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Thanks to Reddit sleuths, everyone can try the LotV test maps by following instructions here. Note: This is not a beta key, it is simply access to Vs. AI and a Unit Tester. I have no idea how cool with this Blizzard is or is not, use at your own risk. | ||
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y0su
Finland7871 Posts
On March 31 2015 17:17 Pandemona wrote: Beta will more than likely be available at around midday Murica time which will be like 6pm EU and tomorrow for Korea and onwards. i guess i'll be going to football practice today after all (instead of watching streams) | ||
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Shield
Bulgaria4824 Posts
On March 31 2015 16:25 digmouse wrote: Stalker is far from a boring unit. It is one of the better unit designs out of SC2. Nice joke. Except that anti-air unit is weak against mutalisks. | ||
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Everlong
Czech Republic1973 Posts
On March 31 2015 17:26 darkness wrote: Nice joke. Except that anti-air unit is weak against mutalisks. No, it's just not a hard-counter, thus it's not something we all hate here and it is actually well designed, basic unit, with strategic and interesting ability. | ||
Liquid`Jinro
Sweden33719 Posts
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LoneYoShi
France1348 Posts
On March 31 2015 17:28 Everlong wrote: No, it's just not a hard-counter, thus it's not something we all hate here and it is actually well designed, basic unit, with strategic and interesting ability. I'm with digmouse and Everlong on this. Stalkers are actually one of the few protoss units that I don't have anything against. | ||
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Foxxan
Sweden3427 Posts
On March 31 2015 17:28 Everlong wrote: No, it's just not a hard-counter, thus it's not something we all hate here and it is actually well designed, basic unit, with strategic and interesting ability. Stalker is a rly boring unit. The blink is a one-sided-micro fest. No micro vs micro with the stalker involved. I actually liked the dragoon from broodwar alot more since it had pretty good interactions but no special abilities. Why put a blink on a unit like this. I seriously dont understand it. Maybe its not the blinks fault tho, hard to say. Without blink it would get better stats i get and therefore it might play vs marauders better etc. Marauders slow are another thing that isnt good for gameplay imo. | ||
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Leviance
Germany4079 Posts
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Phaenoman
568 Posts
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Shield
Bulgaria4824 Posts
On March 31 2015 17:28 Everlong wrote: No, it's just not a hard-counter, thus it's not something we all hate here and it is actually well designed, basic unit, with strategic and interesting ability. And that is why Blizzard needs to either make stalkers better against mutalisks or let adept counter mutalisks. If mutalisks get out of hand, nothing but phoenixes stop them. Protoss is supposed to have at least one ground unit which can do the job. It used to be called dragoon. What is it going to be for LotV? | ||
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ETisME
12276 Posts
The difference between top pro and lower skilled one is huge. parting and hero make so much value over stalkers and it is impressive to watch. | ||
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Hider
Denmark9342 Posts
Why put a blink on a unit like this. I seriously dont understand it. Would make a ton more sense to have it on a meele unit since meele units without abilites often become microless. When you put it on a ranged it, it's just much more likely to result in snowbally scenarios. Stalker is an amazing unit. The difference between top pro and lower skilled one is huge. parting and hero make so much value over stalkers and it is impressive to watch. Put Blink on any unit, and it will create a very high skillcap. But that doesn't imply that all units w/ Blink create equally good blink. There is a reason why many considers Stalkers weak, and that's a result of a gamedesign where it's core stats just cannot be buffed any further. | ||
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Shield
Bulgaria4824 Posts
On March 31 2015 17:42 ETisME wrote: Stalker is an amazing unit. The difference between top pro and lower skilled one is huge. parting and hero make so much value over stalkers and it is impressive to watch. Firstly, we're not parting or hero. And it's unrealistic for Blizzard to expect it that way. Even with micro, I'm sure that 30 stalkers are hardly a challenge for their mutalisks equivalent, e.g. 30. I'm ok even if stalkers have to be supported with something like storm, but no noob zerg will get hit with storm more than once or twice. Why are you so stubborn to acknowledge that stalkers are terrible vs mutalisks? Are you really happy to have phoenixes (and then waiting for fleet beacon) to counter mutalisks? That is ok, but timing is sometimes important. If you have a good core ground unit from gateways, you can always mass it faster. | ||
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Everlong
Czech Republic1973 Posts
On March 31 2015 17:37 darkness wrote: And that is why Blizzard needs to either make stalkers better against mutalisks or let adept counter mutalisks. If mutalisks get out of hand, nothing but phoenixes stop them. Protoss is supposed to have at least one ground unit which can do the job. It used to be called dragoon. What is it going to be for LotV? Stalkers do the job fairly well. If it happens that Mutalisks get out of hand, it is only reasonable to come up with appropriate answer (like Phoenixes). From Terran's perspective, I'd also like to have a ground unit that can deal well with large number of Mutalisks well. Thors are "supposed" to do the job, but guess what, they don't cut it as well and you need static defense. This, or you could stim to death and chase Mutas flying around with Marines forever. | ||
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ETisME
12276 Posts
On March 31 2015 17:49 darkness wrote: Firstly, we're not parting or hero. And it's unrealistic for Blizzard to expect it that way. Even with micro, I'm sure that 30 stalkers are hardly a challenge for their mutalisks equivalent, e.g. 30. I'm ok even if stalkers have to be supported with something like storm, but no noob zerg will get hit with storm more than once or twice. Why are you so stubborn to acknowledge that stalkers are terrible vs mutalisks? Are you really happy to have phoenixes (and then waiting for fleet beacon) to counter mutalisks? That is ok, but timing is sometimes important. If you have a good core ground unit from gateways, you can always mass it faster. I don't see why it needs to be better than muta in equal number at all. Plus you are talking about directly engaging the muta army, muta strength is to contain the protoss and has map control. Muta needs to be strong to achieve that. In a muta game pvz, it is a perfectly viable to play defensive with stalkers and sentries and get those Phoenix out to regain map control etc. | ||
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Shield
Bulgaria4824 Posts
On March 31 2015 18:01 Everlong wrote: Stalkers do the job fairly well. If it happens that Mutalisks get out of hand, it is only reasonable to come up with appropriate answer (like Phoenixes). From Terran's perspective, I'd also like to have a ground unit that can deal well with large number of Mutalisks well. Thors are "supposed" to do the job, but guess what, they don't cut it as well and you need static defense. This, or you could stim to death and chase Mutas flying around with Marines forever. Or... you have mines. I'm sure if you place a few, at least some of them will fire. | ||
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-NegativeZero-
United States2141 Posts
On March 31 2015 17:37 darkness wrote: And that is why Blizzard needs to either make stalkers better against mutalisks or let adept counter mutalisks. If mutalisks get out of hand, nothing but phoenixes stop them. Protoss is supposed to have at least one ground unit which can do the job. It used to be called dragoon. What is it going to be for LotV? lol dragoons did NOT counter mutas, the 2 answers were corsairs and archons, and even archons weren't very good due to the relative immobility vs. air, so corsairs were the favored option in like 95% of games. the difference was that unlike phoenixes, corsairs had splash, so they scaled exponentially well vs. mutas, so you didn't have to make nearly as many of them. | ||
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Agh
United States896 Posts
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Everlong
Czech Republic1973 Posts
On March 31 2015 18:02 darkness wrote: Or... you have mines. I'm sure if you place a few, at least some of them will fire. Mines, while good in theory, don't do well in reality. They are 2 supply and you need reactor on your factory. And if you happen to run into a Zerg player with decent micro, they will just pick them one by one with flock of Mutas + Overseer. It happense here and there that you get this "money" mine hit, but in the long run, mines are not very reliable, in my opinion. edit: I can't remember the last time I saw someone try to deal with Mutas via Mines in professional game, save cases where you slow push across the map obviously. | ||
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Shield
Bulgaria4824 Posts
On March 31 2015 18:04 -NegativeZero- wrote: lol dragoons did NOT counter mutas, the 2 answers were corsairs and archons, and even archons weren't very good due to the relative immobility vs. air, so corsairs were the favored option in like 95% of games. the difference was that unlike phoenixes, corsairs had splash, so they scaled exponentially well vs. mutas, so you didn't have to make nearly as many of them. That's not true. Dragoons beat mutalisks really hard. Provided that you have at least 2 hotkeys of them (24 units) or more. | ||
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SC2Toastie
Netherlands5725 Posts
On March 31 2015 17:49 darkness wrote: Firstly, we're not parting or hero. And it's unrealistic for Blizzard to expect it that way. Even with micro, I'm sure that 30 stalkers are hardly a challenge for their mutalisks equivalent, e.g. 30. I'm ok even if stalkers have to be supported with something like storm, but no noob zerg will get hit with storm more than once or twice. Why are you so stubborn to acknowledge that stalkers are terrible vs mutalisks? Are you really happy to have phoenixes (and then waiting for fleet beacon) to counter mutalisks? That is ok, but timing is sometimes important. If you have a good core ground unit from gateways, you can always mass it faster. Actually, if you are assuming a Protoss that is not skilled enough to properly blink his Stalkers, you cannot assume the Zerg player is gonna be excellent in Storm dodging... Hitting storm on Mutas is quite easy, and Stalker+ArchonORTemplar can chase them off, adding a couple of phoenix allows you to kill them. Mutalisk are a nice unit in ZvP that allow Zerg to finish the game when ahead or control it when even. Protoss needs to scout in time and adapt properly and all is fine and dandy ^_^ | ||
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EPT
It looks like a mix between marauder and stalker which are both boring units. Active ability might be cool strategically though
