TL Mafia XXXVII
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gryffindor
United States524 Posts
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gryffindor
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On February 10 2011 16:48 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: Nothing in this set up is final as of yet. Before the game starts some OP information may change. yeah, role reverser looks a little silly | ||
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gryffindor
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claims to me | ||
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i was joking about claiming to me, but i'm not retracting my claim | ||
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On February 23 2011 13:33 Mr. Wiggles wrote: Also, I'm just going to point this out, the number of GFs is limited. There is no way there would be 6 GFs, as that would mean 6 mafia KP, which seems a bit ridiculous. The GF is worth 1 KP it says in the OP, so if you assume a set-up of 3 KP for mafia, that means 3 GFs max, 1KP each. Speculation: If a grunt is worth say, .5 kp, so not the same as a GF, and fits in line with power costs, possible set-ups become something like: 3GF, 3 mafia total (3kp) 2GF 2grunts, 4 mafia total (3kp) 1GF 4grunts, 5 mafia total (3kp) I think the last two are more likely, but we should be able to tell more accurately after the first night kills and then after RB claims are in. Since the reds can manipulate innocents, frame, role-reverse No, there is no straight Godfather in my opinion I'm also very suspicious of this post: On February 23 2011 13:19 GMarshal wrote: for arguments sake going to create analysis cells, use them for informational analysis (even assuming I were scum there is no way) I could ensure each has a mafia member in it as there isn't enough mafia to go around (I am trying to put at least 1 TL vet in each) as the game progresses and people die we can have new cells form. (also you are free to create your own parallel cells) 1. Coagulation, LSB, gryffindor 2 GMarshal, seRapH, OriginalName 3 Mr. Wiggles, ICanFlyLow, kevconsim 4 Barundar, LastArgument , why 5 darmousseh, Ser Aspi, Kenpachi 6 Gofarman, chaoser, ohN 7 astroorion, CubEdIn, Jackal58 8 Beneather, annul, Conversion 9 icemac, Foolishness, LunarDestiny 10 deconduo, kitaman27, JBright This is just a suggestion, but I think it is a good one, discuss This would get us raped by the role reverser, and is really a scummy idea unvote; ##Vote: GMarshal | ||
gryffindor
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Go ahead and crossvote with me, mafia I'm onto you You are playing completely differently than I saw you as town | ||
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5-6 is much more likely, with 6 being more likely, unless they start with roles (which I doubt) due to the mechanics 5 with an SK I would believe would be balanced as well, but i'm seeing 6 and 2.5-3kp, or something like "you may not kill 3 people" as 3 kp is a bit much right now we will learn soon enough. It is also possible they get to pick to be permanent, or nightly. I'm not quite sure on the mechanic. Lets assume it is permanent, and they pick a GF and a role reverser they'd still have 1.5kp which would round up to 2 afaik The best thing to do is to not come out if you're a hatter, for sure If you're a cop, I wouldn't come out unless you have a guilty, or are pressured I wouldn't ever claim as medic, unless someone you protected and saved is up for lynch Veteran is OK to claim, many setups have bulletproofs claiming first Vigilante is OK to claim TOMORROW if you claim who you are going to kill - Don't claim today, as you can't kill tonight | ||
gryffindor
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On February 23 2011 15:26 Foolishness wrote: Did anyone else find something odd about the above post? 1) pushes bad case on lurkers vs inactives which is null at best on day 1 2) votes someone who isn't even a lurker "to that end" 3) in his next post claims he is "going out", becoming a lurker himself, and an active one I'd rather lynch an active lurker than an inactive one. At least with an inactive one, we might have a chance of convincing the moderator to message them or replace them. | ||
gryffindor
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Probably, but I'm still stuck on GMarshal's obviously scum-motivated plan | ||
gryffindor
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The smarter ones are the ones who pick up on what I'm doing, and make fun of me for it. See: 3 people claiming vig/veteran last page after I did. It was mainly a joke to judge reactions. I'm liking Foolishness/Kenpachi on this page, not liking GMarshal for the reason i voted him, and now I'm disliking a few other people. I don't like that vote on annul, and I dislike LastArgument's very-weak FoS of me that lacked reasoning. @LastArgument, what, exactly, "irked" you in my post? | ||
gryffindor
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On February 23 2011 15:38 Coagulation wrote: well if gryffindor is bill murray than hes probably making shit up for attention as far as his role claim goes I'm doing that, but I don't know this Bill Murray character you speak of | ||
gryffindor
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On February 23 2011 15:38 LunarDestiny wrote: Voting inactives are bad, but there are people who will only reply if their names pop up. I understand the game just started, but I think pressure voting to get someone start talking is good. What's bad is that if the person don't respond and bandwagon on that person happens. That's only bad if they're town, unless you want to out every power role haphazardly. Is that what you want? | ||
gryffindor
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On February 23 2011 15:43 Coagulation wrote: gryffindor ARE YOU BILL? my name is Sam, actually, who is Bill? | ||
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or you could leave it at attacking me and not my argument. i wouldn't mind that. | ||
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On February 23 2011 15:46 LastArgument wrote: As you asked what I found troublesome about this post. as per the town guide found http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=188179 You did what would be as general talking. Rather than being specific with the use of the roles you mention you instead mention generalities. It also a post that lacks emphasis on the fundamental skill in which it has been suggested towns need to play by which is behavioural analysis. This and factoring in your earlier claim makes it seem fairly odd no? Not at all. I felt the need to come in and give a good general way to play as each role for us. People who focus on really weird plans are generally scum. See the plan for the ninjas in XXX which was proposed by the Mafia Godfather. It was very similar to what GMarshal did. I don't consider myself having "generally talked" there whatsoever. I was discussing the setup, with what was possible, and coaching more inexperienced players on what works for town, which is generally lacking overall in terms of sense here in teamliquid (except for good players like Foolishness who *always* get hit N1) Have you noticed, how, in my next posts, I list town and scum reads? Is that not behavioral analysis? Am I not currently voting, and, btw, thanks for responding to my QUESTION of you... which is another way to scumhunt... asking questions... sheesh you're joking, right? | ||
gryffindor
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On February 23 2011 15:46 Coagulation wrote: looks like kenpachi is town this game. thats a shame. hes a good day 1 lynch agree with your read, but you shouldn't state it quite that way it is better to be more... wavering.. in your reads kenpachi is town used to be considered a scumslip in 2004-2005, as seen in this town guide: http://mafiascum.net/wiki/index.php?title=JEEP's_Tells_for_Finding_Mafia #5 is what you just did "kenpachi is town" not "looks like kenpachi might be town" Now, this is generally written off now, but fair warning that people might call you out on that eventually. Some of them, though, are still very damning. It addresses rolefishing on d1, for instance, which is why I am voting GMarshal for that plan to set up mafia members infiltrating potential town circles. | ||
gryffindor
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On February 23 2011 15:59 Coagulation wrote: i see what your saying. i see it more as bait for a desperate mafia to bite. Yeah, you shouldn't do that. It's really not a tell anymore, GENERALLY SPEAKING. | ||
gryffindor
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On February 23 2011 15:57 LastArgument wrote: In your following posts after the one I quoted you only center on GM for a possible red, who is following suggestions found in the link I provided. I also glanced through your posts and you so far have only insinuated that GM as well as mrwiggles. Your list of "reads" is responding to foolishness, but is also a summary of information found in multiple spots within the mafia forum. Most of it is all spoken generalities, rather than specifics. I know I am not very experienced and running purely on what I have read from threads here but based on that it all seems off. You need to re-read the post in which I "insinuated" mrwiggles. I did no such thing; you need to learn to read more carefully. Look at the punctuation, don't just ISO people post-by-post, and read it in context. If that's not the case, learn to read punctuation correctly. I am not sure GM is red, but thanks for noticing I'm voting him. How is he "following suggestions found in the link provided"? I wasn't summarizing anything, either, just speaking from my heart, so that is a misrepresentation as well as my lack of an insinuation on MrWiggles. I can tell you are not experienced. You said it, not me. | ||
gryffindor
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placing you on my shortlist of scum for trying to discredit your buddy GMarshal's attacker | ||
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people to keep alive: gryffindor foolishness coagulation kenpachi ser aspi leaning town: lunardestiny LastArgument (you're thinking, WUT?, but i'll explain if questioned) MrWiggles leaning scum: GMarshal The guy voting annul | ||
gryffindor
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the fact he is pushing ANYONE is better than being inactive and not held accountable | ||
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Him making a far-reaching case on me reads as town. Sure, his case is weak, really weak, but the fact that he would pressure/prod/poke at me with an unjust case/misrepresentation is more easily done from town than scum. Scum know I'm innocent, whereas it really feels as if he doesn't know i'm innocent, or else he wouldn't be making this case on me. He'd be saying, "oh, yeah, gryf is town" or he'd be saying "I like Foolishness's post about the guy voting Annul, but I'm not going to vote him. Instead, I'm going to vote GMarshal for rolefishing" -> Easy bandwagon That is how scum play, they look for very weak reasons to hop onto town bandwagons/mislynches @LD: likely to be town Ser Aspi attempted to make a well formulated case after putting an FoS out on me. I'm not mafia, so if he was mafia, I would expect him to have done that differently. It could be WIFOM off of an associative tell, but I'm not sure if he's good enough to do that. Given that I doubt he wasn't genuine, and I like that he is attempting to create a bandwagon, I'm comfortable with him in my town category. I didn't want to just put "town", as it can be misleading. People will be moving up and down on my list as their play improves/degrades. Coagulation I do not want rid of because of his activity. He is also, if mafia, someone who would possibly incriminate his teammates on accident. I have placed him into the "i don't want them lynched" or "probably town" category because of his lightheartedness, prompt responses to all questioning, and how he answers them fully if he knows to. Kenpachi feels like what I've seen of his play as town. Was he not town as the mayor last game of TL Mafia? Perhaps I should have had him in my "leaning" category. Noone is perfect! On February 23 2011 16:29 Coagulation wrote: Im as pro town as it gets baby I wouldn't say that | ||
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On February 23 2011 16:52 LunarDestiny wrote: @gryffindor You are saying that Ser Aspi read you as mafia and tried to convince town and not sucessful in doing do. While I agree that mafia won't recklessly risk themselves at leading lynches, I believe that they want to form a quick bandwagon on town. But you also said Ser Aspi tried to create a bandwagon which is what mafia wants to do. That should be a scum tell instead of a defense why he is town. No, he made a well formulated case (on someone else, the person he is voting...),"after putting an F.o.S. on me" should then read as "after making a post addressing inconsistencies he had with me" This isn't what happened, either, so not only are you not brushed up on the topic in the voting thread, apparently you don't read the one with words in it either. You have moved down my list, to somewhere in between neutral and leaning. Shape it up or ship it out. | ||
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On February 23 2011 16:58 Coagulation wrote: this early in the game.. and with this level of pressure... mafia tend to wait and jump on town formed bandwagons.. i cant see mafia rising up and starting a bandwagon at this point. why are you taking a point i made and regurgitating it off as one of your own? you've just moved down my list to neutral | ||
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+ Show Spoiler + people to keep alive: gryffindor foolishness kenpachi ser aspi leaning town: LastArgument (you're thinking, WUT?, but i'll explain if questioned) MrWiggles neutral: coagulation leaning scum: lunardestiny GMarshal Lynch, Lynch, Lynch: | ||
gryffindor
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On February 23 2011 17:08 Mr. Wiggles wrote: Yeah, there's a lot of accusations flying around already that mafia can choose whichever to bandwagon. What I'd watch out for, is people who start to heavily push someone else's suspicion of a player, or who start to tunnel really hard.From my experience, this early in the game, that can indicate scum. QFT It is relative to who, though. Certain players doing that would be null | ||
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Thanks | ||
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On February 23 2011 17:20 chaoser wrote: Can you explain why this is a bad idea gryff? Your previous posts on why it's bad (weird, can lead to role reversal) don't really cut it. Roles aren't being revealed and people don't have to follow the list. Isn't it just making this 30 man game into many team mini games? Also, would being in a group with a mafia help a townie or not? More interactions in a more private setting might mean more likely for mafia to fuck up Easily. It leads to the sharing of information, which the mafia need in this setup to properly use their abilities of role reversing the town into submission, as opposed to straight up kill power. If they know you are a Veteran, they can make you a PGO We don't need cells, we have claiming If you want scumhunting, do it yourself The general plan for a town in a whisper/PM setup is 1) Wait on a confirm 2) Massclaim to the confirmed 3) Profit | ||
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On February 23 2011 18:01 LunarDestiny wrote: Ser Aspi attempted to make a well formulated case after putting an FoS out on me. This is exactly what you said. Then you say that it isn't what happened exactly. So you put in misinformation on purpose to catch people off guard. Also you can get away with it because afterward you say that it is done on purpose. If your kind of play is classify as a pro town move, then mafia can use this excuse to slip away after getting caught. Your posts got a lot of lies in them if you keep this up. I know there are pro town lies but consistent lying will just degrade the value of your posts. You just typed 3 paragraphs about how I didn't correctly use a comma, and you are still misrepresenting what I said; learn how to read. | ||
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On February 23 2011 17:46 chaoser wrote: Except in this situation if the groups are known publicly, then a blue getting dicked over by role reversal will immediately give town two very big suspects in the form of his circle mates. There's some pitfalls in the plan obviously, but i can see it working if we play it right. It cuts down on lurking/inactivity too and that's usually a big help. Also, why am I not on your list =[ Do you have a plan for town and can you comment on foolishness' statement about now anyone asking for his opinion means they're mafia? it's hard to read you i guess i'll put you in neutral? everyone else is just a lack of a good read, so neutral sorry. I believe what you're talking about would just lead to WIFOM. Lurkers/inactives will be that way regardless of what cell they're in. I don't see how that is a valid point. | ||
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+ Show Spoiler + people to keep alive: gryffindor foolishness kenpachi ser aspi ohN leaning town: LastArgument (you're thinking, WUT?, but i'll explain if questioned) MrWiggles neutral: coagulation chaoser leaning scum: lunardestiny GMarshal Lynch, Lynch, Lynch: accidentally "edited" a post a page ago, however, I didn't change a single thing intentionally. It was a mistake, as I was just retrieving that list to update it. @ohN, reaction test | ||
gryffindor
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Mafia will bandwagon, or let town vote town. They're not going to stack votes unless it is Lylo and they absolutely have to. They'd rather sit back, and let us tear each others throats open, which we are doing by not coming to a mutual understanding that we are just not understanding each other. I didn't mean to feed you any misinformation, and I felt it was a misinterpretation... first on your part, and then on mine realizing that you sort of understood what I meant. I'm taking our argument to be town on town, due to the sheer amount of confusion I have in what you're trying to say exactly. Do you agree with me that our arguing could have simply been a misunderstanding? | ||
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On February 23 2011 23:13 GMarshal wrote: If you want feel free to RNG the groups, I just made it so each group had at least one veteran player so that new players could get good feedback, if you want you could slide one of the columns up or down a random number to change the groups around also I have issues with this post of your gryffindor, 1 it looks suspiciously like the plan that ended up with town getting raped in salem, 2 what benfit do you get from a mass claim when the DTs can be easily fooled? All the other roles don't require any kind of exposure as Vigi and Hatters can use their own discretion and medics should have clear cut choices. What does mass claiming to a "confirmed" (you still haven't set out a mechanism to confirm a townie) do for them other than expose them to getting hit by mafia? Also I agree that if you want scumhunting you should do it yourself, but like many other things it benefits from peer review, again this is partially to stimulate activity as in PM games newer players often feel left out of the backstage conversations and post less for that reason, its extremely frustrating in that situation. Also assuming the setup is 5-7 mafia they still have 3-4 kill points which is average for a 30 person game, this means that they don't need to use their role reversing powers successfully to win, they just need to slaughter the town, if they can do that by using role reversal then it will be faster, but ultimately they don't have to. TBH I think you are town, I just think your plan would cost us the game if we were to follow it Actually, I disagree with you COMPLETELY, which is why i'm not only keeping you as my top scumread, but keeping my vote on you as well. The level of bullshit that you are trying to pervade into people's minds is astonishing. You, in a PM setup, are against claiming to people who are confirmed? How anti-town can you get? You then go onto say that I haven't provided any ways of confirmation, when we have Detectives, Vigilantes, and Medics. Detective checks we will have to take with a grain of salt, considering kill power vs lawyering/framing, but we will be able to judge that BASED on that kill power in and of itself, the vigilantes should be calling shots tomorrow on D2 for the 2nd night, earning medic protecting, and the medics should be able to whisper their saved players... all of these things can confirm people... problem? What does "being left out" of the PM game and its frustration have anything to do with scumhunting, or lack thereof? I'm not following your train of thought here. They won't have over 6 mafia, and they won't have over 3kp. There is no way it won't have 6, with 2-3KP. That's how it will be, or else it won't be balanced. I'd also ask you to completely abandon any idea you have for "creating cells" when it is d1 in a large game in which we will get confirmed townies. On February 23 2011 23:25 kitaman27 wrote: PMs are a town weapon. The fact that multiple people are discouraging their use is concerning. Town should be able to extract information from mafia, not the other way around. You force the scum to give an opinion when you directly contact them 1:1. People complain that mafia have too much influence through PMs. How about you use that against them and identify the motives behind what they are saying instead? I don't like the idea of being told which two people I should talk to, but I certainly wouldn't advocate keeping all discussion in the thread. I take it you didn't read my strategic post On February 23 2011 17:26 gryffindor wrote: The general plan for a town in a whisper/PM setup is 1) Wait on a confirm 2) Massclaim to the confirmed 3) Profit This is how you play The amount of misinterpretation/not seeing the whole picture/poor play (at the least) here is really startling me I also find the "PMing about spam" to be offensive. If someone has a problem with spam, please step forward and address the town. If nothing new was being brought to the table, or arguments panned out, I would understand, but we are coordinating what to do as a town. Basically, I would like to formally complain about the people complaining about the activity - If you can't handle the game, replace out in my opinion. You signed up for a mafia game, didn't you? Thanks! | ||
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From my interpretation, they use KP nightly. Address RoL here if you need it to be addressed, publicly, asking him in the thread - I've pestered him enough. I love discussing the possible setups with you, but it is really giving you an easy way out of actually scumhunting, so lets direct the power roles less and actually try to scumhunt, ok? I'm also taking a break from posting | ||
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On February 24 2011 06:29 annul wrote: also hi. am out of class now why arent we killing chaoser or GM? im gonna go ##vote chaoser now myself. Annul is teamed with gmarshal. When mafia fos someone d1 and vote someone else they are teamed with their fos. On my phone, will catch up more later. This is a huge slip for d1 though, two scum caught possibly. | ||
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On February 24 2011 10:22 icemac wrote: Also, I just want to say that these cell things is either big balls move by mafia or the workings of bad play. Agree. Vote gmarshal with me, he is the one who had the.idea | ||
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On February 24 2011 10:32 Mr. Wiggles wrote: Quoting so it doesn't get buried. What do people think of this? I find it very interesting for sure. Would any more experienced player like to point out if this is a slip, or if gryf is misleading town? Go to mafiascum Type in common tells in the wipi search Go to mafia tells Go to the d1 section Congratulate me, and realize I'm pro | ||
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I'm happy voting him for the opposite of your reasoning, though, in that he doesn't want a GMarshal lynch. I would join his wagon if it gets to the point where we need to consolidate. | ||
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My massclaim is to ONE PERSON who will be CONFIRMED through night actions That is how you play mafia as a town, you confirm a doctor or a vigilante through a protection or a kill. If it's a vigilante kill, it better be on mafia, or pre-called and you better hope the mafia don't skimp on killing power as opposed to previous nights, so the vigilante idea could be easily manipulated into submission. A protection, however, would give us a clear for a day. Cross-referencing counterclaims is how we would be able to create lynch-pools, or at the least be able to hold people accountable for their night actions in PMs, as opposed to in the thread which would enable mafia to counteract us with their role reversal mechanic. Just sayin' | ||
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On February 24 2011 15:14 Coagulation wrote: I Should mention i talked with ROL in PM and he may have shared some information relevant to the nature of this setup and from what little i could decipher or gather of it so far claiming seems to be the wrong way to go. claiming, to a confirmed, in PM.. on like DAY 2 or DAY 3. I'm not saying claim on d1, although if you all wanted to claim to me that would work. | ||
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you create a confirmation you whisper them your claims mafia will likely claim townie, we will probably have 1-3 of each power role if we have like 5 trackers, though, who knows. It can happen if you have a certain mod. | ||
gryffindor
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OK lets dissect that game... made... use PMs Ok, he made the game, and we can use PMs... It's not right to mass claim to someone who isn't confirmed, sure. That's what you're blindly saying, right? Now, if someone is confirmed to have taken a hit in the night (mafia have been killing 2 people n1 and n2, and then they only kill 1) -> vet comes forward and claims to have been hit -> town claims to him -> profit Now, I would only say N1 and N2 on this scenario, because mafia can choose to manipulate that. I would want to use this d3 at the earliest (if we haven't caught scum yet)... It's all just reactionary. Just because you make two barracks, doesn't mean you have to mass marines. You can end up floating one for scouting, or even make medics to blind observers. The point of my plan is that it is just a basic way to play this setup correctly, as opposed to people lashing out against it because they got played in one particular game... Salem mafia, was it? Well, I wasn't in that game. I love people getting raised up about being outted in PMs. It's actually proper to withhold information. That's why you wait on a confirmation. Then, you PM them, so the mafia can't see what you're saying in the thread to use it against you. The above veteran scenario is actually bad. If you get a PM from the mod, as a doctor, saying you had a successful protection though.... bingo. If a cop rolechecks someone, and sees they are a mad hatter, then there is confirmation there are many ways to have confirmed people on d2, d3 We wait on them to claim We can do this while having scumhunting cells. As long as you DONT ROLECLAIM in your cells, I don't see a problem in it. | ||
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On February 24 2011 15:31 LSB wrote: PMs are great for purposes other than trying to make some kind of ill fated town circle which is going to fail and loose the town the game. For example, in PM gryffindor just defended Iceman/annul. When annul flips red this will prove very useful information. Are you kidding? I would lynch either one of them. | ||
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however, i would vote him BECAUSE of that. | ||
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On February 24 2011 15:31 LSB wrote: PMs are great for purposes other than trying to make some kind of ill fated town circle which is going to fail and loose the town the game. For example, in PM gryffindor just defended Iceman/annul. When annul flips red this will prove very useful information. I could reference a particular game in which it lead to a lopsided town victory, and a game in which the town didn't create a circle whatsoever which was a convincing scum win. It's a case by case scenario. People don't have to believe in confirmation, but I know I will claim immediately when that time comes, except seriously this time. Now, if you all want to lynch me, as some LAL(lynch all liars), go right ahead. Lose your best tactician. | ||
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Also, how is it that you can't correlate my idea with his cell idea? Just because we have cells scumhunting, doesn't mean we can't PM a confirmed on d2 or d3. I do not see how it is black vs white, when there is in fact a lot of room for gray area. | ||
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Both address me I'm loving this Both of you want me to explain my confirmation idea, and Barundar, you will not be forced to claim or anything... How can mafia fake a PM received from a moderator to a doctor saying you protected successfully, or that they are such and such role... We can get confirmation very easily. Cubedin, We don't have to focus on creating one big cell all at once, we would want to only have 1 person knowing everything, actually. The person would likely be killed, unless there are multiple confirmations in the same night. We don't have to really do any of this, scumhunting is completely fine. Foolishness mentioned he would be fine voting Jackal in PM with me, and I can see the train of thought, but I would rather lynch someone through my proper sleuthery in finding tells that they have made, such as the associative tells between GMarshal and Annul that I found, which is enough for me to be happy with where my vote is. Couple that with the fact that both have had wishy-washy voting/pushing, and with the incrimination of icemac, and I'd be surprised if two out of three weren't scum. Foolishness, however, disagrees with me on this. His loss! | ||
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Jackal, your entrance into the game was your exit for me. I don't like being voted by a relative inactive, but I like it even less when said vote comes with an insult. Good riddance. | ||
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1. 5. Jackal58 2. 17. astroorion 3. 1. Coagulation Cell 2, Cell leader: kitaman27+ Show Spoiler + 4. 19. Gofarman 5. 21. kitaman27 6. 12. icemac Cell 3, Cell leader: IDC, they're all competant+ Show Spoiler + 7. 6. Kenpachi 8. 2. LSB 9. 26. LunarDestiny Cell 4, Cell leader: Barundar+ Show Spoiler + 10. 30. LastArgument 11. 3. Barundar 12. 9. gryffindor Cell 5, Cell leader: deconduo+ Show Spoiler + 13. 16. ohN 14. 28. deconduo 15. 8. annul Cell 6, Cell leader: Foolishness+ Show Spoiler + 16. 18. Foolishness 17. 27. Ser Aspi 18. 22. kevconsim Cell 7, Cell leader: Seraph/Mr. Wiggles+ Show Spoiler + 19. 11. Beneather 20. 15. seRapH 21. 24. Mr. Wiggles Cell 8, Cell leader: OriginalName+ Show Spoiler + 22. 14. JBright 23. 23. ICanFlyLow 24. 13. OriginalName Cell 9, Cell leader: Chaoser+ Show Spoiler + 25. 7. darmousseh 26. 25. chaoser 27. 20. Conversion MaxwellE Cell 10, Cell leader: Cubedin+ Show Spoiler + 28. 4. CubEdIn 29. 29. why 30. 10. GMarshal Now, the "leader" to me is someone who needs to go out of their way to actually collaborate with the other people in their group. If you don't want to use my list of cells, and want to use GMarshal's, whatever. I have a good list I just made right here ready for us to use. Basically, the leaders need to go out of their way to make this work. I am fully confident in these peoples abilities to report what is going on within your cell, and to hold people accountable. | ||
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Also, if I'm "most certain"ly scum, and you're the "most certain" about me, how come I'm 2nd on your list? Seems like a contradiction. I don't really care that you're voting for me, because I like that you're taking a definitive stance, as opposed to mulling over something halfheartedly - I was against the cells at first, too, when they I was concerned that they would encourage claiming The thing is, people will claim over time eventually anyways. It doesn't even matter how we go about this. People are either going to PM, or they're not. Noone can make you participate in your cell, but considering your latest posts, perhaps you should take the initiative and PM coagulation. I doubt you will, but it would be a good move for you being pro-town. The other member of the cell that I list randomized you into would be astroorion. I seriously considered your cell to be the weakest until you posted, and I am quite pleased that you seem competant, relatively speaking. I'm sad you suspect me, but whatever. I'll grow on ya. If Coagulation doesn't step up to the plate in your cell, you need to, because astroorion isn't going to (check the top of this page) | ||
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I guess that goes undetected. | ||
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you are reaking of town right now | ||
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i don't feel like i have shit to explain, either, deconduo you want me to post that PM from you about your scummy idea? I didn't think so I could make a GREAT case on you right now, a very convincing one, but I'm not convinced yet myself. Call me a VI again, though, and that will change. I apologize if you feel like I have hurt the integrity of your game, RoL, and I would replace out if you so desire. | ||
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Annul - 6 Gofarman deconduo Ser Aspi LSB astroorion Gryffindor Icemac - 5 why kevonism seraph ICanFlyLow OriginalName People who need to pick one of the above, because their votes are on people with 2 or less: coagulation Jackal58 Barundar Darmousseh chaoser Jbright annul If your name isn't here, I either missed you or you're not voting. I'm sorry, or you're sorry! We've got 7-8 hours, from my recollection. Let's do something about it. People on 1-2 person wagons need to get on either Icemac or Annul. Vote: Annul Reasoning: Bandwagonning, and LSB believing he is scum. I also like the wagon more, excluding astroorion who I feel will probably come off of it due to being Annul's scumbuddy. | ||
gryffindor
United States524 Posts
On February 25 2011 04:36 deconduo wrote: You can't get a read on me so you threaten to get me lynchd if I annoy you? Right. Here are our PMs, please tell me what my scummy plan is. + Show Spoiler + To gryffindor: One of the main parts of the cell idea is that no claims are made. -_- Its NOT a town circle, its an idea circle. This post describes it better than I can: you cut out the part that I was concerned with, actually | ||
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United States524 Posts
On February 25 2011 04:56 annul wrote: 1, bandwagoning. by whom? by you, you mean? because i am entirely certain that i began the wagons on chaoser and GM. called them out ridic early in the game and continued to question the cells idea logic all game. so... ? Note the bolded that is a direct lie -> open voting thread -> see the first vote on GMarshal, in the VERY first vote, from yours truly You are lying. | ||
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On February 26 2011 12:48 Jackal58 wrote: Unless of course you're gryffinder. Then by all means claim some thing else. ##VOTE: Gryffindor ##Vote: Jackal58 I was on the Annul wagon, a wagon on mafia. Were you? I didn't think so. | ||
gryffindor
United States524 Posts
I haven't ever bussed someone on teamliquid; it isn't how mafia is played here. If you expect people to be bussing, you are playing very poorly as town. Would I really go out of my way to push the lynch of my mafia buddy? Would said mafia buddy THEN counterpush me? Who have I had interactions with that would look like my scumbuddies? IF I am lynched, this is a very laughable town Annul had associative tells with both GMarshal and Icemac, both of whom we should pursue lynches on, but you all are so hurt that someone is a better player than you, you can't get over the fact that OMGUS/bussing is just senselessly being thrown at me when both aren't relevant to this particular scenario. The OMGUS relatedness isn't relevant because some OMGUS is very-town, especially when the goal of it is to point out that I'm part of the reason why Annul got lynched. Apart from GMarshal or IceMac, Seraph would also be a good lynch from my perspective, due to the recent post he made sounding like goading/fake-sincerity regarding the medic/cop snipe, and considering his excuse for lurking in the same post... well, it just reads forced and overly defensive. GMarshal looks like Annul's buddy to me, because Annul gave him a casual FoS in a post that he failed to try make look real, followed by voting someone else. It was way past where the RVS should end, and it was a lackluster post saying "Well, i'd lynch gmarshal or ___". He listed GMarshal first, talked about him like he was suspicious, then failed to vote him, voting someone else. Now, I see I have a few votes on me now, so unvote If you're unfamiliar with me, go read Orgah mafia. http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=186653 I am a Serial Killer in this game, and obviously scum. I say obviously, because my play there as scum is contrasted with how I am playing in this game. In that game, I was generally unhelpful, lurking, and inactive. This game, I am very active, and dedicated to the town teching up thanks guys, love you all | ||
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United States524 Posts
On February 27 2011 03:18 chaoser wrote: Wouldn't mafia, if they were trying to redirect off annul, find it easier to pick gryf to stack on? He lied multiple times, changed from no to the PMs to yes to PMs but with his own list. I mean, that's a much easier case to be made than to do it on jackal right? It doesn't make sense to try to push jackal is a viable lynch candidate for mafia when the big juicy target of gryf is there. they tried to shift votes onto me notice how i was also voted at the start of this phase they definitely want me gone. I didn't just vote annul, I actually made about a 40 line case on him, which I guess people missed | ||
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United States524 Posts
On February 27 2011 04:54 chaoser wrote: I don't agree with you LSB, Jackal wasn't an easier choice than Gryf or icemac. I think at that point, no one had voted for Jackal yet, so for mafia to start a completely new bandwagon instead of using one that already had a decent amount of people in it is weird and not what mafia would do. So basically you claimed town, you didn't even say "good players" you said "proven scumhunters" aka keep us around cause we'll help town win please don't lynch us or town is fucked. Not to mention you scream for medic protection, making it seem like you're town. If we're wrong about you being town and you're actually mafia then it's far worse for the town as well. The whole time you've been building up this image of, don't lynch me town, you're going to get dicked cause you need me via subtle threats to town. BC's guide has stated that we need multiple leaders and not to depend on one guy. By trying to consolidate power in a way that's subtle and a bit underhanded, aren't you just making the town depend on you? That's the worse possible thing for town to do, especially since there's a decent amount of newbies who will sheep. What are you trying to pull? I don't know if you're red but I do know that if barundar flips green, you're the first one on my lynch list. If you take the bolded parts, gryf is an easier mislynch than jackal, because of newbies sheeping... I actually agree with that. People don't step up and provide their own analysis. I'm not going to take hours to compose a defense, because I don't feel like I need to. If I had to pick on who was scum between LSB/Barundar, well, who pushed the Annul lynch? LSB. After that, it stalled, and I pushed it again. You know what's even more funny? I tried to engage both of these guys in PM. LSB was non-compliant, and sarcastic. That is what I know of him from his town play, though he is fully capable of misleading people as scum. I'm pretty sure he's town. I'm not going to vote for him, or deter his lynch, though. I won't vote for him because I'm not sure if he's scum, but I won't deter his lynch not only because I'm not sure he isn't, but because I find him to be detrimental to the town as a whole due to focusing too much on mechanics and policy. He also has AtE in relation to him dying in the night, is very arrogant when not justified, and his play is self indulgent. So no, I'm not going to defend him, and I don't care what he flips, but I'm not going to vote him. His AtE is a "i don't want to die" and could also be read as power-role-coaching His arrogance is relating to his scumhunting, when his push he would have done regardless He pushed Annul because he didn't like him, that is null, even if he will lie and say he didn't His defense he will push of this of "I found Annul to be scum, lynched him, etc." doesn't mean that he couldn't have found annul as scum or lynched him as scum, as he would surely know he was scum here. I saw reference to a statement with which he said "when annul flips red", and I'm pretty sure it was read too far into, but it is interesting to note that he said that. List 3 of his list "people to kill when blue" is interesting to say the least. Him having that at all makes me ask why is he so concerned with who is a power role? Could it be because he is sending in the kills? | ||
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United States524 Posts
On February 27 2011 05:03 chaoser wrote: EBWOP (is that how you abbreviate it? lol): The only reason mafia would pick jackal over BOTH grfy and icemac is if both of them were mafia and they had to start a new one. So if barundar does flip red, we should pay attention to those two icemac has been scumslipping throughout the thread, and Annul voted me with his last bated breath. I don't see how you can categorize me with him, as a mislynch, when he is likely scum I'm surely going to vote him. vote: icemac | ||
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On February 27 2011 10:29 bumatlarge wrote: Well I read into the whole annul thing, and it doesn't seem to be an organized bus. Especially with that little squirming performance, but then dropping it quickly in a manner I'd expect from him as scum. I didn't find much to point out on who was leading the accusations, but it does give me a nice ladelful of confidence for the town. Deconduo is not scum I feel, and mostly everyone behind it is likely not. GMarshal is a bit tricky because he seems a little too apologetic, but I've only played with him as town, and he would tend to get apologetic when he isn't inquisitive. Maybe he's just more confident? Anyway, I think annul is probably the better catches for town to get early. I think town would be better served in pressuring the more reserved since that roster seems fairly slim in this game. I like icemac as a lynch target, and others like him that don't quite cut the bill. They are much easier to tell apart then good townie players that keep their mouths in check but speak when it is right, such as ohn. LSB is silly. Good analysis That slot was so.. inactive.. but I'm glad to see you have your head in the right place. Are you referring to LSB/Barundar as the scum playfighting? Have you analyzed the d1 wagons yet? | ||
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On February 27 2011 11:45 Kenpachi wrote: Lynch Targets i feel are Barundar and maybe LSB is Barundar provides good evidence pointing the LSB that hes scum. I dont want to vote Barundar yet cause i thought Annul was townie but ended up being Mafia. We have to pressure the inactives but the one i want to participate is astroorion. he is doing absolutely nothing and should ask for a replacement. ##vote: Astroorion do something yo. Lynch targets described as A and B Votes for C Found Annul to be town, whoops he ended up as mafia, information instead of analysis You want someone replaced? How about Beneather who was just nearly modkilled for Diplomacy Kenpachi just earned himself some scumpoints | ||
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How long have you been playing here? Reds usually stick together. Sure, they will jump onto players like Icemac if the voting is heavy, but... teamliquid's voting is rarely heavy. Post I accidentally posted in the voting thread, where I ended up pushing Annul: + Show Spoiler + OK, listen up guys, this is pitiful the amount of people voting, and the size of the wagons. We only have 5 people on the major wagons, how are we going to properly analyze voting with all of these split votes and cases? We need to consolidate to see who swings late, etc. Annul - 6 Gofarman deconduo Ser Aspi LSB astroorion Icemac - 5 why kevonism seraph ICanFlyLow OriginalName People who need to pick one of the above, because their votes are on people with 2 or less: coagulation Jackal58 Barundar Darmousseh chaoser Jbright annul We've got 7-8 hours, from my recollection. Let's do something about it. People on 1-2 person wagons need to get on either Icemac or Annul. Vote: Annul Reasoning: Bandwagonning, and LSB believing he is scum. I also like the wagon more, excluding astroorion who I feel will probably come off of it due to being Annul's scumbuddy. So I took the time to tally ALL the votes, even if I only listed these. The other wagons, such as my own, only had 2 votes on them. Jackal, for one, shouldn't even count. Regardless of alignment, he should be lynched on policy for his tunneling. That is very unhelpful, and gives an excuse not to scumhunt. Onto more important issues, notice how close the voting was here? It was like 5-5, and I voted Annul, making it 6-5. Would mafia bus at that point? Also, look at the Icemac wagon. Many of the players, such as kevconsim, end up actually joining the Annul wagon. Bussing? Perhaps, but I doubt it. With Annul's vote ending up on me, I'm pretty sure they were considering staging a late push on me, but my rekindling of the Annul wagon with this votecount and me accusing him of bandwagonning (WHICH HE LATER ATTACKED ME FOR), came too far late in the day for them to properly stage a counter push. What of these two wagons, Gmarsh? I personally feel they were both on scum, hence why I'm voting Icemac. As you can see from the above post that is spoilered, I am also fine lynching astroorion, but considering it is being used to deter the Barundar-LSB situation, I'm seeing that Kenpachi might be pushing an easy lynch on him. That makes me want to wait on that. I was afraid you would strawman that post when I saw you were dissecting it, and to be honest you only made 1 huge mistake from it other than jumping to the wrong conclusions, where you stated I was trying to make associative tells between you and iceman. How can I do that? I only know my own alignment, so if I was to do that like I did with you and annul/iceman and annul it would really only be relative to someone flipping. Iceman had stated he didn't want to lynch you, annul, myself, or chaoser.. possibly among others... and this post was so scummy Why grilled him on it. I don't know if he answered the case on him, I doubt he did. Why, at the least, wanted to know if he meant 0 or 1 there, as it would change the entire meaning of the post from defense to offense just based upon what he meant. That would be the only association I remember you having with Icemac, but I wasn't saying that, you took my words out of context on accident. If I was pushing you for that, I would have to push myself, as he lumped you and I into the same category. The fact he lumped Annul in there as well, who flipped scum, makes me believe that he actually wasn't for voting any of the people who were generally active who he listed. His post was rather bland and unhelpful, really, even if it was a defense. Saying "i don't want players 1, 2, 3, and 4 lynched" without any evidence as to why you don't is generally useless. I hope that clears up that I was stating you and annul as having associative tells, completely from him towards you. I highlighted that later in the post, about his FoS into a vote of someone else which is a JEEP tell on d1, and you praised my scumhunting of you. Your defense of this was that "I'm wrong", basically. We'll see if I'm wrong. All in all, I hope you're town. On February 27 2011 12:29 Jackal58 wrote: C'mon man. You've been reading every page of this game. What more do you want me to say about Gryf? He's nuts. Since when is being nuts indicative of alignment? Aren't town the ones who have to rely on conspiracy theories moreso, as mafia are comforted in the sanity of knowing who is who? So, if anything, I would access that as a town tell. On February 27 2011 14:19 Coagulation wrote: Anybody see the scum slip? "if im town" .. Yeah, I saw that. I'm voting him. On February 27 2011 14:44 LunarDestiny wrote: Back. Catchup time... So mafia are targeting experienced players like they always do. People are talking about annul's lynch and there is a bus on annul. First of all, I don't think mafia would sacrifice one of their member to make others more safe. So those who voted annul early or greatly accused him aren't likely to be mafia. Those who jump onto the bandwagon or voted late without giving good reasons should be looked at. Now THIS is an accurate assessment of bussing on Teamliquid I completely agree with LunarDestiny. Why else do you think Mr.Wiggles as killed? He was voting Annul. You think they're going to kill someone who wasn't voting annul last night? Maybe, but they surely killed someone who was. It is more likely people tacked their votes on when it was more clear he was going to be the lynch, at like 8-5 or more spread out on the votecount between him and icemac. @Barundar, you quoted a post explaining Annul's vote on me, then you say if me/icemac aren't red he is bussing? I agree that Icemac is probably red, but Annul was voting me, probably having been instructed to do so. | ||
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United States524 Posts
On February 28 2011 02:36 why wrote: At the moment I am actually thinking that both Barundar and LSB are town and are just at each other's throats. I just didn't find Barundar's arguments all that convincing, as I read through it I was like "sure, but he could also be town with that behavior". But I don't think Barundar would have posted something that long without being town (and he is fitting his town m.o. of long analysis + conspiracy theories). Of course, now that LSB is defending himself, I feel he is more likely mafia because he isn't considering the possibility that Barundar is town and his only defense is that we should lynch Barundar (really?) To me, the best explanation of the annul lynch was simply that icemac and possibly gryff are mafia and it was difficult to lynch anyone else. LSB may be mafia but I think icemac being mafia would open up that case a lot (if icemac is mafia then LSB is likely mafia opportunistically taking credit for busing annul after its clear he is going to die). Icemac has also done nothing today and soft defended annul a lot yesterday. Anyway, for now: ##Unvote ##Vote: Icemac This makes absolutely no sense, and setting up a chainlynch like this on someone who voted Annul OVER Icemac (townie) when annul had 5 votes and icemac had 5 votes surely wouldn't have been done by mafia. EXCUSE me to forcibly double post, but I am setting this one seperate from my main post which is coming, because I for sure want people to read this. Why setting up a chainlynch WHILE VOTING WHO I'M VOTING on me is laughable. I voted annul, in the middle of the lynch, and now LSB and why are pushing me? ha I voted icemac because I felt that scum TRIED TO WAGON ME as opposed to him, which made him look like scum. How can you even put me on that list? I had 2 votes on me when annul had like 10, because of my push on him bandwagonning and unvoting, plus LSB convinced me in PMs to vote him after he said he wouldn't push him regardless, and actually felt he was red. I was sniffing out whether or not it was a bus/whether or not he was blindly pushing like L or Ace would do, regardless of alignment. I'm just glad LSB isn't as good at lynching people as L, Ace, or I... hence why my target got lynched, and not his. | ||
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That was clarified as sarcasm. I'm trying to find where I left off, but I saw this and had to respond. RoL clarified that, did you not see it? On February 27 2011 22:21 Jackal58 wrote: Barundar, I was strongly suspecting you as being scum creating a "false" argument with LSB. A tit for tat that would sew enough doubt in everybody's mind to allow a 3rd candidate to get pushed to the lynch. But after your Homeric epic on LSB I feel that I must dismiss that idea. I don't believe Scum would go that far in a charade. Instead of believing you both to be scum I am fairly certain one of you surely is. However I am not 100% sure which. However I will be after today's lynch. As I've said before this is a numbers game. I am playing them now. Town still has a large numerical advantage. If LSB flips green you are surely scum and will be dealt with tomorrow. UNVOTE: Gryffindor VOTE: LSB Um, LSB proposed the idea first. This is completely his baby. This is a misrepresentation. Is there a reason you aren't really scumhunting behaviorally, and are tunneling on minute details? It is pretty bad play. On February 27 2011 23:04 JBright wrote: A lot of interesting arguments are being thrown around, but none of them are particularly compelling enough to throw any one person to the top. For now, I'll go with the possible scum slip and vote for icemac. ##vote: icemac Now that I've seen icemac flip, I don't really like this post. Sure, I started the wagon for d2 afaik, but jumping on with a weak 3 line post sheeping reasoning is even worse. On February 28 2011 01:55 LSB wrote: So people are voting for me because I'm too good? Wow, good job TL Town! Great job! Appeal to Emotion right here I wish I had been online to see this I would have instantly voted him I shouldn't be saying this, as he's going to kill me in the night now -great On February 28 2011 02:01 LSB wrote: In case you haven't realized, I've already analyzed Annul before, I know how he plays. Secondly, I will say it right now. I put the most comprehensive analysis on Annul, and without my constant badgering and pushing, annul probably wouldn't have died. In addition, you completely ignore my town play. My town play = find mafia and kill. There is a reason why I usually don't live to see day 2. Because mafia take me out early. Your attack is all WIFORM: You are saying "hey what if LSB was scum", well he would play that way. Only problem is it is a complete misrepresentation, my scum play and my town play are completely different, here is a link for how Incog describes it http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190444¤tpage=21#415 Here, you act like meta can't be changed. I completely disagree with you. Furthermore, when I say TL.net doesn't bus, you aren't cleared of that, since you play on mafiascum with me. On February 28 2011 02:04 LSB wrote: Hey guys, lets just use our lynch on Barundar, once he flips red, I'll be cleared. Ezpz. In addition, this is the same problem with Barundar's push against Jackal58, + Show Spoiler + Oops, 'scumslip' I said Barundar was read can you REALLY explain to me how him flipping clears you? that makes absolutely no sense. Even if he's red, you could be BUSSING HIM. I mean, your arguments are all about bussing, why is this bus not even more epic? I find that more likely than you having bussed annul. I've been reading you two quibbling as town on town honestly. On February 28 2011 02:04 LSB wrote: EWBOP He just reads too much in individual posts. I know annul red, ezpz. I know Barundar is red. Lynch him and clear me. you would KNOW he was red if YOU were red. This does not clear you. I'm so glad town was above lynching you guys for your tomfoolery. Even with icemac gone... oh well... he wasn't that good of a townie. On February 28 2011 02:08 deconduo wrote: Good analysis, I agree with most of the points. However, I can't vote LSB ahead of someone who has repeatedly lied, changed his opinions from black to white and posts like this: I would also be vary wary of ANYONE posting like this: Why have the two of you completely discounted the possibility of both of them being town? @LSB Thats not much of a defense. I agree with this My only question is this: Why are people from the United Kingdom so against being blackmailed? It was really a hollow threat, anyways, to see how you would react. Tunneling worse than jackal? probably not, but I'm taking you pushing me to be town. I don't really care, though, except I'll have to get rid of you all before LYLO unless you get your heads out of your asses and decide to actually scumhunt the other dozens of people in the game who could be scum. If I'm such a liar, am I lying about how I pushed Annul when it was 5-5 and I made it 6-5 with reasoning of bandwagonning and liking LSB pushing him? Have I voted for LSB? No. Am I lying about that? Maybe! No, but really, I wish I would have voted LSB now that I've seen his AtE. On February 28 2011 02:10 LSB wrote: Go lynch Barundar and once he flips red that will be my defense. OK, so you bussed him. That will be my offense. What is your defense of you knowing he was red before he flipped? There isn't one possible. If you REALLY want to be cleared, you better hope you're a blue or a medic protects you. I'm not going to 'clear' you behaviorally, unless something is very solid. Bussing usually occurs at the start or the end of the wagon, someone like myself or wiggles was a lot more cleared off of annul flipping than you from my perspective. I have seen AGar, who was Judge here (ace definitely will remember his horrible d1 medic claim in the game chezinu ended up catching him in PM land when he was on a team with mikeymoo... funny game, i really recommend that read... i believe it was the 2nd mini run here.), bus someone on d1 or d2... having started the wagon on them... and was generally thought to be cleared for the rest of the game like you are claiming to be. - I'm not going to let that happen again. I'm not voting you, but I have my eye on you for your pushing of a bus on someone else when it was just as likely you did it yourself, even moreso from the looks of you pushing how "clear" you are going to be. On February 28 2011 02:17 deconduo wrote: Yeah, thats enough for me but I'm still lynching gryff tomorrow. ##Unvote ##Vote LSB you can try, but i don't believe you'll have support, as a lot of good players view me as town you are pushing me for very silly reasoning, and a personal feel you played with me as a SK, and you pushed the cell idea in Orgah (supposedly, or so you said in PM, do you dispute that?) You also backed it up here. I killed you as scum, when you were the godfather, in orgah. Sure, you are playing differently here than there, but you had red text creating your play there. You could easily be lurking/tunneling/pushing me actively just to appear like you are scumhunting when you are, actually, in fact, not. On February 28 2011 02:23 Jackal58 wrote: I haven't. But pressure works better than praise. I'm still favoring gryffindor. I agree with this. However, you're voting me for ME pressuring people, really. My 'lie' was a joke relating to how the host supposedly coached a player how to play this game... that just seems like it shouldn't be happening. Deconduo pushing me is because he has a pretty funny PM in my inbox, from my perspective. I don't believe he is scum, though, due to meta, or I would have been pushing him. On February 28 2011 02:36 LSB wrote: I don't like this "I think both of them are town" argument. Barundar is red. Lynch him. Why is he red? On February 28 2011 02:42 Jackal58 wrote: I'm wondering if team scum is ballsy enough to bus two members two days in a row in order to create the illusion that one of you is so freaking town that he can become almost immune to scrutiny. I like this train of thought. Even if LSB lynched Barundar, who flipped red, he wouldn't be 'clear' I wouldn't be voting him right away, but I wouldn't be anyways. On February 28 2011 02:44 LSB wrote: Idc if you think I'm scum as long as you kill Barundar. And then I'll kill another scum for you day three. We cool? you gonna suicide? d3 is late for a suicide On February 28 2011 02:48 why wrote: @LSB What exactly is your argument again? As far as I can tell it is "he forced analysis on Jackal to shift the lynch from annul" and now "Barundar's case on me isn't that good". You seem awful sure for that to be your evidence. Barundar seems to be playing his pretty usual town self, and the conspiracy theory is totally town from him (see XXXV Barundar believes RoL bussed annul). I have a question: If Barundar is red, then why did he do analysis on Jackal rather than on icemac or gryff yesterday? Both of them had more heat on them and would have been an easier lynch than starting something on jackal. Barundar and I scumhunted through PM, whereas LSB wouldn't really reply to me much. LSB actually let there be a couple hour gap before I PMed him again, badgering him about his feelings on annul willingness to sacrifice self is much more townie you have pretty much said you would be pushing a different person d3... i view his as more town than yours. On February 28 2011 02:51 LSB wrote: He was the one who tried to redirect the lynch from annul, and this is shown as he forced analysis on Jackal. I've already explained why gryff is a harder lynch. As for iceman, well... it would be interesting if iceman was red. That could explain why annul was reluctant to lynch him. You explained this, but you also listed me on tier 3 doesn't make sense to me. Also, why were you even thinking that way, in terms of who would be power role sniped? It only makes sense for mafia to think that way. Well, for the most part. I'm sure you can imagine other reasons, as can I, but those are not proper to talk about! On February 28 2011 03:20 kevconsim wrote: I suggest we do this or lynch Icemac. We can move forward by 1) lynching Barundar 2) lynching LSB 3) lynching Icemac Those are the only viable ways of moving forward i can see. I suggest we lynch Barundar today and if he turns out to be town we lynch LSB If you think they are both town then we should lynch Icemac Anyways ##VOTE Barundar I view this as town. Couple this with the fact he shifted onto Annul at a good time for town to do so, and I'm asking for medic protection for kev. Protect on him would be good... This post is likely town. On February 28 2011 03:42 chaoser wrote: Think he's talk about you kev. Also, LSB, shame on you. Your whole defense has been lynch him first! he's mafia! I'm not! when he flips red you'll see how I'm green. You claim all he's doing is WIFOM but you're doing the same by linking to old games. We can't trust "play style" analysis 100% since smart players will obviously change it up. Or not change it up. That's WIFOM too. Respond to his individual points please, until you do my vote will be on you. He was willing to write a fucking essay; if he was mafia trying that hard, and you're really town, you would try just as hard. So far you're not and so you scumminess is getting higher for me. How is kev "on life support"? he was on the annul wagon. He obviously is good enough to pick out the red wagons, which is good enough for me. On February 28 2011 04:16 deconduo wrote: Why does everyone ignore me... you appear to be actively lurking, and tunneling, from my perspective of course it's easy for me to pick up on this, as it's me you're tunneling on. On February 28 2011 04:25 LSB wrote: There is a difference, and it's not what you say. They arguments are similar as both of them 1) Make assumptions on RoL's picks 2) Assume that Foolishness is mafia There is a few differences. My support of foolishness is weak, I recongnize that the argument shouldn't go far Barundar uses this assumption as central of FOS of me. His argument is that between LSB and Foolishness, foolishness is probably town so LSB must be mafia. In addition another difference is that I'm not accusing Barundar of being scum because of this argument. The difference is I'm pointing out that Barundar made the exact same argument and it is hypocritical of him to try to accuse me of being scum for using my argument. I agree with this information, but this being information instead of analysis, or IIoA, still makes it lack scumhunting. Had you said you were pushing him, actually, for a different reason, this would have made you look good to me. However, you didn't. On February 28 2011 04:32 LSB wrote: Of course annul's lynch was a bus at the end. I even agree to that. The reason why it was a bus was because I shot down all alternatives, and so the mafia couldn't bus anyone. You are making the flawed assumption that I was just another mafia on the bus. You are trying to figure out my actions based off what others were doing. That's a flawed form of reasoning. In addition, seriously, LSB bussing Annul? That sounds dumb. Think of it again. If it was DocH bussing LSB that sounds reasonable, but LSB bussing Annul is impossible. Considering I've been shot night one of every single game where I didn't yell out for medic protection, me yelling for medic protection is perfectly reasonable What do you mean? I posted lots of good analysis. Do I seriously need to link them for you? I'm sure your mafia. Why is to scummy to be sure that your mafia? Are you saying that stating my beliefs is a bad thing? My case on you is based on your forced analysis which is evident through your contradictions and flawed reasoning. Boom I've had more than 5 extensive post arguing my case and other things So if you want to make this a bottle collected game of "see who has lots of good posts", I win. You shot down all alternatives? Icemac, who is now confirmed to be a townie (very surprising to me), was at 5 votes the same time annul was... when I started pushing annul. you hardly shot down all alternatives. @Cubedin, bottom of page 50 I like your analysis of OriginalName's post On February 28 2011 05:49 GMarshal wrote: I looked through and saw there weren't any great analysis out on you icemac, so for your convenience I decided to write one! no need to thank me! ok I'm only going to take the relevant posts as people seem to dislike my posts where I look at every post (as usual my commentary in bold) + Show Spoiler + Seems like shit's hitting the wall pretty hard without any real leads so far. Since its too early, why not just get a semi-active who is probably smart enough to keep their heads in the game but not smart enough to post big as a mafia. I guess this is ironic coming from me seeing as how I've just got up to date & posting. this is an interesting point considering the fact that the people in suspicion at the time were me, gryff, annul and chaoser, if icemac flips red then we should scrutinize chaoser and gryffindor (and me actually) I'm not really sure of what to make of this post one way or another, seems just like a general town post + Show Spoiler + Also, I just want to say that these cell things is either big balls move by mafia or the workings of bad play. here is a post I take issue with, not because it goes against my plan, but because it provides no reasons for it, it just labels it as bad play. I have no problem with discussion, its when there is no reasoning behind it that I start to suspect people. Also its rather aggressive play for a player who just got here (not that that's a bad thing), but it is mimicking annul's "arguments" + Show Spoiler + Analysis doesn't mean shit Day 1. I don't see why you feel so compelled to pull stuff out of your ass and call it high level analysis. and here is a damning post, anyone who argues against analysis gets an automatic scum point in my book, and the rebuff saying it was pulled out of my ass in no way actually addresses any issues he may have with the analysis itself, +2 scum points + Show Spoiler + (~snip, gryffs mention of a possible link between me and annul) I doubt mafia is this stupid. Thats an interesting post actually, notice how this isn't constructive at all? I'm seeing a pattern here of not actually contributing and just dismissing things in general, now I know I'm town but if I were scum it could easily be a slip on annuls part, never dismiss a possible scum slip +1 scum point + Show Spoiler + I'm proposing we kill 0 of annul, GMarshal, gryffindor, chaoser and play it by ear afterwards. you were asked to clarify if you meant 1, if you did then this is a null contribution, as that was where the town was tending anyway and you failed to provide any reason why any of us was a compelling choice at all, +1 contentless posting! + Show Spoiler + (~snip me calling him out on the above posts) Alright, let's just say you are being productive, what conclusions are you actually arriving at? its a good question but he fails to substantiate his arguments, I think I call him out on dodging my questions later + Show Spoiler + (~snip, list of inactives by kita) Where are these people? thats not a contribution, at least put a vote on them to pressure them ,+1 meaningless posting + Show Spoiler + (~snip why's arguments against icemac) So by responding to posts, I'm up for lynch? I've said a lot: the current way we're analyzing data isn't optimal. I don't think we should be you using scant data on Day 1 such as you, yourself, are doing. The reason I'm not listing any names other than the inactives is because I have no reasoning against anyone. I don't think I'm forcing myself at all; instead, I'm making meaningful posts on how town should act on Day 1 which is lynching inactives and semi-actives trying to stay in the covers. Ok, so lets see that actual substance of your defense, basicly it is "I dont like analysis day 1" and "I dunno who to vote for" and you make a pretty basic mistake, you say town should go for lurkers day 1, which is a mistake, town should pressure lurkers day 1 and only lynch them if there is no better alternative, becuase it is easy for mafia to move votes onto a town inactive, rather than a scum lurker, still an easy mistake to make + Show Spoiler + (~snip do not claim message) seriously not a real contribution, but people have been doing this all game long (reinforcing the don't claim message) + Show Spoiler + What I mean is that we shouldn't lynch any actives because they're at least contributing. We'll be able to see their alignment or slipups in the future via posts/ pms/ hit patterns/ lynch patterns/ etc. If it's really that important, then I say ICanFlyLow for not talking at all. First person in the list I found that wasn't talking at all. ##Vote: ICanFlyLow so after deciding that my plan is scummy and 1 of gryffindor annul GMarshal or chaoser should be lynched you switch to an inactive? I already explained why voting for inactives to make them post is good, but after agroing on me so hard this seems like an abrupt change + Show Spoiler + (~snip ON making a FoS on him) How the heck am I red? Just because I'm smart enough to take a bipartisan approach to day 1 and not listen to over analysis and red-analysis doesn't mean I'm scum playing the middle of the road. Right now I'm pretty convinced you're either a baddie or straight up mafia. this is an OMGUS attack without the actual vote, since ON accused him he must be scum, this is bad play from icemac + Show Spoiler + Also, I'm not jumping into this Jackal58 bandwagon because I'm not bad. Lynch me if you will. this actualy merits a townie point, refusing to jump on an easy bandwagon to take votes and suspicion off himself + Show Spoiler + (~snip, Ser Aspi posts an accusation at wiggles) I like. Also, I hate how me and annul are cast with 100% of the blame for just being active holy shit. I think Ser Aspi is got something here. Trying to jump on an easy bandwagon or just easily persuaded? hard to tell, also you weren't taking the blame for being active, but rather for being aggressive without arguments. + Show Spoiler + What do you mean by a huge dive. I changed my vote from an afk-player who just stopped going afk to some major bandwagon scum. Playing it by ear. so you admit that you are essentially sheeping, that is terrible town play (see minimafia VII for an example of why), if you had at least said it was for reason 1,2 and 3 then it would have been but that just points to either bad play or something more sinister +.5 scum points + Show Spoiler + Fair analysis. I just want to ask about the lynches. Haven't played with TL before How significant are Darmousseh, Kitaman27, Mr. Wiggles as players? Are the known for being good players, etc. ? Also, is there any of their caliber that "should be dead" but isn't? I'm okay with ##Vote Barundar for now. stop sheeping , or if you are going to at least point out which points swayed you the most , ok LSB posted a good analysis but think critically about it, I will admit you weren't the only one swayed by it, so I'll give you a pass on that one. Also good questions, I'm glad you are thinking/asking them + Show Spoiler + Oh boy, if ohn is mafia and i'm town, i'm going to quote the hell out of this afterwards. it could be a slip, but we all make mistakes, Im willing to give him a pass Verdict: despite some mistakes and somewhat new play I don't think he is scum (last person I said that about was annul, so take it with a grain of salt), so for now I'm going to put him under sheeping town really though you need to start providing reasons for your posts. How did you know he was going to flip green? You gave him numerous "scum points", then conclude he is green? give me a break. On February 28 2011 05:57 icemac wrote: Oh boy here we go again with the over-analysis. Why so compelled to "defend" me? On February 28 2011 06:00 icemac wrote: I just think you're shady. Even icemac picks up on it, Gmarshal. On February 28 2011 06:43 LSB wrote: He always plays like this, I'd rather have a DT check used on this. Case in point, Haunted Mafia. He tried to get people to claim to him, pretended a DT claimed to him when there was none, and then lied repeatedly, gotmodkilled and flipped town. First off, I wasn't in Haunted Mafia. If I was, though, and I claimed to have a DT claim to me, I'm sure I could pull up said-PM On February 28 2011 07:07 chaoser wrote: He ask lied about his PMs with deconduo No, I really didn't. Deconduo was talking about how he proposed the cell idea from Orgah, where he was scum, and he also supported said idea here, making it look like he was scum. How is that lying? On February 28 2011 07:45 chaoser wrote: AHHHHHHHHHHH GAH! fuck it, i'm going to vote for the guy i've been suspicious of instead of this LSB/Barundar bullcrap vote: icemac first gmarshal putting FoS on me, then bandwagonning with me, then you combine that with you having a quicktime with him.. which icemac outted of all people... and your obviously forced reaction here AS YOU DEFENDED ME IN THE QUICKTIME. That open contradiction accrues scumpoints from me. On February 28 2011 07:50 LSB wrote: Voting Icemac because I want to move the lynch off of just 4 people. Also because Annul was reluctant to move the lynch onto Icemac Ohhh, so you're bandwagonning with me now, too? Great. I wish I had been around to see this. On February 28 2011 08:39 Coagulation wrote: ##Unvote ##Vote Icemac Why did you vote Icemac here? On February 28 2011 09:04 Jackal58 wrote: Well I suppose there is no such thing as a policy vote. Fair enough. ##unvote ##vote Icemac He's been doing post and ghost similar to divinek in XXXVI. And after a day of LSB and Barundar declaring No You! No You! I will take a dim view of people telling me I tunnel. You definitely tunnel. Foolishness lurks until D2 as mafia, yeah I read a game he did this as the Godfather On February 28 2011 10:55 Kenpachi wrote: It's the foolishness way. Do nothing for a long time to avoid getting killed by scum and spring and attack when you least expect it Glad to see you're defending this. You know he does this as scum, too, right? On February 28 2011 11:01 Jackal58 wrote: I believe it's my first game with him. How does he play when he's scum? Do nothing for a long time to avoid getting lynched? Honest question. This looks like a diversion off of icemak. Except everybody is jumping on board. I'm confused. I don't like being confused. Yes. On February 28 2011 11:34 Coagulation wrote: neither of them are mafia. at this point i would say best bet would be to lynch jbright how do you know? On February 28 2011 11:35 Coagulation wrote: he was active somewhat in orgah mafia hes completely inactive here Unvote ##vote jbright I dislike this, considering Icemac had just voted himself, and you voted him 30 minutes before... or at least said in the thread u were going to... i'll have to look to see if you actually did, though i'm like 99% sure you did based upon you posting vote:icemac in the thread.. it just looks like you're happy he accrued 1 more vote, so you're fine to take yours off as your buddy LD isn't going to be lynched. On February 28 2011 11:57 Coagulation wrote: kenpachi vote jbright scum coaching scum? check. On February 28 2011 12:01 Coagulation wrote: shit id rather lynch icemac than LD I'd say you would. On February 28 2011 12:11 Coagulation wrote: foolishness your case against LD was pretty week. hes normally an active poster and not acting like that in this game but that is a big can of wifom. HIS CASE ON HIM WAS WEAK? you're joking, right? We are lynching LD tomorrow I believe Foolishness wasn't hit because they felt he would be medic protected... we shall see if this was the case eventually, like d3 probably, if he isn't killed or hasn't caught us a red. I'm fairly certain that foolishness or I will be hit tonight I'd like to reiterate that medics should consider protecting kevconsim for he is pretty clearly townie | ||
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We can't. | ||
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would you like me to get it? it is trivial for me, as I find you to be town, but if you are really going to be pushing for lynches during the night, I might have to actually do that. How about, since you are seemingly deadset on my lynch, you respond to my wall from a page ago, as opposed to bringing up things that occurred days ago?thanks | ||
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yeah... | ||
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@Gmarshal, I like your defense of your view on Icemac @Deconduo, in relation to the cell idea, I misunderstood it at first. I thought it was for selective claiming. After I realized it wasn't, I wanted to propose a counter-list, as I thought that it was likely GMarshal, you, and annul were scum at the time. Perhaps I'm getting one of you confused with Chaoser? As it is, though, I am not as suspicious | ||
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Is it sad that I am almost as afraid, if not moreso, of dying to a terrible vigilante shot? @Vig, if you are going to hit me, claim in thread beforehand so you can be clear and lead a lynch tomorrow. | ||
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I know Barundar disagrees with that, as he felt like the mafia gave Annul up too easily, which is why he is suspicious of LSB. I mean, if LSB is scum, bussing his teammates, why don't we just let him do it? | ||
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he will accrue medic protection, and if he claims it tomorrow it could be counterclaimed. You don't want a clear? | ||
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claim in PM to me | ||
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Now, if we look at the numbers for 5 mafia = 2.5kp 2 kills, 1 frame, 2 roleblocks... still not adding up LSB/jackal are guilty why are people voting someone other than them? even WITH a vigilante shot, I'm pretty sure they're guilty, unless the mafia are getting more numerical value than I anticipated. | ||
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Sorry for the confusion about the miller. 1) Millers are usually colored black 2) With framing, I didn't expect them to be in the game due to balance | ||
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it is really only around 21 lines of actual content | ||
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On March 01 2011 18:18 JBright wrote: Hmm. You're right, that was a pretty long post...with half of it being a quote from you. Just can't win with you. Show a bit of inactivity (actually a lot)...scum. Post a defense of myself....scum. You know what, I'll just have fun for the remainder of my time in this game. I suppose only town would really care so much and be this aggressive, but what do I know. Don't really know why you keep posting that pic, but I kinda wish I could be a badass prof too. "only believe town could care" yet you're acting like you don't care, here contradiction! | ||
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Tight spot... we gotta keep fighting. | ||
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If player A releases a PM from player B, it is key on their alignments. If both are town, player B will be more apt to vote player A, which is bad If both are scum, it looks as if they aren't both scum together, creating distancing If the one releasing is scum, and the one who is in LD's shoes is town, it looks bad on town If the one releasing is town, and the one who is in LD's shoes is scum, it's not bad for the town | ||
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it really just depends on how you use it, and the commitments it takes to do it properly. Usually the commitments outweigh the benefits, so it shouldn't be done. | ||
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On March 01 2011 23:52 JBright wrote: Well, that was something I wrote right before I went to sleep, so I wasn't going to answer any more until later. Going back to SA's axis of evil, I already gave my (non)opinion on LD, but what about Seraph? Since I haven't been too active myself, I can hardly point my fingers at another low activity player. He seems to come on in spurts during each day/night cycle and didn't have very much to say except for his latest post. I didn't think too much of it, but I suppose the part about the icemac analysis seems strange. There was only ~20 min before the end of voting, so who was he really trying to convince? Won't be reading this until at least 9pm Eastern, so I'll place my vote now. Since I've already thrown around some FoS, might as well vote for one of them. I believe that townies tend to play more aggressive in terms of scum hunting, so I'll keep my vote off GM and SA for now. If LD does post before voting ends, I could be persuaded to vote for him. I'll just go with gryffindor since he's the third of my gut picks. ##Vote: Gryffindor I have actually been defending most of the bigger wagons to people in PMs. 1) why did you feel the need to use parenthesis here? I have only seen scum do that 2) why would you vote for the 3rd of your gut reads? That looks suspicious. @LSB 1) why are you defending LD? 2) you cut out the pimp shoes 3) I feel like you are fake-defending JBright to cover up your actual wanting to keep LD alive | ||
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On March 02 2011 03:45 LSB wrote: The lynch sucks Again, I feel like its another "iceman" esq lynch. This time I don't even think he supported Annul. OK? speaking of iceman, both of these guys were on the iceman wagon, but not annul. How do you defend that? He's voting me, why wouldn't I want him lynched? How about you actually interpret the post properly, and realize I want you to contribute more than posting pointless one liners. I sent that PM to someone proving I had sent it to you. Deconduo, did I send you that PM before Coagulation posted it? The reason I push this last point is because you are essentially strawmanning here by not addressing my real issue with that vote... the fact YOU HAD NO REASONING WITH IT. On March 02 2011 07:32 bumatlarge wrote: Considering all the games in the last few months where I survived past night 2 I've been scum, isn't this a good thing? ;D I like this post a lot though, I'll be using the voting pattern list you made. You should have seen the picture of his computer, lol he said "i have way too much time on my hands" ! On March 02 2011 09:01 LSB wrote: I agree 4 KP is overpowered, but I do believe that Jackal is telling the truth. I still think we should lynch Barundar. My points about him forcing analysis still stands. Or we should check out the Iceman lynch day 1 to see if it was actually a bus by mafia. check out the iceman lynch... day 1... to see if it was a bus... ? excuse me? Also, considering both you and Jackal have essentially claimed power roles that can be roleblocked, you all need to fully claim. You all will be role reversed anyways, and with LYLO only 2 lynches away if we hit MLs sadly, it is time for claims from you two. On March 02 2011 09:04 LSB wrote: If we trust Annul, and assume that there is one godfather. 4 Mafia left, 1 of which is godfather That leaves mafia with 2.5 KP. Which is a bit suspect, especially since 3 people died night one. A more standard setup would be 6 mafia, 1 of which is godfather 5 Mafia left, 1 of which is godfather That leaves mafia with 3 KP. Mafia would have used all their KP on hits night one, meaning if they roleblocked both me and Jackal, that means a vig should have hit. I don't even see how you could believe there are only 4 left. Possible given all the mechanics, but that seems a bit low. Maybe they balanced it out expecting all the modkills that always happen? From my point of view, you are being misleading. You claim a guy bussed yesterday, and he counterclaims you. You claim you were roleblocked today, and a guy counterclaims you, which is even fishier given the amount of kills last night. Do you not see how your play so far could be detrimental to the town? I hope you do. On March 02 2011 09:17 LSB wrote: Why was the first to point out Icemac, coincidentally he did this after my assault on annul. At the same time though, he wasn't really a annul supporter and did attack him a few times. This reads as, well, he made a case... at the time we lynched mafia... but he's not that suspicious, you guys! i swear! If I had to vote right now, it would definitely be on you. I was going to urge you/jackal/jbright to actually get on a relevant wagon, but I am considering making one myself. You really need to full claim. On March 02 2011 11:53 Jackal58 wrote: JBright is town. kevconsim is scum. Don't even ask me to explain, analyze, prove. It is what it is. UNVOTE: LD VOTE: kevconsim He was on the annul wagon, and at a very good time to not be scum. You NEED to explain. I'm not ASKING you to explain, I'm telling you. I'm pretty sure he is town. I'm going to Vote: LSB until I can see that he rectifies the situation with having been counterclaimed on consecutive days, although on d2 it was hardly legit as there wasn't a conspiracy. | ||
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Time to claim, folks, since you stupidly outted yourselves. | ||
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On February 24 2011 10:24 gryffindor wrote: Annul is teamed with gmarshal. When mafia fos someone d1 and vote someone else they are teamed with their fos. On my phone, will catch up more later. This is a huge slip for d1 though, two scum caught possibly. Sup | ||
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I agree with the above 1.2.3.4., and I would like to add the fact that Barundar picked up on him claiming both to be roleblocked, and to be a townie. That seems like a townie wouldn't be informed of that! | ||
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Also, even if that is the case, why would scum waste a roleblock on a townie? | ||
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The votes are pitifully strewn about, and I fully expect a lot of wagon hopping in the next couple of hours. We need to form an active-person-voting bloc. I was imagining this in my car. Myself, Foolishness, LSB, Deconduo, Barundar, Cubedin, LunarDestiny, Jackal, Bum, Ser Aspi, Chaoser ^I am not happy with any of these lynches, although I would consider LSB because of his anti-town player d2+, even considering his "pro-town" play d1, even if he has cognitive bias in relation to how terrible it was due to him eventually being on a scum wagon. What about ohN? Guy has been seriously lurking. | ||
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it says "THE godfather represents 1kp", also there will be 6 in a game this size. So, we should have 4 at .5, and 1 at 1, meaning 3kp 3 deaths, either a vig isn't claiming, or someone is lying Eventually, if a vig doesn't come forward, we need to lynch between Jackal and LSB. Maybe even if a vig comes forward, if we determine they are scum collectively as a town. | ||
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On March 03 2011 05:02 CubEdIn wrote: Let me put it another way: I don't think Jackal is particularly suspicious, I find that other players are suspicious for not trying to make a case against Jackal as well (particularly bum & chaoser). I, for one, don't see a reason why he would counterclaim here as mafia. It feels way more town to create a potential counterclaim and lynch one or the other scenario in which you've caught scum if a vig doesn't come forward given the likely amount of mafia, due to balance On March 03 2011 05:22 LSB wrote: In addition, if I was mafia, why would I claim to be roleblocked? It would only cause more suspicion to myself, especially since (assuming Jackal isn't lying) Jackal would also be claiming The reason why I claimed to be roleblocked is because it is standard practice for town to claim when they are roleblocked. In addition, I'm disappointed by the day 3 lynch. When we have very attractive scum such as SeRapH, instead people decide to 'vote for information'? Lynching for information is horrible. What useful information would you guys get when I flip green? 1) I wouldn't be as suspicious of LunarDestiny for defending you in the post above this, or of Cubedin for posting that he wanted to lynch for information, which you have been holding onto like that chick held onto that wooden door in the movie Titanic. LSB, you know, maybe it's time to let go On March 03 2011 05:24 LSB wrote: I didn't talk with Seraph, but Gmarshal did say he had a conversation with him. that's seraph? Saying we should ignore annul? NM, I'll wait up on you until tomorrow LSB, you just gave me a better candidate On March 03 2011 05:36 Coagulation wrote: I just want to point at that I STARTED THE DAY WITH VOTE ON JBRIGHT People followed and he had a good amount of votes and suddenly suspects are being brought up left and right now THE AMOUNT OF SUSPECTS THAT POPPED UP FOR DEBATE SO EARLY INTO THE LYNCH INDICATES JBRIGHT IS SCUM. um.. Foolishness's cases on LunarDestiny and Seraph preceded your voting, nice try LSB being up for lynch is from d2 as well, and he has been counterclaimed on roleblock you're reading too much into this, bro On March 03 2011 05:41 Coagulation wrote: HEY Barundar I GOT MY EYE ON YOU AND YOUR AGGRESSIVE SCUM PLAY Also, that's actually a mafia-acronym! IGMEOY: ACE On March 03 2011 06:44 deconduo wrote: I was just about to say that theres a lot of lurkers, especially ohn and LA. Yeah, I'd be happy if it shifted onto them, but we don't get a lot of information out of their flips. Since I was fairly certain GMarshal was annul's buddy from d1, and he is defending Seraph while subversively trying to get me lynched through even posting those inane PMS which are illogical and trying to aim at a ML, so if or when Seraph flips red we lynch GMarsh On March 03 2011 09:02 chaoser wrote: please post more lists that have no meaning because they take out all the context. HOW IS A VOTING BLOC MEANINGLESS OR OUT OF CONTEXT? On March 03 2011 09:09 deconduo wrote: I like lists. I'm not very good at doing huge long analyses on people, so I look at little things that other people tend to gloss over. Like voting patterns. Like what wagons people were on and why they changed. In this case, the three of you have voted the exact same way so far in all lynches. Might be a coincidence but what harm does it do to post it? FYI you are one of the few people I have pegged as probably town. Also its not out of context because there is no context. It is what it is. and that's legitimate scumhunting in my eyes. at least, even if YOU can't use it for scumhunting, it really helps players like me who look for associative connections. I doubt all 3 of them are scum, though. I believe kevconsim is the bored townie in that bunch. Typically, mafia actually try not to wagon too hard, unless it gets close to mylo/lylo (like foolishness said, when they know they can win that day or the next) | ||
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also, people who are active can be held accountable. Mafia want us to think that If we leave you/LSB, for instance, we always have a 50/50 scumlynch based upon how many scum are obviously left in this game (5) with the possibility of godfather(s) However, given that line of that, what if mafia decided they DIDN'T WANT A GODFATHER AT ALL? Cover: Cost .5KP makes a player appear as townie 1 night cycle. .... actually, it appears they HAVE to choose one Godfather: Night 1 mafia must choose their Godfather(s). The godfather(s) will then choose what role/alignment they will appear as for rest of the game. If not chosen will be RNG'd. The Godfather is worth 1KP. This leads me to believe that there might be two mafia factions, or a Serial Killer There are a lot of explanations EBWOF5: I'm going to join you on Seraph. I didn't like his PMs trying to get Gmarshal to lynch me, and I'm sold both him and GMarshal are mafia. Possibly with LSB. I'm also pretty sure there is a Serial Killer or a 2nd mafia faction, if a vig didn't hit, unless LSB/you are lying. If this game is following the standard for TL mafia games as I know it, though, Mafia should be at 3kp, giving them an opportunity to roleblock and be at 2.5, meaning 3 kills still. Therefore, they COULD ONLY HAVE ROLEBLOCKED 1 PERSON. That being said, we need to end this KP speculation... I'm so flip flopping on a few things. | ||
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JBright is a really easy mislynch, although I didn't like his parenthesis, I really want GMarshal implicated as I'm fairly certain he is scum, and I really, really, really liked the Seraph wagon in comparison to the amount of active-scummy players who I want to keep around for now like GMarshal, and surprisingly, recently, Cubedin. The players on the Seraph wagon feel less scummy, it was a vote under at 6 vs the 7 of JBright, who I feel might be a mislynch, so I evened up the Seraph wagon. Jump on in, the water's fine. | ||
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at first, i didn't like coagulation's unvote, but I do now | ||
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+ Show Spoiler + jk BTW, GMarshal defended him, and I picked up on GMarshal being scum with Annul a week ago, on the 26th of February. He is our next lynch. | ||
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On March 03 2011 12:43 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: I made a mistake Night 1 with the role PM's which made the mafia not realize that their KP rounds up. This cost them the ability to use a power. To compensate for that Night 2 I gave them an extra .5KP ....................................... AND THIS IS FAIR? You just completely made me believe LSB or Jackal had to be scum because of that, yet you didn't clarify what you were doing before you did it? Half of my posts today have been influenced by that. This is terrible........... | ||
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On March 03 2011 12:53 LSB wrote: Hmm That actually would make sense. 4 Grunts, and 1 Godfather. That is 5 mafia total, so 2.5 KP + the godfather KP, giving them 3.5 KP. They didn't use their power night one, so that means DT checks from night 1 are mostly reliable. By using 1+ roleblocks night two, we can soft confirm both me and Jackal LSB................. no. Also, your list of medic protection is a joke, and needs to be updated based on who is cleared through having, you know, lynched scum. Annul - 10 Gofarman deconduo Ser Aspi LSB Kenpachi astroorion Gryffindor GMarshal Foolishness chaoser darmousseh CubEdIn Mr. Wiggles kevconsim Seraph - 7 Foolishness why LSB Barundar Jackal58 LunarDestiny gryffindor Ser Aspi I updated the annul wagon with my PROPER positioning on it. RoL having me at the end was due to him having missed my vote, I guess. I voted when they were tied at 5-5, so I'm at the least the 6th voter on there, which I represented. Considering unvotes and such, and people coming off of it from before me, my positioning on it may have even increased, but, at the worst, my positioning on it was 6th out of 10. Basically, considering who has been on both wagons, here is what we have: Tier 1 of "who you should protect" Foolishness Ser Aspi LSB Gryffindor | ||
gryffindor
United States524 Posts
If JBright is scum, it is easier to defend him and dismiss him as a village idiot, which makes you not clear whatsoever. That is why my list is much more solid, as it is sheerly based upon voting analysis. I also dislike the way you are saying Jackal is cleared through this, as his was primarily a one liner. I am not really suspicious of either of you. Here is the list I have on a word document on my desktop, I will share it with you, though I probably shouldn't. Townie gryffindor - I know my role Foolishness - Has been on both scum wagons, doing detailed analysis/scumhunting LSB - Has been on both scum wagons, spotlighting, and trying to scumhunt... somewhat. Ser Aspi - Has been on both scum wagons, and made a few good cases deconduo - behavior seems protown Jackal58 - roleblocked, supposedly Barundar - Realized the contradiction between LSB being roleblocked, and greenclaim chaoser - weak meta town read bumatlarge - the slot he replaced into was suspicious, but he has been helping that. Coagulation - this is the first person I am more than mildly suspicious of, although less so CubEdIn - He was above coagulation, chaoser, and jackal on earlier days. Increased suspicion. kevconsim - He was one of my strongest town reads after the Annul wagon, less so now. why - I felt he was likely town before, but I've been liking his play less recently LunarDestiny - has actually helped himself somewhat with a few wall posts. Unsure. GMarshal - associative tells with Annul and Seraph JBright - seems like noob town, but could be noob scum LastArgument - lurking hardcore. blue/red? ohN - lurking hardcore. blue/red/doesn't care? He's been modkilled before Scummy If you actually read the PMs between GMarshal and kevconsim, it is very apparent to me that kevconsim genuinely wanted to lynch annul (which I could tell d1). He was a very strong town read on d1 for me. He is not a good lynch target in my opinion, and in fact, I will be moving him back up my list a little bit after reading those PMs. In fact, those PMs damn GMarshal even more for me, as I feel he was fishing to see what kevconsim's reaction was to JBright. I do not believe the 4 scum are on the bottom of my list. In fact, that would surprise me way more than one of Foolishness/LSB being scum, unless RoL just randomized roles. I would fully expect a few of the middle of the road players like bumatlarge or coagulation to be scum. When I say middle of the road, I mean in terms of scumminess, not play ability. | ||
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On March 03 2011 16:40 Barundar wrote: I like your list gryff, and on the whole I pretty much agree. I also think you are town. Difference between me and you is I look more at tone and arguments than at votes, but both have their right in scumhunting. Your list is objectively strong, it's only if you accept my argument on a day 1 bus on annul, that LSB moves to the bottom of it. Kevcon voted icemac day 1, but suddenly decided to change to annul. I see him as a mafia busser. GMarshal, Cubedin and LunarDestiny are players that I am leaning town on from their arguments and tone, but who I have problems with objectively. What have they actually done? I have been defending OhN and LastArgument in PM's, LA based on day 1 PM behaviour, OhN beceause of his posting. But as they fall inactive and doesn't contribute, my suspecion increases. Thanks. I don't mind tone and arguments, that is why I am suspicious of GMarshal. I feel as if he has been testing the waters on who he can get lynched in PM land towards both myself and kevonsim, I believe the FoS annul put on him, when voting someone else, was faked... and I have yet to see him really help us get rid of scum. I believe he is trying to fake being town, and this is not what I've seen from him as town. Cubedin I have been leaning town on as well, but his play has slipped a little today, and I feel he is slinging a little mud towards people who are somewhat clear. If we lose ohn/LA, and they are town, no big deal. They are both likely modkills. p.s., you can't even spell suspicion + Show Spoiler + jk + Show Spoiler + no, but really On March 03 2011 19:28 CubEdIn wrote: Good Yob town. However, as I said before the lynch, we should not lose focus on either of the two. Also, I think we should have a short discussion of who the Vig should hit (IF he were to hit someone tonight). Do we have a solid target for a vig hit? I'd like to see people who are lurking go belly-up, JBright included. I also don't like how Gryph is adding himself on the medic protect list just because he voted for both scum. I mean, I know it's up to the medics in the end, but I find that that move was almost as to say "I'm confirmed town". Right now, I'm not putting it past anyone to be red, as Mafia seemed to have no issue with busing so far. I'm not saying "I'm confirmed town", I'm saying "mafia will possibly consider people will view me as likely town" However, being only a green, it might be best to let me die TL prides itself on "blue sniping", as Foolishness put it, and though he believes the person sending in the hits has been doing a good job of that, I disagree. I hope I don't eat my words on that, though. On March 04 2011 01:43 bumatlarge wrote: I assumed when he said round-up, that you could get 4 kills if it was at 3.5. I didn't think you could throw in two roleblocks and squeak out 3 kills with 3.5. You want to take this outside bro? The last time I said that, or wanted to, I was scum Just sayin'. On March 04 2011 02:48 LSB wrote: I don't think Rol would have allowed it. I think he just said that he would give them an 'extra' .5 action, rather than using an entire KP which is just mad and abusive Agree with LSB. Also beginning to seriously shift towards him being green. He felt very.. um.. nervous? No... "up in arms" on d2, as if all he had was his voice and his vote. Now that he is somewhat clear, in my book, he has calmed down and is being very pro-town here. I have to go meet my girlfriend and her sister for some mexican, so I didn't get to read Why's post fully yet, but I like the effort. I'll read it when I get back/time. | ||
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he was on annul, at least | ||
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On March 04 2011 12:19 Foolishness wrote: GG hey, what's funny is I was going to just type "GG" if i died. great minds think alike, bro. On March 04 2011 12:53 bumatlarge wrote: gg lol high fives foolishness o/ o/ vote: LastArgument I believe mafia went against their own KP to give LA a good claim I believe kevconsim's chewbacca defense If LA is town, I am suspicious of ohN. I am also believing if I die, you all should investigate the JBright wagon. Cop/Detectives, it is time to claim, in my honest opinion you have had multiple nights of investigations to make clears creating town clears is very pro town, and will help us | ||
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He is also poisoning the well, mudslinging on relative clears from wagons. He can say all he wants about me not being essentially clear, but I was online, voting Seraph, with it at fucking 7-7 on votecount. I could have EASILY shifted my vote to JBright without any heat being thrown on me if I was scum, saying "oh, well, at least I was on annul". Given that 14/16 people left in the game seem to be putting me in the "this guy is solidly town" category, I'm wondering if the other 2 don't KNOW I'm town... but LastArgument hasn't been counterclaimed as Veteran... so I'm wondering if his claim is legit. That would also sort of diminish my suspicion of CubedIn if he isn't lying, as it would just make the doublestack speculation. I was honestly wondering if that was the case, and if mafia did that I wouldn't blame them, so perhaps I am being a little biased in seeing him say that and associating his tone/word usage with the way scum would word that, because I would have worded it differently myself as town. | ||
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On March 05 2011 08:20 LSB wrote: I'm fine with that ##Vote GMarshal I'm not. I'd rather flip flop it, because if you're red then we don't have to lynch GMarshal at all, we can get your scumbuddy LA. It's a 2fer On March 05 2011 00:17 CubEdIn wrote: Ok Gryff, answer me only this: If you were mafia and you wanted to kill Foolishness, would you only use one KP? I don't know who's putting you on Solid town, as I didn't hear people around here coming to defend you at any point. I'm just saying, you're not addressing any of the accusations I made recently, you're using pure WIFOM "If I were mafia, would I not shift vote"??! Well I don't know man, is JB green??!? Because if they're both red it doesn't really matter who you voted for, right? Cuz I'm sitting here trying to defend against people that automatically assume that JB is green/blue, and I have no freaking idea why that is. I don't know what color he is; I know I've been voting at key points of 2 lynches on scum, though. On March 05 2011 07:10 chaoser wrote: Lynch LSB. If he's vigi then we have 100% confirmed in LA being a vet since I doubt medics protected him. If LSB is red then LA is red too. I am for this. LSB has lied way too many times, and has played a terrible town game. Like, if he's scum, I'll pat him on the back, but if he's town, I'm going to shake my head, especially considering how he has been tooting his own horn all game. On March 05 2011 07:14 GMarshal wrote: Also LSB I call shenanigans if you wanted a vigi to shoot Barundar then you could have done it yourself, why didn't you? You have been calling for that shot for two days now, interesting that you didn't take it. I suspect you aren't a vigi at all but a mafia godfather This post, and the last one you made, have made me completely flip flop on my read of you from leaning scum to leaning town. I have been trying to measure you and read you all game, to no avail really, fishing for information out of you through your reaction to me trying to make terrible cases on you. Finally, you react the way I would expect town to react to something. +town points, tbh. I'm completely ready to wagon LSB, even if I believe he might be town, there is a reason people get lynched for lying multiple times (to make them improve next game). If we don't hold people accountable for claiming green/crazy shenanigans like he has pulled, and lynch them, then chaos will rule. I'd rather have chaoser rule than chaos. On March 05 2011 07:16 LSB wrote: Um... why would I shoot Barundar if another vig was going to do it? Why would you CLAIM to have hit LA? Why wouldn't you claim to be hitting LA BEFORE you did it, at which point he could claim veteran BEFORE you did it, allowing you to hit someone like ohN who is lurking hard. I'll tell you why - because Foolishness made a great case on your scumbuddy right before he died, and you're making a terrible gamble. Too bad I follow LAL these days. On March 05 2011 07:27 LSB wrote: We were clearly discussing vig hits, and I'm going to put my suggestion of Barundar in there. It's a waste of town KP I shot Barundar twice. -.- What's so hard about that? It's my dominate strategy I have no idea about a second vig, but hey, I didn't have any problem with shooting LA at the time so I did it. 1) you claimed green, and backtracked - a lie 2) you have been mudslinging on barundar, and said a vig should hit him - you're a "vig" - lie 3) if that's not a lie, it's a contradiction 4) LAL - lynch all liars Vote: LSB | ||
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United States524 Posts
On March 05 2011 08:40 LSB wrote: green=town aligned? I don't understand why you guys are making these silly points -.- You are SERIOUSLY claiming you don't know green to be townie on TL.net? Blue is townie on Epic Mafia, for instance. It's just common knowledge. Nice backtrack, yet again. You are digging your hole deeper, and if you truly are town (which I doubt), you have noone to blame but yourself | ||
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We need 5 votes on someone, and no alternate wagons of 2 or more, just in case the 4 scum blitz You may say, well, that would give them away, but would it? We don't have the information they do! I urge you all to come together, and consolidate, lynching LSB I am tired of his shenanigans, and a rope is only fitting. In fact, the only thing that is fitting will be threads around his neck as he hangs. | ||
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The only thing that is making me hesitant is the quickness of this wagon, but I guess it is obvious | ||
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LSB has lied multiple times | ||
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On March 06 2011 02:10 kevconsim wrote: im not scum im townie the one with the green text I know you are new here, and I actually believe you are a part of the village... a newer part of the village... There is a specific term for a player like that, but I'm not going to dip into Ad Hominem if I can help it, because I've done that way too much in my life, and it doesn't help anything! The thing is, saying "I'm town!" is great and all, but anyone can do it. If you truly are town, it is best to stay in the woodworks, so to speak. What I mean is this: If you are just a green townie, with no abilities in the night, why would scum kill you? I'm being hypocritical here, I know, but that is why I'm sort of getting onto you about this. If you are a cop or something, typing this, I'm going to pat you on the back. Do you want to know why? Because if you are not scum, you have done a great job convincing everyone you aren't a power role, with an ability in the night. You are very, very, very unlikely to get killed in the night by scum. A town vig? a possibility, and far greater than the chances scum will kill you, regardless of what side you are on. I'm not saying it is good to claim green if you are a cop. It is definitely good to claim green if you are a paramedic, though. It isn't bad to claim being a cop as a green, sometimes, either... or even a paramedic if you're up for lynch... but that is iffy. It depends on the level of play in the game. If you're in an invite only game, where there is no way the doctor will counterclaim, then that wouldn't be as lame as if you did it in this game, because in this game if you made that claim then it would be hard to defend what was going on in your brain! | ||
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On February 23 2011 13:47 gryffindor wrote: + Show Spoiler + On February 23 2011 13:33 Mr. Wiggles wrote: Also, I'm just going to point this out, the number of GFs is limited. There is no way there would be 6 GFs, as that would mean 6 mafia KP, which seems a bit ridiculous. The GF is worth 1 KP it says in the OP, so if you assume a set-up of 3 KP for mafia, that means 3 GFs max, 1KP each. Speculation: If a grunt is worth say, .5 kp, so not the same as a GF, and fits in line with power costs, possible set-ups become something like: 3GF, 3 mafia total (3kp) 2GF 2grunts, 4 mafia total (3kp) 1GF 4grunts, 5 mafia total (3kp) I think the last two are more likely, but we should be able to tell more accurately after the first night kills and then after RB claims are in. Since the reds can manipulate innocents, frame, role-reverse No, there is no straight Godfather in my opinion I'm also very suspicious of this post: On February 23 2011 13:19 GMarshal wrote: for arguments sake going to create analysis cells, use them for informational analysis (even assuming I were scum there is no way) I could ensure each has a mafia member in it as there isn't enough mafia to go around (I am trying to put at least 1 TL vet in each) as the game progresses and people die we can have new cells form. (also you are free to create your own parallel cells) 1. Coagulation, LSB, gryffindor 2 GMarshal, seRapH, OriginalName 3 Mr. Wiggles, ICanFlyLow, kevconsim 4 Barundar, LastArgument , why 5 darmousseh, Ser Aspi, Kenpachi 6 Gofarman, chaoser, ohN 7 astroorion, CubEdIn, Jackal58 8 Beneather, annul, Conversion 9 icemac, Foolishness, LunarDestiny 10 deconduo, kitaman27, JBright This is just a suggestion, but I think it is a good one, discuss This would get us raped by the role reverser, and is really a scummy idea unvote; ##Vote: GMarshal I proposed an idea like this as scum. I noticed it as a scum-motivated plan. I voted accordingly. You all should have listened! On February 23 2011 13:50 GMarshal wrote: did you not read the part about it being only for analysis? There will be no roleclaims in those circles, unlike you not all players feel the urge to announce their blue status to make themselves targets for mafia. Are you tired or are you playing stupid intentionally? On February 23 2011 14:09 gryffindor wrote: Oh, so now you have to dip into Ad Hominem Go ahead and crossvote with me, mafia I'm onto you You are playing completely differently than I saw you as town Notice how I got onto him for his tone, even telling him I was onto him. Notice how I attacked him for meta. On February 23 2011 16:11 gryffindor wrote: initial reads: people to keep alive: gryffindor foolishness coagulation kenpachi ser aspi -cut- Notice my initial town reads over a week ago On February 24 2011 19:21 gryffindor wrote: -cut- I would rather lynch someone through my proper sleuthery in finding tells that they have made, such as the associative tells between GMarshal and Annul that I found, which is enough for me to be happy with where my vote is. Couple that with the fact that both have had wishy-washy voting/pushing, and with the incrimination of icemac, and I'd be surprised if two out of three weren't scum. Foolishness, however, disagrees with me on this. His loss! Still pushing Annul and GMarshal On February 24 2011 10:24 gryffindor wrote: Annul is teamed with gmarshal. When mafia fos someone d1 and vote someone else they are teamed with their fos. On my phone, will catch up more later. This is a huge slip for d1 though, two scum caught possibly. Check that distancing I bet that had them shitting themselves On February 24 2011 20:42 gryffindor wrote: Deconduo, do you see how a scum could propose a cell idea? well? I know I'm not "under pressure" exactly, but since I was pushing LSB, and he proved me wrong *tips hat*, I felt I needed somewhat of a defense up. I'm back around page 86, catching up, but I've skimmed backwards from the post seeing chaoser was mafia. Good job guys, when I saw that on the voting thread I was like omg, they let mafia make a good ploy... but really, coagulation saved the town. Congratulations, Coagulation. On March 05 2011 17:40 gryffindor wrote: -cut- The only thing that is making me hesitant is the quickness of this wagon -cut- see my indecisiveness? ...anyways On March 06 2011 08:06 GMarshal wrote: Well, at this point I'm 100% chaoser isn't scum, if he is he has put in so much effort into making his pms consistent and logical that he deserves to keep my vote. Sorry LSB, but I refuse to let you get away with this justification for lying, if it really is an elaborate town plan then you should have tested it for inconsistencies before posting it, the whole hanging the vet proves nothing point is pretty strong. Now if I'm wrong again and choaser flips red well then on my head be it. But I dont think thats going to happen Check this defense... This is the 2nd scum he has defended, at least, and that is confirmed. On March 06 2011 08:10 GMarshal wrote: Night 1 you say? assuming the poor sod is still alive though, you have no reason to kill him, you get to "suggest" who he protects, and look that way you don't have to double stack foolishness. or really worry about his protects. He then goes on to attack the fact that a medic has already died, when with 30 people 1 medic would be very underpowered. On March 06 2011 08:16 Barundar wrote: Lolololol, I can post Skype conversations from the entire game with Chaoser for us discussing targets. Now you are really trying hard This is pretty damning. It's not 100%, but I'd be happy voting him for this. On March 06 2011 08:18 LSB wrote: I could post AIM conversations from the entire game with BC discussing targets. Now you are really trying hard. Oh wait, I was mafia that game. I could post PMs with Doctor H from the game discussing targets. Oh wait, I was mafia that game. Posting PMs to try to prove your town does not work and is a common mafia tactic. I agree with this sentiment. Usually the people who use QuickTime/MSN/IRC/AIM are scum. Yet again, it's not 100%. I've seen town circles use it. I believe it was Mafia XXX that I read where town used that? On March 06 2011 09:53 GMarshal wrote: That should be a pretty good hint that its a desperation ploy rather than an actual plan, good plans are planned with time to actually work rather than pulled out of thin air with a few hours left. LSB of all people should be well aware of this Well, that's not how it ended up. I can't tell you that I wouldn't have been doing the exact same thing as you, and questioning whether or not it was a ploy. That was my initial reaction, but after seeing LSB's bait and switch technique, I honestly am sorry that I disrespected him in the past for his ability. I'm so sad about this. Forgive me, LSB? On March 06 2011 09:54 Coagulation wrote: IM THE MEDIC I MEDIC PROT HIM LAST NIGHT AND BLOCKED A HIT. LSB IS CONFIRMED TOWN. This is what I was pushing for when GMarshal was pushing his cell idea. Medic confirmation is really good for the town. On March 06 2011 10:05 Ace wrote: hahahahahahahahahahahaha ^this lol that facepalm...... On March 06 2011 10:22 kevconsim wrote: ##unvote LSB ^I told you he's a townie, guys. On March 06 2011 12:06 Coagulation wrote: people who voted to lynch LSB LSB Barundar gryffindor deconduo why chaoser kevconsim GMarshal ohN I agree with this list, except possibly why. I'm sitting on the fence on him... there should only be 3 scum left, btw. On March 06 2011 12:07 Coagulation wrote: DUDE IF YOUR NOT MAFIA THIS GAME YOU HAVE HANDS DOWN PLAYED WORST TOWN GAME EVER POSSIBLE. DEFEND ANNUL SOME MORE? DEFEND CHAOSER SOME MORE? I'm glad someone agrees with me. You remind me of how I played this game 2 years~ or so ago, in my mafia infancy. On March 06 2011 12:07 LSB wrote: ^you forgot Seraph could you find where he defended seraph? I know he was all over JBright, but I didn't recall that, hence why I said he only defended 2 confirmed scum... I trust you, now, though. On March 06 2011 21:31 CubEdIn wrote: Wow, 10 pages. That was a desperate attempt to keep lynch on LSB. Almost too desperate, compared to what happened so far in the game. Makes me think that GM/Barundar could just be really stubborn townies. But on the other hand, the mafia would put up a fight when there are only four people left, so at least some of the "anti-LSB" band must've been red. I'm still highly suspicious of gryffindor and kev atm. you're wrong on your suspicions, and here is my defense. I'm going to be kevconsim's lawyer, too, so address him to me. | ||
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I will be doublestacking on LSB. I don't care if I die, since some of you find me to be scum. Where is our mad hatter at? Bombs on Barundar and GMarshal would be nice. | ||
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If you don't "feel I have contributed [as much as the veterans", read me in isolation. You will see that, in fact, I am better than many of the so called "veterans". | ||
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I didn't "mysteriously disappear", I was deadset on your lynch, because you have been lying all game. I find it VERY suspicious I did not die last night, as you were the only person I claimed I wasn't a medic to. The fact I tried to get myself killed last night speaks loads. Let's break down your pitiful post point by point. First, you say "Yep!", but you are really just trying to be annoying second, you make a very weak point about me making a d1 case... so I was trying to scumhunt... more than you did on d1. All you did was just scream "annul is scum annul is scum annul is scum", when it is very possible you simply knew he was scum and were throwing him under the bus, or bussing him. Side note on this, going off on a tangent, people on this site are using this term wrong. I even saw Qatol use it incorrectly, and it saddens me. To "bus" someone is not simply to bandwagon them, it only applies when mafia does it to mafia, "throwing them under the bus". Here is how you use it. "Someone random not named annul" OK? I even pmed you to make sure that you weren't joking and trying to slide by day 1, when the voting WAS AT FIVE TO FIVE. I put the sixth vote on "your" wagon of annul, revitalizing it, but I guess you are too busy with your inflated ego of 'confirmed town' to notice this. Had I not pmed you, tallied the votes, and made a case on Annul... I could have lynched ANYONE, honestly, with the zone I was in I easily could have lynched icemac day 1, and you know what? He called me the best poster in the game. Scum buddy town, and if I was scum, I definitely would have kept him around. So, yeah, eat that | ||
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On March 07 2011 13:29 LSB wrote: LAL? Well, Mr. Vet/Medic/Greenie, we have a liar here I don't care what you think Bus means. Here I call it, and the majority of players call it what I mean. We are not MS. There's no silly 'tells' we go by, weird acrynoms are generally frowned on, and gameplay here is a lot more fun. Oh yeah, I forgot about you soft defending annul day one. Thanks for pointing that out And I don't see why you are resorting to the 'I do more work than you so I am town" If I recall correctly, that was last used to defend Barunder. I swear chaoser was the one that said it Your town play has been pretty bad this game, and I wouldn't be surprised if yesterday you threw out another one of your own, considering how close you are to LYLO. If you want to incorrectly use terminology, go for it, I won't feed into that nor will I be feeding your trolling.. Gameplay here is more fun except when you run into people who believe that they are better than they are. I know my town play is greatly improving, but I guess you don't realize that, yet I still consider myself fairly inept as town because I'm not that good at convincing people. You have been bitter towards me from the start of the game, and actually have done a good job scumhunting.. bravo.. but you almost got lynched how many times? hahaha LSB. My play as mafia has devolved into lurking and gaming the town, and posting terrible (see orgah endgame) Plus, anyways, I know you aren't suspicious of me, just as I'm not suspicious of you, though I'm sure we could both make great cases on the other. You know this because I wouldn't have sent you that original PM I was mafia, when we got Annul. This has been a weird game, and you're trying to figure it out just like I am, and just like Foolishness was. Is it possible both you and Jackal are lying? Sure. However, I don't believe that you are capable of sniping blues in the way that they were sniped. I would be, so yeah, that is a point against me, but I would have actually been better than this. From a PM with Foolishness, talking about who could snipe blues other than me: Unfortunately for me I'm practically the only person that can do that (LSB ain't that good yo). So, who is mafia? Individually, I want to lean towards GMarshal for his associative tells with Annul, but looking at the bigger picture, I realize I have to keep my head on a swivel. There are still likely 3 scum, and we REALLY need to get their KP down to 1. So, GMarshal is out. ohN is out. Your vote on him is horrible. Why? Because he's not the Godfather. Who do you expect to be the Godfather? Do you believe Annul would have let me be the Godfather? I don't. | ||
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likely Godfather, need to reduce them to 1kp, not 1.5kp. | ||
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If you actually feel like you have a case on me, go ahead and address it. We only have 12 and a half hours left to get this lynch correct, and while I don't really mind being lynched, I would rather us lynch the Godfather and reduce their ability to kill per night to 1. | ||
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if you lynch me - 9 town 3 scum nightkills - 7 town 3 scum mislynch - 6 town 3 scum two days from now will be lylo at 4 town 3 scum we only have 2 mislynches, even if we are 3/4, due to all these fucking modkills so, yeah, it would be best if you would, you know, actually vote scum jackal | ||
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On March 07 2011 23:34 Jackal58 wrote: You've claimed Medic and Veteran. If you were a medic you would have died last night. The hits from mafia last night make absolutely no sense. Almost like you picked them. You've asserted that LSB is a liar and should be lynched for that after you became a MOD confirmed liar yourself. I put on a push to save LSB and lynch a red yet you still float accusations of LSB and I both lying. Why would a townie do that? Oh that's right he wouldn't. You have chosen a brilliant way to play scum but like I said before an insanity defense rarely works. Oh and we have 36 hours to mourn your upcoming demise. Too bad I'm not going to be lynched You are quite bad at this game, if you are town On March 08 2011 00:13 LSB wrote: Don't try metaing the godfather. Its impossible If you think that the mafia is dumb enough to place an entire KP on someone who would be an obvious gf choice, you must not have been playing with the right people. If I was mafia this game, I'd hide the KP with a lurker. Someone like oHN or kevcousin. Lurkers usually don't get killed after day 1. The only potential 'godfather' in you perception os Cubed1n, but I fhinj its a horrible idea to start lynching active members when we need to prepare for lylo. Btw, called it, you still think I am mafia. I don't think you're mafia whatsoever I just reworded a PM from Foolishness to get a rise out of you, honestly I am voting LD because I feel he is the Godfather. If he is town, I fully expect him to be modkilled anyways. You know I have been on two thirds of the scum wagons at integral moments one at 5-5 votecount (annul) when it was stagnating... hell, I even pmed you to make sure and try to read you. and then there was Seraph. Foolishness and I went over a lot of cases that day, even suspiciousness on each other, in PM. We ended up nabbing that guy, and it was awesome. Look, I'm glad you deterred the wagon Barundar and I got on you yesterday, as it lead to us getting a 3rd scum. The thing is, we only have 2 mislynches before LYLO, and you KNOW I'm a mislynch based upon my meta. Have you read Orgah mafia where I am scum? I am not playing that way. | ||
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i'd like to see instances where he FoSed every person on that list he voted chaoser, not fos he definitely did fos gmarshal... in the same post he votes chaoser... why is WHY I LYNCHED HIM. his push on me was really, really late. Why would mafia counterwagon mafia? Why would I vote for scum if I was scum when it was 5-5 and icemac is proven to have been a townie, now? he was at 5 votes when I voted annul who was at five votes, and I wouldn't vote mafia at five votes when I have a perfectly good townie to wagon at five votes if I was mafia. I don't bus, sorry bro, that's not in my meta. The only time I would bus would be a hammer, when all is completely hopeless, but TL doesn't work that way. The wagons are usually pitifully small and shift with a small breeze. I am ashamed of your play so far today, Jackal. | ||
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town can benefit from deconduo's work here, guys you have 1 more mislynch, after I flip green you should use it to lynch LunarDestiny I speak now quickly, in rhyme, in time Because you all have lost your damn minds I don't know why you're lynching me It's really pitiful Because I've done my best But you're following a fool | ||
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On March 08 2011 09:58 ohN wrote: Seems to be a pretty strong case against gryff. ##Vote: gryffindor also, this guy is mafia, not the godfather but mafia | ||
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On March 08 2011 09:41 GMarshal wrote: well since coag PMed me such a convincing argument I may as well ##Unvote ##vote gryffindor I'll just note for the postgame that the LSB, coag circle hasn't actually been confirmed, but the chances of LSB busing 3/5 or 3/6 of his teammates is rather slim, no? Not really he should have been dead by now consider this wagon started after I showed suspicion of LSB/Jackal ... It's a possibility I would lynch LSB just for laughs What can he say? He got 2 scum lynched? So did I, and you all are lynching me teamliquid town need to sheep less | ||
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On March 08 2011 11:57 GMarshal wrote: well gryff I *was* going to defend you, but I realized that that would probably not be doing you a favor. i'd tell you to vote LD, but I doubt it matters. It would make it like 7-5 | ||
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day 2: wagonned a lurker day 3: lynched scum day 4: pushed policy lynch on LSB (he should be dead if town weren't moronic) day 5: get mislynched because LSB is bad at this game | ||
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it might be best to just get rid of LSB, even if he is town, because if he is scum you all lost if you don't lynch him | ||
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i feel like an idiot | ||
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On March 08 2011 12:08 Coagulation wrote: and i still dont understand why you sat out the whole LSB vrs Chaoser thing I wasn't here... | ||
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i'm going back to bed... I had my alarm set around 4am | ||
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the fact I still have 7 votes on me is ATROCIOUS town play | ||
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On March 08 2011 12:05 Coagulation wrote: you shoulda defended yourself sooner. I defended myself BEFORE there was a single vote on me in this day cycle, actually. You should check back on this, because it is a misrepresentation. On March 08 2011 12:08 Coagulation wrote: and i still dont understand why you sat out the whole LSB vrs Chaoser thing I wasn't here, and even if I had been, I probably would have been integral in LSB being lynched. I was completely convinced he is scum, although I probably shouldn't have been, considering he has been the kickstart to two scum wagons... even if the one on day 1 wouldn't have worked without me. | ||
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On March 09 2011 03:16 Jackal58 wrote: All scum admit they're green. All scum claim atrocious town play. You are dead. I really thought I was dead. No, actually, if I die I am going to write off a lot of players and put them into my policy lynch category for terrible town play. | ||
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I'm going to vote ohN, as I'm fairly sure he is lurking mafia. I am less sure of GMarshal than I am of him. Considering what I have to work with in this town, you all might want to just follow me for the rest of the game. The only person who is capable of forming their own opinion seems to be LSB, and we all know that isn't saying much with him. Vote: ohN | ||
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I did not see a true case you have made on me... If you would quote it, or address it, I would love to dissect it because it has to be illogical | ||
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Present it, or shut up about it. On March 09 2011 03:33 CubEdIn wrote: And if you're red, then I'm pretty sure ohN is red as well, because you're trying pretty hard to act like you want him dead. Either him or LunarD. I would be happy lynching either of them, or GMarshal. Barundar or you are in my secondary reads, on leaning scum. My town reads are Deconduo, Jackal (sadly), LSB (sadly), myself, Coagulation... probably you and Barundar I believe scum are LD, ohN, and GMarshal... but I could be wrong. I would be happy voting anyone but Deconduo/LSB/Coagulation/Jackal at this point | ||
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also, Cubedin, do this: 1) go into the voting thread 2) look where ohN was voting, in comparison to where I was voting 3) ask yourself if your vote is in the right place | ||
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i have been on 2 out of 3 scum wagons, and we wouldnt be in the position where 2 mislynches = lylo i am suspicious of you... why would you not die if you were truly a doctor? you can bet i would kill you if i was scum, even if it could potentially be a ploy where you are in fact a mad hatter. that would be very cute. it's something i would do. however, even if i thought you were a mad hatter, i would expect your bombs to be placed incorrectly, and would kill you anyways. i am not going to formally claim. however, considering i sent you "mafia"... would mafia really do that? WIFOM I know, but hey... id like to see your lists, but you would have to be mentally handicapped to share them with me Original Message From Coagulation: i dont want to lynch you if your town. i need to organize a mass claim to me whats your role and how did u use it? + Show Spoiler + I originally replied with "mafia" as a joke, but I feel I should address this in thread this PM was actually the first signs of life i had... i went to bed thinking i was dead! i wake back up to watch GSL, and wham... I wasn't sure if I was alive, or if he was trolling me. I was actually pretty upset when I got on with like 5 minutes to lynch (or so i thought) with 7 votes on me. Then I was excited to see I was still alive, but players are still voting me even after it is really obvious that i was being pro-town before i died... whatever, i'm about to just give up, because i don't want to be "modkilled for spamming", even if this is the only way I can avoid being lynched | ||
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Secondly, I really thought I was dead yesterday, but I guess you don't want to use that. We only have 5 hours left to get this lynch onto actual scum, and make it not a mislynch. My name is Sam, not Bill, I don't know why people keep calling me that. | ||
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On March 08 2011 02:28 gryffindor wrote: now that's a stretch if i've ever seen one i'd like to see instances where he FoSed every person on that list he voted chaoser, not fos he definitely did fos gmarshal... in the same post he votes chaoser... why is WHY I LYNCHED HIM. his push on me was really, really late. Why would mafia counterwagon mafia? Why would I vote for scum if I was scum when it was 5-5 and icemac is proven to have been a townie, now? he was at 5 votes when I voted annul who was at five votes, and I wouldn't vote mafia at five votes when I have a perfectly good townie to wagon at five votes if I was mafia. I don't bus, sorry bro, that's not in my meta. The only time I would bus would be a hammer, when all is completely hopeless, but TL doesn't work that way. The wagons are usually pitifully small and shift with a small breeze. I am ashamed of your play so far today, Jackal. Responded to your first here, which you didnt reply to. On March 08 2011 04:03 Jackal58 wrote: Who would claim veteran on day 1 and ask people to claim to them? Scum would. Who would claim medic openly? Scum would. What medic would survive such a claim? Scum would. Who would continuously quote their own nonsensical posts to prove points that were made at the last lynch? Scum would. What Godfather would not hit a confirmed medic in Coagulation? A crazy one. If you're town vote gryffindor I would definitely have hit Coagulation, even if he is a hatter his bombs would be probably poorly placed (no offense) I am only quoting posts that are good as defenses, which you largely ignore. You have tunneled me since Day 1. Refute that? I will prove you wrong. The reason I survived that claim is possibly because scum knew I was lying, hell, I even PMed LSB telling him my plan was to get hit in the night due to my inherant scumminess and getting mislynched. I haven't ever been mislynched as scum past day 1, not counting Orgah, where I would have won if I didn't have a silly voting restriction. Also, speaking of Orgah, I lurked pretty hard that game... whereas here I am being very active. If I'm scum here, as opposed to Orgah, I would have to have a team. I would also most definitely have lurked more, and been active on MSN/quicktime with them. I would have been really picky on who we killed; I'm very good at picking kills. The kills picked this game past N1 were pretty bad, and hit way too many townies. Lynching me isn't really that bad, as it lowers the mafia's ability to claim townie even more, as that is what I am. I don't really mind it, but I have responded to all of your points, yet to continue to tunnel like you have the entire game on me. So, I'm weird, and abrasive... get over it Are you willing to put your neck on the line for our other mislynch after I die, Jackal? | ||
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I doubt there is a 3rd doctor at all, to be honest, and there is no way I would claim anything but green as scum in a large game. In a mini, I most definitely would, but not in a large. I would be trying to lurk and coast like I did in Orgah... and you know what... I lasted until LYLO where I had an easy win if it wasn't a BASTARD GAME. | ||
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On March 09 2011 08:16 Jackal58 wrote: I never said you were abrasive. Your game play is for lack of a better word - weird. Actually I think I called it insane. And yes if it is for the better good of town I will gladly die. I hope the town don't hold you to that, actually, because I'm fairly certain you're just a village idiot | ||
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notice how they are part of LSB's "town plan" notice how i was suspicious of them notice how there are 3 of them, and there are 3 scum left deconduo + ser aspi are my town reads, for worse or better. GG town, I'm green, and I'm done posting unless the wagon on me dissapears I love how you all are ready to take terrible lurkers like ohN to lylo... that's not smart. | ||
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On March 09 2011 08:18 Jackal58 wrote: If I am it's just in the game. Must be a terrible burden for you sir. I wouldn't expect any less out of a Steelers fan | ||
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On March 09 2011 08:30 Qatol wrote: Let's keep this focused on the game and not the people playing the game, please. read his nested quote implying that i was a village idiot outside the game the fact that he is right is hurtful how come in sports (mafia is somewhat competitive like a sport) the guy doing it 2nd is always the one getting caught? just sayin' i was joking because i was actually hurt by his comment, considering what is going on in my life right now, which you somewhat know about | ||
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Deconduo raises a very valid point, that Barundar and LD are likely to tack votes onto me if ohN is mafia. 1) this isn't that bad. a. when i flip town, they will both appear suspiciously b. the problem is ohN might not be mafia.... but if he isn't, he will be a LYLObility c. I myself am someone of a liability in LYLO, as a lot of people I believe are town would likely hammer me 2) if b, they might actually tack votes onto ohN a. this might lead to c. with our next mislynch, which isn't bad either, although I have improved a LOT in terms of catching scum in lylo. I could link you to a game where I won for the town in a 5 way lylo with 3 town and 2 scum based upon deductive reasoning... so, even if, admittedly, i am not that good in lylo, I have greatly improved b. him having little resistance, other than a townie wagon on me which feels like it is actually coming mainly from town, is actually sort of fishy i mean, i have town reads on kev, ser aspi, deconduo, lsb, coag, jackal, and myself... this just feels like a mess to me 3) lets explore c a little a. i claimed veteran to elicit reactions - this, regrettably, is coming back to bite me in the ass b. i then switched to the fact that i am blue/townie/villager/green - truth c. i tried to switch that i was "the other doctor" to get nightkilled, messaging LSB so yeah, LAL, I probably deserved to be lynched. Sorry if I have ruined any friendships this game. Am I nuts? I don't think so. I won't be doing any unnecessary claiming next game, because it really hurts the town, but you all can't help that - only I can. | ||
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- Jackal's vote is not bolded, is that in the rules? Assuming it still counts, here is the vote count: 5 - Gryffindor (first) 5 - ohN 1st jackal, 2nd coag, 3rd lsb, 4th ohn, 5th cubedin 1st why, 2nd gryffindor, 3rd deconduo, 4th kevconsim, 5th Ser Aspi as of right now, I will still be lynched. | ||
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lol | ||
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On March 08 2011 09:58 ohN wrote: Seems to be a pretty strong case against gryff. ##Vote: gryffindor Sheeping LSB right here. If this was LYLO, I wouldn't blame him, but it's not. He is not using his head. @Deconduo, you listed Gmarshal and chaoser in your "possible factions" - what for? | ||
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On March 08 2011 10:59 CubEdIn wrote: P.S.: How the hell is ohN still alive? He has done like.. nothing this whole game. OK? So why aren't you voting him? On March 08 2011 11:57 GMarshal wrote: well gryff I *was* going to defend you, but I realized that that would probably not be doing you a favor. you WERE going to defend me... before I spazzed and thought I was going to die? Wouldn't that just... you know... help your read of me, if anything? I mean, if I would have been like, aww shucks, you all caught me... sure. I have this loophole. I truly was thinking I was dead, lol seeing Coagulation's PM to me, i'll reiterate, was amazing. I felt like I had been resurrected | ||
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like, where I said, oh, guys, I have this guaranteed scumtell... we have 2 scum caught here? I'm glad SOMEONE noticed that. | ||
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i was thinking where he voted chaoser and fosed gmarshal tbh, considering chaoser flipped scum, it actually helped my opinion of gmarshal being town | ||
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wait... now i'm kind of clear... i'm going to die anyways tonight ...dammit lol | ||
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but, on the plus side, now i have ~26 hours to make a case, and a likely flip of ohN scum ...unless barundar and LD are both scum... and vote me... or are modkilled... the thing is, i don't see LD and ohN being scum together, considering ohN's vote on him as a counterwagon | ||
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##unvote ##vote: ohn just in case | ||
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On March 09 2011 10:07 Coagulation wrote: just want to say i highly doubt ohN is scum. well, i KNOW i'm not scum. | ||
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LSB, consider consolidating on ohN for more town cred, or do you not want to bus your own? | ||
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Sup? | ||
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vig killing town, wasting ability, is pretty much green now i would have definitely not killed bumatlarge if i was vig | ||
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LSB didn't lie multiple times? That's why I was getting him lynched yesterday, actually, and noone called me out on shit then. I then claimed medic, and guess who I told I was lying to? LSB. He then tries to lynch me, as opposed to me being nightkilled, but I guess noone believed me. I don't need to convince you. It's 6-5 in my favor, and I am green. I am playing for the town win condition. I am not going to shit up the thread responding to you anymore, sorry. I wish you would vote ohN to prevent mafia from shifting around in the next 5 minutes, but whatever. | ||
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Even Foolishness said something similar to "LSB isn't that good" in PM to me. | ||
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hope you enjoy that | ||
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On March 09 2011 12:00 Jackal58 wrote: I gave you guys the godfather and you let him talk you out of it. Jesus Fuckink Christ. Of course oHN is scum. Jesus Fucking Christ. You just gave this fucker credibility. Jesus Fucking Christ. scumslip? nice. | ||
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On March 09 2011 12:00 LSB wrote: Rol would never give you KP. And you would have shot sooner anyways. I call your bluff Nope. I learned how to play from a great player on MafiaScum, who wisely told me to wait until the town are incorrect about someone (scum you can't get lynched) anyways, IF you are town, you will just ruin the game for us in LYLO because your play is quite bad. | ||
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sorry, RoL, I'm just extremely happy and I enjoy getting under LSB's skin! | ||
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lol LSB said he would make a lurker the godfather | ||
gryffindor
United States524 Posts
On March 09 2011 12:22 Jackal58 wrote: If I can get us both mod killed town wins. Scum. how is that logical? also, you're not ruffling my feathers whatsoever | ||
gryffindor
United States524 Posts
On March 06 2011 22:09 CubEdIn wrote: Wow are you s**ting me? WHY THE FUCK WOULD YOU CLAIM? WHY? this is a very town reaction | ||
gryffindor
United States524 Posts
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gryffindor
United States524 Posts
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gryffindor
United States524 Posts
At no point was I ever mad about anything, though, so I don't really agree unless it was due to spamming. edit: you should modkill Barundar, he failed to vote. | ||
gryffindor
United States524 Posts
From: Meapak_Ziphh [ 1240 posts | Profile | Buddy | Report ] Subject: Mafia Warning! Date: 3/9/11 12:26 Please calm down in the thread. You are being needlessly aggressive. This is an official warning. You will be modkilled if this continues. My posts afterwards: analysis of him not liking my medic claim On March 09 2011 12:42 gryffindor wrote: If barundar is modkilled as town, we are in MYLO tomorrow, and need to no lynch speculation over the playerlist, which was hard due to it not being updated On March 09 2011 12:46 gryffindor wrote: Actually, I believe I might be wrong about that. However, with the amount of modkills we have had, who knows? Realization my count was off Don't see the logic here. | ||
gryffindor
United States524 Posts
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gryffindor
United States524 Posts
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gryffindor
United States524 Posts
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gryffindor
United States524 Posts
On February 22 2011 10:31 RebirthOfLeGenD wrote: you guys are lucky some of my favorite moderators never view this. I would be perm banned x2 at this point. foreshadowing? | ||
gryffindor
United States524 Posts
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gryffindor
United States524 Posts
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gryffindor
United States524 Posts
third times a charm any case i would make is speculation, anyways, do you blame me for caring? I just devoted weeks of my life to this | ||
gryffindor
United States524 Posts
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gryffindor
United States524 Posts
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