EPTThe Worlds format just is just really bad at sorting positioning/rankings of teams that don't win the event. That alone may be enough to say it's wrong to attach any kind of meaning to the results outside of the first place.
2017 Esports General Discussion - Page 27
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Numy
South Africa35471 Posts
The Worlds format just is just really bad at sorting positioning/rankings of teams that don't win the event. That alone may be enough to say it's wrong to attach any kind of meaning to the results outside of the first place. | ||
GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
On August 23 2017 06:25 Numy wrote: The Worlds format just is just really bad at sorting positioning/rankings of teams that don't win the event. That alone may be enough to say it's wrong to attach any kind of meaning to the results outside of the first place. Agreed, but this is true of any bracket format. Even double-elimination only guarantees the "correct" 1st and 2nd place teams even if you assume perfect transitivity and no upsets. Barring a ten-week quadruple-round-robin between all contestants you'll never have truly accurate rankings outside of who is #1. So I really don't like the Worlds format. Baking in privileges for certain regions over others feels very wrong. | ||
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JimmiC
Canada22817 Posts
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
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docsforsale
United States3 Posts
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Sent.
Poland9299 Posts
Don't like how making shitty PR statements like this became the most effective way of getting Riot to cooperate with you. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
Edit: Parenthesis. | ||
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Kaneh
Canada737 Posts
Like you heard a TON of stuff from the NA owners, and a ton of pressure/meetings were probably happening behind the scenes with how much pressure they were showing publicly. The public pushing came 2 years ago with things coming to a head last year, and then deals and talk coming this year. Meanwhile EU is fumbling along, the orgs don't seem to know what's gong on. They're just copying NA blindly. h2k's random threat isn't organized the way all the major NA orgs pushed together when regi stated LoL was losing them money. The reaction from the major NA owners was all along the same lines, and all together. Its the same situation when people found out G2 and fnatic applied to NALCS. No real statements, not real pushing from the orgs. As much as they want to blame Riot EU, its also the orgs/owners fault as well for having just as little organization. Take at least 2 sides to make a franchise, and if the owners are equally as clueless as the league, then wtf did they expect. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
On September 02 2017 17:32 Kaneh wrote: it really feels like the NA owners were driving nalcs and really assisting with the franchsing while the EU owners didn't do as much and just kinda assumed. Like you heard a TON of stuff from the NA owners, and a ton of pressure/meetings were probably happening behind the scenes with how much pressure they were showing publicly. The public pushing came 2 years ago with things coming to a head last year, and then deals and talk coming this year. Meanwhile EU is fumbling along, the orgs don't seem to know what's gong on. They're just copying NA blindly. h2k's random threat isn't organized the way all the major NA orgs pushed together when regi stated LoL was losing them money. The reaction from the major NA owners was all along the same lines, and all together. Its the same situation when people found out G2 and fnatic applied to NALCS. No real statements, not real pushing from the orgs. As much as they want to blame Riot EU, its also the orgs/owners fault as well for having just as little organization. Take at least 2 sides to make a franchise, and if the owners are equally as clueless as the league, then wtf did they expect. NA has always been the easier market than EU. Simply, America has 320 million people, and any extra effort over that is gravy. California alone is basically the size of the largest countries in Europe. On top of that, Riot is based in California, thus they have a local bias. When it comes to EU LCS, Riot has a choice: They can either Franchise, or give EU more money than NA. If they franchise EU, they will be equals. If they do not franchise EU, they need to give EU extra money, because those teams will need to continue to bid higher for players to stay in the league. | ||
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Gahlo
United States35172 Posts
On September 02 2017 18:04 cLutZ wrote: NA has always been the easier market than EU. Simply, America has 320 million people, and any extra effort over that is gravy. California alone is basically the size of the largest countries in Europe. On top of that, Riot is based in California, thus they have a local bias. When it comes to EU LCS, Riot has a choice: They can either Franchise, or give EU more money than NA. If they franchise EU, they will be equals. If they do not franchise EU, they need to give EU extra money, because those teams will need to continue to bid higher for players to stay in the league. EU fans, at least judging by reddit, have been adamant on not wanting franchising. NA is also a simpler market because it effectively caters to the US and Canada, which share a dominant language and can be advertised to relatively the same. Meanwhile EU is divided by tons of languages and distinct cultures. | ||
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Kaneh
Canada737 Posts
And again, they just whine the NA got thiers, without trying anything EU centric. I'm mostly just bitching out the orgs for being so passive and h2k throwing a fit when there's simply no evidence they tried to work with riotEU on anything. The letter reads to me "dear riot, we invested a ton of money with no plan, bail us out" like what did they expect? seems like amateur ownership. "Fully aware and discussed for many months" so you expected what, that they could get you a deal after NA announced thiers and you panicked? so you demanded shit without backing from other orgs and no real plan? You make public PR statements like this when you have some kind of plan/declaration to get what you want, and the other side is balking because they want different terms. NA used it to push riot towards better terms in franchising and league setup, which the orgs already had plans for. EU has no terms. There is no plans. This is just a childish tantrum. Its like thier throw a public facebook tantrum because your partner can't buy that house/car you always wanted, even tho you never really discussed it or had any real plans on how to afford it. | ||
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Sent.
Poland9299 Posts
The difference here is that it seems like H2K (and previously other teams like G2) tried to do something on their own, while North American PR stunts seemed coordinated. I'm only guessing, but I also think that for some reason Riot EU is much less willing (or able) to cooperate with the local owners. | ||
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
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Slusher
United States19143 Posts
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
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Gahlo
United States35172 Posts
Not to mention it's a catch 22 from EU fans(judging by reddit). You're damned if you do, damned if you don't. | ||
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Sent.
Poland9299 Posts
On September 03 2017 05:44 Slusher wrote: Except The open letter from the na orgs was anything but childish. It outlined the ways they had attempted to monetize, the roadblocks Riot was actively creating for them. There is a reason why Tryndamere looked like the idiot, it was because being unable to interpret the na orgs statement would require an idiot. I was trying to say that the letter was okay but didn't cause a strong reaction in the community. That strong reaction happened later, when Regi started playing the victim and Tryndamere responded like he did. I think the community didn't (and probably still doesn't) really care about the financial stuff, but started supporting NA owners "against" Riot because they managed to paint themselves as victims of some great injustice. H2K is trying to do the same now, without realizing their situation is different than TSM's. | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
On September 03 2017 05:58 Gahlo wrote: You can't force EU LCS isn't the same situation as NA LCS. The business culture there is entirely different. I'm sure something could be worked out, but you can't just copy it. Not to mention it's a catch 22 from EU fans(judging by reddit). You're damned if you do, damned if you don't. They should not franchise EU LCS culturally (practically imo it's also bad for na but that's done). But they need to compensate the teams. Most NA orgs seem to be valuing the stability at over $1 million per year. If riot wants EU LCS to exist, they need to pony up at least that much additional revenue to each EU LCS participant. | ||
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AlterKot
Poland7525 Posts
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