EPTNewbie Mini Mafia LIX
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Rad
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On September 11 2014 19:09 Sylencia wrote: Wew Rad, a blast from the past :D | ||
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>.> <.< | ||
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@Superbia and @Fecalfeast - why so quick to jump on loafery being town? @loafery - a game that elaborate and town just decided to mass role call? So sad  Couple questions for you:How often over the past year have you had games similar to that? Is it the kind of game you're used to or do you play more games with sane rules like this one? Do you think mafia will be incapable of giving you positive vibes? Is town capable of giving you negative vibes? You've reached the "not scum" conclusion for Superbia and Fecalfeast pretty quickly, why is that? | ||
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On October 08 2014 03:51 The_Zen_Man wrote: Right now, i really don't have anyone else in mind at all as scum. If someone does find someone else scummy, please share. Isn't that pretty much the only job that town has? To find things that are scummy and pursue them. Any reason you're asking others to do that for you? You say no one else seems scummy to you, are you suggesting that it's probably loafery or the lurkers that are scum? Why are you taking the easy route here? | ||
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On October 08 2014 04:36 The_Zen_Man wrote: It wasn't meant as others doing it for me, rather that others should contribute. Right now there are like 4 people that has only like 3 posts on this thread. I can't really find mafia if i don't have much to go on. I did as much as i could with the info i had at the time. No, im saying that i haven't found anything scummy with the people that have posted other than loafrey. That dosen't mean all mafia are either him or the lurkers, just that i have not found anything suspicious about anyone else. Im not taking any easy route, I have done as much as I can with the given information. Look. You're saying loafrey is the most scummy right now, and you can't judge the 2 lurkers because they've given no content. Ok. So if 2 of those 3 are mafia, it makes sense that there wouldn't be much else scummy going on - at least not intentionally. If one or both mafia are not included in that set of 3 people, then there's some scummy shit going on already. Any reason you're claiming there's not much to go on when you're not convinced that at least 1 of the lurkers is mafia? | ||
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On October 08 2014 07:26 Elvis! wrote: I'm confused. You're happy with people pushing on him but you don't like the wagon. This is most likely just a misunderstanding, but clear information is good information Pushing for information and reactions is good. Fast bandwagons are suspicious and there's almost always a ton of information to be had from them. I'm curious Elvis, what do you have against Loaf playing the newbie card when you yourself are playing it now. On October 08 2014 06:57 Elvis! wrote: Talking about how "newbie" he himself is is a very convenient way of distracting people from you. On October 08 2014 07:22 Elvis! wrote: This, in my unexperienced opinion, doesn't help but rather prevent us from finding mafia. | ||
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On October 08 2014 07:57 Elvis! wrote: A thing I try on focussing at the moment: Isn't information exactly and almost only what we want? We want people to explain themselves about as difficult of themes as possible so we can detect scum indicators. If we ask easy questions, we get easy answers. For me right now, since it's still early, pushing and bandwagoning is not done in order to quickly push an idea of mine and lynch quickly, but mostly to get everyone talking on something we can guess their alignment from. Yes, information is what we want and bandwagons can provide information. We all agree on that. Superbia was saying that he doesn't like this wagon on loaf (in that he disagrees with it), not that he doesn't like bandwagons in general (like you seemed to be confused about). I was just trying to point that out but I guess I added more confusion. Sorry D: | ||
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On October 08 2014 09:53 Fecalfeast wrote: I never meant to make it sound like loaf is town, though I did use the word town. What I should have said, in hindsight, is 'I no longer read loafery scum based on his explanation of his misunderstanding.' What? On October 07 2014 10:21 Fecalfeast wrote: Exactly why this guy is town. He wanted a free win. That's more than just using the word town. That's straight up claiming he IS town. How are you so sure of his intentions? ##FoS Fecalfeast On October 08 2014 09:53 Fecalfeast wrote: Rad, anything else to add to the discussion of lurkers? I see you're thinking the same as I am regarding the low activity players but you've spent most of your posts discussing what other people are saying. Anything from your point of view to add? You mentioned superbia disliking the wagon, what does that tell when compared to the way he is playing? Anything? It tells me that he recognizes the wagon on loaf is sketchy as hell. I agree with his assessment. On October 08 2014 10:16 Superbia wrote: Just vote, you can always retract your vote. Why are you so hell bent on getting the votes for zen at this stage? Why is your vote not enough while we wait for zen to reply? | ||
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On October 08 2014 10:58 Superbia wrote: I am currently quite certain of my case. Also pressure helps. Have you read my case? What do you think? Any reason why you're not voting on zen that you can directly relate to my case? Careless scum caught in a lie or rushed newbie townie? Well... Could a newbie town think he needs to contribute but isn't sure how? Yes. Could a newbie town think that giving his rushed initial impressions is better than not? Yes. So the question here is - was he caught in a lie? My answer is... how could we actually be sure? Your case on him could very well be applied to a newbie town who doesn't have a lot of time to contribute (which he claimed was the case). I've presented my concern for him wanting others to do the work for him, which IMO is quite scummy. I understand your case but don't feel it follows that he was necessarily lying. I'm patiently awaiting some more input from him now that there's a whole lot more content for him to read. On October 08 2014 09:53 Superbia wrote: Town has no need to rush here. I agree Superbia. So why are you pushing people so hard to vote for him? "Just vote, you can always retract your vote." - what even is this? The pressure play would be you presenting a case and voting for him. What exactly could you accomplish by getting people to artificially vote for him? (psssst he can read this thread too and will know who's voting for him just cause you said so and who's voting for him cause they believe he's mafia) | ||
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On October 08 2014 11:03 Fecalfeast wrote: Nice find but again, I mistyped. I meant towny not definitive town. Should I do a full explanation of my thoughts and reasoning about loaf to clear this up? To summarize, I read him null and attempted to signify that by calling him town(y) after I saw him as scummy. Heh. Typo on the word town? O.o Whatever, I'm not going to sit here and argue with you on that. On October 08 2014 11:03 Fecalfeast wrote: When there is a person who straight-up lied to town and got called out for it, why are you ignoring him and targeting one of the only people who tried to stop the witch-hunt on loaf? I'm confused by your motivations for calling me out. Why wouldn't I call you out for such an obvious contradiction? On October 08 2014 11:03 Fecalfeast wrote: You then go on to question super for trying to get people to lynch a liar. Believe me, I am reluctant to pressure with votes but even I can't deny that zen looks trashy right now. See my recent post about the whole liar scenario. On October 08 2014 11:03 Fecalfeast wrote: Believe me No thanks. On October 08 2014 11:03 Fecalfeast wrote: I'm not one for list posts but even a brief write-up on zen, loaf and myself would be great I hardly know where you stand right now. Lists are pointless. You should know where I stand on both zen and yourself. | ||
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If you change your vote, please ##Unvote before posting another vote (can be done in the same post). So are you saying you don't believe zen is scum now? Or you think fecal's trying to bus zen to gain town cred? | ||
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On October 08 2014 15:55 Fecalfeast wrote: I think he will have to at this point and I think he is lurking like a mofo. I don't like lurkers and I actually stated this before... Who cares what I would do, why not worry about what is right now? Because I've been in that scenario before and it threw town into mass hysteria. I like to think about it ahead of time now. Considering he's shown no effort to actually play this game and only has 2 posts on TL, that kind of move might be exactly what we see happen. What's happening right now is only 3 people on here talking and I'm waiting to see Breshke's response. You don't think it's an appropriate topic to discuss dusts? | ||
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http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/301748-a-general-guide-to-mafia Specifically this: In order to blend in with the town, mafia need to appear to be interested in the town agenda. Thus, they may often feign usefulness while contributing nothing of value to the discussion. This allows the mafia to appear pro-town without compromising the mafia agenda. Methods that mafia employ to do this include: rephrasing old arguments, posting random lists of people (town or scum), or summarizing recent events. but the whole thing is a good read if I remember correctly (been a while since I read it). I'm all for discussing specific things about specific people but if we start throwing around lists... I just don't know what to say other than it's bad for town. | ||
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I'm parking my vote on dusts. ##Vote: dusts Reasons: 1. If he's lurking mafia, maybe this will help him realize he can't play this game that way. 2. If he's town and doesn't vote, he'll be modkilled and we have the potential of losing 2 townies in day 1. I'll unvote if he decides to show up and put in some effort. To be a bit more transparent in who I'm currently most suspicious of: ##FoS: Fecalfeast ##FoS: The_Zen_Man | ||
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@abuse - where's your vote? Double standards much? I'll get a vote post with reasons here in a few. | ||
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Your entire case against superbia is based on this idea that he didn't give reasons for why he thinks loaf is town. You try to downplay his efforts by claiming he did nothing of worth until he made a case. This is an extremely easy angle to attack him from and it completely misses the point. The objective for town is to FIND THE SCUM. Scum hunt first and foremost, theorycraft after. How do you think scum hunting works? I'll tell you... by looking for areas of suspicion and following up on them. What have you done the entire game? 1. Piggy backed on other people's ideas. No need for me to go into the whole abuse/loaf aspect, as it's been beaten to death already. Your main argument now though is just copying me from early game: On October 07 2014 11:55 Rad wrote: @Superbia and @Fecalfeast - why so quick to jump on loafery being town? On October 09 2014 02:17 The_Zen_Man wrote: Why did you say loaf was town without giving any explanation as to why? He's already answered that indirectly. It's hard to see if you're not engaged in the thread, and scum are most likely to be disengaged. (I'm reading the thread updates as I write this and I see Super has just pointed this out, even using similar terminology. Whatever, someone will jump on this as me piggy backing on super but it explains why I dropped that pressure on him so... point stands) 2. Constantly explain what town is supposed to do. Seriously, this is the bulk of your posts. See: http://wiki.mafiascum.net/index.php?title=WIFOM 3. 0 scum hunting This is the kicker for me. I pointed this out before and urged you to interact more, but it hasn't changed. You still haven't scum hunted, only theorycrafted. Theorycrafting is the easy part, especially in newbie games. Scum hunting is difficult and requires pushing and adjusting to the situation as it changes. You've just sat back and passed judgement while complaining that there's no content and claiming that people who are scum hunting are scummy for it. I was waiting for you to come back into this thread and drive the conversation before making my conclusion. Instead you've made a terrible case and done nothing else. ##Vote: The_Zen_Man | ||
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I'm not really "here now too" per se. I've caught up on the thread and made by vote with plenty of time before EoD, like I said I would, but this isn't the time of day I can really engage heavily (need to work, and so far that hasn't happened D  I will say that the whole "you're friends with dusts" and "didn't know it was that strict" thing has thrown me for a brainfuck of a loop. I will continue to check this thread and interact as I can but I just can't spend the next 2 hours on this lynch. 3 is way too fucking many as it is. | ||
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On October 09 2014 03:46 Superbia wrote: Echoing the request for Rad to give his thoughts on other people. Can you guys (abuse and superbia) explain exactly what you want from me? A list like superbia gave? You guys both read town to me so I believe the request is with good intentions, but list are fucking terrible, and if we end up with a thread full of lists it'll just turn into WIFOM bullshit. I just don't have the time to give a detailed list like abuse gave. My play time is at night. If you REALLY want a list like superbia gave, fine, I'll do it. | ||
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You didn't know the game was that strict, and dusts doesn't seem to be interested in playing. How do I know dusts didn't tell you his role? If he did tell you his role, what does that mean in regards to your recommendation to lynch him. Mix that with your considering me leaning scum. It's a logical brainfuck and I don't know if I should ignore it or try to figure it out. | ||
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abuse Superbia loafery Lean town: Elvis! Null: dusts Breshke Lean scum: Fecalfeast Scum: The_Zen_Man | ||
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On October 09 2014 06:05 Elvis! wrote: We'll just wait until the dust settles .... (Waited to post this for ages - didn't wanna distract from the lynch) *highfive* for terribly good bad joke | ||
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On October 09 2014 07:58 loafery wrote: just a quick post before I start reading. Is it right in assuming the people that defended zen before his flip lean towards town? I think this advice is appropriate. On October 07 2014 13:58 abuse wrote: 5) loafery please stop pretending to be a total newbie, and if you are then address such unclarities with either the mods or your coach. | ||
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On October 09 2014 09:08 loafery wrote: so what do you think? am i lying through my teeth and acting like a newbie or am i just not very good at this game? I think you're newbie town who needs to stop playing the newbie card and get some help. | ||
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On October 09 2014 09:20 loafery wrote: you vote zen here, but you're also piggy backing on super's claim so what's difference? Adding in 2 points to the arguement? From what i can see zen pushed on super so he has been scum hunting and apparently on me also before so I don't see that as a valid reason for you to having voted for him and he was town, not a very good town but nonetheless town. Believe it or not, I had already written #1 and as I refreshed to check updates, super had said the same thing. Zen was NOT scum hunting, at all. | ||
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On October 09 2014 09:40 loafery wrote: what is your definition of scum hunting? What would the protocol for scum hunting be for you? I'd like to hear your response before I make further posts. Actively engaging in creating discussion that helps clarify any suspicions you have (like you're doing now). This is very difficult for scum to do because it creates a scenario where they might slip, and that can be scary. Zen was happy to sit back, let other people create content for him, and just pass judgement. This was a red flag for me and I was unfortunately wrong in thinking clueless/lazy/scared scum instead of clueless newbie. | ||
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On October 10 2014 06:08 abuse wrote: so scums shot failed. awesome. glad to see that we either have a compitent PR or that scum failed and hit a vet. If a vet was hit, I would suggest claiming it at some point, but it is completely up to you, so don't do it if you don't feel it is a good idea, but chances are high that a vet will just get hit again the next night. Of course any other PR's should not claim. Everyone who did not post at the end of N1, please start posting. I'm curious. Let's say you're a vet. Would you claim? | ||
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On October 10 2014 14:22 abuse wrote: don't try to find out if I'm a vet or not pls. find scum not PR's. Wow. That answer. On October 10 2014 06:18 Rad wrote: I'm curious. Let's say you're a vet. Would you claim? Your post here is scummy as all hell. It's indecisive in when you would suggest them to claim, why they should claim, and even whether you actually think they should claim. It's open to allow others to tell you it's a bad idea while also baiting a vet claim out. It looks townie while serving no use to town. It says a whole lot of nothing while looking engaged. On October 10 2014 14:22 abuse wrote: don't try to find out if I'm a vet or not pls. find scum not PR's. Now back to this gem. How am I trying to find out if you're a vet and not scum hunting right now? You're not getting over confident being a town read to most people d1 are you? Remember, we lynched a townie and there were 4 of us on him. | ||
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Obviously I meant your post HERE is scummy as all hell: On October 10 2014 06:08 abuse wrote: so scums shot failed. awesome. glad to see that we either have a compitent PR or that scum failed and hit a vet. If a vet was hit, I would suggest claiming it at some point, but it is completely up to you, so don't do it if you don't feel it is a good idea, but chances are high that a vet will just get hit again the next night. Of course any other PR's should not claim. Everyone who did not post at the end of N1, please start posting. Copy paste fail /facepalm | ||
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Scum can NOT know what the set up is at the moment. They REQUIRE knowing whether it was a vet or not to know what the setup is. All scum could possibly know that town doesn't is whether or not scum has a roleblocker. That's it. No other information has been revealed to give them any clue as to what the PRs are. | ||
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On October 11 2014 06:26 Fecalfeast wrote: 2. I tried to find the post but I couldn't but from last game someone important (blazinghand I think?) said "The two people arguing are probably town, look to the people watching" in more or fewer words. Breshke - do you agree with this statement "The two people arguing are probably town, look to the people watching"? On October 11 2014 07:26 Breshke wrote: The problem is if we lynch wrong today and loaf gets modkilled we just straight up lose barring more PR magic. Why are you worried about loaf getting modkilled? What has happened to make you believe that he will? On October 10 2014 18:33 abuse wrote: Now that I look at the setup better you are right that scum will know what the setup is if they know if there is a vet in the game. Still, do you think giving them that information in exchange for receiving information ourselves is such a bad deal that you would vote a townie for this? Because that's not helping town. Also it's no good assuming that scum do not have a brain to have ideas as to what the setup could be right now, judging by other people's posts so far. Scum's main job currently except for causing mislynches and staying hidden is finding PR's. I like your rage though. +1 town point. No, revealing that information early is ONLY good for scum. Why are you claiming that me voting for you is voting for town? Do you think you're considered confirmed town or something? You're one of 4 who lynched a town on d1. @Superbia What are your thoughts on abuse giving me town points for my "rage"? Specifically, his being vocal about it. Also, why haven't you voted for Fecal yet? ##Vote: Fecalfeast | ||
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On October 11 2014 08:07 Superbia wrote: Why are you voting for FF? Patiently awaiting your response to my questions. The fact that you asked me that question makes me doubt my own read on you. | ||
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On October 11 2014 08:17 Fecalfeast wrote: Okay before I start reading. Breshke, doyou still read me mafia? Would that change how you view his posts? | ||
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Yes (well most of it, like I pointed out in my post above, not caught up on the Breshke Elvis stuff). Your turn. What does Breshke's current thoughts about you have to do with whatever it is you're about to start reading? | ||
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On October 11 2014 08:30 Superbia wrote: In fact, rad. Why the fuck did that make you doubt your read on me? *SIGH* Superbia... it was a pressure move. 4 people on Zen at the lynch. Probably at least 1 scum on him. Possibly 2. How do you go from pressuring him like that to letting him off the hook so easily and stopping me in my tracks? On October 11 2014 05:17 Superbia wrote: Lol, who are you mafia with? On October 11 2014 05:45 Superbia wrote: So it was a future-read? Sick. On October 11 2014 05:47 Superbia wrote: So let me get this straight: You scumread me at EoN1 because I'm poking you during D2? Some advice from D1 Superbia. On October 09 2014 05:33 Superbia wrote: If you want to pressure someone, you pressure them. If other people are pressuring them, you should be happy. | ||
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On October 11 2014 10:24 Superbia wrote: Rad, what are you thinking? I'm thinking I'd like to know why he waited an entire day to come back to the thread after this bs about waiting to post until I respond to him: On October 09 2014 09:40 loafery wrote: what is your definition of scum hunting? What would the protocol for scum hunting be for you? I'd like to hear your response before I make further posts. So you've had a day to think about it. WHATCHA THINK? You going to tell us or would you prefer to just sit there looking like a newbie passing judgement. And I'm also wondering why the hell he's still pushing for a vet claim. My brain is going to explode. And finally, I'm wondering why he thinks anyone would be cool with him just disappearing for a whole day only to pop back up with a tiny, useless list of his thoughts and a 2 hour limit in which he'll answer questions or some shit. What a fucking team player that guy is. I don't know how to read him though so /tableflip Back to lanning with friends =/ | ||
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On October 12 2014 03:57 abuse wrote: that is an issue, indeed.. :/ anything you want to share yet? I'm on the last page now. Post coming shortly. | ||
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On October 10 2014 18:29 Breshke wrote: This being said i need you to contribute more loaf because i currently feel like a donkey for having a townread on you because you have contributed almost nothing recently. Are you satisfied with his contributions since you've made this post? On October 11 2014 21:12 abuse wrote: this post and question is utterly useless. Why are you asking this question and why are you asking this to breshke specifically? It's not at all. If he agrees with it then his response here: is a blatent double standard with his push on Elvis. The other way to read that is Breshke pushing back on Fecal's statement here: On October 11 2014 05:41 Fecalfeast wrote: I think he's doing nothing as well, to be honest. I thought I would get out my thoughts before the day post, in case I got killed. At the end it says "null or I can't think." I was here for a while and most of that time was dedicated to making a case on breshke. Out of the people who are less active (2-3 page filters) rad, breshke, loaf, and elvis, elvis has done the most work so he is town. Out of the others, I read breshke the most scum based on his entire filter, and loaf less scum. My scum read on you is different than these people. You seem to be poking at me like you did last game, except a lot harder. Almost as if you are thinking the same as breshke, even. which is also a questionable stance to take right before you throw out some townie advice from some other game that contradicts his own stance. The question to Breshke was necessary because if I just come out and point that shit out point blank, it's like giving the answer to the question before the question had a chance to play out. On October 11 2014 14:48 loafery wrote: discreditting me by calling me newbie because i called you out as scum when we're all playing the newbie game is really smart. I've called you a newbie the whole game so clearly this has nothing to do with your random view of my alignment. At first it looked like cute newbie town not knowing the rules, but by playing the newbie card the entire game and consistently looking clueless, you've become unreadable, and that's scary. Post coming up of my current thoughts. | ||
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Super and abuse - leaning a bit town on abuse, a bit scum on super. This post from super has me worried: On October 12 2014 03:34 Superbia wrote: Elvis are you willing to ride or die with Breshke being scum? It's very easy to set Elvis up if Breshke flips town here, and with Elvis's vote ALREADY on Breshke, I can't figure out any good reason to ask this question beyond setting up an easy d3 town lynch. The pressure super put on fecal seemed great but he just... dropped that shit out of no where. Then this gem here I really don't know how to read beyond scummy as all hell: On October 11 2014 15:08 Fecalfeast wrote: super has the biggest filter, the most content and had a super good day 1. And super AGREES with it? WHAT! On October 11 2014 23:12 Superbia wrote: "Hey start finding scum instead of finding scum". I poured all my energy into a good tunnel D1 and it got us a misslynch. I also haven't caught anyone "slipping" or whatever. My read on Rad envelops pretty much all his posts. How the hell is any tunnel of a townie a good tunnel? Super can't even admit he was wrong, especially of the LIE case he made against zen at first, which turned out to be utter bullshit after the zen town flip. So the LIE case was a good tunnel eh? Brilliant! loaf - Scummy as fuck, newbie as fuck, or combination of both. I have no idea. He's a complete wildcard to me and dangerous to town regardless of his alignment. Fecal - If superbia's scum, fecal's definitely scum. If fecal's scum, superbia's either scum buddy trying to look disconnected from fecal by tunneling him, or fecal was trying to use him because he most openly presents himself as the town leader. My vote stays on fecal but I'm completely open to a loaf lynch. I'm undecided on superbia because I actually do believe his scum hunting so far has been pretty damn good, but a good scum is also able to scum hunt seemingly well. @abuse - most of your post was directed at me but you ended with a small paragraph about super and a vote on him. Was this a pressure move or did you have more on him than you were posting? @Breshke - so was fecal giving you good advice or trying to save his scum partner? | ||
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On October 12 2014 05:30 abuse wrote: 30 mins left and I don't know where to go from here. Just park your vote on your biggest scum read. There's really nothing else we can do. My vote on fecal stems from... well shit, probably the same logic that help you come to your conclusion on loaf (but with a different conclusion of course). Elvis and Breshke - the way the day's played out, this just feels like a townie fight Superbia - I like his play style and it reads townie to me, but some of his actual actions read scum to me You - your involvement reads town to me but the way you pushed for vet felt very scummy to me Loaf - unreadable And so we're left with Fecal. 1 of 4 on zen. Useless contributions, unclear reason to vote zen, some posts that feel like scum slips, and his interactions with superbia as of late make me raise an eyebrow to both. Is he scum? Hard to tell, could just be not putting much thought into his posts which would make him newbie town but still town. I come to the conclusion on him based on everyone else, with superbia, elvis or loaf most likely being his scum partner if he flips scum. | ||
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On October 12 2014 05:48 abuse wrote: a vet push is not scummy. If you can even call what I did a push. Please see my post that analyzed the way you suggested a vet claim. No reason to get into a bitching argument about this right now, I do not consider you lynch worthy here. | ||
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On October 12 2014 05:50 abuse wrote: What scumslips by fecal are you talking about, Rad..? I still have not gotten an answer to you about what your deal with him is. See the interactions between him and super where super push him after fecal did some sort of future read, and the bit about fecal claiming super had a super good day 1. | ||
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On October 12 2014 05:52 Elvis! wrote: Mafia's more a game of brains than guts, right? Sometimes gut instinct is more right than the overthinking brain Especially in mafia. | ||
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On October 11 2014 08:50 Rad wrote: *SIGH* Superbia... it was a pressure move. 4 people on Zen at the lynch. Probably at least 1 scum on him. Possibly 2. How do you go from pressuring him like that to letting him off the hook so easily and stopping me in my tracks? Some advice from D1 Superbia. I'll find fecal's actual quote also | ||
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Good thoughts take time. On the bright side though, that flip didn't provide any new information to the mafia. | ||
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On October 12 2014 06:17 Rad wrote: Of course you are superbia, of the people on the lynch, he's the easiest target. er sorry, I could have sworn I saw him drop in and put his vote on elvis, but he changed his vote from elvis to breshke O.o | ||
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Town: Breshke Abuse Null: Loaf Scum: Superbia Fecal | ||
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On October 12 2014 06:29 abuse wrote: I will drop a knowledge bomb at the end of N2 too by the way. | ||
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Super got hit twice in a row, so there was no JK save d1. Tracker should absolutely out a scum here if they saw the kill. I don't know whether or not a JK should come out here. My gut says no. | ||
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I gotta sleep now though and tomorrow's work but I'll definitely read over what I've missed as soon as I get a chance tomorrow. | ||
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My hypothetical tracker list: Fecal Fecal I have 5-6 pages to catch up on (so far) when I get a chance to tonight. | ||
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On October 13 2014 14:05 abuse wrote: my knowledge bomb was that if one of the two peope that superbia mentioned at the start of n2 to be checked (me and Rad) would die tonight then superbia is most likely scum. i was really busy and uninterested with the game yesterday though, so I totally forgot I was going to say this at the end of N2. Totally makes sense you totally forgot cause boooring right? What are the chances scum hits you anyway? I mean, they only had to risk there possibly being a medic or JK on superbia instead of going for the other guy running the show. On October 13 2014 16:54 abuse wrote: Seriously, does even 1 person here think that if me and breshke were scum together, then I would build such huge cases on him, showing every mistake he has made in this entire game? WIFOM nonsense. On October 13 2014 16:55 loafery wrote: But something happened at night and superbia claimed vet so you had to kill him at night. Or else you could have kept him alive and either lynched him or claimed vet and tracker yourselves and have a 50/50. You guys know there is a tracker and you guys are so sure of it because you guys don't have a roleblocker between you and only have 2 goons. So you're thinking they switched their KP target to superbia after he claimed vet? Let me tell you, sir. Superbia posted his last will at like... 10 seconds left on the countdown timer. Looks like we were both sitting there waiting until the last second with me posting just a few seconds after he did. Scum abuse in that scenario has to read that post, decide, and get that switch KP post in really fucking quick. However, it is sketchy as fuck that abuse wasn't there at EoN1 with the inconsistent reasoning of "meh." Or maybe this quote and superbia's last will scared him? On October 13 2014 02:48 Superbia wrote: If we have tracker or cop, check abuse. Superbia, who was suddenly turning on his biggest town read (abuse), might be a problem after all? But hey, now he's back and more excited than ever! He has a plan and everything and already knows who the tracker is (cause there's definitely a tracker right?). Time for town to turn this around with the new town leader abuse! On October 13 2014 17:02 abuse wrote: paragraph 4 : I just love this. "but something happened at night". You don't even know what happened, yet you are so sure of this and pushing it so hard. also why on earth would I want to kill superbia considering he read me as town the entire game. Great point! Why would you abuse? Maybe to allow for this sort of bs WIFOM defense to seal the deal? Abuse/fecal scumteam probably. Not convinced on loaf town but since he considers abuse/breshke scum team (while only pushing breshke, as a note) a vote from him on abuse is a good enough start. Breshke's a town read for me. Could be abuse/loaf instead of abuse/fecal in the scenario that fecal is just a terrible player. So loaf, if you're down to vote abuse instead of breshke, let's do it. ##Vote: Abuse On October 13 2014 14:42 Fecalfeast wrote: loaf/breshke or loaf/rad imo So fecal, you consider abuse confirmed town? The only guy left who was on both mislynches? Cause I don't fit into your scum team scenario unless town completely derped d2, in which case breshke would then be confirmed town to you. But you have him right there, next to your 100% scum loaf and maybe scum me. | ||
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You claimed both were scum. I don't know if you're town or scum right now and am considering an abuse/loaf scum team, but since we match on abuse, let's do it. Certainly you should have no qualms switching? | ||
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On October 14 2014 13:13 Breshke wrote: Rad what is your opinion on loafs play today? Does it not feel like to you he id going for the win? I know you think loaf and abuse could be partners but couldn't it be loaf and ff aswell? Loaf has completely ignored ff's push on him like he doesnt need to worry about it. I am still reading abuse as town one of the reasons is him voting Elvis and not me. both of them would have been a miss lynch so as mafia it probably would have looked far better for him to just lynch me as he had made the first and most well rounded case on me. Abuse what did you get from the hypo tracker claims? Is this information you want to share today because i think you might have to end up doing it either way. @Breshke, Loaf's play is confusing (as has been the case this whole game). I have no clue why he would suddenly become so interested in the game just now but I keep thinking about him missing the vote. There's no way he could know if he'd have gotten mod killed for that, so it doesn't seem like a scum move to keep his vote off a townie. It doesn't mean he's town but it seems more likely that if he's playing a lurkery scum game, he'd remember to vote. @Loaf - why haven't you switched your vote to abuse yet? Why do you think we need to vote Breshke or lose? You think both are scum, so how is voting Breshke better than Abuse? | ||
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On October 14 2014 13:13 Breshke wrote: I am still reading abuse as town one of the reasons is him voting Elvis and not me. both of them would have been a miss lynch so as mafia it probably would have looked far better for him to just lynch me as he had made the first and most well rounded case on me. Abuse voted you, then switched to elvis following superbia (remember we now know that superbia's move was a town move). Scum doesn't care who gets lynched as long as it's town and this opened an opportunity for superbia to take the fall d3 (until of course he started openly considering abuse as scum). In fact, a scum abuse HAD to follow superbia here or risk losing superbia as the scapegoat. That + what I saw as a townie fight between you and elvis is what really pushes me more to believe abuse is scum and you're town. | ||
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On October 14 2014 14:15 Breshke wrote: What makes you think it was a townie fight? Like is there any specific parts? Also if this is your view on it why didn't you oppose the bandwagaons on that day more. Also i know this isn't being discussed anymore really but i think it's important. The second shot on superbia doesn't feel as important to me as I feel like mafia was forced into it as he would have gotten confirmed. Why Rad do you think superbia was shot D1. I know im town so his last reads list had me and Zen as both scum which is wrong. So why was he shot? I don't know how to explain the feeling of "the way this fight is playing out feels suspiciously like a townie fight" but after you've seen a few it becomes more clear. I recognize I might be wrong but sometimes I gotta go with my gut. I did announce that I wouldn't be voting for either you or elvis that day but I'm not going to straight up defend either of you in case of a scum flip. This is why I think he got shot d1: On October 09 2014 03:23 Superbia wrote: I have the ball rolling already dude. We're also not lynching a lurker. They get modkilled or replaced. It's a waste of a lynch. My circles: town: abuse <------------- leaning town: loaf fecalfeast Rad null: Elvis! dusts scum: The_Zen_Man breshke On October 13 2014 17:02 abuse wrote: paragraph 4 : I just love this. "but something happened at night". You don't even know what happened, yet you are so sure of this and pushing it so hard. --------------->also why on earth would I want to kill superbia considering he read me as town the entire game. It's a great play in newbies because newbies are easily convinced with WIFOM defenses. A scum abuse just has to establish his towniness and I can't think of an easier way than killing superbia and playing the wifom defense. | ||
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On October 14 2014 16:07 abuse wrote: The reason for the hypoclaims was to tell if either breshke or Rad were tracker. Because one of them had to be tracker while the other be scum. So loaf and FF are definitely not tracker while either Breshke or I am tracker because magic? On October 14 2014 16:07 abuse wrote: Taking this seriously or not is one of the reasons I did this and breshke did and rad didn't. You're assuming I didn't take it seriously because...? Guess who actually didn't take it seriously - loaf and FF. On October 14 2014 16:07 abuse wrote: Another thing I wanted to see is if the tracker listened to what superbia said during N2. That is to track me during the night. Breshke's hypo list did take that into account and he has me as his N2 track. He saw me not going anywhere and this is why he is not pushing me at all currently. You not going anywhere would not confirm you as town, but it's cute you're pointing that out like it would. It's also funny you would think I'd listen to superbia's advice at end of n2. Pay more attention to the game and you'll be able to bullshit easier, abuse. On October 14 2014 16:07 abuse wrote: There is no reason whatsoever, that a person with a brain, especially someone as observant as rad(as he has proven this game) to go against me at this point and not loaf when it is so blatantly obvious that loaf is pushing just because he wants to persuade people. Again, you're pretending to be confirmed town and that it would be batshit insane to think otherwise. You're not confirmed town and I'm confident others can read through this bullshit. On October 14 2014 16:07 abuse wrote: Call me arrogant, but there is no way in hell, that I should be even considered scum at this point, considering the input I had in this game. You post a lot and make big cases. See my last newbie game a long time ago. I did the same as scum in that game and my effort won it for me. It's really easy to hide in a ton of bullshit because some people believe a big filter is a townie filter. You have to look at the content and the effort they're making. Here's what your actual input to this game was: Mislynch wagon Failed attempt to get vet to claim Mislynch wagon Failed to leave last will after suggesting you'd drop that amazing knowledge bomb Failed attempt to get tracker to claim Plus lots and lots of ignoring my thoughts on FF even when I'm finding shit for you in the last few minutes before d2 lynch. What's next? Mislynch or are you bussing your partner to try to solidify that towniness? On October 14 2014 16:07 abuse wrote: Rad tried to push a wagon with virtually no proof(wagon on FF) and kept going at it at D2. Then just dropped it altogether and hey, now me and breshke are obvious scum, right? And FF is town now, just like that. You should pay better attention to the game. I consider breshke my top town read and by no means do I consider FF a town read. | ||
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I'm not saying anything more about the tracker nonsense abuse has created as a non-red track is useless and anyone could just claim tracker at this point. Anymore talk about tracker that isn't talking about a RED hit is scummy as fuck because it puts the tracker in danger even if we do lynch scum today. My vote stays. | ||
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On October 14 2014 17:40 Fecalfeast wrote: If you are tracker and you don't hop on the main wagon by eod you are donkey-est tracker NA 2014 You're an idiot. On October 14 2014 17:40 abuse wrote: here we go again. Is there like a single day/night phase where you have not said something like this? Sure, go off, don't pay much attention to this, this is like literally the turning point to us losing or not. Stop trying to make it sound like I don't give a shit. I play when I say I can and I have to sleep now because it's 4:45am. Normally I go to sleep an hour ago. Then I have to wake up and work. Eat a dick. | ||
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If you consider me and abuse town, then you consider FF/loaf scumteam. Why would FF bus his partner ASAP on d3? Is this a smart scum play in your book? Does FF get confirmed status level townie points if loaf flips scum in this scenario, making it worth the strange bus? The only other potential outcome there is the loaf wagon catches on, he flips town and scum wins. To me there are 4 realistic scenarios (in order of most likely to me): Abuse/fecal Abuse/loaf Breshke/fecal Abuse/breshke Loaf/breshke doesn't exist for me because it makes more sense for loaf to jump on abuse first instead of you. Loaf/fecal doesn't exist for me because the scenario is too retarded. Abuse/fecal is the most obvious here and looks to win with both scum standing. Abuse/loaf is a play that emphasizes abuse as town leader taking down scum and lynching me or fecal d4. Breshke/fecal is reasonable here with a loaf lynch, with fecal playing stupid town and you playing thoughtful/unsure town playing to abuse considering you and fecal town Abuse/breshke has some potential but less likely to me due to my town read on you and how little conflict you two are producing between each other in d3. As you can see breshke, based on these scenarios and my own interpretations of them, loaf is the least likely logical candidate for scum, and abuse is the most. I'm sticking to my vote on abuse. If you have the same sort of scenarios that are convincing you that abuse is least likely scum, please let me know. As it stands, I feel you need to get your vote on Abuse as the scenario of Abuse/fecal scumteam leaves a loaf town lynch as a possibility even if fecal comes in here saying I've convinced him that abuse is scum (and then switches last second due to 1 town being on loaf). | ||
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I get that Breshke thinks you're town based on your play. I'm asking for the scenarios in which it makes most sense that you're town based on how things have played out. For example, loaf/fecal scumteam requires a retarded play. Pushing your scum partner the whole game is not impossible to do as scum and is actually the ideal thing to do. Loaf is in 1 scenario, breshke's in 2, fecal's in 2, you're in 3. Get it? | ||
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On October 15 2014 05:03 Breshke wrote: But not based on how many scenarios but based on play who do you think scum is? I think ff could easily bus loaf at the start of the day as he isn't the most useful scum partner. Also it seems kind of likely when you look at how loaf reacted to his push, the fact that he hardly acknowledged it even saying he was town because he was looking at it "objectivly", even though ff said he was riding the vote to the grave. Abuse. Check my thoughts on him: http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/466626-newbie-mini-mafia-lix?page=44#876 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/466626-newbie-mini-mafia-lix?page=45#892 http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/mafia/466626-newbie-mini-mafia-lix?page=46#908 About a FF/loaf scum team... early bus from FF because loaf hasn't been useful, loaf suddenly becomes more active... they could have just discussed loaf becoming more active in their QT since he's obviously willing to be more active?? It just doesn't make sense. On October 15 2014 05:01 abuse wrote: it is actually an incredibly stupid play. Also - Rad, would you like to claim PR now? it is about time. Tracker shouldn't claim here without a red hit. Anyone can claim tracker at this point and anyone can counter-claim. If scum is lynched here and tracker remains unknown, town has a much better chance to win. Confirming someone as town to YOU only matters to YOU, and I think YOU are scum. A tracker claim at this point only tells scum who they are, town can't trust it right now. A scum lynch today does not guarantee a town win. | ||
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I think you're probably both scum and I'm looking forward to seeing how FF treats this lynch. The fact that it hasn't gained momentum is a good sign to me. Loaf's lynch was almost certain from the beginning of the day, meaning a scum had to be on his wagon unless you think the scum team is me and loaf. | ||
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Come vote for abuse FF. | ||
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On October 15 2014 05:32 Rad wrote: For fun? Let's lynch scum, that'll be fun. I think you're probably both scum and I'm looking forward to seeing how FF treats this lynch. The fact that it hasn't gained momentum is a good sign to me. Loaf's lynch was almost certain from the beginning of the day, meaning a scum had to be on his wagon unless you think the scum team is me and loaf. This was @abuse, then a bunch of posts appeared making this one ambiguous. | ||
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On October 15 2014 05:36 Breshke wrote: Rad have you looked to my logic about getting a basically confirmed scum today? Link please, it's getting late in the day. | ||
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On October 14 2014 18:25 Breshke wrote: Okay fuck it i'm writing it all out again I don't care that Rad said don't talk about tracker stuff because i think we are in a terrible position with two of the people i think are town fighting with each other. So abuse you thought i was the tracker even though i had said i tracked you last night in my hypo. So unless you had thought about this otherwise it sets up two worlds. 1. You are not mafia therefore ff and loaf are scum 2. You are scum and your partner world 2.1 being ff and 2.2 being loaf submitted the night action. We then look to what the tracker did as it is fairly obvious the tracker hasn't got a hit. 2.1 The tracker tracked loaf and got that he didn't follow anyone. As it is semi confirmed that you abuse didn't submit the night action for the above logic this means that ff must be the one who submitted the night action and is mafia 2.2The tracker tracked ff and got that he didn't follow anyone. Same as 2.1 except loaf must be scum Of course there is he world where the tracker tracked neither loaf or ff but i don't think that is the case. Abuse knew superbia suggested to track him or me (him specifically near the end) so it's easy to get you to relate to him when he points out how you tracking him n2 is what the tracker would have done. It's not necessarily true that either loaf or FF were tracked last night so we can't draw this conclusion. Remember, I still believe you/abuse are a possibility, so none of this matters. | ||
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Game is hard =/ | ||
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<3 abuse, I couldn't end this game with an easy lynch. I was determined to take you down. | ||
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I think the game is just lost for us if superbia stays alive and we took a calculated risk to hit him n2. | ||
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On October 15 2014 06:12 The_Zen_Man wrote: Wow, you had some disturbing thoughts about me..... Hahaha. That was pretty fun. | ||
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On October 15 2014 07:09 abuse wrote: You two really did play well. Read the entire scum QT. We were disgustingly unlucky to have dusts and loaf in the game though Loaf was literally the key player at the end of the game, and he came, said complete bs, and then bailed. Ugh. Most of my thoughts were that rad has to be tracker if it's not loaf, and if it is loaf, then fk it, I don't even feel bad for lynching him and losing the entire game, because of how he played. Oh wells. Probably my last game of mafia. Don't think this is for me :3 Don't give up! You were a top town read for most people and loaf definitely made things easier for us. My only advice would be to step back and rethink things more often. You had fecal pegged as town at the end and that was that, and you let me get away with just arguing with you all of d3. I think from your position suggesting we put fecal up for lynch is smarter than just calling me bad town. On October 15 2014 07:21 Fecalfeast wrote: Oh wow obs qt pegged me from the very start. Ego deflated. Pointers/tips from any scum veterans in the house? Yeah haha, was the same with my last scum game. I think I'm pretty good as scum in newbies but the vets are going to eat me alive. I'm also historically bad as town. On October 15 2014 07:24 loafery wrote: Well i had fun guys in essence i lost that game didnt have a red check either and the ones i checked super and and rad came back as null. Funny how the most townie players were scum. Well played scumteam. Yup that's how it goes sometimes Gotta look at actual contributions to the game rather than who fits into your idea of scum, or scum will play into that. | ||
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On October 15 2014 07:46 Superbia wrote: G_G scum. :D Glad we could finally kill you, sir. u2scary4me this game. | ||
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Actually, nm, without knowing about vet there I'd have to play it differently. Guess we'll never know =P | ||
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"Don't be too sure about surviving the night. Your role will be nullified if scum have knowledge of your role." That's some good advice ^^ "Already asked, I don't get notified" Interesting here - I thought for sure you had been notified after n1. My bad for assuming as this affected my decisions. Thanks for the link. Getting more insight is fun | ||
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 This ego war is pretty lolz guys. | ||
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