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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
So we've got: 80 AD 350 HP shield 20% lifesteal vs: 40 AD 400 HP 20% CDR Armor Shred Movespeed I'm not seeing it on an ADC unless they heavily value the shred. MF for example, whom the current BC is already arguably a legit buy on. But I'm not an ADC player, so I'll pass on this internet argument. | ||
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wei2coolman
United States60033 Posts
On April 10 2015 06:11 nafta wrote: Yea then they buy thornmail and if you don't have 2 shielders you are just gonna die. I said it's buyable, not core. There are some situations where going 6 offensive items is a perfectly okay for ADC's, and situations where you don't need the lifesteal. On April 10 2015 06:11 Ketara wrote: I think that's Goumindongs argument, that this new BC can replace BT. So we've got: 80 AD 350 HP shield 20% lifesteal vs: 40 AD 400 HP 20% CDR Armor Shred Movespeed I'm not seeing it on an ADC unless they heavily value the shred. MF for example, whom the current BC is already arguably a legit buy on. But I'm not an ADC player, so I'll pass on this internet argument. MS is a pretty good defensive stat. I could see it being used in niche adc builds. | ||
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Fildun
Netherlands4124 Posts
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Alaric
France45622 Posts
Graves' damage is frontloaded, there's no way he wants BC. | ||
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Goumindong
United States3529 Posts
On April 10 2015 06:09 wei2coolman wrote: BT is replaceable imo, also going full 6 items isn't out of the question for ADC's. You have to have some amount of lategame lifesteal. BT has 400 ish HP, and 80 AD so you probably won't replace it with Cleaver. You might replace whisper with this if your damage is super backloaded (like Kalista) and you need a mix of defense earlier*. You might replace Scimitar with this if you don't need the cleanse. You might replace BT with this if you already have BotRK(TF, BotRK, Whisper, Cleaver, -Another defensive item/scimitar/IE) Its not "build on everyone ever in every situation". But that doesn't mean that its not buyable. Both on bruisers/tanks who want a mixed selfless item. And on AD's who find themselves wanting a bit of a mixed item late in the game but don't necessarily need scimitar/whatever the other option is The CDR on it is irrelevant. You buy it as an AD because you want the extra pen and HP and no one on your team has already bought it for you. Edit: The real good thing about the item is that either path that wants it has an itermediate option which does about what they want. If you want tank/CDR as your priority you get kindlegem. If you want the damage/kite/hp mix you get phage. So even if you're sitting at close to full items you can always work the build path into your items without being disproportionately weak edit 2: * Kalista for instance only loses 5% armor pen/shred on her rend for the most part with this item compared to whisper which isn't all that much considering how much of her damage rend is. | ||
GrandInquisitor
New York City13113 Posts
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Gahlo
United States35174 Posts
On April 10 2015 06:27 GrandInquisitor wrote: It's interesting to see how the new Black Cleaver will interact with junglers. On the one hand it seems like a great fit with Warrior enchantments. On the other it's also a really strong item on a Cinderhulk Jarvan IV / Vi. Depends. If it's good enough on traditionally Warrior junglers, it might be enough reason to go back to Warrior. | ||
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
Actually I take that back, I'm dumb today. Still no reason to buy a bunch of damage with it though, it's not going to be a damage item. What it's going to be good on is people who have a lot of physical damage AOE, don't really want to buy full damage items over tank items but still need to be doing damage, and like CDR and movespeed. So Garen, Wukong, Darius, etc. It is an item for oldschool bruisers, basically. | ||
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ApxVoid
Canada1 Post
CDR isn't the most efficient stat for adc's either. The armor shred is not bad but LW would be more efficient for meting tanks, since it can be hard to apply 6 stacks in a fight especially with champions like graves. The movement speed is very minuscule on ranged champions since it is halved. 10 ms for 2 seconds is hardly anything and 40 ms for 2s upon a killing a unit or getting an assist isn't much either. The build order will also set you really far. Kindlegem is practically useless on adc's, phage is okay not great, and then you have to wait another 1000 gold to complete the item. This item seems a lot better suited on bruisers and assassins rather than adc's. | ||
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Ketara
United States15065 Posts
40 AD 400 HP 20% CDR Armor shred for team Movespeed vs. 20 AD 250 HP 20% CDR 10% Lifesteal AD for team Lifesteal for team | ||
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ticklishmusic
United States15977 Posts
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Sonnington
United States1107 Posts
The problem with building it on MF is the redundancy of the rage passive. A lot of MF's build Triforce second because her Q is on such a low cd and applies on hit effects. She's a snowbally champ that falls off harder than probably any other ADC. Except for Quinn maybe. If you're not buying TF, then it's inarguably a better item for her. It gives her better mobility and more survivability with the hp. Her ult will fully proc BC after 1.5 seconds and the debuff on enemy champs lasts for longer. The cdr is a moot point(faster q AA resets, whoopie!). While losing 10 armour pen and 10 damage will hurt her dueling/snowball potential. But that won't be a huge deal to her team fighting. | ||
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Nos-
Canada12016 Posts
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AlterKot
Poland7525 Posts
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Sonnington
United States1107 Posts
On April 10 2015 09:30 Nos- wrote: what do you do against a challenging smite top lane? Do you just not fight? Shit's annoying Watch TDK vs NME. Seraph ran top lane smite all 4 games. Basically Flaresz bullied Seraph around early, zoned, and froze the lane. You basically lose lane until you finish your jungle item. | ||
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Nos-
Canada12016 Posts
On April 10 2015 09:56 Sonnington wrote: Watch TDK vs NME. Seraph ran top lane smite all 4 games. Basically Flaresz bullied Seraph around early, zoned, and froze the lane. You basically lose lane until you finish your jungle item. I played Irelia vs Fizz, he smited gromp, got like 4 potions, TP-ed back to lane. With the gromp buff it was really hard to deal with him. Also he came into lane at lvl2 qq | ||
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cLutZ
United States19574 Posts
Edit: Reason #32154364512341 for not having jungle camp/smite buffs and jungle items. | ||
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Kinie
United States3106 Posts
More than likely, they'll just nerf Skirmishers into the ground. | ||
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AlterKot
Poland7525 Posts
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JazzVortical
Australia1825 Posts
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