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Mini Mafia VI: Diplomacy
![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/kaa0k.jpg)
*flamewheel is helping me co-host this game. Any questions can be directed towards him or myself.
+ Show Spoiler [Important Posts] +
Introduction:
Disclaimer: This game follows a non-traditional time cycle which may potentially make the game slow for some people’s taste.
This game has special rules in that it is a combination of Diplomacy and Mafia. In essence, the goal of the game is like in normal mafia: Town must eliminate the mafia, and mafia must outnumber the town. However, there are two exceptions. The mafia win if there are any surviving mafia after Winter 1913. Also, a townie can earn a solo win by owning 12 or more supply centers at the end of any winter phase.
It is highly suggested that you familiarize yourself with the rules of diplomacy before signing up for this game. The full set of rules can be found here .
General Rules:
+ Show Spoiler [Cheating] +Cheating:
Cheating includes (but is not limited to):
1. Posting after death. You may have one polite goodbye post, but it may not contain any potentially game-changing information.
2. Ruining the game by doing something like hand out your mafia's member list to the town.
3. Logging on to someone else's account / looking over someone's shoulder to get their role.
4. Comparing role PM times to determine roles.
5. Posting screenshots of your inbox.
6. Posting any PM you receive from a host.
7. Getting yourself modkilled to help your team. Your non-majority-decided death may not be used as a bargaining chip.
8. Signing up more than once using smurf accounts.
Cheating is not tolerated here. The punishment will be severe.
+ Show Spoiler [Posting] +Posting: Mod Font:This is mod font. It is reserved for moderators. Please do not use it.Question Font:This is question font. Use it to ask the moderators questions about the rules.Activity:You must post in this thread once every 48 hours while you are alive. If you fail to do so, you will be modkilled. Spam:Spam is not tolerated, nor is any off-topic material. Do not discuss Proleague here. Do not talk about Starcraft II here. Play Mafia here. Editing: Editing is not allowed for any reason. Editing will result in a warning. After that, you will be modkilled. This is the one part of the site where it is okay to be double posting, even triple-posting. While I ask for everybody to post as concisely as possible, post again if you have to edit anything. Inappropriate posts:If you want to post something insulting or inappropriate and know the TL mods would have a problem with it elsewhere, don't post it here. If you do, a host will warn you or modkill you and request that you be banned from future games. The hosts have the final say on what is inappropriate. Play to win.You have been warned.+ Show Spoiler +Not only will you be punished for your inactivity, but your whole nation too! Muahahaha...
+ Show Spoiler [Voting] +1. Voting is done in this thread. Do not PM me your vote.
2. Please vote in the following format: ##Vote Qatol. Votes not done in the correct fashion will not be counted. I will update vote counts whenever I get the chance.
3. No conditional voting.
4. You may vote for yourself. You may not vote for anyone dead or outside the game.
5. In the event of a tie nobody is lynched.
6. Voting is mandatory. You may (NOT) abstain.
Signups:
This game is open to anyone with preference to those who have proven themselves to be active. Signups will remain open until all 11 spots have been filled. The game will start after Mini Mafia V is over. I am also looking to have a replacement queue for players, as modkills will heavily affect the game balance.
Game-specific rules:
Modkills:
This game follows the TL Mafia Ban List. If you are modkilled, you will get an appropriate punishment as stated in the banlist. Please refer to it for questions about your punishment.
PMs
PMs are NOT allowed in this game unless explicitly stated.
Time Cycle:
This game is divided into the traditional Diplomacy Spring, Fall, and Winter phases. Each set of Spring, Fall, and Winter phases makes up one year. The game begins in the Spring of 1901. There is no traditional day/night cycle. Mafia-type actions occur during various winter seasons. Lynches occur every third winter (1903, 1906, 1909, 1912), and all other role actions occur on even winters (1902, 1904, 1906, etc.).
Spring Movement: 24 hours
Spring Retreat: 24 hours, or as soon as I get all retreat orders
Fall Movement: 24 hours
Fall Retreat: 24 hours, or as soon as I get all retreat orders
Winter Adjustment: 24 hours
In case I am not able to post around deadline, any votes after the 48 hour mark will not count and the game will be put on halt until the night post is up. Currently the deadline is 8 PM EST, but that is subject to change.
The day/night cycle can be ended before the official deadline if I have consent of all players. Players can send me this consent via PM.
Role Reveal:
There is NO role reveal upon death.
Role Choice:
You are allowed to send in a request for your top choice of role. Once everyone has done so, I will choose assign roles based on a uniqueness system. If [# of people who picked role X] is less than or equal to [# of role Xs available in the game], they are assigned their choices. If [# of people who picked role X] > [# of role Xs available in the game], then role X will be randomly assigned to people in that pool, and the remaining players will be thrown into a second pool. Players in the second pool will get the remainder of the roles in the game at random. There is to be absolutely no discussion on who requested which role. No exceptions.
Nation Choice:
In this game, there are 11 countries:
+ Show Spoiler [Countries] +
E - England (Home SCs: Lon, Edi, Lvp)
F - France (Home SCs: Par, Bre, Mar)
L - Lowlands (Home SCs: Hol, Bel, Ruh)
G - Germany (Home SCs: Ber, Kie, Mun)
N - Norway (Home SCs: Nor, Swe, Den)
R - Russia (Home SCs: Mos, StP, Sev, War)
A - Austria (Home SCs: Vie, Tri, Bud)
B - Balkans (Home SCs: Ser, Bul, Rum, Gre)
T - Turkey (Home SCs: Con, Ank, Smy)
S - Spain (Home SCs: Spa, Por, Tun)
I - Italy (Home SCs: Ven, Rom, Nap)
You are allowed to send preference lists for what nation you would like to play by sending me a list of countries ordered from most preferred to least preferred. Non-listed countries are assumed to be tied for last choice. Once everyone has done so (or stated non-preference), I will determine nation assignments based on a uniqueness system much like Ace's drafting system in PYP. Players with unique first choices will get their first choice. If multiple players pick the same nation as their first pick, then I will randomly assign who gets the nation, and everyone else gets thrown into a second pool and the process is repeated.
+ Show Spoiler [Example] +
Suppose that players have sent in preference lists as the following:
Player 1: ETSRBIANGLF
Player 2: GRAF
Player 3: EFGRAIT
Player 4: GEFAIRTBSN
Player 5: RNGLEF
Player 6: TSIBANR
Going through the list, Player 5 was the only one who specified R (Russia) as his first pick, so he gets assigned Russia. Player 6 was the only one who picked T (Turkey) as his first pick, so he gets assigned Turkey. Players 1 and 3 both picked E (England) as their first pick, so I roll a dice and randomly assign England to Player 1. Player 3 gets thrown into a second pool. Players 2 and 4 also conflicted with picking G (Germany), so I again randomly assign Germany to Player 2, and Player 4 gets thrown into the second pool.
Now its the second round. We now remove the remove first picks from the list and look at second picks. The preferences now look like this:
Player 3: FGRAIT
Player 4: EFAIRTBSN
Player 4 had E (England) as his second choice, which was already picked. So he gets bumped into a third pool. Player 3 picked a unique second pick, so he is assigned F (France). Seeing that Player 4’s third pick has also been assigned, he gets bumped into a fourth pool and is finally assigned A (Austria)
Player 1: England
Player 2: Germany
Player 3: France
Player 4: Austria
Player 5: Russia
Player 6: Turkey
Movement Mechanics:
Units:
Army: This unit can only move on land provinces.
Fleet: This unit can move in sea territories, and coastal provinces (land provinces bordering a body of water). Fleets may also convoy armies across sea territories.
+ Show Spoiler [Summary of Basic Move Orders] +Move Orders:
As in diplomacy all orders are executed simultaneously, and all units have equal strength. Defender wins in the case of a tie. This means that you need another unit to support an attack action in order for it to succeed. Naturally, a defender may receive support in defense.
Therefore, an attack only succeeds if the number of support moves is greater than the number of support holds. If an attack fails, the attacking unit returns to its initial location unless it is dislodged by attacking forces.
If a unit is being attacked, it must defend itself and cannot support another unit.
If two units with equal amount of support attempt to move into the same province, the result is a “bounce”, and neither movement succeeds.
If an attack succeeds, the defending unit is dislodged and may retreat to any adjacent space provided that the space is a) appropriate for the unit type (armies cannot retreat into water and fleets cannot retreat into landlocked provinces) and b) was not the location of a “bounce” during that movement phase. Units with no valid retreat options are destroyed. A unit may choose to disband instead of retreating if so desired. Units that retreat to the same province are destroyed.
Types Spring/Fall orders:
Hold: The unit will defend the territory if attacked, but will otherwise do nothing. Units that are not given orders automatically default to hold orders. Denoted by the order: “[province] H”; i.e. “Lon H”
Move: The unit will attempt to move into and/or attack an adjacent territory. Denoted by the order “[initial province]-[target province]”; i.e. “Ven-Rom”
Support-Hold: The unit will support non-moving target province. If the unit in target province moves, the support order is invalidated. If the supporting unit is attacked, the support is “cut” and the order is invalidated. Denoted by the order “[supporting province] S [target province] (H [optional])”; i.e. “Ven S Rom” or “Ven S Rom H”.
Support-Move: The unit will support a move from target province into a destination province. If the unit in the targeted province does not move to destination province, the support order is invalidated. If the supporting unit is attacked, the support is “cut” and the order is invalidated. Denoted by the order “[supporting province] S [target province]-[destination province]”; i.e. if Germany orders “Mun-Bur”, an army sitting in Mar can support this attack by ordering “Mar S Mun-Bur”.
Convoy: Only fleets can perform convoys. This order will fleets to carry armies across water. You may string multiple convoys together to move an army over multiple sea territories. If a convoying fleet is dislodged, the convoy fails. If the army at target province does not move to the destination province, the convoy also fails. Denoted by the order “[convoying province] C [target province]-[destination province]”; i.e. if England orders “Edi-Nor”, a fleet sitting in NTH can convoy the army by ordering “NTH C Edi-Nor”.
Types Winter orders:
Build: Builds a unit in target province. You may only build units in your vacant home centers. This order is only available if your current SC total is greater than your current unit total. You must specify what type of unit (Army or Fleet) you wish to build on the target province. Denoted by the order “Build [unit type] [target province]”; i.e. “Build F Lon”.
Disband: Disbands unit in target province. This order is only available if your current SC total is lower than your current unit total. Denoted by the order “Disband [unit type (optional)] [target province]”; i.e. “Disband A Mun” or “Disband Mun”.
At the end of every Spring, Fall, and Winter phase, you must send in orders for each of your units according to the rules of Diplomacy. At the end of every phase I will post an updated map along with the orders for that phase. Invalid orders will be regarded as NMRs unless clarified. Failure to send in orders will result in a modkill and replacement.
Special Voting Rules:
1. Not all votes are equal. Each player receives one vote for each supply center under his control. This count is tabulated every winter and is in effect until the next winter.
2. The player who is leading the vote count at the end of every third winter (Winter 1903, Winter 1906, Winter 1909, etc.) will be lynched. The votes of players who die in the winter of a lynch do not count.
Death:
After 1902, players who have lost all their supply centers die. Players may also die by night kill or lynch, as in regular mafia. Other powers may not give support orders to dead players' units. Any player who occupies 2 home supply centers of a dead nation at the end of any winter phase will receive the identity of that said nation. As a reminder, there is no role reveal on death.
Credits:
Thanks to anyone who has ever hosted a game. This list grows ever longer.
Thanks to everyone who helped balance this game.
If you have not read all the rules, go back and do so. I will not compensate for ignorance!
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Roles
Town Aligned Roles
Townie:
You have no special powers other than the ability to vote. But you are necessary for a town victory! So help purify the town and be active!
Detective:
You have the ability to ask for the role of a specific player during the winter of any even year (Winter 1902, Winter 1904, Winter 1906, etc.)
Medic:
You have the ability to prevent one hit on a player of your choice during the winter of any even year (Winter 1902, Winter 1904, Winter 1906, etc.). Neither you nor the person you have protected will be notified if you have made a successful save. You are not allowed to protect yourself.
Vigilante:
You have the ability to kill a player of your choice every 4th winter (Winter 1904, Winter 1908, Winter 1912).
Coroner:
You have the ability to discern the true identities of the dead. Once per game, you may send me a PM requesting the roles of every dead player.
Apprentice:
You have the power to assume the powers of dead people. Once per game, you may PM me a player you wish to impersonate for the rest of the game. If you attempt to impersonate a mafia or a townie, you will not receive any powers.
Lawyer:
All players may submit a diary to the host via PM once a year. When a player dies, you receive their diary. You are informed if the dead player is the coroner.
Mafia Aligned Roles
Mafia:
Your goal is to eliminate everyone else in the town. You may choose to kill one player during any even winter (Winter 1902, Winter 1904, Winter 1906, etc.). You may choose to kill nobody if you so choose. You MAY kill other mafia. You know all the other members of the mafia and are allowed to PM each other. You must also choose the Godfather from among yourselves. If you do not choose by night 1, I will randomly choose for you.
Godfather:
You are the head of the mafia, and when role checked, will show up as any role of your choice. You must choose before Winter 1902 is over, otherwise I will randomly choose for you. You may also override your in-thread vote by PM.
Thief:
You have the ability to ask for the role of a specific player. You may use this ability during the winter of any even year (Winter 1902, Winter 1904, Winter 1906, etc.).
Player List:
1. LSB - France
2. Coagulation - Germany
3. infinitestory - Balkans
4. Beneather - Italy
5. ShoCkeyy - England
6. BloodyC0bbler - Turkey
7. bumatlarge - Austria
8. Nemesis - Lowlands
9. Fishball - Russia
10. citi.zen - Norway
11. Ace - Spain
Replacement List:
1.
2.
11 of 11 players remain
? of ? Detectives remain
? of ? Medics remain
? of ? Vigilantes remain
? of ? Coroners remain
? of ? Apprentices remain
? of ? Lawyers remain
? of ? Mafia remain (this includes the Godfather)
? of ? Thieves remains
? of ? Godfather remains
? of ? Townies remain (This includes all town-aligned players)
Role PM Examples:
+ Show Spoiler +Welcome to Mini Mafia VI: Diplomacy! Your role is: TowniePM Incognito if you have any questions about your role. Welcome to Mini Mafia VI: Diplomacy! Your role is: Blue RolePM Incognito if you have any questions about your role. Welcome to Mini Mafia VI: Diplomacy! Your role is: MafiaYour team consists of: 1. Ver2. Incognito3. ChuiuPM Incognito if you have any questions about your role.
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Reserved*
Signups begin now. Game will start after Mini Mafia V ends. If you sign up for the game please make sure you are familiar with the rules/mechanics of Diplomacy before the game starts.
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On February 05 2011 08:33 LSB wrote:
/IN Can I call turkey?
Role and nation choices must be sent by PM. In thread requests will not be counted.
*Edit please note that the starting positions are as shown in the map in the top of the OP. They are not the traditional starting locations.
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/in 
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FREEAGLELAND26781 Posts
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Instead of ModKill Lightning, can you use ModKill Earthquake?
![[image loading]](http://www.motifake.com/image/demotivational-poster/1001/hold-down-f11-yet-another-quake-rocked-haiti-today-the-capit-demotivational-poster-1264447062.png)
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On February 05 2011 14:01 LunarDestiny wrote:Instead of ModKill Lightning, can you use ModKill Earthquake?
Rofl, I agree!
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Ok earthquakes it is. Also feel free to send in your requests for roles/nations anytime. If possible, I'd like to have the requests in line as soon as the game fills.
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/in
a good night sleep does wonders.
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United States4053 Posts
/in
this looks complicated x_x
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Replacement list? Pshh you should just join straight up. Will be fun 
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This looks really awesome. Sad I can't play, but will try to keep up with the thread.
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Last minute signup as usual.
/in
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Signups are full. Mini Mafia V is now over. You have ~24 hours to get your role/nation requests in. If you do not get a request in you will default to the end of the list.
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I'm doing 2 games at once just to let you know I'm baller like that
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On February 10 2011 07:41 Ace wrote:
I'm doing 2 games at once just to let you know I'm baller like that
Knowing you, I think we're all good.
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i have no preference in role or land
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Please send in your requests by PM only.
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Sorry if I wasn't clear, but I will announce who gets what country after it is decided.
Also, another clarification: This is not like PYP. You will not get a basic alignment PM. You get to choose a role out of the list in the OP. If you pick a role listed under Town Aligned Roles you will be town aligned. If you pick a role listed under Mafia Aligned Roles you will be mafia aligned. You cannot be a mafia-aligned blue role.
Sorry if anyone was confused. The deadline to turn in requests has been extended until Thursday at 11 EST.
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Foolishness
United States3044 Posts
TL Mafia -Played 10 games; Survived 8 games; Medic saved 4 times; Lynched 0 times; Mafia forum!--http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/index.php?show_part=31
I hate you sooooo much right now. I was rockin' the 0 lynched until PYP1. 
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On February 10 2011 13:10 Foolishness wrote:Show nested quote +
TL Mafia -Played 10 games; Survived 8 games; Medic saved 4 times; Lynched 0 times; Mafia forum!--http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/index.php?show_part=31
I hate you sooooo much right now. I was rockin' the 0 lynched until PYP1.
I'm more jealous of the medic saves. Medic saved 1 time! Hit/died night 1 4 times.....
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On February 10 2011 13:33 Qatol wrote:Show nested quote +On February 10 2011 13:10 Foolishness wrote:
TL Mafia -Played 10 games; Survived 8 games; Medic saved 4 times; Lynched 0 times; Mafia forum!--http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/index.php?show_part=31
I hate you sooooo much right now. I was rockin' the 0 lynched until PYP1. I'm more jealous of the medic saves. Medic saved 1 time! Hit/died night 1 4 times.....
I'm just that pro-town
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This game looks like a lot of fun. I love the Coroner role. That's brilliant. I'll have to play this if there's a second one sometime...
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On February 10 2011 13:57 Kavdragon wrote:
This game looks like a lot of fun. I love the Coroner role. That's brilliant. I'll have to play this if there's a second one sometime...
Do you want to be on the replacement list?
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Nation List:
1. LSB - France
2. Coagulation - Germany
3. infinitestory - Balkans
4. Beneather - Italy
5. ShoCkeyy - England
6. BloodyC0bbler - Turkey
7. bumatlarge - Austria
8. Nemesis - Lowlands
9. Fishball - Russia
10. Divinek - Norway
11. Ace - Spain
As a reminder, there is no discussion about role picks. No exceptions.
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we are allowed to role claim though right?
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You took my turkey >
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Yes you are allowed to role claim is you so choose. You are only forbidden to discuss which role you picked in the pre-game stage.
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William McKinley, President of the United States of America, has been shot dead by a Polish anarchist. Though revolutionary fervor may not be yet apparent, trouble is brewing in Europe. Beware of assassination attempts or your nation will surely fall into chaos.
+ Show Spoiler [Spring 1901 Map] +
+ Show Spoiler [Nation List] +
Nation List:
1. LSB - France
2. Coagulation - Germany
3. infinitestory - Balkans
4. Beneather - Italy
5. ShoCkeyy - England
6. BloodyC0bbler - Turkey
7. bumatlarge - Austria
8. Nemesis - Lowlands
9. Fishball - Russia
10. Divinek - Norway
11. Ace - Spain
+ Show Spoiler [Unit Positions] +
Austria: A Tri
Balkans: A Ser
England: F Edi
France: A Bre
Germany: A Kie
Italy: A Nap
Lowlands: A Bel
Norway: A Swe
Russia: A Mos
Spain: F Spain (sc)
Turkey: A Smy
+ Show Spoiler [SC Ownership] +
Austria: [Tri]
Balkans: [Ser]
England: [Edi]
France: [Bre]
Germany: [Kie]
Italy: [Nap]
Lowlands: [Bel]
Norway: [Swe]
Russia: [Mos]
Spain: [Spa]
Turkey: [Smy]
It is now Spring 1901. You have until 8 PM EST on Saturday to get your movement orders in.
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On February 11 2011 13:48 LSB wrote:You took my turkey >
I was going to pick Turkey too.
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I thought we would have to build first. It's Spring 1901 though so did we all start with Armies and Fleets already?
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So no PMs right?
Just making sure, because its going to be very different trying to play diplomancy without PMs.
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On February 11 2011 14:02 Ace wrote:
I thought we would have to build first. It's Spring 1901 though so did we all start with Armies and Fleets already?
![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/0nrjM.jpg)
This is the starting map. I modified the setup so that every nation starts out with one unit, as shown on the map. Spain and England begin with fleets, while everyone else starts with an army.
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On February 11 2011 14:04 LSB wrote:
So no PMs right?
Just making sure, because its going to be very different trying to play diplomancy without PMs.
Correct, there are no PMs.
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oooo that little wiggly thing is a fleet!
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Well that changes quiet a lot.
Whose up for a no agression deal for the first year? This way we wait for the winter phase and we get to built more troops.
Once people have more troops, it becomes really difficult for one person to crack another without town approval, and we should be able to figure out team efforts to take over territory.
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+ Show Spoiler [A note on coasts] +For those who have not played Diplomacy before: There are two territories that have (2) coasts; Spain and Bulgaria. These two territories have coasts that are separated by another territory. Thus, a fleet on Spain's south coast (sc) cannot move to Gas, but is allowed to move to Por and Mar. A fleet on Spain (nc) can move to Gas and Por, but not Mar. A fleet on Bul (sc) can move to Gre or Con, but cannot move to Rum. A fleet on Bul (ec) can move to Rum and Con but not Gre.
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I'm not. Right now I've got an easy path to taking Marseilles from you. I'll think about it and make my decision based on what goes on in the next day and a half.
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Its not that easy eh? You take Mar, I pick up Spa.
I say we all just let it rest untill we get our troops.
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You can't pick up Spain without losing your army or Brest. Your march to Spain would have you surrounded by my new Army in Marseilles, the Army that would be built in Portugal and my fleet sitting in the LYO. Not to mention you'd send off your only army with 1 army in Belarus right there.
You really don't have any power to stop me from taking it. Either way like I said I'm not sure I want to just yet. Still looking at another option.
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How's this gonna go down Inf?
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Incog just told me I actually don't own Portugal or Tunis so umm yea there goes that idea.
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Clarification: The SCs listed under "Home SCs" in the OP means that those are the SCs where you can build IF you own the SCs and they are vacant. Otherwise, you cannot build in these SCs. The word "Home SCs" is just used to determine which SCs you can legally build in if you own them. For example, France is not allowed to build in London even if London is vacant and owned by France. You only own SCs that are shaded in your own color. So currently, everyone only owns the SC that they are currently occupying.
You are not allowed to have multiple units in a single territory.
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On February 11 2011 15:00 Ace wrote:
You can't pick up Spain without losing your army or Brest. Your march to Spain would have you surrounded by my new Army in Marseilles, the Army that would be built in Portugal and my fleet sitting in the LYO. Not to mention you'd send off your only army with 1 army in Belarus right there.
You really don't have any power to stop me from taking it. Either way like I said I'm not sure I want to just yet. Still looking at another option.
I move to spain. At the end of winter I have a troop in Bre, and a troop in spain. 2 countries.
You only have 1 country, a troop in Mar. Doesn't seem that great for you imo.
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LSB i am willing to form an alliance with you to do glorious battle against ace
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You can't help him so early. You'd leave yourself to being double crossed. lol Durrrrr!
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On February 12 2011 10:05 Coagulation wrote:
LSB i am willing to form an alliance with you to do glorious battle against ace
<3
Even though we are separated by many countries, and probably won't be about to ever help each other. Together we will pown!
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Gogo, let's turn this into Sengoku, World against Ace!
I'm a bit confused about the rules, do we have lynch, and if so do we have to lynch someone every year?
Also, what's the places with the suns and how is it different from places without suns?
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Inf hasn't posted anything so I'm praying he'll just keep to himself and build up a bit. GREAT SUCCESS.
It's diplomacy rules, a link in the OP gives a very good rulebook on how to play. Also:
Time Cycle:
This game is divided into the traditional Diplomacy Spring, Fall, and Winter phases. Each set of Spring, Fall, and Winter phases makes up one year. The game begins in the Spring of 1901. There is no traditional day/night cycle. Mafia-type actions occur during various winter seasons. Lynches occur every third winter (1903, 1906, 1909, 1912), and all other role actions occur on even winters (1902, 1904, 1906, etc.).
Spring Movement: 48 hours
Spring Retreat: 24 hours, or as soon as I get all retreat orders
Fall Movement: 48 hours
Fall Retreat: 24 hours, or as soon as I get all retreat orders
Winter Adjustment: 24 hours
In case I am not able to post around deadline, any votes after the 48 hour mark will not count and the game will be put on halt until the night post is up. Currently the deadline is 8 PM EST, but that is subject to change.
The day/night cycle can be ended before the official deadline if I have consent of all players. Players can send me this consent via PM.
Kinda funky how on 1906 we get to lynch and role actions are sent in as well. I'm assuming mafia actions will occur with other actions, which means "night" actions occur more often?
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On February 12 2011 11:20 Nemesis wrote:
Gogo, let's turn this into Sengoku, World against Ace!
I'm a bit confused about the rules, do we have lynch, and if so do we have to lynch someone every year?
Also, what's the places with the suns and how is it different from places without suns?
This is stated in the OP. You are allowed to lynch every third Winter (1903, 1906, 1909, 1912). You may place your vote anytime up until the deadline (which would be at the end of Winter 1903).
Territories that have a sun in them are Supply Centers. Territories that do not have a sun are not.
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Well in that case, I'm going to be taking Ruh. Coag, go take something else.
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I'm taking Apu ! Call it!
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If you have not already done so, please turn in your Spring 1901 actions. They are due in 2 hours.
The inactivity here is disappointing
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its cuz everyone is laaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaazy. But fear not, when my Army of Rape starts moving across the land I bet they get more active.
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Ace is evil? Hitler yeah I think so! :D Let's lynch ace ASAP! :D
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Im watching, but silently. yarrrr death to something and such
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Deadline extended because of inactivity. Also looking for replacements.
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who's inactive, lets just vote them off :D
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my secret lynch agenda has been foiled again by that meddlesome fishball
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Sorry for massive inactivity thus far, have just done two extremely long and tiring days at work which have led me to well, crash almost instantly upon getting home. Tommorrow I should be active in the morning/early afternoon but work sunday night and monday morning. This weekend is my wonkiest of hours this week, so hopefully I can be a bit more regular with my posting in the next few days.
I do notice however i am not the only one almost completely absent, bleh.
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It's a shame because Im fairly certain everyone who signed up has a few TL games under their belt.
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United States4053 Posts
ok this was bad
just got off a plane flight from Boston, ready to be confused by Diplomacy rules
@bum: I don't really want to engage in fight in our first day cycle (?), so I think I'll move my army to Bul.
But I've never played Diplomacy before, so I'm certainly looking for advice >_<
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LSB's Little guide to diplomacy!
Diplomacy is a strategy game. The basics.
Each country can only have one troop on it.
During a season (Spring and Summer), a troop can do only one action.
The actions are move, attack and support. Read the OP to see what these are
When its winter, you capture any supply centers your standing on. So try to get a supply center on the fall turn.
Tips:
Don't attack LSB
Predict your opponents actions.
Make sure your plans still work even if something goes wrong.
Make sure your using all of your troops.
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Well, from any standpoint, we don't benefit much attacking each other straight off. If you are gonna go right out and tell me where you are moving, I don't mind then. I'm going to wait a cycle before I start telling you my movements because I want to at least have two units on the field before I get bamboozled.
I won't take ser even though you told me you were leaving it, because it's more likely you are town since I don't have much to judge you on yet. I'd rather us both be on equal footing with everyone rather then make it a disadvantage for both of us.
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United States4053 Posts
On February 14 2011 04:49 LSB wrote:
LSB's Little guide to diplomacy!
Diplomacy is a strategy game. The basics.
Each country can only have one troop on it.
During a season (Spring and Summer), a troop can do only one action.
The actions are move, attack and support. Read the OP to see what these are
When its winter, you capture any supply centers your standing on. So try to get a supply center on the fall turn.
Tips:
Don't attack LSB
Predict your opponents actions.
Make sure your plans still work even if something goes wrong.
Make sure your using all of your troops.
icwydt
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![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/BaxHK.jpg) Fall 1901
+ Show Spoiler [Spring 1901 Movement] +![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/SUIbm.jpg) Austria: A Tri-Bud Balkans: A Ser-Bul England: F Edi H France: A Bre-Gas Germany: A Kie-Ber Italy: A Nap-Apu Lowlands: A Bel-Ruh Norway: A Swe-Fin Russia: A Mos-Sev Spain: F Spain (sc)-Por Turkey: A Smy-Con
It is now Fall 1901. Unless anyone objects, you have until 8 PM EST on Monday (tomorrow) to get your Fall movement orders in.
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Spain moving to portugal eh?! Trying to surprise me?!
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Looks like France wants to start a war with Spain. Watch out Franch can attack France directly :D.
If you have units on a country does that country produce another unit?If not how do you make more units?
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@shockey: no just taking one of my home SCs
lol @ LSB. Bad move. Looks like you just made a big mistake.
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On February 14 2011 08:12 Ace wrote:
@shockey: no just taking one of my home SCs
lol @ LSB. Bad move. Looks like you just made a big mistake.
Moving to Mar now. Don't worry, I don't want to fight you. We cool?
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On February 14 2011 08:12 Ace wrote:
@shockey: no just taking one of my home SCs
lol @ LSB. Bad move. Looks like you just made a big mistake.
Bull! You have to attack me sooner or later since we're both fleets...
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Unless, we work together and take over the main lands.
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@LSB: Why didn't you take Paris? That's a safer move. Your armies will be stretched thin and can't support each other.
@Shockeyy: I'm trying to avoid conflict at the moment. Even if I wanted to attack you with my 1 Fleet it has 0 support so you'd just take your land back and endgame me.
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hmmm so you want to form an alliance? Sure why not. You're the first one to ask and everyone else is just sitting on their ass. Lets go.
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United States4053 Posts
Bum, I figure we should form an alliance too. Out of all the home areas, I think ours are the closest. I'd certainly feel much safer about backstabbing with an alliance in place, and judging from your earlier post you feel the same. How about it?
Also, why was Bre-Gas pointed out as an aggressive move while Bel-Ruh was not? (As in, is there some characteristic of Bre-Gas that makes it seem more aggressive?)
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On February 14 2011 08:08 Beneather wrote:
If you have units on a country does that country produce another unit?If not how do you make more units?
No. You can make more units IF the number of SCs you own is greater than the number of units you currently have on the board. IF this is true, then you can build another unit (either F or A) in any one of your Home SCs that you own.
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On February 14 2011 08:49 Ace wrote:
hmmm so you want to form an alliance? Sure why not. You're the first one to ask and everyone else is just sitting on their ass. Lets go.
yea of course, we're the only two fleets in this game. I feel like we'll have a huge advantage if we work together.
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um...other people can build Fleets also lol. We just happened to START with Fleets.
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You guys are so jam packed in the western front.
I'm just drinking my vodka, chilling.
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United States4053 Posts
On February 14 2011 09:43 Fishball wrote:
You guys are so jam packed in the western front.
I'm just drinking my vodka, chilling.
ahahaha icwydt
because its almost russian winter
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On February 14 2011 09:28 Ace wrote:
um...other people can build Fleets also lol. We just happened to START with Fleets.
I know they can, but we have an advantage...
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On February 14 2011 08:44 Ace wrote:
@LSB: Why didn't you take Paris? That's a safer move. Your armies will be stretched thin and can't support each other.
I need to counter you if you moved to Mar, and Gas is pretty crucial for French defense.
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I'd like to remind people that we won't win with just lynches. Since the ability phase happens every two years, and lynches only take place every three, mafia do gain an advantage in a passive game.
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Incog, I'm guessing theres no pms allowed in this game right? I saw the rules saying no pms unless you say so and I just want to make sure.
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On February 15 2011 01:40 ShoCkeyy wrote:
Incog, I'm guessing theres no pms allowed in this game right? I saw the rules saying no pms unless you say so and I just want to make sure.
Yup no PMs.
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Fall 1901 actions are due in 6.5 hours. Please get them in if you have not already done so.
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## Vote Divinek
Since you guys are scared to get this started I will.
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Mother Russia is not scared of anything.
...and thanks for bringing this to my attention.
So Divinek, instead of taking and expanding his own SCs, moved his army to Fin.
Gee, I wonder what his next move would be.
Do not test my tolerance.
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with that being said,
## Vote Divinek
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oh shit the bandwagon is forming time to hop on
##vote Divinek
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i really dont have a next move i hardly understand how this game works and i felt like moving on my first turn
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You're a viking.
Make a boat and cross the ocean or something.
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##vote Fishball
KILL the COMMUNIST pig
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Vote Count for Winter 1903
Divinek (3)
Ace (1)
Fishball (1)
Divinek (1)
Fishball (1)
Coagulation (1)
If there is a mistake please let me know.
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On February 15 2011 06:22 Coagulation wrote:
##vote Fishball
KILL the COMMUNIST pig
Don't worry.
The Red Army will raise our Hammer and Sickle in Berlin soon enough.
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The divinek train wagon is leaving!
ALL ABOARD!
##vote divinek
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okay but actually are we just going to play this game like diplo with random lynches in between lol
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oh and for the sake of not dying should things not change much
##unvote
##vote fishball
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![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/Zy6mM.jpg) Winter 1901
+ Show Spoiler [Fall 1901 Movement] +![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/ijKwc.jpg) Austria: A Bud H Balkans: A Bul H England: F Edi-Yor France: A Gas-Mar Germany: A Ber H Italy: A Apu-Rom Lowlands: A Ruh-Mun Norway: A Fin-Nor Russia: A Sev H Spain: F Por-Spain(sc) Turkey: A Con-Ank
+ Show Spoiler [SC Ownership & Available Builds] +
Austria: [Tri][Bud] (+1)
Balkans: [Ser][Bul] (+1)
England: [Edi]
France: [Bre][Mar] (+1)
Germany: [Kie][Ber] (+1)
Italy: [Nap][Rom] (+1)
Lowlands: [Bel][Mun] (+1)
Norway: [Swe][Nor] (+1)
Russia: [Mos][Sev] (+1)
Spain: [Spa]
Turkey: [Smy][Ank] (+1)
+ Show Spoiler [Updated Voting Power] +
1. LSB - (2)
2. Coagulation - (2)
3. infinitestory - (2)
4. Beneather - (2)
5. ShoCkeyy - (1)
6. BloodyC0bbler - (2)
7. bumatlarge - (2)
8. Nemesis - (2)
9. Fishball - (2)
10. Divinek - (2)
11. Ace - (1)
It is now Winter 1901. You have until 8 PM EST on Tuesday to submit your Winter 1901 orders.
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Vote Count for Winter 1903
Divinek (5)
Ace (1)
Fishball (2)
Divinek
Nemesis (2)
Fishball (4)
Coagulation (2)
Divinek (2)
If there is a mistake please let me know.
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Seems like Nemesis drew first blood on the Nazis.
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Hmm, was that a mistake Ace? Weird move.
You didn't get to claim Por since you moved back to Spa...
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United States4053 Posts
On February 15 2011 14:36 Ace wrote:
hmm what? Why?
You only get ownership if you have a unit on a land you don't already own at the end of fall.
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so is like, anyone gonna pay attention to this game?
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charting my next course of action now
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The lynch isn't til 1903 right?
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On February 16 2011 08:57 Coagulation wrote:
charting my next course of action now
You can literally retake Mun after next spring.
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Finally not working retarded hours. Will be active once I can get a better read through this horribly short thread.
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![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/EYONv.jpg) Spring 1902
+ Show Spoiler [Winter 1901 Adjustment] +![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/1sxMD.jpg) Austria: Build A Tri Balkans: Build A Ser France: Build A Bre Germany: Build A Kie Italy: Build F Nap Lowlands: Build A Bel Norway: Build A Swe Russia: Build A Mos Turkey: Build F Smy
It is now Spring 1902. You have until 8 PM EST on Thursday to submit your orders. Please read the rules. Some people have been giving me invalid or ambiguous orders. Since more units are now in play and I'm tired of dealing with it, if you send in an incorrect order, I may not try to clarify it. If it is ambiguous or invalid your units will just default to holding.
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that last part was totally about me.
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United States4053 Posts
Just looking at Rum right now makes me feel tense
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On February 16 2011 11:33 infinitestory wrote:Just looking at Rum right now makes me feel tense
Rum is mine.
Sorry, but we like to drink.
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...
You guys are really being lazy this game :/
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What do you really expect from games like these and the given rule set.
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On February 17 2011 01:18 Ace wrote:
...
You guys are really being lazy this game :/
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Even if it's diplomacy we still have to scum hunt. So if no one wants to scum hunt then I guess I should just start asking for a mass claim then.
11 players, 7 pro-town roles, 3 Scum roles.
That means at worst there are 2 Vanilla Town. Either way I don't care.
Start claiming - now. Also don't worry about the Scum Theif. That one is easy to find. CLAIM. NOW.
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That's why I said "and the given rule set."
The majority of power roles cannot use their powers until next winter; Mafia can't hit anyone yet. Besides mass role claiming like you proposed (which I don't think is the best way to go), there really isn't much to do besides expanding and building shit.
I'm pretty sure things will heat up after a few more years. Hits/checks/saves, countries start to invade each other etc.
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well if it's not the best way to go give me an alternate route because if no one talks shit is about to get really bad.
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I've pretty much listed the alternate route in my post above, which is the current route the game is actually taking - wait it out.
I can see why no talking could lead to a bad ending, especially so when there is limited time for Town to win. I'm also not strongly opposing your proposal to mass claiming, but I'd rather be a bit more conservative here. This game is small enough, and has a relatively good player base to decide for itself so I'll go with the consensus. With that being said, I'm pretty sure you're well aware of the downside of claiming this early of the game.
Keep in mind, the above is just your typical Mafia vs Town mindset. I'm sure many others, including me wouldn't mind going for the epic 12 SC solo win.
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there is no consensus here.
There is only 1 bad thing from claiming here and that's the theif which I dont have a problem dealing with. It isn't even a major problem. So, everyone start claiming now.
and before I forget, Unvote Divinek
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Read the OP, we don't know the amounts of each role, there may be more or less than 2 townies.
Nice try Ace
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##Vote: Ace
"Lets give up the blue list to the mafia" sounds like a bad idea to me
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It doesn't matter how many townies there are. If a few players claim blue and everyone else claims townie then that's very good. Think for more than 3 seconds.
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oh awesome. I knew you'd be the first to jump. Time to get this party started.
I'm the Vigilante.
Guess who's getting shot in winter '04?
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And you're going to vertify your role by useing Mafia KP on me? Nice 'blue claim' btw
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There is NO role reveal. so everyone should claim before the first death so that the coroner can pop. Don't worry if you don't believe the claim because you won't be around much longer to matter.
So stop stalling and claim.
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##Vote ACE
COAG WITH THE ASSIST
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Wow, thats a horrible idea.
Night 1 we know the alignment of who dies, easy.
Day 1 we don't.
So your saying the corner should claim now, when night 1 is not even finished, and the rest of us pray that the doctor isn't stupid enough to claim correctly?
Tell me, why would a townie support such a mass claim?
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why wouldn't you support a mass claim in a game with 11 players and NO ROLE REVEAL?
Everyone that claims green gets put into the unconfirmed pool. Everyone that claims blue goes into the DT pool.
I shoot anyone that clashes.
The cornoner pops to find out who the dead are. Claiming before the first lynch is our best path to victory. If you've got another idea I'd love to hear it.
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Look at PYP3. Sounds suspiciously similar to my "give LSB the blues plan"
You making a few mistakes.
1) Assuming that we won't know the alignment of people who flip.
2) Proposing that we mass claim before the night is over.
3) Relying on blues who will just get shot early off
4) Assuming that there is a small amount of townies
5) Proposing the Corner/DT claim before he gets any results at all
As for an alternative, how about the roles play like how they are suppose to play? If DTs find a red, great! If doctors block a hit, great! If we want to confirm that Ace is mafia, the Corner can claim.
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Not even close. PYP3 and this aren't even on the same level of mechanics.
We are dealing with a no role reveal setup where we know that a coroner role definitely exists. Secondly the Mafia has 1KP and we know that the town also has a guaranteed 1KP - Me.
So as fast as the Scum can kill a townie at night, we can kill them also.
Secondly with 11 players resolving role claims doesn't take as long as 20+.
Where did I mention anything about not knowing the alignment of the people that flip? Not once did I mention anything about alignment since it's really, really obvious that figuring out alignment isn't even an issue here.
You are grasping for straws and not reading here sir. CLAIM and stop wasting time.
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That's actually really good, considering the apprentice can utilize the claim really well. And the doctor isn't even the backbone, if he gets hit first night, we still have coroner, DT and the apprentice. We may have clashing roles or some roles not present, but it will comfortably fishy to have 3 of anything or too many vanillas. I will claim second as soon as I hear from more people or LSB makes a better argument.
@LSB
1) Coroner, Mafia can't fake it even if there are two, because they will conflict.
2) 48 hours left, no one is inactive, just lurking
3) With 3 mafia in an 11 player game, we most definitely have a large pool of blues to work with, and we can lynch on par with night kills in the diplo mode.
4) If there are 5 vanilla townies, we wouldn't be winning via blues anyway. This gives us more information to work with on who claimed what that we would not have before.
5) That's the plan. Mafia can make up shit they checked later, but deciding who they will check and having them follow through gives them no lee-way.
I see coagulation went into sheep mode.
[b]Can the Apprentice take the role of a dead person?[b]
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On February 17 2011 09:15 bumatlarge wrote:
Can the Apprentice take the role of a dead person?
Yes, thats what the role does.
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Actually I think ace might be on to something here.
With the current setup it might be the best alternative we have.
BUT no one should claim until after 1902, as we won't be able to use that information until 1903 but mafia can.
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1) Coroner, Mafia can't fake it even if there are two, because they will conflict.
Umm… You’re missing the point. I’m saying that we can figure out the alignment of most of the people. The person who dies Night 1 is town.
2) 48 hours left, no one is inactive, just lurking
We have 120 hours before day 1 lynch is due -.-
In addition, I'm pointing out how by mass claiming now, we present a nice hit list to the mafia.
3) With 3 mafia in an 11 player game, we most definitely have a large pool of blues to work with, and we can lynch on par with night kills in the diplo mode.
So how do you know this?
And why is relying on blues a good thing?
4) If there are 5 vanilla townies, we wouldn't be winning via blues anyway. This gives us more information to work with on who claimed what that we would not have before.
You just contradicted your first point, in addition, you ignore mafia fakeclaims on roles that there might not have any people. For example, if there is no detective this game and Mafia fake claimed it.
5) That's the plan. Mafia can make up shit they checked later, but deciding who they will check and having them follow through gives them no lee-way.
… I don’t get your response. So why is it so difficult to make up stuff on night one when it is not so difficult to make up stuff night one?
In addition what benefit would we get if the DT claimed night 0 instead of day 1?
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Okay, you have not addressed any of my points, and instead waved around a flag of "We won't know what people flip"
On February 17 2011 09:13 Ace wrote:
Not even close. PYP3 and this aren't even on the same level of mechanics.
You completely ignored my point. I'm talking about how a mass claim is horribly anti-town
You just say...
We are dealing with a no role reveal setup where we know that a coroner role definitely exists. Secondly the Mafia has 1KP and we know that the town also has a guaranteed 1KP - Me.
So as fast as the Scum can kill a townie at night, we can kill them also.
This is not responsive at all. In fact you just reveal similarities. In PYP3 we know that a few roles definitely exist. In PYP3 Mafia had only 1 KP, and town had 3 KP...
Secondly with 11 players resolving role claims doesn't take as long as 20+.
I really don't think that time was the issue with the mass claim I proposed in PYP3. The issue was that I was the SK, and I used that to take out the Bulletbill (and then I would have hit the tracker) Night 1.
Where did I mention anything about not knowing the alignment of the people that flip? Not once did I mention anything about alignment since it's really, really obvious that figuring out alignment isn't even an issue here.
So wait... what's the point of your plan then? If I remember correctly, you were saying that we need this plan because we won't know the alignment/role of players flipping.
In fact that's your only reason (well, you then pretend the only way we can find mafia is through a mass claim) I'll spoiler the parts for you.
+ Show Spoiler +On February 17 2011 09:13 Ace wrote:
We are dealing with a no role reveal setup On February 17 2011 08:58 Ace wrote:
why wouldn't you support a mass claim in a game with 11 players and NO ROLE REVEAL? On February 17 2011 08:45 Ace wrote:
There is NO role reveal. so everyone should claim before the first death so that the coroner can pop. Don't worry if you don't believe the claim because you won't be around much longer to matter.
So stop stalling and claim.
A few questions for you.
Let's say this is the claim
+ Show Spoiler +LSB- Townie
Coagulation - Corner
infinitestory - DT
Beneather - Townie
ShoCkeyy - Vet
BloodyC0bbler - Doctor
bumatlarge - Apprentice
Nemesis - Townie
Fishball - Townie
Divinek - Townie
Ace - Vig
What do we do now? How does this benefit the town?
Why should we do it now night 1, instead of Day 2?
Why should the corner claim before he gets any results?
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Will alignment be revealed on death?
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Role Reveal:
There is NO role reveal upon death.
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Just making sure. Thanks!
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On February 17 2011 10:10 LSB wrote:Okay, you have not addressed any of my points, and instead waved around a flag of "We won't know what people flip" Show nested quote +On February 17 2011 09:13 Ace wrote:
Not even close. PYP3 and this aren't even on the same level of mechanics. You completely ignored my point. I'm talking about how a mass claim is horribly anti-town You just say... Show nested quote +We are dealing with a no role reveal setup where we know that a coroner role definitely exists. Secondly the Mafia has 1KP and we know that the town also has a guaranteed 1KP - Me.
So as fast as the Scum can kill a townie at night, we can kill them also. This is not responsive at all. In fact you just reveal similarities. In PYP3 we know that a few roles definitely exist. In PYP3 Mafia had only 1 KP, and town had 3 KP... I really don't think that time was the issue with the mass claim I proposed in PYP3. The issue was that I was the SK, and I used that to take out the Bulletbill (and then I would have hit the tracker) Night 1. Show nested quote +Where did I mention anything about not knowing the alignment of the people that flip? Not once did I mention anything about alignment since it's really, really obvious that figuring out alignment isn't even an issue here. So wait... what's the point of your plan then? If I remember correctly, you were saying that we need this plan because we won't know the alignment/role of players flipping. In fact that's your only reason (well, you then pretend the only way we can find mafia is through a mass claim) I'll spoiler the parts for you. + Show Spoiler +On February 17 2011 09:13 Ace wrote:
We are dealing with a no role reveal setup On February 17 2011 08:58 Ace wrote:
why wouldn't you support a mass claim in a game with 11 players and NO ROLE REVEAL? On February 17 2011 08:45 Ace wrote:
There is NO role reveal. so everyone should claim before the first death so that the coroner can pop. Don't worry if you don't believe the claim because you won't be around much longer to matter.
So stop stalling and claim. A few questions for you. Let's say this is the claim + Show Spoiler +LSB- Townie
Coagulation - Corner
infinitestory - DT
Beneather - Townie
ShoCkeyy - Vet
BloodyC0bbler - Doctor
bumatlarge - Apprentice
Nemesis - Townie
Fishball - Townie
Divinek - Townie
Ace - Vig What do we do now? How does this benefit the town? Why should we do it now night 1, instead of Day 2? Why should the corner claim before he gets any results?
Well we can guess by the order of claims who is more believable. For instance, if no one else claims Vig, Ace would have had to be extremely lucky as mafia to pick the only role we didn't have. Therefore, we really don't have many reasons to lynch Ace, unless he does something ridiculous, or future evidence proves against him.
We are chancing on a pre-set amount of roles (1 of each). This leaves no room for mafia to claim blues while not being put out there. This doesn't make it an auto-lynch of course, but this puts a spotlight on the person. 2 blues of the same role have nothing to fear really, since they can prove what they are in most cases.
With that set-up, unless one of the last claims was a blue, we can assume all the blues are legit, until proven otherwise. We nearly clear 7(!) people, unless mafia has previous knowledge, is lucky, or waits for an untaken role. Again, it's either that or nothing (haven't heard an alternate plan). Mafia can only take out 1 person every 2 years, so they can't "eliminate" all the blues without us gaining anything with the blues we know. I'd assume BC would be the first to die, then myself. This way mafia's hits do not get stopped, unless they want to risk a protect, where the odds are in the BC's favor. The coroner should have popped at some time confirming BC and our first lynch and letting me flawlessly assume second doctor. I die next, because of the repeat scenario. Ace get's a hit off, DT reveals 2 checks, and Lawyer gives any info or clues based on diaries. Come 1906, mafia hit 3 people, 2 doctors and most likely the DT, who has given us info on two people. At the same time we had 1 lynch and ace's hit, confirming him, and then another lynch. If Inf checked LSB and beneather and you both came back town, the last three would be under heavy scrutiny (the 5 who claimed town will most likely have 3 dead among their number. Mafia hit Ace in 1908, and the confirmed coroner and Lawyer remain along with two role checked townies. Then GF is one of the townies.
We can analyze dual claims quite well with a DT with guaranteed 2 checks (unless mafia fakeclaim one, that would be interesting) and we get plenty of time to do additional analysis as well and maneuvering in the game.
Worse case scenario, mafia claims a role that we do not have. Alternately, mafia claims a claimed role, in which case we have to be resourceful depending on what role was dual claimed. Best case, DT checks mafia who claimed vanilla tow, Ace vigs another who was GF, and DT checks another and hes mafia > we win without using diplo mechanic or analysis (aside form DT)
I like our odds, mafia has to fakeclaim blue, and we can still visualize the actual set-up if there are 3 different extra blues lying around.
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Though looking at it again, it seems a lot more viable to do the roleclaim after W1902. We can buy more time rather then subjecting the doctor to a first kill, an coroner can prove himself by taking the claim of himself and the hit. There is no vet though, we would get lucky if they hit green.
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Doesn't revealing have that fundamental problem of giving mafia a perfect list of who to hit? Sure there could be protection but with multiple blues having claimed the mafia can be fairly sure they arent lying etc
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They only have 1 kp and they have very good chances to take out a blue regardless, and there is no vet.
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How does the mafia win in this game when they have the most votes that it over runs the town? So lets say there's 3 mafias and 1 town but the townie has more countries than the other 3 does it mean the game still goes on?
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On February 18 2011 07:59 Beneather wrote:
How does the mafia win in this game when they have the most votes that it over runs the town? So lets say there's 3 mafias and 1 town but the townie has more countries than the other 3 does it mean the game still goes on?
The only way one townie could have more votes than mafia is if they have a majority of the SCs. A majority of the SCs is 18. Townies get a solo win at 12. So if the situation you describe would not happen as that townie would win way before this scenario occurred.
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![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/SKy0T.jpg) Fall 1902
+ Show Spoiler [Spring 1902 Movement] +![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/j0w7F.jpg) Austria: A Bud-Vie Austria: A Tri H Balkans: A Bul H Balkans: A Ser-Gre England: F Yor-Lon France: A Bre-Gas France: A Mar-Spa Germany: A Ber H Germany: A Kie-Hol Italy: A Rom-Apu Italy: F Nap-ION Lowlands: A Bel-Ruh Lowlands: A Mun H Norway: A Swe-Fin Norway: A Nor H Russia: A Sev-Ukr Russia: A Mos-StP Spain: F Spain(sc)-Por Turkey: A Ank-Con Turkey: F Smy-AEG
It is now Fall 1902. You have until 8 PM EST on Saturday to submit your orders.
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:o Looks like france wants Spain :O This looks likes Ace is fucked!
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France is drawing first blood. Incoming ragefest.
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On February 18 2011 10:31 Beneather wrote:
:o Looks like france wants Spain :O This looks likes Ace is fucked!
Are you going to take Tunisia?
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United States4053 Posts
How's this going down, Turkey?
~your friendly neighbor, Balkans
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United States4053 Posts
On February 18 2011 11:56 infinitestory wrote:
How's this going down, Turkey?
~your friendly neighbor, Balkans
P.S. You too, Italy.
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On February 18 2011 10:35 LunarDestiny wrote:
France is drawing first blood. Incoming ragefest.
Technically, although there is "no blood", Nemesis made the first move.
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wow inf really trusts me. MASS CLAIM YES NO?
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On February 18 2011 12:51 bumatlarge wrote:
wow inf really trusts me. MASS CLAIM YES NO?
I feel ignored
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For:
Ace
Bum
Nemesis
Against:
LSB
Coag
fish
?:
divinek(didnt say)
inf (ignored)
Beneather (ignored)
BC (nothing)
shockey (nothing)
Ace already claimed so give your opinions. I think it might be better to wait until after night so we can buy a night. Mafia win in 1913 anyway, so after doc ad app die (if they dont get hit), it will already be spring of 1907. We only get 4 lynches to kill 3 mafia. I think claiming now or tomorrow gives us the best chances.
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On February 18 2011 12:43 Fishball wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2011 10:35 LunarDestiny wrote:
France is drawing first blood. Incoming ragefest. Technically, although there is "no blood", Nemesis made the first move.
How did I make the first move? All I did was expand.
Coag I see that you are rather getting close to my land :X
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On February 18 2011 10:48 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2011 10:31 Beneather wrote:
:o Looks like france wants Spain :O This looks likes Ace is fucked! Are you going to take Tunisia?
Of course :D
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Mass Claim... hmm. I think it's a good idea because it has a lot of ways to catch mafia slip ups and we can lynch 1 player if two overlap or something we can lynch one then kill the other. There are 11 players 4 mafia so 7 townies 6 roles 1 townie so 1 to each player so we'll know if there's an overlap. I think Mass claim is the way to go.
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Also, we should use Ace's vig hit ASAP because if we don't the mafia we'll get him and we'll lose one of townie kps w/out even using it.
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On February 18 2011 13:23 Beneather wrote:
Also, we should use Ace's vig hit ASAP because if we don't the mafia we'll get him and we'll lose one of townie kps w/out even using it.
There are 3 mafias, and vig can't use kp until 1904
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On February 18 2011 13:13 Nemesis wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2011 12:43 Fishball wrote:On February 18 2011 10:35 LunarDestiny wrote:
France is drawing first blood. Incoming ragefest. Technically, although there is "no blood", Nemesis made the first move. How did I make the first move? All I did was expand. Coag I see that you are rather getting close to my land :X
You expanded onto one of Germany's SC.
Not all SC can produce units, only your default SC can.
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On February 18 2011 13:29 Fishball wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2011 13:13 Nemesis wrote:On February 18 2011 12:43 Fishball wrote:On February 18 2011 10:35 LunarDestiny wrote:
France is drawing first blood. Incoming ragefest. Technically, although there is "no blood", Nemesis made the first move. How did I make the first move? All I did was expand. Coag I see that you are rather getting close to my land :X You expanded onto one of Germany's SC. Not all SC can produce units, only your default SC can.
really? I didn't know that.
But isn't his default SC Kie?
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United States4053 Posts
I've been debating whether to claim or not. I haven't ignored the argument.
I think it's easy to catch an unprepared mafia, but I've got reservations about 2 things.
1) They've had time to prepare claims and think about what they would respond if challenged.
2) How would you check a role like doctor?
On another note, still waiting on a response from Italy/Turkey - What do you guys intend to do?
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Noooo, the big bad germans are coming to rape my men...someone save me!
Is that an official declaration of war?
AND NO ONE SHOULD CLAIM UNTIL AFTER 1902
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On February 18 2011 13:27 Nemesis wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2011 13:23 Beneather wrote:
Also, we should use Ace's vig hit ASAP because if we don't the mafia we'll get him and we'll lose one of townie kps w/out even using it. There are 3 mafias, and vig can't use kp until 1904
mb, but there's also a thief so there maybe 4 mafias.
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So LSB I claimed Vigi and even after I said I wouldn't attack you you still took Spain.
Come on, this REEKS of Scum play. There are 0 counter claims to the Vigi claim. If you were a Townie why would you take Spain?
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On February 18 2011 13:59 infinitestory wrote:
I've been debating whether to claim or not. I haven't ignored the argument.
I think it's easy to catch an unprepared mafia, but I've got reservations about 2 things.
1) They've had time to prepare claims and think about what they would respond if challenged.
2) How would you check a role like doctor?
On another note, still waiting on a response from Italy/Turkey - What do you guys intend to do?
1.) Doesn't matter how much time they have to prepare a claim. There are 11 players which means any role clash doesn't take us too much time to solve. It's going to be difficult for them to safe claim when No Role reveal screws them over also. We have an Apprentice and a Coroner role which makes mass claim really powerful early on.
2.) Doesn't even matter. We just need to split the power roles from the vanilla roles asap. Once that happens and players die anyone can be confirmed via apprentice (first death) or via coroner (at anytime he decides to pop).
If you don't support mass claim then propose another idea. The amount of laziness and lack of thinking is making this epic setup look like shit.
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On February 18 2011 14:19 Beneather wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2011 13:27 Nemesis wrote:On February 18 2011 13:23 Beneather wrote:
Also, we should use Ace's vig hit ASAP because if we don't the mafia we'll get him and we'll lose one of townie kps w/out even using it. There are 3 mafias, and vig can't use kp until 1904 mb, but there's also a thief so there maybe 4 mafias.
In an 11 player game I highly doubt there are 4 Scum. 3 is pretty standard, 4 is overkill especially when Scum can kill via taking provinces.
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On February 18 2011 14:18 Nemesis wrote:Noooo, the big bad germans are coming to rape my men...someone save me! Is that an official declaration of war? AND NO ONE SHOULD CLAIM UNTIL AFTER 1902
Give a really good reason. Claiming before the first death helps the Town more than it helps Scum.
## Vote LSB
This shouldn't even require much thought.
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How does it help town more than it helps scum?
We can't really do anything with the information from mass role claiming until 1903 when our lynch comes in and 1904 when blue roles come in.
On the other hand, it helps mafia choose their blue target of choice.
There really is no reason why we shouldn't wait until after the first death, or if there is maybe you can explain it to me.
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On February 18 2011 14:52 Nemesis wrote:
How does it help town more than it helps scum?
We can't really do anything with the information from mass role claiming until 1903 when our lynch comes in and 1904 when blue roles come in.
On the other hand, it helps mafia choose their blue target of choice.
There really is no reason why we shouldn't wait until after the first death, or if there is maybe you can explain it to me.
Scum: I only know who is Scum, so anyone I kill is Town. Roles not flipping dont necessarily affect my kill choice. I always know how many Scum and Town are in the game, therefore I always know the state of the game.
Town: I only know that I am Town. I don't know any roles, so when someone dies I still don't know anything about the state of the game except that there is one less player.
"We can't do anything with the information" isn't a correct argument. The mere fact that we know who is Town aligned via roles BEFORE death puts Mafia in a position to false claim incorrectly. We ALSO make our coroner role more powerful before he has to pop. Like I said above if we have no idea about people's roles before they die when we have the power to actually make this easier on ourselves then why wouldn't we do it?
Getting everyone's information before the first death makes things that much easier in the long run. It's an 11 player game which means we don't have to wait long to resolve anything. Just CLAIM because we are wasting a ton of time with this ridiculous shit. People are trying to talk diplomacy shit when it's still a Mafia game.
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I like how you still havent addressed my critisims of your plan Ace and start blabbering how it will make things 'easier', along with a OMGUS vote.
Again I ask. Why in the world do we need role flips? Knowing that someone that died is green or blue isn't going to magically reveal the scum team.
Again I say, why would the scum team do any unsafe fake claims?
Again, I repeat, unless you have some overwhelming urge to give up the doctor on the first night and give up our chance to prevent the Mafia KP for the rest of the game, do not support Ace's so called 'plan'
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On February 18 2011 15:39 LSB wrote:
I like how you still havent addressed my critisims of your plan Ace and start blabbering how it will make things 'easier', along with a OMGUS vote.
Again I ask. Why in the world do we need role flips? Knowing that someone that died is green or blue isn't going to magically reveal the scum team.
Again I say, why would the scum team do any unsafe fake claims?
Again, I repeat, unless you have some overwhelming urge to give up the doctor on the first night and give up our chance to prevent the Mafia KP for the rest of the game, do not support Ace's so called 'plan'
I'm not sure if you can't read or are selectively reading so here it goes again:
Aside from the obvious benefits of catching Scum in lies, knowing people's roles before they flip gets us closer to catching them since it can be proven who lied via Coroner. If people die and we don't know their role than NO townie except the Apprentice (once) would know if we actually succeeded in killing Scum. If we know a the role or by extension the alignment of a player that died then we can actually go back to their posts and analyze what was going on. Without this information it is that much harder to confirm reads on other players.
"why would the Scum Team do any unsafe fake claims?"
Gee, maybe because they don't know what to claim? Have you *ever* played in a game with mass claims before? Where Scum try to stall as long as possible to claim so they can find out what roles are safe? That's whats going on now. The faster the Town mass claims the harder it is for anyone to fake a claim. If the Scum team fake claims then let them - between myself (Vigilante), Coroner and Apprentice with only 11 players it doesn't take a lot of effort to resolve this stuff. Add in that at least 3 of us playing this game are smart players unless all 3 of us are Scum I don't see this not working.
Stop with the scare tactics by the way. Giving up the Doctor is the least of our worries here. Especially since you know, we have an Apprentice role. Your fears are seriously unfounded.
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Suppose Ace the Mafia dies, would the corner get a result of Mafia?
There goes your "oh, we can tell if mafia lied" argument. Your little 'role vertification' plan is unessissary and just a ploy to flush out the blue roles.
I've played games with mass claims. PYP3, my plan was basically a mass claim. And if I remeber correctly you tried to do a mass claim which failed miserably in Penalty Mafia.
In addition, your saying that preventing mafia KP is unimportant. Thats intresting.
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United States4053 Posts
On February 18 2011 14:18 Nemesis wrote:Noooo, the big bad germans are coming to rape my men...someone save me! Is that an official declaration of war? AND NO ONE SHOULD CLAIM UNTIL AFTER 1902
I very much agree with this. Even if I go with this plan, I'll at least hold off until then as well.
I also have to ask:
You say that based on the claims and knowing the alignment of dead guys, we can fish out coroner fake claims, etc. But that takes time, and day cycles are very precious to us. Mass roleclaiming quickly gives the mafia instant information, which they can put to use immediately. I don't think a mass roleclaim gives us the luxury of using the information immediately; we have to sift out the bullshit first, while the mafia doesn't. How will you address this?
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Coroner:
You have the ability to discern the true identities of the dead. Once per game, you may send me a PM requesting the roles of every dead player.
Coroner is an activated ability. Once activated, the roles of all the dead are revealed to the Coroner. So mafia would flip mafia, thieves would flip thief, blue roles will flip their respective blue roles, and townies will flip townie. Basically this role gives the coroner a one time role reveal for all past deaths.
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On February 18 2011 16:30 infinitestory wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2011 14:18 Nemesis wrote:Noooo, the big bad germans are coming to rape my men...someone save me! Is that an official declaration of war? AND NO ONE SHOULD CLAIM UNTIL AFTER 1902 I very much agree with this. Even if I go with this plan, I'll at least hold off until then as well. I also have to ask: You say that based on the claims and knowing the alignment of dead guys, we can fish out coroner fake claims, etc. But that takes time, and day cycles are very precious to us. Mass roleclaiming quickly gives the mafia instant information, which they can put to use immediately. I don't think a mass roleclaim gives us the luxury of using the information immediately; we have to sift out the bullshit first, while the mafia doesn't. How will you address this?
We aren't fishing Coroner fake claims, we are using the Coroner to help find fake claims via people's death.
We have the luxury of using the information immediately and I've addressed this several times: we know roles are tied to alignment. We do not know anything via death, hence we need to force a mass claim before death so EVERYONE is held accountable. We sift through the bullshit the same way we always do in every game of Mafia ever played: We analyze.
LSB you really should stop comparing this game and PYP 3. The mere fact that you are not only a poor player when it comes to understanding mechanics, but also that you still don't understand what No Role Reveal does to the Town means you should stop speaking. If you can not comprehend how a game works that is fine, but when I'm here explaining to you the difference between the games and you still can't "get it" then maybe you should think of something else to ponder over.
That being said if any of you have a problem with this idea I'll ask: Have any of you ever played a game with No Role Reveal?. If you have tell me what happened in that game when the first player died.
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I'm still not sold on pre-1902 massclaim. I think we can get the same information while taking a slight chance on giving any blues an extra night. I've already discussed what would happen if we all claimed now, and even though it gives nice odds, I think we can wring some more usefulness out of the plan doing it after night.
Post-1902 massclaim
Mafia - Thief is useless still. Worsts case, they snipe the DT first. The coroner would be a bad hit as well. Every other role would be ok to lose, as medic and apprentice would die first anyway, lawyer can be kinda useful later, Ace vig claimed with no counterclaim and a vanilla town hit would be great.
Town - Coroner pops, claims for both himself and the dead person, carries a lot of wieght, would be pretty difficult to falseclaim. DT gives his check. If both medic and apprentice are alive, then we begin the process one night later, and buy DT an extra life. Lawyer can get dary of dead player and confirm coroner. Claimed vig benefits the same as he is the only claimed person.
I think it's better to wait just one night, because it makes the plan stronger for blues, and the odds are against mafia in hitting a role we need. I suppose it could still be up for debate.
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On February 18 2011 16:46 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2011 16:30 infinitestory wrote:On February 18 2011 14:18 Nemesis wrote:Noooo, the big bad germans are coming to rape my men...someone save me! Is that an official declaration of war? AND NO ONE SHOULD CLAIM UNTIL AFTER 1902 I very much agree with this. Even if I go with this plan, I'll at least hold off until then as well. I also have to ask: You say that based on the claims and knowing the alignment of dead guys, we can fish out coroner fake claims, etc. But that takes time, and day cycles are very precious to us. Mass roleclaiming quickly gives the mafia instant information, which they can put to use immediately. I don't think a mass roleclaim gives us the luxury of using the information immediately; we have to sift out the bullshit first, while the mafia doesn't. How will you address this? We aren't fishing Coroner fake claims, we are using the Coroner to help find fake claims via people's death. We have the luxury of using the information immediately and I've addressed this several times: we know roles are tied to alignment. We do not know anything via death, hence we need to force a mass claim before death so EVERYONE is held accountable. We sift through the bullshit the same way we always do in every game of Mafia ever played: We analyze. LSB you really should stop comparing this game and PYP 3. The mere fact that you are not only a poor player when it comes to understanding mechanics, but also that you still don't understand what No Role Reveal does to the Town means you should stop speaking. If you can not comprehend how a game works that is fine, but when I'm here explaining to you the difference between the games and you still can't "get it" then maybe you should think of something else to ponder over. That being said if any of you have a problem with this idea I'll ask: Have any of you ever played a game with No Role Reveal?. If you have tell me what happened in that game when the first player died.
Great, so instead of actually addressing my concerns of perfect blue sniping by the mafia, now you are resorting to bashing my experience.
Okay, I challenege you to provide me a game where mass claiming worked in a No PM mini game.
Just because this is the first no-role reveal game (apparetly XXXVI doesn't count) I've played, doesn't mean that I can't recognize a bad plan.
Again, so why do we need to 'sort out fake claims'? The coroner can flip dead players without a mass claim. Wtf are we going to do with accountability? A dead mafia is a dead mafia. Its not like the mafia can still pretend to be playing when the mafia is dead.
I believe you are mafia, and since you're right about to die, you're trying to shove a bad plan through the town so that you can help your scumbuddies.
This is demonstrated since you insist its very important we do it right now before the mafia hit has been decided. There is no reason why we need to do it early, besides for the false sence of urgency your plan creates.
I'd like to keep this civil, so I'll refrain from attacked you personally, and I'd ask that you do that too.
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Just saying, shouldn't we use the apprintance on the corner to get two role flips?
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How would apprentice know who the coroner is?
I don't think LSB is one talk about recognizing bad plans : / but that aside, I've given you most if not all the benefits of mass claiming. I'd just like Ace to clarify why it should be before W-1902 and not after.
Ace has claimed vig, and a counter claim to him would make him look bad, but no one has so far, so he seems to be looking more townish to me. Not saying a vig should have claimed yet, but only you and coagulation are really against it, so unless you have something to really say against ace besides blues being known (already discussed why this isn't as damning as it sounds) and fakeclaiming. As I already stated, coroner and lawyer can't really be faked, medics are expected to die quickly along with apprentices, DTs can only be faked by the thief but this puts a mafia member under immediate threat, and ace has claimed vig already. The GF/DT/Thief issues are the largest problems we have to deal with, and massclaim, while it does not solve this problem, spearheads it right of the bat where we would eventually have to deal with it later.
So unless we can analyze extremely well (which involves people posting more), we probably won't win with no public blue communication. Though everyone here is a capable player, so perhaps that is what LSB is banking on? Anyway, there is no reason to finish Ace off before 1904, LSB, as he can't fake an extra hit when we can safely assume there is only 1 mafia KP, and other vigis will claim hits.
Lay off rage, bro.
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United States4053 Posts
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Delay due to inactivity. Divinek has been modkilled. Waiting for confirmation from a replacement.
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On February 19 2011 12:13 bumatlarge wrote:
How would apprentice know who the coroner is?
After the coroner claims and gives his results, the apprentice takes his role. Think of it as a baton pass that way we get two results
I don't think LSB is one talk about recognizing bad plans : /
Considering I've developed and pushed bad plans twice before, I know what a bad plan is... this is a textbook example of a bad plan. You recognize it too. If it was such a good plan, why don't you claim right now in the Fall of 1902?
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Nooooooooo! Divinek is deead So when is Winter going to start?
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On February 21 2011 02:00 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +On February 19 2011 12:13 bumatlarge wrote:
How would apprentice know who the coroner is? After the coroner claims and gives his results, the apprentice takes his role. Think of it as a baton pass that way we get two results Considering I've developed and pushed bad plans twice before, I know what a bad plan is... this is a textbook example of a bad plan. You recognize it too. If it was such a good plan, why don't you claim right now in the Fall of 1902?
Apprentice can only take the power of dead people, so unless mafia kills coroner after he used his powers, apprentice can't take his power.
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LSB doesn't read the rules.
And I hope you ban divine for a good ten games because I rarely see him active enough in any games.
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![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/CMFHh.jpg) Fall 1902 Retreat
+ Show Spoiler [Fall 1902 Movement] +![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/Cjm6R.jpg) Austria: A Vie H Austria: A Tri-Ven Balkans: A Bul S Gre Balkans: A Gre H England: F Lon H France: A Gas-Par France: A Spa H Germany: A Ber-Mun Germany: A Hol-Ruh Italy: A Apu-Ven Italy: F Nap-TYS Lowlands: A Ruh H Lowlands: A Mun-Kie Norway: A Fin-StP Norway: A Nor S Fin-StP Russia: A Ukr-War Russia: A StP H Spain: F Por-Spa(nc) Turkey: A Con S AEG-Bul(sc) Turkey: F AEG-Bul(sc)
It is now Fall 1902 Retreat. Winter will commence as soon as I get retreat orders in. Feel free to send in build orders if you wish.
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Sorry citi.zen has replaced Divinek.
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Coag, this means war! D:
Anyone want to partner up with me on my quest on World Domination and killing those Nazis?
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On February 21 2011 05:26 bumatlarge wrote:
LSB doesn't read the rules.
And I hope you ban divine for a good ten games because I rarely see him active enough in any games.
He already has had a ban, so the next one would be 3 games. Good enough?
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Future movement cycles are 24 hours for each phase.
Looking for one more replacement.
Armies can cross from Con to Bul and vice versa without fleets.
Armies can cross from Den to Swe and vice versa without fleets.
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United States4053 Posts
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![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/3dGg0.jpg) Winter 1902
+ Show Spoiler [Fall 1902 Retreat] +![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/Pv1hr.jpg) Balkans: Bul-Rum Russia: StP-Mos
+ Show Spoiler [SC Ownership & Available Builds] +
Austria: [Tri][Bud][Vie] (+1)
Balkans: [Ser][Gre][Rum] (+1)
England: [Edi][Lon] (+1)
France: [Bre][Mar][Par][Spa] (+2)
Germany: [Ber][Mun][Hol] (+1)
Italy: [Nap][Rom]
Lowlands: [Bel][Ruh][Kie] (+1)
Norway: [Swe][Nor][StP] (+1)
Russia: [Mos][Sev][War] (+1)
Spain: [Por]
Turkey: [Smy][Ank][Bul][Con] (+2)
+ Show Spoiler [Updated Voting Power] +
1. LSB - (4)
2. Coagulation - (3)
3. infinitestory - (3)
4. Beneather - (2)
5. ShoCkeyy - (2)
6. BloodyC0bbler - (4)
7. bumatlarge - (3)
8. Nemesis - (3)
9. Fishball - (3)
10. citi.zen - (3)
11. Ace - (1)
It is now Winter 1902. You have until 10 PM EST on Monday to submit your orders. Note that some roles can use their abilities in this phase.
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Norway, Russia, or Austria, do you want to help me get rid of germany?
##Unvote Divinek
##Vote Coagulation
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This is still mafia, even if it has a diplomacy theme - get active please. Don't be fooled into thinking you can win by getting 12 cores by yourself: the mafia will work together AND kill people who get close to that target using their KP. That said, I can see a "confirmed" player being medic protected at night and getting "free" provinces from other townies in some situations.
We have at most 4 lynches before the mafia win. Eliminating players via diplomacy seems tricky and could easily backfire and give mafia more KP and/or votes. The 3 vig hits seem hugely important. If the mafia have a thief, stealing the vig would probably be gg.
Which brings me to Ace's vig claim. The timing of the claim is odd, given the vig can only be confirmed in 1904. Up until then they are just a big mafia target. Maybe Ace counted on medic protection, but then that does not stop the thief, right? Why give the mafia more KP on a silver platter?
Would love to hear from BC at some point.
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The following people need to post soon or risk being modkilled:
ShoCkeyy
Aaaand that's about half the players in the game. This isn't going to turn out at all.
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I'm here, just not willing to do much work unless other people step up
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I've here, watching my homeland being invaded...
Damn Nor and its borders touching Stp
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should really lynch anyone trying to eliminate other players. Townies don't know who is town/scum so they should be smart enough not to kill others. Smh.
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Very little really that I can talk about atm.
People are randomly fighting and playing this more like diplo than mafia (although I am guilty of this as well).
I shall try to get more into this, but it will take serious discussion from more than ace to make this feel like anything other than diplo
IS I do apologize for taking Bul, but without it I am pretty well fucked if anyone decides to invade -_-
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On February 21 2011 17:32 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Very little really that I can talk about atm.
People are randomly fighting and playing this more like diplo than mafia (although I am guilty of this as well).
I shall try to get more into this, but it will take serious discussion from more than ace to make this feel like anything other than diplo
IS I do apologize for taking Bul, but without it I am pretty well fucked if anyone decides to invade -_-
I call BS, I know you wanted it and is more than happy to take it from him.
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On February 21 2011 15:37 Nemesis wrote:
Norway, Russia, or Austria, do you want to help me get rid of germany?
##Unvote Divinek
##Vote Coagulation
lol u mad?
your the aggressive one.
i had said i was willing to push after ace with LSB.
instead your pushing me.
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Vote Count for Winter 1903
citi.zen (Divinek) (3)
Ace
Fishball (3)
Divinek
Nemesis
Fishball (3)
Coagulation
citi.zen (Divinek) (3)
Ace (7)
LSB (4)
Coagulation (3)
LSB (1)
Ace (1)
Coagulation (3)
Nemesis (3)
If there is a mistake please let me know.
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On February 21 2011 18:08 Coagulation wrote:Show nested quote +On February 21 2011 15:37 Nemesis wrote:
Norway, Russia, or Austria, do you want to help me get rid of germany?
##Unvote Divinek
##Vote Coagulation lol u mad? your the aggressive one. i had said i was willing to push after ace with LSB. instead your pushing me.
your =/= you're
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Anyone else care about the thief taking the vigilante role?
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On February 21 2011 23:50 citi.zen wrote:
Anyone else care about the thief taking the vigilante role?
I'm not really concerned with that, since I believe Ace is Mafia.
If he was thief, it's really strange that he would claim this early. It would be understandable if he claimed 1904, but 1902 is just...
However, we do still have to consider the possibility if Ace actually is thief, that would mean our 1903 lynch should be used to root out the thief because in 1904 Mafia can hit and kill two people.
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Also, I will keep my vote on Fishball. Not because we share a border - neither of us can really make another move for lack of support.
I will vote for him for this post:
On February 17 2011 08:30 Fishball wrote:
I've pretty much listed the alternate route in my post above, which is the current route the game is actually taking - wait it out.
I can see why no talking could lead to a bad ending, especially so when there is limited time for Town to win. I'm also not strongly opposing your proposal to mass claiming, but I'd rather be a bit more conservative here. This game is small enough, and has a relatively good player base to decide for itself so I'll go with the consensus. With that being said, I'm pretty sure you're well aware of the downside of claiming this early of the game.
Keep in mind, the above is just your typical Mafia vs Town mindset. I'm sure many others, including me wouldn't mind going for the epic 12 SC solo win.
The first part is wishy-washy: maybe he's against the plan, but he'll go with the other players; maybe not talking is bad, but let's not talk substantively about anything either.
The second part gently encourages others to go for the "epic win". I don't like that one bit - as I stated before. The mafia will work together to prevent us from getting there. If all else fails kill someone who gets close at night. This "epic solo win strategy" distracts the town at this stage.
Thus far Fishball reads like someone trying to seem active and fly under the radar. I see no real effort to catch reds or help the town, only discrete comments to promote confusion and some spam. Red behavior.
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On February 21 2011 18:08 Coagulation wrote:Show nested quote +On February 21 2011 15:37 Nemesis wrote:
Norway, Russia, or Austria, do you want to help me get rid of germany?
##Unvote Divinek
##Vote Coagulation lol u mad? your the aggressive one. i had said i was willing to push after ace with LSB. instead your pushing me.
Ahem push after ace? Is that why you are taking over my land?
Ace, can you provide an example game on a no fliip game so maybe we have a better idea of what you are talking about?
citi.zen, vigi can't shoot during 1902, but it would indeed be troublesome for 1904.
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United States4053 Posts
On February 21 2011 17:32 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
IS I do apologize for taking Bul, but without it I am pretty well fucked if anyone decides to invade -_-
I'm more fucked without Bul, seeing as the number of people who could turn around and invade is ~4, and seeing as I don't have a fleet yet, I can't convoy as an escape route.
I also want to see an example game from Ace where massclaim helps. I'm not yet sold on the idea, and I do agree that the timing of Ace's vig claim is odd (even if there isn't a counterclaim).
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On February 22 2011 00:28 citi.zen wrote:Also, I will keep my vote on Fishball. Not because we share a border - neither of us can really make another move for lack of support. I will vote for him for this post: Show nested quote +On February 17 2011 08:30 Fishball wrote:
I've pretty much listed the alternate route in my post above, which is the current route the game is actually taking - wait it out.
I can see why no talking could lead to a bad ending, especially so when there is limited time for Town to win. I'm also not strongly opposing your proposal to mass claiming, but I'd rather be a bit more conservative here. This game is small enough, and has a relatively good player base to decide for itself so I'll go with the consensus. With that being said, I'm pretty sure you're well aware of the downside of claiming this early of the game.
Keep in mind, the above is just your typical Mafia vs Town mindset. I'm sure many others, including me wouldn't mind going for the epic 12 SC solo win. The first part is wishy-washy: maybe he's against the plan, but he'll go with the other players; maybe not talking is bad, but let's not talk substantively about anything either. The second part gently encourages others to go for the "epic win". I don't like that one bit - as I stated before. The mafia will work together to prevent us from getting there. If all else fails kill someone who gets close at night. This "epic solo win strategy" distracts the town at this stage. Thus far Fishball reads like someone trying to seem active and fly under the radar. I see no real effort to catch reds or help the town, only discrete comments to promote confusion and some spam. Red behavior.
i think your aces scumbuddy
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It's 8 vs. 3 now. If we mis-lynch + mafia hits someone it will be 6 vs. 3. I can see situations where this is already LYLO, depending on the voting power distribution.
Start talking - you will not get to 12 cores as town.
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United States4053 Posts
##Vote BC
Because the least you could have done is tell me to move aside. At least that way I would have had time to prepare a fleet on Gre.
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United States4053 Posts
Also, I agree that citi.zen/divinek looks slightly red, based on that fiasco in the beginning where divinek went aggressive on Russia and then pulled out the "I'm noob" card back on page 6.
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United States4053 Posts
On February 21 2011 23:50 citi.zen wrote:
Anyone else care about the thief taking the vigilante role?
oh btw guys I reread the OP because I thought something sounded wrong here, thief doesn't steal the role like apprentice, it's actually a mafia DT from what I can tell.
no spreading misinformation pls
I am, however, legitimately concerned that Ace is Godfather taking on Vig's role, since Vig doesn't even do anything until 1904 but is still a power role.
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Thief:
You have the ability to ask for the role of a specific player. You may use this ability during the winter of any even year (Winter 1902, Winter 1904, Winter 1906, etc.).
"Ask for" implies some sort of transfer of power to me, but incognito can clarify. Otherwise it would be "ask about" or something like that.
Perhaps you already asked in a pm?
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Detective:
You have the ability to ask for the role of a specific player during the winter of any even year (Winter 1902, Winter 1904, Winter 1906, etc.)
Looks like the Mafia Theif is just a Mafia DT then.
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That's one bit of good news at least.
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United States4053 Posts
On February 22 2011 04:25 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +Detective:
You have the ability to ask for the role of a specific player during the winter of any even year (Winter 1902, Winter 1904, Winter 1906, etc.) Looks like the Mafia Theif is just a Mafia DT then.
Yup. ^-^ that's how I read it too
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IM HERE IM HERE.... I had to drive to NY this past weekend and I finally got internet here in my hotel room.
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Vote Count for Winter 1903
citi.zen (Divinek) (3)
Ace
Fishball (3)
Divinek
Nemesis
Fishball (3)
Coagulation
citi.zen (Divinek) (3)
Ace (7)
LSB (4)
Coagulation (3)
LSB (3)
Ace (1)
ShoCkeyy (2)
Coagulation (3)
Nemesis (3)
BloodyC0bbler (3)
infinitestory (3)
If there is a mistake please let me know.
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Why are you guys trying to kill off some one that has barely any voting power or even any nations under his control? You guys really need to examine what we have so far... I voted from LSB because one, he's in my allies territory and two it's cause he's only voting off ace cause of vet status. Which is an idiotic move. If ace had some important position. i'm sure that Ace would be all over this mafia game, but because this mafia game seems so dead, he doesn't even want to play much. Now we need to get the activity up and not go off and waste your votes. I vote for LSB.
Might sounded weird what I typed, but I just got internet in my hotel room and I needt o get to work and I didn't have much time to post
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On February 22 2011 06:06 ShoCkeyy wrote:
Why are you guys trying to kill off some one that has barely any voting power or even any nations under his control? You guys really need to examine what we have so far... I voted from LSB because one, he's in my allies territory
Care to elablorate hm?
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United States4053 Posts
On February 22 2011 06:09 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2011 06:06 ShoCkeyy wrote:
Why are you guys trying to kill off some one that has barely any voting power or even any nations under his control? You guys really need to examine what we have so far... I voted from LSB because one, he's in my allies territory Care to elablorate hm?
as the two nations beginning with fleets, shockeyy and ace formed an alliance at the very start iirc
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Seemed like a very informal alliance.
Lets look at the votecounts so far.
citi.zen
Fishball-Voting because citi.zen attacked him
Fishball (3)
citi.zen (3)- Voted because of this http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190444¤tpage=12#232
Ace (7)
LSB (4)- Voted because of this http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190444¤tpage=8#151
Coagulation (3)- Voted because Ace is scum, bless his heart
LSB (3)
Ace (1)- Pissed because LSB attacked Ace
ShoCkeyy (2)- Voted because LSB attacked Ace
Coagulation (3)
Nemesis (3)- Voted because he's fighting coag
BloodyC0bbler (3)
infinitestory (3)-Voted because he's fighting BC
Everything marked in red is people voting for their own personal reasons, not with any analysis at all. (Ok, I'm biased with Coag, but Coag always plays like that). We're making the lynch just our own personal playground to try to play diplomacy.
I'd rather we use it to find scum. IE Ace.
Then again, I can take out Ace tomorrow if you want me to. If you give me the greenlight, I'll do it, and then we can pick another person to lynch.
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Yes. The Mafia wants us to play diplomacy while they kill us.
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United States4053 Posts
On February 22 2011 07:17 citi.zen wrote:
Yes. The Mafia wants us to play diplomacy while they kill us.
let's not do this
"hey forget about diplo while i attack fishball and lsb attacks ace"
kinda thing
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On February 22 2011 07:44 infinitestory wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2011 07:17 citi.zen wrote:
Yes. The Mafia wants us to play diplomacy while they kill us. let's not do this "hey forget about diplo while i attack fishball and lsb attacks ace" kinda thing
I don't see why my attack of Ace is a bad thing...
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On February 22 2011 06:20 LSB wrote:Seemed like a very informal alliance. Lets look at the votecounts so far. citi.zenFishball-Voting because citi.zen attacked himFishball (3)citi.zen (3)- Voted because of this http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190444¤tpage=12#232Ace (7)LSB (4)- Voted because of this http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190444¤tpage=8#151Coagulation (3)- Voted because Ace is scum, bless his heart LSB (3)Ace (1)- Pissed because LSB attacked AceShoCkeyy (2)- Voted because LSB attacked AceCoagulation (3)Nemesis (3)- Voted because he's fighting coagBloodyC0bbler (3)infinitestory (3)-Voted because he's fighting BCEverything marked in red is people voting for their own personal reasons, not with any analysis at all. (Ok, I'm biased with Coag, but Coag always plays like that). We're making the lynch just our own personal playground to try to play diplomacy. I'd rather we use it to find scum. IE Ace. Then again, I can take out Ace tomorrow if you want me to. If you give me the greenlight, I'll do it, and then we can pick another person to lynch.
Wtf you smoking?
I voted Divinek right after Ace did, and never changed my vote. Not after the douche invaded me.
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Well, I guess you just want to keep him on line but really doesn't look fair. Your destroying the dear boy
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On February 22 2011 07:17 citi.zen wrote:
Yes. The Mafia wants us to play diplomacy while they kill us.
As much as I can slap a more detailed response to your "reasoning" on page 12, I decided not to.
With the quote above though, all I can say is, "Says the guy who took one of my SCs".
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On February 22 2011 07:44 infinitestory wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2011 07:17 citi.zen wrote:
Yes. The Mafia wants us to play diplomacy while they kill us. let's not do this "hey forget about diplo while i attack fishball and lsb attacks ace" kinda thing
I explained this to you already. We can easily be in LYLO by the 2nd lynch.
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I'm not explaining anything about No Role Reveal and why Mass Claim beats it in this setup again. If you haven't gotten it by now from reading my posts and using your head you never will.
citizen is correct in that trying to play Diplo isn't a great idea(yet) since there is no way town can kill all 3 mafia via invasion. The best you can say is that aggressive nations are more likely to be Scum if you believe that Townies are not going to try and kill each other.
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On February 22 2011 08:55 citi.zen wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2011 07:44 infinitestory wrote:On February 22 2011 07:17 citi.zen wrote:
Yes. The Mafia wants us to play diplomacy while they kill us. let's not do this "hey forget about diplo while i attack fishball and lsb attacks ace" kinda thing I explained this to you already. We can easily be in LYLO by the 2nd lynch.
too bad you didn't start this game, I think you're the only one thinking
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On February 22 2011 08:00 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2011 07:44 infinitestory wrote:On February 22 2011 07:17 citi.zen wrote:
Yes. The Mafia wants us to play diplomacy while they kill us. let's not do this "hey forget about diplo while i attack fishball and lsb attacks ace" kinda thing I don't see why my attack of Ace is a bad thing...
It is a bad thing because youre attacking the only person in this game that has nothing except with what he started with... You only attacked ace because you want him out of the game early on.
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On February 22 2011 03:39 infinitestory wrote:
##Vote BC
Because the least you could have done is tell me to move aside. At least that way I would have had time to prepare a fleet on Gre.
This post makes no sense. Yes you retreated but won a center overall. How would "moving aside" have helped at all? BC won two centers out of it.
You and BC moved to the top of the shady list. Plus, BC has too many votes and no intention to help.
""Vote BloodyC0bbler""
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Damn phone.
## Vote BloodyC0bbler
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On February 22 2011 09:54 Ace wrote:
I'm not explaining anything about No Role Reveal and why Mass Claim beats it in this setup again. If you haven't gotten it by now from reading my posts and using your head you never will.
IIRC, you said that the Mass Claim wasn't suppose to be for the alignment flip. Why the change of heart?
On February 22 2011 10:53 ShoCkeyy wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2011 08:00 LSB wrote:On February 22 2011 07:44 infinitestory wrote:On February 22 2011 07:17 citi.zen wrote:
Yes. The Mafia wants us to play diplomacy while they kill us. let's not do this "hey forget about diplo while i attack fishball and lsb attacks ace" kinda thing I don't see why my attack of Ace is a bad thing... It is a bad thing because youre attacking the only person in this game that has nothing except with what he started with... You only attacked ace because you want him out of the game early on.
Start here and read down http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190444¤tpage=8#151
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Note that if lsb and BC are red and we mislynch we're done - they have too many votes. Just saying.
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On February 22 2011 10:58 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2011 09:54 Ace wrote:
I'm not explaining anything about No Role Reveal and why Mass Claim beats it in this setup again. If you haven't gotten it by now from reading my posts and using your head you never will. IIRC, you said that the Mass Claim wasn't suppose to be for the alignment flip. Why the change of heart? Show nested quote +On February 22 2011 10:53 ShoCkeyy wrote:On February 22 2011 08:00 LSB wrote:On February 22 2011 07:44 infinitestory wrote:On February 22 2011 07:17 citi.zen wrote:
Yes. The Mafia wants us to play diplomacy while they kill us. let's not do this "hey forget about diplo while i attack fishball and lsb attacks ace" kinda thing I don't see why my attack of Ace is a bad thing... It is a bad thing because youre attacking the only person in this game that has nothing except with what he started with... You only attacked ace because you want him out of the game early on. Start here and read down http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190444¤tpage=8#151
The question is why would you waste your vote on ace when you could easily kill him?
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On February 22 2011 11:01 ShoCkeyy wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2011 10:58 LSB wrote:On February 22 2011 09:54 Ace wrote:
I'm not explaining anything about No Role Reveal and why Mass Claim beats it in this setup again. If you haven't gotten it by now from reading my posts and using your head you never will. IIRC, you said that the Mass Claim wasn't suppose to be for the alignment flip. Why the change of heart? On February 22 2011 10:53 ShoCkeyy wrote:On February 22 2011 08:00 LSB wrote:On February 22 2011 07:44 infinitestory wrote:On February 22 2011 07:17 citi.zen wrote:
Yes. The Mafia wants us to play diplomacy while they kill us. let's not do this "hey forget about diplo while i attack fishball and lsb attacks ace" kinda thing I don't see why my attack of Ace is a bad thing... It is a bad thing because youre attacking the only person in this game that has nothing except with what he started with... You only attacked ace because you want him out of the game early on. Start here and read down http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190444¤tpage=8#151 The question is why would you waste your vote on ace when you could easily kill him?
Agree, it'd be much more simpler for you just to lynch somebody else then kill Ace on the next winter. I really don't know who to vote for but I'll go for bumatlarge because he is taking my SC and I don't like that
##Vote: Bumatlarge
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On February 22 2011 11:01 ShoCkeyy wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2011 10:58 LSB wrote:On February 22 2011 09:54 Ace wrote:
I'm not explaining anything about No Role Reveal and why Mass Claim beats it in this setup again. If you haven't gotten it by now from reading my posts and using your head you never will. IIRC, you said that the Mass Claim wasn't suppose to be for the alignment flip. Why the change of heart? On February 22 2011 10:53 ShoCkeyy wrote:On February 22 2011 08:00 LSB wrote:On February 22 2011 07:44 infinitestory wrote:On February 22 2011 07:17 citi.zen wrote:
Yes. The Mafia wants us to play diplomacy while they kill us. let's not do this "hey forget about diplo while i attack fishball and lsb attacks ace" kinda thing I don't see why my attack of Ace is a bad thing... It is a bad thing because youre attacking the only person in this game that has nothing except with what he started with... You only attacked ace because you want him out of the game early on. Start here and read down http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190444¤tpage=8#151 The question is why would you waste your vote on ace when you could easily kill him?
Because some of us would rather hear what other people say (Ace's and your opinions don't count) before moving on with the kill.
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United States4053 Posts
On February 22 2011 10:55 citi.zen wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2011 03:39 infinitestory wrote:
##Vote BC
Because the least you could have done is tell me to move aside. At least that way I would have had time to prepare a fleet on Gre. This post makes no sense. Yes you retreated but won a center overall. How would "moving aside" have helped at all? BC won two centers out of it. You and BC moved to the top of the shady list. Plus, BC has too many votes and no intention to help. ""Vote BloodyC0bbler""
imagine yourself in my shoes for a moment, please.
I now have a unit on Rum, pretty much trapped, and I'm going to have to move it back to Ser so BC/someone else doesn't push it farther. In the end, in winter 1903 (when SC count really matters) I will most likely end up with fewer SCs. If BC just wanted access to Rum and told me so, we probably could have worked something out.
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On February 22 2011 11:17 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2011 11:01 ShoCkeyy wrote:On February 22 2011 10:58 LSB wrote:On February 22 2011 09:54 Ace wrote:
I'm not explaining anything about No Role Reveal and why Mass Claim beats it in this setup again. If you haven't gotten it by now from reading my posts and using your head you never will. IIRC, you said that the Mass Claim wasn't suppose to be for the alignment flip. Why the change of heart? On February 22 2011 10:53 ShoCkeyy wrote:On February 22 2011 08:00 LSB wrote:On February 22 2011 07:44 infinitestory wrote:On February 22 2011 07:17 citi.zen wrote:
Yes. The Mafia wants us to play diplomacy while they kill us. let's not do this "hey forget about diplo while i attack fishball and lsb attacks ace" kinda thing I don't see why my attack of Ace is a bad thing... It is a bad thing because youre attacking the only person in this game that has nothing except with what he started with... You only attacked ace because you want him out of the game early on. Start here and read down http://www.teamliquid.net/forum/viewmessage.php?topic_id=190444¤tpage=8#151 The question is why would you waste your vote on ace when you could easily kill him? Because some of us would rather hear what other people say (Ace's and your opinions don't count) before moving on with the kill.
Why doesn't my opinion count? 'Cause I am allied with Ace? Well either way, like I said, you can try and kill ace next turn rather than waste your vote on him.
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Once again I am missing a significant amount of actions. Please get them in people. Hard for me to find replacements, though if I can't I suppose I would have no choice but to either end the game, or modkill without replacements, which would severely imbalance the game.
Vote Count for Winter 1903
citi.zen (Divinek) (3)
Ace
Fishball (3)
Divinek
Nemesis
Fishball (0)
Coagulation
citi.zen (Divinek)
Ace (7)
LSB (4)
Coagulation (3)
LSB (3)
Ace (1)
ShoCkeyy (2)
Coagulation (3)
Nemesis (3)
BloodyC0bbler (6)
infinitestory (3)
citi.zen (3)
bumatlarge (2)
Beneather (2)
If there is a mistake please let me know.
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United States4053 Posts
On February 22 2011 15:16 Coagulation wrote:
so is ace lynched?
lynch is in winter 1903, dummy
also, don't forget about this
Godfather:
You are the head of the mafia, and when role checked, will show up as any role of your choice. You must choose before Winter 1902 is over, otherwise I will randomly choose for you. You may also override your in-thread vote by PM.
If the godfather is anyone not named infinitestory, citi.zen, or Ace, he can change the lynch to BC. Which frankly isn't safe for us, since BC and LSB would both have to be red for the lynch to hit.
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Since im now back at my machine I see that citizen is participating and has somehow managed to get others too as well, awesome. I guess we can get a real game out of this.
As such I will post my thoughts.
The entire situation with citizen taking charge is awesome. Serious props for joining later and keeping active, however stop your random finger pointing unless you start pointing some at yourself. You not only have FoS myself but you have also FoS Infinity. You tell us we shouldn't be playing this like a game of diplomacy yet attacked fishball without provocation to my knowledge rather than taking one of your own home sc's.
Now I am just as guilty on that as I took Bul however I'm not trying to keep eyes elsewhere.
On February 22 2011 11:45 infinitestory wrote:Show nested quote +On February 22 2011 10:55 citi.zen wrote:On February 22 2011 03:39 infinitestory wrote:
##Vote BC
Because the least you could have done is tell me to move aside. At least that way I would have had time to prepare a fleet on Gre. This post makes no sense. Yes you retreated but won a center overall. How would "moving aside" have helped at all? BC won two centers out of it. You and BC moved to the top of the shady list. Plus, BC has too many votes and no intention to help. ""Vote BloodyC0bbler"" imagine yourself in my shoes for a moment, please. I now have a unit on Rum, pretty much trapped, and I'm going to have to move it back to Ser so BC/someone else doesn't push it farther. In the end, in winter 1903 (when SC count really matters) I will most likely end up with fewer SCs. If BC just wanted access to Rum and told me so, we probably could have worked something out.
I currently hold no intentions of moving farther north as I now have two potential exits if I am attacked. I have no real interest to be super aggressive this game as I have not been given a reason to be. If you don't like how the board is situated at the moment I am sorry but I think you can see where I was coming from.
To get the ball rolling on this people really should start talking about this game. I am bad for it and if we can get the level of activity up that would be awesome. Now, ATM ace/lsb are doing an obvious sort of fight (started beginning of game).
I have explained why I moved where I did, but we still need citizen to justify his move, need bum, coag, nemesis, and beneather to all explain why they are all fighting eachother as It makes no sense to me thus far. Do you think eachother is red? why are you all attacking eachothers home sc's without fully owning your own first?
I get this is a mix of two games but so many assaults have happened with little to no provocation that I can get, as no one has vocalized it really in thread except for IS against me, and Ace against LSB. Can we get some reasoning please?
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United States4053 Posts
I'll take your word for it that you won't move farther north. I have no real reason to doubt what you say.
I'm also curious as to why the people playing the most aggressively in diplo are telling us to focus more on the mafia half of the game.
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On February 22 2011 15:48 infinitestory wrote:
I'll take your word for it that you won't move farther north. I have no real reason to doubt what you say.
I'm also curious as to why the people playing the most aggressively in diplo are telling us to focus more on the mafia half of the game.
to avert gazes from their movements would be my guess, but I'm not sure.
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On February 22 2011 15:45 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Since im now back at my machine I see that citizen is participating and has somehow managed to get others too as well, awesome. I guess we can get a real game out of this. As such I will post my thoughts. The entire situation with citizen taking charge is awesome. Serious props for joining later and keeping active, however stop your random finger pointing unless you start pointing some at yourself. You not only have FoS myself but you have also FoS Infinity. You tell us we shouldn't be playing this like a game of diplomacy yet attacked fishball without provocation to my knowledge rather than taking one of your own home sc's. Now I am just as guilty on that as I took Bul however I'm not trying to keep eyes elsewhere. Show nested quote +On February 22 2011 11:45 infinitestory wrote:On February 22 2011 10:55 citi.zen wrote:On February 22 2011 03:39 infinitestory wrote:
##Vote BC
Because the least you could have done is tell me to move aside. At least that way I would have had time to prepare a fleet on Gre. This post makes no sense. Yes you retreated but won a center overall. How would "moving aside" have helped at all? BC won two centers out of it. You and BC moved to the top of the shady list. Plus, BC has too many votes and no intention to help. ""Vote BloodyC0bbler"" imagine yourself in my shoes for a moment, please. I now have a unit on Rum, pretty much trapped, and I'm going to have to move it back to Ser so BC/someone else doesn't push it farther. In the end, in winter 1903 (when SC count really matters) I will most likely end up with fewer SCs. If BC just wanted access to Rum and told me so, we probably could have worked something out. I currently hold no intentions of moving farther north as I now have two potential exits if I am attacked. I have no real interest to be super aggressive this game as I have not been given a reason to be. If you don't like how the board is situated at the moment I am sorry but I think you can see where I was coming from. To get the ball rolling on this people really should start talking about this game. I am bad for it and if we can get the level of activity up that would be awesome. Now, ATM ace/lsb are doing an obvious sort of fight (started beginning of game). I have explained why I moved where I did, but we still need citizen to justify his move, need bum, coag, nemesis, and beneather to all explain why they are all fighting eachother as It makes no sense to me thus far. Do you think eachother is red? why are you all attacking eachothers home sc's without fully owning your own first? I get this is a mix of two games but so many assaults have happened with little to no provocation that I can get, as no one has vocalized it really in thread except for IS against me, and Ace against LSB. Can we get some reasoning please?
This post is actually helpful because it makes me almost certain BC is red.
Keep in mind BC is one of the top players on TL. As town he typically comes up with a plan of sorts. He knows that he is a prime target for the mafia and needs to make the medic want to protect him. I've seen him so many times kick things off by suggesting DT check lists, medic lists, plans to confirm townies, etc. etc. In this game he would be a lot more motivated to do this since he leads in votes, making him an even juicier mafia target.
Contrast that approach with what BC does in this game. The only long post is the one above, your typical "pretend to be active but give the town nothing" fare. BC says he will give us his opinions on the game but fails to offer much of anything: no talking about Ace's proposal and zero thoughts on how the town might proceed. His post is only really interested with addressing my FOS-ing him, which he does in two ways: patting me on the back for making the game more active (maybe I will think him an ally and lay off him); and casting some doubts about me, which he also does in his follow-up post. Read this sentence again, remembering it comes from one of the best mafia players on TL:
Serious props for joining later and keeping active, however stop your random finger pointing unless you start pointing some at yourself.
While acknowledging the game picked up a bit due to finger pointing, he wants me to stop doing it. Unless I start pointing fingers at myself, that is. Which makes no sense.
Then we have a series of empty statements, restating some of the things we know - eg LSB fighting with Ace.
So there you have it. If you are going to vote for someone else, please offer better behavioral analysis. Then again the level of inactivity is so high the game might be stopped anyway.
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Spring 1903
+ Show Spoiler [Winter 1902 Adjustment] +
Austria: Build A Bud
Balkans: Build A Ser
France: Build A Mar
France: Build F Bre
Germany: Build A Ber
Lowlands: Build A Bel
Norway: Build F Swe
Russia: Build A Sev
Turkey: Build F Smy
Turkey: Build F Ank
citi.zen, president of Norway, is dead.
It is now Spring 1902. You have until 8 PM EST on Wednesday to get your orders in.
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Wow, that was quick for citi.zen to go.
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Russia is going for total domination.:O! Fishball why did you want to kill citi.zen?
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Citi.zen was causing up activity, which mafia did not like. So now to look back at everyones post and see who was against citi.zen causing this activity or at least going against him.
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so citi.zen makes a huge post about BC being mafia
then gets immediately offed.
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Vote Count for Winter 1903
citi.zen (Divinek) (3) (dead)
Ace
Fishball (3)
Divinek
Nemesis
Fishball (0)
Coagulation
citi.zen (Divinek)
Ace (7)
LSB (4)
Coagulation (3)
LSB (2)
Ace
ShoCkeyy (2)
Coagulation (3)
Nemesis (3)
BloodyC0bbler (4)
infinitestory (3)
citi.zen (dead)
Ace (1)
bumatlarge (2)
Beneather (2)
If there is a mistake please let me know.
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And Coag is right...
##Vote BC
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On February 23 2011 05:48 Beneather wrote:
Russia is going for total domination.:O! Fishball why did you want to kill citi.zen?
Yes, I am obviously Mafia since he touched my tralala, therefore I decided to off him so I can take over the world.
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Now would be claiming time, if people are on board with that. I AM A MEDIC LOLZ NOW YOU HAVE TO CLAIM LOL DISNEY WORLD.
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On February 23 2011 08:01 bumatlarge wrote:
Now would be claiming time, if people are on board with that. I AM A MEDIC LOLZ NOW YOU HAVE TO CLAIM LOL DISNEY WORLD.
Great, I wonder what the next KP is going to...
All right then. If you are medic, why didn't you protect Citi.zen last night?
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I'm town
I think Citizen might have been on to something.
LSB don't kill Ace unless there is a counterclaim.
##Unvote Coagulation
##Vote BloodyCobbler
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As much as I dislike BCs sudden move into Bulgaria, I don't get this bandwagon that suddenly formed on BC. It's one thing to say "I don't like BC be cause of A, B, and C", and another to say "I agree with a dead man, vote BC".
It seems all too convenient.
I do agree, BC isn't as active as he usually is, and since we know that he has been moving his pieces around he is in fact paying attention to the game. Way to lurkerish for a townie.
Only thing stopping me from voting BC, is Ace. I'd rather lynch him. But... Hey! If you guys let me kill Ace, I'll vote BC!
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Vote Count for Winter 1903
citi.zen (Divinek) (3) (dead)
Ace
Fishball (3)
Divinek
Nemesis
Fishball (0)
Coagulation
citi.zen (Divinek)
Ace (7)
LSB (4)
Coagulation (3)
LSB (0)
Ace
ShoCkeyy
Coagulation (0)
Nemesis
BloodyC0bbler (9)
infinitestory (3)
citi.zen (dead)
Ace (1)
ShoCkeyy (2)
Nemesis (3)
bumatlarge (2)
Beneather (2)
Non Voters (7)
bumatlarge (3)
BloodyC0bbler (4)
If there is a mistake please let me know.
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United States4053 Posts
Vanilla townie.
I'm not a huge fan of this bandwagon on BC right now, if only because
1) I certainly didn't have a very conclusive reason for voting BC - I'll admit that, but I don't have anyone better. I've personally loosened my suspicion on BC since I voted.
2) That bandwagon sprang up way too quickly, based on (dare i say) very shallow evidence, including on citi.zen's part. What does citi.zen even say? Shallow FoS initially pointed because of some post of mine? And he follows it up with some shoddy logic? I'm not attacking citi.zen of course, but his post is by no means a reason to bandwagon BC.
I'll avoid WIFOM as much as I can, but I personally think BC's being scapegoated.
##Unvote BC
##Vote Ace for pouncing on BC far too quickly IMO.
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Vote Count for Winter 1903
citi.zen (Divinek) (3) (dead)
Ace
Fishball (3)
Divinek
Nemesis
Fishball (0)
Coagulation
citi.zen (Divinek)
Ace (10)
LSB (4)
Coagulation (3)
infinitestory (3)
LSB (0)
Ace
ShoCkeyy
Coagulation (0)
Nemesis
BloodyC0bbler (6)
infinitestory
citi.zen (dead)
Ace (1)
ShoCkeyy (2)
Nemesis (3)
bumatlarge (2)
Beneather (2)
Non Voters (7)
bumatlarge (3)
BloodyC0bbler (4)
If there is a mistake please let me know.
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Everyone should be making diaries before night or when it looks like they will be lynched so lawyer can help confirm coroner.
I believe a coroner should pop after the lynch, but should claim regardless.
I was protecting ace of course, as I really couldn't predict citizen getting hit. I didn't really interact with him as I was fairly absent from internet access.
Everyone should claim, as I am obviously the next kill target, since the chances of two medics is slim, it's a difficult fake claim and it puts a huge target. Already explained why claiming now is best.
REMEMBER TO WRITE DIARIES (I forgot to that would be bad lol)
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On February 23 2011 09:07 infinitestory wrote:
Vanilla townie.
I'm not a huge fan of this bandwagon on BC right now, if only because
1) I certainly didn't have a very conclusive reason for voting BC - I'll admit that, but I don't have anyone better. I've personally loosened my suspicion on BC since I voted.
2) That bandwagon sprang up way too quickly, based on (dare i say) very shallow evidence, including on citi.zen's part. What does citi.zen even say? Shallow FoS initially pointed because of some post of mine? And he follows it up with some shoddy logic? I'm not attacking citi.zen of course, but his post is by no means a reason to bandwagon BC.
I'll avoid WIFOM as much as I can, but I personally think BC's being scapegoated.
##Unvote BC
##Vote Ace for pouncing on BC far too quickly IMO.
rofl at least pretend to be trying
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We shouldn't kill Ace until he at least gets the chance to use his ability. It is so easy to verify vigi claim (aka he tells us his night hit and there are two deaths at night), and if he isn't the vigi, then the real vigi would just kill him.
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Nemesis is right... Why would you want to kill off a vigi? If it is true, he can at least prove his point. Which is why it makes me suspicious of Infinitestory and LSB, they're both trying to pin down on Ace really hard this game.
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United States4053 Posts
On February 24 2011 02:15 Nemesis wrote:
We shouldn't kill Ace until he at least gets the chance to use his ability. It is so easy to verify vigi claim (aka he tells us his night hit and there are two deaths at night), and if he isn't the vigi, then the real vigi would just kill him.
1) we can't assume there's a real vig
2) vig's ability isn't even usable until winter 1904... if Ace is mafia, given that he has 1 unit left and no chance of escaping LSB, it would be a pretty good deal to take 2 more years of life.
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alot of people claiming green townie
im also green townie
whoever else has claimed green townie may very well be mafia
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United States4053 Posts
On February 24 2011 09:04 Coagulation wrote:
alot of people claiming green townie
3 so far, I think?
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thats alot considering how many roles and how many players isnt it?
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United States4053 Posts
On February 24 2011 09:15 Coagulation wrote:
thats alot considering how many roles and how many players isnt it?
Somewhat. 1 of each blue role + 3 green townies = 9 town-aligned, which isn't impossible, and there doesn't necessarily need to be one of each blue role (although there could be more than one as well)
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United States4053 Posts
might as well compile this, since I realized I forgot who the third townie claim was
Claims:
Ace - vig
bumatlarge - medic
Nemesis - townie
infinitestory - townie
Coagulation - townie
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Alright, in order to save Ace from dying... He is a confirmed Vigi, which means, I am claiming as a DT. Anybody else that claims after me will be a mafia trying to counterclaim me and get me killed. This is why the mafia keep pushing ace in order to get him killed through this winter of 1903 especially now that they have they're own mafia DT. On other news, I'm pretty sure that BC is a mafia and that's why LSB and a few others are still not going against BC.
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As such, more inactivity please get your orders in!
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On February 24 2011 09:19 infinitestory wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 09:15 Coagulation wrote:
thats alot considering how many roles and how many players isnt it? Somewhat. 1 of each blue role + 3 green townies = 9 town-aligned, which isn't impossible, and there doesn't necessarily need to be one of each blue role (although there could be more than one as well)
Thing is, we only have 11 players. The picture wouldn't add up unless you are assuming we only have two Mafia.
Of course we don't know how exactly the roles are distributed, but if we take a conservative guess and assume that there are at least one of each role as listed, then there is only room for one duplicate role, and it would likely be Townie.
We already have three claiming Townie.
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On February 24 2011 10:46 ShoCkeyy wrote:
Alright, in order to save Ace from dying... He is a confirmed Vigi, which means, I am claiming as a DT. Anybody else that claims after me will be a mafia trying to counterclaim me and get me killed. This is why the mafia keep pushing ace in order to get him killed through this winter of 1903 especially now that they have they're own mafia DT. On other news, I'm pretty sure that BC is a mafia and that's why LSB and a few others are still not going against BC.
All right, if your DT, who did you check? Did you check BC?
On February 24 2011 08:04 ShoCkeyy wrote:
Nemesis is right... Why would you want to kill off a vigi? If it is true, he can at least prove his point. Which is why it makes me suspicious of Infinitestory and LSB, they're both trying to pin down on Ace really hard this game.
First of all, he's not a vig, look over Ace's posting. He's mafia.
Secondly, lets pretend that he might just be vig, the 1% chance. Who is he going to shoot 1904? Probably me. And I'm not going to trade my life to 'confirm' Ace.
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... did you not read my claim? I checked Ace first day... I just said he's a confirmed Vigi.
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How about we make sure he won't shoot you but rather some one else so we can prove he is Vigi... Either way, now that the mafia knows whos a vigi and DT, I would have to act faster than I possibly can. Hoping that there is a medic, I can get a save, and actually get the scum out faster than anything. And since there's no pms in this game, I have to post everything here... Also if you don't die, you're my next check LSB.
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Fair enough, I can outvote both of you if you two end up being the scum team. I won't claim then, just to see if you do end up being right. (well of course, the mafia theif could figure stuff out, but who knows, maybe we can lynch the theif tonight)
unvote: Ace
Who would you suggest moving the vote onto? I want to see actual analysis on BC if I'm going to switch onto him. I'm unconvinced by this "citizen died so BC must be mafia" reasoning.
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Well so far, BC is the most likely choice, seeing as there isn't a lot of activity.
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United States4053 Posts
##Unvote BC
A DT check outweighs any suspicions I have. Though I already explained why I'm not voting BC.
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United States4053 Posts
On February 24 2011 14:05 infinitestory wrote:
##Unvote BC
A DT check outweighs any suspicions I have. Though I already explained why I'm not voting BC.
ops
##Unvote Ace
is what i meant to do
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On February 24 2011 13:51 ShoCkeyy wrote:
Well so far, BC is the most likely choice, seeing as there isn't a lot of activity.
How am I the likely choice? I am the only one who has explained my troupe movements out of the people being aggressive early on. Instead we have people who have been pushing personal agenda's going unaccounted for?
Lack of activity doesn't mean go for the person who has justified their own actions, it would mean go for people who sit in the back pushing their own game while not answering for themselves. We have bum attempting to invade italy, nemesis and coag fighting. Neither of these fights have been clarified. How about before we start trying to start a bandwagon people start justifying their selves.
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Well, BC, have you commeneted on anything besides the game? Seems kindof lurkerish.
All right then, who's more scummy, bum, nemesis or yourself and why?
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On February 24 2011 14:21 LSB wrote:
Well, BC, have you commeneted on anything besides the game? Seems kindof lurkerish.
All right then, who's more scummy, bum, nemesis or yourself and why?
Honestly, I'd look to the people as I said, not justifying their actions. I have called out bum, beneather, nemesis and coagulation more than once now to at least justify why they have done what they have and gotten nothing.
Also what would you have me comment on besides the game? No one really is talking but you and every now and then we get a random post from someone else.
Factor in we have a bunch of people role claiming now and i start to facepalm?
Ace could very well be vigi as it is one of his preferred roles but the claim would also help save him since hes in a terrible situation atm. Shockeyy is already in an alliance with him since beginning of game and suddenly comes out to save him is also suspect. As much as I would love to believe them both its far too odd considering the circumstances.
The entire game is too inactive for me to get solid behavioural analysis as everyone is doing plays that although suspect are harder to read considering there are two games being played in one / literally no one is talking (yes im also to blame for this). If everyone would start posting normally as per a regular mafia game it would be far easier to keep things going, but so far that isn't happening.
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Which is the reason why i rolechecked ace first. I wanted to make sure i was allied with some one that is pro town. That justifies my reasoninh to rolecheck him first. Second i started the ally with him cause we were the first two countries with fleets, which apparently came out handy seeing that ace is a vigi.
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Bc just stop squirming. You're getting shot.
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On February 24 2011 15:59 Ace wrote:
Bc just stop squirming. You're getting shot.
Ace shoots BC 1904. We lynch Nemesis today?
First, he has unjustified aggression and started his own mini war up. + Show Spoiler +On February 13 2011 02:26 Nemesis wrote:
Well in that case, I'm going to be taking Ruh. Coag, go take something else. Attacks Ruh for no reason, and explains this as him 'expanding' On February 18 2011 13:13 Nemesis wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2011 12:43 Fishball wrote:On February 18 2011 10:35 LunarDestiny wrote:
France is drawing first blood. Incoming ragefest. Technically, although there is "no blood", Nemesis made the first move. How did I make the first move? All I did was expand. Coag I see that you are rather getting close to my land :X And proceeds to declare war On February 21 2011 10:08 Nemesis wrote:
Coag, this means war! D:
Anyone want to partner up with me on my quest on World Domination and killing those Nazis?
Secondly, he has been only parroting and hasn't taken a stance on who to lynch. + Show Spoiler +On February 15 2011 09:06 Nemesis wrote:
The divinek train wagon is leaving!
ALL ABOARD!
##vote divinek Jumps the Divinek bandwagon for no reason On February 18 2011 14:52 Nemesis wrote:
How does it help town more than it helps scum?
We can't really do anything with the information from mass role claiming until 1903 when our lynch comes in and 1904 when blue roles come in.
On the other hand, it helps mafia choose their blue target of choice.
There really is no reason why we shouldn't wait until after the first death, or if there is maybe you can explain it to me. Critisizes Ace's plan, but he is essentially just repeating my points On February 24 2011 02:15 Nemesis wrote:
We shouldn't kill Ace until he at least gets the chance to use his ability. It is so easy to verify vigi claim (aka he tells us his night hit and there are two deaths at night), and if he isn't the vigi, then the real vigi would just kill him. Notice that he doesn't take an actual position on Ace, he's just saying we delay what we do.
unvote
##Vote: Nemesis
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I'm not sure on Nemesis. Besides Coagulation should be looked at much harder than Nemesis for now.
Myself and Shockey should probably be on everyone's "almost surely confirmed Innocent" list by now with bumatlarge a close second.
LSB should be in "not sure but good chance of being Innocent" list. That's 4 players in an 11 player game that for now we should put on the likely cleared list.
Before citizen died I looked at BCs post and thought wtf is this? Then citizen died and imo BC still seems useless and scummy. I just don't believe any Pro-Town player not in danger of dying would miss out on a chance to comment on LSB possibly killing me with anything less than "LSB and Ace are fighting". Epic insight there.
I'm still not sold on IS. Especially with a townie claim
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oops I forgot to add bumatlarge. Give him the benefit of the doubt for now.
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On February 25 2011 03:55 Ace wrote:
I'm not sure on Nemesis. Besides Coagulation should be looked at much harder than Nemesis for now.
Yeah, the only reason why you don't like Coagulation is because he's fighting Nemesis. Remember, Coagulation wasn't the aggressor, Nemesis is.
As for IS, I'm feeling the only reason why you don't like IS is just OMGUS.
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I have no major issue with IS vote or Coagulation fighting Nemesis. More so that if you look at the 4 players as "innocent" and BC as Scum then Coagulation definitely stands out above Nemesis by the lack of useful activity in this game.
Nemesis at least seems to be helping out. I guess we'd have to look at his posts and determine if his help seems like it's fake if you think he's Scummier than Coagulation.
IS I just don't believe his claim.
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On February 25 2011 03:55 Ace wrote:I'm not sure on Nemesis. Besides Coagulation should be looked at much harder than Nemesis for now. Myself and Shockey should probably be on everyone's "almost surely confirmed Innocent" list by now with bumatlarge a close second. LSB should be in "not sure but good chance of being Innocent" list. That's 4 players in an 11 player game that for now we should put on the likely cleared list. Before citizen died I looked at BCs post and thought wtf is this? Then citizen died and imo BC still seems useless and scummy. I just don't believe any Pro-Town player not in danger of dying would miss out on a chance to comment on LSB possibly killing me with anything less than "LSB and Ace are fighting". Epic insight there. I'm still not sold on IS. Especially with a townie claim
lawl? I have posted more and attempted to get discussion going more than most players. Bored is a better example of my play at the moment. Citizen dying right after accusing me is one of the most retarded reasons someone could have to paint me as red and screams desperate way to link me. In regards to LSB and your situation? miss out? You started a war against eachother day 1 and the moment you get roflstomped you claim a role that would force town to keep you alive till 1904 at the minimum. This doesn't scream town play or mafia play, it screams "i'm ace and better than everyone so don't let me die".
You aren't surely confirmed innocent as your claim is super suspect. Shockey's claim coming from one of the more inactive players and a player in an alliance with you is also suspect. Is it likely he could be a dt, yes, but just as likely as you possibly being gf.
I am finally glad to see people discussing other options as well, it shows the game has potential to not keep being inactive and boring but seriously, if you want to make a case on me, actually make a case.
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The only thing you've said in that post that makes sense is that I am indeed better than everyone.
I hope you enjoy being 6 feet under.
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On February 25 2011 05:09 Ace wrote:
The only thing you've said in that post that makes sense is that I am indeed better than everyone.
I hope you enjoy being 6 feet under.
Considering I don't believe your claim, ill believe it when I see it.
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No one is better than the Russians.
No one.
*hic*
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which would mean you don't believe Shockkey's claim and by extension we'd both have to be lying or at least Shockkey would and you would bring up a case of at least one of us being Mafia.
Unfortunately for you - you didn't. See what I mean about you being useless? If you don't believe my claim then you'd have to push for Shockkey to be lynched because he would be the link that lies.
You didn't.
BANG BANG!
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On February 25 2011 05:13 Ace wrote:
which would mean you don't believe Shockkey's claim and by extension we'd both have to be lying or at least Shockkey would and you would bring up a case of at least one of us being Mafia.
Unfortunately for you - you didn't. See what I mean about you being useless? If you don't believe my claim then you'd have to push for Shockkey to be lynched because he would be the link that lies.
You didn't.
BANG BANG!
Or factor in you two are aligned from the get go and he believes your legit and lies? gasp he could be town as well.
This is more than just a simple game of mafia, people in pre arranged alliances such as yourself could have supporters from either side.
Hell, lets argue you are vig for a moment. In the current situation you are in you have so little voting power your sway within the town is pretty bad, ie without your roleclaim you were dead. Now factor in that at most because of your situation you would get off one shot. Why did you not instead recommend shooting someone (in this case me) and then get offed letting the apprentice pick up your role, and hiding town kp power from the mafia, hell you could even give them a list of recommended targets.
IF you fail shoot like your going to, you instead remove town voting power, and let it sit there to be claimed by only two people, 1 one of which you have already admitted you think lied.
Yet you aren't pushing to lynch them? Normally you push to lynch liars.
Do you seriously want me to start outlining all the situations in which your claim shouldn't be taken seriously? why shockeyy's shouldnt? Considering you straight out refused to explain situations to people earlier as it was a waste of your time, accusing people of not giving similar forms of information is hypocritical and lumps you in the same ship your placing me.
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*yawn*
For a busy guy you sure seem active when my gun is out of the holster.
BANG BANG BANG!
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On February 25 2011 05:26 Ace wrote:
*yawn*
For a busy guy you sure seem active when my gun is out of the holster.
BANG BANG BANG!
eh? did you fail to read my earlier post where I said bored? No activity and no one trying usually means I'm not going to. One game like PyP3 was enough to teach me its not worth the effort. Besides, now that someones talking to you your lack of activity as sparked as well, fancy that.
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did anyone here something?
no?
ok, cuz last I checked dead men don't speak.
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im green town like i have said all game. me and LSB have a kind of mutual unspoken agreement/understanding where we generally work together as town and leave each other alone (for the most part) when we are of separate alignments. (metagame ftw)
##Vote: Nemesis
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![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/hrnjf.jpg) Fall 1903
+ Show Spoiler [Spring 1903 Movement] +![[image loading]](http://imgur.com/cc12T.jpg) Austria: Vie-Tyr Austria: Bud H Austria : Tri S Bud Balkans: Ser H Balkans: Bul H Balkans: Gre-Alb France: Bre-MAO France: Par-Pic France: Spa-Por France: Spa H England: Edi-Lvp England: Lon H Germany: Hol-Bel Germany: Mun-Ruh Germany: Ber-Kie Italy: Apu-Ven Italy: TYS-Tun Lowlands: Bel-Hol Lowlands: Ruh S Bel-Hol Lowlands: Kie-Mun Norway: Dead Russia: War-Lvn Russia: Mos S Sev Russia: Sev H Spain: Por H Turkey: Smy-AEG Turkey: Con S Bul Turkey: Bul H Turkey: Ank H
It is now Fall 1903. You have until 8 PM EST on Friday to get your orders in.
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Vote Count for Winter 1903
citi.zen (Divinek) (3) (dead)
Ace
Fishball (3)
Divinek
Nemesis
Fishball (0)
Coagulation
citi.zen (Divinek)
Ace (0)
LSB
Coagulation
infinitestory
LSB (0)
Ace
ShoCkeyy
Coagulation (0)
Nemesis
BloodyC0bbler (6)
infinitestory
citi.zen (dead)
Ace (1)
ShoCkeyy (2)
Nemesis (3)
bumatlarge (2)
Beneather (2)
Nemesis (7)
LSB (4)
Coagulation (3)
Non Voters (10)
bumatlarge (3)
BloodyC0bbler (4)
infinitestory (3)
If there is a mistake please let me know.
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Beneather you are a very funny guy
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Assuming that he doesn't move out of tunisia
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the fact he took out doesn't bother me. The fact he took and still hasn't said much about it or any one else moving is weird.
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Coag, you should send this as your orders
A Hol-Ruh
A Mun S Hol-Ruh
A Ber - Kie
This will get you Ruh, and I don't believe there is any way to counter it. From there you can work on dislodging Nemesis from Kie more easily.
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United States4053 Posts
On February 25 2011 04:28 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +On February 25 2011 03:55 Ace wrote:
I'm not sure on Nemesis. Besides Coagulation should be looked at much harder than Nemesis for now. Yeah, the only reason why you don't like Coagulation is because he's fighting Nemesis. Remember, Coagulation wasn't the aggressor, Nemesis is. As for IS, I'm feeling the only reason why you don't like IS is just OMGUS.
What does OMGUS stand for?
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Basically, (Pretend I'm ace)
OMG Infinitestory voted for me! He must be scum! You suck!
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What is wrong with me taking Tunasia? It's like Ace will get there :D
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United States4053 Posts
ok Ace, any particular reasons you don't trust my townie claim?
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On February 25 2011 02:57 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 15:59 Ace wrote:
Bc just stop squirming. You're getting shot. Ace shoots BC 1904. We lynch Nemesis today?
First, he has unjustified aggression and started his own mini war up. + Show Spoiler +On February 13 2011 02:26 Nemesis wrote:
Well in that case, I'm going to be taking Ruh. Coag, go take something else. Attacks Ruh for no reason, and explains this as him 'expanding' On February 18 2011 13:13 Nemesis wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2011 12:43 Fishball wrote:On February 18 2011 10:35 LunarDestiny wrote:
France is drawing first blood. Incoming ragefest. Technically, although there is "no blood", Nemesis made the first move. How did I make the first move? All I did was expand. Coag I see that you are rather getting close to my land :X And proceeds to declare war On February 21 2011 10:08 Nemesis wrote:
Coag, this means war! D:
Anyone want to partner up with me on my quest on World Domination and killing those Nazis? Secondly, he has been only parroting and hasn't taken a stance on who to lynch. + Show Spoiler +On February 15 2011 09:06 Nemesis wrote:
The divinek train wagon is leaving!
ALL ABOARD!
##vote divinek Jumps the Divinek bandwagon for no reason On February 18 2011 14:52 Nemesis wrote:
How does it help town more than it helps scum?
We can't really do anything with the information from mass role claiming until 1903 when our lynch comes in and 1904 when blue roles come in.
On the other hand, it helps mafia choose their blue target of choice.
There really is no reason why we shouldn't wait until after the first death, or if there is maybe you can explain it to me. Critisizes Ace's plan, but he is essentially just repeating my points On February 24 2011 02:15 Nemesis wrote:
We shouldn't kill Ace until he at least gets the chance to use his ability. It is so easy to verify vigi claim (aka he tells us his night hit and there are two deaths at night), and if he isn't the vigi, then the real vigi would just kill him. Notice that he doesn't take an actual position on Ace, he's just saying we delay what we do.
##Vote: Nemesis
First of all, I didn't start the mini-war...coag was the first to declare war. All I did was take a neutral land near him.
On February 18 2011 13:59 Coagulation wrote:
THIS MEANS WAR NEMESIS
Did you intentionally missed this which was before my declaration of war?
For your second point, I thought that I made my stance pretty clear. I agree with ace's plan except for pre-1902 claim. The divinek bandwagon was obviously a joke, and my stance in who to lynch is maybe the person I have my vote on, which is BC?
You are not usually this bad at reading LSB, which makes me think that you may not be town this game.
Combine that with the fact that you just attacked ace and is planning to kill him with your next move before he has the chance to shoot, I think there is a good chance that you might be scum.
I'll keep my vote on BC for now though as I am more certain of him than you. I'll make my case against him soon.
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Also anyone want to ally with me, as it looks like mini-war is soon to be 2 on 1?
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On February 25 2011 10:40 Nemesis wrote:
First of all, I didn't start the mini-war...coag was the first to declare war. All I did was take a neutral land near him.
Munich is one of Coag's home Supply Centers -.-
Combine that with the fact that you just attacked ace and is planning to kill him with your next move before he has the chance to shoot, I think there is a good chance that you might be scum.
I have good reason for attacking ace. And I don't plan on killing him until after 1904 if he can't prove himself.
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On February 25 2011 10:40 Nemesis wrote:Show nested quote +On February 25 2011 02:57 LSB wrote:On February 24 2011 15:59 Ace wrote:
Bc just stop squirming. You're getting shot. Ace shoots BC 1904. We lynch Nemesis today?
First, he has unjustified aggression and started his own mini war up. + Show Spoiler +On February 13 2011 02:26 Nemesis wrote:
Well in that case, I'm going to be taking Ruh. Coag, go take something else. Attacks Ruh for no reason, and explains this as him 'expanding' On February 18 2011 13:13 Nemesis wrote:Show nested quote +On February 18 2011 12:43 Fishball wrote:On February 18 2011 10:35 LunarDestiny wrote:
France is drawing first blood. Incoming ragefest. Technically, although there is "no blood", Nemesis made the first move. How did I make the first move? All I did was expand. Coag I see that you are rather getting close to my land :X And proceeds to declare war On February 21 2011 10:08 Nemesis wrote:
Coag, this means war! D:
Anyone want to partner up with me on my quest on World Domination and killing those Nazis? Secondly, he has been only parroting and hasn't taken a stance on who to lynch. + Show Spoiler +On February 15 2011 09:06 Nemesis wrote:
The divinek train wagon is leaving!
ALL ABOARD!
##vote divinek Jumps the Divinek bandwagon for no reason On February 18 2011 14:52 Nemesis wrote:
How does it help town more than it helps scum?
We can't really do anything with the information from mass role claiming until 1903 when our lynch comes in and 1904 when blue roles come in.
On the other hand, it helps mafia choose their blue target of choice.
There really is no reason why we shouldn't wait until after the first death, or if there is maybe you can explain it to me. Critisizes Ace's plan, but he is essentially just repeating my points On February 24 2011 02:15 Nemesis wrote:
We shouldn't kill Ace until he at least gets the chance to use his ability. It is so easy to verify vigi claim (aka he tells us his night hit and there are two deaths at night), and if he isn't the vigi, then the real vigi would just kill him. Notice that he doesn't take an actual position on Ace, he's just saying we delay what we do.
##Vote: Nemesis First of all, I didn't start the mini-war...coag was the first to declare war. All I did was take a neutral land near him. Did you intentionally missed this which was before my declaration of war?
MY this means WAR Comment was in direct response you your aggressive actions.
either your lying or you dont understand what you did. regardless you brought any conflict that has been generated between us on to yourself.
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On February 15 2011 10:26 Fishball wrote:
Seems like Nemesis drew first blood on the Nazis.
DONT LET NEMESIS LIE HIS WAY OUT PRETENDING HES THE VICTIM.
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On February 25 2011 10:45 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +On February 25 2011 10:40 Nemesis wrote:
First of all, I didn't start the mini-war...coag was the first to declare war. All I did was take a neutral land near him. Munich is one of Coag's home Supply Centers -.- Show nested quote +Combine that with the fact that you just attacked ace and is planning to kill him with your next move before he has the chance to shoot, I think there is a good chance that you might be scum. I have good reason for attacking ace. And I don't plan on killing him until after 1904 if he can't prove himself.
ummm WTF, Munich was white when I took it.
How can he claim ownership of land that he doesn't own?:/
And coag went the other direction away from Munich, so I thought he didn't want it.
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And LSB, then why are you moving your fleet right next to portugal right now, you have plenty of time to do that later on?
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BloodyC0bbler
Let's take a look at his posts then, shall we?
On February 21 2011 17:32 BloodyC0bbler wrote:
Very little really that I can talk about atm.
People are randomly fighting and playing this more like diplo than mafia (although I am guilty of this as well).
I shall try to get more into this, but it will take serious discussion from more than ace to make this feel like anything other than diplo
IS I do apologize for taking Bul, but without it I am pretty well fucked if anyone decides to invade -_-
His first post after the game starts which was on Winter 1902. All this time we had been discussing about Ace's mass roleclaim idea, and he says there is "very little I can really talk about?"
He pretty much just made excuses in this post on why he doesn't want to take a position. That sounds to me like a scum afraind to slipup.
Now on to his next post:
On February 22 2011 15:45 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Since im now back at my machine I see that citizen is participating and has somehow managed to get others too as well, awesome. I guess we can get a real game out of this. As such I will post my thoughts. The entire situation with citizen taking charge is awesome. Serious props for joining later and keeping active, however stop your random finger pointing unless you start pointing some at yourself. You not only have FoS myself but you have also FoS Infinity. You tell us we shouldn't be playing this like a game of diplomacy yet attacked fishball without provocation to my knowledge rather than taking one of your own home sc's. Now I am just as guilty on that as I took Bul however I'm not trying to keep eyes elsewhere. Show nested quote +On February 22 2011 11:45 infinitestory wrote:On February 22 2011 10:55 citi.zen wrote:On February 22 2011 03:39 infinitestory wrote:
##Vote BC
Because the least you could have done is tell me to move aside. At least that way I would have had time to prepare a fleet on Gre. This post makes no sense. Yes you retreated but won a center overall. How would "moving aside" have helped at all? BC won two centers out of it. You and BC moved to the top of the shady list. Plus, BC has too many votes and no intention to help. ""Vote BloodyC0bbler"" imagine yourself in my shoes for a moment, please. I now have a unit on Rum, pretty much trapped, and I'm going to have to move it back to Ser so BC/someone else doesn't push it farther. In the end, in winter 1903 (when SC count really matters) I will most likely end up with fewer SCs. If BC just wanted access to Rum and told me so, we probably could have worked something out. I currently hold no intentions of moving farther north as I now have two potential exits if I am attacked. I have no real interest to be super aggressive this game as I have not been given a reason to be. If you don't like how the board is situated at the moment I am sorry but I think you can see where I was coming from. To get the ball rolling on this people really should start talking about this game. I am bad for it and if we can get the level of activity up that would be awesome. Now, ATM ace/lsb are doing an obvious sort of fight (started beginning of game). I have explained why I moved where I did, but we still need citizen to justify his move, need bum, coag, nemesis, and beneather to all explain why they are all fighting eachother as It makes no sense to me thus far. Do you think eachother is red? why are you all attacking eachothers home sc's without fully owning your own first? I get this is a mix of two games but so many assaults have happened with little to no provocation that I can get, as no one has vocalized it really in thread except for IS against me, and Ace against LSB. Can we get some reasoning please?
As citi.zen pointed out, this is pretty much a big post saying nothing to make it look like he's "contributing without contributing."
The rest of his post are him trying to justify his inactivity, and makes more long posts that doesn't say anything.
On February 24 2011 14:16 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 13:51 ShoCkeyy wrote:
Well so far, BC is the most likely choice, seeing as there isn't a lot of activity. How am I the likely choice? I am the only one who has explained my troupe movements out of the people being aggressive early on. Instead we have people who have been pushing personal agenda's going unaccounted for? Lack of activity doesn't mean go for the person who has justified their own actions, it would mean go for people who sit in the back pushing their own game while not answering for themselves. We have bum attempting to invade italy, nemesis and coag fighting. Neither of these fights have been clarified. How about before we start trying to start a bandwagon people start justifying their selves.
On February 24 2011 15:12 BloodyC0bbler wrote:Show nested quote +On February 24 2011 14:21 LSB wrote:
Well, BC, have you commeneted on anything besides the game? Seems kindof lurkerish.
All right then, who's more scummy, bum, nemesis or yourself and why? Honestly, I'd look to the people as I said, not justifying their actions. I have called out bum, beneather, nemesis and coagulation more than once now to at least justify why they have done what they have and gotten nothing. Also what would you have me comment on besides the game? No one really is talking but you and every now and then we get a random post from someone else. Factor in we have a bunch of people role claiming now and i start to facepalm? Ace could very well be vigi as it is one of his preferred roles but the claim would also help save him since hes in a terrible situation atm. Shockeyy is already in an alliance with him since beginning of game and suddenly comes out to save him is also suspect. As much as I would love to believe them both its far too odd considering the circumstances. The entire game is too inactive for me to get solid behavioural analysis as everyone is doing plays that although suspect are harder to read considering there are two games being played in one / literally no one is talking (yes im also to blame for this). If everyone would start posting normally as per a regular mafia game it would be far easier to keep things going, but so far that isn't happening.
Conclusion: BC is trying to stay away from the spotlight by not taking any stance, and trying to make it look like he's contributing by making big posts of fluff.
Contrast this with his town game where even though sometimes he is inactive, he tries and give people advice and steer town in the right direction.
BC is scum
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On February 25 2011 11:06 Nemesis wrote:Show nested quote +On February 25 2011 10:45 LSB wrote:On February 25 2011 10:40 Nemesis wrote:
First of all, I didn't start the mini-war...coag was the first to declare war. All I did was take a neutral land near him. Munich is one of Coag's home Supply Centers -.- Combine that with the fact that you just attacked ace and is planning to kill him with your next move before he has the chance to shoot, I think there is a good chance that you might be scum. I have good reason for attacking ace. And I don't plan on killing him until after 1904 if he can't prove himself. ummm WTF, Munich was white when I took it. How can he claim ownership of land that he doesn't own?:/ And coag went the other direction away from Munich, so I thought he didn't want it.
On February 05 2011 08:32 Incognito wrote:Mini Mafia VI: Diplomacy In this game, there are 11 countries: E - England (Home SCs: Lon, Edi, Lvp) F - France (Home SCs: Par, Bre, Mar) L - Lowlands (Home SCs: Hol, Bel, Ruh) G - Germany (Home SCs: Ber, Kie, Mun) N - Norway (Home SCs: Nor, Swe, Den) R - Russia (Home SCs: Mos, StP, Sev, War) A - Austria (Home SCs: Vie, Tri, Bud) B - Balkans (Home SCs: Ser, Bul, Rum, Gre) T - Turkey (Home SCs: Con, Ank, Smy) S - Spain (Home SCs: Spa, Por, Tun) I - Italy (Home SCs: Ven, Rom, Nap)
On February 25 2011 11:08 Nemesis wrote:
And LSB, then why are you moving your fleet right next to portugal right now, you have plenty of time to do that later on?
Why not?
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On February 25 2011 11:10 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +On February 25 2011 11:06 Nemesis wrote:On February 25 2011 10:45 LSB wrote:On February 25 2011 10:40 Nemesis wrote:
First of all, I didn't start the mini-war...coag was the first to declare war. All I did was take a neutral land near him. Munich is one of Coag's home Supply Centers -.- Combine that with the fact that you just attacked ace and is planning to kill him with your next move before he has the chance to shoot, I think there is a good chance that you might be scum. I have good reason for attacking ace. And I don't plan on killing him until after 1904 if he can't prove himself. ummm WTF, Munich was white when I took it. How can he claim ownership of land that he doesn't own?:/ And coag went the other direction away from Munich, so I thought he didn't want it. Show nested quote +On February 05 2011 08:32 Incognito wrote:Mini Mafia VI: Diplomacy In this game, there are 11 countries: E - England (Home SCs: Lon, Edi, Lvp) F - France (Home SCs: Par, Bre, Mar) L - Lowlands (Home SCs: Hol, Bel, Ruh) G - Germany (Home SCs: Ber, Kie, Mun) N - Norway (Home SCs: Nor, Swe, Den) R - Russia (Home SCs: Mos, StP, Sev, War) A - Austria (Home SCs: Vie, Tri, Bud) B - Balkans (Home SCs: Ser, Bul, Rum, Gre) T - Turkey (Home SCs: Con, Ank, Smy) S - Spain (Home SCs: Spa, Por, Tun) I - Italy (Home SCs: Ven, Rom, Nap) Show nested quote +On February 25 2011 11:08 Nemesis wrote:
And LSB, then why are you moving your fleet right next to portugal right now, you have plenty of time to do that later on? Why not?
I must have missed that then :X
On that note, you took Mar even before your suspicion on Ace which was based on his mass roleclaim plan?
Anyways, I'm off for now as I have midterms right now and I need to study. If anyone has anything they want me to respond to, I'll do it tomorrow.
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On February 25 2011 11:19 Nemesis wrote:Show nested quote +On February 25 2011 11:10 LSB wrote:On February 25 2011 11:06 Nemesis wrote:On February 25 2011 10:45 LSB wrote:On February 25 2011 10:40 Nemesis wrote:
First of all, I didn't start the mini-war...coag was the first to declare war. All I did was take a neutral land near him. Munich is one of Coag's home Supply Centers -.- Combine that with the fact that you just attacked ace and is planning to kill him with your next move before he has the chance to shoot, I think there is a good chance that you might be scum. I have good reason for attacking ace. And I don't plan on killing him until after 1904 if he can't prove himself. ummm WTF, Munich was white when I took it. How can he claim ownership of land that he doesn't own?:/ And coag went the other direction away from Munich, so I thought he didn't want it. On February 05 2011 08:32 Incognito wrote:Mini Mafia VI: Diplomacy In this game, there are 11 countries: E - England (Home SCs: Lon, Edi, Lvp) F - France (Home SCs: Par, Bre, Mar) L - Lowlands (Home SCs: Hol, Bel, Ruh) G - Germany (Home SCs: Ber, Kie, Mun) N - Norway (Home SCs: Nor, Swe, Den) R - Russia (Home SCs: Mos, StP, Sev, War) A - Austria (Home SCs: Vie, Tri, Bud) B - Balkans (Home SCs: Ser, Bul, Rum, Gre) T - Turkey (Home SCs: Con, Ank, Smy) S - Spain (Home SCs: Spa, Por, Tun) I - Italy (Home SCs: Ven, Rom, Nap) On February 25 2011 11:08 Nemesis wrote:
And LSB, then why are you moving your fleet right next to portugal right now, you have plenty of time to do that later on? Why not? I must have missed that then :X On that note, you took Mar even before your suspicion on Ace which was based on his mass roleclaim plan? Anyways, I'm off for now as I have midterms right now and I need to study. If anyone has anything they want me to respond to, I'll do it tomorrow.
Mar is part of france btw.
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now you finally realize that you are in fact the one that aggressively attacked me and started this conflict.
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United States4053 Posts
there seems to be a lack of knowledge of the contents of the OP
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Shockkey who are you investigating next night?
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United States4053 Posts
pretty sure he already said he's going to check LSB
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From the looks of things, LSB is cooperating with us, so I'm undecided at this moment. But LSB is still on the top of my head unless some one else comes up that looks way too suspicous.
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hmm, I'd say ignore LSB for now. Check out Beneather, IS or Coag.
Fishball can chill for another day since that seems to be all he's doing.
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United States4053 Posts
I'd say consider checking nemesis as well.
fishball's just enjoying his vodka
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feel free to check me so we can start putting pressure on the late townie claims.
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If LSB is thinking of killing ace off...
I'm going to be moving into Italy regardless of what beneath thinks. He can chill in Tun if that's what he's aiming for.
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United States4053 Posts
On February 25 2011 12:27 Coagulation wrote:
feel free to check me so we can start putting pressure on the late townie claims.
i'm pretty sure you were the last townie claim
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Makes sense for LSB to move to MAO though. If he doesn't believe my claim he can just attack from Spain and MAO. I'm gonna prove myself by shooting BC tonight anyway.
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United States4053 Posts
On February 25 2011 12:28 Ace wrote:
Makes sense for LSB to move to MAO though. If he doesn't believe my claim he can just attack from Spain and MAO. I'm gonna prove myself by shooting BC tonight anyway.
hold your horses, it's not 1904 yet
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god damn these years take forever
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On February 25 2011 12:28 infinitestory wrote:Show nested quote +On February 25 2011 12:27 Coagulation wrote:
feel free to check me so we can start putting pressure on the late townie claims. i'm pretty sure you were the last townie claim
nope..
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Game Over! Inactivity wins!
The following players have been modkilled for inactivity and failure to turn in orders:
BC
Beneather
Bumatlarge
Coagulation
ShoCkeyy
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You mean I win.
Me vrs, Ace and Infinestory, I vote off infinistory, and kill ace, and then I kill Fishball later.
Town wins!
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On February 26 2011 11:23 LSB wrote:
You mean I win.
Me vrs, Ace and Infinestory, I vote off infinistory, and kill ace, and then I kill Fishball later.
Town wins!
Erm ?????
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United States4053 Posts
this game looks rather over
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United States4053 Posts
also dont vote me off pls
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I actually thought the 48 hours cycles were too long, and people still fail to turn in their actions, even though they have been posting (somewhat)?
;/
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United States4053 Posts
On February 26 2011 12:07 Fishball wrote:
I actually thought the 48 hours cycles were too long, and people still fail to turn in their actions, even though they have been posting (somewhat)?
;/
I agree with this... I was really disappointed at the lack of activity.
Is the game officially over (i.e. we can start discussing roles and stuff openly)?
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O.O wait, I thought it was tomorrow that I was supposed to turn in the move orders D:
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Ohh, Fri 8pm EST... I'm dumb... Sorry about that
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Lol - can we have a role list? I'm still curious who the third red was.
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United States4053 Posts
im still curious who the first two were
man im bad at this
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On February 26 2011 13:07 citi.zen wrote:
Lol - can we have a role list? I'm still curious who the third red was.
I don't know who the blues were (other than that Ace was legitimately Vigi), but I know the red list.
BC, Fishball, LSB
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United States4053 Posts
wtfs i was only 1/3 in my suspects on night 2
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United States4053 Posts
so i guess the role list is:
Ace - vigi
Shockeyy - dt
bum - medic
coag - townie
nemesis - townie
me - townie
bc - red
fishball - red
lsb - red
beneather - ?
citi.zen - ?
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Shame it ended, we were schooling you guys, and would have won
Citi.zen was the coranor.
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BC and LSB I was pretty sure of. Fishball I picked on but he gave me nothing so he went right back into the "no idea" pile. Infi / coag seemed more likely reds, if anything.
At any rate, interesting concept, would try it again some day. Too bad for the inactivity.
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United States4053 Posts
On February 26 2011 13:26 LSB wrote:
Shame it ended, we were schooling you guys, and would have won
Citi.zen was the coranor.
I had a feeling you were red from the start, but I thought you were bussing ace -_- which had me really confused when citi.zen died and ace was confirmed Vig.
My suspect list at the end of 1903 was something like Nemesis / you / fishball, but voting off Nemesis would have gotten us owned.
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United States4053 Posts
oh btw godfather vote change power is way OP
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On February 26 2011 13:39 infinitestory wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2011 13:26 LSB wrote:
Shame it ended, we were schooling you guys, and would have won
Citi.zen was the coranor. I had a feeling you were red from the start, but I thought you were bussing ace -_- which had me really confused when citi.zen died and ace was confirmed Vig. My suspect list at the end of 1903 was something like Nemesis / you / fishball, but voting off Nemesis would have gotten us owned.
^_^
LSB I had a feeling was Scum but then I was like god damn everyone is inactive - I'd rather play as if LSB is semi-confirmed town and go from there. BC was obvious scum because of some post that pretty much answered nothing.
Couldn't decide on Fishball at all :/
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I seriously had to will to play this game, period. Or the last mini mafia game in which I was modkilled. With time as much of an issue for me these days combined with general lack of ability to put forth effort this is prob for the best. I seriously need a long break.
Sorry for adding to ruining your game incog.
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On February 26 2011 14:02 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2011 13:39 infinitestory wrote:On February 26 2011 13:26 LSB wrote:
Shame it ended, we were schooling you guys, and would have won
Citi.zen was the coranor. I had a feeling you were red from the start, but I thought you were bussing ace -_- which had me really confused when citi.zen died and ace was confirmed Vig. My suspect list at the end of 1903 was something like Nemesis / you / fishball, but voting off Nemesis would have gotten us owned. ^_^ LSB I had a feeling was Scum but then I was like god damn everyone is inactive - I'd rather play as if LSB is semi-confirmed town and go from there. BC was obvious scum because of some post that pretty much answered nothing. Couldn't decide on Fishball at all :/
LSB was one of the most blatant scum we've had in a long time. Ace roleclaims vigi, which is just about the most easily confirmed role ever, without being under serious pressure, and what does LSB do in response? Take Spain. Then he tries to lead a bandwagon to lynch Ace. When that fails, he makes a fleet so he can take out Portugal before the first time Ace can use his vigi hit. I couldn't understand how anybody could think a townie would do that.
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On February 26 2011 14:49 Qatol wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2011 14:02 Ace wrote:On February 26 2011 13:39 infinitestory wrote:On February 26 2011 13:26 LSB wrote:
Shame it ended, we were schooling you guys, and would have won
Citi.zen was the coranor. I had a feeling you were red from the start, but I thought you were bussing ace -_- which had me really confused when citi.zen died and ace was confirmed Vig. My suspect list at the end of 1903 was something like Nemesis / you / fishball, but voting off Nemesis would have gotten us owned. ^_^ LSB I had a feeling was Scum but then I was like god damn everyone is inactive - I'd rather play as if LSB is semi-confirmed town and go from there. BC was obvious scum because of some post that pretty much answered nothing. Couldn't decide on Fishball at all :/ LSB was one of the most blatant scum we've had in a long time. Ace roleclaims vigi, which is just about the most easily confirmed role ever, without being under serious pressure, and what does LSB do in response? Take Spain. Then he tries to lead a bandwagon to lynch Ace. When that fails, he makes a fleet so he can take out Portugal before the first time Ace can use his vigi hit. I couldn't understand how anybody could think a townie would do that.
Which is why I kept railing with have you ever played a game with no reveal!!!!?
Mass Claim was still the best bet to win imo. citizen was right when he said trying to "play diplomacy" and take out 3 scum was a very...ambitious plan ^_^
When LSB took Spain I was somewhat glad. If he offed me under the circumstances I was in (RC Vigi with a chance to shoot) I was hoping the town would just crack him and BC instantly.
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On February 26 2011 15:06 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2011 14:49 Qatol wrote:On February 26 2011 14:02 Ace wrote:On February 26 2011 13:39 infinitestory wrote:On February 26 2011 13:26 LSB wrote:
Shame it ended, we were schooling you guys, and would have won
Citi.zen was the coranor. I had a feeling you were red from the start, but I thought you were bussing ace -_- which had me really confused when citi.zen died and ace was confirmed Vig. My suspect list at the end of 1903 was something like Nemesis / you / fishball, but voting off Nemesis would have gotten us owned. ^_^ LSB I had a feeling was Scum but then I was like god damn everyone is inactive - I'd rather play as if LSB is semi-confirmed town and go from there. BC was obvious scum because of some post that pretty much answered nothing. Couldn't decide on Fishball at all :/ LSB was one of the most blatant scum we've had in a long time. Ace roleclaims vigi, which is just about the most easily confirmed role ever, without being under serious pressure, and what does LSB do in response? Take Spain. Then he tries to lead a bandwagon to lynch Ace. When that fails, he makes a fleet so he can take out Portugal before the first time Ace can use his vigi hit. I couldn't understand how anybody could think a townie would do that. Which is why I kept railing with have you ever played a game with no reveal!!!!?Mass Claim was still the best bet to win imo. citizen was right when he said trying to "play diplomacy" and take out 3 scum was a very...ambitious plan ^_^ When LSB took Spain I was somewhat glad. If he offed me under the circumstances I was in (RC Vigi with a chance to shoot) I was hoping the town would just crack him and BC instantly.
Indeed it was. A mass claim would have revealed that there were a LOT of blues. The mafia might have mitigated things a little by claiming apprentice (I don't remember if there was another unused blue role), but even then you just lynch people who claimed the latest to grab the mafia who waited until it didn't look like anyone else would claim that role before claiming it.
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I knew I could take spain without much opposition from the town considering how Ace was acting. He was just yelling "mass reveal" with no reasoning, so I fabricated a little battle and moved in.
An inactive town, and Nemesis attacking Coag did give me confidence I could pull it off without getting fingered by anyone but Ace, who I could ignore.
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On February 26 2011 15:12 LSB wrote:
I knew I could take spain without much opposition from the town considering how Ace was acting. He was just yelling "mass reveal" with no reasoning, so I fabricated a little battle and moved in.
An inactive town, and Nemesis attacking Coag did give me confidence I could pull it off without getting fingered by anyone but Ace, who I could ignore.
Yes, but there is no way the town should have let you. The difference between your attack and the Nemesis/Coag fight was Ace's roleclaim. Your attack after that claim should have immediately gotten you lynched.
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I had grand plans...
I proposed to BC to have citi.zen killed so I can take over all the SCs up north,+ Show Spoiler +On February 23 2011 07:24 Fishball wrote:Show nested quote +On February 23 2011 05:48 Beneather wrote:
Russia is going for total domination.:O! Fishball why did you want to kill citi.zen? Yes, I am obviously Mafia since he touched my tralala, therefore I decided to off him so I can take over the world.
It is not likely that Town will be able to vote off LSB or BC at the end of 1903. I have been keeping close watch. Ace will die before 1904 no matter what, and it is very likely that the rest of Town will not have majority of the votes anymore due to the amount of SCs we would have. Keep in mind another person would drop in 1904 too.
I actually planned for all 3 of us to come forward as Mafia and goad the rest of Town all the way to the end if we get to that point.
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On February 26 2011 16:45 Qatol wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2011 15:12 LSB wrote:
I knew I could take spain without much opposition from the town considering how Ace was acting. He was just yelling "mass reveal" with no reasoning, so I fabricated a little battle and moved in.
An inactive town, and Nemesis attacking Coag did give me confidence I could pull it off without getting fingered by anyone but Ace, who I could ignore. Yes, but there is no way the town should have let you. The difference between your attack and the Nemesis/Coag fight was Ace's roleclaim. Your attack after that claim should have immediately gotten you lynched.
Don't you like Townies that have doubts.
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Gah, I was rather inactive this game as I am a busy.
Well at least I was right on LSB/BC. Fishball seemed to have just flew by everyone's radar though.
And sorry coag, I rather messed up on reading the OP, and I also wanted to have a little fun by fighting with someone.
This is rather sad that town died even before the first lynch >.<
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On February 26 2011 15:12 LSB wrote:
I knew I could take spain without much opposition from the town considering how Ace was acting. He was just yelling "mass reveal" with no reasoning, so I fabricated a little battle and moved in.
An inactive town, and Nemesis attacking Coag did give me confidence I could pull it off without getting fingered by anyone but Ace, who I could ignore.
:/
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On February 26 2011 15:11 Qatol wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2011 15:06 Ace wrote:On February 26 2011 14:49 Qatol wrote:On February 26 2011 14:02 Ace wrote:On February 26 2011 13:39 infinitestory wrote:On February 26 2011 13:26 LSB wrote:
Shame it ended, we were schooling you guys, and would have won
Citi.zen was the coranor. I had a feeling you were red from the start, but I thought you were bussing ace -_- which had me really confused when citi.zen died and ace was confirmed Vig. My suspect list at the end of 1903 was something like Nemesis / you / fishball, but voting off Nemesis would have gotten us owned. ^_^ LSB I had a feeling was Scum but then I was like god damn everyone is inactive - I'd rather play as if LSB is semi-confirmed town and go from there. BC was obvious scum because of some post that pretty much answered nothing. Couldn't decide on Fishball at all :/ LSB was one of the most blatant scum we've had in a long time. Ace roleclaims vigi, which is just about the most easily confirmed role ever, without being under serious pressure, and what does LSB do in response? Take Spain. Then he tries to lead a bandwagon to lynch Ace. When that fails, he makes a fleet so he can take out Portugal before the first time Ace can use his vigi hit. I couldn't understand how anybody could think a townie would do that. Which is why I kept railing with have you ever played a game with no reveal!!!!?Mass Claim was still the best bet to win imo. citizen was right when he said trying to "play diplomacy" and take out 3 scum was a very...ambitious plan ^_^ When LSB took Spain I was somewhat glad. If he offed me under the circumstances I was in (RC Vigi with a chance to shoot) I was hoping the town would just crack him and BC instantly. Indeed it was. A mass claim would have revealed that there were a LOT of blues. The mafia might have mitigated things a little by claiming apprentice (I don't remember if there was another unused blue role), but even then you just lynch people who claimed the latest to grab the mafia who waited until it didn't look like anyone else would claim that role before claiming it.
The many blues helped the mafia in a weird way. Everyone was just trying to stay alive and use their power (plus play diplomacy), instead of doing regular analysis. It's also why many instinctively disliked Ace's plan, I would guess.
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people dont do my plans because they assume I'm always trying to trick them and dont read.
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I thought I sent all my actions in...
Well looking back I don't see a few posts I thought I had posted. I guess PMs didn't either? Ttat sucks.
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On February 26 2011 23:20 Ace wrote:
people dont do my plans because they assume I'm always trying to trick them and dont read.
Tbh I liked your plan! Because it gave us Bum as the medic, guaranteeing our next night hit, and it threw suspicion on Nemesis and Infinitestory.
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The Mafia didn't NEED that info though. It could pretty easily win @ diplomacy given their huge info advantage and option to kill other any player at night. If BC survived the lynch you already had it.
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On February 27 2011 03:48 citi.zen wrote:
The Mafia didn't NEED that info though. It could pretty easily win @ diplomacy given their huge info advantage and option to kill other any player at night. If BC survived the lynch you already had it.
word.
On February 27 2011 02:37 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2011 23:20 Ace wrote:
people dont do my plans because they assume I'm always trying to trick them and dont read.
Tbh I liked your plan! Because it gave us Bum as the medic, guaranteeing our next night hit, and it threw suspicion on Nemesis and Infinitestory.
Yea, but it also gives the town a chance to win. Doesn't change things too much for you as you already know who isn't Mafia, but for us it's crucial.
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Dunno about how big the advantage is.
The reason why I had that much voting power was because you made the mistake of assuming that I would have attacked you day 1.
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On February 27 2011 03:48 citi.zen wrote:
The Mafia didn't NEED that info though. It could pretty easily win @ diplomacy given their huge info advantage and option to kill other any player at night. If BC survived the lynch you already had it.
So do you think there were too many mafia in this game? Incognito and I tried to balance out having 3 mafia by including a lot of blues, but if there was really no margin for error on any lynch, I'm a bit worried about that if we try to do this again.
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Think about this in terms of total votes. Each time a townie takes a center from someone else the town vote total might go up or stay the same: if it's taken from another townie votes are merely transfered, not gained. For the mafia this is not a problem - all provinces won in diplo are net gains. Add to this the ability of a mafia player to ally a townie in diplo without a shred of evidence about their alignment and things get even worse: a townie might well help a red player take votes away from town! As an example:
On February 25 2011 06:17 Coagulation wrote:
im green town like i have said all game. me and LSB have a kind of mutual unspoken agreement/understanding where we generally work together as town and leave each other alone (for the most part) when we are of separate alignments. (metagame ftw)
##Vote: Nemesis
Edit: that was to LSB.
@ Qatol: yes, two mafia would have a more interesting task and migh need to choose between "domination" or "survival" victory. A town "12 province" win might also be happen.
Edit 2: before I forget, Ace's "diplomacy" mistake is important too. Mafia can discuss moves and obvious mistakes will be caught before they happen, but the chances that some townie makes a mistake is pretty high.
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On February 27 2011 04:38 LSB wrote:
Dunno about how big the advantage is.
The reason why I had that much voting power was because you made the mistake of assuming that I would have attacked you day 1.
no I didn't assume you would have attacked me Day 1. Show me where I acted out on that assumption.
On February 27 2011 04:46 Qatol wrote:Show nested quote +On February 27 2011 03:48 citi.zen wrote:
The Mafia didn't NEED that info though. It could pretty easily win @ diplomacy given their huge info advantage and option to kill other any player at night. If BC survived the lynch you already had it. So do you think there were too many mafia in this game? Incognito and I tried to balance out having 3 mafia by including a lot of blues, but if there was really no margin for error on any lynch, I'm a bit worried about that if we try to do this again.
Hard to say because too many mafia wasn't the issue here - lazy players were.
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I think it seemed a fair set-up. I think we had an equal chance, because BC was a high priority lynch target, and LSB would have had to kill off Ace to avoid an incoming vig hit to his face. That would have made an easy second lynch. In that time I think town would have a nice edge even without the coroner.
Im still a little confused on everyones role though, did we have an apprentice and a lawyer?
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On February 27 2011 06:08 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On February 27 2011 04:38 LSB wrote:
Dunno about how big the advantage is.
The reason why I had that much voting power was because you made the mistake of assuming that I would have attacked you day 1. no I didn't assume you would have attacked me Day 1. Show me where I acted out on that assumption.
So then why did you move into Spain Fall 1901?
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Because it's one of my SCs and it's the only one with a border to the rest of the map. Why wouldn't I move there?
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Mafia
LSB
Fishball
BC
DT
ShoCkeyy
Medic
Bumatlarge
Vigilante
Ace
Lawyer
Beneather
Coroner
citi.zen
Townies
Nemesis
Coagulation
Infinitestory
Although I'm disappointed that this setup didn't work out, a few performances were good. Props to citi.zen and Ace for putting in an effort, even though the game was eventually doomed. citi.zen's reads were spot on, and Ace's mass roleclaim strategy was an excellent way to get information out there. Really there is no reason to wait for people to start dying off in order to roleclaim.
A couple notes: Ace was obviously town the instant he roleclaimed vig. If you look at the context, the game is pretty much dead when Ace makes this claim. He doesn't claim off some pre-arranged plan, and he certainly doesn't claim in order to derail town discussion (there was no town discussion). Ace's claim was basically to try to get the game going. Why would mafia want the game to get going? If everyone's inactive, theres no reason to put yourself out like that. Ace was under no pressure whatsoever, so the only possible motive for him is that he is town trying to get town off in a good direction. Nevermind if you thought the plan was bad or not (it wasn't), but still, when a player pops their head up like that when there is no activity whatsoever, you should get an instant town read right there.
LSB was obviously mafia from the first year or so. Both his posts and movements on the board point to scum. In fact, his thread behavior almost exactly fits his TMMM 2 profile. His Spring 1901 attitude is somewhat aggressive, but not very indicative. However, once Fall 1901 comes around and Ace announces his roleclaim plan, LSB immediately opposes it...and fails to provide a superior alternative (his alternative is basically - play this game like normal! which, if you look at the inactivity in the game, clearly isn't going to get town anywhere). This is classic red LSB, criticizing plans without giving alternatives, and generally doing nothing positively productive for the town. Furthermore, the movements should make it even more clear that LSB is mafia. Because of Ace's 1901 mistake, 1902 LSB makes massively aggressive moves against A CLAIMED VIG with no counterclaim. Given the circumstances I outlined in the previous paragraph about how Ace is clearly town, this should be raising flags for everyone. As Qatol said, taking spain then trying to get Ace lynched is an extremely blatant anti-town play.
Off to balance issues, I don't think there was a huge balance problem here. Yes, mafia controlled 1/3 of the vote near the end of the lynch. But I think this was a product of A) lack of town organization, B) lack of accountability in everyones board moves, and C) general inactivity. Simply put, town did not have a plan. Everyone made moves without thinking about who was being aggressive, and why. Without accountability, mafia was able to gain many votes without being challenged AT ALL, which is a huge mistake. Once you let mafia get comfortable with lots of votes, town power decreases dramatically. The fighting between townies didn't help either, not to mention the multiple townies who didn't turn in valid orders/turned in suboptimal orders). Mafia played well and didn't make any significant order mistakes (except for maybe Fishball trying to take Moscow without potential support in 1902). Even the multiple blues this game weren't used properly. ShoCkeyy's role check on Ace was suboptimal, and should have been used to check one of the inactives, or one of BC/LSB. Only 3 people sent in Lawyer diaries, although only one did so before 1902. Lawyer never bothered to share the results (which would have let town know that the coroner was dead). Nobody talked about any of the mechanics such as Lawyer/GF/Thief and how they could be used, which could have benefited town immensely. So while I might change this setup if it is ever used again (doubtful), I don't think we can make any certian conclusions on balance, as town played a really suboptimal game (both on the board and in the thread). The only people who turned in optimal movement orders were mafia.
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Sorry incog hope to be more active the next time you run one. Thanks though
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On February 27 2011 06:25 Ace wrote:
Because it's one of my SCs and it's the only one with a border to the rest of the map. Why wouldn't I move there?
Because that gave up your control of portugal and would leave you with only 1 supply center come 1902, which guaranteed your death.
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As I like to say, there is a reason why I have never won a game as mafia!
This game would have been the first, but thankfully it got ended before I could claim victory.
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On February 27 2011 04:46 Qatol wrote:Show nested quote +On February 27 2011 03:48 citi.zen wrote:
The Mafia didn't NEED that info though. It could pretty easily win @ diplomacy given their huge info advantage and option to kill other any player at night. If BC survived the lynch you already had it. So do you think there were too many mafia in this game? Incognito and I tried to balance out having 3 mafia by including a lot of blues, but if there was really no margin for error on any lynch, I'm a bit worried about that if we try to do this again.
Balancing with 3 Mafia is fine. It's just that Town never got their shit together, and we just tried to exploit that to the max. If Town had missed their first lynch in this game, they would never be able to have majority of votes for second lynch and so on, which means they cannot win at that point anymore.
My first pick was Theif, which I got. Granted my insights and Incognito's are different, but I've talked to him on MSN a week or two ago that I foresee inactivity playing a huge part, especially in games like this. Based on that and along with additional information, going Mafia gives me a huge advantage. Also, I didn't have to deal with Town. It was a no-brainer for me.
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On February 27 2011 06:32 LSB wrote:Show nested quote +On February 27 2011 06:25 Ace wrote:
Because it's one of my SCs and it's the only one with a border to the rest of the map. Why wouldn't I move there? Because that gave up your control of portugal and would leave you with only 1 supply center come 1902, which guaranteed your death.
and yours ^_^
@Fishball: I told Incognito if I don't get Vigilante I want to be Scum.
Original Message From Incognito: Ah ok. So survival purposes sounds good. Show nested quote +Original Message From Ace: Well having 3 of us spread out in the corners allows us to evade being linked by army movements. Also having a Spain + Russia/Turkey, or Spain + England team is good for applying pressure to the middle of the map. Original Message From Incognito: Ah ok sounds fair, although it might be difficult for mafia to cooperate if they are all spread out on the corners. Original Message From Ace: well if I was Scum I was hoping that getting Spain, my allies got any of the other corner countries. Something like Spain-England-Turkey, or Russia if we got lucky. That way our entire plan would hinge around just staying alive long enough to break the town and not push any lynches unless it was a guaranteed Town screw up. If we control the corner countries it would have been A.) difficult to stop a 2 on 1 attack and B.) difficult to be invaded. The worst case would have been getting any of the middle countries or neighboring countries. If 2 Mafia players (who are supposed to be town and have no communication) start building away from each other going after their other neighbors that should raise eyebrows if anyone is paying attention. But oh well time to Scum hunt ^_^ Original Message From Incognito: You did request vigilante, right? And just for curiosity, what is this plan? Original Message From Ace: ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo fucking hell v_v Guess I have to play for real and put my Scum plan on hold. Original Message From Incognito: Welcome to Mini Mafia VI: Diplomacy! Your role is: VigilanteYour nation is: Spain PM Incognito if you have any questions about your role.
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On February 27 2011 07:11 Ace wrote:Show nested quote +On February 27 2011 06:32 LSB wrote:On February 27 2011 06:25 Ace wrote:
Because it's one of my SCs and it's the only one with a border to the rest of the map. Why wouldn't I move there? Because that gave up your control of portugal and would leave you with only 1 supply center come 1902, which guaranteed your death. and yours ^_^ @Fishball: I told Incognito if I don't get Vigilante I want to be Scum. Show nested quote +Original Message From Incognito: Ah ok. So survival purposes sounds good. Original Message From Ace: Well having 3 of us spread out in the corners allows us to evade being linked by army movements. Also having a Spain + Russia/Turkey, or Spain + England team is good for applying pressure to the middle of the map. Original Message From Incognito: Ah ok sounds fair, although it might be difficult for mafia to cooperate if they are all spread out on the corners. Original Message From Ace: well if I was Scum I was hoping that getting Spain, my allies got any of the other corner countries. Something like Spain-England-Turkey, or Russia if we got lucky. That way our entire plan would hinge around just staying alive long enough to break the town and not push any lynches unless it was a guaranteed Town screw up. If we control the corner countries it would have been A.) difficult to stop a 2 on 1 attack and B.) difficult to be invaded. The worst case would have been getting any of the middle countries or neighboring countries. If 2 Mafia players (who are supposed to be town and have no communication) start building away from each other going after their other neighbors that should raise eyebrows if anyone is paying attention. But oh well time to Scum hunt ^_^ Original Message From Incognito: You did request vigilante, right? And just for curiosity, what is this plan? Original Message From Ace: ooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo fucking hell v_v Guess I have to play for real and put my Scum plan on hold. Original Message From Incognito: Welcome to Mini Mafia VI: Diplomacy! Your role is: VigilanteYour nation is: Spain PM Incognito if you have any questions about your role.
Seems like we have similar vision.
Funny thing though is that I "randomed" my country. I told Incognito that I had no preference since I didn't have time to go through everything at the start of the game. I was quite surprised that I got Russia.
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EPT![[image loading]](http://www.math.buffalo.edu/~sww/0history/mckinley-assassination2.jpg)
