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Baa?21242 Posts
I’m here to translate/give some backstory on Tabe’s reputation and perception in China and the fallout from his strat leaking scandal. To put it bluntly Tabe is being completely vilified by everyone in China, from Netizens to former pros to casters. To give some context on Tabe’s status/reputation in China-
Contrary to his fairly good reputation in the west, Tabe has, for most of the past years, been viewed with at best disinterest and disdain and at worst outright hate in China. Tabe is typically perceived as someone who is somewhat slimy/sleazy in that he places his own self-interest above all else, and is a generally disloyal and untrustworthy individual. There are of course conflicting accounts of various things, but there have been quite a few stories and “incidents” around him. First, I’ll give you some reactions to Tabe’s leaking incident at World’s today/yesterday depending on your time zone.
PLU米勒 (LPL Caster)
http://weibo.com/3202111700/CEDUMeNZu?from=page_1005053202111700_profile&wvr=6&mod=weibotime&type=comment
虽然lpl队伍输了，我们也会气，也会骂，但永远不会出卖他们，更不会把这些当作跟别人炫耀的资本
Yes, even though we will be angry and be upset that LPL teams lost, we will never betray them, and we would never show off to other people through it.
Misaya
http://weibo.com/1140554177/CEDwXDYVN?from=page_1005051140554177_profile&wvr=6&mod=weibotime
http://weibo.com/1140554177/CEDytieUB?from=page_1005051140554177_profile&wvr=6&mod=weibotime
我就想问为啥别人都懂事地阻止你了，你还继续想做贱事？
I just want to know why you keep trying to do sleazy shit even after everyone else was trying to stop you?
Misaya also discussed this on stream - http://v.youku.com/v_show/id_XMTM1NzU1Nzc5Mg==.html
EDG Sanshao
http://weibo.com/p/1001603896961882312996
Tabe 今天的所做，更是让我们所有一线俱乐部和队员感到愤怒。这种公开场合用最直接的方式暴露俱乐部的战术，无论是什么出发点，都是下流的，堂而皇之的坐在这个台上，靠出卖队伍信息来博得眼球，是一种耻辱！
What Tabe did today made the members of all the teams angry. To expose a team’s strategy in such a public and direct manner, no matter the intention, is depiscable. To sit on that stage and rely on selling out the team to get some views and attention, is shameful!
解说苏小妍 (LPL Caster)
http://weibo.com/5043210086/CEE3uFvy3?
from=page_1005055043210086_profile&wvr=6&mod=weibotime&type=comment
队伍打的怎么样不是我们能控制的事，但自己的职业素质怎么样，是自己的行为决定的……
How the teams play and perform isn’t something we can control, but what we can control is our own professional conduct…
闫紫境GwAwa (Former Caster, Host)
http://weibo.com/1558597584/CEDJA6PgJ?from=page_1005051558597584_profile&wvr=6&mod=weibotime&type=comment
回复@大半夜睡不着起来看猩猩:不得不说 我们解说从来没干过这种事 即使知道 不要说我们解说怎么怎么样 解说都在S5第一线/
I have to say, our casters have never done anything like this even if we know [information].
http://weibo.com/1558597584/CEDLGqe02?from=page_1005051558597584&type=comment
记得S3世界总决赛 皇族对阵SKT 老歪特和我说他有一手制裁FAKER 算大招 他练了很久 我在解说台上面说 皇族有大招 决赛有机会 大家请给皇族加油 结果他们没用 我也没说 现在告诉大家 是阿卡丽
Remember S3 World Finals, Royal vs. SKT. Whitezz also told us there’s a secret pick they have prepared for Faker that they practiced a lot. I said on the desk that Royal has a secret strat, and if it comes out in the finals, please cheer for Royal. They never ended up using it, and I never told anyone. I’ll tell everyone now, it was Akali
Edward (EDG Owner, on the EDG App)
这个叛徒Tabe。你他妈是中国人吗？
This traitor Tabe. Are you fucking Chinese or not?
解说小米 (LPL Caster)
http://weibo.com/2120006760/CEE5npr6S?from=page_1005052120006760_profile&wvr=6&mod=weibotime&type=comment
技不如人咱输得起，但这样的出卖，真的让人很气愤……//
We can lose because we get out-skilled. But to get sold out like this, it makes you angry….
Godlike/Ackerman
http://weibo.com/5400531923/CEDR1FsWk?from=page_1005055400531923_profile&wvr=6&mod=weibotime
tabe有锅，这个肯定甩不掉的，国外的直播解说，国外的队伍基本都会看的，或多或少会去知道一些。这个还是比较影响的，固然泄露了一些但是比赛从来没有说输了是一个人的责任，大家看的平静一点，起码来说tabe也是希望IG赢，只是不知道会有这样的后果
Tabe has blame in this, this is indisputable. Foreign [LCS] teams will typically watch foreign streams, and will more or less know what’s being said. This definitely have an impact. Even though some information was disclosed, a loss is never just one person’s responsibility. Everyone should calm down. At the very least Tabe was hoping iG would win, but just didn’t know there would be this kind of consequence.
小苍cany (LPL Caster)
http://weibo.com/2850616155/CEDRNdLmQ?from=page_1005052850616155_profile&wvr=6&mod=weibotime
不管IG是不是被BP打败，赛前透露关键信息这是什么心态干出来的？！
It doesn’t matter whether or not IG lost on ban-pick, what was going through your mind when you disclosed such crucial information before the game?!
LOL小楼 (LPL Caster)
http://weibo.com/2721185633/CEDEGDLp1?from=page_1005052721185633_profile&wvr=6&mod=weibotime&type=comment
我不是针对谁，也不帮ig甩锅，我只是觉得这样真的很没有职业素养
I’m not calling anyone out, and I’m not trying to divert blame from IG, but I feel doing stuff like this shows a lack of professionalism.
http://weibo.com/2721185633/CEDLBmVTl?from=page_1005052721185633_profile&wvr=6&mod=weibotime
利用chris对他的信任套出ig接下来想用的英雄，然后在解说台一个个念出来。IG输了就是菜，但是还要被朋友捅一刀吗？//@怎么也吃不胖的阿J:只是人家自己的分析，什么职业素养有什么关系
To use Chris’s trust in him to get info on what champs IG will pick next, and then to read them out one by one on the analyst desk. iG lost because they were bad, but they also got stabbed in the back by their friend.
And now, for Tabe’s “history.” I’m not trying to libel him, and this stuff is generally pretty well reported in China. As stated earlier, there is a lot of he-said-she-said, but this is the kind of stuff that informs public opinion of Tabe. Perhaps I’m slightly biased, but where there’s smoke there’s fire goes the old saying.
**Incident 1 – OMG drama**
Tabe and Whitezz were friends and went pro together on CCM, later renamed IG. Whitezz was eventually kicked from IG, and later reports say it was Tabe who did so. Eventually Tabe and Whitezz ended up on OMG together.
However, they both ended up leaving OMG. It was a huge scandal/drama in the scene, and the popular narrative (later disputed by Whitezz and Tabe/Whitezz’s next team). It goes something like follows:
Whitezz and Tabe left the team with Whitezz because both of them wanted their girlfriends to live at the teamhouse with them and to get a salary. Whitezz’s girlfriend UU and Tabe’s girlfriend VV were appointed as team managers or some similar role. The team acquiesced at first but eventually Gogoing/San/Cool were upset with the arrangement, since Whitezz and Tabe took the main rooms to live with their girlfriends whereas Gogoing and San had to room in a very small study room and Cool a temporary housing unit that was added to the roof/attic area of the team house. It was reported that Whitezz was a poor teammate (standard complaint of poor attitude, flames, doesn’t admit mistakes, doesn’t respect scheduled practice times, etc.). The other teammates wanted Whitezz to either improve or be kicked, but Tabe and Whitezz’s girlfriend, who was sort of a team manager, were against it. San expressed his desire to leave the team, and Tabe wanted San to stay, so he agreed to look into the Whitezz issue. The end result was a team vote, 3 voted in favor of kicking Whtiezz, and Tabe abstained.
2 Days later, Tabe announced that he would leave with Whitezz. He told the management/sponsor that if they wanted to keep Tabe and Whitezz, they hav eto kick San and Cool. Meanwhile Tabe and Whitezz’s girlfriend UU were saying Gogoing/San/Cool and the team have attitude/character problems and don’t believe in teamwork. Eventually they departed.
Sources-
OMG History, includes interviews/reports/anecdotes from various involved individuals, including former OMG sponsor, Whitezz, VV, remaining OMG teammates. It’s basically a he-said she-said scenario. http://lol.178.com/201209/140827509862.html
**Story 2 – “Retiring” from Royal**
In early 2013, Tabe left Royal. He cited poor working conditions and low salaries, and wanted to pursue a casting/streaming career to raise money to support his family. Netizens were generally supportive, since esports conditions back then were quite poor compared to today. However it turns out that Whitezz later went and begged Tabe to come back to the team since Royal floundered without him (recall Uzi was unwilling to play with anyone but Tabe, Royal went through 4 or 5 supports after Tabe left). Chat logs were shown on stream:
**Whitezz *
You have to think back, when you were playing on Royal, UU and I were living the life you and VV are living right now, having left the professional scene [T/N: Whitezz also briefly “retired,” but came back due to Tabe’s request as you’ll see]. You gave me a phone call and asked me to come help you play in the pro scene. I risked arguing with UU and chose to help you out. To think if I started streaming/making VODs back then I would probably have a decent income right now.
Ever since we went pro, you sold me out so many times, but when have I ever resented you?
And I’m not asking you for too much right now. Just finish up these last two months with me. I’m about to leave China, it might be many years before we see each other again.
A single word from you was enough for me to kick everyone on CLC [T/N: Canis Lupus Campestris, Noah’s Ark/OMG/Royal’s precursor http://lol.esportspedia.com/wiki/Canis_Lupus_Campestris］. I always bore the reputation of being the “team destroying demon” and got flamed for it, but you just left to go play on Royal on your own, and I quietly retired without saying a word.
When you were leaving Royal, we tried to keep you, but we didn’t try to hold you against your will. I know you weren’t happy, and you wanted to live your own life. But I literally have no options right now. Uzi switched four supports already, every single winning game ends up being a loss. I can’t even retire and successfully transition [T/N: into a casting/streaming career] right now. Do you want me to completely fucked? So much that you can’t even stop making vods for 1-2 months and help me out?
We’ve known each other for four years, just help me out, I’m begging you help me out once.
This is the last time I’ll ask you. If you still don’t want to help me I’ll never bring it up again.
**Tabe’s response*
As a caster/VOD maker, if I put in 100, I can get 100, but I can also get 1000. Do you understand? I’m 22, I need to think about my future. If I’m still 16 maybe I can expend my youth years.
If I’m still on Royal, do you think Xiaoxiao would be going to All-Star? Of course I’d get voted. And I really wanted to go to All-Star. If I don’t want to play pro I must have my own reasons, I gave up a lot too.
You can find logs/screencaps here- http://bbs.ngacn.cc/read.php?tid=6242903&rand=653
A few points here-
Loyalty is obviously valued very highly everywhere, especially in Chinese culture. Many netizens saw this as Tabe being a scumbag/etc, and public opinion really turned from when he first retired.
A lot of people mocked his comment on going to All Stars over Xiaoxiao. Recall that this was mid 2013, when WE and iG were still by far the two most popular teams in China, and Fzzf/Xiaoxiao were genereally regarded as far superior to any other supports. They think Tabe had an overinflated sense of importance.
Eventually Tabe was persuaded to return with a higher salary, and many people were of the opinion that Tabe orchestrated the whole thing and completely left Royal out to dry just to try to get some more money. Opinion is more divided on this, and it’s unclear what the actual reason was.
**Incident 2.5 – Tabe’s comments at/following S3 worlds.**
You may recall that Tabe very publicly lambasted the Chinese esports environment and the L.Ace organization at and after World’s. This drew the ire of many individuals in the Chinese esports scene, who accused Tabe of extrapolating the unsavory situation at Royal (salary/money disputes primarily) to the whole scene. They were especially quick to note that Tabe has a history of being involved in drama filled situations, and claimed he was unfairly slandering other organizations even though it was only teams that he’s been involved with that has had this sort of shadiness.
Again, it’s a he-said she-said thing, but it left a poor taste in a lot of Chinese netizen’s mouths.
**Situation 3 – Tabe’s Return**
Following this Tabe exited the scene and was somewhat forgotten. However, with the extreme growth of streaming and reports that top streamers like Misaya and Whitezz were making millions of dollars and living very comfortable lives, Tabe resurfaced. He started doing some streaming of his own but wasn’t particularly popular. In addition he went on the LPL stream to do some guest casting/analysis at games and some third party special events. Most people were kind of surprised that he was so quick to return after essentially denouncing the scene.
I would describe reaction to his conduct on stream/casting at events is generally negative to mixed at best. He tends to make a lot of vulgar/sex jokes on stream/to his girlfriend, including often bragging about how his girlfriend was a virgin when they first met, which some people view as crass. There was an incident when during a Chinese third party tournament, the casters had to fill time due to lag/delays, and Tabe told a lot of old stories about his time on Royal, including making fun of Godlike for being a virgin (supposedly the only one on the team) at the time which a lot of people perceived as distasteful or even outright malicious. He also was writing comments on Weibo after Uzi was benched mocking OMG in a pretty passive aggressive manner, and capitalizing on it to duo queue with Uzi while he was benched.
The perception is that Tabe relies a lot on tearing other people down to build himself up, and tends to place himself in the middle of controversy/tag along to popular personalities to build up his own brand.
**Story 3.5 – Tabe’s Brief Coaching Stint for SPG**
Tabe had a brief stint as a coach for a low tier LSPL team, Speed Gaming, in Spring 2015. The team didn’t really go anywhere and Tabe was relatively quiet, but there were some rumors/stories going on, sourced to Speed Gaming’s manager (a girl), that Tabe was a sleazy and egotistical guy. This might border on character assassination since there are no real sources, but it’s being spread around Chinese forums/Tieba pretty widely right now, so might help inform the Chinese netizen attitude towards Tabe.
**Incident 4 – Chris/LGD coaching scandal**
Those of you who followed the LGD coaching fiasco leading up to worlds might recall that the whole thing started when Chris heard from a “friend” that Korean coaches were getting paid multiples what he was paid. It’s widely speculated that this friend was Tabe. Chris, when he was a pro, started on iG in 2011/2012 with Tabe, and went on to CLC (was kicked by Whitezz, indirectly through Tabe if the previous story is to be believed), before returning to play for a bit on Noah’s Ark, then possibly kicked (unclear) again, at which point he went to another team, then returned to Royal. (Incidentally Pyl was also on that ill-fated CLC team and “left”). Opinion on this issue is split, but many feel like Tabe was intentionally trying to start shit out of jealously/malicious intent for whatever reason. After Chris left LGD and went to iG, Tabe was very vocal in talking about how they’re friends on the analyst desk, which led to today’s iG pick/ban leaking scandal.
The iG Draft Leak
Based on current reactions, this is probably the nail in the coffin for Tabe’s esports career in China.
There are some semi-joking posts stating that Tabe did this intentionally, either at the direction of Chris to mislead the enemy team or to divert attention from LGD and iG’s spectacular failure at World’s.
More common are people just viewing this as more evidence of Tabe’s sleaziness/questionable character. People are calling attention to the fact that he had everything written out, so it was pre-meditated and not something that was spur of the moment.
A common copypasta reads:
tabe不泄密ig会输吗？我认为他们照样会输。但是，如果ig赢了tabe就不该骂吗？ 再想一个问题。为什么tabe会知道ig的大招？答：肯定是tabe自己去问的，不然ig还会主动告诉你tabe? 再问：为什么tabe问了ig的人就告诉他了？ 答：因为tabe是中国人，Ig是中国队，谁都不会想到中国人会卖中国队。 最后一个问题，我为什么要来喷tabe?是为了ig的失败泄愤吗？ 不是，那是为什么，是因为我看到了让我反感的东西，让我恶心的东西，不喷，我心情不好，念头不通畅。 你见过3个外国人劝一个中国人不要卖队友吗？我见过。 你见过一个人为了秀英语就照着稿子读人家战队的战术吗？我见过。
Would iG lose if Tabe didn’t reveal their strat? I think they would’ve lost anyways. But, even if iG won, should we not flame Tabe because of it? Also, think of another issue: Why would Tabe know iG’s strat? Answer: Because Tabe is Chinese. iG is Chinese, and no one would expect a Chinese person to sell out a Chinese team. Last question: Why am I flaming Tabe? Because iG lost and I want to vent? No. Then why? Because I saw something that upset me, that disgusts me. If I don’t flame, I feel bad and can’t think clearly. Have you ever seen three foreigners try to stop a Chinese person from selling out his teammates? I have. Have you ever seen someone read strats off a script to show off his English? I have.
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Chinese drama best drama.
Rest in peace Tabe.
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Wow . . . . I had no idea how much of an asshole Tabe really was.
I liked him before but after this, hell no not anymore.
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On October 12 2015 09:57 Azarkon wrote:
Chinese drama best drama.
Rest in peace Tabe.
I think it'd be better if Tabe's League persona/life/career rested in pieces. He's a real jerk.
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Wow...
Seems more like idiocy than betrayal though. If you wanted to betray the team effectively, you would leak strats secretly. But esports today, it doesn't matter what language you use when you say things publicly, all the juicy bits get translated.
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I was curious why he was leaking picks and bans on stream... Pretty shitty thing to do
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On October 12 2015 09:44 Carnivorous Sheep wrote:
**Incident 4 – Chris/LGD coaching scandal**
Those of you who followed the LGD coaching fiasco leading up to worlds might recall that the whole thing started when Chris heard from a “friend” that Korean coaches were getting paid multiples what he was paid. It’s widely speculated that this friend was Tabe. Chris, when he was a pro, started on iG in 2011/2012 with Tabe, and went on to CLC (was kicked by Whitezz, indirectly through Tabe if the previous story is to be believed), before returning to play for a bit on Noah’s Ark, then possibly kicked (unclear) again, at which point he went to another team, then returned to Royal. (Incidentally Pyl was also on that ill-fated CLC team and “left”). Opinion on this issue is split, but many feel like Tabe was intentionally trying to start shit out of jealously/malicious intent for whatever reason. After Chris left LGD and went to iG, Tabe was very vocal in talking about how they’re friends on the analyst desk, which led to today’s iG pick/ban leaking scandal.
Honestly, I'm fairly confused why the common assumption that the Chinese community has is that Tabe is telling Chris about better salaries out of jealousy/malicious intent. I wonder if it's because I'm older, but what's wrong with Chris trying to get paid better? What's wrong with Tabe wanting better for his friend in the first place? Of course, we will probably never know the full story, but this story doesn't make sense if you think Tabe is malicious in some way. I feel as if it is a friend looking out for his friend in a scene that seems to not pay/respect their own players enough.
Even if the community wants to hate on Tabe, the general trend of his complaints seem to be exactly about treatment of players/ personnel in Chinese organizations.
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The Neverending Chinese drama. This whole thing is far bigger than I thought before.
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Australia18228 Posts
I've always thought the 'humble guy' was for show, but I don't think he would be stupid enough to accidentally leak strats.
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Bearded Elder29903 Posts
Damn, didn't know about all of this.
Thanks for sharing Cheep.
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If I may... Tabe was on the analyst desk in California while both teams were on stage and just about to hop in to Champion select. Was there really enough time to relay the information he spat out in California and get it to Fnatic on stage?
Or is there some massive details I may have over-looked? I don't want to sound like a massive idiot, but it was getting late last night when I was watching the games and so I was tired and can't remember all the details.
P.S. - I wonder who edited tabe's leaguepedia page:
http://lol.gamepedia.com/Tabe
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United States47024 Posts
Tabe's still one of the best/most successful Chinese players to play LoL but yeah, he's pretty much a scumbag.
Tuned into his stream a couple times after he "retired", was not really amused.
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Maybe it's a culture difference thing, but I don't see anything wrong with all the things he did in the past. Leaking strats is kinda retarded, but the rest is just....whatever.
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The way he leaked it on the analysts' desk makes no sense though. I am actually more inclined to believe that it was an accident - there was a miscommunication between him and Chris on what was "secret strat" and what was "random musing".
Additionally, I think there is a lot of scapegoating going on and Tabe seems to be a convenient excuse.
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On October 12 2015 15:19 Sufficiency wrote:
The way he leaked it on the analysts' desk makes no sense though. I am actually more inclined to believe that it was an accident - there was a miscommunication between him and Chris on what was "secret strat" and what was "random musing".
Well, clearly it wasn't random musing seeing as how they picked exactly the picks tabe mentioned. I see no way to interpret tabe's leak as a joke. The way tabe presented it wasn't really comical either. He was just spitting facts. I mean, if he said they were gonna pick teemo or something then I could maybe see it, but hecarim and kalista/kennen aren't exactly outlandish.
Additionally, I think there is a lot of scapegoating going on and Tabe seems to be a convenient excuse.
No one is blaming him for the loss. Just that it's absolutely stupid and a complete betrayal to leak strategies on live broadcast to the opposing team. Maybe if it was on the Chinese stream it'd have been different.
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Vancouver14381 Posts
On October 12 2015 13:56 BreAKerTV wrote:If I may... Tabe was on the analyst desk in California while both teams were on stage and just about to hop in to Champion select. Was there really enough time to relay the information he spat out in California and get it to Fnatic on stage? Or is there some massive details I may have over-looked? I don't want to sound like a massive idiot, but it was getting late last night when I was watching the games and so I was tired and can't remember all the details. P.S. - I wonder who edited tabe's leaguepedia page: http://lol.gamepedia.com/Tabe
You know you can see who made the edits right?
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On October 12 2015 15:45 JBright wrote:Show nested quote +On October 12 2015 13:56 BreAKerTV wrote:If I may... Tabe was on the analyst desk in California while both teams were on stage and just about to hop in to Champion select. Was there really enough time to relay the information he spat out in California and get it to Fnatic on stage? Or is there some massive details I may have over-looked? I don't want to sound like a massive idiot, but it was getting late last night when I was watching the games and so I was tired and can't remember all the details. P.S. - I wonder who edited tabe's leaguepedia page: http://lol.gamepedia.com/Tabe You know you can see who made the edits right?
Uh... I didn't thoroughly inspect this, but I imagine so.
EDIT: After a long look through the page, I was unable to locate the editor(s) of said page.
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All i know is that yesterday he fucked with the team owned by the son of china richest man. Better stay out of mainland china for now tabe.
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It's shame his legacy won't be the innovation of Annie Support, instead it will be this crap. Bad way to go.
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On October 12 2015 15:23 Itsmedudeman wrote:Show nested quote +On October 12 2015 15:19 Sufficiency wrote:
The way he leaked it on the analysts' desk makes no sense though. I am actually more inclined to believe that it was an accident - there was a miscommunication between him and Chris on what was "secret strat" and what was "random musing". Well, clearly it wasn't random musing seeing as how they picked exactly the picks tabe mentioned. I see no way to interpret tabe's leak as a joke. The way tabe presented it wasn't really comical either. He was just spitting facts. I mean, if he said they were gonna pick teemo or something then I could maybe see it, but hecarim and kalista/kennen aren't exactly outlandish. Show nested quote +Additionally, I think there is a lot of scapegoating going on and Tabe seems to be a convenient excuse. No one is blaming him for the loss. Just that it's absolutely stupid and a complete betrayal to leak strategies on live broadcast to the opposing team. Maybe if it was on the Chinese stream it'd have been different.
Maybe I chose the wrong word. It's not so much "scapegoating", per se; it's that now the fans have something else to direct their anger to.
Anyway, I don't think it was that big of a deal since IIRC IG had basically no way of making out of the group and there was too little time to prepare for such a pick even if other teams deem it real. I am still conflicted on if he did it on purpose.
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Interesting read. TY Cheep, clearly a lot of work went into that.
Would be nice if you'd explain what happened today though instead of just leading up to it and then ending the article.
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Would be great to know what actually happened, a lead, if not a link to know where to look at before reading all this.
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United Kingdom50293 Posts
So what happened to stir this controversy was Tabe was on the analyst desk before iG v AHQ; he said that iG had some secret strats and then started to straight up say what they were such as kalista/kennen and hecarim jungle (That very game kakao picked hecarim jungle) the analyst desk had to outright tell him to stop.
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Bearded Elder29903 Posts
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Thanks
And holy cow, the rest of the desk are like "wtf are you doing?"
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I missed the actual discussion where he said that stuff, but man Tabe sounds like an idiot, he literally sounded like he was reading iG strats off a piece of paper, no discussion just leaking. Really wonder what was going through his head, did he think there wouldn't be consequences?
I remember Tabe's fiasco when retiring, it didn't sound very pretty. Pretty amazing that he managed to fuck up yet again in such a big way, he should give the esports scene a rest.
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I think that was just stupid... I didn't know about Tabe before, because I was always watching only EU LCS so I don't really care about him, but that was distasteful.
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Yeah watching that video it looks more clueless than malicious.
Difficult to believe that he wouldn't know what the impact would be though, even if it was an honest mistake its something that he should have known not to do.
He probably deserves a good degree of the hate he gets, I'd imagine.
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Poland3748 Posts
On October 12 2015 18:33 DarkCore wrote:
I missed the actual discussion where he said that stuff, but man Tabe sounds like an idiot, he literally sounded like he was reading iG strats off a piece of paper, no discussion just leaking. Really wonder what was going through his head, did he think there wouldn't be consequences?
I remember Tabe's fiasco when retiring, it didn't sound very pretty. Pretty amazing that he managed to fuck up yet again in such a big way, he should give the esports scene a rest.
If he is just stupid, then why was he invited to the analyst desk? I think he just an egoist.
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On October 12 2015 19:45 Ketara wrote:
Yeah watching that video it looks more clueless than malicious.
Difficult to believe that he wouldn't know what the impact would be though, even if it was an honest mistake its something that he should have known not to do.
He probably deserves a good degree of the hate he gets, I'd imagine.
He's been a player/coach for YEARS though... I really doubt he wouldn't understand how important not revealing a teams so far unused strategies is.
Also after having zirene basically ask "wtf r u doing tabe" he goes straight into listing their other picks until the other casters pull the plug for him
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I think he just doesn't care at all.
He has probably made a fair amount of money by streaming/doing other stuff and now he's just doing whatever the fuck he wants.
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Don't attribute to malice what can be better explained by sheer stupidity.
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On October 12 2015 20:19 las91 wrote:
Don't attribute to malice what can be better explained by sheer stupidity.
That's the vibe I'm getting from him, if only because I can't fathom what the benefit was of leaking those strats. It's not like his comments changed the outcome of the game, all he did was dig himself a really, really deep hole.
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Poland3748 Posts
On October 12 2015 20:28 DarkCore wrote:Show nested quote +On October 12 2015 20:19 las91 wrote:
Don't attribute to malice what can be better explained by sheer stupidity. That's the vibe I'm getting from him, if only because I can't fathom what the benefit was of leaking those strats. It's not like his comments changed the outcome of the game, all he did was dig himself a really, really deep hole.
He looked knowledgable and informed so perhaps he was hoping he is raising his position for future. But I think atm it backfired so hard we will never see him again.
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Pretty sure this was not malice but just stupidity from Tabe. If he wanted to do harm he would just leak in secret to the enemy team and not in public right before the game. He wanted to look important/knowledgable on the desk.
Is it even confirmed that ahq ever heard what he said before the game? Because I kinda doubt it.
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I would assume their computers and game/comm servers are part of an air-gapped system, and i know that they can't bring electronics on stage, so I don't think they could have listened to the desk even if they want to.
I don't know what it was but it definitely wasn't stupidity. You guys are not giving him enough credit, dude clearly isn't dumb enough to not know what he was doing lol.
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Even if it was stupidity, stupidity isn't an acceptable excuse for that sort of thing.
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On October 12 2015 21:43 Ketara wrote:
Even if it was stupidity, stupidity isn't an acceptable excuse for that sort of thing.
It is even an excuse for killing someone.
But if what O-ops said is true then Tabe knew ahq would not hear what he said anyway and it was not even that stupid and we are overreacting. Although you can argue it was somewhat of a leak for their next opponents in case heca would not get played.
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Cayman Islands24199 Posts
don't really want to wade into this nuclear mess but the other, broader background is the politics of CCP china vs hong kong and the various identities involved. suffice to say it's a hot mess but neither tabe or chinese lol fans are blameless and it's best to just ignore the whole affair and move on.
when lol rises to the level of national pride and you thrwo in china's peculiar mix of insecurity and outsized national pride, it's a gas explosion. tabe probably was on casual friendly terms with some of the ig coaches and they jokingly said 'it doesn't matter if you leak the info we'll lose anyway.' but tabe for some reason actually did it and went full retard.
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On October 12 2015 21:57 oneofthem wrote:
don't really want to wade into this nuclear mess but the other, broader background is the politics of CCP china vs hong kong and the various identities involved. suffice to say it's a hot mess but neither tabe or chinese lol fans are blameless and it's best to just ignore the whole affair and move on.
when lol rises to the level of national pride and you thrwo in china's peculiar mix of insecurity and outsized national pride, it's a gas explosion. tabe probably was on casual friendly terms with some of the ig coaches and they jokingly said 'it doesn't matter if you leak the info we'll lose anyway.' but tabe for some reason actually did it and went full retard.
Heh did not think of the Honkong angle but it would explain stuff like "Are you fucking Chinese or not?". When Dyrus leaked something which was actually relevant noone accused him of being a traitor to his country.
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I'm assuming it was more an ego thing than malice. Showing off how in the "know" he is and how valuable he is with his insider information more so than trying to do iG any harm.
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On October 12 2015 22:18 Numy wrote:
I'm assuming it was more an ego thing than malice. Showing off how in the "know" he is and how valuable he is with his insider information more so than trying to do iG any harm.
Yes being on the desk is huge and he wanted to show off how much of an insider he is in the chinese scene.
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Poland3748 Posts
On October 12 2015 22:38 Kenpark wrote:Show nested quote +On October 12 2015 22:18 Numy wrote:
I'm assuming it was more an ego thing than malice. Showing off how in the "know" he is and how valuable he is with his insider information more so than trying to do iG any harm. Yes being on the desk is huge and he wanted to show off how much of an insider he is in the chinese scene.
He is very outsider now. I mean chinese teams would now talk with any other analyst from the analyst desk over Tabe given they all protested while Tabe wanted to just spoiler the whole strategy.
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Poland3748 Posts
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TLADT24920 Posts
Didn't realize LoL has so much drama lol. This Tabe fellow sounds like he's done a lot of questionable actions. I don't know much about him though from the video, it didn't seem like he hesitated when giving out the strategy, but I also feel that it was going back to the idea of him wanting to be seen as knowledgeable rather than maliciously. Just the thoughts of someone who knows nothing about this scene.
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Given that he's been a player and a coach for so long, assuming he didn't have a malicious intent does not make him stupid, it makes him an utter retard lol. Pretty sure he had to know what he was doing. I hope he's gone for good now.
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On October 13 2015 03:27 Maluk wrote:
Given that he's been a player and a coach for so long, assuming he didn't have a malicious intent does not make him stupid, it makes him an utter retard lol. Pretty sure he had to know what he was doing. I hope he's gone for good now.
This makes no sense. If he wanted to do harm then he is a retard, because he did not do any other than to himself. He leaked right before the start of the game and it seems highly unlikely that ahq heard any of it.
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On October 12 2015 21:56 Redox wrote:Show nested quote +On October 12 2015 21:43 Ketara wrote:
Even if it was stupidity, stupidity isn't an acceptable excuse for that sort of thing. It is even an excuse for killing someone. But if what O-ops said is true then Tabe knew ahq would not hear what he said anyway and it was not even that stupid and we are overreacting. Although you can argue it was somewhat of a leak for their next opponents in case heca would not get played.
Lol you know if no one stopped him he would have gone in on that shit. Might not have affect that particular game but it's a problem for sure for all future games. It's not like they prep a completely diff strat for every team.
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On October 13 2015 05:26 O-ops wrote:Show nested quote +On October 12 2015 21:56 Redox wrote:On October 12 2015 21:43 Ketara wrote:
Even if it was stupidity, stupidity isn't an acceptable excuse for that sort of thing. It is even an excuse for killing someone. But if what O-ops said is true then Tabe knew ahq would not hear what he said anyway and it was not even that stupid and we are overreacting. Although you can argue it was somewhat of a leak for their next opponents in case heca would not get played. Lol you know if no one stopped him he would have gone in on that shit. Might not have affect that particular game but it's a problem for sure for all future games. It's not like they prep a completely diff strat for every team.
They actually used similar picks later on iirc. I think we saw the Kalista and maybe a Lee Sin too.
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He wasn't going to stop at kennen/kallista. I'm assuming we would have got solo lane picks if the desk didn't stop him. Plenty of time between games for c9/fnc to prep based on the information.
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I feel like this whole thing is getting way way out of proportion.
What he did ws stupid and disrespectful...but to say ithad any effect on the matches seems a bit far-fetched for me.
It would be different if suddenly we saw AHQ come out with a Hecarim ban... and this is just a horrible idea and sets a horrible precedent.
He was definitely just trying to show off about his insider information for Chinese teams...but we can all see he has pretty much ruined his Chinese esports career by now...and due to China being the largest market on the planet for Riot..I highly doubt we will see more of him on the desk in the future.
And about all of his past drama... meh..you gotta make that money and cash in on everything you can. Noone else is going to be paying his bills and supporting him for the rest of his life... make it while you can, you don't owe your life to any strangers.
(And people saying it influences future matches are legitimately insane... are we pretending the other teams live in a vacuum and wont see IG play this Hecarim comp? If he knew they were playing it that day the ONLY team he could have spoiled it for was AHQ, since everyone else was going to see them play the comp before their match anyways)
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I reread the whole thing more thoroughly and I still don't see anything wrong with his past actions. It's just...drama. From an outsider, none of us can really say who's in the right for any of those incidents. Spoiling a strategy is unforgivable even for an accident now that I think about it a little more though. RIP Tabe
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We will never know what their other two secret weapons were
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The funny part of the leak is he did it with a straight face, what a stone cold killa
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On October 12 2015 21:56 Redox wrote:Show nested quote +On October 12 2015 21:43 Ketara wrote:
Even if it was stupidity, stupidity isn't an acceptable excuse for that sort of thing. It is even an excuse for killing someone. But if what O-ops said is true then Tabe knew ahq would not hear what he said anyway and it was not even that stupid and we are overreacting. Although you can argue it was somewhat of a leak for their next opponents in case heca would not get played.
He said this very near the start of the day, before the very first game of the day. Plus he also called the kalista kennen bot lane which they then played several hours later. The players are all over social media between games, just look at their twitter feeds.
And even if we imagine that somehow this wouldn't get to the players on the stage, OR to the other two teams ig would face (who have tv's in their dressing room showing the games, so they saw him say it live.) Then there was still a chance at the time of a 4 way tie in the group (3-3 each) so there were even situations where ig wouldn't have wanted to reveal those strats until the bracket stage.
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Also don't forget how much Dig went on tilt when Dyrus leaked their strat (see Scarra's reflections interview). Imagine how much when you see some commentator just reading to blab your entire strategy. While iG obviously didn't get knocked out of groups only because of Tabe, it was still a stupid thing to do from him. Seriously wtf was he thinking.
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Makes sense. The whole thing with the leak is that it basically sets tabe as someone who can't be trusted with any inside info. If he was willing to tell everyone on the analysis desk and the public who else could he have told?
Well, I hope that he won't be a problem again in the future and I wouldn't be surprised if he gets blacklisted or some sort.
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Thanks for all the translations Cheep.
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Delicious drama nomnomnom.
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meh, tabe will always have a place in my heart for the epic interviews he did during s3. I always felt like Uzi was a bigger asshole than tabe would ever be.
I never liked chinese fans, especially after they basically voted in shit players for their all stars team rather than voting in their best possible rosters. Voting started out with like flame, dandy, pawn/rookie, imp and mata and it turned into "lets vote in slumping chinese players" I was surprsied cool didn't win the voting over rookie lol
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On December 06 2015 11:25 Garaman wrote:
meh, tabe will always have a place in my heart for the epic interviews he did during s3. I always felt like Uzi was a bigger asshole than tabe would ever be.
I never liked chinese fans, especially after they basically voted in shit players for their all stars team rather than voting in their best possible rosters. Voting started out with like flame, dandy, pawn/rookie, imp and mata and it turned into "lets vote in slumping chinese players" I was surprsied cool didn't win the voting over rookie lol
Really? It's ALL STARS, the whole point is to vote in all the fan favourite/famous people from your region.
Why should they vote in the korean imports, when they can vote in the chinese players they've been fans of for ages? It's not like all stars actually matters for anything.
NA voted in dyrus, hai (and secondarily meteos) and aphromoo... That's hardly voting the best players in...
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On December 07 2015 00:42 killerdog wrote:Show nested quote +On December 06 2015 11:25 Garaman wrote:
meh, tabe will always have a place in my heart for the epic interviews he did during s3. I always felt like Uzi was a bigger asshole than tabe would ever be.
I never liked chinese fans, especially after they basically voted in shit players for their all stars team rather than voting in their best possible rosters. Voting started out with like flame, dandy, pawn/rookie, imp and mata and it turned into "lets vote in slumping chinese players" I was surprsied cool didn't win the voting over rookie lol Really? It's ALL STARS, the whole point is to vote in all the fan favourite/famous people from your region. Why should they vote in the korean imports, when they can vote in the chinese players they've been fans of for ages? It's not like all stars actually matters for anything. NA voted in dyrus, hai (and secondarily meteos) and aphromoo... That's hardly voting the best players in...
In regards to aphromoo... he is actually a really good support? Did you not see them crush NA playoffs? Of course they are outclassed by world caliber teams, but in NA, he is actually good. Hai, while not the best jungler, is probably the best shotcaller outside of Asia (well Yellowstar is just as good imo, but who knows which one is better) and can directly impact a team to rise above their playing abilities and work as a cohesive unit. Dyrus... he just retired, of course he would win the fan vote in that regards. It's our last chance to see him play (and zionspartan was a close 2nd in the voting for top laner for NA LCS).
The thing that bothered me was that the chinese fans basically got pissed off koreans were representing them and demanded that they vote chinese players. If they were going to vote in chinese players, why not vote in ACTUAL GOOD PLAYERS?
With the lack of international tournaments worth watching outside of world (IEM is a freaking farce of a tournament), I would hope to see ACTUAL GOOD TEAMS battle it out at all-stars. But I guess everyone else is complacent enough to watch shit tournaments.
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The land of freedom23126 Posts
Because those Chinese players were the best in LPL including Koreans?
I know, that it's easy to talk shit when you hadn't watched a single game of an LPL probably, but still.
This is literally as all-star with regards to the rules as it could be, besides imp instead of Uzi but it's still questionable.
The thing that bothered me was that the chinese fans basically got pissed off koreans were representing them and demanded that they vote chinese players.
Sources?
On December 07 2015 07:10 Skitter wrote:
Koro1 isn't the best Chinese top? I suppose Aluka is better? Nah, maybe Xiyang, right?
Oh yeah, Clearlove is such trash lmao.
Uzi is the only one I'll give you.
PYL is still the best Chinese supp outside of EDG except for maybe TcT.
Like honestly, I don't know what the fuck you even mean.
Give me your LPL Allstar
Get rekt, mate, TcT isn't even top-5.
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Koro1 isn't the best Chinese top? I suppose Aluka is better? Nah, maybe Xiyang, right?
Oh yeah, Clearlove is such trash lmao.
Uzi is the only one I'll give you.
PYL is still the best Chinese supp outside of EDG except for maybe TcT.
Like honestly, I don't know what the fuck you even mean.
Give me your LPL Allstar
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United Kingdom50293 Posts
The best Chinese tops are clearly Cola and Ackerman. World finalists don't lie.
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I've read that iG might actually have paid Tabe to leak the information so that iG wont be blamed for underperforming (idk lol). But after reading this, its finally clear to me that he is indeed an asshole and a shame to Chinese community. RIP Tabe.
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What an interesting time capsule denouncing Tabe, especially after seeing he's been coaching for long time now and won a MSI and a Chinese title for RNG
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EPT![[image loading]](http://i.imgur.com/rICJxLk.gif)
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