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youngminii
Australia7514 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:20 Artanis[Xp] wrote: This is a question too hypothetical to answer as it would require me to confirm or deny roles and give too much information away. Translation: Aeres is scum and he's making up the role. By answering this question, I would be confirming the existence of the fake role and as such, I can't give a real answer. Maybe. | ||
infinitestory
United States4053 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:08 DoctorHelvetica wrote: A scum role that avoids lynches permanently is broken since we'd have to rely on using a single vigi hit to win the game, presumably. And don't assume a bus driver couldn't switch lynchees in this game. This is Insane Mafia and we need to throw our previous conclusions about how roles should work out the window. At least to some degree. Although my top 2 when I told the town who I was going to lynch was SiN and THEN youngminii, I changed my mind after SiN's martyring post. Perhaps a busdriver switched SiN and young, trying to save SiN only to have the opposite effect? It seems plausible enough but I'm not sure there is any real way to know and having YM role claim is just going to paint a new big target for the mafia forcing our medics to spread even thinner. @InfiniteStory There are many roles that could be twisted to do this that are fairly standard/used in mafia games. Roles like the hider, commuter, bus driver, etc. If a lynch-swapping bus driver exists, I'm convinced that would be town, since otherwise we would be almost unable to lynch a mafia (a red lynch-swapping bus driver would always switch the lynch to a townie unless our top two in votes are reds every single time). However, like I said earlier, that bus driver would have to be certain youngminii is valuable and by extension probably know his alignment. That would indicate either they're both mason-like roles (unlikely, since the bus driver is already a bus driver), or they're both reds. But I've already noted that a red lynch-swapping bus driver would be ridiculously OP. Contradiction. Therefore, I'm convinced youngminii's role saved him, making him a likely blue. | ||
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deconduo
Ireland4122 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:21 infinitestory wrote: I don't know whether Artanis would give us such a blatant lie, i.e. about the number of bodyguards. If you are, as you claim, a bodyguard, then I think that makes DCXLVI highly suspicious. Agreed. Even though this is insane mafia, if we can't believe what the mod says then we might as well give up now. This means that either Aeres is lying or DC isn't a bodyguard and instead is something else that can interact with the mayor. Keep in mind that even if Aeres is lying it doesn't necessarily mean he is scum. | ||
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Archas
United States6531 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:21 infinitestory wrote: I don't know whether Artanis would give us such a blatant lie, i.e. about the number of bodyguards. If you are, as you claim, a bodyguard, then I think that makes DCXLVI highly suspicious. As has been stated before (and most likely again later), this is INSANE Mafia. We have no idea what Artanis and LSB are capable of throwing at us. I hope that DC actually isn't a Bodyguard as he implied. If he wasn't, that means there's still a hidden Bodyguard out there, and I can stall for time while the Mafia searches for the hidden one. In that period, we can coalesce into a more organized town and start trying to get at the Mafia. | ||
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Veldril
Thailand1817 Posts
Young's case could be either ways; he has a role that immune to lynch (more likely one time, since permanent immunity is slightly too OP), or he has someone protected him with or without him knowing. We need to get more information before we can conclude which is the case. Right now, I think it is agreeable that medic should protect veterans first. However; from what I see from Sinquity's role, I think most medics would also be able to cure Murrayitis, which could be a decisive factor in this game. But since we don't have any infected player yet, the curing of Murrayitis is moot for the time being, but it should be discussed more on the next night. I want to ask you guys something too. Would it be a good idea to analyze the Murrayitis's mechanics and how it would affect the game in the long run? I think I find it's interesting but I'm not sure if other players agree or not. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
So why don't we start with the things that we DO know (feel free to add to the list): 1. Dr.H as been elected our Mayor. 2. Dr.H can't be killed while his bodyguards are still alive. 3. Youngminii somehow avoided the Mayor's lynch, and SiNiquity was killed instead. 4. There are 3 players remaining in Fishball's circle, including Fishball. 5. One of the modkills was a Mafia who was in the circle. 6. There appears to be a role that has a second vote, which shows up as an Elder vote. 7. An anonymous Mafia's vote did not count because of a booger-flinger, what this implies, I have no idea. | ||
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:22 youngminii wrote: Translation: Aeres is scum and he's making up the role. By answering this question, I would be confirming the existence of the fake role and as such, I can't give a real answer. Maybe. I just talked to him about it on MSN. In the words of Artanis "If the definition of the night action is only that he can't be targetted by night actions, then nothing in that includes not being able to protect the mayor." Can you confirm this Artanis? | ||
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Artanis[Xp]
Netherlands12968 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:26 DoctorHelvetica wrote: I just talked to him about it on MSN. In the words of Artanis "If the definition of the night action is only that he can't be targetted by night actions, then nothing in that includes not being able to protect the mayor." Can you confirm this Artanis? Yes. If the player would not be able to protect the bodyguard with such a role, this would be added into the description sent to the bodyguard. | ||
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infinitestory
United States4053 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:24 Aeres wrote: As has been stated before (and most likely again later), this is INSANE Mafia. We have no idea what Artanis and LSB are capable of throwing at us. I hope that DC actually isn't a Bodyguard as he implied. If he wasn't, that means there's still a hidden Bodyguard out there, and I can stall for time while the Mafia searches for the hidden one. In that period, we can coalesce into a more organized town and start trying to get at the Mafia. Either that, or you're actually the only bodyguard, and DC was just trying to shaft us >_______> Just because it's INSANE mafia still doesn't mean Artanis is allowed to lie to us on such an important topic, IMO. Then we would literally be fighting the mafia and the gods. | ||
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:23 infinitestory wrote: If a lynch-swapping bus driver exists, I'm convinced that would be town, since otherwise we would be almost unable to lynch a mafia (a red lynch-swapping bus driver would always switch the lynch to a townie unless our top two in votes are reds every single time). However, like I said earlier, that bus driver would have to be certain youngminii is valuable and by extension probably know his alignment. That would indicate either they're both mason-like roles (unlikely, since the bus driver is already a bus driver), or they're both reds. But I've already noted that a red lynch-swapping bus driver would be ridiculously OP. Contradiction. Therefore, I'm convinced youngminii's role saved him, making him a likely blue. I looked around mafia scum roles related to lynches. What jumped out at me was the role "Unlynchable" which merely survives the first lynch. This can be either a town or mafia role, although it seems it's typically a pro-town role. Not saying that's YM's role, but this is not enough to confirm his as town by any means. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:24 Aeres wrote: As has been stated before (and most likely again later), this is INSANE Mafia. We have no idea what Artanis and LSB are capable of throwing at us. I hope that DC actually isn't a Bodyguard as he implied. If he wasn't, that means there's still a hidden Bodyguard out there, and I can stall for time while the Mafia searches for the hidden one. In that period, we can coalesce into a more organized town and start trying to get at the Mafia. When you got the PM saying you're a bodyguard, did it tell you that there are two bodyguards? Or do you just think that DC is the other one? | ||
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youngminii
Australia7514 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:24 Aeres wrote: I hope that DC actually isn't a Bodyguard as he implied. If he wasn't, that means there's still a hidden Bodyguard out there, and I can stall for time while the Mafia searches for the hidden one. In that period, we can coalesce into a more organized town and start trying to get at the Mafia. Why are you so sure there are 2 bodyguards? Wasn't your logic behind the 1 bodyguard theory based on the assumption that DCX is a bodyguard? I want to ask you guys something too. Would it be a good idea to analyze the Murrayitis's mechanics and how it would affect the game in the long run? I think I find it's interesting but I'm not sure if other players agree or not. I don't see why not. | ||
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:24 Veldril wrote: From what I see of the first day lynch; I think for this game, the top three votes will be taken into account. It is very likely that there is a role that would prevent the "top" voted player to avoid the lynch, be it one time or can use all the game long. Young's case could be either ways; he has a role that immune to lynch (more likely one time, since permanent immunity is slightly too OP), or he has someone protected him with or without him knowing. We need to get more information before we can conclude which is the case. Right now, I think it is agreeable that medic should protect veterans first. However; from what I see from Sinquity's role, I think most medics would also be able to cure Murrayitis, which could be a decisive factor in this game. But since we don't have any infected player yet, the curing of Murrayitis is moot for the time being, but it should be discussed more on the next night. I want to ask you guys something too. Would it be a good idea to analyze the Murrayitis's mechanics and how it would affect the game in the long run? I think I find it's interesting but I'm not sure if other players agree or not. Murrayitis, for now, is something we have to be very aware of but it's also something thats effects will become much more significant as the game wears on. Our main priority is scumhunting. | ||
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infinitestory
United States4053 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:24 Veldril wrote: From what I see of the first day lynch; I think for this game, the top three votes will be taken into account. It is very likely that there is a role that would prevent the "top" voted player to avoid the lynch, be it one time or can use all the game long. Young's case could be either ways; he has a role that immune to lynch (more likely one time, since permanent immunity is slightly too OP), or he has someone protected him with or without him knowing. We need to get more information before we can conclude which is the case. Right now, I think it is agreeable that medic should protect veterans first. However; from what I see from Sinquity's role, I think most medics would also be able to cure Murrayitis, which could be a decisive factor in this game. But since we don't have any infected player yet, the curing of Murrayitis is moot for the time being, but it should be discussed more on the next night. I want to ask you guys something too. Would it be a good idea to analyze the Murrayitis's mechanics and how it would affect the game in the long run? I think I find it's interesting but I'm not sure if other players agree or not. I just ran a simulation on it. Assuming Plague Doctors RNG unless they are directed to cure someone by DrH, Murrayitis will kill on day 6 or 7 on average. I also considered what would happen if Plague Doctors RNG only (and ignore DrH), and it seems that it's stunningly close to the first scenario (still kills around day 6 or 7 on average). | ||
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Pandain
United States12989 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:17 youngminii wrote: He didn't PM me, he seems to be using "why aren't you PMing others" as an argument. Sorry Pandain, you're not an idiot, your arguments are. So you're assuming that I can PM people and your argument is that I should be roleclaiming through PMs? And please, tell me how letting me die is a good thing? Back up your arguments. In any case, your posts have been hugely scummy to me, but then again they always are. I've never been in a mafia game where you've given solid arguments as a townie. Reread my posts. I was saying perhaps we should include you into a pming circle. As for you dying, I'm actually considering whether it would be better than someone else. Because most likely maifa will go after either the active townies, veterans, or the people who have already claimed valuable roles. You are not a Vet(albeit good), you are not exactly active, and you do not have a "valuable role" except in one scenario I'm thinking of in which it's like the thor rush+scvs, in that you can't be killed if we constantly protect you. However, that would still mean town numbers would have to be greater than mafia. As for the lynch role being town, I'm considering it as of now. But keep in mind we don't even know if that's what he has, he's told us nothing. That's what I'm especially cautious of. As for Aeres, that's great news. Just one question, did artanis tell you there were two, or are you assuming there are because dxcvii basically claimed as one. | ||
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Archas
United States6531 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:28 jcarlsoniv wrote: When you got the PM saying you're a bodyguard, did it tell you that there are two bodyguards? Or do you just think that DC is the other one? Bodyguards are not told who the other Bodyguards are. I do not know for sure if DC is a Bodyguard... it is possible that he is not. My suspicion is that he is, though. On November 01 2010 04:28 youngminii wrote: Yeah but that's just saying "IF there's a role like the one Aeres is claiming then it would be so" Why are you so sure there are 2 bodyguards? Wasn't your logic behind the 1 bodyguard theory based on the assumption that DCX is a bodyguard? I don't see why not. I'm only going on what I received in the PM. As of now, I am operating under the assumption that there are 2 Bodyguards. Unless someone brings up evidence to the contrary, (i.e. DC's role being revealed) I will keep that claim. Perhaps I am being deceived here, but I honestly cannot say. | ||
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Archas
United States6531 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:34 Pandain wrote: As for Aeres, that's great news. Just one question, did artanis tell you there were two, or are you assuming there are because dxcvii basically claimed as one. I was not told that there was another Bodyguard, but as you said, DXCVII (why was I calling him DC?) basically claimed as one. | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
On November 01 2010 04:35 Aeres wrote: Bodyguards are not told who the other Bodyguards are. I do not know for sure if DC is a Bodyguard... it is possible that he is not. My suspicion is that he is, though. I'm only going on what I received in the PM. As of now, I am operating under the assumption that there are 2 Bodyguards. Unless someone brings up evidence to the contrary, (i.e. DC's role being revealed) I will keep that claim. Perhaps I am being deceived here, but I honestly cannot say. I know you aren't told who the other bodyguard is, but were you told that another one exists? What reason do you have to operate under the assumption of two bodyguards? | ||
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jcarlsoniv
United States27922 Posts
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DoctorHelvetica
United States15034 Posts
He certainly needs to clarify some things to us | ||
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