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Ok, this one may not be simple, but maybe someone can boil it down for me, what’s the basic idea to play Thresh?
Some examples of basic ideas:
With Morgana: Early game catch people with Q, shield ADC with E, poke when prudent. Late game wreck people with AP. Always ward.
With Jana: Stand near ADC so they benefit from Auras. Shield when they are about to attack or about to get hit. Tornado to peel for adc or if someone is standing still when you’re sieging a turret. Use your speed to run around and ward.
With Thresh I must not really know what to do. I don’t “feel” like I’m playing badly, but I seem to always lose and that’s a sign. I’ve tried reading various guides, but they haven’t really explained what my “plan” should be or how it should feel when I’m playing him correctly.
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On February 25 2015 03:22 General_Winter wrote:
Ok, this one may not be simple, but maybe someone can boil it down for me, what’s the basic idea to play Thresh?
Some examples of basic ideas:
With Morgana: Early game catch people with Q, shield ADC with E, poke when prudent. Late game wreck people with AP. Always ward.
With Jana: Stand near ADC so they benefit from Auras. Shield when they are about to attack or about to get hit. Tornado to peel for adc or if someone is standing still when you’re sieging a turret. Use your speed to run around and ward.
With Thresh I must not really know what to do. I don’t “feel” like I’m playing badly, but I seem to always lose and that’s a sign. I’ve tried reading various guides, but they haven’t really explained what my “plan” should be or how it should feel when I’m playing him correctly.
In lane I play kind of similar to morgana, Q is your bind. You hit it and quickly trade some damage and back off. When someone is low enough you go in on a chain and finish them. If you manage a lead you run at them and E, follow up with Q and just kill them. You support ganks with the same combo super strongly, so waiting for those is nice too. If you're with a jinx or someone with really good hook followup you can go in on nearly any hook.
In teamfight you just output CC, mostly peel. Save an interrupt for Katarinas etc, then just stand near your carries and hook whoever goes for them and isn't in a position to dodge. Then clean up. People can't dodge hook in chaotic fights, and landed hooks reduce CD, so you pick you targets well and you have stupid chain CC. In fights I find its best to drop ult early right in the middle of the fight as a zone control tool. If you know they will need to move from one area to another just ult right in the middle. It lasts a long time and then your carries can use it to kite people through etc.
Past midgame your role is also to roam the map and find picks. Find someone out of position, run at them, E-Q and lantern a teammate in and clean them up.
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Bard... Broken as fuck? His kit look really really powerful.
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Kits are never broken. All that matters are the numbers.
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On February 26 2015 18:30 GolemMadness wrote:
Kits are never broken. All that matters are the numbers.
Passive: Enemy team cannot buy wards or trinkets
Q: Teleport your whole team anywhere on the map
W: Switch your team to red/blue side
E: Reveal enemy team
R: Turn into a dragon
HA
but yes bard could be quite bad. If his Q is hard enough to hit and not enough damage that his roam isn't scary, but he is forced to roam to power up his passive and leave his ad 1v2. His E is cool but its possible that its not actually that much of a huge advantage, the transport speed is quite slow so the enemy gets a long warning, as an escape in many situations its much worse than a simple jump. His ult has huge potential to fuck up and actually net benefit the other team. He could be straight up bad.
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My initial thought process, assume I'm the terrible player that I am, is thus:
Q--Surprisingly strong in the 2v2 in the absence of a lane swap.
W--Sustain is nice but overall very meh
E--More as a thread to sneak Dragon/Baron or a way to crack into the base more easily
R--Zoning for objective control
The meep thing, idk, it could be good or bad. I think on release he'll probably be pretty weak but I think he'll get upgraded early on.
He seems more designed as IDK a mid-laner who roams a bunch or as a support who specializes on roaming. The real problem I think is that once you pick him you're essentially locked into requiring safe laners (Morg top, Cait adc) who ideally have some form of CC themselves.
I'm guessing some Koreans/Chinese players and teams will be able to utilize him well because of how powerful he really seems overall, but it'll be interesting how he ends up panning out. He seems really really strong for teamfighting, but I'm not sure I can think of a realistic team comp that could really abuse his kit.
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On February 26 2015 18:30 GolemMadness wrote:
Kits are never broken. All that matters are the numbers.
Thresh says hi.
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On March 03 2015 08:39 3threes3 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2015 18:30 GolemMadness wrote:
Kits are never broken. All that matters are the numbers. Thresh says hi.
stop it. Thresh can absolutely be nerfed or buffed based on his numbers, this is a dumb meme. Don't forget damage is a number, so is range and cooldown.
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On March 03 2015 08:39 3threes3 wrote:Show nested quote +On February 26 2015 18:30 GolemMadness wrote:
Kits are never broken. All that matters are the numbers. Thresh says hi.
Doesn't have a win rate over 50% in solo queue, LPL, OGN, NA LCS or EU LCS. Pretty broken.
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On March 03 2015 09:12 sob3k wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2015 08:39 3threes3 wrote:On February 26 2015 18:30 GolemMadness wrote:
Kits are never broken. All that matters are the numbers. Thresh says hi. stop it. Thresh can absolutely be nerfed or buffed based on his numbers, this is a dumb meme. Don't forget damage is a number, so is range and cooldown.
Reread what he said. "Numbers are broken, not kits".
What will always be broken about Thresh is his utility, which has nothing to do with numbers. The fact that you are talking about range when "with numbers" is mentioned is hilarious, because range nerfs are KIT NERFS. It changes how the ability works. A number nerf doesn't change how the ability works at all.
The fact that you both are suggesting that kits can't be overpowered is actually really funny. I guess you blame the power creep phenomenon on "numbers". Bard's problem are clearly going to be "numbers". Since you can actually make his E CD go to 100 minutes, it could be solved by "numbers", right?
What an ignorant reply. And you still have the guts to reply with that "stop it" attitude. Who do you think you are to tell me to stop and when have you heard ME say anything ever? Entitled prick. Take your time to study about what "numbers" mean in this context and, if the best thing you can come up to reply is "but you can nerf the range", just don't bother.
Anything that changes the way the abilities work, even if it can be expressed by number, is a nerf regarding the kit, not the power of said kit. When you nerf Thresh utility, you are nerfing his kit. Nerfing Thresh by numbers would be making his Q and E do no damage. Which, of course, would make him unplayable, but that doesn't change the fact that his kit, by itself, it's overpowered.
And for the other reply, not even going to bother if you are trying to prove something with winratios, honestly, since I'm not saying that Thresh is overpowered, which is something that apparently has been misunderstood or explained poorly by me.
User was warned for this post
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thresh hook, box, and flay now do no damage
is his kit still broken?
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On March 03 2015 09:43 3threes3 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2015 09:12 sob3k wrote:On March 03 2015 08:39 3threes3 wrote:On February 26 2015 18:30 GolemMadness wrote:
Kits are never broken. All that matters are the numbers. Thresh says hi. stop it. Thresh can absolutely be nerfed or buffed based on his numbers, this is a dumb meme. Don't forget damage is a number, so is range and cooldown. When you nerf Thresh utility, you are nerfing his kit. Nerfing Thresh by numbers would be making his Q and E do no damage. Which, of course, would make him unplayable, but that doesn't change the fact that his kit, by itself, it's overpowered.
How can something be unplayable and overpowered at the same time?
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On March 03 2015 09:43 3threes3 wrote:Show nested quote +On March 03 2015 09:12 sob3k wrote:On March 03 2015 08:39 3threes3 wrote:On February 26 2015 18:30 GolemMadness wrote:
Kits are never broken. All that matters are the numbers. Thresh says hi. stop it. Thresh can absolutely be nerfed or buffed based on his numbers, this is a dumb meme. Don't forget damage is a number, so is range and cooldown. Reread what he said. "Numbers are broken, not kits". What will always be broken about Thresh is his utility, which has nothing to do with numbers. The fact that you are talking about range when "with numbers" is mentioned is hilarious, because range nerfs are KIT NERFS. It changes how the ability works. A number nerf doesn't change how the ability works at all. The fact that you both are suggesting that kits can't be overpowered is actually really funny. I guess you blame the power creep phenomenon on "numbers". Bard's problem are clearly going to be "numbers". Since you can actually make his E CD go to 100 minutes, it could be solved by "numbers", right? What an ignorant reply. And you still have the guts to reply with that "stop it" attitude. Who do you think you are to tell me to stop and when have you heard ME say anything ever? Entitled prick. Take your time to study about what "numbers" mean in this context and, if the best thing you can come up to reply is "but you can nerf the range", just don't bother. Anything that changes the way the abilities work, even if it can be expressed by number, is a nerf regarding the kit, not the power of said kit. When you nerf Thresh utility, you are nerfing his kit. Nerfing Thresh by numbers would be making his Q and E do no damage. Which, of course, would make him unplayable, but that doesn't change the fact that his kit, by itself, it's overpowered. And for the other reply, not even going to bother if you are trying to prove something with winratios, honestly, since I'm not saying that Thresh is overpowered, which is something that apparently has been misunderstood or explained poorly by me.
So he's not overpowered, but he's broken...? What does that even mean? Thresh used to be the top support in the game. Then his numbers got nerfed. Now he's balanced. The nerfs were to the damage of all of his abilities, less base health, less base armour, higher cooldowns, higher delay on his ult, less attack range, less time to collect souls, etc.
If you're going to say that nerfing the numbers of his kit isn't a nerf to his numbers but instead a nerf to his kit, then ok, but I don't think most would agree, and that's just pointless semantics.
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Hi all, I'm d3 atm playing in a team for my uni. I'd like someone good at analyzing replays to help me watch some of our games and identify how we can improve early dragon fights (the first 2-3 drags). My team can generally identify mistakes we make in laning + lategame fights but we tend to lose/fall behind in a lot in early dragon fights and have little idea why we're losing them, so we'd like some help with that. PM (or reply) if u can help, thx!
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Guys
How do I deal with Nasus? Not as in what champs counter him, since i know Olaf, Teemo, etc do quite well vs him.
Im not talking about particular champion counters, rather, I want to know what the general playstyle vs him is. Basically you have to try and make sure his Q stack isn't so big right? So, am I right by saying you have to constantly push lane? That way he will lose CS to turret and even more Q stacks gone to turret.
So, is that the best way to counter him? I of course tried to zone him etc, but he just keeps coming back with teleport, with good defensive stats depending what he is vs ing (frozen heart vs AD or visage vs AP).
So my plan now is just to push push and push, and roaming mid/bot. Is this ok?
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You will want to roam at some point. If you lose early, roam early, win early, roam after tower is down. You want to either force him to stay in lane and farm while you roam or have him join teamfights and be weak. If you roam and don't get any results though it's probably game unless you got someone else on your team who can overpower him.
Long story short make laning phase end as soon as possible :p
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On March 06 2015 21:06 sDgotto wrote:
Guys
How do I deal with Nasus? Not as in what champs counter him, since i know Olaf, Teemo, etc do quite well vs him.
Im not talking about particular champion counters, rather, I want to know what the general playstyle vs him is. Basically you have to try and make sure his Q stack isn't so big right? So, am I right by saying you have to constantly push lane? That way he will lose CS to turret and even more Q stacks gone to turret.
So, is that the best way to counter him? I of course tried to zone him etc, but he just keeps coming back with teleport, with good defensive stats depending what he is vs ing (frozen heart vs AD or visage vs AP).
So my plan now is just to push push and push, and roaming mid/bot. Is this ok?
You don't really want to push him to turret. He can actually farm quite well under turret and is very dangerous to dive with wither and ult. Very early game it is harder for him to CS under turret, but after a few levels of Q he will have no issues if he is good. Roaming is good, ideally you wouldn't push the lane, but keep it as far out as you can while harassing him and zoning him away from the creeps so he can't lifesteal back up. If he is far up in a lane he dies to ganks very easily with no escape. If you get ahead you should be able to allin him and get him low enough to zone pretty well. You can try allining, baiting wither out, jumping out, waiting for it to expire then going in again. Roaming is good but you have to get something out of it. pressure early dragons too if he wastes tp getting back into lane. He is pretty bad in early dragonfights.
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Ok, I'll bite. Why are people picking Viktor mid with Hecarim top in competitive play? I don't understand why these two champs synergize.
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Why doesn't Vayne build Tri Force? She seems like she would like everything on it except for the AP.
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EPT
