EPTSamsung win the 2017 World Championship! - Page 56
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Join the LiquidLegends 2017 Worlds Pick'em Group! Ban bets!! Ban bets will continue for the duration of Worlds. You can place bet at any phase of Worlds; on individual games, series, whatever your heart desires. Bans will be enacted the day after Worlds ends, to ensure everyone can still post on LL while Worlds is ongoing. glhf~ - Winners in bold - better, better's win condition, bettee [ban duration for loser] - Yorbon, EDG fails to make it out of groups, vs DarkCore [1 week] - Sleight, Fnatic doesn't make it out of groups, vs AlterKot [2:1 weeks] - Apex, Gigabyte getting out of groups as a 1st place seed + TSM will finish 1st in their groups + Samsung will fail to qualify from their group + C9 will get out of their groups, vs JimmiC [1 week] - geript, Korean teams will win a combined 17 or more games in Groups, vs Gahlo [1 month] - geript, NA teams will win a combined 7 or less games in Groups, vs Torchise [1 month] - zer0das, SKT doesn't win Worlds, vs no one [1 year] - Zato-1, NA teams combined wins will be greater than or equal to EU teams combined wins, vs Yorbon [1 month] | ||
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Ansibled
United Kingdom9872 Posts
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AlterKot
Poland7525 Posts
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Sent.
Poland9198 Posts
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
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ruypture
United States367 Posts
It's hard because Hauntzer, Bjerg, and Double are obviously skilled players, even Biofrost has great potential. I'm not sure about Sven because he always does so poorly, but he clearly isn't the only issue TSM has either. | ||
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Sleight
2471 Posts
![[image loading]](https://overclock3d.net/gfx/articles/2015/09/29054653760l.jpg) Alright, I feel like I have shitposted TSM enough until C9 make it out of groups. | ||
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chipmonklord17
United States11944 Posts
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NpG)Explosive
France994 Posts
On October 15 2017 00:41 ruypture wrote: but HOW could they go 0-3 They didn't, they beat misfits the first time today. | ||
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lilwisper
United States2515 Posts
On October 15 2017 01:58 Sleight wrote: Alright, I feel like I have shitposted TSM enough until C9 make it out of groups. They deserve the shit post. Before it was all about brackets and not getting the chance. This was beyond the easiest group by far and you didn't convert it. Worse you got shitstomped by the 0-5 team (yes FW is still FW but still). | ||
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chipmonklord17
United States11944 Posts
On October 15 2017 03:15 lilwisper wrote: They deserve the shit post. Before it was all about brackets and not getting the chance. This was beyond the easiest group by far and you didn't convert it. Worse you got shitstomped by the 0-5 team (yes FW is still FW but still). Don't forget that after fucking demolishing Misfits off the back of Biofrost's Rakan they just didn't bother to give it back to him in their pivotal match versus FW. They just didn't deserve to make it through. | ||
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geript
10024 Posts
1. VS WE TSM stupidly overvalued a Jarvan take away; he's A- tier imo but people are drafting him like he's S tier. TSM then picked themselves into 3 losing lanes even after it being obvious that WE was playing to smash towers early. The third pick Caitlyn should've been a redlight and interested TSM in grabbing a Mid 3rd pick and banning out mids. They give up lulu, but can grab either Karma or Taric; the latter of which would've really helped stabilize for mid-game fights. On top of it, TSM just tried to passively scale and lost their towers with nothing in exchange. 2. VS Misfits Misfits outdrafted themselves; they allowed TSM to squeeze them for Rakan. Misfits drafted a Jarvan too early to try and punish the obvious incoming hypercarry pick. Misfits Ryze pick helped to allow TSM to do what they obviously want to do which is play slow, scale and then out team fight. 3. Vs FW TSM undervalued both Janna and Trist. Lulu is strong, but when choice of hypercarries are available on both sides it doesn't really matter. Janna just offers far more protection. TSM walked into an easy Trundle and were lucky that FW switched to Renekton. They gave up having any meaningful lane except top as well as a double ADC comp for FW. They made the top jng start obvious and then didn't spend any time to protect an obvious need to protect top giving up an easy first blood. Basically the who time TSM is incapable of adapting. They can only play for late and try to absorb pressure and win at 35+ minutes. Drafts were never analyzed for how they should adjust play. Sven was never in the right place. Even a crappy player like me knows where he should be and why. That's a problem. It's dumb. | ||
GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
I would love to see a graph of: Week 1 Pick/Ban, NA vs World Week 2 Pick/Ban, NA vs World Incidentally it is almost comical how royally Flash Wolves fucked TSM. First they throw a massive lead against MSF, then with nothing to play for, they get their only win of the tournament against TSM. If either of those outcomes are reversed, TSM advances without a tiebreaker. | ||
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dsyxelic
United States1417 Posts
its just sad now lol | ||
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Kinie
United States3106 Posts
On October 15 2017 04:43 GrandInquisitor wrote: It's not just a TSM problem adapting. It is NA in general who struggles to adapt between week 1 and week 2. It is the same thing I said more than a year ago at 2016 worlds. I would love to see a graph of: Week 1 Pick/Ban, NA vs World Week 2 Pick/Ban, NA vs World Incidentally it is almost comical how royally Flash Wolves fucked TSM. First they throw a massive lead against MSF, then with nothing to play for, they get their only win of the tournament against TSM. If either of those outcomes are reversed, TSM advances without a tiebreaker. To me, the only NA team that seems to adapt from week 1 to week 2 is C9, which is probably why they scrape by into Quarterfinals every time and then get kicked out by a Korean team in the Quarters. C9 - in my eyes - is the only NA org that seems to recognize that any major tournament they get into will have a fluxuating meta and have just enough experience and raw talent that they can shift their strategies in the draft to make themselves competitive in most of the games they played. The only time you can't say that about C9 was... I think Worlds 2015, when they went 3-0 first week then 0-4 second week, because they only had one viable strategy for week 1, got found out, and then got it banned away in week 2 and they couldn't adapt in time because Hai was still on the team and couldn't contribute effectively. But they had a stat pop up where NA was something like 3 - 21 in second week of Worlds, and this was prior to TSM's one win, so now that record is like 4 - 23. That shows some SERIOUS issues amongst all the NA teams in how they manage themselves and don't adapt from week 1 to week 2. But TSM has always been slow at changing up their shit when the meta changes or a new patch hits and new champs become powerful, which has bitten them in the ass before both on the international and local level. | ||
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geript
10024 Posts
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GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On October 15 2017 05:14 geript wrote: 4-23 somehow doesn't surprise me. I don't think it's just failure to adapt to the meta of the group/tournament. I think it's failure to adapt within a draft (for example TSM not recognizing/responding to the Caitlyn pick vs WE) and a failure to adapt within game. It's like NA goes into a game with a specific plan and are going to draft and play towards that regardless of what your opponent is doing. But that doesn't explain the week 1 - week 2 disparity, because why would they only fail to adapt within drafts in week 2 but adapt perfectly well in week 1? | ||
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Sleight
2471 Posts
On October 15 2017 05:29 GrandInquisitor wrote: But that doesn't explain the week 1 - week 2 disparity, because why would they only fail to adapt within drafts in week 2 but adapt perfectly well in week 1? It isn't adapting. It is sheer prep. The Worlds metagame doesn't exist until week 1. Week 1 defines the metagame. Then you have to innovate within that on week 2. In a practice bubble, NA does well with identifying whats strong. Then they fail to adapt to attack the strongest components of the meta. | ||
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Sent.
Poland9198 Posts
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Scip
Czech Republic11293 Posts
On October 15 2017 04:45 dsyxelic wrote: its gotten to a point where NA being bad has lost its humor its just sad now lol Then why am I still laughing at all the TSMtards crying their salty tears | ||
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lilwisper
United States2515 Posts
On October 15 2017 05:34 Sleight wrote: It isn't adapting. It is sheer prep. The Worlds metagame doesn't exist until week 1. Week 1 defines the metagame. Then you have to innovate within that on week 2. In a practice bubble, NA does well with identifying whats strong. Then they fail to adapt to attack the strongest components of the meta. I have a question that might be a bit silly, but does worlds meta really change that much? Usually it's what ever was popular in the patch that worlds is played on plus ori/corki/ryze(sometimes). | ||
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