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On April 16 2012 00:56 Lazermonkey wrote:
@Therapist and solohan50 - I really think that's a bad/scummy way of looking at the no lynch. Even if we end up lynching a townie we will at least obtain a bit info. If we instead end up no lynching we will still know nothing and the mafia will most likely proceed to kill a lurker. So basically we are back at square 1 then except the mafia is one person close to victory. If anthing, the no lynch should be the last resort if we really fuck up and doesn't get anything done.
What's the least bit of info we obtain from lynching a townie day one? In my first game, we almost mislynched a blue cop and he roleclaimed and completely lost the ability to obtain any real information all game. In our second game, we just randomly lynched someone and could get no real information from it (seriously, the extent of it was "oh that sucks oh well"). I don't see why you say that having only one person killed in a day/night cycle brings the mafia closer to victory. If anything, they are one person FURTHER from victory which is the entire basis for wanting a no lynch.
So please, honestly, tell me how to learn things from a day one lynch. If there is a way, then I am just too bad to know it at this point and would love the tips.
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Yay I get to replace someone!
Personally I think seeing a few no lynch calls makes some people seem suspicious to me based on what I'm reading, and I think if we have no lurkers of fluffies to lynch they may be a good place to start. That being said I sort of thing Nova is rather lynch happy and quite willing to swap lynch too readily.
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What now? Why would i not swap off of a pressure vote when the idea was to get that person to post? are you trying to tell me i should do exactly what i did as scum last game and be like, MEH, He posted, but i want to lynch him anyway? That hardly makes sense. Also, Lynching a lurker provides benefits like being able to see who voted when, peoples stances, and more importantly it sets an expectation that people who lurk will die. as an incentive to post.
There isnt positive reinforcement on this game. If you lurk, you die. if you're active, you still might die, but at least you'll be helpful to the town first.
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Eh I still think it makes you seem a bit suspicious but you do raise a point. Anyways, back to accusing lurkers.
##VOTE: Macheji
Not seeing a lot out of him so.
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I am here for another few hours tonight. am hoping to see a lot more activity within the next day. more activity, more posting analysis, etc. Course, this does not mean that fluff posting is okay. on to more important matters, next we should go after people who dont seem really dumb but are making posts with a strange motivation behind them. purpose behind the posts is a huge teller as to what the players alignment is.
Please feel free to question me while i am here.
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On April 16 2012 01:06 Therapist. wrote:Show nested quote +On April 16 2012 00:56 Lazermonkey wrote:
@Therapist and solohan50 - I really think that's a bad/scummy way of looking at the no lynch. Even if we end up lynching a townie we will at least obtain a bit info. If we instead end up no lynching we will still know nothing and the mafia will most likely proceed to kill a lurker. So basically we are back at square 1 then except the mafia is one person close to victory. If anthing, the no lynch should be the last resort if we really fuck up and doesn't get anything done. What's the least bit of info we obtain from lynching a townie day one? In my first game, we almost mislynched a blue cop and he roleclaimed and completely lost the ability to obtain any real information all game. In our second game, we just randomly lynched someone and could get no real information from it (seriously, the extent of it was "oh that sucks oh well"). I don't see why you say that having only one person killed in a day/night cycle brings the mafia closer to victory. If anything, they are one person FURTHER from victory which is the entire basis for wanting a no lynch. So please, honestly, tell me how to learn things from a day one lynch. If there is a way, then I am just too bad to know it at this point and would love the tips.
+ Show Spoiler +On April 16 2012 01:06 Therapist. wrote:Show nested quote +On April 16 2012 00:56 Lazermonkey wrote:
@Therapist and solohan50 - I really think that's a bad/scummy way of looking at the no lynch. Even if we end up lynching a townie we will at least obtain a bit info. If we instead end up no lynching we will still know nothing and the mafia will most likely proceed to kill a lurker. So basically we are back at square 1 then except the mafia is one person close to victory. If anthing, the no lynch should be the last resort if we really fuck up and doesn't get anything done. What's the least bit of info we obtain from lynching a townie day one? In my first game, we almost mislynched a blue cop and he roleclaimed and completely lost the ability to obtain any real information all game. In our second game, we just randomly lynched someone and could get no real information from it (seriously, the extent of it was "oh that sucks oh well"). I don't see why you say that having only one person killed in a day/night cycle brings the mafia closer to victory. If anything, they are one person FURTHER from victory which is the entire basis for wanting a no lynch. So please, honestly, tell me how to learn things from a day one lynch. If there is a way, then I am just too bad to know it at this point and would love the tips.
The thing is, we really get the ship rollin' and start to discuss. If we start pressuring and we really pressure someone to the point where they are very close to get lynched they will obviously start to deffend themselfs, either by explaining their actions or to that they tell their opinion on who they think is mafia . Also in a close vote alot of information can be obtained by watching who voted for who(as nova said).
##Vote: Macheji
Btw, could we get some info of whether no lynches are possible or not? That we we could start to talk about more important matters instead of hypothetical fluff
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My spoiler Tag messed by the way... please ignore it.
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Those are different subjects in my opinion. No one's saying not to vote and pressure and get things going and vote for people if they're not defending themselves. What if everyone posts up and makes a defense for themselves and all the day one pressure votes have achieved what they can achieve. What's the next move?
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On April 16 2012 04:10 Therapist. wrote:
Those are different subjects in my opinion. No one's saying not to vote and pressure and get things going and vote for people if they're not defending themselves. What if everyone posts up and makes a defense for themselves and all the day one pressure votes have achieved what they can achieve. What's the next move?
IF they achieved what they can achieve... you should have at least one person you should feel comfortable lynching.
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##Unvote
I may be missing something, but I don't see how no lynches are possible? Voting is mandatory, and everyone must vote. That's how I interpret the rules anyway. Hopefully this can be clarified after Lazer's question.
@oneplus - you have been lurking for quite some time now. What do you think about TheRavensName's stance on possibly lynching one of the people who've called for a no lynch vote? We need to hear from you.
##Vote: oneplus
@Nova - Who is your most suspicious read so far?
@Therapist. There is a lot that can be learned from a day 1 lynch. It just might take another day or two for the pieces to fit together. The more discussion we have from everyone, the more we can learn from a day 1 lynch. Which is why we need to put as much pressure as possible on the lurkers.
So far I'm only getting the slightest scum reads from two people, and have nothing to base a case on. I'm hoping the activity will improve now after a quiet patch - it seems most people have checked in recently which is a good start.
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If you truly are a townie you shouldn't be interested in defending yourself more than absolutly necesary. Your main interesst should lie in trying to find who REALLY is the mafia and telling that to everyone. If your arguments seems logical enough they will vote for that person. Telling everyone that you are a townie will not help at all unless you have very good proof for it(not likely on day 1). In fact staying to defensive will make you look scummy.
So Therapist; what are your thoughts this far?
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Okay it makes sense and I can agree with it. I think it would be helpful to hear what others have to say on it as well.
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I don't have too many specific thoughts so far. I've just been thinking about the no-lynch stuff for the first time and have been happy to get peoples' opinions on it. Perhaps that input itself can be put to use later on, which is why I have said I would like to hear others' opinions on the matter.
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On April 16 2012 04:20 Pure-SC2 wrote:
@Nova - Who is your most suspicious read so far?
Solohan50
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@Thereapist
You need the lynch in order to learn information about each person. Even if everyone defends themselves adequately, there are still going to be differing opinions on each player. A lynch is needed in order to find out the true identity of a player. With this information, we can go back and look at their posts in a new light. We can also go back to the discussion about why to vote for this player and glean more information about the other players and motivations.
Basically, a lynch is needed in order to get 100% correct information that can hopefully help the investigation. Up until this point, a lot of the investigation is speculation because no facts are known.
I also agree with Nova that I am a little suspicious of Solohan50 right now. He seems to favor a no lynch, which I think does much more harm than good.
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Also I'm going to let Solohan50 find out what i find scummy about his own post and do something about it. If a vanilla townie looks at someones post and finds it scummy, theoretically another vanilla townie should be able to do the same. Im not gonna tell you how to defend yourself.
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On April 16 2012 04:49 Nova_Terra wrote:
Also I'm going to let Solohan50 find out what i find scummy about his own post and do something about it. If a vanilla townie looks at someones post and finds it scummy, theoretically another vanilla townie should be able to do the same. Im not gonna tell you how to defend yourself.
Do you mean his post after start was called, or before that?
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His first post after the game actually started, yes.
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EPT
