk wrote: I also am paranoid that everyone in the game seems to be on the LM wagon aside from me which means scum has to be on his wagon, and I have no idea why scum would bus straight after losing trifel. I had this problem before with my first game with Bresh, and pushed a scum wagon, but the original train also turned out to be scum. If it was someone other than LM I'd be more concerned, or if the main point against LM was filter size/inactivity, making it a policy lynch... You may be right, but provided he is scum, it would be hella difficult to defend him, I think, and trying might make it really easy to find the third scum. My instinct when wagons are too easy is to find a new train, too, but I honestly see nothing redeeming about LM. I'll need something more concrete on Shining to support a Shining lynch, though. You called his post mostly meh with a sprinkling of town -shrugs- I'm not seeing how that makes him scum? And I'm not seeing the carefulness in his filter you were talking about, or why that couldn't come from town as well. | ||
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On January 24 2015 00:22 geript wrote: Fuck that. We're lynching Damdred today. Like the dude literally can't make his mind up on anyone. If I had a nickle for every time he's waffled his read on me then I'm pretty sure I'd have $2. Seriously Damdred which reads haven't you gone all squiggle legs on? And every time you change your reason for changing views on someone. I don't think I've ever seen someone who's town change their opinions so much in a game. Damdred has literally not read a single filter since his "let's lynch LM" post at the beginning of the day. It's not like he read a filter on D2 either. D1, idk. But with as much flipping his views on everyone he does, I don't think so. The main reason Damdred should've been lynched in Imperial was lack of doing shit he usually does as town. Usually he's pretty active as town, which he's not really been since D2. Usually he has some goddamn shitty opinion that he pushes, here he's not really pushing anything, his goddamn shitty opinion is extra shitty AND he can't even make up his fucking mind on his goddamn shitty opinion. Damdred has played long enough and has been in this game long enough to have a read to hang his hat on. That's not really there. On top of that this fucking sleezeball was willing to die for his townread that claimed VT. Like townies don't ever EVER do that. They know their reads can be wrong. Plus, he wasn't really doing any sort of anything to convince anyone else to vote for anyone on D1. Like the only redeeming point that Damdred has is that he seemingly wants to kill LM. #stopthebullshit #lynchtheperpetuallyundecided #hisbloodforthebloodgod ##unvote ##vote Damdred Is this your real opinion or kneejerk? I don't hate a Damdred lynch, but I'm not nearly as certain he'd flip scum right now. :/ Also...I don't know how scummy going for someone who is townread by the majority is vice one of the easier players to get lynched. Is changing your mind alignment indicative? Also, just as a general statement, in my mind JJB is all but 100% confirmed. Any blue who did not immediately come out with LS' death and railroad JJB needs to die 1000 vigi deaths for major suckage. Especially if they claim doc. LS was the obv nk as a claimed cop with a confirmed red check. I'd actually straight up lynch a CC at this time without a moment's remorse lol. (Damdred, I'm not sure I agree with your geript read, but I'll check into it closer later. I have to go now.) | ||
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On January 24 2015 07:41 geript wrote: I had a random thought. Why didn't they just kill JJB? They know the setup. Why didn't they kill him on N1? Like no one has claimed anything else. If there's not a medic, then every NK goes through. Where you headed with this? | ||
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On January 24 2015 07:49 geript wrote: Idk if anywhere honestly. Just weird that they leave a confirmed town around. I get the argument of who it is and they have to kill him at some point. This far into D3 they can't even CC him. Plus the GB kill as really bad. It almost gets me thinking that all the mafia team is inexperienced with dealing with endgame situations. So maybe it could be LM/Shining or similar. It feels important. I wish I knew why though. -shrugs- JJB is all but confirmed town (only situ he isn't is if we have a really dumb blue hanging around somewhere). NKs are WIFOM. If the intent was to give no information I think that succeeded. Maybe the answer is in a unique read he had at the time? | ||
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On January 24 2015 07:56 geript wrote: But if they had someone ready to CC on D2 then why not claim medic at start of D3? Like it makes no sense. geript, explain to me how it makes sense that JJB is scum this game. that is where this line of questioning ends. | ||
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We know we have a cop. We know that JJB claimed tracker. - If he's scum and there's a real tracker, that tracker should have countered him by now. - If he's scum and there's a real doc, the doc should have countered by now because LS' flip revealed the fake. Unless our blue is friggin retarded this game, JJB is the real tracker. | ||
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On January 24 2015 08:19 Breshke wrote: RSo what scumteam are you most paranoid of? Lol, depends on the minute and who posted last sometimes That's why I'm pushing LM who I'm fairly confident of. This vote should make the first day more clear, and hopefully give us new information to work with. Assuming I'm right on LM, I'm hoping to find the third scum after the vote Day 3. Or at least fully clear 1 or 2 more of my town leans. | ||
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On January 24 2015 08:24 geript wrote: That's not the question. The question is: 1. Mafia know town has cop/tracker 2. Mafia keeps tracker around seemingly planning to CC JJB 3. Don't ever CC JJB Why? It tells me that mafia aren't really familiar with setups like this and are likely less experienced and less involved. Which points more towards 3 newer players. Or has less credibility than JJB. Or it's WIFOM. geript, I'm not lynching people based on this type of setup speculation. It's not good play. It's a good reason to look at the new players I'm townreading and consider that I may be wrong, yes, but it's a starting point not an end-all. LM is my lynch for today. It will take something drastic - or brilliant - to dissuade me from that. I have too many question marks regarding other players. | ||
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On January 24 2015 08:00 jarjarbinks wrote: ##Vote: LM I think they are keeping me around because I am less value to town than the rest of VT's. I am a confirmed town but that's it. I haven't really helped town at all because I suck at this game. If I wasn't tracker I would have been dead day 1. If I was mafia, I would keep the tracker like that too. I'm guessing they are banking on me getting reads wrong and mislynching people to the end. It's pretty humbling, but that's my guess on their strategy. I just think that you have trouble getting read as town, bro. After this game we can definitely talk about that if you want. ^^ Easier lynches tend to be kept around because scum needs town to mislynch. Give me your thoughts? The JarJar brain juices help me think lol. | ||
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On January 24 2015 09:01 jarjarbinks wrote: Actually, someone's post on how killing LS before me made more sense than my argument for keeping me alive. Having a 100% town is pretty helpful, despite my not so good reads sometimes lol I'm uncertain on the damdred vs geript battle going on... if one of those was scum, which one would u choose? meh, if I had to with a gun to my head right now i'd say damdred, but frankly this is exactly why I want to lynch lm...the third mafia is I don't know who | ||
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On January 24 2015 09:52 geript wrote: Meh. Killing lurkers ain't bad. Not sure I want to vote with Damdred though. You should kill who you think is most likely to flip scum. (obvious statement, I know) But, seriously, if all LM is to you is a lurker policy lynch and you're scumreading someone else, you shouldn't be voting LM anyway. This post makes it seem like you don't really think LM is scum? Or at least any more than any other lurker. | ||
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On January 24 2015 10:13 DarthPunk wrote: Why are you having such a strong reaction to geript's analysis here? Like geript has a good point about the night kills. He isn't calling JJB scum, but you seem to be invested in not talking about this. Is this a good point DP? Do you think the night kills eliminates the possibility of veteran mafia players ever being scum? Where is your cut-off for "veteran"? This is a coached game, which makes the newbie scum argument less valid anyway, and a pretty obvious play imo. As I said, it's worth taking another look and reconsidering my reads, but it is not good enough alone to lynch on. I want to get my one pretty sure scumread lynched. It's that simple. If I see someone with a better case that I can verify and makes sense to sheep, sure, but until then I'm going to push that scumread, plain and simple. | ||
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On January 24 2015 08:32 rsoultin wrote: Or has less credibility than JJB. Or it's WIFOM. geript, I'm not lynching people based on this type of setup speculation. It's not good play. It's a good reason to look at the new players I'm townreading and consider that I may be wrong, yes, but it's a starting point not an end-all. LM is my lynch for today. It will take something drastic - or brilliant - to dissuade me from that. I have too many question marks regarding other players. | ||
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On January 24 2015 08:26 rsoultin wrote: Lol, depends on the minute and who posted last sometimes That's why I'm pushing LM who I'm fairly confident of. This vote should make the first day more clear, and hopefully give us new information to work with. Assuming I'm right on LM, I'm hoping to find the third scum after the vote Day 3. Or at least fully clear 1 or 2 more of my town leans. | ||
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On January 24 2015 10:22 DarthPunk wrote: Nobody said anything about not lynching your scumread... Nobody said anything about lynching someone based on geripts analysis. Geript had solid analysis on the night kills, the GB kill makes zero sense and anyone who has played scum before would auto kill JJB imo. I agree with the conclusion that geript made about the scum team probably being noobs. Why are you having such a strong reaction to this? It can't be because you don;t want to lynch based off his analysis because nobody suggested that. Clear now? | ||
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On January 24 2015 10:27 DarthPunk wrote: DID ANYBODY SAY THEY WERE LYNCHING SOMEONE BASED OFF GERIPTS ANALYSIS? Literally, point to me where anybody in this game said that? What the fuck dude. You are starting to make zero fucking sense right now. The better question is what is your problem with me not instantly going OMG you are SO RIGHT to geript? I'm allowed to state my opinion, and that is my opinion: I don't think no CC carries as much weight as he's giving it. Do you think his point is really that good? I don't think you ever answered that. | ||
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On January 24 2015 10:28 DarthPunk wrote: No. Not really. Repeating yourself when I clearly have no fucking Idea what you are talking about in the first place does not clarify anything for me. You asked me why I was having a strong reaction to something. From my perspective I'm not responding strongly to it at all. In fact, the opposite is true. I'm not finding his point compelling. Reacting strongly to it would be more along the lines of saying "geript, you have to be mafia or stupid just bringing this up". I don't think that. I just don't think his point was earth-shattering. Why do you think this is a strong reaction? | ||
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On January 24 2015 10:39 DarthPunk wrote: Cause It seems that way to me? Like if you don't feel that way i'm not going to convince you that you do. ... No, you're really not going to convince me that I'm feeling something I'm not. Good statement. -_- I'm sorry, but this seems like a very pointless conversation. I know that you answered my question, but I guess I'm still trying to follow why 1+1 = 3. You honestly think that a GB NK and no CC on JJB = no veterans could possibly be scum? I mean, it does remove you from suspicion, so I suppose I can see the appeal of the argument to you in that sense, but as I said before this is a coached game. And odd as it may seem to you I don't really see a CC being so outside the realm of thought of new players that they wouldn't consider it. The fact that JJB was RBd and NKd in fact suggests that someone was at least considering CCing him. | ||
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RBd and not NKd. | ||
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Who here would have believed a tracker or doctor claim on Day 3, even moments after the day began? The tracker would have known the moment JJB claimed EoD 1, and the doctor should have protected LS. In fact, an NK on LS in and of itself suggests there's no doctor in the game, because it's an obvious save: the claimed cop whose red check flipped scum. You don't think it would be suicide to CC JJB now? I'd definitely find a CC very unbelievable today. | ||
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On January 24 2015 11:10 DarthPunk wrote: And yet that is what it seemed like you were trying to do. You became very combative when talking about this point from geript. anyway I agree it is a pointless conversation and I have gotten everything I can out of it. While still avoiding the question I asked you. Do you or do you not think that a GB NK and a RB on JJB adds up to no possible vets in the scum team? why? Maybe if I break it up like that it will be harder to overlook. | ||
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Alright then. If that's what you genuinely think. So you don't think anything I said at all made sense? To you there is no situation/possibility whatsoever to explain those two things but a scum team completely made of noobs. Well you're definitely not on my list of the most logical players in this game BTW ^ that is what would be called a strong reaction. Asking you if your opinion remains the same after presenting a different viewpoint is hardly a reason to yell xP | ||
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Lol, this was what I asked you earlier, a couple times, which you kept answering with your former post before our conversation even began. It's hardly putting words in your mouth. If you intended to answer differently you had every opportunity to. Push me then, DP. Since this conversation makes me scum. | ||
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Because if you still think it's possible then that's exactly what I think, and that's exactly why I don't think geript's point is enough to incriminate certain people and exonerate others. Am I making sense to you? Or are you determined to fight with me to the bitter end? lol | ||
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On January 24 2015 11:16 rsoultin wrote: While still avoiding the question I asked you. Do you or do you not think that a GB NK and a RB on JJB adds up to no possible vets in the scum team? why? Maybe if I break it up like that it will be harder to overlook. How is this difficult to grasp? | ||
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On January 24 2015 12:06 DarthPunk wrote: Point out to me. Where. ANYONE. CHANGED THEIR READS BASED ON GERIPTS ANALYSIS. You seem paranoid at a townie analyzing the night kill, or anyone drawing conclusions from it when nobody is doing that at all. THAT IS SCUMMY AS SHIT. If that's what you think, be my guest. I can disagree with a point without people changing their reads. I'm not sure why you're so hung up on that. | ||
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On January 24 2015 12:10 DarthPunk wrote: I said that is what I think. That does not mean I do not believe it is possible for a world to exist where somehow geript or especially Damdred are scum. I think it is likely. I agree with geript. That does not preclude any other answer potentially being true which is the position you tried to shove down my throat. You know how you could have known that? Read the post I posted like 6 times and not tried to draw an irrational logical position from that conclusion. Or you simply could have answered my questions. I am not trying to paint you into a corner. If I were I'd be scumming you for this exchange. Asking you if you think something is not the same as shoving it down your throat. | ||
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On January 24 2015 12:07 The Shining wrote: You had some original points against him at the time of you casing him, yes, but I guess I expressed that thought wrong. What I meant was you planted the LM case and let it sit N2 and then came out the gate pushing it after Bresh appeared with his LM case. Also, I had already questioned LMs activity at this point, too. The support for the LM lynch picked up overnight you could've seen that as an opportunity to push the mislynch. Again, this is all on LM flipping Town, which I don't see happening. Tin foil hats. I'm actually more suspicious of Geript pushing a counterlynch on you instead. Repeating myself here but unless he really is convinced LM isn't scum, I don't see the sense in replacing him with you as the lynch. Unless this is trying to save a scum mate late in the game? Too much tinfoil cuz LM hasn't flipped yet but still worth mentioning for once he does flip scum. Talk to me, Shining. I'm beating my head against a wall with DP and it won't get me anywhere, lol. You said you don't think LM will flip town. I'm kind of curious as to the tinfoil hat theories if he hasn't flipped yet. We still have plenty of time to discuss that, provided LM is lynched and doesn't flip scum. So you're scumreading geript for his push on Damdred earlier? What do you think of his comment about lynching lurkers? | ||
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On January 24 2015 12:23 DarthPunk wrote: Because you kept stating that you were not going to lynch people based on geripts analysis. When not only had nobody even suggested that. Nobody had even used that as a basis for a shift in their reads. Anyway ##unvote I still think you are town based on the strength of your filter before you started being impossible to deal with rationally. Hm. Okay? I'm pretty sure I've stated other things without being prompted to as well, so I'm not sure why you put special significance on that, but that's fine. Perhaps it all goes back to your initial tone read on me. DP, so let's say that geript's point is 100% correct. Who would your noob scum team be? I'm assuming Shining because of your earlier suspicions. | ||
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On January 24 2015 12:43 geript wrote: Rsoultin going ham on stupid shit and not understanding anything is really odd too. Like that never happened in the newbie game. -_- lol. Sure, geript. Is LM just a policy lynch to you? | ||
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On January 24 2015 12:54 geript wrote: Mostly. I forget what points Breshke made start of D3 that Damdred was trying to claim. But I liked those a lot. I'll filter that shit specifically tomorrow just to make sure it's a good lynch. I kinda want to lynch Damdred though. LM feels like a better lynch but I'd get 0 pleasure out of it. I can't read Damdred still -_- If I had to change wagons it would be to him, but I wouldn't want to risk going to lylo for it so. You like being right; I can tell lol. Well, if things are still looking similar to how I'm seeing them now, he'd probably be a good Day 4 lynch. I don't think it's a good idea to potentially carry a lurker into lylo at all. | ||
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On January 24 2015 15:24 The Shining wrote: When there is no real threat to either of you if you're scum with LM already at 5 votes? It doesn't seem impossible to me but whatever. Condescending attitude and a sarcastic response. Would you rather I keep my thoughts to myself? Because that doesn't help town at all. And you get rather touchy when anybody so much as mentions your name in a post. DP - Because we don't have unlimited mislynches to play with, far from it. I've done my best trying to read them both and your question was which one seems scummier than the other, not which one I think is scum. I've made clear my only solid scumread is LM, then I toss up between Breshke and Damdred. Geript wasn't even on that list. Geript's response to me brainstorming and not pushing him, just implying what I'll learn from an LM flip seems overly sarcastic and dismissive. That's why he's on that list now, too. I'm still on the fence about Damdred so yes, from where I'm sitting and what I'm seeing, I'm concerned over Townier but not confirmed Town Geript pushing Scummier but not confirmed Scum Damdred over Scummiest LoneMeow. Thank you. That clears it up for me, anyway. Eh, I'm ignoring the attitudes as much as I can this game. They can't all be scum. If you want to bounce ideas with me I'm happy to listen. I know people keep asking me where I stand with the ifs and buts, but I think I've gotten all I can out of a Day 1 vote analysis and there's not much to gain from Day 2, so... If you like I can explain my read on Breshke? Right now I'm trying to find scum by finding town. | ||
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On January 24 2015 16:05 rsoultin wrote: Thank you. That clears it up for me, anyway. Eh, I'm ignoring the attitudes as much as I can this game. They can't all be scum. If you want to bounce ideas with me I'm happy to listen. I know people keep asking me where I stand with the ifs and buts, but I think I've gotten all I can out of a Day 1 vote analysis and there's not much to gain from Day 2, so... If you like I can explain my read on Breshke? Right now I'm trying to find scum by finding town. EBWOP: Actually, if you get a spare moment, please read his filter, particularly leading up to the Day 1 vote. Then please give me your thoughts. He caught my attention because he was parked on JJB when everyone else switched. | ||
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In fact, I'd like your thoughts on it, too. I specifically approached players' filters with an eye on their voting and how their reads developed leading up to the votes. It was a little more difficult with all the wagon switches, but it's why I have some people as town that some of you don't. I want to see if y'all see/get the same things from those filters. | ||
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On January 24 2015 16:40 DarthPunk wrote: I just looked and Breshke's day one filter and it looks really bad in hindsight. It wasn't amazing, no. What do you think of his play at EoD? | ||
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Day 1. | ||
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On January 24 2015 17:12 DarthPunk wrote: I mean what do you want me to say? It was bad. He only wanted to lynch JJB who wasn;t getting lynched and then he afk'd Sure. That's what it looks like if you're not paying attention to the context. (And JJB was a viable lynch before the claim, not to mention scumread initially by both you and geript, so it's not a wild Day 1 read. Just putting that out there.) On January 18 2015 13:18 Breshke wrote: Damdred i had a look at jarjars filter and am probably agreeing with you. This read is almost baseless. Amid all the fluff the two reasons for the town read are that he generated discussion and meta. As to the generated discussion part i would say many players have done this. The first two that come to mind are Trfel and GB with both of their openings. However in the spoiler below you can see that Jarjar doesn't think that them making waves with their opening is alignment indicative but thinks the fact that LS has generated discussion is townie. The thought process here doesn't seem to line up. + Show Spoiler + On January 17 2015 18:48 jarjarbinks wrote: I bolded the part (I hope lol) of this quote that I thought summed up my thoughts on Trfel and GlowingBear. Trfel's vote and GlowingBears equally "interesting" opening is probably due to the strategy GlowingBear helped give Trfel. GlowingBear's explanation of Trfel's Vote makes this WIFOM in my eyes. They both started the way they did to make waves and nothing more. Not alignment indicative in my eyes. That being said, I'm more suspicious of GlowingBear over Trfel because of his playing experience. A counterargument to this for Trfel is his "stubbornness" on the bottom of page 8. Strange play if you were just trying to "make waves". He could just feel a necessity to defend himself, but I felt the arguments against his vote were relatively weak at the time. Saying what I said above about GlowingBear, I feel like he might want to try doing something else besides claiming VT at the beginning if that was the "making waves" play that shows balls. Us newbs killed LS for just that last game and we (mostly me) are slow learners. Also secondly on his meta point he has played one game as town and has never seen him as mafia so that isn't really justified either. Hence i think his LS read is fairly scummy Personally not a fan of this read of his and I've already discussed why with him, but that's not the point. This was the only strong scumread in his filter. Come EoD, big hullabaloo with GB and all that noise, you see Breshke attempting to push his scumread: On January 18 2015 21:24 Breshke wrote: Yeah its fairly shit isnt it. ##Vote:JJB/b] I still think this would be the lynch today even thoughpeople familiar with him seem to disagree While still trying to determine the alignment of the main wagon: On January 18 2015 21:26 Breshke wrote: Ffs ##Vote:JJB Currently id also be down for a GB lynch On January 19 2015 05:23 Breshke wrote: GB if damdred wadsnt an option who would you go for? On January 19 2015 05:30 Breshke wrote: Also GB what do you think of jarjar? [B]On January 19 2015 06:24 Breshke wrote: Btw im not intrested in lynching GB today anymore. I really think jarjaf is the way to go There are some other examples of him trying to understand why players were voting for one another, but the point is his play lined up with his reads and he seems to be actively looking for the best lynch and engaging with other players (until he AFKd) Then of course his play picked up in Day 2 and has been much better since, which isn't really that odd a trend given how much of a clusterfuck the first day phase usually is in these games. I don't see someone stubbornly clinging to a read against all evidence, or content to just park a vote for whatever reason. That progression reads townie enough to me to fit in with his improved filter later. | ||
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On January 24 2015 17:41 DarthPunk wrote: Yeah I agree that the passage of posts you quoted look townie when you put it like that. But honestly those questions don't seem to lead anywhere. Like he doesn;t draw a conclusion from it or at least doesn;t share his conclusions with the thread. Also GB looked townie enough for a huge wagon on him to completely dissipate within like 15 min or so. So it's not like Breshke was doing something against thread sentiiment. The place he ended up was bad. Period. And JJB was NOT a realistic candidate because neither Gewrit nor myself really tried nor wanted to lynch him. And honestly we were going to get the lynch we wanted day one. And the reason we didn't want to lynch him was because of parallels we drew to Slam at the start. Reread the vote DP please -_- People on the whole were not interested in moving onto that WW lynch. Most of your sheepers came after JJB claimed. I spent a good few minutes trying to decide whether or not to switch my own vote cause frankly they all felt like shit ^^ but I had stronger townreads on GB and JJB than WW. | ||
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On January 24 2015 17:42 DarthPunk wrote: This part is untrue as explained in above post. I can see where you are going with this and it does give bresh some cred but not as much as you seem to believe IMO. All I'm saying is compare what he's doing during the lynch to, say, LoneMeow, and one looks particularly more townie than the other. I can see where Breshke was coming from even if I didn't agree with him. And that slam-lite stuff is just...lol if that's why y'all were townreading him I have no words. Not just meta on a new player, but it wasn't even his meta. | ||
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On January 24 2015 17:58 DarthPunk wrote: Say you are unfamiliar with something. Well a strategy you can use to understand that something easier is to draw parallels to something as an aide to help you understand that new thing easier and more effectively. The slam comparison was great IMO. Eh, I personally don't care that much why you guys townread him. He does need help on the appearing townie thing. This really isn't about that. Anyway, I explained my townread on Breshke. His Day 2 filter speaks for itself, imo, but his EoD didn't appear as bad to me on closer inspection as it does at first glance. | ||
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On January 24 2015 19:39 LoneMeow wrote: Please explain which of your town leans mislynching me would clear and why? This is a weird question LM. If I believed that you were town, I would not be pushing you for lynch. Assuming you're mafia, with two reds flipped it would bring a new dynamic to the Day 1 vote to evaluate, and also information from how the Day 2 vote goes, that might allow me to clear one or more of the people I'm not sure of. And if this is a mislynch, well...that's harder. So I'm hoping it's not. The fact of the matter is that based on the Day 1 vote, your behavior is the only behavior that doesn't read townie to me at all, in the sense I can't think of reasons that make it town. You said that you didn't have the time to know when WW voted vice trfel, but you were there at EoD while all the switching was going on. I can see getting a little lost (I did -_-), but that post read so very much like "oh, good lord, there is a reason that WW could be scum, yay now I can switch without looking scummy". I don't know how else to put it. I'm glad you're coming out now, but if you're town, it's probably too little, too late. Note the other less active players with small filters. They're in the thread making reads, asking questions, on a semi-regular basis. Your activity is more sporadic. It makes it hard for me to objectively look at you, look at them, and say hey that person is scum and LM is town. Give me a reason to believe a player here is more likely to be scum than you. | ||
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I'm reading your case on Damdred now, Lonemeow. I also have to read geript's closer. I will say that I do remember going through his filter when Damdred's read changes first came up after Day 1, however, when I was back to leaning scum on him, and a look through his reads actually had me drop him to null rather than made me think he was more likely to be scum. Maybe I missed something, though. | ||
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On January 25 2015 00:33 jarjarbinks wrote: LM- I've never played with you. People keep claiming that your more inactive this round. Is it true? Do you have any reasons for being less active? DP- Can you clarify what exactly makes damdred a better lynch than LM? Was it just because LM started posting last night? Did your spat with Rsoultin make her more scum, or did you not getting anything out of that? Rsoultin- Have you learned anything from your inquiries of the past 24 hours? Did your talks with Geript and DP make you think either was more town or more mafia? Shining-Besides me, who are 3 people you consider most town at this point? Damdred- Who are 3 people you consider most town at this point? What I learned will be more useful after this lynch is decided. I'm sorry I'm not being more straightforward about this right now, but I want to concentrate on pushing the LM lynch (unless he gives me a good reason not to lynch him beyond suddenly becoming active when his ass is on the line, -sorry, LM, but it's just the truth-). I think he's scum and I'm expecting mafia to try to find a way out of this lynch if he is, which I'd prefer not to contribute to right now. But yes, I do think that depending on how the vote goes, some of the things from the last 24 hours could be helpful in finding the third scum, if only be process of elimination. | ||
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On January 25 2015 01:26 LoneMeow wrote: Why is it a weird question? Your statement is essentially "if he flips town, it will give me the alignment of 1 or 2 players". What I am asking is you to explain whose alignments you can deduce from me flipping town, and the logic by which you would do so. I said assuming I'm right on you, LM. I'm pushing you as scum. So my statement has nothing to do with you flipping town? | ||
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On January 25 2015 00:52 Damdred wrote: @JarJar, Rsoultin, JarJar and Dp are the towniest towns at this point. The shining random change was as stated before was because of a misread of one of his posts. I thought he was pushing me scum with LM and voted JarJar I believe, when I just read the sentence wrong and it was between LM and JarJar. It was an easy mistake to make when phone reading and led to a scum read that when my mistake was realized the read had to changed based on that new information. Its like if DP said something like "IF I claimed cop we would lynch first claim" after someone had already claimed cop and I missed the IF (even though the sentence doesn't make sense) would make me scum read one of the two if I misread the statement, corrections must be made. Theres not much to say about GB honestly, when you know that someone is town by the way they push something its just apparent. GB was boring before he started pushing his case, its a simple read but it is what it is. Once GB got to work it was apparent that he was town from the work and should of been obvious to the thread even if they weren't paying full attention. Plus I did give reasons like the push being similar to other games in tone and the feel of the push, even if DP disagreed the reasons were given so this is a bs reason to scum read me. Being disconnected from the game overall isn't that subjective and it is true. Geript hasn't really been that involved past a point and forgets about posts or seemily skips over posts and just seems dissatisfied when hes in game during certain points. That's a form of disconnect i'm sorry to say. Im sticking on LM here Okay, so...LM brought up a good point on your geript reads. I noticed that you brought up some of the same things I questioned geript on when you came to the conclusion that he was probably scum: i.e. the red check reaction, the way he handled his trfel scumread (that could be town), etc. So what made you change your mind? What made you start looking at him as scum, specifically? Your reasons obviously I can understand if I found them odd as well...but several things he mentioned about you I've also found odd xP My question is at what moment, at what particular post, did you go wait. I think this may not be town geript. I need to look at him closer. | ||
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On January 25 2015 01:39 LoneMeow wrote: Aha, ok. I read that as "or if I am wrong (and he flips town)" but I guess it makes sense the other way, too. Still would like to hear the logic for who it clears and why. If you're scum I expect some of the resistance to your lynch today to come from scum, with only 2 scum left. That's kind of a given. I'd be looking for people finding reasons to cast doubt on a wide net of other players in an attempt to find a counterwagon that sticks, or for their votes/reads to not be coming from a place that reads genuine, or something of that nature. It's not something I'm paying close attention to now because I don't want to start worrying about a third scum until you've flipped scum and I know I'm right. If I'm not I have to reevaluate everything. Voting analysis cross-checked with read progressions is what I like to base my scumhunting on. It's why I'm not down for a Bresh lynch, or a Shining lynch, and why Damdred makes me eeeeehhh somewhere in the neutral range. So the voting Day 2, plus your alignment added to a second read-through of the voting Day 1. Essentially I'm not going to be able to give you a list of names until the day is done. It's all what-if's and hypotheticals, especially when a good portion of the analysis will be based on what happens between now and EoD. Does that make sense to you? | ||
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On January 25 2015 01:50 Damdred wrote: The point today where I went this can't be town Geript was when he looked at breshkes post about why LM was scum and was like "this is great reasons haven't read any good reasons" which is a paraphrase. It struck me as odd and really disjointed towards the game since a lot of it was already stated before. Then you go and look back a bit and Geript lacks a little bit of follow up when you aren't directly talking to him, which bothered me a bit. I have a nullish read (you), though hell if you're scum and think that scumming geript is going to help you win, you're brighter than that I think...and a couple town-ish reads that could go mafia. One of them has to be if it isn't you. So please put a pin in this so we can discuss it later, provided you survive the lynch today. | ||
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On January 25 2015 02:04 Damdred wrote: I was answering the charges that LM brought against me, which btw its odd he spent more time hammering on the secondary thread sentiment in Damdred then someone who he said is his preferred lynch in breshke don't you think? I'm not reading anything that convinces me LM is town, if that's what you're asking. But I am looking back through your filter. The Shining reads have always made sense to me, so that point at least is weak. I'll get back to the thread on the rest. | ||
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On January 19 2015 00:11 Damdred wrote: GB reaction is priceless I'd rather not lynch the bear. And that's what GB does, likes killing lurkers early On January 19 2015 04:29 Damdred wrote: Cause I really am meh and I could want to lynch a lot of people and change my mind at this point. GB besides a couple of moments you have been meh and uninteresting . On January 19 2015 04:36 Damdred wrote: Meh GB is town from this more than likely. GB was being boring now he's not. I agree these weren't compelling arguments in favor of GB, any more than my arguments that trfel wasn't being trfel or my tone read on JJB were, but it's not like he's not explaining the read. People just didn't like the explanation xP That said, Damdy, going through your filter one of the main problems I see is that I keep having to click on the little number thingy to take me to the thread just to get a frame of reference for what you're talking about. That makes it very easy for scum and lazy town to take you out of context if you're town. | ||
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On January 25 2015 02:41 Damdred wrote: Rsoultin doing POE this is where I am currently JarJar Rsoultin DP Shining/Breshke Geript LM If you had to pick two people I was most wrong about which two would it be? No one is listening that I don't want to get into this right now. Okay. Frankly, I don't think you're wrong. I was waffling on DP a few times but I still really like his filter and I think he believes LM is town even if I don't agree with him. If LM is scum, geript actually looks worse to me than DP. And I do think LM is scum, which is the main reason I don't want to get into it; I feel like my reads right now are mostly associative, with the exception of JJB, Shining and Breshke. You three I've been trying to work out. I really want LM to flip so I can see where my reads stand then. | ||
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On January 25 2015 02:42 LoneMeow wrote: Okay, I see what you meant now. Since I'm town, do you think the resistance to lynching me is more likely coming from scum trying to look better after the flip or town reading me correctly? :/ How should I know? If you look super scummy to most of the player base I think it's equally likely for scum to tr you so they can look better, or to just go with it for the mislynch. It entirely depends on how many town are on your wagon. What I can say is DP needs to do a better job explaining his read on you because I still can't follow it @.@ and he's the only one I think who actually has said he thinks you're town. | ||
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On January 25 2015 03:05 geript wrote: I'm so tired of this elo hell. You mentioned this before. What does elo stand for? | ||
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On January 18 2015 06:15 Damdred wrote: He really hasn't posted any reads quite yet so he hasn't answered my question at this point so not much to garner yet. Geript has some good thoughts in his posts. I can't really tell his alignment yet That was your Damdred post mentioning alignment (null is my interpretation). In his initial large reads posts he just mentioned Geript's first post. I agree that one post alone is hard to judge anyone by so this isn't a red flag for me... On January 19 2015 05:56 Damdred wrote: I'm glad you asked me dp, I am lazy and think your obvious town. I don't see you being Scum nor a lynch so I'm ignoring your filter because I read you in thread as town. Geript is pretty town, if he's alive after d2 and no roles claim he's pulling a Russian mafia but he looks super towny LS is town based on hi a addiction to meta as town. Jjb is mafia I think As a point of curiosity, what did you mean there, Damdred? I don't understand the significance of people claiming roles. On January 20 2015 09:22 Damdred wrote: Lol, Geript might actually be Scum after those posts. Please clarify which posts. I know what I think you're saying, but it's better if you just tell me. I've linked where this post was in the thread. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/475036-student-mafia-v?page=50#999 On January 20 2015 11:54 Damdred wrote: Geript, lets say I calmed down and have taken a step back and gazed over your filters in Russian mafia and here. Im comfortable saying the anger here isn't like what happens in Russian where you are just 100% cool until you get caught by what you deem to be an imbalanced game. I don't see you throwing doubts on people as mafia in this case, you would roll with it and bus your team mate without questioning claims I think. I think you are towny this game, and shouldn't let my paranoia get the better of me probably. So that leaves me with staring at (minus town reads) Breshke LM geript talk to me about DP. How sure are you that hes town right here? I know you were pretty sure earlier? Can you explain Russian to me? This is the second time you've mentioned it in trying to determine geript's alignment. On January 23 2015 23:22 Damdred wrote: DP seems to be involved and connected to the game and giving thoughts, I think even though I have some doubts about him I don't think he would connect himself with the scum team like this if LM is scum which is a real possibility. Breshke looks the best coming into today really putting in the effort to try to solve the game and answer questions about him Rsoultin looks great as well, questioning everything and seems paranoid enough to be towny plus actions before. Jarjar: Un cc'd blue Town: Breshke Rsoultin DP JarJar I think, that Geript feels really disconnected from the game and he sometimes really lacks followup and can't really tell what hes doing anymore. Really seems like yesterday he was disparaging the claim of LS and JarJar trying to put doubts setting up trfels counter claim which trfel totally fell through with. But that's wifom, besides that. The question about the day 1 lynch will bother people because why would mafia want to pull off a town? Perhaps to stop town from lynching LM as a last second lynch, as GB myself both lost ton of traction and GB my main pusher stopped and jarjar was claiming blue so getting people from looking at LM would be good. LM is the other mafia I think, not trying to solve the game. I think tis geript and LM at this point. But we will see and geript will give me tons of flack for this post I know hehe ##Vote LM So...these are the actual times that I've noticed a distinct read change in Damdred's filter on geript. Geript, what makes this scummy to you? Apart from, you know, you not liking people thinking you could be scum, anyway. | ||
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On January 25 2015 03:49 Damdred wrote: To the first question, Geript would normally be a high priority night kill. Obviously with both of our blues coming out early he would be shuffled down the list but if he was alive with no blues claimed then it would be possible hes scum at that point. That point it was all so random posting and made it seem like Geript was questioning whether LS actually had a red check on trfel and was throwing a bit of shadow in my mind on the claim. Was just a weird series of posts by geript at that point. Russian mafia geript played one of the best games of scum I ever saw him play, really town sided a lot of the time did just enough to get mislynches, ended up getting caught by a tracker/watcher though. Was a fun game though. So then am I right in interpreting your referencing Russian as a reason to be paranoid of geript even when his posts seem townie? | ||
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On January 25 2015 03:58 geript wrote: Things you have to take into account of the early D2 posting. First I was sick. Second, I fully expected a CC. Like, what sort of idiot mafia don't CC LS there? geript, no one is pushing you for the lynch right now. Besides, if scum CCs LS on Day 2...either people believe LS and kill trfel anyway (the correct move, because you can verify him, lynch one scum and identify the second that way, or immediately lynch the fake-claimed ls the next day and clear the cc), giving town two obv scum to lynch early in the game, or they lynch ls and still give town two obv scum... A CC would be bad for mafia there. Please tell me what about Damdred's reads on you makes you think he's scum? | ||
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On January 25 2015 04:10 geript wrote: ELO is a rating system originally used in chess but adopted for a number of other games. Hrum, so just calling everyone bad again? Okay. -shrugs- I suppose, re: the CC. You've played more games as scum than I have. Everyone seems to have different opinions. I was just told last game, for instance, that scum tends to be very reluctant to claim roles. I'm sure it's situational, but it does leave an auto-lynch once the dumbassery is over, so I'd personally expect it more late than early game in general. | ||
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On January 25 2015 04:24 geript wrote: In semi-open games, you're right. Mafia tend to just accept a claim and kill it. Open setups are an exceptionally different beast though. Your reason for thinking Damdred's reads progression on you is scummy? Or any of his other flip-flop reads you mentioned, for that matter. | ||
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On January 25 2015 04:27 geript wrote: Also, if I were calling you bad, then I'd just call you bad. I'm really surprised that you're on TL and don't understand what elo hell is. Like the people around you being bad might have part of it. In my experience it's more an issue of people not listening, doing dumb shit, randomly because caught out by the opponents stupidly doing things they shouldn't that of course end up working well for them, etc. Lol, I'm not a gamer, geript. Far from. I like games like...poker, catan, risk...so I don't really belong on this site except for the mafia. I like this game a lot. ^^ Regardless, thanks for explaining. I'd agree that games like this have too many townies not acting very townie, which makes it extra hard to find scum...especially if scum doesn't have to really even try. It's why I haven't been quick to jump on what can easily be newbie bad instead of scum most of this game. | ||
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On January 25 2015 04:59 geript wrote: Like I'm being honest in that it would in no way surprise me that mafia was just afk. Because in some regards the game kinda feels like that and it's LM/Shining or similar. But at this point, everyone who scumreads me or even suggests such bullshit will be up for a lynch because that's literally preposterous. geript, I don't know why you insist that it's impossible that anyone could think you are scum. Because I <I>literally</I> have entertained that possibility off-and-on throughout the game. I know I'm a newbie. I know I barely know you and can't meta-read you at all. But I also know I'm not a complete moron, so if there's something in your play that has me questioning you, then no, it is not preposterous for anyone to scumread you. Where do you get this highly elevated view of your play? I mean, this is a serious question. You said earlier in this game no one can read you right, yet now you're on about how anyone possibly even suggesting you're scum must be scum because it's impossible for anyone to think so? | ||
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On January 25 2015 05:26 geript wrote: People don't read me right because they don't bother to think in my experience. It doesn't really require meta. Like you don't even ask, "what's he doing? Is he doing mafia things?" because that's really not how you read me. You look at what I'm thinking about. As mafia, my thoughts never really match; like there's a huge jump and points I have don't flow into each other in a coherent way. Thoughts (and thought process) won't always make sense or seem logical, but there's a clear thought that leads into another thought and so on. Wheels churn and one thing gets me interested in another thing that seems random but it's connected in a very natural way. That's the thing that I can't ever fake as mafia. -squints at- so...as mafia your thoughts don't match or...as town your thoughts may seem random, but they do connect without being in your head I'm not sure how anyone could tell the difference between not matching and seemingly random? o.0 well, regardless, I guess you've explained why you find his reads scummy, though i'm not sure how that helps the rest of us, lol. at least it doesn't really help me. I don't know how damdred normally treats you in a game when he's mafia. | ||
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On January 25 2015 05:42 DarthPunk wrote: There is no way geript is scum here. If Geript is scum this game I will need to re-evaluate the way I play but I don't see it happening. Like, people are askling me to explain my town read on LM and I can do so whilst explain the way I read things period and perhaps it will help people with geript also. When I am reading the thread sometimes posts will pop up that are really unlikely to come from scum because the reasoning being used only really makes sense if that person is town. Case in point: This post here looks really townie to me because it is an open window to a townie mindset. It shows healthy paranoia and the rationale is coming from a place that only makes sense from a Town!LM perspective. Then he looks at my filter and decides there is no reason to call me scum. He is collecting and analyzing information and changing his position based on that. I like this post so much that as soon as I read it I again decided I didn't want to lynch him. As for geript, there are countless posts in his filter that make me think he is town, further, I don;tn think scum could or would switch their style up like that mid game from an easier to fake style of posting. ( large constructed posts) to a harder to fake style (conversational ITT) I will give you this. If you're right about LoneMeow you are probably also right about geript, and I would not want to lynch him Day 4. That post in and of itself doesn't seem scummy to me, either, but from a paranoid perspective him saying his defender appears town while finding a reason to scumread his couterwagon is not terrible play if he's trying to get out of a lynch. It's his play as a whole that I'm reading. If you are not right about LM...well, I'll address your geript read, then. There are a few points in his play that make me suspicious of him with a trfel/lm scumteam. | ||
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On January 25 2015 05:57 DarthPunk wrote: Explain where this is happening. First of all he called me scummy in that post more than he calls me townie. And he calls his only defender scummy! do you see scum ever doing that?!??! That is suicide from someone whose win condition depends on survival. But makes perfect sense from someone whose win condition is predicated on solving the alignments of others! -sighs- You really get worked up over small things. He said he was worried about you. He said what appeared to be distancing from the lynch could be scummy. And then said he can't find scum in your filter. That is not calling you scummy, not in my book. He only said this at all because Breshke asked him. Look at your own quote. I am looking at what he literally said. He literally said something you're doing could be scummy but he doesn't think so because of your filter. | ||
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On January 25 2015 06:05 DarthPunk wrote: What motive does a mafia have to not hard town read me at that point? Honest truth? If he flips scum your filter looks bad by association. Trfel's crazy JJB is good JJB is good was an obvious ploy, but partially but not really defending a "scum partner" is a less obvious way to paint you scum and get you mislynched. | ||
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On January 25 2015 06:05 DarthPunk wrote: What about shining? Will you lynch shining over LM? Not in the slightest. I have more reason to suspect Damdred than Shining. | ||
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On January 25 2015 06:08 Damdred wrote: As far as I can tell, LM isn't even voting me is he? He made a case against you but chose not to vote. I can read that as coming from either alignment :/ | ||
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On January 25 2015 06:11 DarthPunk wrote: Gah. Hopefully I am wrong and LM flips scum. Hope you are, too -_- I think the game is mostly solved if you are. Otherwise it's back to a bunch of unknowns. | ||
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On January 25 2015 06:15 DarthPunk wrote: If your town read is about to get lynched you try it anyway honestly. :/ You may be able to convince Damdred. Your townread is the one I think is most likely to flip scum, so...I have no interest in moving if he's set to be the lynch. | ||
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On January 25 2015 06:21 DarthPunk wrote: You think I can convince damdred to join his own wagon? Yeah...... NO. Lol, a shining wagon, or whatever other shennanies you were interested in, obviously. xP I'm not high. | ||
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On January 25 2015 06:21 LoneMeow wrote: GET OFF ME, THIS IS A MISLYNCH WAGON. Don't mislynch because you're too tunneled to even consider other options. If you can not state 3 clear reasons why you are lynching me then you are either scum or tunneling for bad reasons. I'm obviously open to lynching just about anyone who is not me or jarjarbinks but I would prefer Damdred. Breshke exhibits very similar paranoid thinking in some of his later posts as I have been going through so I no longer trust my read on him that much. ##Vote: Damdred Shit reasoning for scumming Bresh day 1. Complete disinterest in where the vote was heading day 1. BS reason for switching to the WW wagon day 1. General inactivity throughout the game. get rekt xP | ||
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On January 25 2015 06:22 geript wrote: This is a question that bugs me because I don't see it ever come back up again. It's just kinda full speed ahead on LM. I also don't remember anyone commenting on how active LM tends to be as either alignment. Maybe I made a passing comment that I usually think of LM as a low activity guy. Overall, I'd agree with you that the early townreads were perhaps quite wrong, but I'm not really seeing clear scum motivation or a lot of scummy things. One thing that does kinda bug me is that the's big on the LM-Trfel +1 theory, but if that's the case, then he should basically have it down to rsoultin/DP/Shining/me. But he doesn't really get how Trfel+LM implicates DP. There's no question as to whether or not LM is mafia. Yet he had a conversation with mafia bout LM. Seriously, geript? He had JJB as his prime scum read. Can you quote me where he was scumreading trfel Day 1, because I certainly don't remember it. | ||
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On January 25 2015 06:28 geript wrote: Like that post really bugs me. No one's really been pushing a Shining lynch at all. Like, activity isn't keeping Shining in the realm of mislynchable people. It's moreso the fact that his filter is pretty barren. He recognizes this but he doesn't really make any attempt to do anything about it other then, "Oh I guess I'm just on the list of mislynchables." I do not see scum in shining's filter. I saw him go after GB hard, get into a shouting match with Damdred and GB. I saw him evaluate our spat in the thread. He's presented ideas others haven't. There isn't a disconnect between what he's doing and what he's saying. You honestly think he has a better chance of flipping scum than LM or Damdred? | ||
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I don't know Bresh's work schedule at all, but a dead phone at 8:30 a.m. does seem like a stretch, DP >< Meh. I really don't have any big issues with his filter though is the problem. He should be here to explain this >< | ||
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On January 25 2015 06:46 LoneMeow wrote: You do realise that all of those points except the last are based on day 1 alone - we're at the end of day 3 now, so you really should have some new evidence one way or the other by now. The last point would apply also to The Shining, yet you're not calling him scum for it, why's that? I find Day 2 practically a vacuum with the red check on Trfel. You weren't even here for it. You've done pretty much jack all above and beyond everyone else's jack all. What you did post was mostly Day 1, and that' what I find scummy. Another counterargument? | ||
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We can question Breshke when he gets back. All the time in the world for that. | ||
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This is ridiculous >< | ||
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Okay, you win, DP, I suck at this lol >< | ||
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geript (yes I know I'm quoting damdred) Can you walk me through your point on breshke? I couldn't follow it very well. You said all the people he was towning were the only possible players who could be part of a trfel/lm team? | ||
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Maybe Damdred. That shift to breshke was super sudden from an earlier townread. I'm pretty sure geript is town. | ||
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On January 25 2015 07:11 Damdred wrote: Geript is cleared he wouldn't pull a second mislynch off a town that's been an almost afk lynch as scum I think. Which is a bit of wifom but hes town, DP is town. So that really narrows down my focus. JarJar is confirmed Shining, Breshke, Rsoultin. There are two mafia in there. I think its Breshke and Rsoultin with his unwillingness to switch, LM was acting pretty towny eod. It's not me, I doubt it's shining, so you're missing a mafia there Damdred. | ||
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On January 25 2015 07:24 geript wrote: The lowest DP ends is usually null but more often I remember it more as Breshke giving him a soft town lean. I'm town, rsoultin' town, Shining's town. Like it makes no sense for a Damdred LM scum team. But he's happy about the LM lynch but isn't really thinking how it affects his reads. He's also not really flat analyzing based on filter alone. hmmm okay. so...I don't know. a damdred LM scum team doesn't make sense, you're right. dp is in the same null category as damdred... i'll have to see where else breshke has read dp, cause this post doesn't really illustrate your point. | ||
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On January 25 2015 07:37 geript wrote: 3/4ths of the people who reasonably could be mafia with LM and the last being null doesn't illustrate that my point that his LM scum team makes no sense. i'd just assume that was why dp was null, cause to me the only thing that had me wondering was his association with trfel and lm...so no, it doesn't really, since dp was in the null section. which is why I need to find if his other posts with reads are generally towning dp; that would then make sense and illustrate your point | ||
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if y'all have questions leave them in thread and I'll get to them players not here during the lynch, your impressions on what happened would be nice | ||
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On January 25 2015 13:39 Damdred wrote: I already said why I think shining is town, by POE those three are my most likely scum team. Shining is town i'm like 95% sure of it so its bresh and Rs im pretty sure. Okay, so just to be clear here, you're going with all scum being on the town wagon (LM)? Are you 100% sure that Breshke is scum? I'd like to see why. I'm obviously not scum -_- Not only is it inherently wrong to say wrong always = scum, but the Breshke lynch was not the only lynch I resisted, which you should very well know. I didn't want to move onto you, Shining or Bresh. That you're trying to sell a scumteam of me and Bresh is almost as scummy as your sudden eagerness to jump to him when you'd been townreading him most of the 48 hrs leading up to the lynch. The only reason I could have under those circumstances for trying to keep the lynch on LM was because I thought he was scum. Unless you're saying that there are four scum left. That's just bad, Damdred. I'll look at Bresh again, cause clearly my reads aren't all right, but your eagerness to paint us both scum for a lynch on a town makes me think he isn't and you're trying to get one of us lynched Day 4 to win the game for your scum team. | ||
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On January 25 2015 16:23 jarjarbinks wrote: Ya I haven't used it this game. That model was based on EOD votes, dead peoples votes, and who dies at night. I first figured that if I could get enough games into the system, I could figure out if say voting for a town that gets lynched makes you any more likely to be scum or not. I was thinking about doing something like seeing how claiming or including votes that switch later affect a person's alignment as well, but those require more digging into every game and would take more time. I only had 2 games in the system then and 3 now. I've been kind of lazy, mostly because it seems like all the people that play on here were very against it. Statistics are supposed to be used to help support things people normally see in the games. Since my numbers were going against common perception, I figured it was either: You guys were wrong OR My model sucked some big balls. I went with my model sucked some big balls. I think if I had time to put in like 30 games to the model I might have something. But that's going to be a while. My 3 game model has it like this (baseline is 2/7 because theres two scum out of 7 people): Me: 43% mafia... lol Breshke: 41% mafia Rsoultin: 31% mafia Shining: 30% mafia Everyone else: 29% mafia This is without a +/- 3% buffer. But like I said before, I'm not using this at all and for good reason. If I did, I would have still been genuinely confused because of the very large train Day1 and GB voting for me... lol Don't know how right your model is there, bro, but if it's dependent on other people's reads, we're doing so well this game it might as well be trash -_- Sorry. Just irritated with myself. Anyway, talk to me about what you think without the stats? | ||
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Unless votes are widely scattered, not everyone on a town mislynch is going to be scum, even if the counterwagon is scum. It's mathematically impossible. And I'm not convinced Breshke actually is scum. With town vs. town it's even less alignment indicative who was on the mislynch wagon. I try to look at why people are voting what they're voting -_- Obviously that didn't work out so well for me this time. Eh, going to bed. Revisit this with fresh eyes in the morning. | ||
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On January 25 2015 16:47 geript wrote: So how much percentage points do everyone get? I ask because I was interested in it at end of game; I mean it did have mafia as the #2,3 and 4 on the to lynch train. He told you, geript ^^; The baseline is 2/7, which comes to 28.5714% or rounds up to 29%. That means if you were to completely randomly draw a name out of a hat they'd have a 29% chance of flipping scum. It would help if you told us by how many percentage points each of those situations were increased, JarJar. Like, EoD votes on a town vs. a scum, the dead people scumreading still living players, and the night kills' reads on living players. Do you factor in town reads or just scum reads? Is it just the most recent opinion of the dead players? Do you look at the scum players reads? Things like that. But yeah, he did already explain his model. The +/-3% is JJB's personal opinion of a player. | ||
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On January 25 2015 17:33 Breshke wrote: RSo did yout ake another look at my filter do you still think im town? Also how sure are you on your the shining read are you sure you arnt jsut giving him a pass for being a newbie? All that shit I said about DP seemingly defending LM from nothing i still think is true but he might just have seen something i didn't. Also he seemed genuinely happy when people started changing their votes to me so i have me hesitations. Meh. I'm doubting myself a lot right now. I did look at your filter again and I just don't see it. Like, your Day 1 play didn't impress me, but nothing felt off about you at EoD. You looked like you had your scumread and were actively trying to push it. I've said multiple times you've looked a lot better since Day 1. Both you and LM seemed suspicious of DP with an LM town flip. Shining thought LM was scum. You did. I did. JJB did. Geript agreed, too, but still didn't want to lynch him today for whatever reason. (He might have said it, but all I remember is him saying Damdred would be more satisfying.) Damdred thought he was scum. DP thought he was town for a long time and I'm still not getting why. I need to reread the posts near EoD and am putting it off till tomorrow. I'm kind of in the same camp as you. I'm inclined to wonder if it's TMI in regards to DP townreading LM. But I'm not sure if I just didn't see something obvious, or it's because DP is scum. Shining...I just don't see Shining as scum. I have yet to see a post that jumps out at me from him that suggests he's scum, and his voting was pristine Day 1 too. Damdred's weird reaction to the lynch has me all sorts of paranoid. I don't want to look at it now, though, cause part of it is entirely OMGUS, I'm not gonna lie. I honestly don't think he's this bad as to jump right to scumming whoever led a lynch on a town with nothing else to support it. | ||
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On January 25 2015 18:18 DarthPunk wrote: I'm not scum for Town reading LM. You are just bad for scum reading him. Honestly. The dude looked townie day on because of the way he could change gears on his read with with new information proving his read wrong. Scum just don't change gears that fast in response to new information. They just don't. I have explained all this before. I honestly STILL have no idea how all of you bads scum read him based on his filter. AND HE WAS SHITTING TOWNIE RAINBOWS FROM HALFWAY THROUGH YESTERDAY. Honestly. You may be right. Obviously you were right that he was town. I personally see nothing incredibly townie about changing your mind when you're told that you've completely flip-flopped the facts that is the basis for your read...however maybe that's a problem with my own understanding of how scum and town plays. Nor do I see anything incredibly townie about a bunch of questions that lead nowhere. I probably was not going to listen to him no matter what he said yesterday, and that's my own fault, but I'll take another look when I'm less irritated to see if it was glaring me in the face or not -_- Do you have to yell all the time? I don't respond well to it ^^ | ||
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On January 25 2015 18:33 DarthPunk wrote: Scum are invested in their reads. It takes a lot of energy and time to build a safe read on someone as scum and you don;t want to just clear people who you could mislynch like he did. Especially when you are newer it is DIFFICULT and time consuming to just backtrack like that as scum. Which is why I thought it was townie. Then once he became engaged in the thread it was really obvious that he was town and I have multiple posts in my filter explaining why. You could be right and it is an experience thing. Or you could be scum. Like the way you refused to adjust or even contemplate adjusting your position on him is the DIRECT OPPOSITE of the townie thing that LM did. -shrugs- You've been wanting to scumread me all game. Enjoy. You have your opportunity. Shining and Breshke were never going to be my switches. Maybe Damdred. I know that I can be wrong, but I don't switch to townreads if I can avoid it -_- | ||
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On January 25 2015 18:40 DarthPunk wrote: Well I was right wasn't I? Like I town read him. I got him to engage with the thread and shit town rainbows and tried to not lynch him and I was right to do that. So I suppose it doesn't matter if you don't agree with my reasoning because it was correct. Anyway I am not gonna talk about this anymore I will get too mad. If you want to know why I thought he was town read my filter. Why do you want to no lynch? Because you read on Mafia scum wiki that it was the correct mathematical play? here is my position on no lynching. We No lynch: Then scum are gonna shoot the most competent townie in the game which 1000% will be geript or myself. And then whoever out of geript and myself does not get killed will have to deal with an incompetent town with one less competent townie in the game. So no. The idea of leaving things even further in the hands of you lot whilst praying you lynch the right person from the comfort of the OBS Thread does not fill me with confidence at all. I don't know. A no-lynch may not be terrible just because it would have to give town extra information before trying to pick scum out of the remainder. Either way we have no more mislynches left. | ||
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On January 25 2015 18:42 DarthPunk wrote: Anyway. Homework for everyone tonight is to take a look at everyone's filters with a fresh perspective and try and find a scum to lynch tomorrow. No shit Sherlock -_- | ||
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On January 25 2015 18:47 DarthPunk wrote: I feel like I need to hold your hands at this point. DP. Telling people in a game about finding scum to find scum is flat out condescension. If you've got nothing productive to say, please do us all a favor and keep it to yourself. I've tried to ignore you and geript acting like you're the only ones in this game who are worth more than toilet paper, but it is becoming increasingly irritating as time goes on, and believe it or not it does actually interfere with reading the two of you. At least for me. So if you're town, cut it out. | ||
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Okay, I'm removing myself from this thread before it turns into more of a tit-for-tat. Gnite Bresh. DP. | ||
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On January 26 2015 00:22 Damdred wrote: I've already explained why Geript is town, it's in the post. And we aren't no lynching final group would be rs, bresh, jarjar, shinning,me. I'd rather have a non ark in there. We lynch breath Tommorow then go from there. Why do you not want to discuss this game at all? | ||
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On January 26 2015 00:52 Damdred wrote: I am discussing but if you ask me a question don't quote the answer when you ask it. It's like people questioning dp, it was an inconvenient time for eod on a Sunday and he made it here to do thing a he's town. Okay, let me explain my question here. We are talking about a lylo lynch. You have basically decided already who you are going to lynch with no real analysis to back it up other than: so-and-so is town therefore so-and-so is scum. I mean, I expect someone like SL to be screaming about auto right now cause he's just a little (heh) irrational, but to me you making blanket statements and not backing it up with any analysis other than poe feels like you're not interested in figuring out this game. Can scum not make it to EoD to do things? Who is "confirmed town" to you and why? | ||
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On January 26 2015 01:08 Damdred wrote: Scumcan make it to eod, but if the time is a bit meh they won't bother especially with basically an auto lynch set up let alone try to shenanigans onto someone. Geript and dp and jarjar are confirmed for me. Shining and myself are town I feel. So very little options. Poe solves games sometimes, and it's pointing to besh and you. It is what it is. You're wrong on at least one of us, which invalidates your poe. JarJar is confirmed to me. I have reasons to townread Breshke and shining (could I be wrong, obviously yes) but I don't see this game nearly as black-and-white as you do. I don't know anymore -_- Why are you townreading shining? Still feels? Why have you been blindly townreading DP all game? Why do you think the only place for scum on the lynch yesterday was LM's wagon? | ||
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On January 26 2015 01:13 Damdred wrote: And yes, Scum can pull people off of town. Day one it's not a bad play but the lynch to push us into Mylo when we basically auto lynching? No they want to hammer that through. Sorta like how you were ok autolynching and lynching for info to go into mylo. I thought LM was scum -_- Yell at me for how bad that read was if you want, but it was hardly autolynching. | ||
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On January 26 2015 01:08 Damdred wrote: Scumcan make it to eod, but if the time is a bit meh they won't bother especially with basically an auto lynch set up let alone try to shenanigans onto someone. Geript and dp and jarjar are confirmed for me. Shining and myself are town I feel. So very little options. Poe solves games sometimes, and it's pointing to besh and you. It is what it is. ...that is a very weird way to say you're town. | ||
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On January 25 2015 06:22 Damdred wrote: Also DP is like 99% never mafia, he made sure he was here EoD at a completely abysmal time for him. Sounds really crappy to clear someone on but its pretty true people who don't really care about the game won't show up, town has more reason to care. On January 25 2015 06:41 Damdred wrote: I"m not ok with a switch to shining, i'm ok with lynching breshke or LM here. A breshke scum complicates the game a bit and makes the last one hard to catch. On January 25 2015 06:41 Damdred wrote: ##Unvote ##Vote Breshke Lets do this On January 25 2015 06:43 Damdred wrote: I'm wrong more often than not, LM is a lower activity player. And I could be tunneled, and i'm probably wrong about Geript. On January 25 2015 06:51 Damdred wrote: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/474146-newbie-mini-mafia-lx That's the game, he even targets setup speculation like he did with the medic talk. I think breshke is a good lynch here but so is LM On January 25 2015 06:59 Damdred wrote: End game cred, scum team of Breshke and Rsoultin All of that came from you before flip. It's like you were already setting up your "poe" in anticipation of LM flipping town. On January 25 2015 07:11 Damdred wrote: Geript is cleared he wouldn't pull a second mislynch off a town that's been an almost afk lynch as scum I think. Which is a bit of wifom but hes town, DP is town. So that really narrows down my focus. JarJar is confirmed Shining, Breshke, Rsoultin. There are two mafia in there. I think its Breshke and Rsoultin with his unwillingness to switch, LM was acting pretty towny eod. What? That directly contradicts what you were saying before the lynch when you switched to bresh... | ||
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On January 26 2015 01:29 Damdred wrote: No it was an auto lynch we basically threw every vote in the game on lm and most people ark. Before the last 30 minutes we got no information, now we have information from that lynch, and the sentence about my Poe doesn't invalidate it at all. Dp has been really towny, he made sense with Scum lm but not with many others. Because Scum want mylo not to lynch breshke. Which brings me back to LM's paranoia -_- Bresh mentioned it, too. This idea that the only possible scumteam DP could be on is with trfel/lm. geript himself said that DP is probably not going to do that as scum. | ||
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On January 26 2015 01:40 Damdred wrote: Of course I set up my Poe because I was convinced breshke is Scum here and I still am especially with how breshke came into night phase, Geript right it was really funky. And I love this you just make me more sure by every post by pulling everything you can that I'm Scum. LM was acting towny in hindsight more so than breshke. So yes I switches off. And your total reluctance to not only not switch to breshke but not switch to ANYONE is pretty telling. Breshke should have been what, cursing everyone out? He was acting more towny in hindsight than breshke which is why you changed your lynch vote? Again you are directly contradicting what you said when people asked why you changed your vote. Why should it matter in your world of an rsoul/bresh scumteam if I don't switch to anyone else? Lol, you've seen me play scum, Damdred. I do not suffer from the inability to reason out how pretty much anyone could be scum (which may be my overall problem with scumhunting in general, being too paranoid). | ||
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On January 26 2015 01:41 Damdred wrote: I'm sorry if dp was Scum he would kill Geript over GB unless they were Scum together. How is this not WIFOM? Seriously -_- | ||
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On January 26 2015 01:50 Damdred wrote: It's not because dp respects Geript and knows Geript has the greatest chance to catch him over new 's. Now if you wanted to you could talk about a Geript dp team, which you have never done even though you say you reason out every person etc. Lm was acting towny, I don't like ark lynched which is what we were doing. Geript found good point, dp found another it was time to go. I've thought of a geript/DP scumteam, and maybe it's just me, but that's a ton of interaction and blatant ties to one another that if one is lynched would make it ridic easy to find the other. Just doesn't seem that viable to me. Possible, but unlikely. I find it more likely that one pocketed the other and hid behind the WIFOM of not NKing their pocketed town than I do the idea of running the table together. Damdred, BS meter. What you're saying now simply does not line up with what you said when you first switched your vote. | ||
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On January 26 2015 01:58 Damdred wrote: Thought progresses change and I'm not reading my own filter to make it line up. Geript made a good point, dp did as well I switched. I have enough doubts especially this game to move. -_- A dead phone/time and having you and dp in a null list with lm as scum are good points? I'm not saying they're terrible ones, but they're so groundbreaking that they merit a complete reversal in your reads? You say you think bresh and LM both can be good lynches while simultaneously setting up a poe that makes sense only with an LM town flip, and now try to say that LM was obviously town and that was why you switched? Either you're experiencing an early case of alzheimers where you can't remember something as simple as what you were thinking less than 24 hours ago, or it seems a hell of a lot like you're capitalizing on this town flip as much as you can. | ||
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On January 26 2015 02:08 jarjarbinks wrote: Ya well its obviously due to change. But I guess you know that. There's two parts to it. First part If you vote for the lynched townie, it causes a 2% increase, if the lynched townie voted for you, it gives you a 23% increase. If the guy that got killed at night voted for you, then that's a 16% increase. Second part: You have to factor in wagons and strength of the votes. So if you look back to the waffle lynch, there was 8 people on waffle, 2 on GB, and 2 on me. All the people who voted waffle get a 2% increase to start with. But since there was such a big wagon on Waffle, I used a factor of (4/12) and multiplied it by the 2% to get the actual increase. I found 4/12 by subtracting 8/12 from 1. I did this because on wagons mafia has less of an incentive to park their vote on the lynched guy. So for day 1 all the waffle voters only got about .7% increase because of their waffle vote. The less experienced/good the town team is, the less you can use the model. It also helps to have more players in the game. JJB, help me out here. I'm OMGUSing Damdred. Are my points valid or am I being a stubborn ass again? >< I know you're town, and I respect your intelligence, so can you double-check me real quick? | ||
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o.0 can you tell me where you got your percentage increases from? the 23% and 16%? just as a point of curiosity | ||
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On January 26 2015 02:14 jarjarbinks wrote: Hold on I'm catching up. I'm assuming you have an argument on him in this thread somewhere? I do. It's basically a running argument with him at this point -_- But yeah, I quoted his vote switch to Bresh and stuff and you can see what he's been saying since Night 3 started. Just be my sanity check if you don't mind. Thanks a bunch, bro. | ||
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On January 26 2015 02:16 Damdred wrote: Obviously when I set up my Poe I was convinced lm was flipping town, which was after voting had closed btw. Theresistance to the flip makes it highly likely if not assured that breshke is Scum. Also lm said he was town right as voting ended and it was believable The "resistance" to the flip was me. And saying that DP being there at EoD made him town, that you were probably wrong on geript, that you could be wrong on LM and just tunneled, that you're 95% sure on Shining, all before the flip while saying both LM and Bresh were good lynches was not setting up your PoE before the flip? | ||
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On January 26 2015 02:34 jarjarbinks wrote: Regressions. Took old games and found the change in %'s from what the %'s should have been if the person voting for town was killed etc. And that 23% is beyond what the maximum % increase would be. The highest it would be in this game is 23% times 12/13 which is 21.2%. That would be if the lynched guy parks a solo vote on someone he thinks is mafia while no one else believes him. Probably will never happen. Sorry if its confusing. It would be easier to explain it if you saw the model. Honestly I feel like my model is useless in this game though. It's not going to help us find scum. :/ Eh, I'm sure the more games you add to it and the more we play in general so you can tweak it, the better it will get. But the human element is always gonna make it imperfect. | ||
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On January 26 2015 02:33 Damdred wrote: I've been saying I'm sure on shining for a long time now. That isn't changing, unless things happen obviously. I said well before flip I suck at reading Geript, so that's no change. Not sure where you are going with this, the way lm acted right at the end really showed town. Mhm. So tell me, then, why being around at EoD makes DP town unless LM is town. That statement came well before your bresh vote while you were still on LM. Oh, and while you were still saying both were good lynches. ^^ | ||
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On January 26 2015 02:40 jarjarbinks wrote: I think this quote shows when/why he began switching. Yeah, that was his explanation for the vote. Did you read the quotes I posted and my comments? That's what I need the sanity check on. | ||
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On January 26 2015 02:51 jarjarbinks wrote: Idk rsoultin. Damdred was the first Breshke vote. He didn't need to do that. I could see him seeing that DP had some good points and that LM wasn't mafia and decide to switch to the other guy people were suspicious of. Half survival half change in point of view. Town wants to survive too, not just mafia. I guess if you think that breshke is town, then it would make more sense if Damdred was mafia to switch to him. There was the beginnings of a train on Damdred. The thing I worry about most with Damdred is the GB kill day 1. I could see a team with damdred/trf on it wanting GB dead. But I could see a team of Trf + two people who haven't played with geript and DP much wanting GB dead as well... The more posts I get from Dp and Geript, the more I think they are town. Unless they are both mafia, they are 100% sure each other is town too. I might park my ideas that they are town for a while, unless something crazy happens. I think the NK will help us get a better idea of what is going on. Honestly I've gotten more suspicious of you (Rsoultin) as the game has gone on. The problem is I can see the way you are acting being due to u as a person, which makes me hesitate on it. I could see you having this strong/long a filter with you as mafia though... Shining is probably the biggest question mark in my mind. Fair enough. I may just be OMGUSing Damdred. Lol, you're always suspicious of me when you have nowhere better to park your suspicion; it's okay. Wrong but okay. So you're in the rsoul hard-bussed trfel camp, too, hm? | ||
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On January 26 2015 02:54 jarjarbinks wrote: Ya idk your argument didn't really convince me of anything. You have quotes there, but idk if they are as implicating as you believe they are. I'll go double check. Please @.@. My argument is his quotes read like he already knew that LM would flip town before he flipped, even before he voted LM, and he was setting up his PoE to point fingers at players before the flip. It could be straight up OMGUS paranoia, which is why I need a sanity check. | ||
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On January 26 2015 03:15 jarjarbinks wrote: Sorry computer issues. Double check has me seeing confusion on the Damdred flip, but I didn't get the same end result as you did. It is weird to me that Damdred would flip and still say that LM is a good lynch when LM still had a ton of traction. I think that if he knew that LM would flip town, as soon as he flipped to Breshke he would have not said anything later about LM being a good lynch. I would think he would want it to look like he realized LM was town from DP's argument and switched on to someone else because of the argument so he's slightly cleared of suspicion when LM flips town. Actually the hard-bus trfel part of the whole rsoultin=mafia thing makes little sense to me. I don't see you taking such a big risk for no reason. The only reason why I felt you were suspicious was because some of your play has paralleled his (lol). It seemed to me like Trfel had already planned to defend me and get on LM. Like pretty much when the game started. He always defended me from the get go and went after LM. Before I thought that meant he was bussing LM, obviously that wasn't the case. You have done the same thing in this game. The reason why I didn't feel like it was worth bringing up is because I saw that you as a person would probably defend me in the game and that LM was a relatively easy guy to take for mafia until EOD yesterday. Your resistance to change EOD yesterday does follow Trfel's planned actions. It could be coincidence though, but I guess I am allowed to be suspicious lol Yeah, you're allowed, lol. Eh, in my paranoid world scum can make mistakes, and his saying that DP was town for being here at EoD presupposes the main wagon is town...before Damdred decided that Breshke was his lynch and not LM. A scum DP would want to be around to try to move the wagon off scum, so by saying him being here at EoD makes him town makes it seem like Damdred already knew how LM was going to flip. Is my logic flawed? I also can see getting an equal amount of flak from everyone in this game if I chose to switch to Bresh last minute and Bresh was also town. And then it would be LM and me Damdred was trying to push xP | ||
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On January 26 2015 03:37 jarjarbinks wrote: I could definitely see that. How does that statement presuppose that the main wagon is town? I missed that part. In your mind, You me bresh shining are all town. Is that still true? That would make dp or geript 1 mafia and damdred the other? Okay, so this is my thought process. Damdred and I are on LM. Damdred makes a comment that the simple fact that DP being in the thread at EoD makes him town 100%. - Possibility 1. LM is town. DP is therefore town because he is trying to move a lynch off a town. Scum wouldn't care enough to wake up early to stop a mislynch. - Possibility 2. LM is scum. DP is therefore either town believing LM is town and trying to stop a mislynch, or scum trying to save his scum buddy. Damdred then decides to switch to Breshke and says that both LM and Breshke are good lynches after his vote change. So, why is DP town 100% unless Damdred knew that LM was town? And if Damdred was so certain LM was town, why was he voting him? Why did he say both were good lynches later? ^ In my paranoid world, this makes it highly likely Damdred is scum, knew exactly how LM would flip, and set up his PoE to jam a Breshke lynch through. He's shown no interest in even considering other possibilities. As far as Shining and Bresh are concerned, I'm not sure. I thought they were town before and I don't see anything new since then to change that...do you find DP and geript's points as damning as they do on Bresh? Maybe I'm missing something. I guess it could be Shining as a scum partner. I don't think geript is scum either, I really don't. I don't see that battle between geript and Damdred Day 3 being easy to pull off as scum together. DP...I just really need to look at him closer. I never understood why he was townreading LM so early. It is very convenient for him that everyone aligned him with a scum LM and he's been by and large ignored as a potential scum partner for anyone else. I just need to approach him with an open mind, which is something I don't have regarding him right now >< | ||
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On January 26 2015 03:37 Damdred wrote: Most of the time Scum doesn't show to inconvenient deadlines. Your argument comes from what if lm flipped Scum it seems rather than flipping town. DP woke up when an lm lynch was basically 100% town cares that much. It's town favored, arguing otherwise is silly. It's like Euro players staying up to 4 am to help at deadline that's a town The point is not that your logic is wrong, Damdred. The point is that it was only right if LM was town, and you made your point while still on the LM lynch where you were supposedly scumreading him. You could say that at that point you thought LM was town and were just looking for a counterwagon, however you then later said that LM and Breshke were both good lynches. So if you had any doubt on the alignment of LM where he may be scum, DP being in the thread at EoD with LM as the main wagon was not alignment indicative. This looks like TMI to me in a very bad way. | ||
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On January 26 2015 04:01 jarjarbinks wrote: hmm ya I don't know. I think what happened here is that damdred pointed out an observation he has seen in the game that isn't 100% true and you not only called him out for it you also took it to the farthest conclusion. When I read that I'm thinking he's not basing that observation on the vote/flip of LM. Its more on the basic knowledge of scum vs town making deadlines. I could see myself as mafia waking up if I was pushing one of the wagons and wanted to see if it worked. I could also see myself as town doing the same thing if I thought I was right. That means I disagree with his statement in defining DP as town. It helps that I know I'm town and I know that Damdred isn't stupid, I'll admit -_- If Damdred is scum which I think is highly likely, then I am scared of the way thread sentiment is going regarding Breshke. | ||
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On January 26 2015 04:01 jarjarbinks wrote: hmm ya I don't know. I think what happened here is that damdred pointed out an observation he has seen in the game that isn't 100% true and you not only called him out for it you also took it to the farthest conclusion. When I read that I'm thinking he's not basing that observation on the vote/flip of LM. Its more on the basic knowledge of scum vs town making deadlines. I could see myself as mafia waking up if I was pushing one of the wagons and wanted to see if it worked. I could also see myself as town doing the same thing if I thought I was right. That means I disagree with his statement in defining DP as town. With a town Damdred this statement is 100% right, assuming he's...illogical. But Damdred is not a sicklucker. He is not a lightningstike or a glowingbear. Those three players I have learned to give leeway to if they don't make sense cause they do that sometimes as either alignment >< Damdred knows what he's doing enough to know that scum probably is not going to roll over if a scum partner is the main wagon. So as long as he still suspects LM, making that statement is illogical, irrational, and not like the Damdred I know. That he refuses to acknowledge that fairly simple fact makes me even more suspicious of him >< | ||
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On January 26 2015 04:19 geript wrote: This is going to sound like a really dumb reason to scumread someone, but Shining's not quoting anything for the most part. That's really curious because the last game he quoted a bunch of hsit. Probably explained by working on a tablet, which Damdred and I have already verified is true. I like that you're revisiting Shining, though. It's nice to see at least one other player not dead set on auto lynching tomorrow. | ||
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On January 26 2015 04:27 DarthPunk wrote: Yeah I'm in bed reading on my phone. It's 6:20 am. I have thought he was scum for ages. 1.) I have no idea how people can be strong tow re adding him (especially rso) 2.) the only good point that makes him town is a meta point and new players have unreliable meta. Hi, DP. Why especially me and not especially Damdred? ^^ What is the good point that makes him scum? I personally don't see why he isn't null to people unfamiliar with how he plays ^^ | ||
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On January 26 2015 04:33 rsoultin wrote: Think it's pretty obvious if you've been reading the thread DP. EBWOP: I'm actually not that opposed to a no-lynch, tbh, however I suspect JJB and geript would be the NKs. That said...more time to think about the thread can't hurt. Seriously doubt you're ever the NK DP. If not a no-lynch, I want to lynch Damdred. | ||
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On January 26 2015 04:35 DarthPunk wrote: I have been and it's not. Like you seem to be calling me scum but not actually doing so. You have been calling out damdred a lot also. Just say who you want to lynch no reason to play games. I'm not playing games. I've been obviously calling Damdred scum. I am willing to reconsider Shining, and I have my doubts about you. I am not calling you scum, but I am not calling you town, either. I think you're a viable scum partner for Damdred, but it doesn't matter pre-flip. | ||
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On January 26 2015 03:47 rsoultin wrote: Okay, so this is my thought process. Damdred and I are on LM. Damdred makes a comment that the simple fact that DP being in the thread at EoD makes him town 100%. - Possibility 1. LM is town. DP is therefore town because he is trying to move a lynch off a town. Scum wouldn't care enough to wake up early to stop a mislynch. - Possibility 2. LM is scum. DP is therefore either town believing LM is town and trying to stop a mislynch, or scum trying to save his scum buddy. Damdred then decides to switch to Breshke and says that both LM and Breshke are good lynches after his vote change. So, why is DP town 100% unless Damdred knew that LM was town? And if Damdred was so certain LM was town, why was he voting him? Why did he say both were good lynches later? ^ In my paranoid world, this makes it highly likely Damdred is scum, knew exactly how LM would flip, and set up his PoE to jam a Breshke lynch through. He's shown no interest in even considering other possibilities. As far as Shining and Bresh are concerned, I'm not sure. I thought they were town before and I don't see anything new since then to change that...do you find DP and geript's points as damning as they do on Bresh? Maybe I'm missing something. I guess it could be Shining as a scum partner. I don't think geript is scum either, I really don't. I don't see that battle between geript and Damdred Day 3 being easy to pull off as scum together. DP...I just really need to look at him closer. I never understood why he was townreading LM so early. It is very convenient for him that everyone aligned him with a scum LM and he's been by and large ignored as a potential scum partner for anyone else. I just need to approach him with an open mind, which is something I don't have regarding him right now >< Everything in one convenient post for you. Anything else? | ||
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On January 26 2015 04:39 DarthPunk wrote: Yeah cause I tried to get you all to lynch my scum buddy damdred over lurker LM yesterday. Honestly. I've already said I can't look at you objectively right now. Thoughts on Damdred? | ||
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On January 26 2015 04:41 rsoultin wrote: I've already said I can't look at you objectively right now. Thoughts on Damdred? EBWOP: Though come to think of it, since Damdred is obviously not going to vote for himself, we would still have lynched LM with no one else around at EoD. I'll look at your play later. | ||
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On January 26 2015 04:44 DarthPunk wrote: You say it's obvious that you called damdred scum but you prefaced that statement with "in my paranoid world" so I not sure why you think we should be taking that seriously. And you keep repeating you don't understand my LM read and I keep telling you why I read him that way and to please read my filter. And you don't and again state you don't get it. Maybe you don't want to get it. @geript rso looks worse as the game goes on what are your thoughts on a scum!rso? Your explanation doesn't make sense to me. I'm sorry. So repeating it ten times doesn't make it any more understandable. And yes, I'm admitting that I'm paranoid of him partially because of his insta-scum reaction directly after the flip. It was why I was trying to get JJB to sanity check me. That doesn't mean that I don't think Damdred is scum. It means I want a second opinion since we've clearly demonstrated already how I can be wrong. | ||
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On January 26 2015 04:47 DarthPunk wrote: Only cause you refused to switch off an obv mislynch... If I switched on to Damdred your first counter LM would still be lynched. I did not switch to Breshke from LM. I was wrong. I've admitted it. I don't know that Breshke was the right lynch, but LM definitely was the wrong one. | ||
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On January 26 2015 04:53 DarthPunk wrote: @jjb as you know rso best do you think she could have a filter like she does as scum? He already said he thinks I could. | ||
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On January 26 2015 04:58 DarthPunk wrote: Ok so in your mind. I am scum with damdred and try to lynch him instead of lurker LM because with my mystical powers of foresight, I know that : shining, breshe and jjb, who are all town in this world, are just gonna not show up for the flip? To me it seems like your logic is starting to break down. I think I've said a few times I'm not sure about you. That is not the same as saying you and Damdred are definitely a scum team. I've also said I'm not sure about Shining. | ||
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On January 26 2015 05:01 Damdred wrote: Meh shining wasn't on a tablet for all of last game though, which isn't a huge point but he had a comp for a lot of the quotes he did besides that meh. Here's the thing a better player than I told me that heuristic about waking up/staying up. Instead of attacking the idea, why didn't you instead attack it wasn't an unreasonable time? DP himself said it wasn't to bad? Can someone besides rs tell me his Scum team pair right now? Or the two likeliest people and why? I'm not attacking the idea; I'm saying it doesn't fit in with a suspicion that LM is scum, which is what you were demonstrably doing at the time you said that statement. I have no clue what Australian time is in relation to my time and frankly don't care that much. DP, who actually lives there, would obviously have a better idea of whether or not the timing was reasonable. | ||
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On January 26 2015 05:04 Damdred wrote: Wait when did you become unsure of shining? You were really sure of him before now rs? Even though you've attacked almost every person toad you haven't mentioned breshke almost at all why? I think you're scum. I know you're trying to push at least one town as scum. I don't think you're in it for the long game, bussing breshke for cred to ride out the game. I relooked at breshke last evening. If I'm wrong, I'm still wrong; I still don't see anything damning in his filter. Being wrong in and of itself does not make a person scum. I get what geript's saying, but I know I at least have been told many times as a newbie not to make pre-flip associations, so if that's he only reason to scumread breshke, I think it's pretty weak. I need to relook at shining. I don't really expect to see anything different, but that doesn't mean I shouldn't look when my reads are obviously off. You completely changed your read of me. It happens. | ||
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On January 26 2015 05:18 Damdred wrote: I actually think the push on trf is to sure and to aggressive. And the rest of the game rs is really passive and unsure about who Scum is. After catching tr you would think the opposite is true. Those first few posts just totally to sure to fast I know trfel. Trfel was pretty obvious as scum because as town he's a low post count, high content player who deliberately doesn't say his opinion on things until he has something "good" and well-thought out. I thought his opening was strange, especially with the bs reason for it, but his novel of null reads was what tipped the scales from suspicious to scum. I said that was the main thrust of my case against him at least once. Just as I know LS and JJB. Which is why I was strongest on those reads. | ||
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On January 26 2015 05:28 Damdred wrote: You chainsaw defended jarjar for no reason, like he was super scummy and got saved by his blue claim, LS was an ok read. The jarjar looks like tmi at that point when you defended him so hard. You hit trf out of the gates hard, hard fast and to sure when compared to the rest of your play. Interpret that how you like, Damdred. I already said those were the three I know best. Trfel, LS and I have played in every single game together since I started at the site. I know LS is an easy mislynch. I know Trfel knows it, too. Bad form on him to scum LS right off the bat. I know that Trfel doesn't do half-assed reads as town. And yes, I know my little brother. -_- Not sure why you find it unbelievable that I'd know my own brother well enough to get a tone read on him. I was suspicious of his opening, but his explanation was just him. As scum, I should be going after the low-hanging fruit or at least letting it play out (yeah, I know LM qualifies but I thought he was scum ><) not defending them. | ||
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Trfel wasn't going to get traction. That was already clear with how the night went. Didn't like the WW lynch, either, but...meh -_- GB and JJB were more townie so I did it to save them and hoped my WW read was wrong. | ||
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On January 26 2015 05:35 DarthPunk wrote: I'm pretty sure rso mentioned she has played scum before. Rso have you played scum before offsite? Yup, I have. Ask a lot of questions and just kind of sheep. I'm awkward at it. My scum team spent most of their time trying to figure out what to do if I was lynched or how to prevent it from happening, lol. | ||
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On January 26 2015 05:38 DarthPunk wrote: And you obviously believe she is capable of this much posting as mafia? Anyway. I'm really getting some more sleep now. Later. The forums aren't remotely comparable. We rarely get over 10 pages in a game over there. I don't know if I can be this active here. I suspect not, but without having played scum here I can't prove it one way or another. | ||
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On January 26 2015 05:44 Damdred wrote: I do, and she busses the most expendable person on the team at least that time. Not sure why rs moved off of tr I canteven remember her pushing it at eod. Or really pushedanything to save the towns just don't want to vote them Wtf. I never bussed anyone o.0. That is a straight-up lie, Damdred. They caught me cause of my votes...and, well, the thing with stepping in it with the blue role lol >< just didn't lynch me for god knows what reason. | ||
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There's our dinky game. Have at it. I'm not sure how helpful it is given how vastly different these communities are, but Damdred, Shining and I all played in it, Damdred and myself as scum. | ||
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On January 26 2015 06:08 Damdred wrote: I thought you Busd unreliable in that game. Anyway I wasn't even active just trying to remember it. Kinda convenient for you to misremember it in a way that makes it look like I buss as scum, but whatever. You can do that as town, too. I can't say that I never would, but it's not exactly the most brilliant move to hard-buss a scum mate for legitimate reasons that others in the game should also recognize, if they're familiar with trfel. | ||
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I can tell you guys why I did things, or thought things, and you can either except those reasons or reject them, but all I have is my filter. I've led multiple mislynches as town. I usually try to consolidate my vote at EoD. It's normal for me to be less aggressive when I'm less sure, but equally wrong as town. Y'all can read my town games if you want to try the meta thing. So if you have questions, please ask. | ||
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Damdred...I still really think his play right before the flip looked like TMI. He's being very obstinate about only seeing the game one way based on what I perceive to be flimsy reasons. After him, DP or Shining. I don't know if DP is right about the vote and stuff...will have to really look at it and what was possible to see if that argument holds. Shining I haven't filter-dived again yet. It's more who I think is likely with Damdred if DP doesn't make sense. | ||
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On January 26 2015 07:03 geript wrote: Honestly, I'm really torn on Damdred entirely. Like I think I just want to call him town and say fuck it, if he's mafia I'm just going to lynch him in every game he's in. geript, I posted about what looked like TMI to me. Am I high? Cause it makes sense to me, and I didn't find his play nearly as "townie" EoD Day 2 as others apparently did. He switched his read on Bresh so fast I almost got whiplash. | ||
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On January 26 2015 07:39 Damdred wrote: Geript, you won't ever have to lynch me. I'm actually trying to play now, jarjar was confirmed town and wasn't going along with the program. We shouldn't no lynch today. Wow. Now that's a townie thing to say, isn't it? Yay the guy who would interfere with your agenda is out of the way? What the hell does that comment even mean, Damdred? | ||
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On January 26 2015 08:44 Damdred wrote: Jarjar wasn't afking and doing nothing like he had been and pushed against a damdred mafia: ). Nice interpretation, Damdred, not to mention WIFOM since he was the only confirmed town in the game. Any more stories you'd like to tell? He didn't agree with the TMI thing, but neither does anyone else it seems -_- Maybe I'm out to lunch on that, but I don't think I am. Regardless, keeping geript around favors you and especially DP, if we're going to get into WIFOM. The way this goes pretty much depends on him the way things are shaking out. | ||
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On January 26 2015 09:22 Damdred wrote: Haha everyone else can mention nk but the pair of people I have as mafia jump on me. Pretty funny. ##vote Rasputin You really think I'm scum? If you're town, this is the most stupid I have ever seen you play in MYLO. What do you even have against me, Damdred? No, seriously. What is your case? I've yet to see one. | ||
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On January 26 2015 09:43 The Shining wrote: Geript, quoting is a pain in the ass on a tablet. I will only do it here if absolutely necessary, like in this post. Also, I was in that game when both RSo and Damdred were scum(I was a blue role) and I think JJB linked an old scum game of mine in the Newbie game. This isn't my first time saying this but I really think those are horrible examples of play. This is an entirely different atmosphere. I don't think I've tried a fraction as hard there as I have here, sadly. Breshke, OK well your paranoid world has come to life. LM was town. And now that your paranoid world has come to fruition, you drop DP. You ask him to agree on a no lynch after posting this: Once your mislynch went through, instead of following up your suspicion, you give soft BS reasoning for letting DP go. "Seemed genuinely happy"? He's a vet, I'm sure he can pretend to be happy in a text post. "Saw something you didn't"? Then go filter dive and look for what he saw, or ask him, or bring it up. You dropped this way too fast considering you bothered to mention it in a prior post. Looks to me like you're afraid of DP defending himself and proving you're scum and are trying to buy yourself another NK with the no lynch instead. Or worse, you're back tracking off of a scum partner that you never intended to push, anyway. Shining. Common sense. We mislynch today the game is over. There is no need for scum to try to get another NK. Also, read. Breshke has not dropped DP as suspicious. Third, if you let Damdred mislynch me I will be very annoyed with you. Very. Annoyed. (I know that's not scary, but since I think he's scum, I can't blame him for trying to win. Just dumb town for letting him.) Or have I been wrong about you all game and it really is you and Damdred? | ||
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##vote: Damdred | ||
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On January 26 2015 10:01 Damdred wrote: Here's the thing rs, I'll make a huge case when I get home with evidence and the like but I'll give you arsenal peek.1) Gameplay has been super uneven compared between early and later in the game. 2) made a case on trf really didn't push it around eod when everything was going down the drain. 3) Came out hard early was super sure of read replaced by momentary reads. 4) hasn't Scum hunted but only reacted to the thread. - And your gameplay hasn't been uneven? You barely play. Pot calling kettle. - I dropped it because I thought I might be tunneled and no one gave a shit what I thought. - I was super sure on Trfel. LS. JJB. Everyone else I don't know as well. I was sure enough on LM to stand my ground, wrong or right, when the safe play would have been to have folded. - Of course I've scumhunted. BS. And more BS. | ||
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On January 26 2015 10:06 Damdred wrote: If you are town rs why aren't you worried about bresh coming so hard alongside you? Let me put this to you very simply, Damdred, so that you can understand. I am town. I do not think you are town. In the event that you are town, I am still more sure that I am town than you are. Clear enough for you? | ||
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On January 26 2015 10:09 rsoultin wrote: Let me put this to you very simply, Damdred, so that you can understand. I am town. I do not think you are town. In the event that you are town, I am still more sure that I am town than you are. Clear enough for you? EBWOP: Okay. I will answer that question without sniping this time. I don't know 100% that breshke is town. Or shining is. Or even geript is. I know that how you behaved at EoD felt very wrong to me with the sudden switch to breshke, seemingly unprompted. The whole thing looks very orchestrated. It does look like you absolutely already knew what was going to happen with LM and left me there to take the fall...and I don't believe for a second that a town Damdred has absolutely no doubt with six people still left in the game as to who the scum are. If you are trying to push a breshke lynch, and I'm not seeing damning things in breshke's filter, the logical conclusion is that scummy-acting Damdred is trying to mislynch breshke. No, I don't like people calling me 100% town. Makes my skin itch. But you're not this dumb. You are not this dumb. And if you are this dumb, well, I guess I have to severely lower my expectations of you in the future. | ||
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On January 26 2015 10:22 Damdred wrote: You've asked all these questions. What is my Scum motivation to get off of lm at the end like that to lynch someone else when I already had a town lynch sewn up? The town cred, obviously. I'd already made it abundantly clear that I thought LM was scum and wasn't moving. | ||
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On January 26 2015 10:27 Breshke wrote: off a town lynch onto another town? Why havnt you looked at it AT ALL from me being town. I agree geript is town but I have most of the game i don't see what has made you flip your read. Im boring because im about to leave. It is absurd that we arnt no lynching They want to push the mislynch through. It's pretty obvious. | ||
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On January 26 2015 10:29 Damdred wrote: Town cred for what? What's the point of towncred in mylo when half the game is scumming me at least. Town cred for not being on a town mislynch. Are you really this obtuse? Why would I give a damn which "town" wagon was being mislynched as scum. I could have nailed your ass to the floor Day 2 if I was scum and you were town and no one would have cared. I could have nailed Shining when DP tried to push that. Or Breshke. As scum it wouldn't matter to me which scummy-looking townie got the shaft. You are not this bad, Damdred. | ||
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Day 3 not Day 2. | ||
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On January 26 2015 10:34 The Shining wrote: Bresh, I agree, I saw the same in looking at LM's EoD actions. I was just curious if one part of your paranoid world is real, why not question the possibilities of other parts? Mainly because I couldn't see what DP saw in LM, either. My reads haven't changed all that much. I'm almost as sure about you as I was about LM, which is why I'm listening to these other scum team theories. I was wrong once this game and could be wrong again, although I don't think I am. I was always going to suspect Damdred if LM flipped Town, I even mentioned that in my filter, but I don't see it possible for the two of you to be teammates. So either I'm wrong on you or wrong on him. The only other slight question mark I have is DP, because of the LM townread and you letting him go so easily. I actually haven't looked into interactions between you two yet but now I want to. I'll have to come back for that. RSo, there are 6 of us left. What I was getting at is if Breshke somehow does convince us all to no lynch, we still have 6. After Night 4, it'd be 5 with 2 scum. His reasoning looks good on the outside(get rid of a question mark) but it also allows another NK to get rid of our strongest Townie who could figure it all out. Also, why so snappy with me? I did read. Anything DP-related after that is "idk still paranoid as shit about DP." And that is it. this is a very important lynch for Town. I'm paranoid of basically all of you after my last Mylo experience. I just felt like Bresh set himself up to pursue that train of thought, not chalk it up to paranoia. If anything, Mylo is the best day for theories like that. At the risk of sounding conceited, Damdred and I would've played a much better game without towning each other and association if we both rolled scum together. He also was ready to lynch me as scum at one point over a misunderstood post alone. I doubt scum would do that to another scum without making sure it wasn't a misunderstandng beforehand. That's not to say I don't think he's scum because I've been on the fence about him basically all game. You are one of my strongest townreads but I'd like to see his case on you first, in case there really is something there I'm not seeing. Sorry. I'm irritated. I got screamed at by DP last night...again...and Damdred's frustrating me a ton. Did you read what I posted about TMI? Maybe I'm the only one who thinks that makes sense, but no one has told me how it hasn't, except JJB thought I was reading too much into it. Eh, I can see that, Shining, about the NK. I just think if they were concerned about getting rid of the player that could figure it all out, they would have gotten rid of him instead of JJB. Just keep blocking JJB. Yet they didn't. Which suggests to me that scum isn't concerned with being found out right now. geript, please think about that when you're deciding what to do >< | ||
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On January 26 2015 11:45 Damdred wrote: [/b][/b]I think RS is scum but i'm going to unvote for now just in case I change my mind and he gets hammered with people afk on him me. ##unvote You couldn't of nailed me d3 especially since the votes would of been tied and I wouldn't of voted to lynch myself. And you didn't have the votes to take out shining I think. So... you think Breshke looks scummy though even though you town read him? If I'd voted you first, yes, the tie would go to lynching you, and if you and I both voted shining, yes he would be lynched. Pointless conversation. No, I don't think Breshke looks scummy. You're taking my comments out of context. I said if i'm scum any scummy-looking townie, which is objectively anyone up for lynch who isn't scum, would do to secure the mislynch. | ||
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On January 26 2015 12:12 The Shining wrote: Also, RSo has Breshke as a town read but called Damdred, Breshke, myself scummy looking townies. If we're scummy looking, how do you know we're town? I know I'm picking at your wording but its kind of odd that you'd call us scummy looking, when you've been towning or nulling me and Bresh. I actually like that question, Damdred. Breshke 100% town read RSo and gets at Damdred for being sure, without any doubts, of Geript and DP being town. Hypocrisy. Damn, I really have to rethink my read on RSo now. This buddy buddy system is a lot weirder from you 2 than it is from Geript and DP, vets with a few games together. Its unsettling. Good lord this is a hypothetical situation -_- I said if I were scum, any scummy-looking townie would do. If I were scum and assuming one of you three were also scum, at least two would be scummy-looking townies. Please stop nitpicking what I'm saying | ||
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I don't know right now DP. Is it alright for me to not know? | ||
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That's why I'm resistant to a Breshke lynch, because I don't understand why Damdred would choose to buss him in MYLO. And I don't understand anyone who has absolutely no doubts about who scum is, like Damdred demonstrated. It is legitimately as simple as who looks scummier than who to me. | ||
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On January 26 2015 12:23 DarthPunk wrote: Well there are 5 players left not including yourself. You should kind of have an idea. Like just Through POE my solid townies I get you, Breshke, shining. It was Damdred's unvote. I think I fixed it now. Okay...I have to look at shining, again. But I didn't find a reason to scum him before and I don't remember seeing anything in particular to scum him since. As long as going back through his filter doesn't show me something I missed, he probably will still be a townread for me. I do have reasons to suspect you but I think your argument about you and Damdred not being a possible scumteam could hold merit. I need to think about it. Maybe both breshke and shining are scum, and my townreads are completely off, but that just...I know I've been wrong before but that would be so off-base...I still need to look into it. I don't think geript is scum. So I guess the best I can answer you DP is I have reasons to doubt my reads right now, cause I don't know how much sense they actually make. That's why I said I don't know. I could be OMGUSing Damdred and he's actually town, but I don't think so. I need some time to actually sit down and think about it all. | ||
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On January 26 2015 12:25 DarthPunk wrote: I do. You know, have a case. Like are you even reading the thread. You keep doing fucky shit like that and it is incredibly off putting. I didn't see it. Let me read it. | ||
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On January 26 2015 11:54 DarthPunk wrote: I want to lynch breshke today. The vote yesterday being so close and contested like that is far far far more likely to come from a town/scum wagon than two town wagons. If yesterday is town/town I don;t see mafia bothering to contest it. I don't see why scum!Damdred tries to shenanigan off Town!LM onto Town!breshe as scum. It doesn't make sense. I don;t care what bullshit Rso and Breshe try to sell you. Also this vote count is pretty fucking damning: On one side is confirmed town LM, Both my town reads and I. On the other side is scummy Breshe, scummy Shining, and Scummy/townie/??? Rso. along with slam lite WHO SAID HE PROBABLY WOULD HAVE SWITCHED WAGONS. The inertia for the lynch yesterday for no good reason. In response to increasingly townie contributions from LM is scum Driven. SCUM WANTED TO LYNCH LM and the only way they could do that and save face was to pretend to afk. Further the way he is hard buddying Rso since the lynch yesterday is fucking off. Like he hasn't buddied anyone like that in this game and now it is mylo he is pulling out all the stops. Damdred looks townie since yesterday, and Honestly I don't think geript is capable of this kind of a performance if he is scum. So if you are scum geript gg. We lose. I don't really buy all that shit with breshke's phone, he hasn't made any of the deadlines iirc and we are in the same timezone so obviously he doesn't care that much about the outcome of lynches. As lynches are the biggest tool for town that looks bad to me. I actually think breshke could be scum with Shining this game instead of Rso, POE has 2 out of those three and even though damdred says he believes Rso could scum with such a huge filter it is a difficult proposition to come to terms with honestly. I also hate that breshke is pushing so hard for a no lynch rather than trying to lynch his top scum read. (I'm not even sure who that is at the moment) ##Vote: Breshe Obviously I have to be flexible with my vote cause it's lylo townies need to consolidate but Breshe is the best lynch today. He is the most likely to flip scum. TOWNIES! Lynch breshke with me. or be called bad in post game. As for RSO it reminds me of last game when people were not scum reading mafia in Imperial because of filter size. I said basically the same thing in that game as I have been in this game and I should have learnt my lesson. IF THE ONLY REEDEMING THING ABOUT SOMEONE IS THEIR FILTER SIZE THEY COULD VERY WELL BE SCUM. ...I actually like your case. I guess the problem I have with it is I'm the reason that lynch didn't go through. I know that. I'm also not scum. So that assumes that my two townreads are scum. ##unvote Just let me think for a bit without all the yelling, please. That would help. | ||
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On January 26 2015 12:38 DarthPunk wrote: So basically you have no idea. And even the person you are pushing to lynch at mylo ITT you aren't sure about? Sigh. Last time I was sure I lynched a town, so it's probably better that I'm not, DP. | ||
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On January 26 2015 12:04 The Shining wrote: Like I said, I've been wrong before, could be wrong again. This is why I want to see Damdred's case on RSo before making my final call on him. He's a big fat question mark for me right now and I'm hoping his case will either shed light on something I'm not seeing in the scum team of Bresh/RSo, since you two are going at him unopposed, or give me a clearer scum case on him, because I've been toying with the idea of him playing me all game. RSo yeah I meant to loosely comment on that DP interaction, actually. Filter size isn't neccesarily alignment indicative and yet its been brought up that your filter size is questionable if you were a newbie scum player. It does seem like a hell of a lot but HTS was one of our biggest filters last game, flipped scum. I can't rule it out on filter size alone, especially since some of your filter is those interactions with Geript and DP that seemed to hit dead ends. I kind of agree with JJB, honestly. It was a good thing to catch, Damdred swapped off pretty fast, but you ran with that one as far as you could go. For me, its a question of why is Damdred under scrutiny for swapping off of one Town wagon to another, sort of similar to how Geript did D1. And you gave Geript a pass. It makes sense at first glance but in the full game context, its not as consistent as I've seen you be. I initially gave geript a pass and then started suspecting him again when he reacted to trfel's red-check. It's in my filter somewhere I'm sure. I don't find it impossible for scum to switch from one town wagon to another if it makes a player look bad to be on a wagon that flipped town. Like I don't 100% agree that only town would move off a town wagon, but DP was right that the vote was close. I'm not sure if it wasn't just because I'm obstinate and they were both town, though. | ||
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On January 26 2015 12:43 rsoultin wrote: ...I actually like your case. I guess the problem I have with it is I'm the reason that lynch didn't go through. I know that. I'm also not scum. So that assumes that my two townreads are scum. ##unvote Just let me think for a bit without all the yelling, please. That would help. ##vote: no-lynch I want the extra time to figure this out. It can't hurt. I don't actually think there are so few smart people here that we can't figure it out if another town is night-killed. DP, the case kind of makes sense, but it assumes either I'm mafia, which isn't true and no one has proven, or the players who were AFK were AFK because they were scum. It's just based on a lot of assumptions and not an actual scum case against a player. Town vs. town lynches can be close, too. I want to really dive the individual players rather than speculate on whether the number of people on each wagon had any bearing on the alignment of the players or not when I was the only one on LM in-thread. I'll post some analysis here tomorrow night after work. I think it would be good for all of us to do that on our scumreads and try to hash this thing out. | ||
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On January 26 2015 21:54 Breshke wrote: But no lynching and geript dieing means we don't lost to a world that like no one has considered Absolutely this. geript, I think you're town because you are actually considering the possibilities instead of trying to punch through a lynch. These poe lynches based on shaky heuristics make my skin crawl. With 72 extra hours to talk things through, people can actually look through my 21 pages and catch something if I'm scum, yeah? Why didn't mafia kill you over JJB? That question bugs me when they still have a roleblocker. I don't think there's a good NK for mafia. I think the best explanation for you still being alive today is you're predisposed to not scumread them, and if that's the case...any NK they could make would be bad for them. It's perhaps a little tinfoil, but with the people who came out so vehemently against a no-lynch, that makes me feel I'm not on completely the wrong track. I think you're defaulting to Shining because you don't know what else to do. I don't think that's a good reason. If you don't think it's Breshke or me, Shining has to have a scum mate, and it has to be one of the people you keep thinking are town. All I want is a chance to really get into everyone's filters and find scum instead of a last-minute scramble, and I don't think mafia can make any more NKs without giving us some form of information. I really think the no-lynch is the best play here. Also, um, yeah. There's no reason for me to not switch wagons as mafia unless you assume Breshke and I are mafia. But like, the only reason people have to assume that is because the wagons were close? It's just plain stupid. Show me how bresh is mafia, or how I am, beyond a close vote. Super bad play. | ||
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On January 26 2015 22:46 DarthPunk wrote: Neither of you post anything for hours and then you both post big posts within 30 minutes of each other and they are backing each other up. And you are in completely separate time-zones. How convenient for you both. Add this to poe and the vote was close. DP, how is breshke scum? How am I scum? Who but mafia benefits from trying to fast-track a vote without thinking it through? If you're town, please take the time to really consider what you're doing. None of your arguments are real arguments. Posting within 30 minutes of each other doesn't make anyone mafia. It's just before 8 a.m. my time and I work at 9. As simple as that. | ||
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@dp...i was right on ls, jjb and trfel, all of whome you were wrong on. also ww. so my methods arent completely worthless. upu need to demonstrate why someone is scum r ather than make assumptions on unflipped wagons and base your /entire/ analysis on that. some is fine, but not the entire thing. @geript...a no-lynch with this much uncertainty on everyones part is not terrible. id rather be relatively certain tham hand the game over to scum yolo guessing shining and bresh scumteam is sort of a cop out imo without actually determining why theyre scummy. its not good enough just to say that the team /could/ work | ||
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geript, answer me this: why are both you and DP still alive when mafia still has a roleblocker? I've got schoolwork to do, but then I'll come back. If you have questions, I'll answer them. Otherwise just keep commenting on how weird it is that I'd know my own brother and the two players I've played with in every game here well enough to get a good read on them, lol. | ||
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I know it's the wifom one. but it is kind of odd that he's been so overlooked. I townread him for EoD 1, and I know this is different from where I normally play with him, but I don't think he's actually pushed anyone at all this game...which, at least in the less active one, he does a lot. | ||
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On January 27 2015 10:04 geript wrote: A point against Rsoultin is how not casual she was at the start. That's different from Carol and NLX. I didn't have a reason to be? Why are you ignoring my first game, geript? lol I called bats and oats the most scummy thing in the thread and got into a pissing contest with them. It just depends on the game. | ||
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On January 27 2015 10:49 Breshke wrote: I wouldn't say this is entirely true. He has been pushing people but its really mostly been whoever the thread was on at the time (LM and myself come to mind) Yeah. I probably overstated it. But usually like people will push someone independently of others' thoughts on that player, and I'm not sure I've seen that from him this game. It's worth looking into for sure. | ||
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On January 27 2015 11:36 Damdred wrote: Also I ackwoledge this earlier, but I'm not sure RS can be scum with bresh. So idk about rs Why are you so sure it's bresh, Damdred? Could you be wrong about shining? Nothing scummy jumped out at me in particular about shining, but forgettable and skating by seem to be accurate enough descriptions when all the rest of us newbies keep coming under fire. | ||
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On January 27 2015 11:45 Damdred wrote: I'm not sure about anyone right now. Could be wrong about everything honestly Yeah, I'm in the same boat, but still working on school. Gonna dive shining here in a bit and see if I agree with geript's case enough to be willing to sheep it. The last point resonated, though. I think the one with you, LM and GB was kinda already explained. And I know people have mentioned over-explaining things as scum before, but I don't really know how to differentiate that when it's not obvious like trfel's was. His null reads were full paragraphs. | ||
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On January 27 2015 12:16 DarthPunk wrote: Cause: Geript is town and Damdred looks townie whenever he tries. Day one and Last lynch. I think the Vote yesterday was scum/town due to weird lynch inertia and the vote being so closely contested. You conveniently afk'd from two lynches and were there just before the lynch of LM before disappearing again as noted by geript. Rso - Shining whilst possible doesn't make as much sense due to the way Rso refused to swap her vote to you yesterday which, if she is scum and you are town is a completely arbitary decision. ALSO Your play changed weirdly at mylo. What he's actually saying is he thinks I'm scum, Breshke. I suppose we'll see why when he comes back with whatever he's looking for. | ||
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On January 27 2015 12:19 DarthPunk wrote: Rso are you back from work? Just finished my schoolwork for the night. What's up? | ||
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Uneven play. I've posted over 20% of the posts in this game. It would be stranger if it was perfectly even. My push on Trfel. Yeah, I did drop it, so I guess I can see your point there, but y'all were the ones calling it a terrible case, and only LM seemed even interested in it. Ironic how that plays out. I also do tunnel badly so I wanted to step back from it for a bit. The LM lynch was town, but it's not exactly alignment indicative for someone to stick to their guns. I can do that as either town who thinks they're right or mafia who just doesn't know what to do. If you're reading my old games, geript, it has to be pretty obvious that I'm an insanely stubborn player. And you don't know that breshke wasn't town so I'm not sure where you're getting this from anyway. JJB is my brother. I really don't know how else to say that. Maybe y'all aren't as close to family, or something, but yeah. I know the kid. He's not exactly the best liar in the world. I'm pretty sure I could tell if he was scum because it would be clear to me he didn't believe what he was saying. | ||
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On January 27 2015 12:21 DarthPunk wrote: What I am actually saying is exactly what I wrote. Don't tell people what I really mean. I mean what I say. There is no reason to do that as town. DP, you just told Breshke you thought he was scum because you didn't see how I could be scum with shining? Not really sure how else to interpret that. The plain and simple truth is, that unless you think breshke and shining were lurking in the wings and scum together when breshke was about to be lynched, in order for you to think that breshke is scum you have to think that I am. And the only think I've really seen you say about that is the lynch was too close to be town vs. town? Why? I could have switched to Damdred, Shining or Breshke but didn't. I'm the reason that vote was static. If you think it was contested by scum you have to think that I am scum. But that's circular reasoning; the vote is scum cause rso is scum and rso is scum because the vote is scum. What makes me actually scummy? | ||
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ask shining. he's good at catching me as scum | ||
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-waits on the damdred and dp cases against me- actually, I think i'll go do my dives if you're done with me, geript | ||
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On January 27 2015 13:06 DarthPunk wrote: They have to do with my read on you. Just go about your business. It seems kind of weird that your scumread would be dependent on what I get from my dives. Shouldn't you be able to tell I'm scum by now if I'm scum before those dives? You seemed pretty sure just a moment ago. | ||
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Can you show me the post that changed your mind from breshke and lm are both good lynches to you screaming to get on bresh? (I'm moving through the filter backwards) | ||
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geript brought up a point about Bresh's list excluding the obvious scum partner(s) of trfel and lm, specifically dp. Dp was in the null section with you, of course, but you said that it was possible he was the try-hard. why didn't you change your vote then? the phone dying comment from dp was when you changed your vote. did you think that argument was better or damning in some way? | ||
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On January 25 2015 02:41 Damdred wrote: Rsoultin doing POE this is where I am currently JarJar Rsoultin DP Shining/Breshke Geript LM If you had to pick two people I was most wrong about which two would it be? How did you get from this to everyone is town except bresh and rso? You were pretty heavily scumreading geript for awhile. I might buy that you believe DP being around at EoD is alignment-indicative (99%?) in and of itself, especially since you already had him as town, but the flip-flop with me and geript was pretty sudden. | ||
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On January 24 2015 06:08 Damdred wrote: Honestly the reason I never analyzed your post was because you called dp scum on it then buddies him later so I never bothered to read it. By pie you are scum. I'll answer the rest later, but still scum reading someone for changing stances is bs and you know it. Look how you react you are disconnected at points not even knowing that most of the reasons breshke brings up for lm that you call good have already been stated in thread? That's total lack of reading right there, yet its good then but bad ealier. and no this is different at times you make this huge effort to look towny when you need to be and then you go back into this idgaf mood where you do jack shit. Its more like Russian mafia than any of your town games shrug This is something that I noticed, too. I'll want to see if it's in geript's filter, where he changed his mind. I have to ask, though, why would that keep you from analyzing his post? geript, if you're here, can you explain when your nullish read on DP changed and why? | ||
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Will say this, though...the earlier part of Damdred's filter has me kind of doubting a Damdred/DP scumteam because of their interactions earlier. geript, what brought you to Damdred and DP as a team? They've aligned pretty well after flip, which I noticed, but I think you said you were going to read their filters? | ||
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On January 19 2015 06:07 Damdred wrote: Granted I've never seen dp as mafia so I can't compare what he's doing here. But he has follow up to questions does research on LS to find his meta and change his read. He woke up at God awful time just for deadline, I don't have to read someone a filter to town read then if I like their thread prwacense. Jarjar isn't really finding Scum and caught him in a lie about me voting GB when I never did. The slight Scum slip. And he's not really hinting so yea. Huh. You said that for the Day 1 lynch too? Hadn't noticed that before, Damdy. | ||
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On January 27 2015 14:00 geript wrote: Nah I think he's town. If I just happily waddled my way into his pocket free of charge, then that's my fault. I've reread his filter. There are a few alarm bells, but 95% of it is exactly how I remember him playing as town. I meant from early game in your first 1-2? analysis posts? | ||
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If you thought trfel was scum why would you want to lynch his top scum? I'm having trouble understanding this. | ||
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Why is your case dependent on my dives? Do you have one against me at all, or are you making it up? I think you may be making it up. | ||
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I also really could use the extra time. I should be going to bed but I have a lot of game still to go through. | ||
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On January 27 2015 14:42 DarthPunk wrote: Your reasoning and rationale for your no lynch was inconsistent. You said you would no lynch but actually wanted to lynch damdred. You said you wanted to no-lynch in case geript and I were scum together. You said you wanted to no lynch to have more time to dive filters and figure out the game. Then When I asked you why you wanted to no lynch you said it was because of me and geript. Which was bullshit because you had not once mentioned that as the reason. Not once. The main thing I was suspect of you over was the fact that you said you didn't want to lynch today because you wanted more time to figure out the game, and then you were not doing anything of the sort. You were not making cases and diving filters like you wanted to and which was your rationale //at one point// for a no lynch. But then when you said you were gonna be diving filters and solving the game your behaviour became more consistent with your stated desires. You then happily shit up the thread with geript and are basically still tunnelling damdred. So really I don;t see you doing the kind of things you said were the reasons you wanted more time that the no lynch would provide you with. Like your filter dive and case making came down to a few posts tunneling damdred some more, you are not trying to figure anything out past that point even though you argued at length that you wanted to no lynch for that reason. Anyway that is what my suspicions were over. I started with his filter to see if I was wrong, and it's not really tunneling when I'm asking him questions, now is it? I'm not actually finished, DP. His was just the first. I don't know if Damdred is the one I want to lynch today. I still want to check shining to see if I agree with geript's case. I still think one of you probably pocketed the other one, and I think you're the more likely culprit than geript, but that may change when I look at geript. I need to look at breshke again since so many people were scumming him. I'll have questions for you, too, I'm sure if you want to stand by. | ||
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On January 27 2015 14:43 DarthPunk wrote: I specifically asked you to tell me why you wanted to no lynch and you said something you had never ever mentioned previously and ignored all your previous reasoning entirely. And? They're not mutually exclusive. It certainly isn't going to win me any brownie points with you if I'm trying to manipulate you to say that I think you may be pocketing geript. | ||
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On January 27 2015 14:53 DarthPunk wrote: Did I say they were mutually exclusive. no I said your stated reasons were inconsistent. Like if someone asks you why you want to no lynch, why would you talk about something that you have never stated before and ignore everything else. Why would you not also include those reasons when specifically asked? Well because you are bullshitting your reasons for wanting the no lynch IMO. I don't actually see the advantage that scum has for a no-lynch. Maybe I'm just dumb, but I don't. It's true that regardless, one townie voting wrong is enough to screw the lynch, and that doesn't change with 6 or 5 players. You already knew why I wanted a no-lynch. Were you just hoping I'd answer differently so that you could say my answers weren't the same? | ||
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On January 27 2015 14:58 DarthPunk wrote: Anyway by now you should have figured out by now that if you are town and you think breshke is town that the rest of the townies are not gonna no lynch so you need to make sure you are all on the same wagon so scum can't influence the lynch. YET! You are sticking with some shitty and inconsistent reasoning for wanting to no lynch you aren't really pushing the wagon you want (damdred) to the rest of the townies that you 100% need to vote with you your scum team is not really defined. All you are certain of is that your buddy bresh is town and that you want to no lynch for a reason that is not genuine or consistent. Shush, child. I'm reading geript xP I may have to leave my conclusions in the morning and hope the rest of town doesn't shit the bed, but I'm going to try to do this right. Geeeeeeript. More a point of curiosity than anything: why do you do these psychological question thingies? You did it with both me and JJB, but the one you did with him seemed more on point. Kinda. | ||
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On January 27 2015 15:00 DarthPunk wrote: No. Take all the countless other weird things about you stated by myself and others. I am just adding to the general case against you in the thread. I do not need to list every scummy thing you have ever done over and over again. If you want to know, read the filter that you have claimed to have been wanting to read for the last two cycles. Regardless you're probably going to want to consolidate it just a little at least if you genuinely want to lynch me. Though I guess your vote is still on Breshke. Why not me? | ||
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On January 27 2015 05:46 geript wrote: I think I want to lynch Shining and here's why: 1. The JJB "catch"--One of the things that stuck out to me on D1 was the JJB "catch" regarding Doc/Cop setup. I really wish I had pressured him more over this. Like it's really not something that town tends to think of that much because for the most part, they really don't care. Can you explain this point? You said it earlier but I'm not sure how it's more likely to come from mafia than town? 2. Many of his posts are "over explainy"--Things just seemed to be hashed out in a longer, less effective way than they were in Newbie LX. Posts tend to be one long thought instead of separated but somewhat connected thoughts. Is this meta based on one game? 3. GB had a few decent points on him here: The second point I've been back and forth on. But I think it's reasonable accurate-ish. It is interesting to note that both Damdred and GB picked up on the "scumreads Damdred, GB and LM but votes for GB." Coming from a game where pretty much no mafia bussed, it's a pretty odd thought imo. There's paranoia, but Shining in my (short) experience is a pretty methodical player and that seems rather odd coming from him. Eh, I don't know. Most of these points were on something GB misunderstood... 4. I really like the point against him that he's quoting less. I know he says it's a pain and I completely sympathize with that as I often play from my phone and quoting from mobile is a real hassle especially when I want to quote multiple things. That said, for me it shows a level of caring and want to find the right lynch. It's something that, maybe incorrectly, I'm putting stock in, but I don't think it's something that should be ignored wholly. Nh. Could be alignment indicative but I don't know how strong it is. 5. This is to some extent wifomy, but in the immortal words of Teh Blazinghand the first of his name long shall he live and long may his shenanigans live in imfamy, "There's wine that's easier to drink and wine that's harder to drink." In this case, I find it to be the former. I think if Shining were town, when there was a slight push towards him near the EoD3 he would've been a much easier target than Breshke. Like if he's town, his lynch says little to nothing about Breshke/LM and town is likely to be wifom focused on them D4. Shining's pretty low impact this game and I think almost anyone could easily come up with reasons to head towards him easily. Except that for most of today and much of yesterday, few if any have really taken a hard look into him. Few care. For town, to some extent that can be normal. But he really feels like lynch bait and it's really odd to see lynch bait come up so infrequently if he's town. This I think is a very good point, actually. Probably the best one here and the main reason I'm reconsidering my read. I think it's odd that he hasn't been pushed much this game. ##vote The Shining I'll be around sporadically for the rest of the afternoon/evening. I'm going to look at rsoultin and DP next. Sidenote: I think I'm going to blame not lynching Damdred on GB. I'm just going to sheep his townread for now and blame him for it if it's wrong. If he's town though I totally got there on my own for better reasons because meta. | ||
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On January 27 2015 15:09 DarthPunk wrote: Cause there is no scum team without breshke in it. I still think Breshke - Shining is a possibility. I just seem to argue with you more because you are around and keep pushing my buttons. Mrt. Why is there no scum team without Breshke in it? I kind of think it would be weird for town to be pushing a Breshke lynch and the scum team of Breshke and Shining to just sit by and go whatever. It seems like the only way you can think Breshke is scum based solely on the vote is if you think I'm scum, too. What is your case against Breshke other than how close the vote was? | ||
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On January 27 2015 15:12 Breshke wrote: + Show Spoiler + On January 27 2015 05:46 geript wrote: I think I want to lynch Shining and here's why: 1. The JJB "catch"--One of the things that stuck out to me on D1 was the JJB "catch" regarding Doc/Cop setup. I really wish I had pressured him more over this. Like it's really not something that town tends to think of that much because for the most part, they really don't care. 2. Many of his posts are "over explainy"--Things just seemed to be hashed out in a longer, less effective way than they were in Newbie LX. Posts tend to be one long thought instead of separated but somewhat connected thoughts. 3. GB had a few decent points on him here: The second point I've been back and forth on. But I think it's reasonable accurate-ish. It is interesting to note that both Damdred and GB picked up on the "scumreads Damdred, GB and LM but votes for GB." Coming from a game where pretty much no mafia bussed, it's a pretty odd thought imo. There's paranoia, but Shining in my (short) experience is a pretty methodical player and that seems rather odd coming from him. 4. I really like the point against him that he's quoting less. I know he says it's a pain and I completely sympathize with that as I often play from my phone and quoting from mobile is a real hassle especially when I want to quote multiple things. That said, for me it shows a level of caring and want to find the right lynch. It's something that, maybe incorrectly, I'm putting stock in, but I don't think it's something that should be ignored wholly. 5. This is to some extent wifomy, but in the immortal words of Teh Blazinghand the first of his name long shall he live and long may his shenanigans live in imfamy, "There's wine that's easier to drink and wine that's harder to drink." In this case, I find it to be the former. I think if Shining were town, when there was a slight push towards him near the EoD3 he would've been a much easier target than Breshke. Like if he's town, his lynch says little to nothing about Breshke/LM and town is likely to be wifom focused on them D4. Shining's pretty low impact this game and I think almost anyone could easily come up with reasons to head towards him easily. Except that for most of today and much of yesterday, few if any have really taken a hard look into him. Few care. For town, to some extent that can be normal. But he really feels like lynch bait and it's really odd to see lynch bait come up so infrequently if he's town. ##vote The Shining I'll be around sporadically for the rest of the afternoon/evening. I'm going to look at rsoultin and DP next. Sidenote: I think I'm going to blame not lynching Damdred on GB. I'm just going to sheep his townread for now and blame him for it if it's wrong. If he's town though I totally got there on my own for better reasons because meta. Point one is meh to me as i think it honestly is different for every player and how much they think about the setup and rely on roles coming out etc. I like point two and three and dislike point 4. Five is what really sold it for me though because i think it says a lot. I don't get damdreds townread on the shining and damdred decided to vote me when DP was trying to get another wagon to get traction and the shining was considered as an option. Without specifically looking in his filter can you explain damdreds town read on the shining for me RSo because i don't know if it is just me or not. Not really. He's basing it on meta. I didn't see anything that jumped out at me as scummy per se when I went through his filter for Day 3. The reasoning I didn't always agree with but I could follow his train of thought? I don't know if Damdred's meta read should apply so strongly between a forum with 10 page games and a forum like this, though. The strength of his surety is a bit weird. | ||
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Some of the interaction between Damdred and DP around page 7ish (I think) of Damdred's filter makes me question that. Like the back and forth about Damdred not reading DPs filter, though I don't think that was pursued very far, and Damdred saying DP's townread on LM was weak. I don't really see anywhere else that they've engaged with each other much, though. And DP kinda just rides as town without much explanation on Damdred's part. I'll have a more solid opinion on them when I get to DP's filter. I'm reading geript right now, working my way up the list. Obviously they've been aligning their reads today. | ||
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am I missing something? the phone thing seems like a very strange tipping point, but both you and damdred chose to jump on that. | ||
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On January 27 2015 15:39 geript wrote: If Damdred/DP are town, it makes 0 sense for Breshke to not be in a mafia team. Like if he's town in that situation too, you as mafia don't give a fuck to vote for LM or Breshke. Breshke is even heavily preferential because LM is still exceptionally wifomable. If Damdred/DP are town, I'd have to agree with you. That makes me and Bresh scum or both scum AFK. Unless you're scum, but I'm not really hating your filter right now, other than a few odd points here and there. Haven't finished it though. What was so compelling about the phone? | ||
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On January 25 2015 06:50 geript wrote: Fuck it. I really don't want to care about this but it is weird. I'm going to feel really extra stupid and lazy if Breshke flips town though. ##unvote ##vote Breshke You made your points about Breshke before this...but this tipped the scales? | ||
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On January 21 2015 09:08 geript wrote: Like JJB literally just was 100% wrong. Damdred never really heavily pushed JJB. He procrastinates on reading him for like half the day then lackadaisically tells people to vote for him. Like there's never even a good reason for Damdred to even say the shit he is other than his flipfloppery on GB (town-mafia-town). Plus JJB is literally claiming mafia with Damdred. Idk. I'll think about this more but I can't fathom a reason JJB says anything like that as town. In the least, we lynch Trfel and have more time to think about it. ##vote Trfel That's interesting. Why you said that and came to the conclusion that it seemed more scummy on JJB's part than Damdred's is weird, though. Course...my brother makes really strange comments sometimes. | ||
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On January 27 2015 15:54 geript wrote: Reading his filter and past games filters and doing an 8 game meta on him at least half of which were games I've played in. And...why do you think he's town? You already explained Breshke's meta points. | ||
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On January 27 2015 16:09 geript wrote: Damdred? Because his mafia games and town games are actually somewhat different. He has better points as town generally, and as mafia he's kinda wtf ever. He's a bit more passive and as soon as mafia is thrown on me he's all over it and pushes it to hell because he knows that he does that as town all the time. It's lots of little random stuff. But if he's mafia, I'm pretty sure I found a really, really random way to read him. He used mostly my points when he was scumming you. I don't know if you noticed. | ||
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DP...if I say "I'm not interested in moving off my top scumread when he's set for lynch" why the shenannies? | ||
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On January 27 2015 16:29 geript wrote: Yah, initially I was really unsure where to put DP. Because it was either a really bad potentially scumbuddy partner he's townreading or he really believes it. Like, I just don't really see a world where only 1 of DP/Damdred is mafia. Maybe possible, but like the only situation it could be would be with Shining. But that's pretty piss poor. Plus like not killing me, not really ever being in any way remotely close to considering me as mafia. Like some of the eod switches are a bit odd, but he's literally done that a bunch as town. Like the last game when people really wanted to lynch me he literally told them to go fuck themselves and called them bad for lynching me on D2. Like ever since we became butt buddies on VS (after the OMGUS game) we've found ways to read each other right. Plus, like he's realized that while I'm not always right I do make some really good reads pretty consistently. Plus, honestly, like me pushing on Breshke was more on him. So there's that. Yeah, your filter wasn't bad. The two lists thing was weird. The reaction to the red-check, but you did say you were sick I guess. A couple other things, like the breshke lynch on the phone point. I think it's strange you don't really doubt DP much but then, y'all think it's strange I can scumread Trfel so quickly, and townread my "slam-lite" brother. Speaking of Breshke. Rereading his filter. Most of it is from today. Don't know if that means anything. He did buddy up to me pretty good, but the only way I can see a Breshke/Shining scumteam is if they both went yolo and AFKd it and didn't realize Bresh was in trouble. Seems...unlikely. I know it's not as easy to see from my perspective because I could be the most profilically posting newbie scum evar, but if it's not bresh and me, not bresh and shining, and i'm not really seeing any big reasons to think you're scum, either...it's shining and one of your townreads or Damdred and DP together. Bresh made an interesting point about you not going for the easy lynches back when JJB was scumming you. Damdred has scumread some harder people to lynch. Trfel at the time (well I know it), you, me...but when it comes right down to it he's only been pursuing the easy ones. LM. JJB. Breshke when Breshke is AFK. | ||
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On January 27 2015 16:38 DarthPunk wrote: There are other people in this game and I didn't want you to lynch a town read of mine. Like do you think just because you decided that is what's gonna happen? lol. I think when there are noticeably not enough people actively in the thread to change the outcome unless I change my mind -shrugs- I mean, the results of the lynch speak for themselves. Unless one of the AFKers returned. | ||
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Why of all things in the entire game when you first came in did you pick out me pushing Trfel? It's not so much that you shouldn't have cause it was very noticeable, but you didn't actually comment on or notice anything else until you came back a great while later. | ||
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On January 27 2015 16:55 geript wrote: Like I really don't get why anybody didn't expect a CC from somewhere there. Like mafia have to be really bad or have no balls to not CC something on D2. Like it's really, really trash play generally there. Like I can't see DP not yolo claiming there to get like JJB lynched or something. IDK if Damdred would but meh. This argument I've never really understood from you. Semi-open, maybe, but 2 power roles is 2 power roles. A CC just as a cop comes out with a red check...I mean if town is logical they still lynch the red check. I know JJB is an insanely easy mislynch cause he's a jokester and I don't think he actually connects his thoughts when he posts...but if the red check goes through... Then I at least would be wondering why a player chose that moment to come out with their claim. To cast suspicion on the red check? At best they get JJB mislynched first, but that's a guaranteed second scum Day 4. I personally don't see how it would be worth the risk. | ||
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I was actually expecting a CC, tbh. And was prepared to be highly skeptical of it, too, however logically I can see why scum would choose not to with a real cop and a real red check, they were already losing one scum for sure. | ||
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His posts are painful though, especially this late at night -_- | ||
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On January 27 2015 17:13 geript wrote: ##unvote ##vote breshke What makes you scumread breshke, geript? | ||
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On January 27 2015 17:14 DarthPunk wrote: So you don;t understand why geript said he didn;t understand why nobody cc'd and you don;t get that but you also expected a CC? Anyway geript you need to lynch breshke with me or explain to me who is in scumteam without breshke and how. I don't want a last minute wagon that would be retarded. at mylo. It's less that I don't understand why he expected a CC at the time, and more that I don't understand why he finds it significant looking back on it. In retrospect it seems like a bad play. | ||
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On January 25 2015 08:35 The Shining wrote: FFS this is bs. OK I'm sorry if my posts look constructed and formatted, it is my style of typing. I tried my hardest to get here before EoD but I'm at work with only tablet capability. I'm sick of giving excuses for myself but this is my life right now and I'm sorry. EoD is 5 pm for me, 4-6 are my busiest hours. I was typing up a post before this one half hour before EoD responding to LM and Breshke wanting my read on DP. Here it is. "LM, Breshke - My townread on DarthPunk is not strong. It is a lean. As someone put it earlier, his early filter was Trfel centric which was a red question mark for me but everything since then has seemed pretty Townie. He wanted to lynch LS and did his own past game diving to evolve his read into a town read, which I agreed with because LS felt to me how he felt in the newbie game. There is also a ton of direct questioning from DP, as well as what seems like genuine effort to solve the game. I do see it possible for scum to question and "solve" the game, too, but going head to head with my pretty strong townread in RSo seems like suicide IMO." After today, I have to look into what Damdred said about DP not being the type to associate himself so closely by defending scum LM. LM flipped Town so did DP trust his town read or was it vying to buy town credit? I got busy as hell at work as I was typing what is in the quotations and couldn't finish anything or get back on until now. Now I'm logged into what feels like a shiteshow. I was wrong on LM and I swore he was scum. I'm actually really upset about this because his EoD reminded me of me when I had to defend myself last game out of a mislynch. It would've given me enough pause to think about moving wagons, honestly. Breshke not being here is about as damning as me not being here EoD, yes, but the phone excuse he brought up seems to be really weak. Also, current discussion on Breshke. In his filter, he blatantly started he had DP as townread D1 and had to rethink it. Null on DP for a while, asks someone for their thoughts on DP. Throws this out there. Implies DP is scummy now. Afterward, he questions DP's townread on LM. By that logic, you're implying DP is scum and wants to align himself with LM because he knows LM will flip town and you also imply Town thinks the only way we scum DP is if LM is scum with him since he defended him so this would exonerate DP. If you believe your own logic, why did you still case and push LM so hard? | ||
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@DP He's been waffling. It's a legitimate question. You like attacking me. Hi again. | ||
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On January 27 2015 17:27 Breshke wrote: Are you asking me to respond to that RSo? Bresh, you said you had it down to three. If you had to choose two right now, who? | ||
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Damdred is almost just as bad. He's been flat-out certain about you from the get-go, and only changed on me later, but you and Shining...I really just don't see you guys trusting me not to change my mind. I know I'm stubborn but I can't be mind-controlled from a scum QT lol. I've done a few shenannies of my own in my very short TL career. | ||
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Then you vote Breshke based on a vote that must be scum vs. town just because it was close. You must just really like fighting with me, DP, if you've got Bresh as your top scumread but can't stop picking at me who you keep waffling on. | ||
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On January 27 2015 18:05 geript wrote: I will case you And you I might believe actually believed what you were casing. Go ahead. | ||
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Though I suspect it has more to do with your unwillingness to think DP and Damdred might be a scumteam than thinking Bresh is legitimately scummy, I'd still like to see it. | ||
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I see you calling Damdred scummy throughout your filter for this or the other while he generally ignores you, which is kinda strange imo...but now you're certain he's town over a town mislynch? | ||
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On January 27 2015 18:14 DarthPunk wrote: The way he acted yesterday doesn't make sense from a scum perspective at all. No? Okay...he was the counterwagon. Granted, this isn't alignment indicative at all, but that's kind of the point. If he's the counterwagon wouldn't he have a very good, selfish reason to support shenanigans onto another player? | ||
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Managed to scumread him. I'm getting tired -_- | ||
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...So, rather than considering the possibility that you could be wrong, which you just yelled at me for, you're going to ignore the simple logic that it's to the benefit of a player to shenanigan onto a player not them regardless of alignment and say he's definitely town. Despite the entire rest of he game? Lol, and people call me stubborn. | ||
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His voting and just disappearing does not exactly instill me with confidence. I'm willing to lynch Shining if Damdred can help me make sense of some of those things, cause Shining doesn't seem to give a shit either, and if town doesn't give a shit we're screwed anyway. But I do think Damdred's the lynch here. I just don't see a Breshke/Shining scumteam unless they both just got overconfident and decided not to come play at EoD. Possible I guess, but it doesn't seem likely. | ||
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And you, DP, if you're town...you're right, stylistically I am not a fan of your play. I'm also not a fan of being yelled at constantly by you xP Bastard. This is a student game, after all. My brother was happy to be killed cause y'all aren't very newbie friendly. Just sayin. | ||
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On January 27 2015 18:32 DarthPunk wrote: After we lynch breshke I will take a hard look at shining and Rso. Shining getting modkilled would actually be really really good for us. Unless he's town? Then that would be...like...bad? xP | ||
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Lol I'm actually fine with you, tbh, even if I don't approve of your play. Maybe if I play with you more I'll see were the arrogance comes from and it might actually be justified. Gnite. | ||
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On January 27 2015 18:36 DarthPunk wrote: No because then we can't mislynch him and then I would insta lynch you. -_- You do realize if he gets modkilled as town the game is over, right? Or if you lynch me at all. -beats with a wet noodle- | ||
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And I'm still thinking he's not. Fair enough. (You'd still lose though. Joke's on you.) | ||
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On January 27 2015 18:58 geript wrote: Like one thing I don't really get is why you're voting no lynch. Like if you're town and you think Shining is town (and about to be modkilled), voting no lynch only loses a winnable game. Like it's lylo. You're talking. DP's talking. Damdred's talking... kinda. Breshke's said a bit of stuff. Shining very little. Like IF Damdy/DP is a team, yah I had bad reads on them, but the approach taken at MYLO is super odd for both you and Breshke. No lynch means a town modkill is gg. No lynch gives you less room to win the game. No lynch literally only removes my ability to talk. Like I've talked today to death. Also DP if you are mafia, one thing I would say is chill on the "stay the course" talk you gave me at the start of the day. It really caught me off guard. But idk how you would approach me there as town. Frankly, I'm not planning on keeping it at a no-lynch, but I wanted to give Damdred a chance to clear up my questions about him >< | ||
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On January 27 2015 19:04 Breshke wrote: RSo i was thinking it was damdred and shining so that would mean DP would be the town of the three. DP keeps calling me mafia for bad reasons that are especially bad since im town and i havn't really seen him consider otherwise. So that makes me think it is probably DP/damdred or maybe DP/shining. I wish shining was around at EoD because i probably would have been dead and LM could have probably convinced people today. ##Unvote ##Vote: DP I think DP's reasoning is pretty blah and weak, too, frankly. But I don't know him from Adam. Maybe he always is this way. I know that Damdred usually doesn't just run around blindly. Maybe he can't be assed, but... | ||
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Then the whole Damdred must be town because...he shenaniganed onto a lynch that removes him as a counterwagon? I mean, that's just a silly reason to townread someone. Then of course Damdred's DP is town because he woke up in the morning. And his sudden townread on geript. I don't get either of those. Nor why he's hard-towning shining. Like, I think shining is likely to be town, too, but I don't know how anyone can be that sure, especially with his complete lack of presence here at MYLO. | ||
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On January 27 2015 19:35 DarthPunk wrote: Right... so all that shit you said about a no lynch was all bullshit. Obviously we're not no-lynching today. Maybe if I striptease. I'm not a complete moron, DP. No on wants the no-lynch so why would I sit there in the corner picking my nose going oh nooooes I hope you guys get it riiiight. | ||
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On January 27 2015 19:41 DarthPunk wrote: When I said literally that you argued with me about it -_- There was still a chance of convincing people at the time. There isn't now. Watch out, I may start calling you dense xP But at least I won't yell. | ||
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At any rate, the point Bresh is I don't think I want to vote DP today. I'd rather vote Damdred or Shining, and I'm leaning toward Damdred the longer he stays away from the thread. | ||
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-puts a muzzle on the troll- Nah, I dunnae, I just don't see this lynch being town-favored unless I'm dead wrong about half my reads. I mean, the people assuming Damdred and Shining are town...well that just sucks cause they're not even here. | ||
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I really need to get some sleep. But, things as they stand, probably Damdred for me unless he suddenly looks super towny in the morning. | ||
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On January 27 2015 19:38 DarthPunk wrote: It's not weak I just have different reads to you. If you saw the game the way I saw it it would be obvious. Lol, you say I'm scum and then you say this. That makes no sense xP | ||
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For his unexplained read changes @ EoD before the flip, based on things like time of day it was and...who the hell knows with geript. For the LM vote based on nothing and the JJB vote based on reading his filter (with no further explanation) when the only player he was really applying pressure to (apart from cool) was Trfel. For his determination to blindly push through a lynch based on pre-determined poe (before the flip of a player he was still at least partially scumreading until 2 minutes before the lynch) without bothering to think through the thread. For his general disinterest afterwards. And probably half-a-dozen other things in the questions I started asking him while he was still in thread that he couldn't be assed to answer. ##vote: Damdred Physical therapy, so I can check in maybe twice today if something changes and Damdred bleeds green. | ||
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Probably should unvote first if I want it to count. ##unvote ##vote: Damdred | ||
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On January 27 2015 18:58 geript wrote: Like one thing I don't really get is why you're voting no lynch. Like if you're town and you think Shining is town (and about to be modkilled), voting no lynch only loses a winnable game. Like it's lylo. You're talking. DP's talking. Damdred's talking... kinda. Breshke's said a bit of stuff. Shining very little. Like IF Damdy/DP is a team, yah I had bad reads on them, but the approach taken at MYLO is super odd for both you and Breshke. No lynch means a town modkill is gg. No lynch gives you less room to win the game. No lynch literally only removes my ability to talk. Like I've talked today to death. Also DP if you are mafia, one thing I would say is chill on the "stay the course" talk you gave me at the start of the day. It really caught me off guard. But idk how you would approach me there as town. Dude, why does he have to do anything when you'll townread him for it anyway? lol If what's holding you back on Damdred is DP...take a look at DPs play today and his reasons for things. What has he really been doing since the lynch except posting BS cases based on assumptions on unflipped players and sniping at me from the sidelines whenever he sees an opening? Do his reads really make that much sense to you? If what's holding you back on Damdred is Damdred, gonna be frank here, I do not understand. | ||
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You were probably the only universal town read aside from JJB Night 3. You said it makes sense not to NK you to deny information...but what information would scum be denying on a universal town read? Consider that. | ||
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On January 28 2015 01:02 Damdred wrote: So Geript, Breshke and RSoultin... Geript/ RS Geript/ Breshke Breshke/Geript- This is the least likely pairing I think as geript would of just went into mylo. I hate looking at geript because of a shit storm that would break out again, but I have to cover my bases and think everything out. And him wanting to kill shining and then sheeping onto Breshke bothers me still a bit, gotta think all of this through. ... Two of your scumteams are the same, and Breshke pretty much 99x out of 100 unless his scummate just hates his guts cannot be mafia with anyone but me if you're townreading Shining. What mafia team in their right mind is going to buss with no chance of making a save if a town Rso suddenly goes OMG! Bresh is totes scum and LM is town, ise sorry LM! and switches to Bresh? The Geript/RS pairing is literally the only one of those that even works. And you didn't mention DP. Again. Like, legitimately, if you think Breshke is scum you have to think either Shining or myself is scum with him. | ||
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On January 28 2015 00:51 The Shining wrote: I live in NYC. =l It's a shit excuse but I got snowed in at my mom's last night, wasn't able to get back home into the city until this morning. But I AM here and will still be here at EoD. I have a lot to catch up on, though, so give me a little bit. ##Vote: Breshke I'm still trusting my read on him. Unless I see something in the last few pages that scream town on me, I'm convinced I'm right on him. Geript, what did you see that made you switch to scum on Breshke? Maybe I haven't seen it yet but it might help me see things clearer. Anyone want to talk about anything? Should be able to answer once I catch up to current pages. Do you disagree that there is any viable scum team with breshke that isn't either me or you? If you are voting Breshke right now you are calling us both scum, as far as I can tell. Do you think I'm scum? Do you wonder at all about Damdred's strong-towning you? | ||
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On January 28 2015 02:42 Damdred wrote: We had at least three afk townies on LM that day though, which doesn't help or hinder the theory. Shining was no where to be see neither was JarJar and you didn't want to move so maybe its not such a stretch to think that the lynch would never go through. I am definitely obstinate. But so obstinate scum is willing to risk that chance? I find that doubtful. It's not like I've never changed my mind at EoD. | ||
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On January 28 2015 02:42 Damdred wrote: We had at least three afk townies on LM that day though, which doesn't help or hinder the theory. Shining was no where to be see neither was JarJar and you didn't want to move so maybe its not such a stretch to think that the lynch would never go through. I don't believe in scum slips, but if they existed, this would be one -_- Breshke, JJB, Shining how do geript and I make sense as a scum team? and why would you be voting bresh if he clinched that vote and you thought this? | ||
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townies, please look at damdred and dp. damdred is now flipping his read on geript all of a sudden yet again but with lousy reasoning if i'm wrong on you, damdred, i'm sorry but you've been playing a shit-ass game and take it as a compliment that I think you're way better than this brain cells shining please use them -_- | ||
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like i agree that you coming off bresh makes it harder to believe youre scum. its my one reservation right now. but woth three on bresh and if youre scum with either dp or shining and can get a wagon started on a town geript you can secure a mislynch while moving off bresh. there are 4 town to frame after all and you and dp arent providing cases in particular consider lynching dp or shining and i might believe youre town. make a real case | ||
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anyway...i have to get back to work goobers ^^ sorry lm :-/ town was so getting lynched day 3 ick | ||
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On January 28 2015 07:19 LoneMeow wrote: rsoultin, sorry about the yelling. I was "kind of" frustrated since it seemed like you were not even bothering to read what I was posting and I was almost certain you were actually town and not intentionally pushing mislynch. no worries lm i dont take offense at yelling despite my growls at dp. frustration is perfectly fine lol i deserved that | ||
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On January 28 2015 07:20 DarthPunk wrote: Anyway that was a hard game. GG all. I may nominate Rso for impressive newbie performance. I feel bad for everything I put her through. And I will totally do it again. Also I lied I don;t feel bad at all :D lol a nice gesture but getting lynched is hardly impressive. i need to stop brain dumping into the thread | ||
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On January 28 2015 07:28 Breshke wrote: LM i think you started actually looking townie towards the end I should have been around for the lynch. Rso i actually feel really bad like my bad play got latched onto you because we both town'd each other haha nah bresh we got played and the shining vote especially shoulda made it obv but i didnt have the time to work it out before leaving | ||
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On January 28 2015 09:51 DarthPunk wrote: I just wanna point out to the obs qt heroes that although I definitely made mistakes. I am insanely hard to lynch. And intimidating in the thread. I am pretty sure Rso would have called me mafia for days in the obs qt, but in the game she was too timid and second guessed herself and I think a large part of that is because lynching me is fucking hard and intimidating. That is just my personal rationale behind it. Like Rso called me out for various things correctly since day 2. Eh, I woulda gone for you for sure, but I knew that was why geript was still alive. It was...insanely...obvious...when he was not the NK. I was not at all lying about why I wanted a NL lol. | ||
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like, that was the part that threw me off the most about him | ||
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On January 28 2015 07:08 geript wrote: Rsoultin's issue literally was imo not reading/thinking. Like I explained 4-5-6-7 different things 4-5-6 different times and it never took. Like how Trfel could be mafia and not a good D1 lynch. Also, FWIW, I don't like the Trfel check. I think that there were many other better checks at that point and Trfel was easily catchable. Next, don't fucking claim a check with the first post in a day. It literally makes the day like 90% worthless. My interest was that he was the exception to the rule. Only mafia who wasn't a good lynch in your book. You kept saying you found reasons to read him both ways...which to me translates as null, not scum, so just drop him into the no-lynches. I think the biggest problem is sometimes I don't articulate what I'm really trying to say correctly, so keep asking when the answer shows the question wasn't understood >< | ||
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He was the first I looked at and the first I cleared, cause he was the hangover on the JJB lynch :/ Lol @ HTS...I literally had no time to read the thread since I left and still haven't. I thought I wouldn't be there for flip at all. I just said Damdred cause Bresh was town lol. I'll admit though I did doubt a little when he came back to the thread but it was just too little too late and I have to actually you know...go to work lol :/ | ||
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Though frankly the weirdest thing to me was the DP/geript brofest...so couple that with a trfel scum and yeah -_- paranoia running rampant. I almost 100% know he's scum and you have him as the scum to not lynch. You can see where I'm going with this, right? lol | ||
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I don't think in words and it translates oddly sometimes :/ | ||
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and I think geript could have been persuaded on Day 2, with 20/20 hindsight | ||
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On January 28 2015 11:11 Damdred wrote: That ws what caused me to play so horrible LS. CoolTLname sent me a pm that basically out'd his alignment a bit. And I asked BH to replace me so that tlname could continue playing but BH mod killed him instead and it just put me in a funk o.0 I can completely understand that :/ | ||
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legitimately that was the reason I was fine calling you town at the end i'm paranoid. I thought you were scumreading trfel, then finding an excuse not to lynch him, so that when if he flipped scum you could point back to it and say, see? but really that was so paranoid I probably shouldn't even have brought it up, in retrospect | ||
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jjb told me that >> he actually said the no cop/doc thing before he opened his role saw that he was the tracker and went oh noes :0 so funny lol >< | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
I am technologically retarded. Is that as simple as clicking on a link? lol (nope have never done a podcast) | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
not to the right people breshke and I could not have lynched dp by ourselves. it was always going to be a problem. and if damdred kept super towning him like that, we probably still wouldn't have been able to. shining had to go first and I was too stuck on damdred it is what it is | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
I tunneled on you for a dumb reason. I kept thinking no way is damdred not smart enough to realize there's more than one possible scumteam and by the time you started considering alternatives I had to leave for work -_- legitimately if we'd had the time to talk about it I might have pulled my head out my ass long enough to at least consolidate on shining...shining's afk already concerned me and he was my go-to after you | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
to keep geript and/or dp alive and take out jjb (I <3 my bro, but he didn't have the thread pull or strong reads. he defaults to me being scum when he can't think of anything lol) unless the vets are just extremely on the wrong track. and narrowing it down from there is even easier | ||
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rsoultin
Netherlands15308 Posts
On January 29 2015 22:11 DarthPunk wrote: Shooting the confirmed townies makes the game harder to solve due to POE. Shooting them both was absolutely the correct play regardless of who was mafia. You make sense on the one hand, but on the other I don't think that's the best play 100% of the time. Neither did you with the GB kill so -shrugs- | ||
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