Team Melee Mini Mafia - Couples Therapy - Page 2

On November 02 2011 00:30 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:
Assuming all your set ups have an equal probability, this doesn't seem too balanced. Mafia most likely need a roleblocker, and while role check is decent for figuring out who the next hit will be on, it still doesn't negate public claims. For example, if I am a sane cop, I know there is a 66% chance I can claim and be jailed or protected the following cycle, and there is literally nothing the mafia can do to stop it.

On November 02 2011 00:30 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote:
Assuming all your set ups have an equal probability, this doesn't seem too balanced. Mafia most likely need a roleblocker, and while role check is decent for figuring out who the next hit will be on, it still doesn't negate public claims. For example, if I am a sane cop, I know there is a 66% chance I can claim and be jailed or protected the following cycle, and there is literally nothing the mafia can do to stop it.

On November 02 2011 00:33 GMarshal wrote:

I think to remedy this the mafia rolecop should be a roleblocker.

Problem solved :-P

On November 02 2011 00:34 Palmar wrote:


This creates some weird shit with roleblocker vs roleblocker mechanics, read the mafiascum wiki article.

On November 02 2011 00:39 GMarshal wrote:

I have, I don't see the issue they have with it though, scum roleblocker goes before jailor since the jailor is also a protection. Not really an issue, I mean I like the idea of a scum rolecop, but in a setup in which there is a potential for a medic/jailor or worse, both, the scumteam needs a way to suppress them. It also really gives an incentive to avoid claiming

Anyway, I've read 2 of 4 games and they never seemed to run into *too* much trouble, although I feel like they are too blue heavy

On November 02 2011 00:46 Palmar wrote:


I'm sticking with the setup, but I love the discussion.

F11 is another similar setup, now TL is definitely not Mafiascum, I think the level of town play here is slightly higher and we know each other very well. But on the other hand, I think TL plays really bad Scum. I have no idea why, since I myself am really bad at scum, but it just seems to me that the general way of playing scum on TL is to sit back and pray town fucks up.

F11 had a win-rate of 40%-ish for town on mafiascum, so they went with 2of4 instead. I like the idea of the setup because it forces mafia to play a very analytical game (you can't just randomly roleblock until someone claims, you should be pro-active in looking for you target), and it might end up in mafia being forced to claim or counter-claim, which I find a fascinating area of the game we don't explore nearly often enough.

In any case, would you take the gamble as a sane cop? Now if you did a good job and found mafia night 1, I'd consider taking the risk day 2. But what if mafia has enough balls to just shoot you? It's a huge can of wifom.

On November 02 2011 00:55 GMarshal wrote:


What! You dare stick with a setup I don't entirely agree with! This means WAR!

Seriously though 2 of 4 seems to work, although you need to consider that mafiascum has pretty bad towns, for example the mountanous setup, witch is 10 town 2 scum has a 30% town win rate. I think that with two blues the scumteam is going to be fighting an uphill battle, but I'm in favor of any setup that keeps active players alive. I still dislike cops, so I would love to throw in a miller instead of one of the VTs, simply to give scum a chance to squirm out of a check. Ether that or maybe consider making one of the scum a framer in setups that have DTs.

Just random thoughts because I'm bored.

On November 02 2011 01:07 Palmar wrote:


Those were exactly my thoughts, I did wonder when I first read the setup "isn't that really good for town?". And yes, Mafiascum towns are pretty bad. (In fact, TL towns are the only towns I've every seen that are relatively good).

And then there is the issue with those random-open setups, which is the difference in balance depending on mod-roll, F11 was even worse in that respect (VT game vs a cop/doc game are vastly different).

We might have to add a miller to the TL version of 2of4. I also had a crazy idea of simply not telling the mafia who their teammate is and giving the goon a gun. If the goon dies, the role cop gets a gun. For some reason TL seems to do okay as 3rd party and not scum. But I feel it's too themed (and similar to sleeper cell, which I hope will be hosted again in the future).

We also have the possibility of replacing the Cop out of the cop/doc combination with a parity cop, because really, a cop+jailkeeper is not OP, it's only cop+doc that breaks the game. with a parity cop it reduces their investigative power by at least one night. Only problem with this is that the parity cop immediately knows the setup.

Or we could just replace all town cops in the 2of4 with parity cops.

On November 02 2011 01:19 GMarshal wrote:


I dislike the idea of making the scumteam not know each other, too theme as you said, and it removes the communication/coordination advantage, which is what scumteams now days seem to be failing to exploit. I really like the idea of replacing the cops with parity cops, which weakens the cop somewhat, I also suggest you make him unable to check himself, just to make the role more interesting.

I'd still like to see a framer or miller but that's a personal preference, parity cop would work nicely too, and I'm not sure if both parity cop and miller together make the cop too weak of a role.

On November 02 2011 01:52 hyshes wrote:
/in

do we choose our own teams or do we get them from the hosts?

On November 02 2011 01:54 Palmar wrote:


I assign the teams.

Edit, also you already signed up and I already added you to the list lol.

On November 02 2011 01:57 GMarshal wrote:

Are you going to do the assignments by RNG or by picking and choosing? (idle curiosity, you don't have to answer if you don't want to, I just want to know who to blame when I'm assigned my team, whether you or the dice :-P)