|
On June 02 2012 05:45 Unforgiven_ve wrote:+ Show Spoiler +You start going off on Ange77 for "siding with you too strongly"? I think you are taking bandwaggoning a bit too far. She had her own analysis. My exacts words were " I forgot to put this in my last post, i also, dont like how Ange sided by me so strongly. That REALLY raised my eyebrown when i read it." My one and onyl target has been suki, saying that thing about IF Ange777 turns red was just a random thought, a possibility we cannot discard, dont you think? And i dont understand what are you saying here, please post what i said or ask me/show me if i wrote something weird to your eyes Show nested quote +You explicitly state that you are going to disregard Solstice and don't bother to defend yourself.
You are implying that red Ange77 or a red Suki implies a connection. What connection? That if one is red, it's likely the other is as well? I don't understand what you are saying.
About Solstice, this is your exact quote
Some tother time would say you are not good at reading and throw a light insult ;D but at this point of the game i (think?) know is me not knowing how to make a proper post. Im not good at writing long posts thats why i try to resume and point to the precise stuff i find scummy. Suki voted for Ange77 to enforce a day 1 lynch especially since YOU had only a single vote.
I'll try to paraphrase your words: "I don't have time to insult you right now but if I did, I would say you aren't good at reading (an insult in itself). I'm not very good at writing so I try to keep it short and simple." You don't address him at all. Just make excuses.
|
On June 02 2012 05:26 Vivax wrote:Show nested quote +On June 02 2012 05:02 Ange777 wrote:
And Suki IS bandwagoning. He was the 5th player to vote for me, I can't see how this counts as "the first".
You are right, I've mistaken miltons' post for sukis. Still doesn't change my opinion after reading his filter. Going for the lynch as opposed to a NL will always look like a bandwagon. In fact, when there aren't any decisive reads, there has to be a bandwagon. But better that than more confusion. I've also said heist shouldn't try to disrupt the voting process against you, should it be one vote away from a majority, cause then we will end up without information. That doesn't mean I will accuse him for bandwagoning just cause he's the last to vote. There are no proper scumreads in his posts, one of the most early scumreads is inactivity, by which you shined. I've already compared the times of your posts in the other games with those in this one, and you didn't feel pressured to post in this one when you did in the other. You've either set your priorities in a way that it will make you look suspicious, or you are scum. Then this case on suki, it's just perfect for you, the contribution you are giving us concerns mostly him, and you also vote for him. Since there is already a fair amount of people suspecting him, it's just natural you're gonna try to spin momentum away from your towards his case. Also, you post a lot of small posts effectively diluting the thread. Look, I'm suspicious to a bunch of people already, I am pushing the accusation against you. Then why do you just pick sukis' case cause it's the case where you could obtain a majority and not get lynched? Cause it's gonna be too hard for you to push a case on me, heist and Golden tried, now they're silent when it won't work. Who defended you?Heist. Guess what, his first line regarding you was: 'Let us hear something from you. No pressure.' He's going pretty soft on you despite being a lurker.
You are really going all out in an attempt to distort me. My only real contact with Ange77 is telling her to stop lurking and asking her to start contributing. How could I possibly go hard on her if she's only been lurking. There's nothing to analyze. My first line, if you remember, was only halfway through day 1 and there's no real need to be screaming at people to be active.
|
Guys I want your opinion on Unforgiven's recent behavior. We only have about an hour and I will not allow a NL.
I find the following suspicious: vivax, unforgiven_ve, superouman. I am comfortable with lynching any of them.
Ange77 and Suki both read town to me, although if they are the majority, I am siding toward a Suki lynch.
|
On June 02 2012 06:05 Unforgiven_ve wrote:+ Show Spoiler + I'm not very good at writing so I try to keep it short and simple. pretty much you said it. Thats my response, my accusation to suki was 4 points long and i tried to make it clear, if thats not enough for him, then what more can i say? -------------------------------- change of plans, i have to go, i will say it again. VOTE FOR SUKI PLEASE!
He's challenging your 4 points. But your response to the criticism is oh well... best i can do. If that's not a weak stance, I don't know what is.
|
On June 02 2012 06:14 Vivax wrote:
This is a blatantly ridiculous thing to do, yet it looks like I won't be able to push the case against Ange777.
To me, it looks like people go extra soft on her to whiteknight.
You better pray suki is not gonna flip town, which i believe he will.
##unvote Ange777
##vote suki
Ready to vote for Ange777 again once there is the prospect of a majority.
Also, remember that unforgiven_ve was the first to push the case against suki. That will reveal a lot about his alignment too.
OH, and Ange777 is actually following that case while suspecting unforgiven at the same time.
Why exactly would you suspect someone of being mafia if he was the first pushing the case against someone you believe is mafia?
Looks like we have a scumtell.
The damn deadline is getting close.
If it's blatantly rediculous, DO NOT DO IT. You are almost confident suki is town, why are you placing your vote on him??? We still have a bit of time, closer to an hour. Now it just looks like you are bussing.
|
On June 02 2012 06:19 Unforgiven_ve wrote:
Xatalos, please think this. Im risking my neck here! im goin all-in for suki, that would be a ridiculous way of play for a mafia dont you think? Its something pretty obvious, at least for me, im convinced he is mafia and when his alignment is revealed + the mafia kill at night, we will have a shitload of information, dont you think?
Are you following what's been happening and the rapid bandwagon on Suki? Sticking your neck out by siding with the majority? I'm gonna call you out. And I hope you keep talking. It's just making me more convinced.
|
On June 02 2012 06:34 s0Lstice wrote:
This is chaos. We are badly split up right now. The only chance we have at a majority now as I see it is Suki.
Ange777 made some good points about him, but then flung shit at everybody who continued to question her. I asked for analysis, there was enough time and plenty of content in the past to comment on. Instead you made a snap judgement on unforgiven and then basically insta tunneled him.
I hate how this day is ending. Heist, if Suki flips scum, you're in deep. You came in late and changed your vote to another pointless vote, splitting us further.
I'm in an awkward position because I've suspected both Suki and Unforgiven. Vivax makes a good point about suspecting both being logically unsound. With that said, I'm not feeling too great about Suki being lynched, as my read on unforgiven is stronger.
I just don't see the Unforgiven lynch happening today. It has to be Suki, here and now, or nobody.
## unvote
## Vote: Suki
I changed bacause I was not very condifent in either a Suki or Ange77 lynch and my Superouman lynch was useless. You agree that Unforgiven seems more scummy. I don't like how you are giving up to commit to a worse read.
|
On June 02 2012 06:37 Unforgiven_ve wrote:
Lol ange, now you understand when I said if you flip maafia blah blah???
Heist, you not helping your cause, you did not showed me my MANY ATTACKS against the people
You said were attacking me...and if you really read the thread, you can see I was the FIRST one voting for suki, 24 hours
Ago, so, explain to me please, siding whit who?
You purposefully call yourself so brave because you are sticking with Suki. Attention, he has the majority. You are sticking with the majority. Don't attempt buoy yourself up because you were the "first".
|
BTW, a NL is possibly the worst thing that can happen right now. I promised I would change my vote, and I''ll do so if it comes down to it because I'm almost convinced Ange77 is town, much more so than Suki who has been absent.
|
|
|
I made my vote change close to an hour ago. I was hoping more people would be active. Ange77 had misgivings about Unforgiven, we still had no vote from golden.ne, and Vivax was almost completely convinced Suki was innocent. You admit that between a close vote between Suki and Unforgiven, you very well might have voted for Unforgiven. So not completely fantasy. I don't in good conscience vote for people I don't think is mafia unless absoultely necessary like right now.
|
I've clearly laid out my reasoning for everything and if you fail to see it then fine. I've got bigger worries, notibly Vivax.
|
Solstice, I'll address all your concerns come day time.
Seriously though, if I was mafia, why would I not take the easy route and side with the Ange77 bandwagon initally?
|
On June 03 2012 07:19 Vivax wrote:
And guess who his case was: heist. -_-
You don't say....
I'll have a defense of his accusation no matter that he's dead. Ugh. GG.
|
On June 02 2012 12:32 s0Lstice wrote:Concerning Heist, I want to get this case out there on the off chance that I am the N1 kill. Lets have a look at what he has been doing to hunt scum: + Show Spoiler +For most of day 1, he has had one target, and that is Vivix. His first accusation against him contained the following points: a perceived contradiction, and his views/defense of sciberbia. This is the contradiction. Vivix says he sees the reason behind sciberbia's no-lynch argument, but still prefers to lynch. Seeing the logic and worthyness of considering of an idea, but still coming down on the other side of it is not a contradiction, provided you supply the reasons for doing so. Vivix does; he says he still wants to lynch to get rid of lurkers right off the bat or act on a strong scum read, and get lynch information earlier rather than later. His views and defense on sciberbia have been covered a lot, so I'll just say one thing about this. Vivix has been steadfast in his convictions consistently. At the time, the sample size was small and no pattern had developed yet, so the suspicion is warranted. As the game goes on however, nobody should be surprised that Vivix was so sure on his first town read. He is consistently steadfast in all of his opinions. Moving on. He posts some filler before addressing Vivix again. The filler is basically asking Eishi_Ki to clarify his thoughts on Vivix, asks Vivix to post more, and pressures the lurkers. Nothing really scummy here, he is just doing due diligence on his case. His second address to Vivix has one repeated point and one new one: Vivix' sure read on sciberbia, and his hasty vote on Eishi_Ki. His read on sciberbia I've talked about already...his vote on Eishi_Ki represented his first scum hunting target. He went after him full force and voted. Again, these are consistent with Vivix' aggressive play. He defends a town read aggressively, and pursues a scum read aggressively. Next he addresses someone new, and its Unforgiven. He chimes in with his thoughts, which is fine. It's the current subject matter. He uses a lot of words to say that he agrees on the suspicions, but will reserve judgement. It's a very safe stance. He follows this up with further safe pressure on the lurkers. His third address to Vivix. He again uses a lot of words to say basically: I don't agree that your high activity and extremeness makes you absolutely town, and you may be doing it to obscure the scummy things you do. This is trumped up WIFOM + Show Spoiler +Vivix as scum thinks, I'll be careful but still contribute. But wait! That is what they are expecting! I'll be aggressive to throw them off my trail. But wait, maybe they are expecting me to expect that so I'll be more careful. But wait! etc etc There's a reason constant aggression reads as town: because in more cases than not, it is town. His fourth address to Vivix. He harps again on Vivix' opinion of sciberbia. He keeps driving this point, and damns him for finding a townie and not hunting scum. Except....Vivix has been hunting his top scum read: Eishi_Ki. This just makes no sense. Vivix scum hunt was aggressive and obvious. There is no excuse for ignoring it in this context. You know who else kept harping on Vivix' opinion of sciberbia? SukiSomething else Suki did was to drop his main suspicion in favor of another target. Heist does this too, stating that he is giving Vivix the benefit of the doubt, and then votes for a lurker. Not the lurker that has had the most buzz going for a policy lynch, but Superouman. Essentially a wasted vote. In summary: -Pursues case on Vivix on the basis of three weak point -his fast read and defense of sciberbia -WIFOM on how his aggression is a scum ruse -spending time confirming townies and not hunting scum, even though he is -Only other scum hunting is lurker pressure, and 'wait and see' on Unforgiven -Drops his main read on the basis of 'giving the benefit of the doubt' -votes for a lurker that had no policy lynch buzz as of yet Events surrounding the lynch: + Show Spoiler +I'll start here, when the votes counted thusly: + Show Spoiler +Day 1 Votecount
Sciberbia (1): Miltonkram, Superouman
Eishi_Ki: Vivax
Unforgiven_ve: Xatalos, Suki
Suki (2): Unforgiven_ve, Sciberbia
Ange777 (5): Miltonkram, Vivax, Xatalos, Eshi_Ki, suki
Superouman (1): Heist This is shortly after Ange shows up. She takes the time to defend herself some and promises a scum read soon. While she is away doing that, sciberbia makes a post trying to organize everyone onto one person, and the votes on Ange go to 6 when I vote. Ange comes back and posts her read on Suki. It is solid, compelling, and, as we know now, dead on. She votes Suki right away, giving him 3 votes. Xatalos responds that he likes her contribution, and sciberbia comes back trying to illustrate how lynching suki is the best option for us as a group based on our stated convictions. Unforgiven chimes in to reinforce his Suki vote. I mention as well that her case is pretty good, and combined with all else, would draw my vote if he was our choice. The atmosphere at was pretty anti-Suki, and only getting worse. With Ange posting a very solid scum read, and a couple people suggesting she should live. If this goes further, Suki would definitely replace Ange as the consensus choice. Now Ange pursues Unforgiven, and pretty hard too, dropping a quick FoS. Xatalos follows up with his earlier suspicions and votes for him. This is a shake and bake counter movement to the building case on Suki. While this is going on, Suki draws another vote from Milton. That makes 4. This is when Heist enters, when Suki is in a lot of danger, and there is a counter-movement swelling. He jumps all over Unforgiven. He went from non-commital on Unforgiven to all out war without any in-between, right at the time when the case was countering Suki's. He flat out yells at Vivix to not vote for Suki. He removes his vote on Superouman citing it as useless, only to place it on another useless case that had the third most votes. The only conceivable use it has is to stop the lynch of Suki. With 12 minutes left, he switches to Suki once it is clear that he is the consensus choice. This gave us majority on Suki, but Xatalos had already agreed that he would vote to ensure a lynch vs a no-lynch if it came to it, so it was going to happen anyway. What it also does is give him some deniability when Suki flipped scum. Not a lot, but some. In summary: -swoops in when the pressure on Suki is getting bad -pursues a useless counter-case vigorously against a player who he has been ambivalent about -switches his useless vote from one place to another useless place -was one of the very last to come in to vote for suki I think he has tied himself pretty strongly to Suki. What do others think about this?
PART 1 "Let's have a look at what he has been doing to hunt scum..."
This part of your argument deals with my accusations on Vivax. If this somehow reflected on my scumminess why didn't you speak up before the events around the lynch, accusing me? Because it doesn't. You simply didn't agree with me. You dedicate quite a bit of your post defending Vivax, but I'll reiterate your take on my points and then show my thought process.
My main point, as you call out, is Vivax's dedicated defense and conviction toward Vivax, which I found highly suspicious and you disregard as a townie being consistently aggressive. You even applaud his consistent aggressiveness as a fundamentally town. However, there is quite a big distinction in aggressiveness defending someone and aggressively following scum reads. Vivax is the former. Finding and trying to insist confirmed townies does NOTHING for the town come lynch time. That is the crux of my argument. He spends day 1 aggressively defending someone who he can't possibly know for sure is town, and provides very little actual substance for a lynch. His one "aggressive" scumread is on Eishi, a poorly argued accusation in which his main point is that it's suspicious that Eishi can't be here near deadline since he lives in Korea. This is hardly compelling evidence. His aggressive behavior that you cite as such a townie behavior. Ask yourselves what has he actually done for the town after all this "aggression"?
The WIFOM is directed right to this quote by Vivax
I'm one of the most, if not the most active poster in this game so far. Assuming that I survive this day or night while being mafia, my posts make me so transparent that I wouldn't survive day 2 for certain. In that case, I would have played mafia like an idiot. Also cause I'm exposing myself quite extremely.
I've already talk about this quote before. If this isn't suspicious, then I don't know what is. I have not been spending time "not hunting scum, and confirming townies" as you put it. My main activities day 1 was actively pursuing Vivax. And just because I disagree with someone else's accusations does NOT mean I have confirmed the accused. I'm simply waiting for more information, i.e Unforgiven and Ange77. My drop on Vivax was because there was simply no momentum that would allow a lynch. I honestly feel like everyone had the one set opinion of him (oh he's so aggressive and consistent, he must be town) that they refused to read anything else in a different light. Frustrating but I agreed to drop it in order to actually have a lynch.
Concerning my vote on Superouman, which you call wasted because he had "no policy buzz as of yet".
Yes precisely this. Why didn't he? Why was he so much less suspicious in so many people's eyes than Ange77? Various people had superouman on their suspicions list for essentially the same reason as Ange77. Lurking. Why then was there such massive and quick Ange77 bandwagon with almost no mention of Superouman. It was suspicious to me and next I would argue that you can't waste a vote when there are still hours and hours before the lynch. I was hoping to take the bandwagon off of Ange77, which erupted almost out of nowhere without even waiting for her to respond and place my vote onto the scummier lurker in my eyes.
PART 2 "Events surrounding the lynch"
Your main argument is that I purposefully entered an anti-Suki atmosphere to shift the votes away from him. In fact, I was present throughout the entire time that the Ange77 bandwagon erupted. If I was mafia, I could have sealed the mislynch with my vote. Suki was the next highest candidate and he would have survived. Why didn't I? I was reserving my opinion till after she was allowed a chance to contribute and respond to her defense? I have been doing this all day 1. If I don't have a strong opinion I'll give the accused a chance to defend and contribute: I've done it with Unforgiven, ange77, Superouman. Who was the only one who never showed up, never bothered to help town? Superouman. This was my reasoning for my vote and that was who I gave my vote to. Ange77 survives and finally posts her analysis, giving her a much more town impression in almost everyone's eyes.
You then state that the atmosphere turned distinctly anti-Suki. The only reason you construe the atmosphere as anti-Suki is because literally almost all the active people on at the time were the original votes behind Suki: Sciberbia, Unforgiven_ve, and Ange77 (check pg. 13) while Vivax and Xatalos still remaining unconvinced. At this point, the voting total is Ange77 with 6 votes and Suki with 3. Milton then turns against Suki to make it 4, as you said. At this point I come in. And according to you, it's only because of the atmosphere because you are solely reading my actions trying to construe everything as mafia. You fail to mention what was occurring simultaneously: Unforgiven_ve and his set of really bizarre posts against Ange77. The growing momentum against Suki is a direct result of Ange77 becoming more active and trying to clear herself as town, which is what I've been promoting the entire time.
Unforgiven_ve is the reason I changed my vote. I really suggest you go through his filter and can explain his behavior. It felt off to more than just me: Even you express discomfort at his behavior but ultimately side with a Suki lynch to create a lynch, same as I. You on the other hand don't even attempt to convince us of your "stronger" read.
On June 02 2012 06:34 s0Lstice wrote:
This is chaos. We are badly split up right now. The only chance we have at a majority now as I see it is Suki.
Ange777 made some good points about him, but then flung shit at everybody who continued to question her. I asked for analysis, there was enough time and plenty of content in the past to comment on. Instead you made a snap judgement on unforgiven and then basically insta tunneled him.
I hate how this day is ending. Heist, if Suki flips scum, you're in deep. You came in late and changed your vote to another pointless vote, splitting us further.
I'm in an awkward position because I've suspected both Suki and Unforgiven. Vivax makes a good point about suspecting both being logically unsound. With that said, I'm not feeling too great about Suki being lynched, as my read on unforgiven is stronger.
I just don't see the Unforgiven lynch happening today. It has to be Suki, here and now, or nobody.
## unvote
## Vote: Suki
Your last few points:
I've already given reasoning why a Unforgiven vote was not useless (check my filter after my final vote).
And of course I was last, I wasn't convinced but a NL was worse. What else could happen?
Lastly, there was no guarantee that Suki would have been lynched had I not done so. Xatalos's vote and his assurance to create a lynch comes AFTER I've placed my vote, which was already last minute (look at the timing).
|
On June 03 2012 16:03 sciberbia wrote:This will be my post about heistI'd honestly be really surprised if heist isn't mafia. Read s0lstice's case on him - it's pretty good. I've read through heist's filter and found a lot of stuff that seems scummy to me. I'm just going to highlight some previous points I find particulary damning as well as add a couple of pieces of evidence. 1. Circumstancial evidence surrounding suki's first post + Show Spoiler +Recall this part of my accusation of suki + Show Spoiler +On June 01 2012 11:18 sciberbia wrote:
Finally, I can think of one really good explanation as to why he realized his mistake: He might have gone back to the mafia QT where his scumbuddies set him straight. Just a theory. But I'd like to hear suki explain how he realized that he had misinterpreted the rules.
suki never did explain this post, made 9 minutes after his original: + Show Spoiler +On May 31 2012 12:43 suki wrote:
Oh wait, this is kind of important to my reasoning.
Are you allowed to change your vote after you make it?
I dont see any explicit answer in the rules. I assume you can't since we're not able to edit our posts, but just to make sure... Well, suki turned out to be mafia, which makes my mafia QT theory seem a little less wild. What does this have to do with heist? His response, 4 minutes later: On May 31 2012 12:47 heist wrote:
You CAN change your vote. You aren't allowed to edit posts, but you can change your vote in new ones. So, not only do we know heist was online, but he even corrected suki in the thread. I feel like my mafia QT theory was pretty spot on. In case it's not clear, here is what I'm saying probably happened: + Show Spoiler +
suki: hi guys. im roleblocker. sorry im late
heist: suki you should make a post b4 you get accused of lurking
*suki makes post*
This takes 9 minutes:
suki: okay I just made a pretty big first post
*heist skims it*
heist: why do you make such a big deal out of that vote?
suki: what do you mean?
heist: you realize he'll probably just unvote right?
suki: oh shit. you can unvote?
heist: yea. It's ok: you're just noob. nobody will care.
suki: well should i correct myself?
heist: Just ask if you can unvote. Then I'll answer it.
This takes 4 minutes:
suki: k. just did
heist: ok I answered it. Nobody will ever suspect anything.
Perhaps not conclusive by itself. But I'm pretty sure this is what happened given heist's later scummy behavior. See below. 2.Heist's comments on suki + Show Spoiler +Pay attention to the timestamps On June 02 2012 05:37 heist wrote:
I am not completely convinced about Suki...
On June 02 2012 06:05 heist wrote:
Ange77 and Suki both read town to me, although if they are the majority, I am siding toward a Suki lynch. On June 02 2012 06:17 heist wrote:
If it's blatantly rediculous, DO NOT DO IT. You are almost confident suki is town, why are you placing your vote on him??? We still have a bit of time, closer to an hour. Now it just looks like you are bussing. On June 02 2012 06:37 heist wrote:
I changed bacause I was not very condifent in either a Suki or Ange77 lynch and my Superouman lynch was useless. You agree that Unforgiven seems more scummy. I don't like how you are giving up to commit to a worse read. On June 02 2012 06:43 heist wrote:
BTW, a NL is possibly the worst thing that can happen right now. I promised I would change my vote, and I''ll do so if it comes down to it because I'm almost convinced Ange77 is town, much more so than Suki who has been absent. On June 02 2012 06:55 heist wrote: I don't in good conscience vote for people I don't think is mafia unless absoultely necessary like right now. In summary - he is first "not completely convinced" - now suki reads town to him - now it looks like vivax is bussing suki - now he's not very confident in a suki lynch - he's much more convinced ange is town than suki - he didn't think suki is mafia the "not completely convinced" and the bussing comments scream scum to me. Cattivik called Heist out on the bussing comment early in N1 and heist failed to address it in his defense. Xatalos also finds this scummy. 3.suki's comments on heist + Show Spoiler +4. heist's latest slip + Show Spoiler +I just picked up on this slip that I might not otherwise think much of. But on top of the already mounting evidence, it just makes too much sense. On June 03 2012 09:53 heist wrote:
That is the crux of my argument. He (Vivax) spends day 1 aggressively defending someone who he can't possibly know for sure is town, and provides very little actual substance for a lynch. Heist has "thought" Cattivik is mafia the whole game. The "crux" of heist's argument is that cattivik spends day 1 aggressively defending someone "who he can't possibly know for sure is town". If Heist actually thinks Cattivik is mafia, then in Heist's brain, Cattivik does know who is townie and who isn't. If on the other hand, Heist knows for a fact that Cattivik is town, Heist knows that Cattivik doesn't actually know for a fact that I'm townie. I'm pretty sure that heist has been attacking cattivik for confusing townie play the entire time. Heist knows it's easy to attack a townie for confusing townie play - it happens all the time. So, in heist's brain, he is trying to convince everyone that Cattivik is bad townie. But here he slips in revealing that he doesn't actually think cattivik is mafia - just bad townie. Not sure I explained this very well but I think it makes sense. Basically, I have a town-read on Cattivik and a scumread on Heist, and this little slip reinforces that notion. I'm actually interested to hear if anyone agrees with this analysis. I am aware that ShiaoPi has a town-read on him, but does anyone else? And ShiaoPi, would you please detail why you think he is townie? ##Vote heist
It's looking more and more like I'm going to be spending day 2 defending myself with no one acknowledging anything I've written.
Let's go through this shall we? I've numbered your points:
1. Suki doesn't realize you can change your vote. I correct his mistake. And that's your first point? Are you serious? Did you really just make up an entire conversation out of nowhere. Why would I reply to him in thread if I "corrected him in mafia QT" as you claim I did? If Suki doesn't respond, that's not my problem. I don't control what he's doing. Pure pure speculation.
2. When I said I'm not completely convinced about Suki, you completely misinterpreted it. I was referring to the fact I was not convinced to the accusation against him MEANING that my opinion of him was town, not mafia. So yes, Suki reads town (me staying consistent). I was never, never convinced in the Suki lynch. The dilemma for me was that both Ange77 and Suki seemed town to me. Why did I ultimately side with Ange77? because after her recent set of posts, she was leaving me a pretty big impression of town while Suki was absent the entire lynch.
I looked back at the Cattivik's bussing comment. I was referring to the fact that I think Cattivik is mafia (and I have been for pretty much all D1) and that's why I used the word "bussing".
3. Great. Suki didn't comment on me. What do you want me to say? This is completely outside of my control. I can't really say anything about this and you know it. Non point.
4. I don't think I'm completely comprehending what you are trying to say here. Too many what ifs. How are you construing my argument so that I believe Vivax is a bad townie? I DO think Vivax is mafia and I've been trying to make my case all game.
|
From Xatalos:
Heist
Heist is the opposite of Miltonkram. His early posts look pretty decent (unlike Miltonkram), but he starts to raise my suspicions later on in his filter (while my suspicions of Miltonkram lessened later in his filter). The one I found the most suspicious is this post:
On June 02 2012 06:17 heist wrote:
Show nested quote +
If it's blatantly rediculous, DO NOT DO IT. You are almost confident suki is town, why are you placing your vote on him??? We still have a bit of time, closer to an hour. Now it just looks like you are bussing.
The feeling I get from this post is that he's in panic and trying to figure out something to save his teammate. He uses capslock, multiple question marks, and worst of all, makes a potential slip by saying "now it just looks like you are bussing". If we consider the option of Suki being town (as they both imply), how can Vivax possibly be bussing him? What if Heist already knows that Suki is Mafia and makes such a weird statement just because of that?
Later Heist concedes and votes for Suki to attain the majority, which could be Mafia trying to buy credibility or town trying to genuinely ensure the lynch. This isn't a suspicious move (the opposite, actually) but his posts up to this point are pretty much desperate attempts to save Suki. This emotion and hastiness also seems pretty out of character considering his calm posting earlier.
I'm going with Heist for today, and I'm still not convinced about Vivax being the correct lynch. If needed to attain the majority, I'd have to consolidate on Vivax, but there's still so much time left I'm hoping it doesn't come to that.
##Vote Heist
I'm going to sleep now (finally, it's REALLY late here). I hope to see some good responses when I come back, especially from the people I took the most effort to write about (Vivax, Miltonkram, Heist). Vivax, I hope you'll take it as your goal for today to regain our trust by sharing your reads (especially your original and in-depth reads) about the players and discussion topics so far. Miltonkram and Heist, you'll need some pretty amazing Mafia hunting to convince me you're town...
Look at my very first post. I use caps lock pretty frequently when I want emphasis. If you can actually pinpoint any emotion as you call it to something less circumstantial than caps lock, please point it out. I was just merely active during last phase of the lynch. The bussing comment is referring to my opinion of Vivax, whom I believe is mafia. I don't know if you've bothered to read Vivax's comment, but his vote comes close to an hour before the lynch, which is a lot of time before anything is final. I wanted to gain some momentum for Unforgiven_ve but nope. He starts off by putting distance between himself and his vote, arguing all game that Suki is certain town. But then he goes against his surest town read and votes for her anyway. This is classic bussing as mafia and I'm dealing strictly with Vivax's behavior.
|
I've been against Vivax from the beginning and I've seen nothing to change my suspicions. Just want to add my statements to the other bodies of work.
His continued odd statement like these:
If there's a majority the town can get without fear of hitting blue, it's Ange777.
that leave me scratching my head. It feels like he was trying to rush along an Ange77 bandwagon lynch based purely on the fact she was lurking. And when she stops and starts contributing more?
And frankly, even if Ange777 would turn out to be town, all this last hour confusion is thanks to her and the decision to play games when she can't be properly active in them. You don't join a game of starcraft to go afk while you play chess either, then to come back asking others for help when the enemy is in your base, blaming one of the guys who was playing actively.
If you are town, you should be really aware of the bad impact you are having on this game. I would frankly still lynch you just for that.
And now activity is construed as a scumread. It's conflicting and already shows him putting distance on his Ange77 bandwagon that did not fall through.
You have had only weak reads and joined both bandwagons to create a lynch. You continue to deflect accusations in a poor manner and you will have my vote.
I think it's really misguided to focus on my posts when there is much more reliable information to get from sukis' posts, you look for mafiavibes from me when there are behaviors of a confirmed mafia towards other players at your disposal.
##Vote: Vivax
|
So, so sorry guys. My internet got cancelled (I'm moving apartments). I'm at a library right now. Let me read things over first.
|
Vivax is town. 
OK I can expect the backlash. But I think problem here is everyone is just trying to attribute the most scummy motivations to every action that I've been doing and ignoring everything that can't possibly construed as scum. Same to ShiaoPi, literally just for association with me.
@Miltonkran: I don't think we should be policy lurker lynching anyone today. Today's lynch is way too crucial to have a mislynch on Eishi whose suspicions rest mainly on lurking, which at this point is a nulltell.
And there's no way I'm voting for myself. (I don't understand you Vivax).
It may be my point of view, but I think it's safe to say that mafia will be trying their hardest to get me lynched today. And from that point of view, my main suspicions are still going to rest on Unforgiven_ve.
His unfounded accusations against Ange77 linking her and Suki, his quick bandwagon after ONE single off-hand comment from Solstice. Do you guys realize where all the accusations against me started? From this comment by Solstice:
On June 02 2012 06:34 s0Lstice wrote:
This is chaos. We are badly split up right now. The only chance we have at a majority now as I see it is Suki.
Ange777 made some good points about him, but then flung shit at everybody who continued to question her. I asked for analysis, there was enough time and plenty of content in the past to comment on. Instead you made a snap judgement on unforgiven and then basically insta tunneled him.
I hate how this day is ending. Heist, if Suki flips scum, you're in deep. You came in late and changed your vote to another pointless vote, splitting us further.
I'm in an awkward position because I've suspected both Suki and Unforgiven. Vivax makes a good point about suspecting both being logically unsound. With that said, I'm not feeling too great about Suki being lynched, as my read on unforgiven is stronger.
I just don't see the Unforgiven lynch happening today. It has to be Suki, here and now, or nobody.
## unvote
## Vote: Suki
Solstice later backed up his accusation in his night post, but Unforgiven_ve, you basically hitch a ride on this bandwagon really quickly and without good reasoning of your own. You have continued to do no real analysis of me and instead state your reasoning as "it's obvious" and the rest just goading everyone else to mindlessly follow your example.
##Vote: Unforgiven_ve
The remaining scum is either Miltonkram or Xatalos.
|
|
|
|
|
|
EPT
