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On August 20 2015 04:22 joshie0808 wrote:Show nested quote +On August 20 2015 04:17 Sholip wrote:
I see that having some time restriction is inevitable, but if the games are decided by more XP gathered, it would only be fair to at least display your XP in-game somewhere. That way you could have an idea if you are in a winning position should the timer expire soon. That raises some problems though: -You would also need to see your opponent's XP in order in order for that number to mean anything. -This would invalidate certain strategies (hidden bases) when you see your 3 base XP score rising at the same rate as their perceived 2 base economy. -The emphasis might then transition to winning by XP rather than winning "legitimately". Builds would be developed to maximize XP by the 25 minute mark, rather than winning the game, which is not the focus. I think using XP as the determining factor is kind of like in boxing/MMA, victory by decision. But as a fighter you want to win by KO... Perhaps this might not be the best analogy but yeah.
I don't think you should be able to see your opponent's XP, though, just as you don't see their tech, units, etc.
But you could memorize how much XP you generally have at certain points in your games and compare that to your actual XP at any time. For example you know that you usually have 100,000 at 20:00 and you usually win with it. If you see that it's soon 20:00 and you only have 80,000, you will have to start thinking about doing something soon, else you risk loosing by XP.
I think this could be valuable information for you, and it would come as less of a surprise at the end of the game that, bamm, you lost (or won, for that matter).
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On August 20 2015 04:42 Sholip wrote:Show nested quote +On August 20 2015 04:22 joshie0808 wrote:On August 20 2015 04:17 Sholip wrote:
I see that having some time restriction is inevitable, but if the games are decided by more XP gathered, it would only be fair to at least display your XP in-game somewhere. That way you could have an idea if you are in a winning position should the timer expire soon. That raises some problems though: -You would also need to see your opponent's XP in order in order for that number to mean anything. -This would invalidate certain strategies (hidden bases) when you see your 3 base XP score rising at the same rate as their perceived 2 base economy. -The emphasis might then transition to winning by XP rather than winning "legitimately". Builds would be developed to maximize XP by the 25 minute mark, rather than winning the game, which is not the focus. I think using XP as the determining factor is kind of like in boxing/MMA, victory by decision. But as a fighter you want to win by KO... Perhaps this might not be the best analogy but yeah. I don't think you should be able to see your opponent's XP, though, just as you don't see their tech, units, etc. But you could memorize how much XP you generally have at certain points in your games and compare that to your actual XP at any time. For example you know that you usually have 100,000 at 20:00 and you usually win with it. If you see that it's soon 20:00 and you only have 80,000, you will have to start thinking about doing something soon, else you risk loosing by XP. I think this could be valuable information for you, and it would come as less of a surprise at the end of the game that, bamm, you lost (or won, for that matter).
Why do you have to know your XP? You also don't know your opponent's unit count and still have to make predictions on his play.
Getting a feel for your XP would plainly be another question of, well, experience. Not sure if worth training just for those tournaments though.
The question is of course if XP are balanced, which I think they are not 100% (I think Zerg has an advantage), but I don't know and I think the margin is small and the scenarios in which this will actually come down to a plain "race advantage" are rare.
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Funny given that this has been in WC3 since FOREVER 
But better late than never...
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On August 20 2015 04:50 KaiserJohan wrote:Funny given that this has been in WC3 since FOREVER But better late than never...
Exactly this.
I wonder why Blizzard didnt make them in the first place ..
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On August 20 2015 05:02 OnlineLoser wrote:Show nested quote +On August 20 2015 04:50 KaiserJohan wrote:Funny given that this has been in WC3 since FOREVER But better late than never... Exactly this. I wonder why Blizzard didnt make them in the first place ..
They didn't so they could add it later.
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Each match in a tournament is currently limited to 25 minutes. This would equate roughly to a 35-minute game in Heart of the Swarm due to the game-clock changes in Legacy of the Void. If the game reaches the 25-minute limit, victory will be awarded to the player who has the highest experience point value. Experience is accrued throughout the game by earning money, constructing units, destroying units, etc.
Really dislike this. I can see so many people getting a loss for games they were going to win. Hope they find a better solution than exp points..
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When will it be in the game? I can't click tournaments yet 
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On August 20 2015 05:12 hitpoint wrote:Show nested quote +Each match in a tournament is currently limited to 25 minutes. This would equate roughly to a 35-minute game in Heart of the Swarm due to the game-clock changes in Legacy of the Void. If the game reaches the 25-minute limit, victory will be awarded to the player who has the highest experience point value. Experience is accrued throughout the game by earning money, constructing units, destroying units, etc. Really dislike this. I can see so many people getting a loss for games they were going to win. Hope they find a better solution than exp points..
It seems like this would be a rare issue, 35m is quite long anyway.
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On August 20 2015 05:12 hitpoint wrote:Show nested quote +Each match in a tournament is currently limited to 25 minutes. This would equate roughly to a 35-minute game in Heart of the Swarm due to the game-clock changes in Legacy of the Void. If the game reaches the 25-minute limit, victory will be awarded to the player who has the highest experience point value. Experience is accrued throughout the game by earning money, constructing units, destroying units, etc. Really dislike this. I can see so many people getting a loss for games they were going to win. Hope they find a better solution than exp points..
Do you pay attention to scores? How often are you up in points and lose? I know people will always figure out a way to work the system, but the reality is for the most part, the person who is going to win has the most points. And if you notice someone is trying to just turtle up and win then you can do the same thing and at that point it almost becomes a coin toss.
The time limit is needed. I don't want to enter a tournament and then have to wait an hour to play the next game because two players are sitting around doing nothing, or even worse both just leave for some reason. I'm sure when they picked the time limit they had data to look at the average length of a game which is probably in the 10-20 minute range and then added a few minutes to that so essentially only a higher sliver of games will end up in a draw anyway. I can say so far playing Beta with all the new units and ways to make things happen having games go longer than 25 minutes isn't very common.
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On August 20 2015 05:12 hitpoint wrote:Show nested quote +Each match in a tournament is currently limited to 25 minutes. This would equate roughly to a 35-minute game in Heart of the Swarm due to the game-clock changes in Legacy of the Void. If the game reaches the 25-minute limit, victory will be awarded to the player who has the highest experience point value. Experience is accrued throughout the game by earning money, constructing units, destroying units, etc. Really dislike this. I can see so many people getting a loss for games they were going to win. Hope they find a better solution than exp points..
I would think (hope) that having an advantage is also reflected in XP. Either more resources mined or spent or more units killed... That said, I don't even know how XP is calculated, and as far as I know it is not entirely public, either. If your XP is not displayed in-game, it would be nice to at least know how it is calculated.
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If you host custom games on the LotV beta you can set a time limit. It shows you who has more XP when the time limit is getting close. So anyone theory-crafting if this will give people injust wins can test it out and see how well it works.
On August 20 2015 04:31 Garemie wrote:Show nested quote +On August 20 2015 03:47 WrathSCII wrote:
Looks cool!
Is it me or the UI looks little different in the last 2 pictures? (Bottom Right) Looks like a little TV. Wonder if that means spectator options.....oh I dream big.
Pretty sure just the Menu button re-skinned. Same three buttons that are there in HotS, just re-skinned.
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OMG I always thought that all the hype about this Automated Tournaments thing was about doing tournaments with your friends, not random people... I'm so out of the LotV loop!
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Hmmmm three things spring to mind.
First: WC3! This was one of the coolest features and I can't believe it's taken this long for them to implement this.
Second: GM streamers. These will be SO fun to watch GM streams play through.
Third: they better do a DAMN good job at getting hackers the fuck out of this game now that the tournaments are back on Bnet.
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On August 20 2015 05:17 FLuE wrote:Show nested quote +On August 20 2015 05:12 hitpoint wrote:Each match in a tournament is currently limited to 25 minutes. This would equate roughly to a 35-minute game in Heart of the Swarm due to the game-clock changes in Legacy of the Void. If the game reaches the 25-minute limit, victory will be awarded to the player who has the highest experience point value. Experience is accrued throughout the game by earning money, constructing units, destroying units, etc. Really dislike this. I can see so many people getting a loss for games they were going to win. Hope they find a better solution than exp points.. Do you pay attention to scores? How often are you up in points and lose? I know people will always figure out a way to work the system, but the reality is for the most part, the person who is going to win has the most points. And if you notice someone is trying to just turtle up and win then you can do the same thing and at that point it almost becomes a coin toss. The time limit is needed. I don't want to enter a tournament and then have to wait an hour to play the next game because two players are sitting around doing nothing, or even worse both just leave for some reason. I'm sure when they picked the time limit they had data to look at the average length of a game which is probably in the 10-20 minute range and then added a few minutes to that so essentially only a higher sliver of games will end up in a draw anyway. I can say so far playing Beta with all the new units and ways to make things happen having games go longer than 25 minutes isn't very common.
I don't know how the WC3 system worked but I don't remember having to wait too long. Granted, that was over 12 or 13 years ago.
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On August 20 2015 05:12 hitpoint wrote:Show nested quote +Each match in a tournament is currently limited to 25 minutes. This would equate roughly to a 35-minute game in Heart of the Swarm due to the game-clock changes in Legacy of the Void. If the game reaches the 25-minute limit, victory will be awarded to the player who has the highest experience point value. Experience is accrued throughout the game by earning money, constructing units, destroying units, etc. Really dislike this. I can see so many people getting a loss for games they were going to win. Hope they find a better solution than exp points..
What would be your recommended solution to guys laming it out?
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Finally the technology we thought was lost in 2004, has finally been re and reverse engineered.
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Drawing from other competitions that are time/points based (boxing/mma) I don't see a problem with the 25 (real) minute cap and games being decided on experience points. It just becomes another thing to factor into your strategy.
Overall super excited about this!
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I wonder what they'll do to allow these to be obs/streamed?...
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all this amazing stuff in LotV for a lousy stinkin' $40... WoW
pun intended.
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EPT
