EPTTL Mafia Idea Factory - Page 20
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
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Keirathi
United States4679 Posts
On July 22 2012 08:34 Blazinghand wrote: I think the "if you get hammered by X, something happens to X" type roles work a LOT better in Instant Majority Lynch than in Extended Majority Lynch. Yes. That's the way I always played with Bomb role in IRC, but I'm not sure how feasible Instant Majority is in a forum game. | ||
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iGrok
United States5142 Posts
Seriously, I mean every role there could be in a TL Mafia normal game | ||
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Keirathi
United States4679 Posts
Also the potential Princess role. I guess its kind of similar to a mayor, but what about the potential of losing a day cycle? Is that enough/too much of a counter to having a confirmed townie? Also Hitman. Is perma-medic penetration OP? Or is it balanced out by more town roles? | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
On July 22 2012 08:39 Keirathi wrote: Yes. That's the way I always played with Bomb role in IRC, but I'm not sure how feasible Instant Majority is in a forum game. If you had a cohost or votebot (I think prplhz and zona both have one) it can work. Palmar ran his Idiot Cop mafia as instant majority and it worked great | ||
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Qatol
United States3165 Posts
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Kurumi
Poland6130 Posts
On July 22 2012 11:04 Qatol wrote: Bomb-omb's ability to kill people who hit him at night is simply too strong. It allows the town to get a free Mafia/SK kill with absolutely no effort in the thread at all. Similarly, the Mafia/SK lose a member without that member necessarily having done anything wrong at all. It kinda defeats the idea of scumhunting. This is the same reason we don't use Meth Man in games any more. Passive PGOs are wonky. I think variant where you need to decide when to use your defence and having it limited would work a lot better. | ||
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Qatol
United States3165 Posts
On July 22 2012 11:08 Kurumi wrote: Passive PGOs are wonky. I think variant where you need to decide when to use your defence and having it limited would work a lot better. PGOs are even worse because they survive the night kill attempt. But Meth Men are still pretty bad. | ||
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Keirathi
United States4679 Posts
On July 22 2012 11:04 Qatol wrote: Bomb-omb's ability to kill people who hit him at night is simply too strong. It allows the town to get a free Mafia/SK kill with absolutely no effort in the thread at all. Similarly, the Mafia/SK lose a member without that member necessarily having done anything wrong at all. It kinda defeats the idea of scumhunting. This is the same reason we don't use Meth Man in games any more. Fair point. Is there any way to balance it? I think I still like the idea of a punishment role because of the interesting possibilities for daytime play to draw the night shot. Maybe make him like a suicidal PGO who only has a certain number of nights that he can be paranoid? | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18473 Posts
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
Artosis Pylon Mafia It was a quiet day around the Artosis Pylon. Gateways hung out and chilled, producing zealots and archons and all manner of good units to support the Protoss army in its struggle for dominance. However, someone has gone horribly horribly amiss! During the last night, the Artosis Pylon, who provides all the buildings with power, took shield damage! If he died, all would be lost! Furthermore, Qatol the Gateway was found horribly murdered! The buildings gathered together around their Artosis Pylon and soon realized that hidden among them, disguised as Photon Cannons are Terran Bunkers! Damn those bunker rushers! Damn them to hell! Each day, as long as there's a Protoss Building alive, they produce a new wave of units to be sent to the front. The Buildings decided that collectively they might modify their rally points, so that the units DESTROY a building among them before continuing to the front, once each day. Hopefully, this will let them burn out the horrible bunker rush infestation. Mechanics: The Artosis Pylon: This is the central pylon that powers every structure-- your fates rise and fall together. It has 6 hit points! The Ghost Bunker that has enough range, each night, to take a shot at this Pylon! Even if there are still Protoss Buildings left alive, if the Artosis Pylon dies it's all over-- Mafia wins, but Millers (Assimilators) also win, since they don't need power to operate. This isn't a player, this is a mechanic. Sim-City: Due to the fact that you're clustered oh-so-tightly around the Artosis Pylon, certain actions are clearly visible. If a building is destroyed or roleblocked, the killers or roleblocker don't have time to clean everything up. Roleblocked buildings are announced with each day post, and there are clues for roleblocks and night kills. Roles: Gateway -- you are the pride of the Protoss race, capable of producing such wonderful units as the Zealot and Dark Templar, which are fucking bullshit and shouldn't be in the game. Although you can't do fancy things like other production facilities or tech structures, you still have your voice and your vote! You return "gateway" to rolecop checks. You win with the Protoss. Warpgate -- huh? I thought this was BW themed! Well, whatever, you're here so we'll use you. You don't get to produce units nearby like other production facilities, but you have a special link with another warpgate or two that lets you communicate privately. You return "gateway" to rolecop checks. You win with the Protoss. Assimilator -- you just have the bad luck of being nearby when all this took place, and you're not even involved. Anybody who looks will think you're a Terran Building because you don't use the power field like a normal Protoss building. You return "gateway" to rolecop checks for some reason. You win with the Protoss, but should the Terrans win by killing the Artosis Pylon, you get a partial victory. Photon Cannon -- you're just a regular old Photon Cannon, laying down the law and destroying enemies where you see them! You have been trained in all the arts of war, and can detect, change modes, and shoot. Once per game at night, you can fire a Singularity Charge to destroy the building of your choice! Also, once per game at night, you can use your Detector trait to determine if a building is Protoss or Terran! Also, once per game, you can use your area control to lock down one building's movement, preventing it from taking any action at night, while also protecting it from 1 KP that night! You return "Defensive" to rolecop checks. You win with the Protoss. Mothership Core -- you're a powerful defensive building, and you plan on using your powers to defend your Artosis Pylon! X times per game at night, you can fire an imba mothership shot to destroy a building of your choice. However, Blizz hasn't finished designing you since you're coming out in HotS, so you can't fire on the first night. You return "Defensive" to rolecop checks. You win with the Protoss. Shield Battery -- you're one of the best-designed static defense structures in BW! Sc2 is lesser for not having you. Each night, you can nominate a building and Shield it. This prevents one KP towards the target at night, but if it gets stacked with 2 KP, welp, sorry bro. You return "Shield Battery" to rolecop checks. You win with the Protoss. Observatory -- without you, Protoss would only be able to make Shuttles! I heard most good builds go double Observatory, but I can't be sure. You can use your sensors to Follow a building each night, and see where it goes-- if it visits another building, you will be informed. You return "Detection" to rolecop checks. You win with the Protoss. Robotics Facility -- it is a subtle thing, being a Robotics Facility. Most of the time, you are producing observers, but sometimes you produce shuttles-- you can't be sure. Every night you can send whatever you produce over a building to see whether it uses the Power Field or not, and assuming it's an Observer, it will detect to determine if a building is Protoss or Terran! but you don't know whether your Player is having you make shuttles or observers this game. You return "Detection" to rolecop checks. You win with the Protoss. Lucky Stargate -- yeah, you're the shit. You've been making arbiters all game, and you can use them to jailkeep a player each night. You return "Stargate" to rolecop checks. You win with the Protoss. Unlucky Stargate -- yeah, you're the shit. You get to make carriers, arbiters, all the great protoss units-- wait, WHAT? your Player has you massing corsairs. Oh man, what a misclick-- doesn't he know this a PvT? Well, at least every night you can have your corsair use its Disruption Web to roleblock a player. You return "Stargate" to rolecop checks. You win with the Protoss. Severely Unlucky Stargate -- oh god, why are we making scouts? What are we, 12? You're completely, utterly useless, just like the units you're making. You return "Stargate" to rolecop checks. You win with the Protoss. Marine Bunker -- you're a bunker full of marines. Damn, you're so strong... it's so unfair. you can deliver your faction's KP. You win with the Terran. SCV Bunker -- well... so you can't actually shoot out of this bunker. Look, someone had to proxy all these buildings, and so you made a bunker to hide yourself in afterwards. You do such a good job of blending in that you look like a Protoss building to Detectors. You win with the Terran. Firebat Bunker -- ok, so admittedly this sounded like a better idea before you got into the bunker, but you actually aren't close enough to burn anything with your flame jets. At night, though, you can get out and try to burn a building. It won't actually hurt them, but the smoke and flames should prevent them from doing anything useful. Watch out, though, since you could leave a trail of clues when you exit your bunker like this. You win with the Terran. Proxy Factory -- you're a proxied factory! X times per game, you can call in a Vulture Raid to try to take down a protoss building that isn't a Photon Cannon. However, your Player is cautious and doesn't want to attack a Photon Cannon. You must specify the role name and target building to assure your Player his precious Vultures will be safe. If he shows up and it's the wrong building (such as a Lucky Stargate instead of an Unlucky Stargate), he'll freak out and think he went the wrong way, and send his vultures home. You win with the Terran. Ghost Bunker -- you're the lynchpin of this bunker rush strategy. Due to your superior positioning and range, you can actually fire on the Artosis Pylon! Once per night, you can fire at the Artosis Pylon, destroying one of its hit points. Alternatively, you can Lockdown a Protoss building, preventing it from taking any actions. Shooting the pylon will generate clues, though, since Ghosts are rare units in TvP. You win with the Terran. Proxy Science Facility -- you're a proxied Science Facility! This is clearly a good strategy. Each night, you can Detect a building and see what it is. You win with the Terran. Proxy Academy -- you're a proxied academy! I use this strat in TvZ a lot. Once per game, you can use your medical knowledge to clean up and hide the results of a lynch-- nobody will be able to figure out from the wreckage what the building was. You win with the Terran. | ||
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Qatol
United States3165 Posts
On July 22 2012 16:31 Keirathi wrote: Fair point. Is there any way to balance it? I think I still like the idea of a punishment role because of the interesting possibilities for daytime play to draw the night shot. Maybe make him like a suicidal PGO who only has a certain number of nights that he can be paranoid? Mad Hatters are probably the closest thing to what you are looking for. | ||
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iGrok
United States5142 Posts
Haven't you ever heard of The Stove? Scouts OP! | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
On July 24 2012 04:33 iGrok wrote: Severely Unlucky Stargate best role ever lol. Haven't you ever heard of The Stove? Scouts OP! I hate to admit this, but I actually lost to freaking scout rushes on iccup from time to time. How are you supposed to fight a scout with like the 5 marines you made before you made factories? ;_; and then the DTs come EDIT: on a more serious note, I'm trying to think about a way to make the artosis pylon thing balanced-- maybe as an alternative cap on mislynches. Normally with 4 scum and 12 town and no vigis, town can mislynch three times and then be at MYLO, and would take 4 days to finish off the scum. Assuming the scum ghost bunker shoots every night and is lynched last, scum could still win even with no mislynches, motivating town to use the clues to find the ghost bunker. Does this sound like a good mechanic in a clues game? | ||
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iGrok
United States5142 Posts
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
On July 24 2012 04:56 iGrok wrote: Clues games are as balanced as you make them. Balancing roles is irrelevant when your clue can basically be "iGrok is scum" Ah yes, I can see it now. "Day 5: The gateway explodes in an oddly iGrok-ey way, as though iGrok walked over to it and delivered the kp last night." Well, barring egregious bad balance issues, I guess clues can push it wherever it needs to go ;_; | ||
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iGrok
United States5142 Posts
On July 24 2012 05:00 Blazinghand wrote: Ah yes, I can see it now. "Day 5: The gateway explodes in an oddly iGrok-ey way, as though iGrok walked over to it and delivered the kp last night." Well, barring egregious bad balance issues, I guess clues can push it wherever it needs to go ;_; Exactly. And this is why I abhor clues games. | ||
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Kenpachi
United States9908 Posts
On July 24 2012 04:34 Blazinghand wrote: I hate to admit this, but I actually lost to freaking scout rushes on iccup from time to time. How are you supposed to fight a scout with like the 5 marines you made before you made factories? ;_; and then the DTs come EDIT: on a more serious note, I'm trying to think about a way to make the artosis pylon thing balanced-- maybe as an alternative cap on mislynches. Normally with 4 scum and 12 town and no vigis, town can mislynch three times and then be at MYLO, and would take 4 days to finish off the scum. Assuming the scum ghost bunker shoots every night and is lynched last, scum could still win even with no mislynches, motivating town to use the clues to find the ghost bunker. Does this sound like a good mechanic in a clues game? its ok i played a PvT vs a B- Terran once and he wrecked me with Ghosts. i cried i also lost a ladder match as protoss where the guy used Nukes and BCs i didnt cry but i thoroughly enjoyed the game actually rofl | ||
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Blazinghand
United States25563 Posts
So what about a clue game that doesn't include any clues EXCEPT for clues on Artosis Pylon hits? Or maybe some alternative tradeoff for scum to not want to shoot at the Pylon? I guess the big thing I'm looking at is the Artosis Pylon is actually just a boring mechanic if there's no reason for scum NOT to shoot it. I guess maybe I should get rid of clues, limit scum PRs, and have a strong scum PR like a roleblocker be the only one who can shoot the Pylon. Basically the setup would be such that if there are no no-lynches or anything weird, as long as scum shoots the pylon every night, the town has one less mislynch available before losing-- but if scum wants to use the roleblocker (or perhaps some other juicier PR, but obviously not one that can bring LYLO closer like a vigi could), he can't shoot the pylon on any turn he roleblocks. Would that provide both incentives to shoot and not shoot the pylon without breaking the game? So the scum setup might be like a godfather, a goon, a situational vigi (the factory in the above setup) and the roleblocker/pylonshooter. | ||
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Acrofales
Spain18473 Posts
Assimilator - You win with the Protoss, but should the Terrans win by killing the Artosis Pylon, you get a partial victory. Correct way to play this role: roleclaim D1. AFK. Assimilator should be given some incentive to actually play on 1 faction or the other, or maybe be 3rd party. I just got a wacky idea: Your only goal in life is to get some gas. It's why you volunteered for the assimilator job in the first place. But your Player keeps using it on crap like corsairs and observers. That shit aint fair, so you've decided to siphon some off the top. You don't care anymore about helping the protoss. All you care about is getting enough vespene gas for your old age. You win the game when you have X gas. You can siphon off 1 gas per cycle without the Player noticing. My iniitial idea was that X should be greater than 6 to give the assimilator some incentive to try to prevent the mafia from shooting the artosis pylon every night. However, that might be too hard. | ||
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